50 year watch enthusiast... My simple rules: Choose among the best makers, buy what you genuinely love, take care of it, and keep it for your lifetime! Allow your emotions to drive you to make the best decision, but choose carefully. Each one of my pieces carry a special story, and that makes them unique to me.
What's with Watch Dealers talking out of both sides of their mouths ? Out of one side they say watches are NOT investments, out the other side they tell you the best " investment " pieces. What gives ???
These are the type of behaviours that ruin an industry…. Once you start getting non-watch people buying watches for profit, it ruins it for us REAL WATCH LOVERS & COLLECTORS!
It's like pretty much every domestic car in that decade is worth nothing now but, the Ford GT manages to keep increasing in price. Odds of you picking the exact right watch and having the money at the same time aren't great lol.
To be honest I totally disagree with your choice of watches as investments, maybe in the market today, but long term I don't see them as investments. It's too risky that you specifically find that one buyer that searches that watch when you want to sell it. If you go Patek (and Rolex, AP, ... the usual), the market is solid and huge.
That's the entire point of the video he's talking about getting on the ground floor of the NEXT Patek. Would you rather buy a watch for 8k and sell if for 20k, or buy a Patek for 38k and sell it for 40k? If you watched the video he said it's speculation. The same exact speculation when people buy completely overpriced Rolex, Patek, and AP in this bubble market. None of those watches are intrinsically worth a fraction of what they command.
Thanks Federico for calling these four brands to our attention. I think of Girard Perregaux as a knockoff of the Audemars Piguet Offshore so I would like to hear your in-depth take as to why you think this brand should stand out on their own. I know that Federico knows why, but I am still waiting to hear the specifics before I can buy in. Federico please share the details or have Hans join you to make the case.
I think the Parmigiani TONDA GT and TONDA PF should be on this list. They’re as in house and quality as it gets. A TONDA GT in hand out does the fit, feel and finish of the big 3 IMO, plus their take on the integrated bracelet feels very much their own. And they’re under 5,000 watches a year. Their head master watch maker Michel Parmigiani has done movements for the Big 3, as well as A. Lange and Sohne and many others
I don’t get the Moser hype, they look like Movado Museum design knock offs to me - I think it’s been generated by dealers hoarding them, then trying to make a buck with a coordinated hype train.
Have you looked at the back of the watch? Plus you’re only referring to one line called the Endeavor. I own one of the Movado knock offs and it’s beautiful inside and out, backed up by a quantity of 50. Not that I care if it goes up but it’s what I know I’m wearing not what people perceive it to be.
I also see great potential in Girard-Perregaux, especially with the Laureato. 🏆 This model does not need to hide behind the rivals like Royal Oak or Overseas, as the quality is truly astonishing. 💎 I am convinced that now where the Royal Oaks, Nautilusses and Overseas‘ in this world are extremely „overpriced“, there will be a trickle down effect to the Laureato as it is the „next in line“. 🥈 I missed to pull the trigger on an offer last year (8000 € brand new) but just got the last from my local AD for catalogue price (13000 €). I have no worries that it will be worth 20000 € at the end of this year. 💰💰 In the meanwhile, I will wear it with great joy. My watches get wrist time, they are not safe-objects. 🏄♂️
@@Raph.Bogaert time will tell. FP Journe is hyped now, but plenty of other independents have been like that then collapsed. Rolex, AP, and Patek, there is no real risk in owning,
@@mr_watchaddict3146 haha you got me there :D I agree with the 3 mentioned and I would only add FP Journe to that, I think that one will stay. All the other brands mentioned are amazing brands, but not here to stay in the long run as investments.
Just can't get behind the idea of 'investment watches'. You're encouraging people to buy watches that they possibly aren't that keen on in order to hoard them for a possible future profit, likely a small one, rather than to actually wear and enjoy them. You're a dealer, I get it, this is how you think, but as an enthusiast I'd rather you actually told us about watches. Maybe do a review or two.
It doesn’t have to be a safe queen to be an investment. I wear my Explorer 214270 mk2 every day despite it doubling in value since I bought it. Just beat up your 5711 on the lawnmower! 😉
Gary, you are so right. Collecting watches used to be so enjoyable. Now only richer folks can buy nice pieces at the AD level. Maybe there will come a day in the near future when the tide turns and the majority of us can buy pieces to WEAR and ENJOY, not just the rich. Too many are buying pieces to stick in their vaults and gloat how much hey can sell at a profit.
