I’m *mostly* indifferent to attendance. As long as the crowd is full enough to give a good atmosphere, I’m happy. I couldn’t care less what the numbers are, huge crowds can be quiet and dead and smaller crowds can be excited and noisy.
@@Diegbone it was always going to drop , last year was their first time going there so people found the need to put expenses for it. this year was their second time ... and no its not "concerning" when you're still packing that many people in. what's concerning is the expenses for traveling and hotel and the ticket was too much for a lot of people as well. some of my friends told me they couldn't go because of expenses and they were from UK.
i agree , as long as it looks packed on TV and i'm getting quality product , i'm good with this. AEW's biggest problem is advertising tho , they need to do that a lot more to all the towns they go to
It was the same injury that took Thunder Rosa out. The kicker? It was her and Brit Baker that were complaining about Thunder Rosa taking so long to come back and how it's unfair that Jaime had to temporarily be an "interim" champ until Rosa fully vacated the title. Fast Forward and it's now Jaime in Thunder Rosa's position and Brit having an even worse one with the mini-stroke... Both of them are humble AF now!
I honestly do not understand AEW haters. They put on a good show even if it's not your brand of storytelling or wrestling. They're great for the business as a whole. Wrestlers are making more money, they're happier because they have options, we get matches we never would have gotten, and they've given WWE some incentive to actually try. Who are these people who want to go back to the 2000's and 2010's where WWE had a monopoly? It was a terrible 20 years for wrestling.
Indeed! AEW doesn't even have to 'beat' WWE or what not. It can exist alongside and that's fine, as you said. AEW or WWE having better attendance or worse doesn't make it better or worse and isn't a reflection on one's person or identity. All wrestling doesn't have to appeal to all people; having those options to watch is good for everyone though. Further more, as you said, it gives wrestlers - old and new - options and opportunity. I remember when TNA was a new company - so smack dab when WWE was the dominant promotion and there wasn't any real second tier promotion of note - there was an article that talked with a lot of non-WWE wrestlers at the time. One of whom was the TNA Knockouts Champion... and they had to work at a Sunglasses Hut to make ends meet. Even the article was aware enough to note that it was baffling that someone that was on TV regularly had to work a second full-time job; and how the Knockout would occasionally get recognized while working the Hut and just how embarassing that was because well... here was a top champion of a promotion on TV weekly doing a minimum wage job.
Because Aew was touted as the savior of wrestling. It was going to be the one to bring down WWE. Everybody was supposed to leave WWE to sign for Aew. Fans don't like being told that what they love sucks, even if intellectually they know the criticism is valid. Now they know they have a comperable if not better product and they are returning the favor.
i don't give two fucking shits about AEW Attendance being 50k or 46k , that was still a lot of hyped people who turned up for a hyped Event that we all collectively enjoyed watching and none of these news (Attendance or Britt Baker backlash) is going to overshadow what a fucking amazing event it was. call it a hot take , i don't give a shit.
I believe that the attendance metric is indicative of audience interest in the product, similar to Steam's player hours metric. If attendance is down, that means revenue is down, and if there are fewer people in attendance, those watching at home may see it as an inferior product regardless of quality. Putting on a 16-star show means nothing if the gate is small enough to put you in the red. Dips happen, but continuous drops are usually a sign that something needs to happen before the audience leaves for good. WWE experienced this until HHH took over, after proving the concepts he championed in NXT.
Maybe you will give a s*** when ratings and attendances are so low that TV companies don't bother buying the shows and the company goes out of business.
@@PaladinGamingNetwork1 see i don't disagree with you on your points about continuous metric going being a sign of losing interest in the product. HOWEVER you don't have a terrible product if you're having 55k ticket sales and 46k people in attendance. it was always going to be lower than the first. and also i believe AEW's issue right now is not the product itself , its not the booking either because anybody with eyes can actually see that they have been booking great programs this year (2022-2023 were bad) , i believe AEW's issue right now are 2 things 1. WWE getting hot and taking a portion of former WWE fans back given the circle of wrestling fans in US are so much smaller than before) and 2. AEW lacking proper advertising of their shows and programs in the towns they go to. i remember in the years before (2019-2021) AEW was advertising like crazy. but now i hear people say they came to their town and they didn't even know. they need to advertise better because they have good characters and builds and interesting storylines to offer. your point about WWE experiecing this also proves the fact that you can be this bad and you can always bounce back in the years to come. AEW is not going out of business. neither will WWE.
@@PoeticPoker262 AEW is only going out of business if Tony Khan decides its going out of business , and one event pulling 46k people instead of 55k is not something that will make companies go out of business LMAO. ratings never meant shit to me as there are worldwide viewers you won't ever count , and Attendances are a matter of product not being hot , once it gets hot again and they advertise better then you'll see it go back to form. just as WWE did. WWE used to be as bad (look up Stomping Grounds 2019) because at the time AEW was hot. Doom and Gloom is getting people nowhere and i believe AEW will bounce back so no , i don't give a shit about this if its looking packed on my TV
@@leorelic but ratings should mean something to you, because as I said when ratings and attendances get too low, TV companies do stuff and that includes cancelling. You might not care right now but if AEW gets cancelled then it's all because of ratings, then maybe you will care.
Danhausen is still on the roster, yet hasn't been near an AEW event in how long? Makes me sad. (Sure, he's keeping himself busy on the Indie circuit, but that doesn't get much coverage now does it... )
I get why Tony Khan wants rankings and I get why he keeps getting rid of them. They just don't work in wrestling. Just because someone is winning a lot doesn't mean they should get a world title match, but if their win record puts them at #1, then it makes the ratings pointless if they don't get a world title shot. Like right now Will Ospreay would likely be the #1 spot because of his record, but it's not time for him and Bryan to have a title match. Can't have Ospreay lose in order to fall down the rankings because he's got his own championship right now so he'd likely remain #1 for months until it's time to do him vs Bryan.
