.38 Special Rivals (and Beats) 9mm for Self Defense!
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- Опубликовано: 18 янв 2021
- In this video I will be discussing many of the pros and cons of the .38 Special and 9mm cartridge, as well as their platforms revolver VS auto, but I will be talking mainly about duty size firearms and will be referencing law enforcement "one shot stop" statistical data as well as the Greg Ellifritz data, when talking about how they compare in terms of real world self defense.
I will also do a ballistic test in my normal "Jug-or-Not" box with my normal bologna pack test, but also a wood penetration test. I will also do some practical accuracy and reload drills. 
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I knew a man that's now long gone. After coming home from WWII serving in the 2nd Ranger Battalion he became a state trooper. He carried a 38 a S&W Model 10 with a 4 inch barrel. He said, it was accurate, easily stopped a man if proper shots were used and was less maintenance than a 1911 . Now he also did carry a 1911 if in plain clothes. By the way he shot down a low flying German ME109 with a Thompson SMG at the Ardennes , the plane was flying tree top high and he got lucky, he said he was the only Infantryman with a 109 kill, confirmed.
How cool is THAT!!
Sorry dude, but I highly doubt that anyone brought down a German fighter with a Thompson SMG. He may have been shooting at it when it went down, but I highly doubt he was hitting it. Chances are someone else was also shooting at it with something more potent - like a .50 cal heavy MG.
@@crekow Well that was what he told me and he had a written statement from his company CO stating the fact because they Article 15 him for it, because he disobeyed orders doing so.
@@montanamountainmen6104 I don't doubt that he shot at a plane. I highly doubt that his actions brought it down.
@@crekow Well I wasn't around in 1944 but I do know what I read on his DD214 and his citation for the Bronze Star Medal he was awarded for doing it.
Standard.38 special loads are just plain pleasant to shoot.
You mean in a snub nosed or full size? I’m on the fence about what I should go for
@@rudrashakti108 I have a 686+ with a 3 inch barrel and after switching to a hogue monogrip it is very enjoyable to shoot, and with a good pancake holster it is a good carry gun as well. The stock grips seemed a little small for my hands, and after about 50 rounds it started to bother the inside of my thumb. New grips fixed that.
@@IAMMRPATRICKBORNAGAIN good to know
@@rudrashakti108 Standard pressure loads just don't have enough energy to expand reliably in 38spc. This is made even worse in a snub nose. Standard pressure loads that actually work are far and few between. imho fed nyclads and the underwood 158 std pressure is about the only loads I think that will work
@@rudrashakti108 If your gun will accept plus p and if you can shoot plus p comfortably by all means go with plus p
Well my Dad may he R.I.P took out 2 armed robbers with a 38 special and the robbers had semi auto and shot gun
That speaks volumes.
It's sad that he had to, but I'm glad he made it home to the family.
Has nothing to do with what each person carried at all.
✨OK , BUT IF YOU'RE A GOOD SHOOTER IT'S OK , BUT *IF YOU ARE NOT* FIVE SHOTS WITH A CHARGE OF 13 OF A 380 CHEETAH P. BERETTA AN YOU STILL HAVE 8 SHOTS AND SHOOTING. ITS RELATIVELY GOOD . IN OTHER SIDE YOUR VIDEO IS VERY GOOD . GREETINGS FROM MEXICO .👍👍✨🌈✨✨✨
R.I.P. Condolences
Started my LE career carrying a Smith mod 28 with 2 speed loaders loaded with a total of 18 rounds of 38 plus p. Finished with a Sig P320 loaded with 17 plus 1 rounds of 9mm. Never felt under gunned with either. Don’t recall a problem with a revolver or the auto loaders. A bad guy hopped up on drugs is going to absorb a lot of rounds no matter what your caliber of choice is. If you know there’s going to be a problem grab a long gun.
This has long been my attitude: A handgun is "just in case I need." A long gun is "for sure I need it."
Revolver jams are like UFO's
I've never seen or experienced one, but I hear the stories
The alien holding the revolver is like "why y'all staring at me?"
In over 40 years of shooting experience I've had it happen exactly once. It happens but rarely not knocking Taurus they have come a long way. Back in the Mid 80s high pressure 357
I've only had a revolver jam 1 time..no fault of the gun. A primer backed out of a cheap reload.
Had a bullet back out of the case once and lock the cylinder up.
Aliens carry Ray Guns but they have to be recharged after three shots but they fry you like a cheap steak !😋
My local department still carries a 5 shot .38 Special snub nose revolver as a back up gun ( primarily for detectives and plain clothes officers ). Interestingly enough, their load of choice is the Winchester Ranger 130 gr. +P.
Good load for sure, I think I did test it in my 2" Taurus 605 and it did well. I often see that for police the S&W Bodyguard .380 and the S&W J-frame is the backup gun, often times ankle guns.
It's not the gun so much that matters as it is the man behind the gun.
One advantage of the 6-shot wheel gun is that they’re [comparatively] insulated from the “high capacity” gun grabbers at this time.
Hopefully this is true. And while I hope this will not ultimately be the case, if it did happen my channel would explode and i'd be filthy rich lol. I'm torn, but ultimately I support the bill of rights and it clearly supports the idea that whatever the government has, should be no greater than what it's citizens has, as the citizens allow the government to exist.
Sadly the government already outguns us. We can't have full autos, cuz apparently we the citizens (their bosses) can't be trusted. Keep up the good videos, love wheel guns.
the Washington S-oBs might declare by goofy but fun 16-in Heritage .22 an assault revolver.
But when they come for your guns, they will take them all.
Don't let they take away your rights.
Firs they grab you semis and then the next step they will take all.
Fight for your rights.
Jim Cirillo proved the snub 38 can hold its own even when the odds are stacked against you, just gotta train as much as possible !!
and carry a new york reload
.38 Special works just fine. I carried it concealed while serving in Israel. I still carry one. Good vid.