@@dannysimenauer5745 It's such a shame 😔 anyone no matter It's a blue collar or a rich guy should be able to buy these pieces . Catering just to the rich is bullshit actually this whole AD thing is getting out of hand with pushing collectors to buy multiple watches just to go on a wait list, they can go take a crap as far as I'm concerned. My Rolex Explorer 114270 z series will be my only Rolex
Hi Fed, callout from Mike, Toronto, Canada. I've been watching your content for a very long time and always look forward to "THE NEXT ONE". My comment this time has nothing to do with watches per se but specifically directed at your intro which is in dire need of a makeover. You've obviously worked hard to get where you are physically, it's time to get rid of the old image as it were. Oh and by the way, I think Parmigiani Fleurier is on the move also!
Hate to say it because I love the brand and will own one someday but Moser is getting kind of stale. These are all good picks, just ask Bill Sanders he has one from every brand you listed.
I can't get into Moser it's just not my style and it's possibly there just in the now and collectors will losse interest in Moser in the future like Frank Muller I'm strictly a Omega speedmaster MW, Zenith chronomaster tri color ,Explorer 1,IWC and Heuer Monaco Calibre 11 style of watches but Moser is interesting. The Laureato is great alternative Royal oak even though I don't do alternatives. It's just a temporary fix that in the end you're going to still want the Royal oak alternatives rarely work. I always go for a watch that the brand is known for. That's just the way I operate.
anyone care to explain just how much prices have risen over the last few years, with examples way beyond rolex and others that underpin the grey market? ive seen lots of talk, but no detail on it, and having seen how a few visible dealers price their stock that it takes no more than a single higher price for everything in it's sphere to rise. is that the market, or the dealers causing inflation? also very surprised to see so many watch lovers wearing RM and not being able to appreciate them beyond the $.
Moser never ….GP is the only one but buying one of them you’re just saying to people I’ve got more money than a Tudor can’t afford Rolex AP Patek and VC
Watchbox increased DeBethune used prices significantly after they took a stake in the company. They are charging MB&F HM prices for used, DB’s entry level DB27s. All high end and great watches, but the mark ups are pretty crazy.
When the financial bubble bursts, luxury hype will jackknife. I like Moser, but the whole high-end of the market is driven by oligarchs looking for a place to park their money before the bottom falls out. Started with Rolex and the mania is spreading fast, but it will come down faster.
Not sure about it. The international world of finance has come down heavily on white washing so to send funds over borders will attract a lot of attention from fraud investigations, closing bank accounts etc. Because of this people are looking for other ways, a watch can easily be transported from one country to another with few questions ever asked, this will not only continue but parallel to further restrictions on moving money watches will increase to be used in their new role as a currency. And value will keep much better than fiat cash. You talk about oligarchs, yes, but not only criminals like that but people from all walks of life, people that are sick of governments treating them like criminals just for transferring honest money. I know many people that are struggling with their bank accounts being closed literally for no reason, as the government treat any large transfer of money as a potential criminal act, so for every criminal they actual catch doing this they will upset hundreds of honest citizens, it`s harassment, and should not be allowed.
I don't know about that either 🤔 there's been speculation about it for years now and still no change. It just seems to be getting worse. I just don't know how much higher Rolex can go. Daytonas were 40k a few months ago now there 53k it's unbelievable
Thieves watch and take note of these types of videos too. Wear your watches responsibly, only in good company, and away from obviously dangerous areas. Take care and try to stay out of harm's way. Keep the hobby, and the hobbiests alive and safe.
GP is trash! Values have skyrocketed over the past 2 years and not only is the value for money terrible at this point but they are banking on being a “cheap” royal oak (AP) another brand with only 1 hot model line. Pass. However Moser is 100% incredible watches and belong way above their current price point. In my opinion of course 😉😉😉
50 year watch enthusiast... My simple rules: Choose among the best makers, buy what you genuinely love, take care of it, and keep it for your lifetime! Allow your emotions to drive you to make the best decision, but choose carefully. Each one of my pieces carry a special story, and that makes them unique to me.
