GW’s Worst Leak - and why you should care…
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- Опубликовано: 6 июл 2024
- Gag Orders, Non-Solicitation Clauses, and Non Competes? We're talking about one of the most controversial topic in the Warhammer community: the Games Workshop NDA Leak.
Is this just an overblown, boilerplate contract? Or an insidious document, designed by a greedy company to fool viewers and silence content creators? We discuss The Never Ending Contract and how it affects both the miniature and 3D Printing communities.
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Игры
Straighten your tie, DANIEL
I promise it was trying to be a Prince Albert knot :3
@@3DPrintedTabletop
a Prince Albert... knot??
(god, that sounds doubly painful) 😖😳
(😄)
@@nbell63 I specified for a reason lol
@@3DPrintedTabletop 😂
I can’t unsee it
When I got sent my Photon as sponsorship from Anyubic, they literally gave me three terms: 1 ) Print my figures on it for the next year, 2 ) When asked, say it was printed on the Photon, and 3 ) IF I chose to review it, be honest so they can use the information to improve the product. In addition, the clauses were literally in those words. No other legal terms, no other clauses, nothing.
GW used to be a good company. It's been a couple decades since they have been.
That's great 👍
It’s been 30 years since gw was a good company. They were anything but that during this century
Last time gw was good out riders existed
Shit, now I want a photon. Was it any good?
@@matteblack5805 For the time it was amazing - it was one of only a handful of consumer resin printers when it came out. But as time went on, the QA seemed to drop a bit, and modern resin printers are more reliable, faster, and last a lot longer. My current one is a Mono 4k screen, which means much higher resolution, faster exposure times, and a longer-lasting screen.
Thank you for keeping this issue "in the news," Danny! It seems like GW have a minor/fake "scandal" every week, and the truly important stories like this one tend to disappear down the memory hole. It's public knowledge that multiple GW employees sent this document out to numerous creators over the course of several months. As far as we know, they are still asking content creators to sign this exact document. This issue should be talked about much more than it currently is.
As a content creator myself, I've seen many examples of NDAs that are sent to potential reviewers. This document from GW is unique in this industry. It is heinous. Most NDAs for review purposes say "do not disclose any confidential information," and "wait until review day to post your review"... because that's all that they need to say.
Our audiences deserve transparency. Content creators are required to disclose paid sponsorships and whether they received free review stock from companies. This transparency allows the audience to calibrate for bias. HOWEVER, Being under permanent legal threat for posting a bad review about GW product (or a good review for a competitor) is absolutely something that the audience deserves to know about. The fact that the existence of this signed document is considered confidential is infuriating. This is a monstrously unethical way to advertise.
I do not fault anyone who has signed this. Games Workshop employees sent this to creators and told them it was a perfectly normal document, when they knew damn well that it wasn't. This is predatory behavior. It hurts creators who sign, and it hurts creators who don't sign. It hurts anyone who watches RUclips reviews. It hurts competing companies. It hurts the hobbies that we love.
Yes, publicly owned businesses constantly do unethical stuff... but that's NOT an excuse. Games Workshop doesn't get a free pass on this issue. Thank you again, Danny, for making this video. Sunshine is the best remedy for shady business.
Well said, Brent 👌
@@3DPrintedTabletop It's great to see both of you care about the community!
Brent!!! Thank you for sharing your voice.
Brent, I heard this comment in your voice and could practically see your canoe on the water. Your calm but enthusiastic style shines through wherever you post! I love how level headed yet passionate you are about this hobby.
Q
Too many folks are producing great proxies. No way I’m paying astronomical prices on GW’s artificial scarcity on their chunks of plastic…. We have plenty of gaming stores allowing proxies in their local tournaments.
If gw had color separation, articulation, and snap fitting like bandai it would be a lot closer to fine. If bandai had the legal ability to make well priced model kits of stuff like warhammer titans it would be amazing. The occasional issue with fragile plastics, or overengineering a kit for its scale is preferable to this.
@@flamestoyershadowkill6400 It would atleast be fair for half of the overpriced shit Forgeworld farts out to be warped to hell and back.
@@flamestoyershadowkill6400 Oh yes no, Bandai is one of the best and worst company combined. They manage to bring out amazing products only to shotgun themselfs in the foot with horrible ones. :D
@@burnbobquist8999 pbandai? And whatever is the as model kit line
I'm not sure GW's pricing is your issue. Most of the indie companies producing GW look-a-likes, either actual minis or STL files, are even more abusively priced than GW's original products.
Anyone who reviews GW stuff just needs to say they "We DON'T have an NDA with games workshop" at the start of their video. If they don't say that then the review should be taken as fake/unreliable/coerced.
