Blades, Bureaus, and Bastards: Examining the Politics of New Vegas
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- Опубликовано: 27 фев 2017
- My first Fallout lore/world video. May the lord have mercy.
Facebook: / mitch-l-462561553915283
Twitter: / angered_courier
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Mitch L what did MisterCaption even do?
who's MisterCaption?
"Makeup Artist: MisterCaption"
Mitch L ?
Mitch L Being a lover of your channel, I obviously am prone to questioning/overthinking everything. I, however, don't venture into comment sections all that often. Could you enlighten me as to what he's been doing? Checking this section, I see he has called you a cuck, which does not bode well for my eventual estimation of him. Signed, your least succint subscriber.
Children of slaves in the legion are actually raised by priestesses and trained to become fighters for the legion at a young age if I remember correctly.
Wow so wholesome! Guess slavery is okay, then (sarcasm)
It's in a way sort of like how in Sparta, children were taken from mothers and raised to be soldiers.
@@spoonhouseinc.1124it is okay
I really love this direction you have taken!
NV reminds me very much of the end of the Republic of Rome, when centralized and decentralized distributions of power were difficult questions dominating political theory of the time (Even if Roman senators had not the brass of Julius Caesar to say it aloud, I'm looking at you, Marius) and New Vegus seems to be wrestling with the same dynamic. I also enjoy the call back to the Roman perspectives on Civilization in Fallout NV, with groups like the Great Khans, The Boomers and Mr. New Vegas being very much like the Germans, Sarmatians and Palmyrians. This game is so influenced by classical history, and it makes me so pleased.
Thanks Snail! It's so obvious but I never thought of the Khans as similar to the Germanic tribes. Very well put.
Small correction, Vault City was coerced into joining the Ncr with the use of underhanded tactics , like hiring mercenaries to harass the town
This was one of the main reasons that made me enjoy this game! There was no clear "good" or "bad" side! This game was way ahead of it's time!
More like this! This is great! Hearing about these factions in great detail and making it not too complicated to listen is great to listen to, like a podcast. Keep it up man.
This was a very interesting video indeed. I've played Fallout New Vegas for many years now and was still in the dark about most of these details you bring up. It brings the usually scattered puzzle pieces into one - easily digestible, straight to the point video. I commend you on this achievement. Hope to see more things like this in the future.
Thanks! I definitely want to investigate the smaller factions at some point.
awesome video! I just recently found your channel through souls lore videos (binge watched just about all of them). love the way you breakdown and present information. hope to see you doing more these videos for other games, and excited to see where you take your channel from here since soulsborne may be just about over.
Can already tell this video will be great.
Subbed.
That was pretty great but it left me wanting more!
This is awesome man! As much as I love soulsborne I feel like that well may have ran somewhat dry. Would love to see more different lore series from you, fallout especially.
This was really good, I myself was just going to work on a video gushing about NV. I hope to see more of these, NV doesn't get the conversations it deserves.
yeah boi he's doin vids on shit he actually likes and its better than ever
the king is BACC
That was a really interesting video, looking forward to more fallout new vegas stuff. The NCR and Legion are both relics, I think, the latter to a much greater extent of course, and neither are really suited to wasteland. Mr House too, now that i think about it. I think one of the ideas the devs were trying to put forward was how, in a broken world, the old way of things wouldn't be able to work, and instead of trying to rebuild what once existed, something new needed to be made. Moira Brown from FO3 said something to that effect as well, and even though it was made by different devs, i think that still applies. With that in mind though it annoys me that the WGTOW (Wastelanders Going Their Own Way) ending ended with as much suffering as it did, no matter what your own courier did. Mine was a 10 INT, 10 CHA, and 100/100 bartering and speech character, with pretty much the best outcome in every quest, and it made almost no difference in the end. A wasteland under his rule should have been paradise, dammit!
Kzer Pie Thanks for giving it a shot! I agree. The beauty of New Vegas is that nobody is 100% right, but you go in expecting that. It makes the story much more interesting.
