It does. It just takes a number of years. Their previous elite farm system circa 2020 produced this current era of 4-straight winning seasons. There are countless examples of franchises worse than the Mariners becoming consistent winners off the back of elite farm systems. Anyone with memories will tell you how much of a joke the Astros were as a franchise in the years after the Killer B's. Or how hapless the Royals were before their back-to-back World Series appearances of the mid-2010s. Elite farm systems changed those things.
We've got the farm system. We've got the pitching. Now we just need a few free agents who can actually hit. Oh wait.....that costs money. Oh wait. Oh no. Oh crap. Oh hell.
Blame the front office for signing guys like Ray and Castillo to big deals over bats. Still middle in payroll. The front office is just awful in my opinion
@@GeorgeConner69420the same front office that developed julio, cal, gilbert, kirby, woo, miller and traded for castillo is awful?? They haven’t hit on low-budget offseason bats, but that doesnt make them awful. Our owners are cheap!
I'm interested, but you guys repeat yourselves a lot. Do you remember that the Mariners play in T-Mobile Park? Unless a player has elite power, Seattle should be content with hard line-drive hitters who use the entire field and don't strike out. In that sense, the top guys fit the profile for the ballpark. Your analysis seems to overlook the fact that average "power hitters" get psyched out and typically underperform in Seattle.
@@benluecken2839 At times, Randy gets hot in the post season and can carry a team but most of the time not so much. 199 bats with the Ms - batted .231 with 5 HRs. not so impactful imo.
Young was drafted in ‘22 and is expected to debut this year at some point so 3 years on the nose, Ford takes a bit longer because catchers take a bit longer as it’s not as much athleticism but game calling. Also if your bar is Griffey or ARod you are gonna be disappointed more often then not as both would be inner circle hall of famers (Griffey is) if not for ARods PED stuff.
The Mariners should target two teams for trades, the Diamondbacks and the Royals. Trade for Jake McCarthy and Gino Groover on the Diamondbacks. Get Vinnie Pasquantino from the Royals and possibly Javier Vaz. Trade JP, Castillo and Robles with whatever other baggage they have along with prospects. Bring up Cole Young to play SS, Michael Arroyo to play 2B and Evan Williamson to swing duties at 3B/DH with Groover. Bring up Brandyn Garcia to have a starting LHP. Lineup would be as follows. RF McCarthy LF Arozarena CF Julio C Cal 1B Vinnie Pasquantino 2B Arroyo DH Raley/Williamson 3B Groover SS Young Starting Pitchers Gilbert Kirby Garcia Miller Woo I truly don't understand why kids that have a decent walk rate and low K rate aren't valued more. Baseball isn't all about hitting for power like pundits are putting in these kid's heads nowadays. You need table setters that are consistent at the plate to help put pressure on the pitching and give your superstars better chances at the dish as well. For every Ohtani/Judge you need a Luis Arraez type of hitter to compliment your lineup and create more runs. Also, a strikeout is a missed opportunity and should be looked at as such. If I was a manager and had a guy striking out at a 30% clip, they'd be riding the pine until they can figure out how to make contact with the ball. The new age stats also muddy the game in my opinion. A homerun is a homerun, double a double, etc. It doesn't matter what launch angle it's hit or how far it goes, the goal of the game is to get on base and/or drive in runs when hitting, so the more hits and less k's the better.
@@devindukes8258 Plenty of guys make the jump from AA. Arroyo probably needs another year though, true. Javier Vaz could be substituted from what I put above as well.
The reason why stats like launch angle and exit velocity are important for prospects is because it shows their potential. 2 players can hit the same number of HRs but one may have the *potential* to get more in the future based on his underlying stats. And potential is all that matters for prospects.
we keep hearing how awesome the Ms farm system is but it seems like it’s always a couple years away. Dipoto will even use the rankings as something to hang his hat on but until one of these guys actually hits at the major league level I’m skeptical.
Well to be fair a lot of them have graduated in recent years… Kirby, Gilbert, Julio, Cal, Woo, & Miller. Unfortunately Kelenic and Kyle Lewis didn’t work out. This newest class is still very young .
The last time we ranked the Mariners farm system as top tier was when they had Julio Rodriguez, Logan Gilbert, George Kirby and Cal Raleigh in the top 10.
What are you talking about. Their best players are from their farm system lol. They drafter a bunch of pitchers for 3 years, then went for bats. Those first batch of bats is harry ford and he is projected to come up sometime this year.😅
So tired of hearing how stacked the M’s farm system is. It makes ZERO difference with this organization. Every year the farm system is stacked and they just don’t ever pan out. This stacked farm system has NEVER translated to success at the big league level.
"Every year the farm system is stacked and they just don't ever pan out." Julio Rodriguez, Cal Raleigh, George Kirby, Logan Gilbert, Bryce Miller and Bryan Woo haven’t panned out?