Unfortunately the community at large is too immature to recognise paid content and bias when they see it and just absorb the publicity
So people get sent free products for review, but can't properly criticize the product for fear of legal repercussion? Just when I think I can't dislike GW any more than I already do...
It is weird, as it isn't like the content creators are going to rip apart their free products.
This is the case for almost any review where the content creator didn't purchase the item themselves. This is not news and hasn't been for years.
@@mekko1413 "almost any" is a stretch. Just because it happens elsewhere doesn't mean people don't want to know about it.
@@mekko1413 usually the case is the company sending the product will cut ties and discontinue supporting the creator, not sue. Not saying GW would sue in every case, but the fact that they have that written in the agreement is what is not OK here, AND why it is news to people
@@mekko1413 No it is not. For example in art. it is the standard to send paints , paper, brushes for review and expect them to be PROPERLY evaluated and put in their rightful quality spot. Compared to others and pointed what is good and what is BAD on the material.
A simple example was when arteza created a new line of gouache paint and sent for review to dozens of people. they were CRUSHED.... their next try wsa much better because they went back and SOLVED the issues
Far too many people have forgotten that we do not have to buy what they are selling. We can find something else to do. Instant gratification can come from a competitor who might be really happy to have you as a customer.
Amen. I am building a renegade guard army with all third-party proxy models. Tons of minis and model kits from great companies.
Oldhammer and poorhammer is The Way. Proxy and counts-as models all the way.
And that does not even count 3D printing, an obvious alternative to James's shenanigans.
I don't buy anything GW. I get into different tabletop board games with miniatures to build and paint and at reasonable costs in comparison.
Exactly!
One page rules is looking pretty good
One doesn't even have to give up on the game.
How many people here even play in official tournaments?
Anyone ever had issues putting down a good-looking Proxy?
No reason we shouldn't commission an artist to make custom sculpts in this day and age. For the amount of money we pay on a single Game Workshop model, it would be far better to find a few really good 3d artists and reach out to them instead. If you don't want to wait around for the work to be complete, there is a lot that are already selling original art works... just get a file and print off as many as you want.
This obvious hatred of their customers is what made me stop buying Games Workshop stuff. It is like an abusive relationship. "GW hits me because he loves me." Screw that. There is enough strong competition out there that the GW brand of abusive collecting and gaming is obsolete.
Great seeing this covered so well! Very unfortunate that the NDA is still be pushed by Games Workshop, it's not good for anyone. Awesome video!
Nice to see you here!
Discourse - I didn’t realize your legal background! That was an interesting bit of context as someone who enjoys your channel. :)
@@AVspectre Did you not see me in the video? I was wearing the traditional garb
Based on your output, I take it that you haven't signed the NDA 😆😆😆 Stay salty 😍
@@DiscourseMinis that was you! so hawt! SLAANESH approves. :) jk
I stopped buying GW in the 80s, when I perceived a shift from what had been a reasonably ecumenical approach to the broader hobbies to a very parochial one. It was a business decision by GW which I understood, but one which turned me off their product line(s).
Roll forward 10 years, and GW, across its bricks-&-mortar venues, across jurisdictions, repeatedly engaged in illegal 'restraint of trade' as defined by various local legal authorities... and then there was how they treated staff.
I have watched GW, as a vaguely interested party, for decades and I have seen the same negative business/managerial philosophies repeat... repeatedly.
I have friends who are still fanboys, who get burnt at least once a year, *every* year, and yet still buy GW product (I'm willing to bet that this comes close to an actual definition of mental illness in the DSM-5). They squeal, they buy, they squeal, they buy - and, at the GW end of the commercial chain, all you can hear is: Ka'CHING!
Nostalgia should only be of so much value - but GW has milked this beyond the dreams of avarice... but not beyond GW's corporate greed. Your love of hobby should not be an opportunity for a relationship of abuse.
Still, as ever: caveat emptor.
With the amount me and just a couple of my mates have poured into this we could have launched our own start up like we discussed in high school, instead of allowing our selves to send our creative minds to ruin thinking about someone else's universe (which frankly isn't even that great out side a handful of unique concepts).
What does ecumenmenical and parochial mean exactly? I have a large vocabulary but I've never heard those terms, would you care to explain? Of course I wont be bothered if you dont
@@primetimeforcrime
Ecumenical (adj):
representing a number of different Christian churches.
- in context, back in the day, GW (via "White Dwarf") was happy to promote gaming hobbies across platforms and across companies, eg. offering game play enhancements for Chaosium and quickly as they would TSR.
-
Parochial (adj):
having a limited or narrow outlook or scope.
(Hist. related to parish concerns specifically rather that those of the diocese).