50 year watch enthusiast...
My simple rules: Choose among the best makers, buy what you genuinely love, take care of it, and keep it for your lifetime!
Allow your emotions to drive you to make the best decision, but choose carefully. Each one of my pieces carry a special story, and that makes them unique to me.
Agreed. I buy my watches to keep. Choose wisely and pick what YOU like and not what some critic tells you to like or buy.
Fed I love your channel! Please put the brands and watches that you're going to talk about in the video down in the description section
Well the Russian oligarch market for hyper watches has taken a bit of a dent just recently.
I am a big fan of H Moser. Their timepieces are stunning. Though I hope they will remain watches for watch enthusiasts and not becoming hyped watches.
Lots of hype going into H. Moser lately. Months ago, it seemed many dealers wouldn’t want to take them for trade.
That's the power of WatchBox/Govberg
What's with Watch Dealers talking out of both sides of their mouths ? Out of one side they say watches are NOT investments, out the other side they tell you the best " investment " pieces. What gives ???
Czapek has some potential too I think
Maybe. Not fully in house they i think they are selling around rrp
These are the type of behaviours that ruin an industry…. Once you start getting non-watch people buying watches for profit, it ruins it for us REAL WATCH LOVERS & COLLECTORS!
That green dial Moser is the nicest watch I ever seen you wear. Gorgeous piece.
My Grand Seiko SBGH267 "Whirlpool" more than doubled in price since i purchased in 2018... I never bought it as an investment though.
I get nervous when I hear watches are considered an asset class. While technically true, most depreciate in value. Buy what you like and can afford!
It's like pretty much every domestic car in that decade is worth nothing now but, the Ford GT manages to keep increasing in price. Odds of you picking the exact right watch and having the money at the same time aren't great lol.
To be honest I totally disagree with your choice of watches as investments, maybe in the market today, but long term I don't see them as investments. It's too risky that you specifically find that one buyer that searches that watch when you want to sell it. If you go Patek (and Rolex, AP, ... the usual), the market is solid and huge.
That's the entire point of the video he's talking about getting on the ground floor of the NEXT Patek. Would you rather buy a watch for 8k and sell if for 20k, or buy a Patek for 38k and sell it for 40k? If you watched the video he said it's speculation. The same exact speculation when people buy completely overpriced Rolex, Patek, and AP in this bubble market. None of those watches are intrinsically worth a fraction of what they command.
What do you think of Kurano Tokyo watches?
The H. Moser you are wearing makes me envious. Stunning timepiece. Congrats😄👍
Greatings from Hamburg/ Germany
It’ll be interesting to see if a big dealer corners the market with any of these, like some have tried with Journe and De Bethune.
Great video, love that green dial Moser
Thanks Federico for calling these four brands to our attention. I think of Girard Perregaux as a knockoff of the Audemars Piguet Offshore so I would like to hear your in-depth take as to why you think this brand should stand out on their own. I know that Federico knows why, but I am still waiting to hear the specifics before I can buy in. Federico please share the details or have Hans join you to make the case.
He’s conjuring up a market for undesirable watches out of his own fan base. I don’t think he’s doing it maliciously that’s just what he’s doing
I think the Parmigiani TONDA GT and TONDA PF should be on this list. They’re as in house and quality as it gets. A TONDA GT in hand out does the fit, feel and finish of the big 3 IMO, plus their take on the integrated bracelet feels very much their own. And they’re under 5,000 watches a year. Their head master watch maker Michel Parmigiani has done movements for the Big 3, as well as A. Lange and Sohne and many others
I don’t get the Moser hype, they look like Movado Museum design knock offs to me - I think it’s been generated by dealers hoarding them, then trying to make a buck with a coordinated hype train.
Have you looked at the back of the watch? Plus you’re only referring to one line called the Endeavor. I own one of the Movado knock offs and it’s beautiful inside and out, backed up by a quantity of 50. Not that I care if it goes up but it’s what I know I’m wearing not what people perceive it to be.
Absolutely. Fredo has been pushing H Moser and GP for some time now …
I agree. On some of the models how do you even tell what time it is ?