Yeah, really good points. I would add that any system that factors in those things or otherwise gets more complex - say, a #1 contender pool where people can gain a spot in and from where the next challenger is pulled from - just starts to straddle the line between kayfabe (who is in-universe in good form and doing well) and real life (who the fans are behind and want to see, what makes a good story, etc) even more. And that feels like an impossible line to straddle in a way that suits both sides, because you're trying to mix fiction and non-fiction. Real life doesn't follow narrative rules.
@@PhotonBeastone glaring issue is they want everyone to feel equal I’m guessing so they didn’t separate them by a division or class. That would solve the Osprey being number one overall. He holds that belt so he’s the top of that division. Swerve would obviously be number one in the heavyweight division/class and so on. Better yet they could make classes and keep the overall but use the overall as a fan vote on X or whatever. People like to feel involved with the product.
@@PhotonBeast With wrestling being pre determined as it is, the rankings can be skewed any which way they want if you think about it. They could just adopt a lineal ranking system. If you beat someone ranked above you, you take their spot and they fall back a spot. You lose to someone ranked above you nobody moves but your record still takes a loss. Perfect solution. Champions also fight non title all the time. Perfect scenario for upsets and whatnot. Impromptu title shots next week. A litany of things can be done. They’re just lazy
I can't wait for the internet to lose it's mind in February for Grand Slam. It's the first wrestling PPV/PLE that's local to me. So I'm getting my ticket, showing up on the day, enjoying the show and not caring how many people walk through the gate.
AEW actually had a huge audience at their event?! That’s new cause last time I checked WWE had to fit fans into stadiums cause there’s over a thousand fans every year for Summerslam Wrestlemania Royal Rumble etc. This is new congratulations to Tony and AEW
Lets be real they never really used the rankings to there advantage ... Pac was up in the rankings for a long time and they gave title shots to people not even in the top 5
For AEW, the win/loss was an interesting concept and I am sure it has its fans of it... but I'd be thinking that for the majority of wrestling fans out there they are more interested in good stories and drama and trying to work those in and around somebody's win/loss record can be quite difficult.
I think the reason AEW is so overanalyzed is because they’re the first company to be created and rise up as competition to WWE in the internet age where wrestling is so accessible and kayfabe is mostly dead. So it’s just easier to analyze on a larger scale. That being said, most people “analyzing” are just complaining online with no actual knowledge. Both AEW and WWE 😂
Vince is exactly why the relationship soured with Fox. Fox was actually really happy under Triple H’s leader ship and it gets me to think that maybe Fox will reinstate WWE in the future maybe and maybe they’ll allow their shows to be uncensored this time.
I love Raw and NXT but Smackdown is sometimes tough to watch with all the blackouts and censoring. I feel like so much is lost. Honestly the Wyatt Sicks debut love it or hate it I think would have been toned down and not as impactful on Fox.
The actual real reason is Ratings and not getting some of their moneys worth via advertisers and sponsors. That’s why. FOX were expecting the numbers they got on their debut which was 3.9 Million viewers, SmackDown averages 2.2 Million and is a flatline. FOX then didn’t like the fact that wrestling fans weren’t interested in the other stuff that was being advertised and sponsored. FOX paid 1 Billion and lost a shit ton of money. FOX were expecting a lot more for what they paid.
9:26 The problem is TK making things seem better with AEW than what we all see with our own eyes. Nobody was against AEW until they started running their mouths. Lets not forget, WWE literally ignored AEW for the longest time despite the constant shots being fired by AEW talent and TK. If AEW had better ratings than Raw or SmackDown, AEW & TK would talk about it for years.
46K??? That’s embarrassing for their biggest PPV. You can’t cover that up. If Mania went and had 46K people would be jumping off rooftops and screaming they’re dying. If it was something like blood and guts,it would have been fine. But that’s their version of mania. It’s not silly to expect a sellout crowd. It’s these kind of excuses that make Tony not fix the issues they have and get the company to where it should be. Because he watches these shows and listens to social media and when the media is like “oh this is a huge success! Stop saying it’s not” he thinks AEW is perfectly fine.
How would any company treat such a drop in attendance? They would recognise something is wrong and do something about it. I was there. It was a great show. But TKs booking has lost them a lot of potential attendees. Perhaps if TK worried about the drop off, as he should be, he'd be trying to improve. With AEWs roster, they should be the best wrestling company on earth.
46k for a 90k stadium is embarrassing and even if you don't care about attendances, you should at least admit that's a big problem for the future of the company.
A major reason why I think the Fox-WWE relationship has soured in recent times is because Fox has been intent on replacing SmackDown on Fridays for a while especially since Fox has greatly increased its commitments to college football in recent years in a bid to compete with ESPN & gone behind WWE's back to do so. For example the week SmackDown goes to the USA Network, Fox will be airing a Big Ten college football game in its time slot as part of the agreement Fox signed with the conference a few years ago. Fox will fill SmackDown's old time slot with college football/basketball (especially the Big Ten) in the fall & winter & the UFL (a minor football league that Fox owns alongside The Rock) in the spring. This more than anything else is why the WWE-Fox relationship is ending. However due to the fact that Fox is a partner in the VENU Sports venture alongside Warner Bros Discovery (who air AEW), I could see Fox asking TK for the rights to air ROH or Rampage as late night programming on their network especially since Fox does not have any late night programming currently.
Tracking wins and losses for wrestling sounds like an interesting idea at first, but when you think about how much it would take to deal with, it falls apart pretty quickly. The level of micro-management needed is pretty insane. It also has the potential of burying talent on a level that wouldn’t happen to them if the records weren’t tracked.
Smackdown isn’t going to Netflix in the U.S. here though. Also, Fox doesn’t get out of the argument blameless either. They’ve been muting the audience and blacking out the screen at the hint of anything bad. Yet, they do worse stuff when it comes to what they show on their shows like Family Guy. So Fox isn’t helping either.
