appreciate the comments here gamers, let’s not make it a space to vent disparagement towards the game or devs here tho, not what i’m lookin to do and not what this community is about. just wanted to share some thoughts on the present, ideas for future directions, and reflect on the past where i ate so much wheat in one sitting i shit myself every couple hours for five days
so glad you said sneakers and not boots because of the incident in 2018 when i thought mr. blake’s boots looked appetizing during our semester-ending class jeopardy game and ended up in the ER
yeah the doctor gave me a fist bump and said he tried the same thing back when he was a kid in mr. blake's class, was surreal. think i need to become a doctor now
Queen Nai being bad is a completely out of date take since katars no longer need 4 dex, and that happened over a year ago. Nai has made top 8s in both 1v1 and 2v2 in multiple lan championships since then.
thats all there is to pick up. remaining is nonsense people acted the same when axe was new. only difference is brawlhalla got more popular and there are more people whining
I like how Egg chooses his music for the background, the way it builds up the history with him, going from a "we're fighting the monster" vibe when he is talking about the problems to a happy end of season at the end when he talks about the part of the changes
13:35 What are you eggsoup?? No go ahead please tell us. Or are you too afraid? Afraid that your true identity will be known??? You can't hide forever. The truth will always come out eventually...
A friend and I were discussing that there should be a new legend embargo so that they cannot be played in ranked until their first balance patch. They should add a non experimental 1v1 mode outside of ranked as well so people can actually fully warm up before their ranked matches.
agreed! i think new legends aren’t so powerful that they’re skewing ranked entirely, and i do understand their logic of wanting a lot of data right away, but having a restriction gives an air of legitimacy to the game and their decisions that i think is tangible and valuable. plus if there’s a proper casual 1v1 mode, that would be the hotspot people would queue to try out the new gamer
On the topic of broken being relative: I think the main problem comes from Characters with very strong signatures (Imugi being a good example). While for top tier players these differences are relatively minor: they aren’t for your average player (around gold). Having signatures that do a lot of damage and are difficult to punish makes them disproportionally strong at those ranks because people already struggle to punish normal signatures. On paper the brawlhalla balance is very good. In high tier play it is very very close. But in “low” tier play… well, its no coincidence you’ll see the same characters over and over and over again. This is especially bad (as you later mention I now see) for imugi, who’se main flaw is supposed to be his speed/dex. But his strong sigs compensate for this weakness
I mean at the very least some old characters match the hitbox sizes that the most recent ones have, such as Hattori, her Nsigs and Dsig are pretty solid to be that old onto the game, but oh well, BM is too lazy to rework some older legends to match the current in power. They barely did sentinel and only added an extra swing on side sig. The thing I think matters the most is that the newer characters have more interesting skills, more mechanics more tools, like active imput, that older legends (for example bodvar) do not have. And the more tools you have to mix up and less with your opponent, the more chance you have of winning This is why weapons such as great sword are so strong. People just don't know how to deal with them because of how complex they are compared to other weapons
yeah i didn’t really elaborate on that point as well as i could have. the main idea is that a lot of sigs that are comparatively “simple” can be a lot stronger than those with a bunch of fancy shmancy mechanics - so the convo going down that route feels like focusing on the wrong thing. especially when new mechanics can be super fun! older legends tend to occupy the status near the “best” based on meta shifts… just not the top spot when someone new comes out
Yes but ur argument can be used to say the contrary. Although weapons that have fancy new mechanics like greatsword are often quite strong, they are also harder to master. Yes greatsword can be harder to anticipate because of how complex it is, but if its complex for u, it has been for the other guy that learned it aswel. One could argue that since it takes more skill it could be stronger than bow or sword which are stupidly simple weapons despite still being very strong
Something you didn't mention is the possibility that Brawlhalla are deliberately releasing legends in an overtuned and imbalanced state so people spend money on them and then come with the nerfs to preserve balance and repeat the cycle.
@@vinhsannguyen2100 im indeed saying what i want. People just say this everytime a legend get released but after a week or so stuff just gonna die down and nobody cares about it anymore
I think it’s good for the game, there needs to be more excitement and action, but the devs should consider revamping the older legends soon. Most of the older legends are not even remotely “bad” but it’s easy to think that when the sigs are so plain and dull in comparison. The devs should definitely prioritize a make over for most older sig kits. Even the base model for the older legends need to be revamped. The brawlhalla UI as a whole needs to be revamped. The newer legends show us how talented the art team is, but it’s like they’re forgetting the past with each release lol.
Isnt it logical for marketing, but also just for gamer's interests to have a new legend being good and perhaps even slightly overpowered instead of having boring new legends that barely anybody plays, (like dusk, ezio, reno, vector, magyar etc...) and provoke no interest at all because of how lame/bad their are gameplay wise ? I personally prefer having a new legend that is very good, or even to some extent broken, and having them adjust it afterwards if necessary instead of a new character that i will never play any other day than it's release date. I feel like this is especially important for brawlhalla since the new characters are almost the only new content for the game and that they are already very rare.
Brawlhalla def has a problem with trying to constantly one up the latest legend with a new gimmicks and op sigs and stats. Until the newest legend will have a complete fucking cutscene as a sig.