- in context, in pursuing a defining house style, GW (via "White Dwarf") dropped all mention of any other game format or potential competitor. What had been inclusive suddenly became 'it's them or us!'
@@nbell63 thank you very much, its helped me understand you statement better. Have a great rest of you day!
@@nbell63 Yes, two very descriptive words, if you know what they mean, and your reply to the questioner is most commendable. Explaining them both in the context of your earlier comment, beautifully done sir !
I suspect that with your knowledge, and use of both words, you may be a fellow Scot ?
This explains why so many of my once-loved video makers on YT have now gone over to nothing but GW products on their tutorials. I stopped buying/painting my own GW products way back in the early 90's, and now see so many younger gamers being drawn into the GW trap of only being allowed to play with/paint their models with GW products. I use a myriad number of different paints in my own painting service, but keep getting pressure from younger customers to only use GW paints/glue on the models they ask me to paint for them, as they are being brainwashed/forced into using only GW produced products, if they want to play the games they have bought into. GW started out using other games systems from mostly D&D, including miniatures/rules and terrain pieces, before producing their early games such as Rogue Trader/Dark Future/Confrontation, and then concentrating their White Dwarf magazine onto only GW products/minis/paints etc, and have gone on from there to become one of the biggest, and also one of the most litigious companies in the world. They are the biggest bullies in the table top gaming world now, and they are now expanding their bullying influence into the world of RUclips and other online outlets. GW don't want any competition from independent manufacturers/painters/game systems, so will always bring legal pressure onto anyone who goes against them, and starts their own YT channel that promotes anything but GW in every way. I worked in a model shop in the 90's, and GW reps often came into the shop, demanding that their products be placed in the most prominent positions, that their products be promoted more than any other models, and if not, they would either stop supplying the shop or bring their legal department down on our heads. Even at competitions and model shows, GW were bullying the show organisers into giving them prime positions, or they would boycott any future shows. Now GW are starting their own video games, and using their legal demands to stop any negative reviews of their game system, which is just showing them in further bad light, due to their constant litigation and price hikes. I know so many people who are now turning away from all GW games and finding a new love for the hobby by using other game systems such as Battletech and more, which fulfil their gaming desires, don't need constant new rules/codex books, and are more fun to play, and cheaper than most of the GW offerings today.
The thing to do is to stop buying from GW. That is the bottom line and the only thing that will change a company. Gamer nexus had a problem with Newegg and how it was basically stealing from its customers.. and its only from showing the company how bad it is now why Newegg are listening to its customers. Many people decided not to buy from Newegg even its only for 6 months. GW need to get the backlash it deserves from these NDA's so it sees the errors of its ways. I don't buy this stuff but my grandson does and I've always been startled at how much the stuff is for a little piece of plastic.... Hopefully, players will just go on a hiatus from buying. Seems like a just say "no" goes out to content creators and players.
Honest review of every single GW branded item. They have not ever, at any time. Reduced their costs. Instead they keep raising their costs. Regularly with out regard to their customers. Which means they are ALL over priced and demographically destructive for a 'game'. When could a kid walk in and honestly say "They want to get into Warhammer 40k" and be able to buy an army? Currently, only if someone else was willing to buy several hundred dollars just for a 'game'. GW - Shame on you, this is disgusting.
It really stands out just how much Game Workshop is fleecing it's fanbase.
As popularity goes up - prices go up
As popularity goes down - prices go up
and when nothing changes - prices go up
GW are pricks and don't deserve our money. There are thousands of other gaming companies out there that deserve our attention and don't feel the need to update their rules every 5 minutes.
Games workshop doesnt even deserve your stock money.
Into is killer! I feel for anyone wanting to give honest reviews.
GW stock shows the future. One Page Rules 4 Life!
I hate how quickly people forgave GSW for their dmca. They went after an independant youtuber who was reviewing a competitors product and when they were caught they just said: ooops, and people just kept buying their stuff. I don't buy GW, GSW or AK Interactive.
GSW?
Edit: I watched to the end of the video, I now know that it's Green Stuff World.
Yeah, I hadn’t known about these other poor company decisions. Was glad to know so they might inform my spending of my limited dollary-doos. I’ve never bought GamesWorkshop (mostly just buy figures to paint rather than war game, though I would be open to if they weren’t so predatory on so many different levels), but it’s good to know about the poor choices employed by other industry names too.
I hadn’t heard what AK did, but I think it’s kind of funny he would get lumped in with GW since I heard his Vallejo Game Colour line started after GW burned him on a contract.
@@nunyabidness3075 AK and Vallejo are two separate companies. AK and MIG were related and fell out due to a business dispute, IIRC.
@@TylerProvick I believe AK and Vallejo are primarily owned by the same man. I think AK was created as a new partnership, but like you say, it broke up leaving Frank Vallejo(?) in charge.
