Still creeps me out even all these years later Fun fact, Gascione most likely lost his leg because the old school hunters believed the beasthood took you over through the right leg, hence the belts on the old armors over the leg That was one of the most interesting descriptions you read
I think you focused too much on the archetypal love story, instead of the tragedy bloodborne is meant to be. I don't think Maria killed herself because she couldn't be with Gehrman because he was shy. I think she killed herself due to what they did in the fishing hamlet, and that's why she threw away her blade. I think Gerhman was distraught at this point, because she killed herself, and that's why he made the doll - in memory of her, in his grieving.
Yeah, Gherman and Maria both regret the fishing hamlet but Maria is the one who killed herself and I think Gherman feels guilt and blames himself somewhat.
Unfortunate that arguably the most industrious channel for BB lore is run by a hack. There's so little nuance half the time I think he has to be joking. It's like People magazine for Bloodborne lore.
I think he made some good points but I have to agree with you on that theory. I defintely think Maria threw away her blade out of guilt for participating in the killing of Kos, who was a celestial being ( I believe) and killed herself from the torment of it. I think the photo could've been of German and her, and she smashed it out of guilt for not deserving to have love considering she helped kill Kos. I could see German already having a fetish for making dolls but after Maria's death he was distraught and made the Doll in memory of her, and so he didn't have to let her go.
Infatuation is a synonym of mania, yet you chose to use fetish? Hmm, can't say I agree with that. Here's what I think happened: Gehrman clearly felt a strong love for Maria, but, for one reason or another, never let her know; he didn't know how to tell her, so his love for her was driving him mad. After she killed herself, Gehrman became depressed and built a doll in her image. The moon presence took pity on Gehrman and animated the doll in the dream for him; Gehrman's love for maria literally created the doll. That's why the doll has dialogue about being made to love her creator ("Hunters have told me about the church. About the gods, and their love. But... do the gods love their creations? I am a doll, created by you humans. Would you ever think to love me? Of course... I do love you. Isn't that how you've made me?").
I don't think moon presence cares about Gherman or any human for that matter, this dream was just meant to trap him and others and manipulate them into doing MP's doing.
+Ishidoro Clisham Although I do think the moon spirit has its own agenda,i tend to agree with Alex P. Afterall "the great ones are sympathetic in spirit."
+Ishidoro Clisham I agree and i guess the sympathy the moon pressence has shown towards gehrman was just a tool to get gerhman to do its bidding. Then again i do beliefe that the great ones sometimes show genuine sympathy towards their surrogates.
+Alex P I agree that he took the fetish angle a little too far. It's obvious with the Old Hunters DLC that Gehrman made the doll to model Maria, but he's also dismissive of the doll. I think maybe he realized that the doll wasn't Maria and over the years began to resent it for being more of a reminder of his lost chance of love. But I don't think Gehrman has an actual doll fetish. I think there would be a lot more doll related stuff with him if that were the case. Not sure about the Moon Presence animating the doll, especially if it has even limited movement in the real world. And the doll still exists even after killing Gehrman and the MP.
Don't know man... from the sound of his voice seems like Gherman created the doll to try and remind him of Maria but he regrets having done so because the Doll doesn't fill his heart the same way Maria did. So when he says "you may use the Doll" he kinda seems angry at her, or angry at himself for having made her.
The doll is more little snow girl rather then golden bride. Little snow girl tells a story about old childless couple who create a daughter from snow but when spring comes they loose her. Golden bride tells about Smith Ilmarinen who smiths him self a bride from gold.
Just my theory. The entire DLC is all Gehrman's nightmare, much like the dream, (hence: Hunter's nightmare and not hunters' nightmare.) This is why Maria is a corpse. She is actually dead but kept alive in Gehrman's nightmare, along with Ludwig, because what happened to them haunts him in his sleep. This is why Gehrman sleeps soundly after you complete the DLC. Gehrman felt guilt and love for Maria, so he fashioned the doll after her death out of guilt and loneliness. I believe Maria killed herself out of guilt for helping Gehrman slaughter the people of the fishing village in search of eyes, not because of being rejected by Gehrman. It doesn't make sense to me that Gehrman would make a doll of someone he is in love with while she is still alive, nor would he choose a doll over the real thing.
I believe that the souls of laurence, ludwig, and maria do reside their though, and the kos orphan event happened in game real time, like the presence fight
Yeah I mean commiting genocide and murder is much less troubling to a person's soul than their teachers dick. Gratitude doesn't really translate to "advances".
I think that Gehrman loved Maria but since she didn't reciprocate his feelings, he made the Doll out of his obsession over her but in time came to resent her because she wasn't the Maria he wanted. Maria probably just really admired Gehrman as her outfit indicates.
I'm not sure about Maria's feelings; her clothing descriptions said she had "admiration" for Gehrman, not "affection" or the like. It could be that she looked up to him as a friend and mentor, not realizing that he was obsessed with her.
so gehrmen spent this entire time waiting for Lawrence but because or the dlc Lawrence is trapped in the hunters nightmare and a powered up cleric beast so there's no way for him to help gehrmen. if we don't put gehrmen out of his suffering there's no one to do it
slightlytwistedagain yes it is but I feel extra bad for him because like most forced into his position he's waiting for a friend someone he knew to come help him but his friend fell victim and became the thing he was trying to fight
Can't say I agree with this very much. It sounds like a Japanese high school romance. They like eachother but are too shy to express it? It also ignores all the terrible things in the research hall and Maria's own dialogue.
+Kira F Maybe not intentionally, but the myth likely spans from what happened to Gehrman. Great job connecting the lore! "A widespread belief of the period was that 'beast blood crept up the right leg...'" I'm going to look into this further with the other wheelchair enemies to see if they, too, are missing right legs.
+fungo in the true ending you're also missing a leg I'm pretty sure the moon presence takes it and took gehrman's but the little wheelchair fellas probably had it removed in some other way
That wasn't even the right door they were talking about. It's further down past the lady of the night. You're reading too much into this. Also "How to Pick up Fair Maidens" is a running Easter Egg in the souls game.
I believe gerhman was cursed and forced to live the orphan of kos's nightmare when he slept in the hunters dream because he assisted bergynwerth in the killing of the fishing hamlet people. Lady maria admired gehrman, most likely because of his amazing skill with a blade without the use of magic or blood. Maira wanted to be like gerhman, so she choose to use a weapon that relied on skill instead of blood, this made her different from other vilebloods. Then maria discovered what gehrman did and was appalled by it, so she turned her back on gehrman and his teachings by abandoning her rakuyo. The rakuyo reminded her too much of gehrman and her former admiration for him, she could no longer stomach it and threw it away. She choose to be the guardian of the fishing hamlet people and stopped anyone who had gotten too far.
khknight Its evident that she had a hand in the hamlets massacre, she never discovered ghermans "secret". Not to mention to mention that at least in her early days, she was not a so righteous person given that the patients in the reaearch hall know her well. She mightve been there to comfort them sure, but she was not dismayed by the practices for at least long enough to be a well known figure. And it doesnt seem she holds resentment for gherman mostly because theres no evidence for it. She threw her rakyuo away because she was disgusted by her own hand in the action. Plus she has a picture from the hunters dream fire mantle with her when she commited suicide. Doesnt point to resentment
I have to disagree with some aspects. First off "unaware of his mania" obviously translates to ignorant of his interest. Why would that be an immediate thing? It takes time to develop feelings no matter how fleeting. She admired his skill before anything else in my opinion. He was the first damn hunter after all. And it's possible that she was his first disciple as indicated by the old hunter bone. (yes it might say he but I don't care) Perhaps the separation occurred once events unfolded with Kos and the possibility for feelings to swell. Another anomaly (the moon presence) took place that seized Gehrman and declared him host of the hunters dream indefinitely. A guiding light for all hunters throughout time. Both trapped by dream and nightmare. Gehrman with the Moon Presence. Maria with the Orphan of Kos. It's just not right to water her story down to love for a man when she obviously takes a stand to protect what lies beyond the Astral Clocktower.
She was practically immortal and didn't even have to sit there protecting the secret. She could've gave in to her unyielding love and searched for a way to reach Gehrman. But it's obvious there was more priority in the secret of Fishing Hamlet than her master. The doll aspect is spot on though. And that part about them not reading each other's feelings. Alas it's all theory.
+chrissk08 The "he" in the old hunter bone is a mistranslation. The japanese text uses a gender neutral pronoun so it's not stating if it's male or female.
Jesus, the old hunter bone doesn't matter! Who cares if it's a he or she, multiple hunters had the ability! It could literally be any of the first hunters, it wasn't exclusive to Maria and Gherman. It could be Gherman's leg for all we know.
+chrissk08 I didn't get the impression she was protecting the village. I read it as her trying to hide the guilty secrets of bergenwyrth/healing church/the first hunters. Though who from is the question that comes to mind.
I feel like Maria had admiration for Gehrman,not love. cause she was unaware of his mania. So his obsession made him create the doll cause Maria is dead.
+pentatopComment Which table? and even so, you dont keep pictures of only those you love. even those you respect and admire. People keep pictures of Gandhi, Abraham Lincoln, Martin Luther King because of respect and admiration. its more to a mentor and student relationship for Maria.
+pentatopComment For example if I was a devout follower of Gandhi I would keep a picture of him. but if after finding out he slept naked with underaged girls to test his celibecy I would probably be disgusted and in anger break his picture. But then I would also remember that I followed this man whom i admired and dont have the heart to throw it away even though he commited this atrocity. Maria was full of admiration for Gehrman unaware of his curious mania. Also she probably didnt like him after what happened in the Fishing Hamlet. You know she thinks of that incident with disgust so maybe she has some anger towards Gehrman but also loyalty that is splitting her decision.
"...About the gods and their love, but do the gods love their creations? I am a doll created by you humans, would you ever think to love me? Of course i do love you, isn't that how you made me?" I think this has a much deeper meaning (no pun intended). It's questioning our faith as humans to the gods, just as Gehrman made the doll to love him, the gods made humans to love them, we don't choose faith, It's inherent in our creation.
I honestly don't think Gehrman has a fetish for dolls..I always thought he was trying to create a new Maria out of the doll, with the One Third Umbilical Cord at the Hunter's Workshop. She's stuck in the Old Hunter's Nightmare..for all we know she went missing without saying goodbye and that piece of him was never at rest, so he tried making a new Maria. Just a theory though. This kind of reminds me of the Pinwheel theory.