I think there's a fundamental problem in the game that makes it hard to "balance", which is that dex does very little. So if you want to make a character a slugger, you can only give them slow sigs. But they will still have a fast weapon kit, which means you just have a strong character with great stats and a bad sig kit.
It makes sense for brand new characters to be/feel slightly more powerful, and adding new mechanics is kinda required to make them feel unique. But I don't know if these new characters actually have faster/stronger sigs (Like, comparing Imugi to Teros or Ulgrim) or if it's just getting used to new attacks
YES! THANK YOU! i miss og brawl, back when people wouldnt weapon stall. It just feels so sweaty and i miss when it wasnt about winning but about cool combos and 0 to deaths.
I think in brawlhalla u can technically make any weapon and any character work but what separates things is how easy they are to make work. Some weapons/characters are just generally gonna have a tougher time winning than others and this can be bc of the meta and matchups or simply due to the character lacking something like having bad stats, bad sigs, a bad weapon comp or any combination of these options.
I think something that could help your point, of having more definied archetypes (or at least, that's something i would really like to see), is reworking stats and/or stances. Sometimes they just dont get it right on the first time, and i think the game would ultimately benefit if stats were to be tweaked and rebalanced post release, in light of a way larger, community feedback. And i think they haven't tried this yet becuase they might fear that it would take away from the legend's uniqueness, given that stats are the only variables to a universal moveset. Which is fair, but it sometimes can result in very awkward stat lines that actually take away from a legend truly fitting into a supposed archetype (even in recent releases, just look at Loki).
I 100% agree but to me the biggest issue with the new sigs isn't that they fit the arctype but a more general problem: They cover too much or are not situational enough. Like sigs on earlier characters seem designed about an idea of "here is this specific range or thing and a sig you can press in that moment to cover it" but also include a very clear counterplay / weakness. I feel like that design principle got a bit lost with sigs like loki scythe side sig, vivi boots nsig and imugi axe side sig.
As a cross enthusiast with 300+ hours i didn't mind at all the power levels getting freaky, it may be due to myself throwing my gauntlets at them mid-combo interrupting their full screen special attacks but as of now as long i don't use anyone beside him and his big ol stand hand
I think more legends should get new reworks/signatures just to try something new and experimental and see if it works or doesn’t and it would be fun if more legends got that treatment
Honestly only characters I have a problem with in ranked 2v2 is double imugi. Makes me wanna smash my head on a wall. Side sig hit box extends so long, you have the like 2 frames to touch the ground and move before you the next one is spammed on most maps
No legend has made me wanna quit the game like imugi. I played 2 days when he came and I haven’t played much since. I’m waiting till he gets nerfed bc he is crazy.
@@tinobeano I did play last night. I beat 2 out of 3 imugis. I don’t think it’s too too much of a skill issue, but a imugi hitbox issue. No reason his sigs should be as fast as they r for a 3 speed legend. I’m getting more used to his sigs but yea you’re right.
Somebody has likely already commented this but the Seven down sig at 1:13 actually can hit downwards. The flames from the bottom can deal a small amount of damage so that's why the Koji died at the bottom
Something I'd like to point out that others may have already, most of the player base is silver. A lot of the comparisons you're making here seem to be more geared towards the high end of skill, more about the potential of the character. From that perspective, I agree with basically all of the video, but a lot of the pain people are experiencing comes from lower down where they might not have as good spacing, might not punish that well, dodge unpredictably, and otherwise adapt during play. Take a look at two of the "toxic" characters (by which I mean not always but known to be taken in order to sig spam) Loki and Artemis. Artemis' lance ssig comes out relatively quickly, makes her move unpredictably, and otherwise is difficult to punish if you don't predict it. It's not the greatest thing at the higher levels since you as the opponent can punish the move more easily, but at the lower levels it can be a huge menace. Loki's scythe ssig suffers from the same issue, it has a MASSIVE hitbox, and it's nontrivial to punish. Again, those at a lower skill level are going to struggle more with that than someone who's a lot more used to it. I wouldn't consider Artemis to be a power creep character (as annoying as it is to play against 5 of them in a row), but Loki on the other hand, I mean you saw what he was like on release. Every legend goes through that somewhat, but more recently it's becoming harder and harder for the majority of players to deal with the new legends being more easily abused, and the solution shouldn't be "skill issue, just get better at the game and you won't have to play against sig spam" because that takes a *long* time to fully escape it.
I got an interesting take, first of all, people from bmg, whoever makes these characters are only human. So its probably not surprising they make their next character a little OP because they're also trying to make a unique character. Think about it, I cant even fathom of making a new character while also making a whole branding identity of it with unique skill sets. Whether or not the next character is significantly better by design is intentional or not, I think its a matter of experience and how much time they had as a game dev. The first row of characters from more than a decade ago dont match with the newly released row of the past few years. To me, that makes sense. But also thats just my opinion without statistics and or their reasoning for it. To avoid this complication, surely they could have just made 'rules' to say "These are our parameters for our characters, they have to be equal to the ones we made nearly a decade ago".