. 38 special has a long long history of putting bad guys down. So does a 9mm.
38 Specials have retired more men than Social Security.
22lr takes out more people every year than any other caliber.
@@mikeprice3705 Point would be .38 ain't that special genius.
So does .45 auto.
Thank you Sam! Really good to see fair comparison. I have a glock 30 s., a sig p365, but have ordered a classic s& w model 19 to get back to 38 & 357. Shooting. I realized I missed revolvers.
One of the most thoughtful comparisons between autos & revolvers i've seen! -Excellent details.
Everything has it's pros and cons... I love 'em all !!
That's the best thing one can say! Heck, i'd take a .25 ACP if I had the chance, just to try something different and to have fun. I love all guns really, excluding polymer .40's lol
@@GunSam Are you an anti-40ite ?? Lol...
@@GunSam I have two italian guns in .25 ACP. They are quite powerful for the size and weight. 9 shots in rapid fire should be enough to deal with almost every attacker. I can place all the shots in a target big as a paper plate in less than 5 sec at 7 yards. No recoil is also a plus. Another 6-shot clip is as big as a Bic lighter, if needed.
Yep, it is all good.
@@GunSam Up till 5 months ago I would have agreed with you about the polymer forties. I took my Glock 27, a Beretta 96 (with Langdon internals), and an H&K P30 40 calibre to the range to fire them to compare. Each one brought an appreciation of its capabilities, the positives and negatives. In retrospect I wish I had also brought my 10 mm revolver with some 40 calibre in that to see where they all ranked. As it was I was able to identify where each would be used in different situations.
Good video Sam!! I've always been a fan of 38 special for self defense and you've perfectly described what my thoughts are!
Greetings from Italy.
Thank you.
This is possibly the best comparison video for these two cartridges I have ever viewed in that you highlighted the difference in performance requirements for civilian self defense vs M&P work. I also enjoyed your video on reverse loading the hollow-base wadcutter. That load is very effective for CQC work. Thanks
What ever you do, don't shoot a bad guy with a handload. Scummy lawyers and prosecutors will accuse you of all sorts of crap in court if you do.
Love this man's vids always throwing out facts and amazing content
Thanks!
Very thorough and well thought out arguments, thanks!
Great video. I love 38+P and have never owned a 9mm. I realize they too have improved over time, but I fell in love with .357 and .45 and eventually got into .40 via a piece I inherited.
I've recently developed a medical condition that renders me incapable of many functions, including racking the slide on any of my semiauto (.40 & .45) pistols. So having began my *firearms journey 27 years ago (Dec 1995, I went from antigunner to gunnut) I returned to my first love - the first gun I purchased - a .357. It's to big to carry, but I can still shoot the hell out of it. So I'm shopping for a S&W Model 640 to carry. I'm not afraid to spend money, so hit me up if you have a stainless or nickel plated one.
The #1 rule in firearm self-protection is carry what you can shoot well.
*edited for spelling
Just picked up a Taurus 856 defender,liking it a lot more for carry than the full size 9.It’s also just plain fun to shoot.
I carry an 856 and love it. For the price I don't know of anything that beats it. The proven model 85 with 6 shots, what is not to like. I now want the 3" defender as I have the 2". I got mine for $225 with a $25 Taurus rebate. Smoking deal!
@@mx5ish I believe you would like the defender,the 3 inch is what I might call the sweet spot for the.38.
I approve. 😊
I carry the 856 snubby and I love it!!!
Have an 856 with 3” barrel as my EDC
I shoot 2000 to 2500 rounds from a revolver every year and have never had a malfunction. I shoot 200-300 rounds a year from autos and generally have 1-2 malfunctions in there. Minimal, but still significant.
I'm in about the same boat. Since I reload revolver rounds, I shoot a lot, never a jam. Probably shoot a couple hundred semi auto rounds a year, get a couple jams...without counting my 10mm conversion.
Excellent as always Sam! Thanks
Thank you.
I have a use for both. I live in the country and I often carry a J-frame, a 9mm Shield, or a even a pocket .380 and I feel it's plenty for around here. If I go to the city I like to carry a 17+1 9mm with at least one extra magazine. My home defense handgun is a FNX-45 with a mounted Streamlight. My woods gun is a GP100 .357 mag. It's nice to have options.
I stick mostly to pocket guns, as it's easier. Usually some form of snub revolver, sometimes my .380 LCP. Once in awhile if I go into cities like Flint as I live in MI, I will carry my Security 9 we see in this video.
.38 revolver and 9mm semi, both are fine platforms. For comfort and accuracy I prefer the revolver, perhaps because I have decades of experience with them.
They always seem similar to me. Probably because a .35 cal bullet, similar weight one moves a tad below 1,000 FPS and one a tad above 1,000 FPS, I guess that makes sense why they often seem similar.
If the performance is close, the deciding factor for me is familiarity and experience. In my case, the .38 gets the nod.
@@k_enn That is my thinking as well.
I find your videos very refreshing & knowledgeable without being a cocky A hole, I am a retired LEO in my career I carried a revolver 38 special & 357 than in the mid 90s was issued a 40 s&w (sig) auto but still had a 38 snubby backup I was always more comfortable with the snubby. If you are a LEO I hope you're a firearm instructor because you have a good bed side manner & as someone who had to get extra training to qualify every year & work harder at it I appreciate you. You come off knowledgeable without coming off a smart ass. Oh I'm from Michigan too.
Thanks. I have never been in law enforcement but I do a lot of research. I used to get a lot of pistol purchase permits, the ladies at the Sherriff's dept kept bugging me to get my CPL as they knew it would save me some trouble, so I took their advice. So, I take it serious, know all the laws, always train and research laws and all of that. Also research all the real world information, self defense shootings etc.