Aaaaaaaand another point in favour of One Page Rules
Looking fly in that suit and tie. Great coverage of the topic Danny!
IAAL, look at three or four of these a day minimim. Agree with Hoeg, from what I've seen so far. Haven't read the whole document because GW isn't worth my billable hours. But that competitive activity language is insane. This goes way, way beyond an NDA. It's likely a lot of it would be thrown out, but as mentioned, the cost of litigation would be high. Hopefully a legal fund will do a test case with it with a small creator.
9:05
How DARE you make fun of our traditional lawyer garb.
😤
In Britain the sending part of the clause can be defeated by not receiving any post from them, you'd need to receive things for that to trigger.
Legit a deal with the Devil. Risk of financial ruin if you break the contract vs not signing it and having the freedom to say what you want.
Moma didn't raise a fool...
Companies trying to censor true reviews, and overeach need to be slapped and reminded that the consumer makes them what they are. It's ridiculous you cant have an opinion on anything anymore without seeing backlash, companies most of all should be looking for constructive criticism instead of trying to crush anyone with an opinion.
Well said! 👍
Its the idea of monopolizing the industry, im sure GW would love to hold all the reigns to our hobby but fortunately we have guys like Miniac and Emil who have fought the good fight and brought us things that vary from the norm. I think it's important to have diversity... to all the up and coming content creators.. keep fighting the good fight and stick to your guns... if you're making quality content you wont need to sell your soul 🤘🏼
I walked away from GW 17 years ago. Screw that nasty corporate nightmare.
Plenty of other excellent tabletops to print, paint, and play.
Share some of those please?
@@dawick5 Battletech is seeing a resurgence.
For an amazing intro to the setting look for "Tex talks Battletech". Should be a playlist of them somewhere in the Black Pants Legion channel.
@@tomface55 Man, I love Battletech but it is a *whole different* kind of rabbit hole. The average WH gamer might have a mental breakdown trying to keep the rules straight on their first BT game.
Alpha Strike uses the same setting and lore, but is definitely a more beginner friendly game.
Can't believe this video only has 13k views. People need to understand this.
This is why you don't do business with unethical companies. Even if that unethical behavior has nothing to do with you, like the way they treat their employees, if they're willing to cross the line somewhere they'll cross the line with you eventually.
That other companies in other industries may or may not use NDAs like this is not proof that GW's NDA is acceptable. It just means we live in a predatory, unjust financial system that rewards heinous practices and exploits the disempowered.
Using threat of legal action (and the finance-destroying court proceedings that would follow) to bind a person's capacity to speak freely, into perpetuity, is an abomination, in any industry.
Outrageous tactics. Hiding these sponsorships HAS to be against youtube (and some nations') Terms and conditions. even if not, this long-reaching stifling of free speech is appalling.
This is an excellent video, I hope this circulates in our community.
Share!
Its very healthy to talk about these kind of "evil corporation" moves. Thanks for making this well written video!
Danny, thank you for making this video, and for being a positive force for change. Taking a stance like this takes real thought and determination, and you not only provide the information in a fast and well presented manner, but also make it funny. Keep up the good work, mate.
I loved the video and it highlights how important it is for transparency when reviewing products. I think GW is becoming a progressively worse influence in this space and keeping controversies like this in the mainstream consciousness is really important because they basically never did anything about it. The only thing I wish you'd also discussed was the doxxing of the person who potentially leaked the NDA by someone in the community - which just seems so extraordinarily cruel.
This editing and opening are spot on! Love it.
This is insanity! GW seems to want to control the entire space. If they didn't feel threatened in this hobby and the surrounding fields, they never would've made such an all-encompassing NDA.
This is predatory business practices at their worst. I think at this point if you see a reviewer online at a whole we should ask if they have signed an NDA and if we don't get an answer we don't support them.
Yes that is not a wonderful solution but it is a way to push back.
Gamza is ...pretty awful. I get he's done some 3d printing and content relevant to the topic,but saying "God bless" ...while showing "exodyke"...and all his other awful content/takes...I dont know, man.
(that's the joke)
@@3DPrintedTabletop I am an old man and did not get it. Mea cupla
No problem at all!
Thankfully we live in a time where gorgeous minis can be found in every nook and cranny of the internet that people should not feel limited in their options. I've never liked GW and I've always found their traditional WH and 40K gameplay boring compared to other games so I was never involved with them much. And after their actions a few years back that hurt local game stores, I decided to stay from this company for good.
Doing good work Danny, thanks for making these videos. Can't forget these details about marketing and dodgy deals.