FOX is the reason Smackdown got 2 Millon views regularly even without top stars like roman . Smackdown may not get 2 Million views regularly once it moves to USA Network
As a Long time SmackDown Viewer and Wrestling guy since i was a lil boy,Im recalling,this is the 3rd,if not 4th time SmackDown! is being Takin away from me(UPN,The CW,Now FOX)and thrown back on Basic Cable,Just Sucks that this Friday is the End Of The SmackDown,WWE/FOX Era😢
And for those AEW drones who cry that WWE shows don't get as much hate as AEW shows, it isn't bias, it's because they're good shows that make sense. It isn't bias to criticise something that's bad, you don't want AEW to be mocked then put on a good show with good stories for once.
I remember when TNA announced rankings in *2010* (the heart of Hogan/Russo/Bischoff's era); 🤣🤣 ...went as well as you'd expect, for as *long* as you'd expect...
The comments about wrestling goes even down to the Indies like JCW. I watched an event from last week and I knew only one wrestler which made it less enjoyable for me. The comment I made got backlash and when I insinuated, I was allowed to have an opinion, it got even crazier.
I think what people are trying to highlight when it comes to the attendance debacle, is that it isn’t about quality of the PPV or how much money they made. When you’re the single biggest wrestling promotion not named WWE in the world and one year you fill Wembley Stadium with approx. 80,000 in attendance, and you drop almost half in attendance numbers in a year, that’s nothing to shove off. I get it, WC have friends and former colleagues in all wrestling companies around the world but to pretend like this isn’t a horrible sign of how things are going for AEW in the spotlight is just simply bad and biased journalism.
A lot of people don't have Netflix or USA network. A lot of paycheck to paycheck working people have regular tv. And smackdown was an outlet no matter how stupid or ugh it was. Plus, During those times, was the start of Romains Push. I feel WWE will hurt from moving away from regular tv.
Honestly people wouldn't criticize AEW so much if Tony Khan wasn't always going after WWE every 2 minutes on and off air and silly things like he's got the greatest announcement for AEW every 2 months
I'm sorry, Adam. I know what you're trying to say, but you're just wrong. If WWE didn't get a good TV deal the next time they come up for negotiations. It would definitely affect us as fans. Because TKO would not pay the wrestlers what they're paying if they're not making what they're making. This would almost definitely affect the product we watch on TV. TV ratings don't mean anything to me as a person, TV deals don't mean anything to me as a person. But they mean something to the product that I watch and if they're bad, the product that I watch could go away. You don't have billion dollar companies by putting on products that lose money. Not if it's a real business you don't anyway.
18:15 after I almost completely tore cuff muscle in half and had to sit out an entire season my Junior year of high school and came back my senior year I was never the same. It took me about 10 years before I could watch baseball because it would make me sad & depressed because I was on my way to going to college on a scholarship because of how well I pitched, how well I batted and how well I played short stop. My twin sons playing t-ball and baseball got me back into loving the game that got ripped away from me; and I can now watch it today because of my sons. So I know Jamie’s pain, and it is such a lonely and crappy feeling to know that it should be you doing it but it’s not because your body doesn’t want you to. I was a JH fan before, and I’m definitely more of a fan now. She is awesome!
Vince is bad person but you guys overlook the fact that your favorite cody came back when he was in charge. WhatCulture Vince bias blinds you guy to that.
It depends on the market. In some countries, WWE has let their TV deals expire, and everything is going to Netflix. It's only in the U.S. where Netflix is getting just Raw.
I have 2 herniated discs in my back causing sciatica. I know everything she said there and yeah it sucks. All the love in the world for how she was able to come back. Its something you suffer with if you dont work on it (Physical Therapy, check ups, etc)
A downside of 40 to 50% in attendance within a year is not a success you can say whatever you want. Who says if you come back again the numbers go down its just stupid analogy 😂😂😂 Whichever product you like thats a different story but there's no denial AEW is having an awful time with ticket sales just look at the upcoming shows All Out/Dynamite/Collision.
Honestly, do you know the No.1 contender for stoking all this tribalism? Freaking Tony Khan. Isn't he the one just rambling on about bald assholes and stats and tickets? Instead of....running his wrestling company? Keep in mind I want BOTH to survive! Competition is amazing! You don't want a monopoly because that makes a crappy product.
Here's the problem as i see it: People watch WWE because they like WWE. People watch AEW because they like AEW, and/or because they hate WWE. That's not a sustainable model and it creates bad energy.
last 20 years it was "very little to reward your investment"? Dude, you were 17 in 2004 and you wouldn't be doing what your doing now had you not been invested. Yalls level of crap talking Vince consistently just to virtue signal is absolutely wild sometimes
Hey boys, long time fan. I wanted to double check because I I know the issue with the ranking system that you have and I totally understand. Although they’re not showing the rankings on the main page, they are still showing their stats underneath their name plate on TV so in other words when they come out and they white underneath it. It shows their weight loss a stat so at least it’s still being shown in someway. Now I do understand the ranking system is not being shown, but we’ll see what happens. But yes, to confirm once again their stats are still being shown when they come out to the ring.
10:51 yes i agree we should not comparing a company who started 5 years ago and company who has legacy from 60's-70's but we should not forget TK in his mind compares with wwe and wants to do big stadium shows like them he should focus on improving creatively stop copyrighting people who are reacting/commentating because it will be helpful for their brand at the end
Great view with ur injury speech. I need double knee and doluble hip replacements and a minimal of 3 back surgeries. The doctors wont xo the surgeries because I'm "too young ", and want me fo wait till im 63..... im 44 now and been like this since im 28. I played basketball, but I can't even bring myself to watch it nemore. I can't even hear the sound of the ball bouncing or sneakers squeaking.