@Gun Sam _Revolver Aficionado_ First of all I'd like to say I really enjoy your videos. I think one of the things that people frequently ignore is the context of the incident. You brought it out here by describing the differences between civilian, police, and military applications. The other important aspect is that your first duty is not to become engaged in an incident by being alert, situationally aware, polite and courteous. The second Is to escape if at all possible. If escape is not possible, then, good tactics and fundamentals while trying to stay calm are your best weapons. The calibre and whether or not it's a revolver or pistol is of minor importance. Wrap all of these these in a winning mindset and you're more likely to wake up for breakfast the next morning.
Thanks
Some civilians speak of high capacity as if they're going to encounter Bravo Company. In civil defense, whether home or away, when facing multiple attackers, there's two scenarios that I've yet to hear play out:
1. One in which multiple attackers retaliated and used every last man they had as they were all picked off one by one. (They usually run)
2. One in which multiple attackers stood there and LET one person pick them off one by one. (They usually run).
I also don't get why people tout the 9mm as 'new age', when it was introduced only 1-3 years after 38 Special, and arguably predates 45acp (ya know, the round for OLD people) lol
Great info once again Sam. Always good to hear from a realist.
That said more ammo is ALWAYS better than less ammo.
Agreed with everything you said, bud.
I work in Nuclear security from years ago, we started out with S&W revolvers thinking it was model 60 38 cal. Then later on some of us got new guns and went to S&W 5906 9mm. It took some practice to get use to the 9mm recoil was about the same, but trigger was a lot different. The 5906 was a pretty good gun, but it did jam sometimes, but the older wheel gun never jam.
I had the civilian market version, the model 915 and it was a good gun, but I do know how all those triggers are, sort of like the Beretta 92's. I was never able to transition the first double action shot back to single action follow ups. It was just a weird trigger.
Glocks don’t jam either. To each his own and all but I’ll take 17 rds of 9mm over 5-6 shots .38 special when my life is on the line.
That Win 130 Ranger +P is my carry round, so it’s awesome to see how well it performed here.
Great video! Thanks for everything you do. I have a Taurus 692 3". Which came with a secondary 9mm cylinder. With ammo being scarce it's nice being able to fire 9mm, .38 Special and .357 whenever I can get my hands on them. I have to say that .38 Special is a dream to shoot. It seems more accurate with less recoil. Take care.
How is your firearm now? Didnt the cylinder become loose from constant firing of .357 rounds?
@@aljaygo7748 I haven't experienced anything physically going wrong with it so far. No loose cylinder. Now I've only run about 50 rounds of 158 grain .357 through it. The rest was 110 grain .357. Various type of .38 and 9mm with no issues.
.327 LCR Ruger
I think a .38/.357 snub nose hammerless revolver is about the perfect balance between weight, convenience and power. I’m a big fan of the S&W 340pd and I carry mine everywhere
Those guns would have to be a handful. From what I gather it's the same as my 342PD in .38 Special only, but because it's .357 Mag it has scandium in the frame alloy, as where the 342PD is just a 442 frame.
@@GunSam true, it can be a handful with full house .357 Magnum rounds. But I generally carry a 158 gr lead SWC plus p. This is an easy round to control.
I got the 340m&p and it’s so easy to carry that I have no excuse to not have it at all times .
@@ShaunPanzer my thoughts exactly.
@@ShaunPanzer Midway has a titanium .357 cylinder for the j-frame for $140. Shaves off 2 ounces. Basically makes the 340m&p into a 340pd. Just incase thats something you're interested in.
Wow! Very interesting concept between the two firearms. I learned a great deal. Thank You!
Thanks for watching!
I forgot to mention that at 30:07 I am standing 7 yards from the target, and my homemade target is near identical to the dimensions of the official IDPA target.
Thanks for the information
My agency switched us from 45 ACP G21 to the G17 9mm. We’re using federal HST 147 grain. I carry 38 off duty, we carry gold dot 135 grain short barrel
I have a 9mm ( Tisas P 35) and a S&W 66. Shooting 38 Special in this heavy duty gun is just plain FUN. I read that Jeff Cooper developed the 10mm to approximate the performance of .357 in a semi auto platform. Having fired both, I agree 💯%. My next handgun will be a 10mm.
...justbtiday received my.10mm conversion barrel ( Double Diamond) from the Glock Store fir my Glock 21 un 4 ACP...picked up Smith 66-1 from a fellow collector earlier this year
I too have 38/357 wheel guns, and 10mm. There is a ton of overlap and I love shooting both calibers.
Pro Tip:
Shooting a lot of heavier loadings makes the softer stuff feel really smooth 👌
Yes
I recently commented on a video you made,you replied back .That was very nice of you.I would like to make another comment.Type of ammo depends on what the situation is,I live in Arizona desert so most people wear t-shirts so I carry 38 so hollow base was cutters.They shoot like 22 long riffle.Easy to make head shots if nessary. Do not want come off as a bragart,for I am not.I am the 70 year old that you replied back too.Very good video and thanks a lot.
Thank you for your channel not many revolver channels enjoy your content
Love your videos. I myself am a wheel gun fanatic I have the lcr 357 carry it everyday with hornady Critical defense 357s I dont mind the recoil out and am very accurate with it. It the gun I trust and love. Keep the vids coming
Thanks. I carried that round in a 2.25" SP101 for awhile. Now days I prefer a low end .357 Mag like Gold Dot short barrel or Hornady American Gunner as both have a little less power and a lot less recoil.
Another great video, thanks.