+Formless Oedon Maria's attire: "she had great admiration for Gehrman, unaware of his curious mania" Definition of Mania: "an excessive enthusiasm or desire; an obsession. - Fetish." In-game evidence shows the doll was created loosely based on Maria. Gehrman had a fetish / obsession with dolls before modeling one after Maria. I agree with everything else you said besides the first sentence.
+fungo True that. Just a question though. Why choose fetish instead of the other synonyms? Maybe his "curious mania " was a way of saying he had a obsession with Maria, and like you said, was awkward around her. But this theory is pretty solid, keep it up.
+fungo Maybe Maria's "great admiration" meant she had great respect for Gehrman's accomplishments as a hunter and didn't have any feelings of affection towards him at all. Hence why Maria chose to become one of Gehrman's students in the first place. With the item descriptions and the smashed unclear picture lying besides Maria, I don't find that there's enough evidence to suggest that Maria had any feelings for Gehrman.
Kao S That's a good point. Let's say she had respect for him as a hunter instead of feelings of affection. That'd explain why she was unaware of the curious mania/desire that he had for her, because she never felt the same toward him as he did toward her. That'd also explain why he had the "How to pick up fair maidens" book, and why he created the doll in her image. I believe after Gerhman realized that a relationship between them will never work, he created a doll in her image and retrieved a 1/3 Umbilical Cord so he can bring it to life, so he can finally find love.
+fungo It's an interesting theory, but I don't think curious mania=fetish. If gehrman had a doll fetish or obsession, don't you think he would have made multiple? Instead he only made one, and that one doll looks exactly like the person I think he was truly obsessed with.
"I think this means she loved Gehrman, otherwise why would they bring up his curious mania". That makes no sense what so ever, sorry. How does one of those exclude the other?
Maria has her blades back because that's how she's reflected in the nightmare. That's how she imagines herself as a hunter. And she stoops to using blood magic in stage two, because anime-level sword fighting clearly isn't enough to stop you. She's really desperate not to let you through.
I concluded that the Doll was the true host of the dream. Similar to how Micolash is the host of the mensis nightmare. No matter what ending happens the Doll is still alive and the dream continues.
See, I've always viewed this in reverse, where Maria had respect and admiration for Gehrman but never full on affection for him, unlike Gehrman who DID have those feelings for her, making the doll.
+N30n_g0LD People always say that, then I am always proven right later in interviews, guides, etc. For example: My theory on the first hunters slaying Kos was substantiated in the FuturePress guide on The Old Hunters.
+fungo I have 2 videos called Naughty old Gehrman, its relating to his relation ship with the doll. also if you watch it, note I have no editing skills so don't expect something beautiful. lol
@@fungo that's because I believe that there is in every games studio à team tasked to search in the internet for fan theories that will help makes sense for some bullshit in the story and plot holes and lore they didn't plan or considered to have a Canon lore for it, they release it as Canon based on fan theories and the fans think they proved them right, damn son they just combined your fan fictions and theories into Canon lore.
Considering that Gehrman's events as a hunter together with Maria were decades ago, he must have been a young hunter when he started feeling love and... "things" for Maria, at least for me it's less disturbing to believe that than to imagine an old man fucking a young looking doll
Goddamn, i missed so much since i started the DLC after killing the Wet Nurse. All the doll says then is “Gehrman awaits you, at the foot of the Great Tree...”
+fungo In the yarnaham streets below, a little further down where the hunter with the rifle shoots at you, there's a lady in one of the houses, knock on the the door and she makes those exact "sexual noises" followed up with her saying how thankful she is to the church. You have to access the area early to catch her when she still has a bit of her sanity left. Guy across from her also says something about how grateful he is to the church( how you know you have the right house). It's not a reference to the kinky sex between geherman and doll, man.
+Mike Mortis I don't mean the glitches have significance and no, the finger twitch was on purpose, but nice trying to rationalize it by not understanding how game development works at all.
+cheese puffs How does what you said explain that it's not a reference to Gehrman and the doll getting it on? Even if that same exact audio plays there, why would it be playing in the workshop? It's not a glitch - as someone had to purposefully code the trigger for that specific audio there and they've updated the game 8 times fixing many other minor glitches.
The reason the Doll in the Abandoned Workshop is able to move her fingers is because she is trying to trick you into thinking that she is able to move in the frozen time, and when you get close, you realize it was because of magnets in her sleeve that are connecting to the metal in your weapons and clothing, and once you're close, she surprises you by punching a hole in your gut.
Is it unreasonable to assume that when Gehrmam tells you to use the doll he isn't talking about sex? The doll levels you up after all. And before he said that he talks about hunters using the workshop to enhance their flesh
I realy dont know where to say this, but i was reading "the thing on the doorstep" by lovecraft and i realized one thing. A theory that i've never heard about and it makes a lot of sense. Here is my theory: the Gehrman we meet in the hunter's dream is no longer Gehrman... is actualy the moon presence. He is possessed by the moon presence the whole time. We speak with the moon presence and this is why he hesitate to say is name at the beginning of the game. The only time we can hear THE REAL Gherman talk is when he is sleeping. The thing on the doorstep is a story about body snatcher and there is a part when 'the possessed' is in the Arkham Asylum (batlol) and he says this - “I had to do it-I had to do it . . . it’ll get me . . . it’ll get me . . . down there . . . down there in the dark. . . . Mother, mother! Dan! Save me . . . save me. . . .” - in a moment when he has control of his body. Sounds a lot like Gehrman calling out for Lawrence and Master Willem to save him. And this also is what the "second ending" is about. The moon prensence takes control over our body, just like Gherman before us. I am not sure about some details but i'm 100% sure this is not just a coincidence. (sorry for my english, i am italian :D)
"Coherently let your mind run wild" Fungo, 'coherent' and 'wild' are antonyms, they are incompatible which is why this entire video is such a brainfart. You take so much out of context that you completely ignore the threads that tie the lore together, making rash assumptions. Honestly, that disclaimer at the end was almost meaningless, "A good theory based on facts, observation and inference". When a game like Bloodborne doesn't give you the high and low of what's going on, the best guess is the simplest one. So why is it that you jump the gun and say Gehrman has a doll fetish, or that the Dream doesn't prevent aging (when it clearly does, else Gehrman would be a skeleton judging by how many graves their are for those he freed and how many nights of the hunt there have been since he was confined to the dream. It's also likely he's dead in the physical world, as we see the Nightmares persist even though their hosts have long since died e.g Micolash, Maria). Instead of focusing on Gehrman's obsession with Maria you just assumed he had a doll fetish, which doesn't make sense considering there's only one doll to speak of that looks identical to Maria. That Maria hasn't aged isn't indicative of vampiric blood either, more that how you look when you die = how you look in the dream/nightmare. That's another part of your theory that falls flat, because it's based on an assumption which is, at it's core, incorrect.
+Giantdad Lives cont. And you've got it backwards, Maria had an 'admiration' for Gehrman and considering their relationship as teacher and student I'm willing to bet that she admired him as a mentor, unaware that he loved her obsessively (compare the implications of 'admiration' against 'mania'). Assuming you are correct, why would Gehrman reject Maria if he was reading books on how to pick up fair maidens? Shouldn't he be overjoyed? Also, you miss the glaring implication that Gehrman has grown resentful of the Doll. Let's just say that after Maria died (for whatever reason) Gehrman becomes depressed, so depressed that he tries to recreate her with the doll yet despite the obsessive attention to detail and painstaking work it would never come to life or bring her back. A Great One, the Moon Presence, sympathises with Gehrman and brings the doll to life within the dream which it uses Gehrman to facilitate to fulfill its goals. To a Great One with no understanding of how humans work this might seem like the ideal solution, but Gehrman, after many years and countless hunters passing through, realises that the doll isn't Maria and instead reminds him of how he failed to confess his feelings for her. He permits the Hunter to use the doll for sexual purposes because he hates it, not because he gets off on watching a doll get screwed. I know I'm being harsh here and that at the end of the day it's anyone's guess as to what is true or not, but I'm sure others can understand my frustration when we see a video that's professionally made that we think is going to either alter our own theories or strengthen them, but what we get is a very shallow, surface level analysis that you could expect from someone like IGN who don't understand story-writing and narratives.
oh my god thank you for this comment. i got halfway through the video thinking "come on, people don't actually agree with this weird bullshit "based on facts"
Wtf did I just watch...... Lady Maria, which has a very interesting background story, was reduced to "killed herself for love", and Gherman would just create a sex doll with her face because you think any man would do that out of loneliness? That's kinda fucked up... Even for just a theory. These sexual themes have nothing to do with BB. (I know this video is old... I just think it's really messed up)
The youtuber basically did what a reporter from a sensationalist newspaper would do: Spin the tale with false facts just to get more readers, which by the way is a dishonest practice.
i feel like the doll in the dream serves the same purpose as mergo's wet nurse, made by a great one to serve the purpose of nurturing another, though the doll is based off of a real object and obviously not made for combat. there are plenty of parallels between the hunter's dream and the nightmare of mensis as well, like gherman and micolash, both serving as hosts for the nightmares that trap them, and the player character and mergo, young beings, one a great one and the other a human, which serve as the main focuses of their respective nightmare/dream. there's also the possible connection between odeon and the wet nurse, as they are both formless beings, and the one thing that mensis is lacking is a powerful great one lurking behind the scenes, pulling strings and creating the nightmare/dream around a younger being in need of care and nurturing to grow and possibly serve some goal set in place from the start. this would leave the hunter's nightmare as the odd one out, with maria being the caretaker like the doll and wet nurse, the orphan being the host, haphazardly forming the nightmare around the memories of the place it's mother died and the memories of blood drunk hunters, too sick to remember the world around them, and finally kos, the powerful great old one who would be pulling the strings had they not died prematurely, possibly even bringing the curse down upon the hunters and scholars with her last breath, and leaving the nightmare unformed, causing the free-for-all of warped memories stacked on top of eachother found in the game, which would still leave the spot of the one in need of care open. maybe the blood-crazed hunters fill that role, as the nature of the curse might change their role to that of prisoners in need of punishment for their heinous acts, instead of children in need of nurturing care? still, pretty interesting to think about.