Man watching a video I can tell how out of the loop I am 😂 I only watch did the show and don't use social media for wrestling Seems like I made the right choice 😊
For Fox the relationship soured with WWE because they lost money. The "problem" is advertisers: If Fox has a crime drama that draws in 2.5 million viewers and wrestling that draws in 2.5 million viewers even though viewership is the same the crime drama will draw more advertisers who want to buy spots on it... so Fox can charge more in kind of a bidding process. With wrestling they have to go with more filler advertising, companies that buy time at a discounted rate because they don't care what show they are on, they just want to get the ads out there.
It depends on the country. Smackdown will air on USA Network in the United States, but in some countries, it's going to Netflix. The same is true for NXT. It's going to The CW in the U.S. and Netflix in other markets.
the roman dog food angle was hilarious. he never got revenge against happy corbin in nxt when roman was the undisputed champ. he went from dog mode to god mode.
I swear the loud minority of wrestling fans are just plain weird. If you like WWE watch that. If you like AEW watch that. If you like indies or other feds, watch that. Stop complaining and making fun of people for not liking what you like.
AEW may be the most analyzed company in history. But them and their fans are constantly taking shots or comparing themselves to WWE. You can't play victim when the #1 reminds you of your place.
@trebs7878 "Sooner or later, we’re going to start beating RAW. It’s not going to be every week, but I bet you over the next 2-4 months, maybe 4-6, we’re going to start beating RAW" - Chris Jericho via Busted Open Radio "WWE is the Harvey Weinstein of professional wrestling" - Tony Khan "Enjoy your blood money. Maybe next week Dynamite can be held in Saudi" - Britt Baker Those are just a few that come to mind. Hell, you even took a shot in your own reply. 🤷🏻♂️
On reddit most of the people like 80-90% people loved the fact that aew got rid of rankings and i was surprised cauae i usually see people complaining about aew nowadays but i am personally happy too
Basically without wins and losses you can now book Brooklyn brawler for the belt maybe curt Hawkins and you don't have to feel like you suck as a booker.... I want the best vs the best On a side note BRYAN DANIELSON VS CM PUNK Does anyone look at the 2 decade caddy fight between these two
WCW did that to Big Show when he was The Giant. Hulk Hogan threw him off the roof of Cobo Hall Arena in Detroit and Show was back in the ring wrestling that night.
That's because they've over-saturated the markets they run in and haven't been to any new venues. Attendance is gonna dip when you hit the same arena 3 times in two years.
must be an andy video... "vonce bad vince bad 2020 programing took a hit because of vince and NO OTHER REASON" and then "numbers dont matter guys, numbers are silly and you're childish if you read them... when aew is losing"
Here's a hot take! I am completely indifferent toward AEW's attendance. It doesnt effect my life one little bit.
🧂
I’m *mostly* indifferent to attendance. As long as the crowd is full enough to give a good atmosphere, I’m happy. I couldn’t care less what the numbers are, huge crowds can be quiet and dead and smaller crowds can be excited and noisy.
I don’t think anyone really cares but some people just find it concerning that their attendance dropped by nearly 50% from last year
@@Diegbone it was always going to drop , last year was their first time going there so people found the need to put expenses for it. this year was their second time ... and no its not "concerning" when you're still packing that many people in. what's concerning is the expenses for traveling and hotel and the ticket was too much for a lot of people as well. some of my friends told me they couldn't go because of expenses and they were from UK.
i agree , as long as it looks packed on TV and i'm getting quality product , i'm good with this. AEW's biggest problem is advertising tho , they need to do that a lot more to all the towns they go to
0:50 SmackDown is NOT going to Netflix. Raw is. SmackDown’s permanent home is USA.
Correction. SD will be on Netflix for everyone outside of the US
If it’s not AEW, they won’t bother to get their facts straight
Exactly
Imagine a RUclips channel doing actual research on news topics. Leave that shit to the comment section.
Fox censored everything on smackdown that was the real problem.
Agreed. They make it so difficult to watch
And that makes me laugh cause Fox of all places is doing the censoring.
I just hope Yuka Sakazaki is recovering from her injury, I miss the magical girl and her big adorable smile
How can fox say that WWE didn’t do anything good for them in 2020 and 2021? That was the beginning of the tribal chief.
That was the only thing that was good though, nothing else was good
And had NOTHING to With Vince. Happened inspite of him.
@@jamesAL9 Vince was the one that turned him heel.
It took a long time for it to be enjoyable. For me, it started getting good with the Sami stuff. Then dropped off for a year.
Roman has been the ONLY thing good for years.
I had no idea Jamie Hayter's injury was that bad! I'm so glad it's all over and that she's better!
It was the same injury that took Thunder Rosa out. The kicker? It was her and Brit Baker that were complaining about Thunder Rosa taking so long to come back and how it's unfair that Jaime had to temporarily be an "interim" champ until Rosa fully vacated the title. Fast Forward and it's now Jaime in Thunder Rosa's position and Brit having an even worse one with the mini-stroke... Both of them are humble AF now!
Thank god is over blackouts every single show was annoying
I honestly do not understand AEW haters. They put on a good show even if it's not your brand of storytelling or wrestling. They're great for the business as a whole. Wrestlers are making more money, they're happier because they have options, we get matches we never would have gotten, and they've given WWE some incentive to actually try. Who are these people who want to go back to the 2000's and 2010's where WWE had a monopoly? It was a terrible 20 years for wrestling.
I think it’s their hubris, and the missed opportunity.