This is a great video, Sam! Thank you.
very very detailed video Sam with information that must have took time to research the right sources, as you know Sam i.m also a big revolver and 38 spl fan as you know and have always told you why i love the 38spl as a defense side arm its everything you mentioned about the design of the revolver with its weight and rigid barrel that aids in reliability and accuracy not to mention a smooth double action trigger system, as you demonstrated its easier to conceal snubby revolvers than compact 9mm semi autos, thus the increase in reload ability and thus your chances of surviving a gun fight.
Thanks!
Awesome video. Thank you for educating people on just how awesome the 38 special is. A few of my friends gave me crap for carrying a 38 snub as my EDC till they watched some of your videos.
Amazing of the number of people that never fired a shot in anger,,,,,or got shot at, that say you need an automatic with a 16 round magazine. The spray and pray crowd seems to be the ones that claim to be experts on what happens in a firefight that they have never been in. (Just FYI My carry gun is a Smith 638 Airweight with 158 Gr +P Hollows,,,,,,although I am looking at the new(er) 90 Gr SuperVels)
Retired cop here. We carried 357s most of my carrier and I loaded with 357. But many of my fellow officers loaded their revolvers with 38+p and only carried 357 ammo for reloads. The revolvers have the advantage that a lot of them can be fired from a pocket without drawing them out. An auto would normally jam after one shot in a pocket as the slide could not work freely. In addition small autos have a bad habit of having their magazines pop loose in the pocket or holster and dropping out of the pistol. I've known people who came home at the end of the day only to discover their magazine was gone. Normally , they found them in the car seat. If that happens you're down to one shot and then, hopefully, a reload. Your correct that civilians only need to deter a wood be attacker or attackers. This can usually be done by displaying the weapon or, when necessary, shooting the nearest threat once or twice. Normally, any attacker ,still able to, will then flee the area. True there are exceptions where a determined attacker keeps coming. But in those cases a head shot, not extra ammo, is the better option. So the best advise I can give anyone is, regardless of the weapon you use, practice the Mozambique drill every time you go shooting. Two quick shots to the torso then one to the head.
I have tested the pocket firing with my Ruger LCP. It's interesting as it does jam and there is always a stuck stovepipe type jam, just not enough umph in .380 to clear the brass while in a pocket. I have heard of silly revolver issues like that missing magazine before too, one story was a cop shot his backup revolver on the range but then somehow along the line he forgot, and was carrying that backup snubby on the ankle for an entire month before he went to check it and realized it was all empty brass in there. Luckily he never had to use any weapons in that time, but it's a good reminder to check all ammo, semi auto or revolver and not do only a revolver brass rim check to determine if a revolver is truly "loaded".
Several auto loaders brands will also fail to fire without a magazine, or even just one that is not seated. There's that too. As for practicing Mozambique method, I grew up right next to that country in South Africa. Never hear dof that expression. But it would obviously work. lol I practice cooking Mozambique chicken livers in roasted hot pepper sauce. Practice makes perfect. :)
excellent input
That made my day when I saw him pull the second and third guns..... well played my friend.
When I was in the AF I started on the SW revolver as the standard issue sidearm. The USAF did not switch to the 9mm til after I got out. So I really love the revolver platform.
I agree with your logic even though I do carry a 380 as a pocket gun sometimes. A lot of it comes down to probabilities anyway!
I do that too lol. I have an LCP, but whenever I "need" to carry it, I carry it to not be seen and very tight in a pocket, so against all advice I carry that one gun with an empty chamber. Typically when I do carry it, I will do so for the now outlawed family gatherings...sitting at the table with dozens of people and the muzzle pointing in the direction of my knees, yeah...don't need a pistol pointing at people with a round in the chamber.
@@GunSam Yeah, carry what you have!
I like revolvers, grew up around them, and trained on them during my first academy, and carried them on and off they the years. The .38 Special has a number of benefits. (Cheap and available ammo not currently one of them). A revolver will malfunction - I’ve seen ejector rods come unscrewed and Ruger GP 100s in the 90s locking up after 30 rounds of magnum when they heated up. Personally, I had a S&W 940 lock up for unexplained reasons - wasn’t the moon clip. Defensive ammo has improved across the board over the years, but when I started in LE in 1990, there wasn’t any one load that would penetrate and expand consistently from 2 & 3 inch barrels, or ever 4 inch barrels in some cases. Back then, and probably still a concern today with some loads is that the fast, lightweight hollow point bullets had lousy accuracy out of a 4 inch revolver while the heavier 158 grain lead round nose or semi wadcutters would shoot point of aim for a shooter who properly aimed, but didn’t expand and over penetration was a concern. Of course, in the same era, the same shortcomings applied to the 9mm. I was first issued 110 gran 357 SJHPs for better performance in a defensive situation. It was still a compromise because the 110 didn’t perform as well as the 125s. There’s still a debate conversation about .38 Special performance consistency from short barreled revolvers. I’m not knocking revolvers, and occasionally carry and shoot one of mine. It’s just that they’re not necessarily better then a reliable semi auto. A quality revolver and a quality semi auto are really about equal as long as they’re used by a competent gun owner. Incidentally, I haven’t paid much attention to current statistics regarding number of rounds fired during a defensive encounter, but I’d be curious if the stats include negligent discharges and suicides. The stats for NYPD while they still held onto their revolvers (3 rounds average for police gunfights) was revisited years later. All of the aforementioned suicides and NDs were removed from the data, and the average went up to 6. Incidentally there was a video of a cop or retired cop a few years back who tragically lost his life defending himself against at least two attackers with a 5 shot. Sometimes there are multiple attackers. Nothing wrong with a five shot - just remember not all scenarios are going to be less than three shots.
Gotta hit em’ with the New York reload lol
Love that lee single stage press behind you. I've reloaded 10s of thousands of rounds off mine.
Just saw your video and your right on point, I started carrying my S&W 640 Pro with 38+P and I feel it’s more then adequate for self defense, I know several law enforcement folks you carried 38 revolvers their entire career, even a couple who where in bad guy battles and said they never felt they where out gunned.