@ position players. Julio is an above average fielder. But very mediocre hitter. Same as Cal, great catcher. The best defensive catcher in baseball. But barely above the Mendoza line batting avg. pitching is the only thing that’s produced from the farm system. All the stud position players don’t pan out.
@@patrickrobbins9858Julio has repeatedly shown he has the potential to be one of the best hitters in baseball. When he’s hot he’s THE best hitter in baseball. His problem is that he’s not been consistent at all, not that he’s a mediocre hitter. Also he won the Gold Glove in center field so maybe “above average” isn’t the right term. As for Cal, the best defensive catcher in the sport gave you 34 home runs, and you’re complaining about the Mendoza line? Be serious.
@@Zach-ls1if The stacked farm system has been being said for the last decade. To only have 2 position players show signs of being good. Neither has shown they’re good enough to do it for a full season. They’ve shown flashes. The only position that’s produced is pitching. Which has given the Ms the best starting 5 in baseball. When the hell are we going to see the position players produce dividends. You can’t keep saying it’s stacked when you’ve only had 2 guys in the last decade.
The farm system is overrated af. Ford and Young are barely doing anything at AA. Montes has holes in his swing. Emerson is just potential. I really don't get the hype. The only real legit right now I see is Celesten.
@@spencerharkins2021 How does batting .240 in double A make you a coveted prospect? I am a mariners fan, too. Ford sucks. Montes is a long ways away. I hope I am wrong, but I just don't see the hype. The Mariners never have prospects pan out besides Julio.
@@GeorgeConner69420 Ford and Young both had around a 120 wRC+ in AA in a very tough hitting ball park. I do think those 2 are slightly overrated. I think they are more solid than great prospects. Laz has a chance to be a masher but that's all he is. He's most likely going to end up at AA towards the end of the season and we'll see how the power translates. The M's still have a very good farm and I'm not sure why you're hating on it.
"I'm very high..." Hey good to know, so am I!
Great analysis, M's are stacked!
4 of 5 starters came out of this farm..
If only an elite farm system translated to an elite MLB team.
It does. It just takes a number of years. Their previous elite farm system circa 2020 produced this current era of 4-straight winning seasons. There are countless examples of franchises worse than the Mariners becoming consistent winners off the back of elite farm systems. Anyone with memories will tell you how much of a joke the Astros were as a franchise in the years after the Killer B's. Or how hapless the Royals were before their back-to-back World Series appearances of the mid-2010s. Elite farm systems changed those things.
I like his low strikeout, high OBP.
We've got the farm system. We've got the pitching. Now we just need a few free agents who can actually hit. Oh wait.....that costs money. Oh wait. Oh no. Oh crap. Oh hell.
Blame the front office for signing guys like Ray and Castillo to big deals over bats. Still middle in payroll. The front office is just awful in my opinion
@@GeorgeConner69420the same front office that developed julio, cal, gilbert, kirby, woo, miller and traded for castillo is awful?? They haven’t hit on low-budget offseason bats, but that doesnt make them awful. Our owners are cheap!
Lazaro is taller than 6’3 lol
I'm interested, but you guys repeat yourselves a lot.
Do you remember that the Mariners play in T-Mobile Park? Unless a player has elite power, Seattle should be content with hard line-drive hitters who use the entire field and don't strike out.
In that sense, the top guys fit the profile for the ballpark. Your analysis seems to overlook the fact that average "power hitters" get psyched out and typically underperform in Seattle.
They have a good farm system because they never trade for an impact player.
Do you not consider Randy Arozarena an impact player???
@@benluecken2839 At times, Randy gets hot in the post season and can carry a team but most of the time not so much. 199 bats with the Ms - batted .231 with 5 HRs. not so impactful imo.
We deserve to win now. Move the fences in and learn how to hunt
These players are so slow to develope. A-Rod and Junior were top prospects but both were impact players within three years of being drafted
Young was drafted in ‘22 and is expected to debut this year at some point so 3 years on the nose, Ford takes a bit longer because catchers take a bit longer as it’s not as much athleticism but game calling.
Also if your bar is Griffey or ARod you are gonna be disappointed more often then not as both would be inner circle hall of famers (Griffey is) if not for ARods PED stuff.
@ nice, thanks for the perspective
McGonigle is not better then Emerson. McGonigle going to be Cavan Biggio.
Mariners suck
The Mariners should target two teams for trades, the Diamondbacks and the Royals. Trade for Jake McCarthy and Gino Groover on the Diamondbacks. Get Vinnie Pasquantino from the Royals and possibly Javier Vaz. Trade JP, Castillo and Robles with whatever other baggage they have along with prospects. Bring up Cole Young to play SS, Michael Arroyo to play 2B and Evan Williamson to swing duties at 3B/DH with Groover. Bring up Brandyn Garcia to have a starting LHP. Lineup would be as follows.