I also see great potential in Girard-Perregaux, especially with the Laureato. 🏆 This model does not need to hide behind the rivals like Royal Oak or Overseas, as the quality is truly astonishing. 💎 I am convinced that now where the Royal Oaks, Nautilusses and Overseas‘ in this world are extremely „overpriced“, there will be a trickle down effect to the Laureato as it is the „next in line“. 🥈 I missed to pull the trigger on an offer last year (8000 € brand new) but just got the last from my local AD for catalogue price (13000 €). I have no worries that it will be worth 20000 € at the end of this year. 💰💰 In the meanwhile, I will wear it with great joy. My watches get wrist time, they are not safe-objects. 🏄♂️
Recently purchased a Zenith ,and now that itch has been scratched The Girard Perregaux Laureato is very much in my sights now.
Urban Jurgensen is awesome and some pieces look like FP Journe!
MB&f is another high horology independent - limited production and beautiful pieces
Hello, good afternoon
Max Busser could be the 5th brand to keep in mind for the future.
Fed, feelings about Chrono Swiss? Owned and sold one a few years ago but recently drawn back to them. Comments?
Love the Laureato!!!
In my personal opinion and a watch collector for over 15 years I see only 3 brand for investment …
Rolex
Patek
Audemaur Piguet…
I agree, and now FP Journe can be added to that list.
@@Raph.Bogaert …So you don’t agree then 😉
@@mr_watchaddict3146 😂😂😂😂😂😂
@@Raph.Bogaert time will tell. FP Journe is hyped now, but plenty of other independents have been like that then collapsed. Rolex, AP, and Patek, there is no real risk in owning,
@@mr_watchaddict3146 haha you got me there :D I agree with the 3 mentioned and I would only add FP Journe to that, I think that one will stay. All the other brands mentioned are amazing brands, but not here to stay in the long run as investments.
Just can't get behind the idea of 'investment watches'. You're encouraging people to buy watches that they possibly aren't that keen on in order to hoard them for a possible future profit, likely a small one, rather than to actually wear and enjoy them. You're a dealer, I get it, this is how you think, but as an enthusiast I'd rather you actually told us about watches. Maybe do a review or two.
watches are not for investment....!! I know that your making your life out of it but hate it when someone call it investment...buy shares dude...
I like the GP Laureato, but Vacheron is a different level of watch.
Their prices are of different levels too…
SOON I WILL GET MY H. MOSER!
LOVE THAT BRAND!
What about the Glashutte orginal is good watch to buy thanks
I just got my new PanoReserve today, so I say YES. Lol
Haven't seen you in a while, god damn Federico! You look so healthy now! very proud of you!
Thanks lm looking for the seventies
Had my eye on Moser for a long time. One day I will have one.
Watches for investment, no thanks, not for me. I buy a watch because I like it and to wear. Not for it to be a safe Queen.
It doesn’t have to be a safe queen to be an investment. I wear my Explorer 214270 mk2 every day despite it doubling in value since I bought it. Just beat up your 5711 on the lawnmower! 😉
@@mr_watchaddict3146 If it's a bit beaten up, you are not getting anywhere near double your money, buyers want excellent, as new condition.
Gary, you are so right. Collecting watches used to be so enjoyable. Now only richer folks can buy nice pieces at the AD level. Maybe there will come a day in the near future when the tide turns and the majority of us can buy pieces to WEAR and ENJOY, not just the rich. Too many are buying pieces to stick in their vaults and gloat how much hey can sell at a profit.
@@dannysimenauer5745 It's such a shame 😔 anyone no matter It's a blue collar or a rich guy should be able to buy these pieces . Catering just to the rich is bullshit actually this whole AD thing is getting out of hand with pushing collectors to buy multiple watches just to go on a wait list, they can go take a crap as far as I'm concerned. My Rolex Explorer 114270 z series will be my only Rolex
@@lonewolfemcquade8133 Agreed
Federico vs Jori goodman, wrestling
Hi Fed, callout from Mike, Toronto, Canada. I've been watching your content for a very long time and always look forward to "THE NEXT ONE". My comment this time has nothing to do with watches per se but specifically directed at your intro which is in dire need of a makeover. You've obviously worked hard to get where you are physically, it's time to get rid of the old image as it were. Oh and by the way, I think Parmigiani Fleurier is on the move also!
Definitely H. Moser and GP laureato
Hate to say it because I love the brand and will own one someday but Moser is getting kind of stale.