As a returning (2 year hiatus) longtime Diamond and tournament player seeing all these new legends, it's insane to me how players have normalized blatantly crept legends. Not all legends are outright creep and it's not necessarily about the additional mechanics they have, but it's usually how they're implemented and how fast they can be... While I'm back to diamond already, I know how to recognize unhealthy and bad design from a mile away. Just because they aren't S tier does not mean they are fine and everyone should just get gud, it's just bad to leave them that way and it makes them pub + low rank stompers. It also steadily makes things worse because they become bases for balance, and each time any changes are made or a new legend comes out, that creep continues rising. So like... Why not call it out early and prevent it? Players are weird. They rather that things become absolutely a huge problem before admitting something is a problem. Do people not realize stats are becoming more of an afterthought as time passes?
Although I love Imugi's design and concept, he really isn't fun to play OR go against. I acrually like playing with characters like Queen Nai, slow and powerful sigs, while Imugi's sigs feel a little off relative to his speed and are extremely hard to punish. I hope BMG tunes these sigs down to match Teros and Queen Nai
I think the power creep in this game has been noticeable since the introduction of characters with directional input moves. Giving some characters more options than others just doesn’t make sense. I understand that it may require more skill to properly use these attacks but it just means that the higher end of players is forced to use a very limited pool of characters or weapons if they want to be competitive. BMG should rework some of the moves for older weapons and characters to bring them up to speed with the new stuff. This would probably result in more variety/options for players.
I haven’t noticed power creep as you did and I find it interesting I thought the power creep from Pokémon gen 3 to 4 was noticeable and from gen 4 to 5 and onwards power creep became blatantly obvious maybe I didn’t notice because the power creep in brawlhalla wasn’t as obvious to me than it was to me in Pokemon
I think bringing older legends up to speed could help counterbalance the power creep, but nobody likes when you change something that everyone's already used to. But you can't release a new guy and have him be mid just to avoid power creep.
Ok no but fr: Raptor and tezca are the only ones actually being played much, thea has been tried by boomie and the rest is kinda just 1 pick and then they stopped, imugi i agree is kinda overtuned but like did we all forget how insane gauntlets were on release? Or how stupid thor orb stall was? Some stuff just is busted on release and then gets nerfed cause its hard to judge balance without testing stuff in a big player pool. Not saying imugi isnt strong but curretn trends show that old legends without a doubt can perform just as well
yeah your last point is really what i wanted to illustrate with the bulk of this vid. putting it all into a brawlhalla centered context is important bc it’s not like the other 60 legends become irrelevant when someone new drops
@@eggsoup something you missed out on that is very very VERRYYYYYYYY importanttttttt is how powercreep affects Walker attack (the main gamemode of Brawlhalla) because when cross got reelased he was VERY CLEARLYYYYY the best character as everyone obviously knows, i do understand keeping that out so the video is shorter and more digestable tho as veeryone obviously knows this since its the main gamemode of the game 😤
YESS, this is exactly what i think of when a new legend is released... this is also exactly what caused me to stop playing league of legends(power creep, 1 of many reasons)
Yeah it's literally the same. Imugi is supposed to be this really slow character but his sigs are really fast which don't fit. Assassins are supposed to be hard and high skill and they made Briar and Naafiri with point and click abilities because they wanted to make an easy assassin
I feel like at this point they're using power creep as a way to better promote these new legends to more people. Now honestly, I don't think that's a bad idea. Cause sometimes people will discover some new things about these legends like seven's cannon dsig hitting down and vivi's blasters ssig hitting up on a wall. The only thing that I hope they get a little better at is properly balancing these new legends more consistently.
Thing is... I use red raptor and loki because I suck at the game so when I use both of them I get into the level of a decent player. They're not OP for me, they're crotches
God I remember When I picked up Tezca I was a Ragnir main before I liked ragnir bc I ❤ dragons and I love Jaguars too so I tried Tezca Dear god I remember landing like a whole 20seconds worth of comboes before I realised how busted battle boots are
I'm gonna be honest, from experience I think the power creep is vastly overstated. Even with most of the new legends being suppousedly busted I'd be lucky to find a small handfull of people who actually play them. Especially a week or two after release. I just think most of the uproar about "Legend X being broken" is mostly hot air and hype, combined with the fact that people just aren't used to seeing them and haven't found ways to counter them yet.
During my placement games I lost three times, one of which was against a toxic Imugi sig spammer, and you know how that went, I tried man I tried. (Still landed plat though)
the only thing i dont like about thea is how they gave her both low defense AND attack. Like, i get it if you wanted to make a fast but weak character but they shouldve given her either more defense or attack. OR MAYBE NOT MAKE THE DEFENSE STANCE TAKE ONE AWAY FROM ATTACK
I started to see the problem when Mordex came in with the whole power creep and scythe. I figured they would fix that...now its Tezca? How long has I been gone?