Indeed! AEW doesn't even have to 'beat' WWE or what not. It can exist alongside and that's fine, as you said. AEW or WWE having better attendance or worse doesn't make it better or worse and isn't a reflection on one's person or identity. All wrestling doesn't have to appeal to all people; having those options to watch is good for everyone though. Further more, as you said, it gives wrestlers - old and new - options and opportunity. I remember when TNA was a new company - so smack dab when WWE was the dominant promotion and there wasn't any real second tier promotion of note - there was an article that talked with a lot of non-WWE wrestlers at the time. One of whom was the TNA Knockouts Champion... and they had to work at a Sunglasses Hut to make ends meet. Even the article was aware enough to note that it was baffling that someone that was on TV regularly had to work a second full-time job; and how the Knockout would occasionally get recognized while working the Hut and just how embarassing that was because well... here was a top champion of a promotion on TV weekly doing a minimum wage job.
Because Aew was touted as the savior of wrestling. It was going to be the one to bring down WWE. Everybody was supposed to leave WWE to sign for Aew. Fans don't like being told that what they love sucks, even if intellectually they know the criticism is valid. Now they know they have a comperable if not better product and they are returning the favor.
The show sucks you like garbage
@@derrickmcmullinbig facts
I don't even watch AEW but a 46k crowd attendance is AMAZING!!!
i don't give two fucking shits about AEW Attendance being 50k or 46k , that was still a lot of hyped people who turned up for a hyped Event that we all collectively enjoyed watching and none of these news (Attendance or Britt Baker backlash) is going to overshadow what a fucking amazing event it was.
call it a hot take , i don't give a shit.
I believe that the attendance metric is indicative of audience interest in the product, similar to Steam's player hours metric. If attendance is down, that means revenue is down, and if there are fewer people in attendance, those watching at home may see it as an inferior product regardless of quality. Putting on a 16-star show means nothing if the gate is small enough to put you in the red. Dips happen, but continuous drops are usually a sign that something needs to happen before the audience leaves for good. WWE experienced this until HHH took over, after proving the concepts he championed in NXT.
Maybe you will give a s*** when ratings and attendances are so low that TV companies don't bother buying the shows and the company goes out of business.
@@PaladinGamingNetwork1 see i don't disagree with you on your points about continuous metric going being a sign of losing interest in the product.
HOWEVER you don't have a terrible product if you're having 55k ticket sales and 46k people in attendance. it was always going to be lower than the first.
and also i believe AEW's issue right now is not the product itself , its not the booking either because anybody with eyes can actually see that they have been booking great programs this year (2022-2023 were bad) , i believe AEW's issue right now are 2 things
1. WWE getting hot and taking a portion of former WWE fans back given the circle of wrestling fans in US are so much smaller than before)
and 2. AEW lacking proper advertising of their shows and programs in the towns they go to. i remember in the years before (2019-2021) AEW was advertising like crazy. but now i hear people say they came to their town and they didn't even know. they need to advertise better because they have good characters and builds and interesting storylines to offer.
your point about WWE experiecing this also proves the fact that you can be this bad and you can always bounce back in the years to come. AEW is not going out of business. neither will WWE.
@@PoeticPoker262 AEW is only going out of business if Tony Khan decides its going out of business , and one event pulling 46k people instead of 55k is not something that will make companies go out of business LMAO.
ratings never meant shit to me as there are worldwide viewers you won't ever count , and Attendances are a matter of product not being hot , once it gets hot again and they advertise better then you'll see it go back to form. just as WWE did. WWE used to be as bad (look up Stomping Grounds 2019) because at the time AEW was hot.
Doom and Gloom is getting people nowhere and i believe AEW will bounce back so no , i don't give a shit about this if its looking packed on my TV
@@leorelic but ratings should mean something to you, because as I said when ratings and attendances get too low, TV companies do stuff and that includes cancelling. You might not care right now but if AEW gets cancelled then it's all because of ratings, then maybe you will care.
wwes relationship with fox was not good years ago
Danhausen is still on the roster, yet hasn't been near an AEW event in how long? Makes me sad. (Sure, he's keeping himself busy on the Indie circuit, but that doesn't get much coverage now does it... )
I get why Tony Khan wants rankings and I get why he keeps getting rid of them. They just don't work in wrestling. Just because someone is winning a lot doesn't mean they should get a world title match, but if their win record puts them at #1, then it makes the ratings pointless if they don't get a world title shot. Like right now Will Ospreay would likely be the #1 spot because of his record, but it's not time for him and Bryan to have a title match. Can't have Ospreay lose in order to fall down the rankings because he's got his own championship right now so he'd likely remain #1 for months until it's time to do him vs Bryan.
Yeah, really good points. I would add that any system that factors in those things or otherwise gets more complex - say, a #1 contender pool where people can gain a spot in and from where the next challenger is pulled from - just starts to straddle the line between kayfabe (who is in-universe in good form and doing well) and real life (who the fans are behind and want to see, what makes a good story, etc) even more. And that feels like an impossible line to straddle in a way that suits both sides, because you're trying to mix fiction and non-fiction. Real life doesn't follow narrative rules.
@@PhotonBeastone glaring issue is they want everyone to feel equal I’m guessing so they didn’t separate them by a division or class. That would solve the Osprey being number one overall. He holds that belt so he’s the top of that division. Swerve would obviously be number one in the heavyweight division/class and so on. Better yet they could make classes and keep the overall but use the overall as a fan vote on X or whatever. People like to feel involved with the product.
@@PhotonBeast With wrestling being pre determined as it is, the rankings can be skewed any which way they want if you think about it. They could just adopt a lineal ranking system. If you beat someone ranked above you, you take their spot and they fall back a spot. You lose to someone ranked above you nobody moves but your record still takes a loss. Perfect solution. Champions also fight non title all the time. Perfect scenario for upsets and whatnot. Impromptu title shots next week. A litany of things can be done. They’re just lazy
AEW MARK
I can't wait for the internet to lose it's mind in February for Grand Slam. It's the first wrestling PPV/PLE that's local to me. So I'm getting my ticket, showing up on the day, enjoying the show and not caring how many people walk through the gate.
Hey, can you please stop touching so much grass?
And I hope you have a really fun time!