These are all good picks, just ask Bill Sanders he has one from every brand you listed.
I can't get into Moser it's just not my style and it's possibly there just in the now and collectors will losse interest in Moser in the future like Frank Muller I'm strictly a Omega speedmaster MW, Zenith chronomaster tri color ,Explorer 1,IWC and Heuer Monaco Calibre 11 style of watches but Moser is interesting. The Laureato is great alternative Royal oak even though I don't do alternatives. It's just a temporary fix that in the end you're going to still want the Royal oak alternatives rarely work. I always go for a watch that the brand is known for. That's just the way I operate.
Only the Moser what you should buy now
Have been watching Watchfinder lately?
I really hate that even the obscure watch brands are even getting gobbled up.
Whenever you upload my day automatically becomes better
Love your watch flawless piece
anyone care to explain just how much prices have risen over the last few years, with examples way beyond rolex and others that underpin the grey market? ive seen lots of talk, but no detail on it, and having seen how a few visible dealers price their stock that it takes no more than a single higher price for everything in it's sphere to rise. is that the market, or the dealers causing inflation? also very surprised to see so many watch lovers wearing RM and not being able to appreciate them beyond the $.
Moser never ….GP is the only one but buying one of them you’re just saying to people I’ve got more money than a Tudor can’t afford Rolex AP Patek and VC
Lookin good, Fed. Suns out, guns out!
My 4 recommendations: MB&F, DeBethune, Czapek, and Laine. So good and so under the radar.
Watchbox increased DeBethune used prices significantly after they took a stake in the company. They are charging MB&F HM prices for used, DB’s entry level DB27s. All high end and great watches, but the mark ups are pretty crazy.
Love that moisner
in world where inflation is crazy high, any watch is great investment really. Better than holding cash for sure.
Mr Anthony sold me to tell y’all to buy GP!!
Definitely a dress watch guy, our Federico...
You finally folded. Now I know the top is in.
When the financial bubble bursts, luxury hype will jackknife. I like Moser, but the whole high-end of the market is driven by oligarchs looking for a place to park their money before the bottom falls out. Started with Rolex and the mania is spreading fast, but it will come down faster.
Not sure about it. The international world of finance has come down heavily on white washing so to send funds over borders will attract a lot of attention from fraud investigations, closing bank accounts etc. Because of this people are looking for other ways, a watch can easily be transported from one country to another with few questions ever asked, this will not only continue but parallel to further restrictions on moving money watches will increase to be used in their new role as a currency. And value will keep much better than fiat cash. You talk about oligarchs, yes, but not only criminals like that but people from all walks of life, people that are sick of governments treating them like criminals just for transferring honest money. I know many people that are struggling with their bank accounts being closed literally for no reason, as the government treat any large transfer of money as a potential criminal act, so for every criminal they actual catch doing this they will upset hundreds of honest citizens, it`s harassment, and should not be allowed.
I don't know about that either 🤔 there's been speculation about it for years now and still no change. It just seems to be getting worse. I just don't know how much higher Rolex can go. Daytonas were 40k a few months ago now there 53k it's unbelievable
@@lonewolfemcquade8133 Well if you don’t own Rolex it’s worse, if you happen to own some Rolex it’s getting better…
@@truxton1000 I bought a Explorer ref 114270 Z series back in 07 at retail. That's my only Rolex and that looks like that's how it's staying
Almost all of them dropped in value
Moser is damn beautiful
Now you look like mr potato
Thieves watch and take note of these types of videos too. Wear your watches responsibly, only in good company, and away from obviously dangerous areas. Take care and try to stay out of harm's way. Keep the hobby, and the hobbiests alive and safe.
GP is trash! Values have skyrocketed over the past 2 years and not only is the value for money terrible at this point but they are banking on being a “cheap” royal oak (AP) another brand with only 1 hot model line. Pass. However Moser is 100% incredible watches and belong way above their current price point. In my opinion of course 😉😉😉
First
2nd 😂
SLAVA UKRAINI
50 year watch enthusiast...
My simple rules: Choose among the best makers, buy what you genuinely love, take care of it, and keep it for your lifetime!
Allow your emotions to drive you to make the best decision, but choose carefully. Each one of my pieces carry a special story, and that makes them unique to me.
First