There's a problem with the logic here on the sexual moans. I double checked and watched a video from VaatiVidya, who's a fellow Bloodborne/Dark Souls lore seeker. Apparently those moans are actually from the alley way that's below the tower, (the one where you can find the Skeptical man and Arianna) and at one of the doors with incense, you find a woman who praises the Healing Church. Parallel to that door is a man who does the same thing "Praise you... Praise the whole damn church!" He says. As for the woman, she says "hehehe yes..." which is the "Sexual Moans" you hear in the Old Hunters Workshop. Perhaps you're right and that Gehrman was indeed sexual with the doll, I'm not downright denying your idea, but we can't count the woman's dialogue as proof for it.
She does her blood attacks because she resorts to her inherited vile blood abilities as a last resort to prevent you from encountering the corpse of Kos.
Please don't reduce a wonderful, nuanced, tragic character as Lady Maria to a typical damsel killing herself over a guy. There is nothing in the game that suggests she was anything but his student. The mania was all one sided on Gerhman's part, and mania isn't romantic, it's creepy and unhealthy. Her first duty was as a Hunter. Then after the bloodshed at the Fishing Hamlet, she cast it aside to care for the patients as a mother figure, in efforts to atone for her past sins. If anything she probably lost respect for Gerhman as he likely influenced her into the hamlet massacre, being her mentor and all. Hence taking up a position far away from him and the workshop. Her suicide was triggered by having to watch the patients suffer and die all for nothing under her care; in essence, her attempt to do good only made everything worse. She likely had PTSD from the hamlet massacre as well which compounded her desolate state of mind.
Finally, a Bloodborne fan that doesn’t have the comprehension skills of a rock. I also don’t think Gehrman saw her in that way, she was likely just a daughter figure to him and it really hurt him to know he took part in her disillusionment so he created a mourning doll to cope with the loss of his beloved student, and to honor her properly. He’s much more tragic and nuanced that way.
@@batterychugger That's an interesting take on Gerhman, I actually hope that is the case as I always thought he was a bit of a creep with his Maria obsession and given their age gap he really ought to see her as a daughter instead of anything else. It would explain the item description for the spare doll clothes that the Hunter obtains as well, where it remarks that they were kept with great care out of love.
Although your sexual theory makes sense, fetish doesn't necessarily mean a sexual fetish. A Google definition of fetish: an inanimate object worshiped for its supposed magical powers or because it is considered to be inhabited by a spirit. So I agree that Gehrman was awkward around girls, hence why he has pick-up books in his dream and workshop. And he and Maria were in fact very much in love. But, because of his awkwardness he never made a move on her. And Maria not knowing of his "mania" doesn't necessarily mean Gehrman had a doll fetish, but maybe she just wasn't aware of his DESIRE for her. So once Maria finished her training under Gehrman, they both went off on their separate ways, in the classic love tragedy of "both parties loving each other, but neither having the courage to make a move." So once Gehrman was burdened with becoming the host of the hunter's dream, he had the doll created in the image of his lost love. Back to the definition of "fetish." Gehrman maybe wasn't literally sexually attracted to dolls, but the doll was his fetish in that he believed that a spirit (Lady Maria's) inhabited the doll. Of course, he never saw Lady Maria in any other attire other than her hunter's attire, so he had made a cutsey everyday wear for the doll to fantasize about what their lives could have been like outside the hunt, hence those sexual moans as well. As for that white fluid, I don't know. Epic Name Bro suggests that the doll is actually a great one in disguise (she spills paleblood, and pretty much adopts you in the true ending, something something the great ones search for mortal wombs or something). But can she really be a great one if she was created my a mortal? Maybe that really is resemblance of all those lonely years of Gehrman firing quicksilver bullets from his hunter's cannon, if you know what I mean.
Just wanted to say that I really like your videos, I feel you put a lot of effort into the content and quality to guarantee an entertaining watch. I really want to support your channel so you can make even better stuff, so expect me to be on those credits as soon as I get a new job xD And thank you for the great content.
I’m not a blood borne lore expert but ghermans peg leg is most likely a out of date method and prevention of the old hunters tale that the blood from fallen beasts crept up the right leg. Eventually belts were used on the pant legs instead, such as our own hunter.
I believe that Maria admired Gehrman, in a 'notice me, senpai' kind of way, while his mania towards Maria was more sexual in nature. Maria tried to kill herself in the 'real' world, but as a result of the curse, was brought into the 'dream'. Gehrman, unable to cope with the loss of Maria, created the Doll in her image, in a replacement goldfish kind of way. Eventually, he came to his senses and became resentful of the Doll, explaining his 'use the doll' comment at the start of the game.
I'm pretty sure Maria's suicide was connected to both her guilt from what happened in Fisherman's Hamlet and the Healing Church, it connects much better to how she's positioned (back turned against a secret she's ashamed of, simultaneously letting her see those who would try to expose it). She also mentions the secret rather than mumbling about "love" in her dialogue. Finally, her relation to queen Annalise hardly means she's harder to kill or failed to suicide. We don't know for sure that every single person trapped in the Nightmare(s) are alive, Micolash is in Mergo's Nightmare but we enter that through his dead body in the Unseen village inside another Hunter Nightmare, Queen Yharnam also has that hole in her belly and there's clues pointing that she might not be alive but that manifestation of hers is still trapped in the nightmare. Let's not forget that that entire Nightmare is reserved to all hunters, Old Hunters in particular.
Great video man. You keep theorizing, it gives me something to do. However, personally, I believe there may be a different explanation to events: Maria came to help in the fight against the beasts. She may have heard tales of Gehrman, and his prowess, and, being one of the first hunters, looked up to him as a teacher and figure to aspire to. But, Gehrman was somewhat taken with Maria, whereas while she may have looked up to him in that way, was definitely not to the extent he was taken with her. She may have been put off by this, and eventually broke ties with him to get away from this man who she admires but creeps her out. This probably didn't work, him chasing after her, and so she took her own life to get him to finally leave her be. He was broken by this, and created the doll to fill the void left by Maria, to bring her back in a sense. But the doll was not Maria, not her personality, not her skill, and admired him, but not in the same way. It wasn't the same. So, Gehrman waits to be released, and is dismissive of the doll because she's not maria, so he scorns or largely ignores her. The doll loves him, but he doesn't love the doll. Just my take on the lore, it's vague to allow theories like these, both mine and fungo's, make of it what thou whilst.
What is that?bloodborne feminist edition? Lol Gehrman creepying out Maria because he loves her and sometimes watches her on facebook leaving a post,Maria killing herself because of the constant abuse of the terrible one tweet left by Gehrman saying "hello Maria.how are you?", the neverending quest by her collegues to ban men from social media to avoid the horrible freedom of men to leave comments as such to avoid other terrible tragedies like the constant fair critique of ideas! Oh god will they ever be able to end this horrible nightmare? Tonight..crazy ass feminists join the hunt...on twitter (cuz seeing real men in real life can trigger them cuz of mens abusive presence and the rape by looking)
+kato093 Literally how the fuck did you read the above comment and came to the "crazy ass feminists" conclusion...? What's got facebook to do with this? Or social media in general? Why must you strawman like this? Why must you make me cringe with secondhand embarrassment burning stronger than a thousand suns.
+SkullParrot he is aware hunters don't have Facebook, right? Also, wasn't aware I was being feminist, just thought German is creepy. Done. ( please let me not have opened myself to further insult, I'm only an human. Mercy for the wizened child...)
Ryan Llewellyn You FOOL. Are you not aware of the age old rule "do not think a male is creepy or ur a nazi feminist"? It's the law of nature, you heathen.
I really like the idea of Maria having feelings for Gherman instead of her just looking up to him, which is what many others have suggested. It also seems to make a lot more sense and makes the story a lot more enjoyable. And by enjoyable I mean heartbreaking. Sad times. Good video tho 10/10
The thing that is very stupid is that he knows what dying he can wake up. Why not looking for a guy to kill him, like he tried to do to you. Lol i will kill you and you will wake up. And i will be rotten in this Hunter Dream forever xD Also Maria didnt knew anything about the dream or whatever, his mania got to be with dolls or obsessed with her, otherwise doesn't fit and the truth of all them are obsessed with. That's their doom. So no, it got to be his infatuation with her or that he's sick with the dolls. After all FromSoftware destroy their characters pretty bad, they don't have happy lives, live happily ever after, etc. Most of them end up like a bad cartoon of themselves being monsters, corrupted, blood thirsty, maniacs, burglars, assassins, etc. You know FromSoft.
damainmg i dont think maria obsessed with the truth, she just admire or like gehrman's ability that he might stop the beast thing? she never show she is interested the truth unlike german who regreted he found the truth. (thank for the information!)
At one point in time, the Healing Church and the Hunters parted ways, didn't they? Doesn't seem like Gehrman had anything to do with what happened in the Fishing Hamlet, since he's not affected by the curse. Somewhere in between, Maria went with the Healing Church and Gehrman got stuck in that dream. Maybe that's why Gehrman didn't say anything to Maria, since they had difference in views and such? And there are a lot of books in the Research Hall on how to pick up fair maidens, haha. Yay theories.
+White Arrow I think you have a point there. It is odd that Gehrman is very old by the time we meet him in the Hunter's Dream. It seems to me that he might have lost his leg rather young in the early days as a hunter. He could have trained Maria while he was still young and before he lost his leg. The moment he lost his leg could have been the catalyst for his creation of the doll. Stuck in his workshop unable to hunt along side Maria might have made him mad with grief. A downward spiral of self loathing could have followed preventing him from mustering up the courage to have his love known. Instead he creates the doll and accepts being the host of the Hunter's Dream to forget his foolish mania. Thanks, Fungo for making the dlc better for me, before i really was hell bent on thinking Gerhman was a super prev creating the doll out of some fetish persuasion. But, that observation of his lost leg give my imagination alot to run with haha.
I'm gonna guess that Gehrman was active in the real world a lot longer than Maria was before they ventured into their corresponding dream realms. I mean I know Maria was younger, but looking at them both now Gehrman is waaay older looking now.
+Omar Tlatelpa We know Gehrman made the doll before he got stuck in the Hunter's Dream. The doll and a spare set of clothes are found in the real world workshop. Also something of note is that if you end up taking Gehrman's place then you lose a leg as well. Gehrman very well may have lost his leg to the Moon Presence when Laurence called it.