I had this conversation on another video. The Devs do this intentionally, to cause hype and usage of new characters. Cause later they always nerf them to the ground
The biggest issue for me is the fact that the hitboxes are so disjointed and inaccurate with the visuals it's so confusing having come back from not playing a long time. Like I visually can't tell where Loki or Red raptors hitboxes are and it's really frustrating
7:20 "just because something has an additional use case doesn't automatically make it better.." Every other legend would drop their sig half way into the wall, possibly getting you killed. Vivi actually finishes her sig all the way no matter at what angle you hit your opponent. I think that makes it better
I think the developers have learnt something from older legends I mean just look at Arcadia, 7 dexterity on a greatsword and spear. Yes she has some nice signature moves but what's the point? It would make sense that newer legends have better stats and weapon combos I've always complained about "wasted stats 🚮", those for me being attack but mainly dexterity (for weapons that really don't need it e.g. Arcadia) so seeing those like Seven and Imugi having 3 dexterity for their weapon choices always seemed fair to me, and giving them any amount of speed above 4 would be crazy, That's why Ulgrim and Teros in my opinion are still one of the best characters in the game, even if I despise them. But still, if it carries on then some of the old legends will need a rework. One being Jiro. I know that stats stay the same but I beg that they do something, anything, to give him one or two more defence. Also, the down sig of his needs more range and should throw him back a bit instead him and the scythe being thrown forward. The candles on my Jiro alter are still alight, so, there is hope.
Im a gold player right, so basically I NEVER play ranked because I get so tilted but since picking up imugi I started winning so much on experimental that I play against platinums and I even went against some diamonds even though im technically still only gold like mid gold too not even high gold. Granted I haven’t played ranked in years and have gotten significantly better since then.
There is one legend that I really wonder what eggsoup thinks about them. And its Zariel. Imo the most underused legends and especially one that is never talked about.
appreciate the comments here gamers, let’s not make it a space to vent disparagement towards the game or devs here tho, not what i’m lookin to do and not what this community is about. just wanted to share some thoughts on the present, ideas for future directions, and reflect on the past where i ate so much wheat in one sitting i shit myself every couple hours for five days
'and i am a penguin'
@@eggsoup thank u so much
Brawhalla is a social experiment to see if a pair of sneakers is enough to kill a game.
so glad you said sneakers and not boots because of the incident in 2018 when i thought mr. blake’s boots looked appetizing during our semester-ending class jeopardy game and ended up in the ER
@@eggsoup true story
Insane@@eggsoup
@@eggsoup Were they though? Was it worth it?
yeah the doctor gave me a fist bump and said he tried the same thing back when he was a kid in mr. blake's class, was surreal. think i need to become a doctor now
tezca mains are single handedly keeping me below plat
I made it to plat last season with zariel , it was a struggle
it is my pleasure to help keeping you below platinum
If you’re struggling to get to plat then it’s not legend matchups that’s responsible for keeping you there if I’m being honest.
@@issacbruhmoments4449 thanks bro ik you always got my back 🙏🙏
@@hackalbh7993 honestly fair I just started like a month ago lol, starting to win more games now though hopefully I do better this season
5:07 “queen nai, shes bad”
hell yeah she is👅👅👅🥵
(this is all i picked up from this video)
@@lincolncapsalot168 lmao
MY MAN 🤝
🫠
Queen Nai being bad is a completely out of date take since katars no longer need 4 dex, and that happened over a year ago. Nai has made top 8s in both 1v1 and 2v2 in multiple lan championships since then.
thats all there is to pick up. remaining is nonsense
people acted the same when axe was new. only difference is brawlhalla got more popular and there are more people whining
I understand that new legends have to have a wow factor, but it shouldn’t be at the cost of balance
Most games do it. Brawlhalla, COD, Multiversus, it's the corporate greed side of gaming
@@TGreenieU new characters need new experimental stuff so people are interested, and new experimental stuff is hard to balance...
@@TGreenieU i feel like RoA did a good job though tbf they were more porting fan created characters into the official thing
0:10 every dlight is in sync with him saying "more" lol
idk if it's more impressive that it's also live commentary so he KNEW he was hitting those perfectly 😭
I like how Egg chooses his music for the background, the way it builds up the history with him, going from a "we're fighting the monster" vibe when he is talking about the problems to a happy end of season at the end when he talks about the part of the changes
@@gustavoaquino3725 I LOVE HOLLOW KNIGHT!
13:35 What are you eggsoup?? No go ahead please tell us. Or are you too afraid? Afraid that your true identity will be known??? You can't hide forever. The truth will always come out eventually...
That was me I told him to do that
@@notstampgoat who will eggsoup be tonight? That’s the question
@@PalmtreePenguinyou threatened him with a gun?
@@fredili3002 no on his recent post I asked him to put penguin in the outro
THE GLORIOUS MORNING IN THE BACKGROUND NO WAEEEE NOSTALGIA!!!! Got insane nostalgic feeling immediately after opening the vid
oh mannnnnn!!!!
Someone beat me to it
i love waterflame
That gd nostalgia hits
A friend and I were discussing that there should be a new legend embargo so that they cannot be played in ranked until their first balance patch. They should add a non experimental 1v1 mode outside of ranked as well so people can actually fully warm up before their ranked matches.
agreed! i think new legends aren’t so powerful that they’re skewing ranked entirely, and i do understand their logic of wanting a lot of data right away, but having a restriction gives an air of legitimacy to the game and their decisions that i think is tangible and valuable. plus if there’s a proper casual 1v1 mode, that would be the hotspot people would queue to try out the new gamer
something about this interaction with the asuri at 11:28 made my day
same fr
ik i love it when ppl emote on egg soup to then be destroyed 💀
your editing has grown so much dude it stood out a lot
ty gamer i worked hard on this one
@@eggsoup WHERES THE FART JOKE
The madlad put in the penguin request, what a man
My request is get my account to valhallan
On the topic of broken being relative:
I think the main problem comes from Characters with very strong signatures (Imugi being a good example). While for top tier players these differences are relatively minor: they aren’t for your average player (around gold).