You've now done Lore Videos on my Top 3 Favorite Games of all time
This is why I love New Vegas so much. This game came out over ten years and there's still daily posts and threads about it on reddit and 4chan. I don't remember much of fo3 or fo4 apart from finding your family or something. But New Vegas is still a great topic of discussion.
Good stuff mate, keep at it!
I know this is an older video but well done!
This is great! You should post something regarding Mr. House, Yes Man, etc.
I love the souls games but fallout will always be my first true love. I only know of one other channel that has more than one or two videos on topics like this in the fallout universe and I can't watch them because of the way the guy talks. I'll watch your stuff either way but I love the idea of branching out with stuff like this and you're freaking great at it. 10 out of 10 ign approved.haha
8:26 many actual legion of Rome did this exact thing. After retiring, roman soldiers would go on to settle newly conquered land.
Hey this was a really cool video! I've never seen a video that really explained the flaws in the legion from a non moral view. Very well done. I was curious if you could tell me what mods you use, specifically the armor you're wearing in the footage. Thanks!
Great video! I'd love a New Vegas remaster for nextgen consoles like Dark Souls got.
Good video, it's cool to see a more deep and analytical approach to discussing New Vegas's factions. Perhaps somebody who spends their time deciphering Dark Souls lore is best suited to this kind of thing? Anyway, being a Legion guy myself, I personally find Cesare's factually incorrect definition of Pax Romana as inconsequential, as I personally think his interpretation of it serves as a good ideological building block to forging a state that can successfully conquer, unite, and prosper in the Wasteland of the United States. In my opinion, subjecting conquered peoples to a culture and government of total submission and forced assimilation would benefit the Legion immensely. As the various population centers of Post-War America have not had large scale contact with each other for hundreds of years, you can expect that these regions have become very culturally diverse and independent. For The Legion, ruling over such a multi-cultured empire would make long term stability impossible. Say what you want about homogeneous societies, but stability is much easier too create and maintain in an environment where everyone speaks one language, believes in one ideology, and submits to one faith. Aside from that, I most definitely agree with you that the Legion is by far too much Cesare's cult of personality and he needs to put some serious effort into grooming a successor who can fully understand, appreciate, and carry on his vision, if that is even possible. Finally, House cancer degenerates belong on a cross.
Some well established and balanced thoughts here, this sort of commentary is why I did the video. What I wouldn't give to see a hypothetical timeline of 100 years after completing New Vegas, from the perspective of a victory of each faction separately.
At the very least, some fan made a map featuring the Fallout world decades after a NCR victory. Check it out: pre02.deviantart.net/4268/th/pre/f/2013/016/5/b/falloutverse_2322_by_mattystereo-d5ros4f.png
You should definitely branch off into other franchises and their lore, since you make quality lore vids
Also mistercaption is the best
6:26 Man, those Legion boys love to jump.
Such a good game, the story is so good people still talk about it years later.
enjoyed this first video. just curious Mitch, will talk about the Brother hood of steel faction that's in New Vegas. there presence there is very small though
1:50 "imperial nature" and "pre war democracy" are the same thing.
YES
Hi! Congrats on the video, great as always. May I ask, what mods do you use?, your game looks gorgeous.
I wish this video had background music from Goodsprings
High taxes isn't necessarily a bad thing but the ncr seems to not really care about social programs don't see any schools or hospitals. Now how yes man ending turns out is more on what type of anarchist the player is.
Goodsprings isn't NCR though.
What I like about NV is what each faction represents. NCR democracy, Legion Dictatorship, and Mr. House is like a CEO of when Corporations is the government.
Please do another New Vegas analysis :D
more!!
I can see why Fallout Las Vegas is a beloved game, the politics are deep and very human. I even like how some people have a false interpretation of certain scripture and even hide their hatred behind a cause to which they fight. That's the kind of stuff that makes you question your own perspective on certain morals you hold dear to yourself and in a lot of cases you don't know until you play a part.