Great points Sam. My P365 jammed yesterday at the range, like hard jam, half battery. I had to do the ole opposite direction jam- smash to get it out. I'm thinking about making my .327 LCR my primary because of it.
Thanks. My .327 has been very reliable thus far, but from what a lot of people do seem to experience is that .327 cases do swell a lot and effect ejection. A nice low end round seems to do well for a lot of people.
@@GunSam Yeah it's basically the pressure king at 45k psi, I noticed the same. My reloads with cfe pistol and aa#9 don't have that issue. Also, with most loads in .327 you will see flatten primers more often, just the way it's designed.
I trust auto loaders when they are full sized, the trust diminishes as the autoloader becomes smaller
I agree with Gun Sam, and the .32 revolver and the .327 are great too. Revolvers rule!
Very nice presentation. Excellent info, too.
I rotate between my 9 mm and my 45 but I've always got my 38 Special as a backup either in an ankle holster or in another department close to me. The reason I always keep it is one of the reasons you pointed out it's never going to jam.
They can jam, and when they fail in the field you can;t fix it.
I can clear a failure in a semi-auto though.
@@BB-1990 Catastrophic failures in autos that cannot be field fixed DO happen, and happen FAR more often than revolvers. I've seen broken ejectors, broken extractors, broken firing pins, broken springs, cracked slides and cracked frames, etc in autos. Autos have a very complex, high parts stress, cycle to feed and fire, while revolvers are extremely simple and and less parts stressful. In about 15 years of watching CCW classes being taught , we have NEVER had a revolver failure. We have multiple auto failures EVERY class, mostly shooter induced. We do pre-inspect all student firearms and have caught problems in both autos and revolvers. But once fixed, the revolvers run flawlessly while the autos will often fail, due to shooter induced problems.
As a re-loader, the .38 is simply AWESOME!! True custom "freedom seeds", you can create!! Good informative vid..
Thanks. Yes I love reloading .38 Special. One of those cartridges you can never go wrong with loading up as so many guns can shoot them.
@@GunSam It’s a great platform because you can load pretty much how you want. You can make a light easy shooting load or spice it up a little. I think it’s a super fun round to reload.
Another factor about reloading come out when you have a revolver with fixed sights. If you are not hitting where you are aiming, you have a wide ranged of powders, grains of powder, and bullet weights that you can work with to get a load that prints to your point of aim. With 9mm, you have a more restricted range because whatever you do it needs to cycle the action reliably.
I heard loaders can make a real hot .38 is it true?
@@Spocklee --- You can load it up to whatever level is safe. You can also load it down for target shooting or other purposes.
Ahhh, the defensive revolver. No ftf, no fte, no limp wrist risk, no mag spring risk, no need to test cycling of expensive defensive ammo, easy to load, easy to unload, easy to see if loaded, and on and on. Just overall the best platform for the average to gun owner for home and personal defense.
Until your oprod is fucked ,a primer blows out,a bullet walks,your timing is off,or one of a several time little springs breaks . Semi autos are superior.
Hi Sam,
Great video as usual. I have doubled check and adding 3dB (not 10 dB) equals to doubling te sound level. That's why I'am considering 38 special for home defense.
Gilles
Ive said this for years, but youve shown WHY. NICE WORK!
Thank you.
I've switched to a revolver because it comes down to contact shots. For self defense it seems likely you'd end up in a scuffle if you're really trying not to have to pull. You can train to stand off, but adrenaline is a powerful stimulant, you might not remember...
I end up carrying 9mm more. But, it's in my S&W 986. I just love that revolver. If I'm going pocket carry, the little 442 is my choice.
This was just two years ago. Bring back the Jug or Not. Great show!
That water jug system was no good. What people never saw, as I don't include in the footage, is falling on the ice the water creates in the winter, or falling on the mud the water creates the rest of the year.
My safariland speed loaders work exactly like the one you showed, as far as I can tell. Had them for years. Just push and the center pin loosens the shells to fall into the chambers. Safariland comp I and comp II.
That was a fast half hour! A very fair comparison.
Thanks for watching!
Watching Sam do ammo tests gave me the knowledge I needed to get my now carry ammo Winchester silvertip 110 grain standard pressure
I had an Uncle that was a Federal Martial and retired in the mid 80's. He worked the West Coast. He carried a 1911 45 acp and a back up 38 special in his boot. He swore by 158 grn semi wad cutters in lead. He worked as a plain clothes agent. He told me that he carried a plus p plus round or a hot loaded plus p round for his snub nose. It saved his life twice. When he transported people he kept his 1911 cooked and locked on an empty chamber in case someone managed to get it off of him during transport. He was the only one that knew that. Years ago holsters did not have the retention systems we have now. He trained himself to rack the slide every time he pulled the 1911. He told me he did this for his own safety in case someone wrestled it away from him. He told me he had to put 2 guys down at near point blank range and both times a shot to mid chest dropped them both. One was high on pcp and one was just a really big guy that pulled loose from them. He swore that , that load was devastating out of the snub nose at close range.
Very level headed look at what people are seldom told, Thank you for telling the truth...If any one doubts Sam ---DON'T cause I've spent 45 + years studying the same & Sam is spot ON!!.
As A civilian it's not my job to stop a bad guy. It's my job to break contact and go home to my family. 95% of the time just producing a gun does the trick. I never feel under gunned with my J-frame. Yes I do like my Glock 19 just fine, but not for EDC.
I understand all of that. I have a ton of guns I would love to carry, but I just don't. I carry what is practical, what works and what I will always have one me, which if it's a big gun I probably won't have it one me. But, my big revolvers are my home defense weapons.
@Sc Houndsman There is no such thing as a S&W J-frame being single action only.