Having signatures that do a lot of damage and are difficult to punish makes them disproportionally strong at those ranks because people already struggle to punish normal signatures.
On paper the brawlhalla balance is very good.
In high tier play it is very very close.
But in “low” tier play… well, its no coincidence you’ll see the same characters over and over and over again.
This is especially bad (as you later mention I now see) for imugi, who’se main flaw is supposed to be his speed/dex. But his strong sigs compensate for this weakness
I mean at the very least some old characters match the hitbox sizes that the most recent ones have, such as Hattori, her Nsigs and Dsig are pretty solid to be that old onto the game, but oh well, BM is too lazy to rework some older legends to match the current in power. They barely did sentinel and only added an extra swing on side sig.
The thing I think matters the most is that the newer characters have more interesting skills, more mechanics more tools, like active imput, that older legends (for example bodvar) do not have.
And the more tools you have to mix up and less with your opponent, the more chance you have of winning
This is why weapons such as great sword are so strong. People just don't know how to deal with them because of how complex they are compared to other weapons
yeah i didn’t really elaborate on that point as well as i could have. the main idea is that a lot of sigs that are comparatively “simple” can be a lot stronger than those with a bunch of fancy shmancy mechanics - so the convo going down that route feels like focusing on the wrong thing. especially when new mechanics can be super fun! older legends tend to occupy the status near the “best” based on meta shifts… just not the top spot when someone new comes out
Yes but ur argument can be used to say the contrary. Although weapons that have fancy new mechanics like greatsword are often quite strong, they are also harder to master. Yes greatsword can be harder to anticipate because of how complex it is, but if its complex for u, it has been for the other guy that learned it aswel. One could argue that since it takes more skill it could be stronger than bow or sword which are stupidly simple weapons despite still being very strong
0:07 bro what flashgame is this soundtrack from, holy nostalgia
age of war or smth like that
My goat put the song list in the description so you can do research what a guy
I think it's a waterflame song, sounds like Dance of the Violins
Wait nvm I think it's Sky Factory by Waterflame
Nvm I was right on it being a waterflame song but I got the wrong song. Glorious Morning by Waterflame
2:55 AM commentaries are my favorite genre of Eggsoup video
Musicalmulch
Something you didn't mention is the possibility that Brawlhalla are deliberately releasing legends in an overtuned and imbalanced state so people spend money on them and then come with the nerfs to preserve balance and repeat the cycle.
i don't think he'd wanna mention something like this because it's a theory, not fact.
@@aromanticlenfanatic Yeah but you don't have to state it as a fact.
Remember everyone, if the opponents legend is simply better than yours, Its a skill issue
If youre getting beaten, it is a skill issue mate
Have I ever played Brawlhalla for more than an hour? No. Am I going to watch a full video about its power balancing getting fucked? ABSOLUTELY
Imugi is so sig spammable and it's disgusting
I despise imugi. Every greatsword legend is op, but good lord imugi is so spammable and I hate it.
@@derekjsplayin Mako is ass, magyar mid, arcadia mid, jaeyun good and imugi is the only stupid one atm
Brawlhalla players everytime bmg release a new legend:
@@vinhsannguyen2100 im indeed saying what i want. People just say this everytime a legend get released but after a week or so stuff just gonna die down and nobody cares about it anymore
@@vietcongat5884stuff dies down because the players get a new character to complain about 😂
i like the fact that you put the penguin in the end to commemorate the guy that ask for it hehe
I think it’s good for the game, there needs to be more excitement and action, but the devs should consider revamping the older legends soon. Most of the older legends are not even remotely “bad” but it’s easy to think that when the sigs are so plain and dull in comparison. The devs should definitely prioritize a make over for most older sig kits. Even the base model for the older legends need to be revamped. The brawlhalla UI as a whole needs to be revamped. The newer legends show us how talented the art team is, but it’s like they’re forgetting the past with each release lol.
00:01 I love that song, I heard it in Geometry Dash once!
@@masoncarriker2255 it's from age of war too!
Glorious Morning - Waterflame
it’s in miragine war and age of war too
I’ll never understand why they decided to give the turtle signature moves that rival a lady wearing Hermes boots in speed and surpass them in strength
Isnt it logical for marketing, but also just for gamer's interests to have a new legend being good and perhaps even slightly overpowered instead of having boring new legends that barely anybody plays, (like dusk, ezio, reno, vector, magyar etc...) and provoke no interest at all because of how lame/bad their are gameplay wise ?
I personally prefer having a new legend that is very good, or even to some extent broken, and having them adjust it afterwards if necessary instead of a new character that i will never play any other day than it's release date.
I feel like this is especially important for brawlhalla since the new characters are almost the only new content for the game and that they are already very rare.
HONESTLY I MOSTLY AGREE
0:09 love that the dwlivery syncs with the attacks. Soothes my smooth head flesh.