@@xddddddddddd4646 weird thing to say
@@xddddddddddd4646 what's your problem a hol3
AEW actually had a huge audience at their event?! That’s new cause last time I checked WWE had to fit fans into stadiums cause there’s over a thousand fans every year for Summerslam Wrestlemania Royal Rumble etc. This is new congratulations to Tony and AEW
Lets be real they never really used the rankings to there advantage ... Pac was up in the rankings for a long time and they gave title shots to people not even in the top 5
When they had the mass injuries a few years ago that basically ruined the ranking systems.
Smackdown down is staying on usa raw is moving to Netflix
In the America's. For myself and others smackdown will be on Netflix too.
Not here in UK everything will be on Netflix in January
SD isn't going to Netflix its a new 5 yr deal w USA
Outside the USA it’s going to Netflix.
For AEW, the win/loss was an interesting concept and I am sure it has its fans of it... but I'd be thinking that for the majority of wrestling fans out there they are more interested in good stories and drama and trying to work those in and around somebody's win/loss record can be quite difficult.
5:45 If WhatCulture truly feels this way, stop aggregating stories that speak about ratings 😂
The rankings absolutely *_MUST_* come back. They are essential to AEW's presentation.
I think the reason AEW is so overanalyzed is because they’re the first company to be created and rise up as competition to WWE in the internet age where wrestling is so accessible and kayfabe is mostly dead. So it’s just easier to analyze on a larger scale.
That being said, most people “analyzing” are just complaining online with no actual knowledge. Both AEW and WWE 😂
Vince is exactly why the relationship soured with Fox. Fox was actually really happy under Triple H’s leader ship and it gets me to think that maybe Fox will reinstate WWE in the future maybe and maybe they’ll allow their shows to be uncensored this time.
The only good thing on Fox was smackdown. The only time I watch Fox was on Fridays
I love Raw and NXT but Smackdown is sometimes tough to watch with all the blackouts and censoring. I feel like so much is lost. Honestly the Wyatt Sicks debut love it or hate it I think would have been toned down and not as impactful on Fox.
was that edit a tony hawk special sound???? someone get this editor a damn raise
The actual real reason is Ratings and not getting some of their moneys worth via advertisers and sponsors.
That’s why.
FOX were expecting the numbers they got on their debut which was 3.9 Million viewers, SmackDown averages 2.2 Million and is a flatline.
FOX then didn’t like the fact that wrestling fans weren’t interested in the other stuff that was being advertised and sponsored.
FOX paid 1 Billion and lost a shit ton of money.
FOX were expecting a lot more for what they paid.
9:26 The problem is TK making things seem better with AEW than what we all see with our own eyes.
Nobody was against AEW until they started running their mouths. Lets not forget, WWE literally ignored AEW for the longest time despite the constant shots being fired by AEW talent and TK.
If AEW had better ratings than Raw or SmackDown, AEW & TK would talk about it for years.
I agree rankings and win loss records bring them back and use them (appropriately) and Jamie Hayter is a Grade A wrestler character and champion.
46K??? That’s embarrassing for their biggest PPV.
You can’t cover that up. If Mania went and had 46K people would be jumping off rooftops and screaming they’re dying.
If it was something like blood and guts,it would have been fine.
But that’s their version of mania.
It’s not silly to expect a sellout crowd.
It’s these kind of excuses that make Tony not fix the issues they have and get the company to where it should be.
Because he watches these shows and listens to social media and when the media is like “oh this is a huge success! Stop saying it’s not” he thinks AEW is perfectly fine.
"Hello there my very good friends" is about as friendly an opening I've ever heard. Always makes me smile and then I get the news. Thanks guys! 👋
The question about what AEW grossed has no real meaning. It's what AEW netted after expenses that matters.
Fox ripped the deal in half because they were getting roasted on twitter every week lmao
I'm just waiting for the payoff about the lights in the studio going wacky. Taker's gonna show up and chokeslam Sidge
1:01 uhhhh, correction guys:
Raw is going to Netflix,
Smackdown is going to USA,
And NXT is going to CW
Outside of the US is different.
How would any company treat such a drop in attendance? They would recognise something is wrong and do something about it.
I was there. It was a great show.
But TKs booking has lost them a lot of potential attendees. Perhaps if TK worried about the drop off, as he should be, he'd be trying to improve. With AEWs roster, they should be the best wrestling company on earth.
46k for a 90k stadium is embarrassing and even if you don't care about attendances, you should at least admit that's a big problem for the future of the company.
A major reason why I think the Fox-WWE relationship has soured in recent times is because Fox has been intent on replacing SmackDown on Fridays for a while especially since Fox has greatly increased its commitments to college football in recent years in a bid to compete with ESPN & gone behind WWE's back to do so. For example the week SmackDown goes to the USA Network, Fox will be airing a Big Ten college football game in its time slot as part of the agreement Fox signed with the conference a few years ago. Fox will fill SmackDown's old time slot with college football/basketball (especially the Big Ten) in the fall & winter & the UFL (a minor football league that Fox owns alongside The Rock) in the spring. This more than anything else is why the WWE-Fox relationship is ending. However due to the fact that Fox is a partner in the VENU Sports venture alongside Warner Bros Discovery (who air AEW), I could see Fox asking TK for the rights to air ROH or Rampage as late night programming on their network especially since Fox does not have any late night programming currently.
What you said about both sides to blame for fan scrutiny is VERY well said
Tracking wins and losses for wrestling sounds like an interesting idea at first, but when you think about how much it would take to deal with, it falls apart pretty quickly. The level of micro-management needed is pretty insane. It also has the potential of burying talent on a level that wouldn’t happen to them if the records weren’t tracked.
Smackdown isn’t going to Netflix in the U.S. here though.