There are several RUclips channels who lets say are some what "shilly" to say the least they are never really critical of anything they might say something like "Oh I like this one better than that, but they are both still really good and I like this fraction more"
This is like getting free beer from a company with the clause that you are not allowed to drink anything else than the stuff they provide.
This gives you headaches, a hangover and in the end is not good for you.
Glad you used Hoeg Law's points, he's a REALLY good legal analyst, and he does great content, and he's all about protecting gaming consumers.
Geez GW making EA looking like a great company. :S
Thanks for this thoughtful video exploration of a difficult topic, Danny. I agree that the mere existence of this NDA hurts the hobby in general, and content creators and consumers in particular. Since this NDA became public, I have basically stopped watching certain small-but-upcoming RUclips channels, either because of their public reaction to the NDA kerfuffle when it arose, or because of the fact that I have never, ever seen them say anything even vaguely critical of GW or a GW product. Basically, unless I personally see a channel post *something* obviously negative about GW, I can't trust their objectivity. The legal threats contained in that document has given GW control over anyone who signs it, and causes me to distrust channels that HAVEN'T signed it if I haven't seen them go negative on GW.
I have no problem with the existence of a review NDA that requires a content creator to abide by an embargo date. I understand and respect that restriction. But an NDA that places restrictions on content of the review, or of ANY OTHER CONTENT THAT CHANNEL RELEASES, as this one does, is unethical and abusive. And I agree with the various professional legal opinions about this document that suggest that its restrictions are so burdensome as to render it unenforceable--but that will never come to a legal test, because of the text that requires that the content creator respond to any GW legal action in a UK court, and that the content creator must pay GW's full legal expenses, EVEN IF THE COURT FINDS AGAINST GW IN THE CASE. That alone is almost certainly unenforceable, but who can afford to bet six figures to find out?
As a result of the NDA, and several other issues around their business practices toward customers, retailers, and employees, I buy FAR less GW product than I did two years ago. I buy nothing from GW, either online or in store; I buy second-hand whenever possible, or through third-party retailers when I must, or I buy proxies as STLs. And I buy and play far more games and miniatures from other publishers than I do from GW these days. As Uncle Atom recently posted, I haven't totally quit buying GW (yet), but I buy much, much less than I used to, and I'm far more careful to buy it in ways that prevent GW from getting any more of my money than absolutely necessary. All of this is due to the way that GW behaves in our hobby space.
Way to go, Danny. Fantastic coverage of this. Thanks for putting it out there!
My Etsy store just lost 100 listings out of nowhere for IP infringement for having the word "warhammer" in the titles. I sell resin miniature bases. For use in Warhammer. I further their IP. And now, since Etsy has terrible sales service, I can't get those listings back, or even edit them to comply. I had to remake all the listings, and now I get to build them back up. I lost eight months worth of the algorithm bumping my listings. I'm essentially starting from square one, and I'm considering throwing in the towel.
Sucks to learn this. Can you say something like " futuristic Sci fi miniature Battle base"?
put spacemace 69million or something like that
I have a channel, GW mainly oriented too, so I have to thank you about this video.
Such type of NDA should be illegal, it's a NDA, not a slave contract.
Seeing some type of actions along the years by GW, I renounced to create some type of content I had in mind.
The only thing I can foresee is a sort of "social union" , or at least some type of laws about content creator.
Europe is trying something about it, but every country still need to receive them in a good way (which I doubt).
Moreover UK is not anymore in UE commercials...
Anyway such problems with NDA and similar ones are something are blowing up more and more often in lately years. I remember the one blamed by Linus about tech, but also before that other tech companies with similar issues about that.
Such "shark" type behaviour should not be allowed in any situation.
The only way is to pay more attention and consideration in what you are going to sign
Bro... you hardly have 400 abos....
@@Chadegon1693 Do you think the author of the book sued by GW was famous?
I still remember when GW practically shut down every forum about Warhammer cause they only wanted official news from themselves and nothing more so they couldn't use any keyword Warhammer related as the name of the forum.
Now, It's about what the GW (and not only) behaviour it's about.
The number of subscribers can change, the sign of a similar NDA lasts.
You can also think aside from GW itself. The author of the video talked about similar behaviour also not GW related, and such it's a trouble cause , not mind the number of subscribers, signing such type of NDA is like selling your contents forever
@@deynonmod this
@@nickkohlmann the Dark History of GW run deep^^ anyway I pay attention to the products, bg or miniatures.
I don't shit down the source of fun, but I don't accept everything they do as it's the best.
this reminds me of the band Midnight Oil. The lead singer has passed the bar and literally laughed at some of the early contract offerings before record companies realized his legal background. Always read the fine print, everything needs a SET end date ( refer to any warranty card)
I 100% understand Games Workshop's desire to control the narrative about their products. It's ethically Despicable, but I can understand it from an Enron kind of perspective.