Interesting, analysis of Caesar's legion, however I would like to point out some misconceptions with it's comparison to ancient Rome, your analysis of Caesar's legion being fueled by war and expansion is completely legitimate however that makes Caesar's legion more similar to an ancient eastern empire (like Assyria or Persia) that was based on collectivism, and expansion. Ironically in my opinion the NCR is closer to being Roman, despite the obvious lack of aesthetic, due to the millitarist nature of the administration and the drive for the Republican government to create more commercial wealth and roman territories. The issues you cited as being the cause to Rome's downfall I simply don't believe to be true. The roman economy didn't necessarily need expansion to remain stable, in fact the expansion and is what I believe caused the eventual downfall off Rome's economy as only the rich patrician classes benefited from the slaves and the common citizens saw their lands bought out by large rich slave owning families. This led to most common people moving to the cities where they were sustained by mass welfare (Bread and Circuses) and the divide of the Rich and the Poor growing even more (the main economic reason I usually see referenced when in the context off the fall of Rome) From what I understand lack of slaves wasn't an issue in Rome, (slaves will still reproduce despite poor conditions, in a r-selected reproductive strategy type sense, usually forced by their masters, as in they have as many children as possible) and that's assuming that a slave was treated that badly. In Rome however especially towards the later years slaves on Patrician's villa's had a much better standard off living than roman citizens in the slums of the cities (such as Rome) where they were sustained by handouts from the government.
Either way your analysis of Caesar's Legion was spot on, though I think the developers should have used a better ancient civilization for the legion to model it's aesthetic after, because Rome even under the empire had nothing to do with the base collectivism (the great khans and Mongolia would have been more suitable)
Also, Ofc, you need to continue this this was fucking amazing.
Bystrk I heartily echo your thoughts.
I believe it was wanted by obsidian, also as a joke as fallout, at least the real ones, are always "humorous".
it's not "real" roman empire, but the "perceived" roman empire.
like Ben Hur's roman empire or something like that.
this is also evident by their apparel, as they aren't just basing themselves on Roman Empire ideals and social structure but they literally "wear" Roman armors and insignias.
you can say it's like a "coat of paint", a "political cosplay"...
1r0zz another thing that's funny is that the legion doesn't even understand basic latin; they pronounce Caesar's name incorrectly and even Caesar doesn't understand that Pax means peace.
jabobok786 No, the way they pronounce Caesar is correct. it's they way roman's would've said it.
I wouldn't say he doesn't understand that pax means peace only that he misunderstands how that peace was obtained.
It kind of reminds me of natural rights philosophy with John Locke and Thomas Hobbes. Locke believed in a constitution and government that existed for the people, while hobbes believed in a government that ruled its citizens through fear. Either way a citizen was giving up certain natural rights in order to live a safe life the government would enforce. I think this fits very well with the whole idea of a wasteland where everything is dangerous and everybody is in a relatively natural state free of government.
Caesar doesnt hate modern medicine
Just started playing again yesterday, odd timing
Wow, this is interesting, keep it up, do non- blood souls stuff if you like it, your community will understand, well at least most of it
True to Ceasar
I feel the need to state that Goodsprings and Nipton are not a part of the NCR, and that is why the NCR doesn't really care when they get attacked. It isn't incompetence, it's merely that they have no reason to expend resources defending these towns. In addition to this, Kurtis is not a member of the NCR who is disloyal. He was a Legion spy planted there years prior to the events of New Vegas.
What enb was you using in this video?
put "orphans" in front of blades in the title and you might catch a bunch of tom waits fans unawares mitch
Many people don’t seem to pick up the same political aspects of mr house as I do. To me his purpose is to show the downside of a society built entirely on order, wealth, and petty hedonism, as well as being an antithesis to the couriers individualism. But most people just get “rich old guy with robots who’s also kind of a dick”
there's only one true choice for who should rule New Vegas: Mr. House!
What’s your mod list?
There are no slave children in the legion, Children are taken from their parents and raised by priestesses to become part of the military. If you aren't a part of the military you aren't a part of the legion, Citizenship through service. You can live under them without being a citizen, but you still have to live by caesar's laws and whatever the legionaries say.