+White Arrow There's no evidence of the Healing Church even existing when the Fishing Hamlet existed (although that explanation might be flawed because the Cathedral Ward as a whole IS the Healing Church). I believe that that happened either during or immediately after the Byrgenwerth schism. Lady Maria was Gehrman's apprentice, so she couldn't possibly be a member of the Healing Church.
BradyTheHunter Then she went with who could be the founders of the Healing Church. It's been established that Maria was Gehrman's apprentice, but they went their separate ways and she was part of the group - whoever they are - that violated the Fishing Hamlet.
I was always under the impression that Maria rejected or was unaware of Ghermans feelings of obsession for her. Which is why he created the doll but realized how fucked up it was and rejected it later on...
This video is rather silly,Gehrman was the first hunter and as such before ascending to the hunter's dream he possessed incredible strenght,very high status and he likely was very wealthy as well so he certainly had countless women wanting to marry him or simply have fun with such an uniquely gifted individual,even more so since,before being chosen by the moon presence he was young and handsome as well. The"how to pick up fair maidens" book must be a silly easter egg put there by FROM SOFTWARE.
+azurewolf7 sadly lore states that the first hunters hunted under the veil of night, aka no one but the church knew about them, and when they were discovered they were disbanded and replaced with the church hunters, who were more doctors then hunters, so it's more then possible that what you believe maybe false.
Well we do know that Gehrman is controlled by the moon presence and that's interesting that you would point out the audio with the orphan of Kos and his crying while sleeping. I never noticed that before. However, while I agree 100% that Gehrman was obsessive, I feel like Maria (given what personality we did see) might have only admired him as a deep respect for the hunter he was versus being head over heels in "love" with him. I feel like Gehrman based the doll off of her during the dolls creation because of his own admiration for his student. At least that was what I had pieced together before during a lore rant with a friend. And I didn't notice the blood around her symbolizing a possible attempt on her own life. I did read that she had tossed her blade(s?) down the well in the fishing hamlet long ago but I can recall the details on all that. .....Anyway great video, and good food for thought.
So the doll in the abandoned workshop twitches her left index finger every few seconds. You wouldn't notice it unless you used the Monocular to examine her more closely. I would say it's a graphical glitch except it's fairly normal looking and happens at regular intervals.
It's not specifically a doll fedish fungo, she's a doll because you cant make an actual person. No other reason. His infatuation with her is because she looks like a person, specifically his interest while he was alive, Maria. You note that he's in love with her and conclude it's a doll fetish instead of realizing he made a doll to look like her, and that doll manifested into the Hunters Dream because it is located in the same place that the Dream takes shape, and is probably very cared for by Gehrman as you pointed out in the video. He does have sex with it. This is a japanese game, and the mans greatest physical attraction has manifested itself into a live defenseless doll. There's nothing else to conclude with his suggestive dialogue and other clues in the game, but he doesn't have a doll fedish lmao.
Maria was his apprentice and they were both part of the slaughter of Kos and the fishing hamlet, which is why the nightmare was created. He got rid of his right leg to purge the plague, which was the old hunters’ superstition as to how it spread
I feel the mania was more directed to Maria, and the doll is merely a result of that. I think that Maria’s love to Gehrman was that of a student to her teacher; whereas Gehrman loved Mariah. He was never able to have her, however, as Mariah never realized that. So after she abandoned the hunt, Gehrman made the doll, as a replacement, modeled in Mariah’s likeness
I disagree with you about the idea of Maria having a crush for Gehrman. The description make me think that she admires him as a teacher and she absolutely don't see him as a potential lover, probably because he is much older than her. That's why he tries to learn how to seduce with his books ;)
A little late to this video but have recently found your Bloodborne content. Some of your videos are informative and entertaining, but this one really grated against me. I would be reluctant to draw any hasty conclusions about lore in a game like Bloodborne, and you mentioned letting your mind run wild with the facts shown in-game, but in the end if you run wild you can run *off course* which is what I strongly feel you've done in this video.......and in doing so you've greatly detracted from delivering an informative experience as well as making your video less entertaining overall. You've brought up some interesting points, but it's as if you're viewing all the game's contents through a hyper-sexualized lens. I personally don't feel there's enough in-game evidence to really justify this theory and it just feels like you're blowing smoke up your own ass, no offense. It was the kind of video that made me feel as if my brain cells were shriveling up in revulsion.........Bloodborne is the kind of game in which it's obvious that great attention to detail and care has been given to the lore elements, yet you're choosing to ignore that in favor of asserting some Gehrman x Doll story of the quality you'd find something like a typical online fanfiction. Please give FromSoftware a bit more credit than that. I would appreciate showing a bit more care and discernment in how you decide to interpret the clues you find in the future.
Damn, you'd think you worked on this game personally, I don't interpret this the same as fungo, but I know eceryone interprets differently, you have no evidence proving this is wrong, so take your own advice and consider all avenues not just "oh well from soft is better than that" I wanna see your video on this topic, seems like you got insider info, where's the video? ??
My theory isn't that she knew about Gehrman's feelings for her. In fact, it doesn't really matter. What does matter is that German was the first hunter and the hunters were ordered by the church to kill mother kos (according to the guide) and did what they did to the fishing hamlet. She found out he did a good portion of that stuff along with the other old hunters, grew disgusted enough to throw her weapon the rakuyo into the well, and decided to protect the secret of the village as a way to punish the old hunters for doing those terrible things. Hell Gehrman being in the hunter's dream is, in a way, his punishment for his actions.
ᵉᵛᵉᶰ ᵗʰᵉ ᵈᵒᶫᶫ, ˢʰᵒᵘᶫᵈ ᶦᵗ ᵖᶫᵉᵃˢᵉ ʸᵒᵘ
How Did You get it that Small?
_That’s what she said... but only to you, Patrick Ryan..._
*Well... She is kinda hot*
Still creeps me out even all these years later
Fun fact, Gascione most likely lost his leg because the old school hunters believed the beasthood took you over through the right leg, hence the belts on the old armors over the leg
That was one of the most interesting descriptions you read
He didn't have an obsession with dolls but with Maria haha
I think you focused too much on the archetypal love story, instead of the tragedy bloodborne is meant to be. I don't think Maria killed herself because she couldn't be with Gehrman because he was shy.
I think she killed herself due to what they did in the fishing hamlet, and that's why she threw away her blade.
I think Gerhman was distraught at this point, because she killed herself, and that's why he made the doll - in memory of her, in his grieving.
Yeah I felt like he totally missed the mark on this one.
Yeah, Gherman and Maria both regret the fishing hamlet but Maria is the one who killed herself and I think Gherman feels guilt and blames himself somewhat.
Unfortunate that arguably the most industrious channel for BB lore is run by a hack. There's so little nuance half the time I think he has to be joking. It's like People magazine for Bloodborne lore.
I think he made some good points but I have to agree with you on that theory. I defintely think Maria threw away her blade out of guilt for participating in the killing of Kos, who was a celestial being ( I believe) and killed herself from the torment of it. I think the photo could've been of German and her, and she smashed it out of guilt for not deserving to have love considering she helped kill Kos. I could see German already having a fetish for making dolls but after Maria's death he was distraught and made the Doll in memory of her, and so he didn't have to let her go.
I agree with most of this, but why would Gerhman just let anyone fuck the doll if he cares for it so much?
Infatuation is a synonym of mania, yet you chose to use fetish? Hmm, can't say I agree with that.
Here's what I think happened:
Gehrman clearly felt a strong love for Maria, but, for one reason or another, never let her know; he didn't know how to tell her, so his love for her was driving him mad. After she killed herself, Gehrman became depressed and built a doll in her image. The moon presence took pity on Gehrman and animated the doll in the dream for him; Gehrman's love for maria literally created the doll. That's why the doll has dialogue about being made to love her creator ("Hunters have told me about the church. About the gods, and their love. But... do the gods love their creations? I am a doll, created by you humans. Would you ever think to love me? Of course... I do love you. Isn't that how you've made me?").
I don't think moon presence cares about Gherman or any human for that matter, this dream was just meant to trap him and others and manipulate them into doing MP's doing.
+Ishidoro Clisham Although I do think the moon spirit has its own agenda,i tend to agree with Alex P. Afterall "the great ones are sympathetic in spirit."
The moon presence logical goal you can surmise, was to murder his rivals by any means necessary.
+Ishidoro Clisham I agree and i guess the sympathy the moon pressence has shown towards gehrman was just a tool to get gerhman to do its bidding. Then again i do beliefe that the great ones sometimes show genuine sympathy towards their surrogates.
+Alex P I agree that he took the fetish angle a little too far. It's obvious with the Old Hunters DLC that Gehrman made the doll to model Maria, but he's also dismissive of the doll. I think maybe he realized that the doll wasn't Maria and over the years began to resent it for being more of a reminder of his lost chance of love. But I don't think Gehrman has an actual doll fetish. I think there would be a lot more doll related stuff with him if that were the case.
Not sure about the Moon Presence animating the doll, especially if it has even limited movement in the real world. And the doll still exists even after killing Gehrman and the MP.
Honestly, I think Gherman felt something for Maria, not some weird doll fetish. The way the doll looks explains it.
Yeah, pretty obvious. But that "something" turned into a doll fetish when he created the doll to look like her.
Don't know man... from the sound of his voice seems like Gherman created the doll to try and remind him of Maria but he regrets having done so because the Doll doesn't fill his heart the same way Maria did. So when he says "you may use the Doll" he kinda seems angry at her, or angry at himself for having made her.
The doll is more little snow girl rather then golden bride. Little snow girl tells a story about old childless couple who create a daughter from snow but when spring comes they loose her. Golden bride tells about Smith Ilmarinen who smiths him self a bride from gold.
Dam he lost a loyal subscriber. 1 loyal sub... 1... big deal.
+DrTheKay if you fuck a doll, you have a doll fetish. Come on look at the care be put into the clothes.
Just my theory. The entire DLC is all Gehrman's nightmare, much like the dream, (hence: Hunter's nightmare and not hunters' nightmare.) This is why Maria is a corpse. She is actually dead but kept alive in Gehrman's nightmare, along with Ludwig, because what happened to them haunts him in his sleep. This is why Gehrman sleeps soundly after you complete the DLC. Gehrman felt guilt and love for Maria, so he fashioned the doll after her death out of guilt and loneliness. I believe Maria killed herself out of guilt for helping Gehrman slaughter the people of the fishing village in search of eyes, not because of being rejected by Gehrman. It doesn't make sense to me that Gehrman would make a doll of someone he is in love with while she is still alive, nor would he choose a doll over the real thing.