19 in the front, 38 in the buttcrack.
Nice use of the "New York reload" with the .38 Special at the end.
Thanks
I thought that was the ‘Texas Reload’?
@@pecosjane Jim Cirillo of the NYPD popularized it in the 1970s. He ran the “Stakeout Squad,” which went after known felons. His unit got into a LOT of firefights. He was 28-0 in those.
@@erikwaters4672 I’m trying to buy his book on the stakeout squad but I only found one for 200 dollars on Amazon.
@Mr. Cool That’s why he lived long enough to write that book, no?
Sam, you are correct. You should have a discussion about concealed carry holsters with semi-autos vs revolvers with same barrel lengths. I think that's where the difference is. Great vid
Thanks. Obviously same barrel length makes the revolver longer, but in the end they even out as a revolver can be holstered with a higher rise holster as the grip is round. A semi auto needs to be holstered lower to avoid the thing from digging into the body, but this makes the holster length the same below the belt. Sort of the same thing for pockets where they even out. People say a revolver prints more as it's thicker, which is true....but it prints a bulge as where the smaller semi auto prints the exact outline of a firearm. As far as IWB holsters, I cannot comment as I never liked them. Ankle carry is a wash too more or less.
I love your videos !!!
You are always really deep with facts and I always learn something new about the very much loved .38 etc 😁
I have many guns way more powerful but I always find myself again and again loving my revolvers , must be the civilized simplistic beauty of these guns🤩🇺🇸.
My babies
( gp100 .357mag 4” , sp101 ‘s in .357mag with 2.2” hammerless & my other in .357mag 3” w/ hammer , all with full-size hogue grips also have the 642 air weight.38+p I carry everywhere everyday as backup to my CCW for the day ,it’s a great pocket gun but sucks to shoot as felt recoil is brutal but I love that .38 ) these guns just feel good in the hand and shoot very well
Thanks. I used to have an SP101 2.25". Nice little revolver.
Great video Sam. But for 2021, I feel we will need some 33rd happy sticks.
You mean 33 round EDC sticks.
Next series with your calm demeanor will be "Fire Side Chat's with Sam". :) Interesting info as always. I think we'll all be having a different conversation a year from now when mag limits are reduced to 10 bringing them closer to the revolver limits 5/6/7. When you can't have 17 rds of 9mm the 6 gun suddenly becomes more interesting.
Yes, and especially if you happen to have a semi auto that might be picky with ammo, and you can't find ammo. A 6-7 shooter revolver that will fire all ammo, un-reliability tested....that's a big deal.
Dear hockey, Do you believe that magazine limits will be upheld given the current balance (or lack) on the US Supreme Court?
@@pecosjane I'm not sure about the Fed, maybe they push something through and then we have to go to court to get it back. My bigger concern will be the individual States. I think if you compare the Fed to the States you'll find way more gun legislation (good and bad) happens at the State level.
When I was in high school, I was in the NJROTC. Our group went to Moody Air Force Base outside of Valdosta, Georgia. One of the first places that we visited was the Air Force Military Police headquarters. On a table, were an M-16, a 12 gauge shotgun and a Smith & Wesson model 15 .38 Special. All the MPs at that time carried either two out of the three weapons. But mostly the M-16 and the .38 Special. They even gave us a demonstration of what happens to anyone who crosses a red line and walks near a parked aircraft. These MPs were all business and we knew right then it wasn’t a good idea to attempt to trespass.
I once carried a four inch S&W model 686 when I worked as an armed security guard. We were(and still are) required by the State of Florida to use only 158 grain lead round nose bullets in our revolvers.
Have you tested the velocity of 158 grain .38 Special bullets?
Great vid very informative. Those are the reasons I carry a 6 shot 36 special . 77 year old Viet Nam combat vet.Really like the Super Vale chick.
I have revolvers and love them. Lots of people on the dark side of the grass because of those. My edc is a 442. Used to be a K15
In statistics an important concept is understanding between Relative & Absolute difference.
There are large Relative differences between handgun calibers in various metrics. Velocity, energy, diameter and bullet weight are common measured differences. So we can readily observe Relative Differences.
However when we take all handgun calibers and look at how many hits it takes we see that handguns require (2) hits in the compiled data from shootings. The difference between 1.1 & 2.3 hits is not significant. So there is very little Absolute statistical difference.
The ability to hit is what is important. You only need to hit twice. If you need (17) shots to hit (2) bullseye you might need practice or a howitzer.
Great presentation on Civilian, Police, & Military hand gun needs and differnces.
Thanks. And that's the takeaway. If you need two hits accurately and reliably, the difference in what the outcome is will be negligible, but the ability to make those hits between the two might be a bigger difference. I think psychology plays into it as well. At least for me, at all times I sort of anticipate a malfunction, and this throws me off a bit. With the revolver the mind is clear, I know that shot 2 will happen with trigger press 2. This plays into my ability to place two good shots.
@@GunSam I think one of the things that people frequently ignore is the context of the incident. You brought it out here by describing the differences between civilian, police, and military applications. The other important aspect is that your first duty is not to become engaged in an incident by being alert, situationally aware, polite and courteous. The second Is to escape if at all possible. If escape is not possible, then, good tactics and fundamentals while trying to stay calm are your best weapons. The calibre and whether or not it's a revolver or pistol is of minor importance. Wrap all of these these in a winning mindset and you're more likely to wake up for breakfast the next morning.
As always very USEFUL! Thank you! Still one of the most intelligent gun channels on UT....................elsullo
Thank you.
Thanks for this update to an often debated handgun topic. I carry 9mm pistols and 38 special revolvers. Today I happen to be carrying a Ruger LCRx w/ 3" barrel. Both are in my rotation. I find it easier to carry large 9mm than large 38 specials which I can also load with .357 magnum. So far I haven't found an IWB holster for my large revolvers.