Brawlhalla def has a problem with trying to constantly one up the latest legend with a new gimmicks and op sigs and stats. Until the newest legend will have a complete fucking cutscene as a sig.
I think there's a fundamental problem in the game that makes it hard to "balance", which is that dex does very little. So if you want to make a character a slugger, you can only give them slow sigs. But they will still have a fast weapon kit, which means you just have a strong character with great stats and a bad sig kit.
It makes sense for brand new characters to be/feel slightly more powerful, and adding new mechanics is kinda required to make them feel unique. But I don't know if these new characters actually have faster/stronger sigs (Like, comparing Imugi to Teros or Ulgrim) or if it's just getting used to new attacks
Love the channel my dude. You're my goto for updates regarding the newer content being released.
YES! THANK YOU!
i miss og brawl, back when people wouldnt weapon stall. It just feels so sweaty and i miss when it wasnt about winning but about cool combos and 0 to deaths.
Age of war song in the intro sparked nostalgia i didnt know i had
I think in brawlhalla u can technically make any weapon and any character work but what separates things is how easy they are to make work. Some weapons/characters are just generally gonna have a tougher time winning than others and this can be bc of the meta and matchups or simply due to the character lacking something like having bad stats, bad sigs, a bad weapon comp or any combination of these options.
"at the end of the day we're all human you are human and i *penguin*" i love that it cuts out on that last part
I think something that could help your point, of having more definied archetypes (or at least, that's something i would really like to see), is reworking stats and/or stances. Sometimes they just dont get it right on the first time, and i think the game would ultimately benefit if stats were to be tweaked and rebalanced post release, in light of a way larger, community feedback. And i think they haven't tried this yet becuase they might fear that it would take away from the legend's uniqueness, given that stats are the only variables to a universal moveset. Which is fair, but it sometimes can result in very awkward stat lines that actually take away from a legend truly fitting into a supposed archetype (even in recent releases, just look at Loki).
As a faith main, I feel this pain, THE HITBOXES CAN BE SO BAS CLOSE RANGE
I 100% agree but to me the biggest issue with the new sigs isn't that they fit the arctype but a more general problem: They cover too much or are not situational enough. Like sigs on earlier characters seem designed about an idea of "here is this specific range or thing and a sig you can press in that moment to cover it" but also include a very clear counterplay / weakness. I feel like that design principle got a bit lost with sigs like loki scythe side sig, vivi boots nsig and imugi axe side sig.
As a cross enthusiast with 300+ hours i didn't mind at all the power levels getting freaky, it may be due to myself throwing my gauntlets at them mid-combo interrupting their full screen special attacks but as of now as long i don't use anyone beside him and his big ol stand hand
Did not expect Glorious Morning to start playing when starting this video
One thing that i wish will be added to the game (for balance reasons): make newer legends just playable in ranked when they are also tournament legal
I havnt been this scared about a new legend since mako but was crazy is that I’ve only lost one ranked game against an imugi
I think more legends should get new reworks/signatures just to try something new and experimental and see if it works or doesn’t and it would be fun if more legends got that treatment
Honestly only characters I have a problem with in ranked 2v2 is double imugi. Makes me wanna smash my head on a wall. Side sig hit box extends so long, you have the like 2 frames to touch the ground and move before you the next one is spammed on most maps
Aw brawl halls was my childhood game sad to see it fall off like that
As someone who played Teros almost religiously back in the day, a lot of these newer characters look like a nightmare to play against.
No legend has made me wanna quit the game like imugi. I played 2 days when he came and I haven’t played much since. I’m waiting till he gets nerfed bc he is crazy.
this is a skill issue go to ranked and play without thinking NOW!!
@@tinobeano I did play last night. I beat 2 out of 3 imugis. I don’t think it’s too too much of a skill issue, but a imugi hitbox issue. No reason his sigs should be as fast as they r for a 3 speed legend. I’m getting more used to his sigs but yea you’re right.
@@JahazielCastillo i was joking a little on my last comment, but i definitely agree that those sigs are faster than they should be
Somebody has likely already commented this but the Seven down sig at 1:13 actually can hit downwards. The flames from the bottom can deal a small amount of damage so that's why the Koji died at the bottom
Feels like my boy Zariel was forgotten, I’ve barely seen any mains in any of the ranked games I play, but I’m still standing (yeah yeah yeah)
To be fair they could tune all old sigs. At least make difference between hitting air and ground. Side sig guns ada, bodwar side hammer, etc
Something I'd like to point out that others may have already, most of the player base is silver. A lot of the comparisons you're making here seem to be more geared towards the high end of skill, more about the potential of the character. From that perspective, I agree with basically all of the video, but a lot of the pain people are experiencing comes from lower down where they might not have as good spacing, might not punish that well, dodge unpredictably, and otherwise adapt during play.
Take a look at two of the "toxic" characters (by which I mean not always but known to be taken in order to sig spam) Loki and Artemis. Artemis' lance ssig comes out relatively quickly, makes her move unpredictably, and otherwise is difficult to punish if you don't predict it. It's not the greatest thing at the higher levels since you as the opponent can punish the move more easily, but at the lower levels it can be a huge menace. Loki's scythe ssig suffers from the same issue, it has a MASSIVE hitbox, and it's nontrivial to punish. Again, those at a lower skill level are going to struggle more with that than someone who's a lot more used to it.