Nicooo You've got it almost... Gehrman was the one who was in love with Maria.
That's what I said, mate
This would be too simple wouldn't it?
I believe that the souls of laurence, ludwig, and maria do reside their though, and the kos orphan event happened in game real time, like the presence fight
It is quite possible. But that's the beauty of the series, you get to come to your own conclusions.
Its not sexual moaning in the old workshop. Data miners and programmers found a glitch that causes a giggling woman in cathedral ward to play.
Phil Battiste THANK YOU
Yeah when i played that it was fucking creepy
I found that noise myself and wondered about it but I never mistook it for sexual moaning. This guy might have a fixation.
Heisenbrrg yes.....something greater indeed...... ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
And they just never bothered patching it out? Riiiiiight
the "moaning" is actually a soundclip of Yharnamite woman laughing under the healing church
I think you're the one with a curious mania dude
Yeah I mean commiting genocide and murder is much less troubling to a person's soul than their teachers dick. Gratitude doesn't really translate to "advances".
And the "sex noises" are an audio glitch. It's the first part of another characters audio clip or so it seems.
Big time. 100% agree.
@@jordanrodrigues8435 Just watch his video delving into the "audio glitch". I have to disagree. It isn't
@@jordanrodrigues8435 guys guys there is this magic, arcane if you will thing called a "joke"
When Gherman cries....my heart dropped. I've never felt worse for any video game character.
Gehrmans story is very very sad
I think that Gehrman loved Maria but since she didn't reciprocate his feelings, he made the Doll out of his obsession over her but in time came to resent her because she wasn't the Maria he wanted. Maria probably just really admired Gehrman as her outfit indicates.
agreed
Maria parents father and mother where killed by a beast Gehrman looking after her as his deather
yeah
No way, she(Maria) wanted that D.
@@davidcattell7631 no that's from a false manga made by a soulsborn fan
I'm not sure about Maria's feelings; her clothing descriptions said she had "admiration" for Gehrman, not "affection" or the like. It could be that she looked up to him as a friend and mentor, not realizing that he was obsessed with her.
so gehrmen spent this entire time waiting for Lawrence but because or the dlc Lawrence is trapped in the hunters nightmare and a powered up cleric beast so there's no way for him to help gehrmen. if we don't put gehrmen out of his suffering there's no one to do it
It's a very common theme of dark fantasy where to free someone you have to kill them.
slightlytwistedagain yes it is but I feel extra bad for him because like most forced into his position he's waiting for a friend someone he knew to come help him but his friend fell victim and became the thing he was trying to fight
+Frank Casamento Welcome to the world of the Souls games, where you have to kill the bad, the good, and those in between as well.
Renato Figueiredo oh I know played dark souls never played 2 and played bloodborne looking forward to ds3
+Renato Figueiredo and they all are miserable xD you know FromSoft
Can't say I agree with this very much. It sounds like a Japanese high school romance. They like eachother but are too shy to express it? It also ignores all the terrible things in the research hall and Maria's own dialogue.
+Sam Wang totally not like Bloodborne is a Japanese game or something
... oh wait
Hehe... From software are Japanese :P
+Bins Wanger part of me wants to see Bloodborne as a cliche high school romance anime now
+coolman229 maybe off topic, but someone should create a fanfic of the doll getting pregnant from the hunter's blood echos or something like that
+Gladon how about no...
Not sure if this is a thing or not but did Gehrman intentionally lose his leg to remove the beast blood like it says in the old Hunter trousers?
+Kira F Maybe not intentionally, but the myth likely spans from what happened to Gehrman. Great job connecting the lore!
"A widespread belief of the period was that 'beast blood crept up the right leg...'"
I'm going to look into this further with the other wheelchair enemies to see if they, too, are missing right legs.
+fungo in the true ending you're also missing a leg
I'm pretty sure the moon presence takes it and took gehrman's but the little wheelchair fellas probably had it removed in some other way
+justaguy500 in the true ending you lose your whole body.
pipboy 0003 oh right, the bad ending or whatever people are calling it then
+justaguy500 Just watched the "bad ending" and it doesn't look like the hunter loses his leg.
That wasn't even the right door they were talking about. It's further down past the lady of the night. You're reading too much into this. Also "How to Pick up Fair Maidens" is a running Easter Egg in the souls game.
Where else does it show up?
And some say @@semiawesomatic6064 searches for the "how to pick up fair maidens" easter egg to this day
@@jaxonmarbary6756 even to this day, he searches for them
Even to THIS day.
@@semiawesomatic6064 can we get an update on your search
"...which OBVIOUSLY represents semen!" :D hahaha, you really want this to be a thing, don't you?
I believe gerhman was cursed and forced to live the orphan of kos's nightmare when he slept in the hunters dream because he assisted bergynwerth in the killing of the fishing hamlet people. Lady maria admired gehrman, most likely because of his amazing skill with a blade without the use of magic or blood. Maira wanted to be like gerhman, so she choose to use a weapon that relied on skill instead of blood, this made her different from other vilebloods. Then maria discovered what gehrman did and was appalled by it, so she turned her back on gehrman and his teachings by abandoning her rakuyo. The rakuyo reminded her too much of gehrman and her former admiration for him, she could no longer stomach it and threw it away. She choose to be the guardian of the fishing hamlet people and stopped anyone who had gotten too far.
khknight Its evident that she had a hand in the hamlets massacre, she never discovered ghermans "secret". Not to mention to mention that at least in her early days, she was not a so righteous person given that the patients in the reaearch hall know her well. She mightve been there to comfort them sure, but she was not dismayed by the practices for at least long enough to be a well known figure. And it doesnt seem she holds resentment for gherman mostly because theres no evidence for it. She threw her rakyuo away because she was disgusted by her own hand in the action. Plus she has a picture from the hunters dream fire mantle with her when she commited suicide. Doesnt point to resentment
This sounds more likely to me. Very well out fellow hunter.
@@RossetaStoned91 She couldn't get over what she did. That regret let to depression and then suicide.
I have to disagree with some aspects. First off "unaware of his mania" obviously translates to ignorant of his interest. Why would that be an immediate thing? It takes time to develop feelings no matter how fleeting. She admired his skill before anything else in my opinion. He was the first damn hunter after all. And it's possible that she was his first disciple as indicated by the old hunter bone. (yes it might say he but I don't care) Perhaps the separation occurred once events unfolded with Kos and the possibility for feelings to swell. Another anomaly (the moon presence) took place that seized Gehrman and declared him host of the hunters dream indefinitely. A guiding light for all hunters throughout time. Both trapped by dream and nightmare. Gehrman with the Moon Presence. Maria with the Orphan of Kos. It's just not right to water her story down to love for a man when she obviously takes a stand to protect what lies beyond the Astral Clocktower.
She was practically immortal and didn't even have to sit there protecting the secret. She could've gave in to her unyielding love and searched for a way to reach Gehrman. But it's obvious there was more priority in the secret of Fishing Hamlet than her master. The doll aspect is spot on though. And that part about them not reading each other's feelings. Alas it's all theory.
+chrissk08 The "he" in the old hunter bone is a mistranslation. The japanese text uses a gender neutral pronoun so it's not stating if it's male or female.
+gbtygfvyg Yeah. I wish that was more evident in the English version.
Jesus, the old hunter bone doesn't matter! Who cares if it's a he or she, multiple hunters had the ability! It could literally be any of the first hunters, it wasn't exclusive to Maria and Gherman. It could be Gherman's leg for all we know.
+chrissk08 I didn't get the impression she was protecting the village.
I read it as her trying to hide the guilty secrets of bergenwyrth/healing church/the first hunters.
Though who from is the question that comes to mind.
"she had great admiration for him"
"This means she loved him!"
....WHAT!?!?!
This is so fucking insulting to Maria XD XD
My god man! It's not semen! It's pale blood, a sign of the great ones!
your photo, your name, your comment... what a combo
Nah. Pale blood ain't white. That baby makin juice
blood borne 2's story is stopping the doll from founding Skynet. After all she is now self aware after you gave her the comb thing
Yo this just blew my mind!! That’s so crazy how you thought of this.
oh my god, Gehrman's sleep talk... My heart.... T____T
that wasn't sexual moaning someone did a video on that. its a glitch sound or something from a completely different area.
I feel like Maria had admiration for Gehrman,not love. cause she was unaware of his mania. So his obsession made him create the doll cause Maria is dead.
+Lord Fallen Yeah, I think the Doll having admiration for Gehrman meant that she looked up to him and his prowess as a warrior than a lover.
+Lord Fallen if not love why maria got a picture of german on the table?
+pentatopComment Which table? and even so, you dont keep pictures of only those you love. even those you respect and admire. People keep pictures of Gandhi, Abraham Lincoln, Martin Luther King because of respect and admiration. its more to a mentor and student relationship for Maria.
but, let say u admire lincoln, will you admire him so much you broke his picture but still not throw the pitcure away ? a__a? 5:39
+pentatopComment For example if I was a devout follower of Gandhi I would keep a picture of him. but if after finding out he slept naked with underaged girls to test his celibecy I would probably be disgusted and in anger break his picture. But then I would also remember that I followed this man whom i admired and dont have the heart to throw it away even though he commited this atrocity. Maria was full of admiration for Gehrman unaware of his curious mania. Also she probably didnt like him after what happened in the Fishing Hamlet. You know she thinks of that incident with disgust so maybe she has some anger towards Gehrman but also loyalty that is splitting her decision.
"...About the gods and their love, but do the gods love their creations? I am a doll created by you humans, would you ever think to love me? Of course i do love you, isn't that how you made me?" I think this has a much deeper meaning (no pun intended). It's questioning our faith as humans to the gods, just as Gehrman made the doll to love him, the gods made humans to love them, we don't choose faith, It's inherent in our creation.
AWillyMammoth but a lot of people are atheists
@@Snazzy12341 and many still remain religious
I honestly don't think Gehrman has a fetish for dolls..I always thought he was trying to create a new Maria out of the doll, with the One Third Umbilical Cord at the Hunter's Workshop. She's stuck in the Old Hunter's Nightmare..for all we know she went missing without saying goodbye and that piece of him was never at rest, so he tried making a new Maria. Just a theory though. This kind of reminds me of the Pinwheel theory.