Thanks for watching! I wouldn't IWB a large revolver myself.
Wrong! You can load 38 Special rounds into a .357 Magnum, but you absolutely can NOT fit a .357 Magnum into a 38 Special cylinder and close it to bring the cartridge into battery! Same thing with the .44 Magnum, it can fire .44 Special but not vice versa.
@@skyburner694 He obviously would know that, I can tell he wasn't saying he loads .357 Magnum in a .38 Special revolver.
@@GunSam Thank you Sam. My 4" revolver is a 357 which can also handle 38 Special.
I considered a revolver for my first home defense gun. But, I ended up with a 9mm. The swaying factors were the ability to put a light and a red dot on the gun if I wanted to. Higher capacity was a factor as well. But, I will still probably buy a revolver one of these days.
For a gun hand held light is better.
@@superdacoolman I like the ability to have a free hand as opposed to having a gun in one hand and a flashlight in the other. I think it's a matter of preference and not that one is better than the other.
One more point: The average CCW (private citizen) carrier in the US needs to unload and reload a few times each day. [There are way too many ‘no guns’ signs in my town.] I need to unload my carry gun, lock it up, go buy what I need, and reverse the process. I’m old; I have been shooting for a very long time. I STILL do not want to point a semi-auto at the floor of my paid-off car and allow the slide to slam home. I prefer the quiet, very safe, click of the cylinder closing on my wheel-gun. 😉
I go to a few gun free places a week. I typically leave my revolver loaded, in and out of pocket easily and close in a compartment in the car, lock the doors.
Nope...posted No guns or not the only place i'll leave my gun in the car is a police station, court house or any govt building...its a very rare occasion for me to be in any of those places so its not a big issue for me. But any local business or shopping area that prohibits guns either doesnt get my business or i just ignore the signs.
Really enjoyed the video..Watched it a few times as i experienced domestic distractions..You brought up several points that i see are often overlooked or ignored..I like the term,"Cartridge effectiveness"....
Thanks. Yeah, I sometimes throw around terms like stopping power, knockdown power and the like....as that's how gun guys talk, and gun guys know what that means, then some snot nose kid gets on that just started learning about guns and probably watched videos with overbearing instructors, then would come at me "THERE'S NO SUCH THING AS STOPPING POWER!". It's gets annoying. Then in the same sentence we have the opposite side yelling at me that it's shot placement, all cartridges less than rifle are worthless. LOL. Well, I am hard pressed to believe that my 4" .44 Mag revolver would have the same effect as a .32 S&W fired from my .327 Snub.
@@GunSam The Joys of social media..LOL
Different strokes for different folks. Still love the channel
4:40 - FACTS!
Most encounters are actually stopped at 1-2 shots. So carry what you makes you feel secure, because all of this is playing to people's insecurities.
yes and up close one handed
38 is a multipurpose round. Use standard pressure rounds to teach new shooters. They are low recoil smooth shooters in a full size revolver. If you reload they can be cheap to make for plinking. Turn up the heat with +P and you have a powerful defensive round. 9mm is cheap but can be snappy depending on the gun you're using.
Some excellent points. There is a huge difference in tactical considerations between a civilian shooting in defense and a law enforcement officer. Your civilian is to break away from a dangerous scenario while the law enforcement cant. If the fight is not terminated, the lawman still has to continue in order to take that person into custody. For a concealed carry application both systems have merit for defense.
good luck defending your home against multiple, determined home invaders with a 5-shot revolver.
I love revolvers, i'm just not a delusional fanboy like some.
A semi-auto or shotgun is way better in most scenarios.
Great job on output of info. With a open mind ( or seem obv) without preference.
I must be a very lucky guy. I am older,I cant even begin to know how many times I have fired a revolver, I know its thousands and thousands, I have never had a jam. I own more than a few revolvers and semi’s and when I walk out the door it is with a revolver. A gun is just a tool, I look at it this way. Bring the tool you are most likely to need for the task at hand.
Y
Revolvers just work. When I first fired centerfire handguns about 20 years ago, my buddy brought out several 9mm's and .40's and I just could not hit anything with them. I said to him " I think I could shoot a revolver better" (even though I had never fired one before), because there's a barrel I can actually look down". And that's still true. A revolver is like a mini rifle, you see a barrel, it's easy to point. Pointing a block Glock, is weird.
I keep the short barrel 135gr +p "the NYPD load" Gold Dots in my S&W 442..
Consistent load. Tested it a couple times in snubs and both times got 837 FPS average.
developed as a request from law enforcement to get a 38 to expand in a short barrel
Sticking my little Chiefs Special in my pocket is so easy, convenient , and safe. I have other good options like my Sig 226 and Glock 19. The Sig and Glock take turns in my Glove Box but rarely ride my belt these days. But my little Chiefs Special is almost always with me. Before I did my 1st deployment to Central America ( No I never met the Desk Commando Col North LOL) My Uncle who was a PA State Trooper gave his 'hold-out' to me with the promise to keep it on me at all times. I retired back in 2015 and did crap ton of short and long deployments around the world. Only fired it once in self-defense. 3 rounds in Terry's chest stop a Green on Blue attack Inside the wire at Butlins. I was in Flip Flops, shorts and a bathrobe, coming from a shower. Thanks Uncle Ross and rest in peace! Funny the Britt SIB agents never asked about the 2 hand rolled hot semi-jacketed wad cutters still in my in issue snubby; when the gave it back. Other than asking if i was related to Humphrey Bogart...
Glad you brought us another awesome video! I'm a STRONG believer in the 38/357, granted I tend to carry both a 357 and a pocket 9mm, best of both worlds I guess! Ha! That said, my go to is the revolver and not the "back up" pistol.
Thanks for watching. I usually carry just my .327 Fed Mag.