Also, Fox doesn’t get out of the argument blameless either. They’ve been muting the audience and blacking out the screen at the hint of anything bad. Yet, they do worse stuff when it comes to what they show on their shows like Family Guy. So Fox isn’t helping either.
Wwe is still on fox in Australia as it has been for over 20 years.
FOX is the reason Smackdown got 2 Millon views regularly even without top stars like roman . Smackdown may not get 2 Million views regularly once it moves to USA Network
FOX weren’t impressed with 2 million, they wanted what they got on the debut, which was 3.9 milllion, regularly
As a Long time SmackDown Viewer and Wrestling guy since i was a lil boy,Im recalling,this is the 3rd,if not 4th time SmackDown! is being Takin away from me(UPN,The CW,Now FOX)and thrown back on Basic Cable,Just Sucks that this Friday is the End Of The SmackDown,WWE/FOX Era😢
And for those AEW drones who cry that WWE shows don't get as much hate as AEW shows, it isn't bias, it's because they're good shows that make sense. It isn't bias to criticise something that's bad, you don't want AEW to be mocked then put on a good show with good stories for once.
I remember when TNA announced rankings in *2010* (the heart of Hogan/Russo/Bischoff's era);
🤣🤣
...went as well as you'd expect, for as *long* as you'd expect...
The comments about wrestling goes even down to the Indies like JCW. I watched an event from last week and I knew only one wrestler which made it less enjoyable for me. The comment I made got backlash and when I insinuated, I was allowed to have an opinion, it got even crazier.
I think what people are trying to highlight when it comes to the attendance debacle, is that it isn’t about quality of the PPV or how much money they made. When you’re the single biggest wrestling promotion not named WWE in the world and one year you fill Wembley Stadium with approx. 80,000 in attendance, and you drop almost half in attendance numbers in a year, that’s nothing to shove off. I get it, WC have friends and former colleagues in all wrestling companies around the world but to pretend like this isn’t a horrible sign of how things are going for AEW in the spotlight is just simply bad and biased journalism.
Turnstile count is not a good metric to use. I’m close to 300 pounds and i can often get around a turnstile without turning it.
A lot of people don't have Netflix or USA network. A lot of paycheck to paycheck working people have regular tv. And smackdown was an outlet no matter how stupid or ugh it was. Plus, During those times, was the start of Romains Push. I feel WWE will hurt from moving away from regular tv.
Honestly people wouldn't criticize AEW so much if Tony Khan wasn't always going after WWE every 2 minutes on and off air and silly things like he's got the greatest announcement for AEW every 2 months
Completely innocent question.....when was the last time he 'went after them'?
I'm sorry, Adam. I know what you're trying to say, but you're just wrong. If WWE didn't get a good TV deal the next time they come up for negotiations. It would definitely affect us as fans. Because TKO would not pay the wrestlers what they're paying if they're not making what they're making. This would almost definitely affect the product we watch on TV.
TV ratings don't mean anything to me as a person, TV deals don't mean anything to me as a person. But they mean something to the product that I watch and if they're bad, the product that I watch could go away. You don't have billion dollar companies by putting on products that lose money. Not if it's a real business you don't anyway.
18:15 after I almost completely tore cuff muscle in half and had to sit out an entire season my Junior year of high school and came back my senior year I was never the same. It took me about 10 years before I could watch baseball because it would make me sad & depressed because I was on my way to going to college on a scholarship because of how well I pitched, how well I batted and how well I played short stop. My twin sons playing t-ball and baseball got me back into loving the game that got ripped away from me; and I can now watch it today because of my sons. So I know Jamie’s pain, and it is such a lonely and crappy feeling to know that it should be you doing it but it’s not because your body doesn’t want you to. I was a JH fan before, and I’m definitely more of a fan now. She is awesome!
Vince is bad person but you guys overlook the fact that your favorite cody came back when he was in charge. WhatCulture Vince bias blinds you guy to that.
Smackdown is not going to Netflix, Raw is going to Netflix. Smackdown is going to be staying on USA
It depends on the market. In some countries, WWE has let their TV deals expire, and everything is going to Netflix. It's only in the U.S. where Netflix is getting just Raw.
I have 2 herniated discs in my back causing sciatica. I know everything she said there and yeah it sucks. All the love in the world for how she was able to come back. Its something you suffer with if you dont work on it (Physical Therapy, check ups, etc)
Is your background lights problem connected to the Collision light problems?
Personally, I don't know if I enjoyed a show or not until I know the attendance and/or ratings.
Lmao ok this is gold
A downside of 40 to 50% in attendance within a year is not a success you can say whatever you want. Who says if you come back again the numbers go down its just stupid analogy 😂😂😂
Whichever product you like thats a different story but there's no denial AEW is having an awful time with ticket sales just look at the upcoming shows All Out/Dynamite/Collision.
Andy Murray looking extremely handsome as always especially in his tight jeans and blue tshirt.
We had to miss AEW shows car was broken sadly.. hopefully make it to SLC one.
I feel like the original ranking system AEW used backed them into a corner
Half the attendance from last year is successful, and a 15 million dollar gate due to jacking up the ticket prices 😂😂😂😂
Honestly, do you know the No.1 contender for stoking all this tribalism? Freaking Tony Khan. Isn't he the one just rambling on about bald assholes and stats and tickets? Instead of....running his wrestling company?
Keep in mind I want BOTH to survive! Competition is amazing! You don't want a monopoly because that makes a crappy product.
Here's the problem as i see it:
People watch WWE because they like WWE.
People watch AEW because they like AEW, and/or because they hate WWE.
That's not a sustainable model and it creates bad energy.
No People watch AEW because wwe gives us nothing to watch but talkey talkey no matches. Not hate.
AEW puts unnecessary pressure and attention on themselves. If Tony Khan would just shut up and put got content on TV . Everything will be ok .
Is it just me or is something moving around in the background on that shelf in the bottom left corner?