+Formless Oedon
Maria's attire: "she had great admiration for Gehrman, unaware of his curious mania"
Definition of Mania: "an excessive enthusiasm or desire; an obsession. - Fetish."
In-game evidence shows the doll was created loosely based on Maria.
Gehrman had a fetish / obsession with dolls before modeling one after Maria.
I agree with everything else you said besides the first sentence.
+fungo True that. Just a question though. Why choose fetish instead of the other synonyms? Maybe his "curious mania " was a way of saying he had a obsession with Maria, and like you said, was awkward around her. But this theory is pretty solid, keep it up.
+fungo
Maybe Maria's "great admiration" meant she had great respect for Gehrman's accomplishments as a hunter and didn't have any feelings of affection towards him at all. Hence why Maria chose to become one of Gehrman's students in the first place. With the item descriptions and the smashed unclear picture lying besides Maria, I don't find that there's enough evidence to suggest that Maria had any feelings for Gehrman.
Kao S That's a good point. Let's say she had respect for him as a hunter instead of feelings of affection. That'd explain why she was unaware of the curious mania/desire that he had for her, because she never felt the same toward him as he did toward her. That'd also explain why he had the "How to pick up fair maidens" book, and why he created the doll in her image. I believe after Gerhman realized that a relationship between them will never work, he created a doll in her image and retrieved a 1/3 Umbilical Cord so he can bring it to life, so he can finally find love.
+fungo It's an interesting theory, but I don't think curious mania=fetish. If gehrman had a doll fetish or obsession, don't you think he would have made multiple? Instead he only made one, and that one doll looks exactly like the person I think he was truly obsessed with.
I love how it went from theory video to a doll screwing fetish.
not going to lie, i read the title as the doll mafia
"I think this means she loved Gehrman, otherwise why would they bring up his curious mania".
That makes no sense what so ever, sorry. How does one of those exclude the other?
9:53 that’s not moaning that’s a glitch with one of the Npcs repeating a line of dialogue over and over
Maria has her blades back because that's how she's reflected in the nightmare. That's how she imagines herself as a hunter. And she stoops to using blood magic in stage two, because anime-level sword fighting clearly isn't enough to stop you. She's really desperate not to let you through.
Game Dev: Let's put all these lore in hidden detail.
Me the player: Ah, ah, ah, ah, stayin alive, stayin alive!
I concluded that the Doll was the true host of the dream. Similar to how Micolash is the host of the mensis nightmare. No matter what ending happens the Doll is still alive and the dream continues.
See, I've always viewed this in reverse, where Maria had respect and admiration for Gehrman but never full on affection for him, unlike Gehrman who DID have those feelings for her, making the doll.
bit of a stretch. fan-fiction material at best
+N30n_g0LD People always say that, then I am always proven right later in interviews, guides, etc. For example: My theory on the first hunters slaying Kos was substantiated in the FuturePress guide on The Old Hunters.
not really, it makes since
+fungo I have 2 videos called Naughty old Gehrman, its relating to his relation ship with the doll. also if you watch it, note I have no editing skills so don't expect something beautiful. lol
+fungo
cool.
nothing wrong with fan-fiction theories becoming more or less true.
@@fungo that's because I believe that there is in every games studio à team tasked to search in the internet for fan theories that will help makes sense for some bullshit in the story and plot holes and lore they didn't plan or considered to have a Canon lore for it, they release it as Canon based on fan theories and the fans think they proved them right, damn son they just combined your fan fictions and theories into Canon lore.
The head of the abandoned doll on the workshop moves when you enter from the front door. I did now know that until recently.
Considering that Gehrman's events as a hunter together with Maria were decades ago, he must have been a young hunter when he started feeling love and... "things" for Maria, at least for me it's less disturbing to believe that than to imagine an old man fucking a young looking doll
Goddamn, i missed so much since i started the DLC after killing the Wet Nurse.
All the doll says then is “Gehrman awaits you, at the foot of the Great Tree...”
This is the most funniest and halirous porady theory i ever seen
As for me Maria's "shackles" are more like the curse that binds her to the Hunter's Nightmare.
"How to Pick Up Fair Maidens"
Somewhere on the far edge of the Kuiper Belt, a spaceship in the far future may detect my sides.
9:53 Damnnnn O_O Nice find bro! Never heard this or have ever heard anyone talking about this audio before
+TheYvesL Yeah, I just discovered it. Thought it was new with the patch, but no.
+fungo
In the yarnaham streets below, a little further down where the hunter with the rifle shoots at you, there's a lady in one of the houses, knock on the the door and she makes those exact "sexual noises" followed up with her saying how thankful she is to the church. You have to access the area early to catch her when she still has a bit of her sanity left. Guy across from her also says something about how grateful he is to the church( how you know you have the right house).
It's not a reference to the kinky sex between geherman and doll, man.
***** I have heard that, but I don't remember that Yes...Yes... thing. Going to check that later.
+Mike Mortis I don't mean the glitches have significance and no, the finger twitch was on purpose, but nice trying to rationalize it by not understanding how game development works at all.
+cheese puffs How does what you said explain that it's not a reference to Gehrman and the doll getting it on? Even if that same exact audio plays there, why would it be playing in the workshop? It's not a glitch - as someone had to purposefully code the trigger for that specific audio there and they've updated the game 8 times fixing many other minor glitches.
This video is brilliant from start to finish. Job well done my friend, truly excellent
The reason the Doll in the Abandoned Workshop is able to move her fingers is because she is trying to trick you into thinking that she is able to move in the frozen time, and when you get close, you realize it was because of magnets in her sleeve that are connecting to the metal in your weapons and clothing, and once you're close, she surprises you by punching a hole in your gut.
Jojo reference? :0
Diego Parra Yes
+bait4sale9001 ORA!
W-WHAT!?
Ohh my god?!?!
lol, does she own a Star Platinum too?
Is it unreasonable to assume that when Gehrmam tells you to use the doll he isn't talking about sex? The doll levels you up after all. And before he said that he talks about hunters using the workshop to enhance their flesh
I realy dont know where to say this, but i was reading "the thing on the doorstep" by lovecraft and i realized one thing. A theory that i've never heard about and it makes a lot of sense.
Here is my theory: the Gehrman we meet in the hunter's dream is no longer Gehrman... is actualy the moon presence. He is possessed by the moon presence the whole time. We speak with the moon presence and this is why he hesitate to say is name at the beginning of the game. The only time we can hear THE REAL Gherman talk is when he is sleeping.
The thing on the doorstep is a story about body snatcher and there is a part when 'the possessed' is in the Arkham Asylum (batlol) and he says this - “I had to do it-I had to do it . . . it’ll get me . . . it’ll get me . . . down there . . . down there in the dark. . . . Mother, mother! Dan! Save me . . . save me. . . .” - in a moment when he has control of his body. Sounds a lot like Gehrman calling out for Lawrence and Master Willem to save him. And this also is what the "second ending" is about. The moon prensence takes control over our body, just like Gherman before us. I am not sure about some details but i'm 100% sure this is not just a coincidence.
(sorry for my english, i am italian :D)
"Coherently let your mind run wild"
Fungo, 'coherent' and 'wild' are antonyms, they are incompatible which is why this entire video is such a brainfart. You take so much out of context that you completely ignore the threads that tie the lore together, making rash assumptions. Honestly, that disclaimer at the end was almost meaningless, "A good theory based on facts, observation and inference". When a game like Bloodborne doesn't give you the high and low of what's going on, the best guess is the simplest one. So why is it that you jump the gun and say Gehrman has a doll fetish, or that the Dream doesn't prevent aging (when it clearly does, else Gehrman would be a skeleton judging by how many graves their are for those he freed and how many nights of the hunt there have been since he was confined to the dream. It's also likely he's dead in the physical world, as we see the Nightmares persist even though their hosts have long since died e.g Micolash, Maria). Instead of focusing on Gehrman's obsession with Maria you just assumed he had a doll fetish, which doesn't make sense considering there's only one doll to speak of that looks identical to Maria. That Maria hasn't aged isn't indicative of vampiric blood either, more that how you look when you die = how you look in the dream/nightmare. That's another part of your theory that falls flat, because it's based on an assumption which is, at it's core, incorrect.
+Giantdad Lives cont. And you've got it backwards, Maria had an 'admiration' for Gehrman and considering their relationship as teacher and student I'm willing to bet that she admired him as a mentor, unaware that he loved her obsessively (compare the implications of 'admiration' against 'mania'). Assuming you are correct, why would Gehrman reject Maria if he was reading books on how to pick up fair maidens? Shouldn't he be overjoyed? Also, you miss the glaring implication that Gehrman has grown resentful of the Doll. Let's just say that after Maria died (for whatever reason) Gehrman becomes depressed, so depressed that he tries to recreate her with the doll yet despite the obsessive attention to detail and painstaking work it would never come to life or bring her back. A Great One, the Moon Presence, sympathises with Gehrman and brings the doll to life within the dream which it uses Gehrman to facilitate to fulfill its goals. To a Great One with no understanding of how humans work this might seem like the ideal solution, but Gehrman, after many years and countless hunters passing through, realises that the doll isn't Maria and instead reminds him of how he failed to confess his feelings for her. He permits the Hunter to use the doll for sexual purposes because he hates it, not because he gets off on watching a doll get screwed.
I know I'm being harsh here and that at the end of the day it's anyone's guess as to what is true or not, but I'm sure others can understand my frustration when we see a video that's professionally made that we think is going to either alter our own theories or strengthen them, but what we get is a very shallow, surface level analysis that you could expect from someone like IGN who don't understand story-writing and narratives.
👏👏👏👏
He's just logical, it doesn't takes to be a genius to realize that this video was just straight up stupid.
I lost my shit when he said at 5:35 that even tho he couldn't see who was in the picture decided to asume that it was gehrman
oh my god thank you for this comment. i got halfway through the video thinking "come on, people don't actually agree with this weird bullshit "based on facts"
The dude did order an entire pile of “How to Pick up Fair Maidens”
I thought the fair maidens book was just a joke
“If you look closely at the books in his workshop you will see many books”
Wtf did I just watch......