I wouldn't consider Artemis to be a power creep character (as annoying as it is to play against 5 of them in a row), but Loki on the other hand, I mean you saw what he was like on release. Every legend goes through that somewhat, but more recently it's becoming harder and harder for the majority of players to deal with the new legends being more easily abused, and the solution shouldn't be "skill issue, just get better at the game and you won't have to play against sig spam" because that takes a *long* time to fully escape it.
this is a very good point ty for sharing
Music in the beginning hit my nostalgia hard
I got an interesting take, first of all, people from bmg, whoever makes these characters are only human. So its probably not surprising they make their next character a little OP because they're also trying to make a unique character. Think about it, I cant even fathom of making a new character while also making a whole branding identity of it with unique skill sets. Whether or not the next character is significantly better by design is intentional or not, I think its a matter of experience and how much time they had as a game dev. The first row of characters from more than a decade ago dont match with the newly released row of the past few years. To me, that makes sense. But also thats just my opinion without statistics and or their reasoning for it. To avoid this complication, surely they could have just made 'rules' to say "These are our parameters for our characters, they have to be equal to the ones we made nearly a decade ago".
@@ihuboo6244 w take tbh
interesting perspective, thank you for sharing! “out-of-the-box” thinking to create something fresh driving eventual power creep could make some sense
As a returning (2 year hiatus) longtime Diamond and tournament player seeing all these new legends, it's insane to me how players have normalized blatantly crept legends. Not all legends are outright creep and it's not necessarily about the additional mechanics they have, but it's usually how they're implemented and how fast they can be... While I'm back to diamond already, I know how to recognize unhealthy and bad design from a mile away. Just because they aren't S tier does not mean they are fine and everyone should just get gud, it's just bad to leave them that way and it makes them pub + low rank stompers. It also steadily makes things worse because they become bases for balance, and each time any changes are made or a new legend comes out, that creep continues rising. So like... Why not call it out early and prevent it? Players are weird. They rather that things become absolutely a huge problem before admitting something is a problem. Do people not realize stats are becoming more of an afterthought as time passes?
I love how supposed heavy weapons/characters are capable of spamming m1 and sigs with little to no cd or punish window.
I’m happy this video exists. It is exactly what I think about the game and about what might make the game way better.
Although I love Imugi's design and concept, he really isn't fun to play OR go against. I acrually like playing with characters like Queen Nai, slow and powerful sigs, while Imugi's sigs feel a little off relative to his speed and are extremely hard to punish. I hope BMG tunes these sigs down to match Teros and Queen Nai
I think the power creep in this game has been noticeable since the introduction of characters with directional input moves. Giving some characters more options than others just doesn’t make sense. I understand that it may require more skill to properly use these attacks but it just means that the higher end of players is forced to use a very limited pool of characters or weapons if they want to be competitive. BMG should rework some of the moves for older weapons and characters to bring them up to speed with the new stuff. This would probably result in more variety/options for players.
As somebody who mains Asuri, I constantly find myself wondering “wow why can’t my character do that”
I haven’t noticed power creep as you did and I find it interesting I thought the power creep from Pokémon gen 3 to 4 was noticeable and from gen 4 to 5 and onwards power creep became blatantly obvious maybe I didn’t notice because the power creep in brawlhalla wasn’t as obvious to me than it was to me in Pokemon
I think bringing older legends up to speed could help counterbalance the power creep, but nobody likes when you change something that everyone's already used to. But you can't release a new guy and have him be mid just to avoid power creep.
I play Brynn and just genuinely feel so disadvantaged against legends with ridiculous unpublishables
Ok no but fr:
Raptor and tezca are the only ones actually being played much, thea has been tried by boomie and the rest is kinda just 1 pick and then they stopped, imugi i agree is kinda overtuned but like did we all forget how insane gauntlets were on release?
Or how stupid thor orb stall was?
Some stuff just is busted on release and then gets nerfed cause its hard to judge balance without testing stuff in a big player pool.
Not saying imugi isnt strong but curretn trends show that old legends without a doubt can perform just as well
yeah your last point is really what i wanted to illustrate with the bulk of this vid. putting it all into a brawlhalla centered context is important bc it’s not like the other 60 legends become irrelevant when someone new drops
@@eggsoup something you missed out on that is very very VERRYYYYYYYY importanttttttt is how powercreep affects Walker attack (the main gamemode of Brawlhalla) because when cross got reelased he was VERY CLEARLYYYYY the best character as everyone obviously knows, i do understand keeping that out so the video is shorter and more digestable tho as veeryone obviously knows this since its the main gamemode of the game 😤
damn lol. way back when i played the game i played queen nai cause maxing defense felt like it would be really annoying for my opponent
YESS, this is exactly what i think of when a new legend is released... this is also exactly what caused me to stop playing league of legends(power creep, 1 of many reasons)
Yeah it's literally the same.
Imugi is supposed to be this really slow character but his sigs are really fast which don't fit.