Man whatculture is AEW spin doctors man. They defend them to the end.
last 20 years it was "very little to reward your investment"? Dude, you were 17 in 2004 and you wouldn't be doing what your doing now had you not been invested. Yalls level of crap talking Vince consistently just to virtue signal is absolutely wild sometimes
I would love Andy to sit in when Sidge gets to selectively miss the podcast.
Hey boys, long time fan. I wanted to double check because I I know the issue with the ranking system that you have and I totally understand. Although they’re not showing the rankings on the main page, they are still showing their stats underneath their name plate on TV so in other words when they come out and they white underneath it. It shows their weight loss a stat so at least it’s still being shown in someway. Now I do understand the ranking system is not being shown, but we’ll see what happens. But yes, to confirm once again their stats are still being shown when they come out to the ring.
They can say how much their gates gross all they want, but the more important number should be how much profit they made.
Just an FYI, smackdown is staying on USA (once it moves there next week). RAW is the show that’s moving to Netflix.
In the UK, everything is moving to Netflix
@@BadenAW fair enough
SmackDown will only air on USA along with NXT on The CW in America, everywhere else in the world every WWE show will be on Netflix
@@BadenAWI think Canada too
10:51 yes i agree we should not comparing a company who started 5 years ago and company who has legacy from 60's-70's
but we should not forget TK in his mind compares with wwe and wants to do big stadium shows like them he should focus on improving creatively stop copyrighting people who are reacting/commentating because it will be helpful for their brand at the end
Great view with ur injury speech. I need double knee and doluble hip replacements and a minimal of 3 back surgeries. The doctors wont xo the surgeries because I'm "too young ", and want me fo wait till im 63..... im 44 now and been like this since im 28. I played basketball, but I can't even bring myself to watch it nemore. I can't even hear the sound of the ball bouncing or sneakers squeaking.
Man watching a video I can tell how out of the loop I am 😂 I only watch did the show and don't use social media for wrestling
Seems like I made the right choice 😊
For Fox the relationship soured with WWE because they lost money.
The "problem" is advertisers: If Fox has a crime drama that draws in 2.5 million viewers and wrestling that draws in 2.5 million viewers even though viewership is the same the crime drama will draw more advertisers who want to buy spots on it... so Fox can charge more in kind of a bidding process.
With wrestling they have to go with more filler advertising, companies that buy time at a discounted rate because they don't care what show they are on, they just want to get the ads out there.
I wonder if it affects the smackdown rating.
Smackdown isn’t going to Netflix in 2025
That’s RAW you goober
It depends on the country. Smackdown will air on USA Network in the United States, but in some countries, it's going to Netflix.
The same is true for NXT. It's going to The CW in the U.S. and Netflix in other markets.
the roman dog food angle was hilarious. he never got revenge against happy corbin in nxt when roman was the undisputed champ. he went from dog mode to god mode.
only losers care about attendance records
I swear the loud minority of wrestling fans are just plain weird. If you like WWE watch that. If you like AEW watch that. If you like indies or other feds, watch that. Stop complaining and making fun of people for not liking what you like.
If you guys got 62% of your salary from the prior year, would you be happy and call it a success?
another "game-changing, groundbreaking" landmark moment that led to nothing
🤣
Is raw and smackdown going to netflix, thought it was just raw
AEW may be the most analyzed company in history. But them and their fans are constantly taking shots or comparing themselves to WWE. You can't play victim when the #1 reminds you of your place.
An example of the 'constant shots and comparing themselves to WWE ' please?
Cheering for WWE is like cheering for the Blackjack dealer at a casino.
@trebs7878 "Sooner or later, we’re going to start beating RAW. It’s not going to be every week, but I bet you over the next 2-4 months, maybe 4-6, we’re going to start beating RAW" - Chris Jericho via Busted Open Radio
"WWE is the Harvey Weinstein of professional wrestling" - Tony Khan
"Enjoy your blood money. Maybe next week Dynamite can be held in Saudi" - Britt Baker
Those are just a few that come to mind.
Hell, you even took a shot in your own reply. 🤷🏻♂️
aew has deleted wins and losses
On reddit most of the people like 80-90% people loved the fact that aew got rid of rankings and i was surprised cauae i usually see people complaining about aew nowadays but i am personally happy too
Basically without wins and losses you can now book Brooklyn brawler for the belt maybe curt Hawkins and you don't have to feel like you suck as a booker.... I want the best vs the best
On a side note
BRYAN DANIELSON VS CM PUNK
Does anyone look at the 2 decade caddy fight between these two
So... What on earth is going on with the lights?
What's with the lights, Fella's . Did you upset the Wyatt 6 or the management ? Lol😂😅😊
Rey mystero and malakai black being thrown off a roof and then right back on TV the next night lol
WCW did that to Big Show when he was The Giant. Hulk Hogan threw him off the roof of Cobo Hall Arena in Detroit and Show was back in the ring wrestling that night.
Why they were pissed off is they had the A-team and that shit they got I would be too
Smackdown is moving to USA and staying there. Raw is moving to Netflix in 2025
Pretty sure that’s just the US, most other countries are getting both on Netflix
AEW should move to the UK permanently it’s where all there fans and they seems to really love them, more than they do the WWE.
I like cola. Coke is my favorite, but I don’t feel the need to talk smack on Pepsi 😆
This entire video has reminded me why I stay off of X
The problem is AEW is struggling to sell out 10k seat venues
They suck. I watched in the beginning. Then i was like what am i doing watching this multi million dollar mud show
That's because they've over-saturated the markets they run in and haven't been to any new venues. Attendance is gonna dip when you hit the same arena 3 times in two years.
BIG UP BRENT!!
must be an andy video... "vonce bad vince bad 2020 programing took a hit because of vince and NO OTHER REASON" and then "numbers dont matter guys, numbers are silly and you're childish if you read them... when aew is losing"
Murray is awful