Lady Maria, which has a very interesting background story, was reduced to "killed herself for love", and Gherman would just create a sex doll with her face because you think any man would do that out of loneliness? That's kinda fucked up... Even for just a theory. These sexual themes have nothing to do with BB.
(I know this video is old... I just think it's really messed up)
The youtuber basically did what a reporter from a sensationalist newspaper would do: Spin the tale with false facts just to get more readers, which by the way is a dishonest practice.
You seriously didn't mention the tear stone talking about how the doll was made for companionship
Wow. Everything about Gehrman is so tragic it's painful.
Shawn Comets but he killed kos
i feel like the doll in the dream serves the same purpose as mergo's wet nurse, made by a great one to serve the purpose of nurturing another, though the doll is based off of a real object and obviously not made for combat. there are plenty of parallels between the hunter's dream and the nightmare of mensis as well, like gherman and micolash, both serving as hosts for the nightmares that trap them, and the player character and mergo, young beings, one a great one and the other a human, which serve as the main focuses of their respective nightmare/dream. there's also the possible connection between odeon and the wet nurse, as they are both formless beings, and the one thing that mensis is lacking is a powerful great one lurking behind the scenes, pulling strings and creating the nightmare/dream around a younger being in need of care and nurturing to grow and possibly serve some goal set in place from the start. this would leave the hunter's nightmare as the odd one out, with maria being the caretaker like the doll and wet nurse, the orphan being the host, haphazardly forming the nightmare around the memories of the place it's mother died and the memories of blood drunk hunters, too sick to remember the world around them, and finally kos, the powerful great old one who would be pulling the strings had they not died prematurely, possibly even bringing the curse down upon the hunters and scholars with her last breath, and leaving the nightmare unformed, causing the free-for-all of warped memories stacked on top of eachother found in the game, which would still leave the spot of the one in need of care open. maybe the blood-crazed hunters fill that role, as the nature of the curse might change their role to that of prisoners in need of punishment for their heinous acts, instead of children in need of nurturing care? still, pretty interesting to think about.
There's a problem with the logic here on the sexual moans.
I double checked and watched a video from VaatiVidya, who's a fellow Bloodborne/Dark Souls lore seeker. Apparently those moans are actually from the alley way that's below the tower, (the one where you can find the Skeptical man and Arianna) and at one of the doors with incense, you find a woman who praises the Healing Church. Parallel to that door is a man who does the same thing "Praise you... Praise the whole damn church!" He says. As for the woman, she says "hehehe yes..." which is the "Sexual Moans" you hear in the Old Hunters Workshop.
Perhaps you're right and that Gehrman was indeed sexual with the doll, I'm not downright denying your idea, but we can't count the woman's dialogue as proof for it.
She does her blood attacks because she resorts to her inherited vile blood abilities as a last resort to prevent you from encountering the corpse of Kos.
Please don't reduce a wonderful, nuanced, tragic character as Lady Maria to a typical damsel killing herself over a guy. There is nothing in the game that suggests she was anything but his student. The mania was all one sided on Gerhman's part, and mania isn't romantic, it's creepy and unhealthy. Her first duty was as a Hunter. Then after the bloodshed at the Fishing Hamlet, she cast it aside to care for the patients as a mother figure, in efforts to atone for her past sins. If anything she probably lost respect for Gerhman as he likely influenced her into the hamlet massacre, being her mentor and all. Hence taking up a position far away from him and the workshop. Her suicide was triggered by having to watch the patients suffer and die all for nothing under her care; in essence, her attempt to do good only made everything worse. She likely had PTSD from the hamlet massacre as well which compounded her desolate state of mind.
Finally, a Bloodborne fan that doesn’t have the comprehension skills of a rock. I also don’t think Gehrman saw her in that way, she was likely just a daughter figure to him and it really hurt him to know he took part in her disillusionment so he created a mourning doll to cope with the loss of his beloved student, and to honor her properly. He’s much more tragic and nuanced that way.
@@batterychugger That's an interesting take on Gerhman, I actually hope that is the case as I always thought he was a bit of a creep with his Maria obsession and given their age gap he really ought to see her as a daughter instead of anything else. It would explain the item description for the spare doll clothes that the Hunter obtains as well, where it remarks that they were kept with great care out of love.
"An old man stuck with a doll for centuries? I mean COME ON, man, How could he not?"
9:53 that's a old woman laughing you can actually hear the laugh at the end of someone's dialouge
Platinum Rage well, now it's even dirtier
I gotta give it up to you man :D , I hardly ever find you tubers funny but on this video you made me laugh a lot , well done man! well done!
Although your sexual theory makes sense, fetish doesn't necessarily mean a sexual fetish.
A Google definition of fetish: an inanimate object worshiped for its supposed magical powers or because it is considered to be inhabited by a spirit.
So I agree that Gehrman was awkward around girls, hence why he has pick-up books in his dream and workshop. And he and Maria were in fact very much in love. But, because of his awkwardness he never made a move on her. And Maria not knowing of his "mania" doesn't necessarily mean Gehrman had a doll fetish, but maybe she just wasn't aware of his DESIRE for her. So once Maria finished her training under Gehrman, they both went off on their separate ways, in the classic love tragedy of "both parties loving each other, but neither having the courage to make a move." So once Gehrman was burdened with becoming the host of the hunter's dream, he had the doll created in the image of his lost love.
Back to the definition of "fetish." Gehrman maybe wasn't literally sexually attracted to dolls, but the doll was his fetish in that he believed that a spirit (Lady Maria's) inhabited the doll. Of course, he never saw Lady Maria in any other attire other than her hunter's attire, so he had made a cutsey everyday wear for the doll to fantasize about what their lives could have been like outside the hunt, hence those sexual moans as well.
As for that white fluid, I don't know. Epic Name Bro suggests that the doll is actually a great one in disguise (she spills paleblood, and pretty much adopts you in the true ending, something something the great ones search for mortal wombs or something). But can she really be a great one if she was created my a mortal? Maybe that really is resemblance of all those lonely years of Gehrman firing quicksilver bullets from his hunter's cannon, if you know what I mean.
Lady maria was originally gonna have more dialogue but it was scrapped and left for code raiders to undig
Just wanted to say that I really like your videos, I feel you put a lot of effort into the content and quality to guarantee an entertaining watch.
I really want to support your channel so you can make even better stuff, so expect me to be on those credits as soon as I get a new job xD
And thank you for the great content.
+TuiFellowship Thanks for the kind comment and you are very welcome!
I’m not a blood borne lore expert but ghermans peg leg is most likely a out of date method and prevention of the old hunters tale that the blood from fallen beasts crept up the right leg. Eventually belts were used on the pant legs instead, such as our own hunter.
I believe that Maria admired Gehrman, in a 'notice me, senpai' kind of way, while his mania towards Maria was more sexual in nature.
Maria tried to kill herself in the 'real' world, but as a result of the curse, was brought into the 'dream'.
Gehrman, unable to cope with the loss of Maria, created the Doll in her image, in a replacement goldfish kind of way.
Eventually, he came to his senses and became resentful of the Doll, explaining his 'use the doll' comment at the start of the game.
I'm pretty sure Maria's suicide was connected to both her guilt from what happened in Fisherman's Hamlet and the Healing Church, it connects much better to how she's positioned (back turned against a secret she's ashamed of, simultaneously letting her see those who would try to expose it). She also mentions the secret rather than mumbling about "love" in her dialogue.
Finally, her relation to queen Annalise hardly means she's harder to kill or failed to suicide. We don't know for sure that every single person trapped in the Nightmare(s) are alive, Micolash is in Mergo's Nightmare but we enter that through his dead body in the Unseen village inside another Hunter Nightmare, Queen Yharnam also has that hole in her belly and there's clues pointing that she might not be alive but that manifestation of hers is still trapped in the nightmare.
Let's not forget that that entire Nightmare is reserved to all hunters, Old Hunters in particular.
Great video man. You keep theorizing, it gives me something to do. However, personally, I believe there may be a different explanation to events:
Maria came to help in the fight against the beasts. She may have heard tales of Gehrman, and his prowess, and, being one of the first hunters, looked up to him as a teacher and figure to aspire to. But, Gehrman was somewhat taken with Maria, whereas while she may have looked up to him in that way, was definitely not to the extent he was taken with her. She may have been put off by this, and eventually broke ties with him to get away from this man who she admires but creeps her out. This probably didn't work, him chasing after her, and so she took her own life to get him to finally leave her be.
He was broken by this, and created the doll to fill the void left by Maria, to bring her back in a sense. But the doll was not Maria, not her personality, not her skill, and admired him, but not in the same way. It wasn't the same. So, Gehrman waits to be released, and is dismissive of the doll because she's not maria, so he scorns or largely ignores her. The doll loves him, but he doesn't love the doll.
Just my take on the lore, it's vague to allow theories like these, both mine and fungo's, make of it what thou whilst.
What is that?bloodborne feminist edition? Lol Gehrman creepying out Maria because he loves her and sometimes watches her on facebook leaving a post,Maria killing herself because of the constant abuse of the terrible one tweet left by Gehrman saying "hello Maria.how are you?", the neverending quest by her collegues to ban men from social media to avoid the horrible freedom of men to leave comments as such to avoid other terrible tragedies like the constant fair critique of ideas! Oh god will they ever be able to end this horrible nightmare? Tonight..crazy ass feminists join the hunt...on twitter (cuz seeing real men in real life can trigger them cuz of mens abusive presence and the rape by looking)
+kato093 Literally how the fuck did you read the above comment and came to the "crazy ass feminists" conclusion...? What's got facebook to do with this? Or social media in general? Why must you strawman like this? Why must you make me cringe with secondhand embarrassment burning stronger than a thousand suns.
+SkullParrot he is aware hunters don't have Facebook, right? Also, wasn't aware I was being feminist, just thought German is creepy. Done. ( please let me not have opened myself to further insult, I'm only an human. Mercy for the wizened child...)
Ryan Llewellyn
You FOOL. Are you not aware of the age old rule "do not think a male is creepy or ur a nazi feminist"? It's the law of nature, you heathen.
the joke @2:39 got you a like.
I really like the idea of Maria having feelings for Gherman instead of her just looking up to him, which is what many others have suggested. It also seems to make a lot more sense and makes the story a lot more enjoyable. And by enjoyable I mean heartbreaking. Sad times.
Good video tho 10/10
Mara only saw germen as a mentor and a friend and that's all likely he never got the chance to tell here how he felt by the time she killed herself.