When I got into 3d printing, it was to create great looking boards to play on. Form 2 printers were a dream that I had no chance of affording. But, thanks to some of the early visionaries of tge medium (like WarLayer), I've been Abe to create some awesome boards.
Now, with resin printers that are able to print in 8 K and can produce Miniatures in line what GW is creating for a mere fraction of the price I can understand their fear. Fear is a powerful motivator to do some truly stupid things. Instead of embracing the 3d printing disruption, GW is trying to just control the entire narrative. Alternate models don't exist. We make the best of the best. We can drive fan favorite videos, etc out of existence and replace it with our "superior" offering.
As I said, I understand why they make these morally bankrupt choices. Too bad they don't have good people helping to keep them from immolating what good will they currently retain.
This was a nice informative video essay. Thanks for covering this, and stretching the type of videos you put out there.
What a civilized florida man. In all honesty keep up the great work danny.
Thank goodness I wasn't wearing our state uniform of camo, an alligator skin, and swamp boots :D
so bottom line is dont sign it and you keep your creative freedom ?
noone should EVER trust anything they see online, ever. danny, i love your videos , and will continue to be a loyal viewer for your whole career , but i have absolutely no way to know if you are getting compensation for any of your vids, id like to hope not, but people have to get paid, thats life, mans gotta eat, but its not just you, its all youtube vids, amazon reviews, twitch channels, very VERY few channels make it in this space without having to make deals, thats just the world, ive left bad reviews on amazon and the company emails me and said " if we send you a $40 gift card will you remove your review?" hell no i wont but im very sure there are people that do that literally for a living, just write bad reviews and wait to get paid to make a good review, the internet is ridiculous, never EVER trust anything you see online or any promotional material ever
Difference is the predatory kind of clauses and the extreme lack of transparency
Just like to say thanks for the video and it’s interesting. (Squidmar however showed free miniatures from GW on their livestream tonight 🙈)
Decisive and necessary. Appreciate the perspective and finally understand the concern.
Well timed references and you managed to keep a straighter face than I would have expected. Well done! You are a dork in the best of ways. ^_^ Thank you for such a thorough examination and breakdown.
I am a commercial artist and I sign NDA’s every time I begin a new job and that NDA is pretty normal.
It’s fine for GW to control WHEN reviews are published. And usually it’s preorder day, not release day (a week beforehand).
The non compete though is bullshit.
theoretically you can negotiate terms of the NDA before signing, including compensation and limits of terms and conditions.
Hahaha, I don't know a company on Earth that would negotiate its NDA with anyone with less than a million subs.
I think I pee myself each time that clown pop up in this video.. Clowns is one of my biggest fears... LoL besides for the clown great video... Lol
It was around 2006, and I worked in a small CNC shop. I could use the CAD Software at home and made some Weels, Tires and Hubs ect that looked nice on Ork models. Then i did stuff like Armor Plates for Tanks. Made some masters from metal, and then some silicone molds to cast PUR-Resin. Sold the casts(made, constructed and planed 100% by me) on Hobbyboards and it took only FOUR WEEKS till i got a letter from GW to stop all Bussines. I was Young and did´nt had much money so i stopped working on my stuff, but it was the same time i stopped with Warhammer 40k as a hobby. At the time i had a 3000points Spacemarine and 2500 points necron army. Sold everything five years later and broke even, but never touched GW again
Yes, yes, very good, but can we talk about how your pitch was bang on at 06:33 ???
Squidmar doesn't sign, criticizes the Manta, and GW STILL sends him free stuff. He just said they sent him the Silent King box for the diorama he's doing - so yeah, the big guys don't need the NDA, it's just the little guys who fall for it
I work in an industrial field. A few years ago a totally new (new to me) idea of contracts started spreading. It's something that started in the auto industry I believe. Also heard it's a Disney standard. If I own an industrial service company, which I did, and I want do work for your plant, factory, or your pipeline, I would have to supply the financials for my company. Everything, and the client takes YOUR financials, and those of dozens of your closest competitors who are also bidding on this job, and then the client will tell the winner how much they well pay them for the work. The bids don't really mean anything other than to get ME to spend time and money researching this job and putting together a detailed labor and parts quote...for free. It may be a prevalent practice in bigger deals or in different industries but I didn't bust my ass building this thing just to get turned inside out. Then to only be allowed a set percentage of profit based on how much money my company has made or how well or bad I have operated my company. It's communistic and I don't bid on those jobs anymore no matter how juicy they are. My insides stay on the inside. Little plastic men are so much easier to get along with.
Such a high quality vid. You even got the hand gestures down!