Assassins are supposed to be hard and high skill and they made Briar and Naafiri with point and click abilities because they wanted to make an easy assassin
the hollow knight music just reminds me that silksong will never release
I feel like at this point they're using power creep as a way to better promote these new legends to more people. Now honestly, I don't think that's a bad idea. Cause sometimes people will discover some new things about these legends like seven's cannon dsig hitting down and vivi's blasters ssig hitting up on a wall. The only thing that I hope they get a little better at is properly balancing these new legends more consistently.
Thing is... I use red raptor and loki because I suck at the game so when I use both of them I get into the level of a decent player.
They're not OP for me, they're crotches
bro jammed my childhood musics in the first minute of the vid, like Age of War and then TF2 intro, bro gimme a break i WILL tear up
true and then when the new weapon is added the power creep will be worse than now
If you still don't think power creep is real, look at ember's katar sigs compared to the newest character.
Tf2 theme in the background
Tick tick tick tick tick
God I remember When I picked up Tezca I was a Ragnir main before
I liked ragnir bc I ❤ dragons and I love Jaguars too so I tried Tezca
Dear god I remember landing like a whole 20seconds worth of comboes before I realised how busted battle boots are
Magyar was underwhelming on release though. And he was after Jaeyun who was broken
I'm gonna be honest, from experience I think the power creep is vastly overstated.
Even with most of the new legends being suppousedly busted I'd be lucky to find a small handfull of people who actually play them. Especially a week or two after release.
I just think most of the uproar about "Legend X being broken" is mostly hot air and hype, combined with the fact that people just aren't used to seeing them and haven't found ways to counter them yet.
I absolutely LOVE your choice of soundtracks
they need to implement a sig meter!!! to reduce op sig spamming
During my placement games I lost three times, one of which was against a toxic Imugi sig spammer, and you know how that went, I tried man I tried. (Still landed plat though)
the only thing i dont like about thea is how they gave her both low defense AND attack. Like, i get it if you wanted to make a fast but weak character but they shouldve given her either more defense or attack. OR MAYBE NOT MAKE THE DEFENSE STANCE TAKE ONE AWAY FROM ATTACK
YOU USED AGE OF WAR MUSIC - 'GLORIOUS MORNING'
YOU UNLOCKED PART OF MY MEMORY I'D FORGOTTEN FOR YEARS WTF
I started to see the problem when Mordex came in with the whole power creep and scythe. I figured they would fix that...now its Tezca? How long has I been gone?
I had this conversation on another video. The Devs do this intentionally, to cause hype and usage of new characters. Cause later they always nerf them to the ground
they should fix older legends sigs just DROPPING on a wall meanwhile they are giving new characters completely different versions for on wall
As a tezca main I can confirm, he's pretty good
The biggest issue for me is the fact that the hitboxes are so disjointed and inaccurate with the visuals it's so confusing having come back from not playing a long time.
Like I visually can't tell where Loki or Red raptors hitboxes are and it's really frustrating
7:20 "just because something has an additional use case doesn't automatically make it better.."
Every other legend would drop their sig half way into the wall, possibly getting you killed. Vivi actually finishes her sig all the way no matter at what angle you hit your opponent. I think that makes it better
I think the developers have learnt something from older legends
I mean just look at Arcadia, 7 dexterity on a greatsword and spear. Yes she has some nice signature moves but what's the point?
It would make sense that newer legends have better stats and weapon combos
I've always complained about "wasted stats 🚮", those for me being attack but mainly dexterity (for weapons that really don't need it e.g. Arcadia) so seeing those like Seven and Imugi having 3 dexterity for their weapon choices always seemed fair to me, and giving them any amount of speed above 4 would be crazy, That's why Ulgrim and Teros in my opinion are still one of the best characters in the game, even if I despise them.
But still, if it carries on then some of the old legends will need a rework. One being Jiro.
I know that stats stay the same but I beg that they do something, anything, to give him one or two more defence.
Also, the down sig of his needs more range and should throw him back a bit instead him and the scythe being thrown forward.
The candles on my Jiro alter are still alight, so, there is hope.
That's Egg 'power creeping on girls' Soup, that's Quality.
Ironic the video 1337 long 😭
the cassidy down sig hammer change sucks, i liked the funny tornado
Glorious morning in the background is an absolute W
I have always said this and people call me sour loser. Kor can not keep up with '3' speed imugi.
Bro when he said and I am, an ad pulled up with the caption 'Opera GX Admin Oiled Up'. Mr. eggsoup, is this true?
Bro I just wanna go back to when mordex and Artemis were considered the best
Im a gold player right, so basically I NEVER play ranked because I get so tilted but since picking up imugi I started winning so much on experimental that I play against platinums and I even went against some diamonds even though im technically still only gold like mid gold too not even high gold. Granted I haven’t played ranked in years and have gotten significantly better since then.
They also nerf the characters next patch too which is sometimes bullshit
But with imugi is a skill issue ngl 😅
Thea is so underrated . In the right hands she is really scary ... That speed .
Id be fine with legends being more broken on release than after balance batches IF they were illegal on ranked, like common
Wait, your telling me you play these games LIVE WHILE MONOLOGING?! How do you focus?
There is one legend that I really wonder what eggsoup thinks about them. And its Zariel. Imo the most underused legends and especially one that is never talked about.