She admired him, dont think love him, then she knew about his particular mania and creep her out xD After all he was his mentor.
+damainmg what is his mania, sorry for bad english, what is mania mean ??
+pentatopComment is like a mental disorder or being obsessed about something, in this case with the dolls.
damainmg
can i say he actually obsessed about the dream and the truth not the doll ? in this case
The thing that is very stupid is that he knows what dying he can wake up. Why not looking for a guy to kill him, like he tried to do to you. Lol i will kill you and you will wake up. And i will be rotten in this Hunter Dream forever xD
Also Maria didnt knew anything about the dream or whatever, his mania got to be with dolls or obsessed with her, otherwise doesn't fit and the truth of all them are obsessed with. That's their doom. So no, it got to be his infatuation with her or that he's sick with the dolls. After all FromSoftware destroy their characters pretty bad, they don't have happy lives, live happily ever after, etc. Most of them end up like a bad cartoon of themselves being monsters, corrupted, blood thirsty, maniacs, burglars, assassins, etc. You know FromSoft.
damainmg
i dont think maria obsessed with the truth, she just admire or like gehrman's ability that he might stop the beast thing? she never show she is interested the truth unlike german who regreted he found the truth. (thank for the information!)
Gherman's raw delivery begging for help and breaking down sobbing always gets to me. Hits me hard and feel so badly for the old man.
At one point in time, the Healing Church and the Hunters parted ways, didn't they? Doesn't seem like Gehrman had anything to do with what happened in the Fishing Hamlet, since he's not affected by the curse. Somewhere in between, Maria went with the Healing Church and Gehrman got stuck in that dream. Maybe that's why Gehrman didn't say anything to Maria, since they had difference in views and such? And there are a lot of books in the Research Hall on how to pick up fair maidens, haha. Yay theories.
+White Arrow I think you have a point there. It is odd that Gehrman is very old by the time we meet him in the Hunter's Dream. It seems to me that he might have lost his leg rather young in the early days as a hunter. He could have trained Maria while he was still young and before he lost his leg.
The moment he lost his leg could have been the catalyst for his creation of the doll. Stuck in his workshop unable to hunt along side Maria might have made him mad with grief. A downward spiral of self loathing could have followed preventing him from mustering up the courage to have his love known. Instead he creates the doll and accepts being the host of the Hunter's Dream to forget his foolish mania.
Thanks, Fungo for making the dlc better for me, before i really was hell bent on thinking Gerhman was a super prev creating the doll out of some fetish persuasion. But, that observation of his lost leg give my imagination alot to run with haha.
I'm gonna guess that Gehrman was active in the real world a lot longer than Maria was before they ventured into their corresponding dream realms. I mean I know Maria was younger, but looking at them both now Gehrman is waaay older looking now.
+Omar Tlatelpa We know Gehrman made the doll before he got stuck in the Hunter's Dream. The doll and a spare set of clothes are found in the real world workshop. Also something of note is that if you end up taking Gehrman's place then you lose a leg as well. Gehrman very well may have lost his leg to the Moon Presence when Laurence called it.
+White Arrow There's no evidence of the Healing Church even existing when the Fishing Hamlet existed (although that explanation might be flawed because the Cathedral Ward as a whole IS the Healing Church). I believe that that happened either during or immediately after the Byrgenwerth schism. Lady Maria was Gehrman's apprentice, so she couldn't possibly be a member of the Healing Church.
BradyTheHunter Then she went with who could be the founders of the Healing Church. It's been established that Maria was Gehrman's apprentice, but they went their separate ways and she was part of the group - whoever they are - that violated the Fishing Hamlet.
I was always under the impression that Maria rejected or was unaware of Ghermans feelings of obsession for her. Which is why he created the doll but realized how fucked up it was and rejected it later on...
This video is rather silly,Gehrman was the first hunter and as such before ascending to the hunter's dream he possessed incredible strenght,very high status and he likely was very wealthy as well so he certainly had countless women wanting to marry him or simply have fun with such an uniquely gifted individual,even more so since,before being chosen by the moon presence he was young and handsome as well.
The"how to pick up fair maidens" book must be a silly easter egg put there by FROM SOFTWARE.
+azurewolf7 sadly lore states that the first hunters hunted under the veil of night, aka no one but the church knew about them, and when they were discovered they were disbanded and replaced with the church hunters, who were more doctors then hunters, so it's more then possible that what you believe maybe false.
Philip Studman Oh i see,so Gehrman wasn't the Bloodborne equivalent of Tiger Woods...
Well,now this video makes more sense.
Same voice actor for the doll and Maria too.
this is my favorite soulsborne lore video ever
OMG Spill white blood shocks me so much...
The inside of dull is filled with so much semen...
This blows my mind
It's clear blood, the great ones have clear blood and the doll was brought to life by a great one.
Goddamnit Gehrman clean up after yourself. Offering the doll and it's still full of your splooge...
But it only comes from her skirt
Ventus S ya but a lot of eldritch creatures spill white blood too
Well we do know that Gehrman is controlled by the moon presence and that's interesting that you would point out the audio with the orphan of Kos and his crying while sleeping. I never noticed that before. However, while I agree 100% that Gehrman was obsessive, I feel like Maria (given what personality we did see) might have only admired him as a deep respect for the hunter he was versus being head over heels in "love" with him. I feel like Gehrman based the doll off of her during the dolls creation because of his own admiration for his student. At least that was what I had pieced together before during a lore rant with a friend. And I didn't notice the blood around her symbolizing a possible attempt on her own life. I did read that she had tossed her blade(s?) down the well in the fishing hamlet long ago but I can recall the details on all that. .....Anyway great video, and good food for thought.
Wait wait wait wait wait wait wait.
Are you telling me that every time you hit the doll, JIZZ FLYS OUT OF IT!!
OH! MY! GOD!
Gehrman came buckets
It's warm too
3:51 that is the funniest thing ever 😂😂
I think the doll bleeds white because she is a pale blood
Dude, Paleblood, the Moon Presence, ripped off his leg when Gerhman became the host of the Hunter's Dream.
Is it possible to give the hair ornament to Maria?
No
+MGTOW Fantasy Zone Somewhere between her ripping you to shreds and stabbing herself with dual swords... I'd say maybe xD Nah just kidding.
So the doll in the abandoned workshop twitches her left index finger every few seconds. You wouldn't notice it unless you used the Monocular to examine her more closely. I would say it's a graphical glitch except it's fairly normal looking and happens at regular intervals.
It's not specifically a doll fedish fungo, she's a doll because you cant make an actual person. No other reason. His infatuation with her is because she looks like a person, specifically his interest while he was alive, Maria. You note that he's in love with her and conclude it's a doll fetish instead of realizing he made a doll to look like her, and that doll manifested into the Hunters Dream because it is located in the same place that the Dream takes shape, and is probably very cared for by Gehrman as you pointed out in the video.
He does have sex with it. This is a japanese game, and the mans greatest physical attraction has manifested itself into a live defenseless doll. There's nothing else to conclude with his suggestive dialogue and other clues in the game, but he doesn't have a doll fedish lmao.
great videos mate
I actually regretted watching this video🤦
Gehrman banging The Doll is like Joker banging EDI. With the exception that Gehrman is almost unbreakable.
Oh no, I'm not buying any of this. A 'doll fetish', really?
Everything else makes sense but that
Maria was his apprentice and they were both part of the slaughter of Kos and the fishing hamlet, which is why the nightmare was created. He got rid of his right leg to purge the plague, which was the old hunters’ superstition as to how it spread
Doll fetish???
Really?
That's what u got from that?
I feel the mania was more directed to Maria, and the doll is merely a result of that. I think that Maria’s love to Gehrman was that of a student to her teacher; whereas Gehrman loved Mariah. He was never able to have her, however, as Mariah never realized that. So after she abandoned the hunt, Gehrman made the doll, as a replacement, modeled in Mariah’s likeness
I disagree with you about the idea of Maria having a crush for Gehrman. The description make me think that she admires him as a teacher and she absolutely don't see him as a potential lover, probably because he is much older than her. That's why he tries to learn how to seduce with his books ;)
bluewings2 i think they were the same age at the time though. it's just that maria stopped aging
If the moon presence takes your leg when you kill Gehrman than that would mean...
A little late to this video but have recently found your Bloodborne content. Some of your videos are informative and entertaining, but this one really grated against me. I would be reluctant to draw any hasty conclusions about lore in a game like Bloodborne, and you mentioned letting your mind run wild with the facts shown in-game, but in the end if you run wild you can run *off course* which is what I strongly feel you've done in this video.......and in doing so you've greatly detracted from delivering an informative experience as well as making your video less entertaining overall.
You've brought up some interesting points, but it's as if you're viewing all the game's contents through a hyper-sexualized lens. I personally don't feel there's enough in-game evidence to really justify this theory and it just feels like you're blowing smoke up your own ass, no offense. It was the kind of video that made me feel as if my brain cells were shriveling up in revulsion.........Bloodborne is the kind of game in which it's obvious that great attention to detail and care has been given to the lore elements, yet you're choosing to ignore that in favor of asserting some Gehrman x Doll story of the quality you'd find something like a typical online fanfiction. Please give FromSoftware a bit more credit than that.
I would appreciate showing a bit more care and discernment in how you decide to interpret the clues you find in the future.
Damn, you'd think you worked on this game personally, I don't interpret this the same as fungo, but I know eceryone interprets differently, you have no evidence proving this is wrong, so take your own advice and consider all avenues not just "oh well from soft is better than that" I wanna see your video on this topic, seems like you got insider info, where's the video? ??
My theory isn't that she knew about Gehrman's feelings for her. In fact, it doesn't really matter. What does matter is that German was the first hunter and the hunters were ordered by the church to kill mother kos (according to the guide) and did what they did to the fishing hamlet. She found out he did a good portion of that stuff along with the other old hunters, grew disgusted enough to throw her weapon the rakuyo into the well, and decided to protect the secret of the village as a way to punish the old hunters for doing those terrible things. Hell Gehrman being in the hunter's dream is, in a way, his punishment for his actions.
The Hunter's Dream should be called The Hunter's Wet Dream
If you now what I mean ;)
haha
Wow this next level analysis. Subbed
Is this bait.
12 minutes and 30 seconds of virgin-like fanfiction. projection at its finest