I'd argue Caesar may have spoken to a super mutant or 2 about the master. He sounds very much like the master in his unity ideology, he just applies it to culture instead of evolution
how old is this game?
As good if not better than Bloodsouls content.
Achshually
The Legion breeds new kids every day, their woman slaves are breeders and that's their only purpouse
I'm really sorry fam, but you're triggering my misophonia something fierce. I'm sure it was a good, very interesting video, but I'll have to sit this one out before this drives me insane. Once again, really sorry.
the legion i.e wannabes
>Hegelian dialectics
>not being a Marxist
Sad!
>being a Marxist
Die!
What are you talking about? There is a morally correct faction in Fallout: New Vegas, its the NCR. Sure, it has a bunch of problems that the old pre-war US had in that universe, and that the NCR is largely overextended as of the events of the game, but they are still a representative government made of the people by the people for the people. Every other faction you can finish the conflict with is simply a matter of choosing the flavor of despot you like the best. Caesars legion is pretty much a tyrant dictator enslaving every group of people he comes across, also treating all women like slaves. So.... yeah... evil... Mr. House isn't much better being a neoliberal venture capitalist so far removed from his own humanity that people are simply pawns to be used as cogs in his ever turning machine of progress and imposing his will on New Vegas via a robot army. Finally, there's you... the player... using the same robot army Mr. House would have employed to control the Mojave. The game likes to paint this ending as an "Independent New Vegas", free to chart its own path, except that's a lie. Its free to follow the path that The Courier wants and anyone who disagrees within or without has a date with a securitron. To be fair, its never clarified what kind of ruler that the courier becomes after the battle at hoover dam, but the fact that the courier now runs New Vegas by no one's consent but their own and there are zero checks and balances on their authority should be alarming for anyone with a passing knowledge of how governments work. Even then, there's no telling what "Yes Man" meant by "Becoming more assertive" and how that might play into things.
Morally correct faction:
- Opens fire on civilians trying to use water which doesn't even belong to the NCR
- Straight up tells you to assassinate political leaders opposing them, with diplomacy being something you have to go out of your way to achieve
- Distorting the truth to make the campaign appear better then it actually is
- Sending multiple people into a vault filled with pre war hydroponic experiments that straight up created a new breed of mutated humanoid and believe they can use it without any sort of repercussion while literally being surrounded by it
- Senate is pretty much in the pocket of the Brahmin barons to the point where one can straight up cause a famine in the New Vegas are with a single declaration
- The fact their president was put in office due to blatant imperialism displacing native people off their land and forcing them into reservations in the middle of nowhere, even after agreeing to treaties that would respect their rights and tribal lands.
I'm not trying to say that democracy is bad, nor that the NCR is bad. But "having problems" is extremely different to a blatant empire that's been twisted and corrupted into the same government that ended the world. the New California Republic (in modern day) is more of an oligarchy then a democracy, considering that those in office and senate are put there via either political backrubbing, money or drumming up sentiment against mutants, ghouls and tribals as populists. While I do like the NCR and see they have many positive notes, the fact supporting them blindly will just make it even worse.
The entire point of New Vegas is, depending on how you feel and how you feel about the Mojave, every choice is "technically" a viable one.
The problem with slaves is that if the females are supposed to be the breeders and yet they don't provide the eugenically best child available to the Legion, they are in fact weakening the group through their presence. In this instance I'm not shaming the idea of slavery in the Legion(as it could be a starting form of economy for it) but rather that females being given the same rights as males in the group would not only provide multiple stronger soldiers but also(following Caesar's own logic for the Legion) would produce the strongest warriors possible from the stronger and more adaptable children.
seems like you don’t understand pax romana- the “roman peace” so often described in roman literature is one sided- caesars view is far more historically accurate, even if it’s misguided to retread that ground. a famous quote from a tribal leadee conquered by the original caesar sums it up- where the romans make a wasteland, they call it “peace”