Well done video. It flowed nicely. At no time during it did I feel bored or uninterested. The comparisons to other NDA's was great to see.
That's a lot of 3D printers, mate. would you recommend the Elegoo mars 2 pro as my first one? I want to get one for printing bits mainly, but also some proxies as well for minis that are incredibly out dated in the Citadel range.
Welp and here again we won't know whether his response to this would be influenced by a contract or some sort of compensation for him recommending a specific product rather than he would genuinely think is the best pick
I have a Mars 3 and I have been happy with it so far if that counts for anything. I haven't talked with their support but I have heard they are great from others
Great video! Thank you for bringing awareness to this topic.
I have signed several NDA in relation to video game alphas and betas that have had clauses that say that you can't tell people about the NDA or you signing it. In practice this is to stop people running their moth about having access to a closed beta prompting more questions about non-public content increasing the likelihood exponentially that they will be pressured in to disclosing things covered by the NDA.
So I understand why it ended up in there even if it's.. Odd.. In this situation.
If GW would have trust in their own products they wouldn't fear critics of it... Not everything is perfect and there are always critics in some form from some people. GW should learn that criticism will help improve. But since GW is public traded the first and only goal is to make money for Shareholders, this is so unfortunate.
So if they semd you something you cant say they sent you anything and that there isnt said contract in the first place, and then you cant trully critic the product it self, it looks like the beggining of a corporate echo chamber
GW priced me out of the market for their products over 2 years ago. I never liked their paints (or the jar design), to expensive, and really aren't better then most other mini paints on the market. When they went after content creators, and seem to be screwing over their fans *coughWH+cough* I have decided not to only to not buy their products (which as mentioned I can't afford), but I also no longer watch RUclipsrs who focus "Solely" on GW products. Nor do I follow any GW social media. Their practices -in my opinion- are bad for the hobby and the hobby community.
I am mainly a D&D player, and mini painter. However, when I do wargame, I now use One Page Rules, rules. Which I have to say are much better then WH. They flow better, and are much smoother. I also 3D print my minis. Does this stop me from buying minis at all?... No. I add to my pile of shame OFTEN!... GW products are just not among my purchases and as a result, in that pile of shame anymore.
Great video! Keeping GW's bad faith/toxic business practices in the news, is a must.
GW can't stop us posting mentions of the competition on those videos though ..
At this point it baffles me how anyone can be surprised that GW is a massive and horrible bully in this industry. They are the Nestle of miniatures. This has been the main thing that keeps me away from any GW products.
The last point is the most important. A non disclosure agreement is intended for employees of a company. The original purpose of an NDA is to prevent the leaking of sensitive company data in the event that an employee leaves the company before a product they were working on is launched to the public. RUclips content creators ARE the public. They are not GW employees, and should be under no obligation to alter their content just because they were sent free stuff.. The point of sending out products to youtubers for review is explicitly, and deliberately, to DISCLOSE the existence and details of the product to the public. GW once again being the bully. As a life-long fan of their games, this makes me sad.
GW has been having these issues for a while now. Why do people still support the company. If you want to impress upon them that it’s unacceptable you have to do that with your wallet hit them where it hurts. Stop buying there stuff and maybe they change their mind or they go away and are replaced with something better
Recently started watching and honestly I love the way you deliver content. Entertaining and factual. Keep up the great work 👍
I think alot of it stems from people 3d printing and taking intellectual property instead of paying for it. Piracy causes issues just like this.
Great video. So glad I don't sup at GW's table...
I have painted miniatures for 30 plus years. I started on Rogue Trader beaky marines, Imperial guard Squats and ratlings and metal Eldar Space Pirates with plastic arms. I stopped buying them in around 2005 due to the price rises and volume reductions (paints) and then when they massively changed the "Fluff" I saw no reason to start back up. Will still very occasionally buy something ( I bought a box of the new Primaris SM's... I couldn't stop myself & also the Aeronautica Imperialis) but I try to stay away now. Too much money for too little return. Have started using army painter paints and other companies brushes.
Pretty much why i love Privateer Press, Corvus Belli and pretty much every other company not named GW...
A lot of work went into this video and it shows; well done!
after GW did stopped fan-videos they showed the true colour even to people that did not cared much about it. I just moved to other wargames, there is lot of those and with my SLA printer I can get amazing models.
Interesting. This seems like quite a big blunder of incompetence from whoever manages these relations to content creators...
More interested in pushing a nearsighted revenue increase than a long game relationship with the community. It could be as you mentioned ( A bit predatory or fear of losing money ) but more likely they're just neglecting it & have adjusted a hire NDA contract or something.