RF McCarthy
LF Arozarena
CF Julio
C Cal
1B Vinnie Pasquantino
2B Arroyo
DH Raley/Williamson
3B Groover
SS Young
Starting Pitchers
Gilbert
Kirby
Garcia
Miller
Woo
I truly don't understand why kids that have a decent walk rate and low K rate aren't valued more. Baseball isn't all about hitting for power like pundits are putting in these kid's heads nowadays. You need table setters that are consistent at the plate to help put pressure on the pitching and give your superstars better chances at the dish as well. For every Ohtani/Judge you need a Luis Arraez type of hitter to compliment your lineup and create more runs. Also, a strikeout is a missed opportunity and should be looked at as such. If I was a manager and had a guy striking out at a 30% clip, they'd be riding the pine until they can figure out how to make contact with the ball. The new age stats also muddy the game in my opinion. A homerun is a homerun, double a double, etc. It doesn't matter what launch angle it's hit or how far it goes, the goal of the game is to get on base and/or drive in runs when hitting, so the more hits and less k's the better.
I want to see how high Robles can go. He is trying to makeup for lost time and big money contracts
I’d like to see Arroyo and Williamson get more pa’s above double AA before they’re up.
@@golfmaniac007 If we can keep him he'd be a good 4th outfielder, but McCarthy is legit and would be a huge pickup imo.
@@devindukes8258 Plenty of guys make the jump from AA. Arroyo probably needs another year though, true. Javier Vaz could be substituted from what I put above as well.
The reason why stats like launch angle and exit velocity are important for prospects is because it shows their potential. 2 players can hit the same number of HRs but one may have the *potential* to get more in the future based on his underlying stats. And potential is all that matters for prospects.
we keep hearing how awesome the Ms farm system is but it seems like it’s always a couple years away. Dipoto will even use the rankings as something to hang his hat on but until one of these guys actually hits at the major league level I’m skeptical.
Well to be fair a lot of them have graduated in recent years… Kirby, Gilbert, Julio, Cal, Woo, & Miller. Unfortunately Kelenic and Kyle Lewis didn’t work out. This newest class is still very young .
The last time we ranked the Mariners farm system as top tier was when they had Julio Rodriguez, Logan Gilbert, George Kirby and Cal Raleigh in the top 10.
What are you talking about. Their best players are from their farm system lol. They drafter a bunch of pitchers for 3 years, then went for bats. Those first batch of bats is harry ford and he is projected to come up sometime this year.😅
So tired of hearing how stacked the M’s farm system is. It makes ZERO difference with this organization. Every year the farm system is stacked and they just don’t ever pan out. This stacked farm system has NEVER translated to success at the big league level.
"Every year the farm system is stacked and they just don't ever pan out." Julio Rodriguez, Cal Raleigh, George Kirby, Logan Gilbert, Bryce Miller and Bryan Woo haven’t panned out?
@ position players. Julio is an above average fielder. But very mediocre hitter. Same as Cal, great catcher. The best defensive catcher in baseball. But barely above the Mendoza line batting avg. pitching is the only thing that’s produced from the farm system. All the stud position players don’t pan out.
@@patrickrobbins9858Julio has repeatedly shown he has the potential to be one of the best hitters in baseball. When he’s hot he’s THE best hitter in baseball. His problem is that he’s not been consistent at all, not that he’s a mediocre hitter. Also he won the Gold Glove in center field so maybe “above average” isn’t the right term.
As for Cal, the best defensive catcher in the sport gave you 34 home runs, and you’re complaining about the Mendoza line? Be serious.
@@patrickrobbins9858Julio has a career ops+ of 130, and Cal’s carreer ops+ is 112. That’s not mediocre, it’s far above average
@@Zach-ls1if The stacked farm system has been being said for the last decade. To only have 2 position players show signs of being good. Neither has shown they’re good enough to do it for a full season. They’ve shown flashes. The only position that’s produced is pitching. Which has given the Ms the best starting 5 in baseball. When the hell are we going to see the position players produce dividends. You can’t keep saying it’s stacked when you’ve only had 2 guys in the last decade.
The farm system is overrated af. Ford and Young are barely doing anything at AA. Montes has holes in his swing. Emerson is just potential. I really don't get the hype. The only real legit right now I see is Celesten.
😂
@@spencerharkins2021The only legit player is the furthest away. Clown...
@@spencerharkins2021 How does batting .240 in double A make you a coveted prospect? I am a mariners fan, too. Ford sucks. Montes is a long ways away. I hope I am wrong, but I just don't see the hype. The Mariners never have prospects pan out besides Julio.
@ absurd takes my guy get some sleep
@@GeorgeConner69420 Ford and Young both had around a 120 wRC+ in AA in a very tough hitting ball park. I do think those 2 are slightly overrated. I think they are more solid than great prospects. Laz has a chance to be a masher but that's all he is. He's most likely going to end up at AA towards the end of the season and we'll see how the power translates. The M's still have a very good farm and I'm not sure why you're hating on it.