"It's a boilerplate NDA, no issues with it, you're just making a massive fuss over it because you hate GW"
-A Person Who Signs Everything Without Reading It First, circa 2021
I don't watch RUclips Games Workshop videos so they can sway me to buy something..
I like watching the painting skills and my army is decided by me because of how cool they look.
So I actually have no idea why we should be taken back by this NDA stuff
this is why i love Battletech there are generally only tight lips on lore or sourcebooks in development, and when it comes to miniatures .... you have a bottlecap? you have a gaming mini.... so long as you can clearly mark which unit is which bottlecap
This video is really interesting and could lead to some genuine productive conversation about how we consume, about incentives and reward structures of reviewers and how maybe we as a community can avoid some of the pitfalls the video game industry went down.
What i fear is going to happen is that all this community takes away from this video is "GW Bad".
GW *is* bad. That's a perfectly appropriate takeaway
@@PQRXYZ433 and there is the first one /sigh
@@Klamev tell me I'm wrong. If you like what GW has to offer, that's fine, but let's not pretend they're a paragon of corporate virtue and don't deserve backlash
@@PQRXYZ433 the conversation could just be a much interesting one, but sure if you want to go with ur dumned down, Twitter headline, ready to get danced over in a TikTok version of what this video was actually about go ahead and enter GW Bad into ur NPC database for voiceline.
You can also add
- unfunny joke about 3D printer go brr
- getting angry about Astartes
- uhmw actually according to the lore there no female space m........
Or some other meaningless phrase the terminaly online part of the "community" likes to repeat ad nauseum
@@Klamev I'm not part of the GW "community" (whatever that's supposed to mean). I quit years ago to play better wargames made by people who don't cynically view their players cash cows. Is it the sunk cost that makes you so defensive? You could play a mini-agnoatic game with your current collection, y'know.
Well thankfully GW has made blatantly obvious whos definitely NOT signed this NDA. When they have turned Arch Warhammer into Voldemort who cannot be even mentioned in certain places in positive manner... yeah just look who GW hates and follow them, dont buy the thing that comes out automatically as consumer, but be customer and wait to see if its worth your money.
Damn... thank you so much for discussing this topic. Really makes me want to stop using big companies like GW and start using smaller creators and the like for minis.
I switched to onepage rules system and then to 15mm , these days only use games workshops fluff and lore.
I bought a 3d printer last year, put my own ban on GW, dropped their gaming systems and picked up other games like OPR and KoW and I've never been happier with my decision. Games Workshop is a toxic dumpster fire, a shady 500 pound gorilla quickly transforming into an industry dinosaur overnight and that's a completely unbiased, unpaid for review.
Also 3d printing that is on par with GW quality is not the future
It's here and now
Thank you for another great video. This explains why I cannot find decent content about painting Privateer Press or Atomic Mass miniatures. Warmachine, Hordes, Riot Quest, Crisis Protocol, and Star Wars Legion are all competition to 40k and AoS. This is bullshit. Many mini painting content creators regularly participate in Games Workshop painting competitions. While I haven't heard anyone say "Making content about GW's competitors is why I can't win awards", it seems likely that is the case. While it's understandable that a company protects itself, the amount of power GW has in the miniature community as whole is ridiculous! More content calling GW out on their behavior is necessary for change to happen.
Damn! Great video! so much I didn't even know about
Well said!
9:05 wtf she's a legal professional 0.0.
Great video explaining everything. GW has become way too greedy and petty in my opinion. This is why I sold all my GW stuff and have started 3d printing or buying from other companies.
The suit was amazing.
I don't know about other places, but in Canada, ambiguous legal clauses are legally unenforceable and immediately voided. Also, perpetual contracts are immediately void. Under the USA legal regime, this seems like it would classify under SLAPP. Honestly, I'm not sure why anyone in the USA would sign anything with GW, because they can claim ALL expenses of their business; essentially rendering all material purchases FREE.
You wouldn't expect anything different from the grim darkness of our times
Great case and point regarding Mediocre Hobbies, guy worked with GW for years, started making content to share and expand his love of the hobby. Got slapped with a C&D and had to leave his position to maintain the work he had done.
Guessing if the contract they send you is more than 10 lines of simple text, and goes into pages and pages it's time to just not sign.
I've heard of too many horror stories of contracts causing big problems.....A builder friend had signed a contract to complete the work on a house ... even with the fact that the owner was not paying he was told if he didn't "complete the house" he would get sued.....He finished the work and it was for about £200, 000 and the persons immediately filed for bankruptcy as it was a business (I don't know all the details) and he ended up £200,000 worse off. Contracts are a big thing that should not be taken lightly.
In the US he could have used what's called a 'mechanics lien' to stake a claim on the house he worked on. US law started out based on English common law.. not sure if mechanics liens date back that far though