Nothing wrong with that! Thats one I have eyed for a bit now, I suppose it will be in my rotation sooner than later. Higher pressures, less recoil,, higher capacity, and very capable round.
That or the trr8 have been really on my mind lately
@@daymonmac6185 The TRR8 looks interesting. It's sort of like an answer to every Glock fanboy's argument that you can't do with a revolver, higher capacity, rails, lights, enough barrel for good ballistics LOL. But then you also have the reliability of a revolver. The .327 is cool but harder to find ammo to shoot through the thing, I mean there's always a little of something but it's typically only .32 S&W Long which is like a step above .22 LR, but the .357/.38 family always has satisfying recoil and it's popular enough you can always find ammo if you try hard enough.
@@GunSam and I happen to have both 38 and 357 on hand, and not desperate any time soon, I may have to step it up and go with the trr8!
I've been shooting revolvers and automatics for about 40 years and I have NEVER had a failure of any kind while firing a revolver. That's all I have to say about that.
I have, round jammed in the chamber, due to a defective primer pocket. The primer shot back in my face. CCI AMMO.
@@donsettie3799 yikes!
@@shaneleonard7218 inner primer opening was not machined through
Personally I love both these cartridges. To me it comes down to preference and buying quality firearms and ammunition that works in your gun. The 3 guns I mostly carry are my s&w shield 9, s&w j frame in 38 spl and my ruger sp101 in 357 with a 3" barrel. I trust my life with all 3 and have never had a problem with any of them. My shield has hever jamed in over 2 years and my revolvers have also ran flawlessly. Just pick what you like and practice. I will say that practicing shooting my revolvers in double action has made me a better shot with my semi auto. This was a great video thanks for sharing.
Thanks. I have not owned a polymer S&W pistol, but have owned a 1992 model 915 with aluminum alloy slide. It was 100% reliable. I once held a shield in a gun store and it fit my hand better than any pistol I ever held. Why I didn't buy it I do not recall. I should trade in my Security 9 to get one of similar size, to knock off a few bucks and get into a nicer gun.
@@GunSam
Just based on fitting your hand better than any other pistol, did you try any CZ after the SP-01?
It fits lots of people like a glove while some with really huge hands don't like it. Give it a try just for the grip if you see one.
Revolvers have always been my favorite simply because they are really cool to me. Excellent for practice and good for various applications. I have never personally had a revolver jam. All that being said, the difference that I have seen between a semi auto jamming and a revolver jamming is how long it takes to clear if it does jam. A semi auto is usually as fast as just racking the slide to chamber another round. But when a revolver does jam, it can take tools and a full field strip to get it running again. However, a revolver can be compact and easier to conceal. But now there are so many pocket options, some of which can hold double what a revolver can and still manage to be smaller. I understand that most gun fights are over in seconds, but if I can choose a gun that manages to be more compact and easier to carry while still offering the same or higher capacity, there really isn't much valid reason to choose otherwise. Then we get to triggers. Most concealed revolvers are typically fired double action. With practice, it is very effective. But most people aren't Jerry Miculek, nor do most people have time or money to practice enough to have a fast trigger finger. Semi autos usually tend to offer lighter trigger options. Power wise, 9mm is a tad more powerful but .38 isn't so bad. Especially +p options. But 9mm still tends to have more defense round options available. In the end, a revolver will get the job done most of the time and there is nothing wrong with using one for defense. However, there are some distinct advantages to semi autos that can be a factor in practice. The guy you get in a gun fight with might be the kind of dude who has the most modern high speed sidearm. You can still potentially neutralize the threat even if he technically has you outgunned. But if reliable semi autos that are reasonably affordable are so common now, why deliberately put yourself at a disadvantage? You won't be hurting your hearing enough for it to matter in the long run, so the noise argument is moot at best. Its usually just a few hours of ringing. I understand that some people shoot better with revolvers because that is what they are used to. That is totally fine. But it is reaching to say that 9mm has enough recoil to disrupt your sight picture for a significantly longer time. I have never fired a 9mm that actually hurt from too much recoil either. Chances are they will be close enough that missing is unlikely with either platform. I do appreciate the work you put in. I like alternative views on things. Keeps my perspective open. However, I don't see enough advantages in revolvers anymore to warrant using them as primary carry. I do carry a revolver on occasion because I like them and I have practice. But it depends on my outfit and where I am going. Still, I would be lying if I said that I didn't trust my S&W M&P 2.0 more. Never had a jam with it and it hits where I point it with a light and consistent trigger pull every time. When I carry a revolver, I do so knowing that I am limiting myself in several ways. I know that my statement seems contradictory. But that is the thing, I just like revolvers. I love the way they look and feel. I choose to use them because I feel that I have enough practice to use them effectively. But I'm not pretending that they are the better gun for the job. When push comes to shove, I will take a semi auto 9mm pistol from a good manufacturer. If you practice enough, by all means, carry what works for you. But I don't feel that .38 is better.
To be fair I have never had a revolver jam but have had autos jams where I could not get the gun clear within any less than 2 minutes of working on it.
@@GunSam I have had 2 or three jams with two of my pistols. One was a basic 1911-A1. Another was in my Sig P238. All with range ammo. However, that was over the course of 15 years. Thankfully never had a jam in my carry guns. I can agree that revolvers in standard conditions are less likely to fail. Still, auto loaders have come a long way over the course of a century. Some designs are close, if not as close to being as reliable as a revolver in terms of jammability. But there are so many designs and most people want cheap pistols. Nothing exactly wrong with cheap if you know what to get. Still, I would rather people carry revolvers than nothing at all. Plus having less rounds usually forces people to be more selective with their shots. In some ways, I wish more people started on revolvers because they are simple to operate.
@@leroyatleroys The way I see it, is that a carry revolver needs to be tested that it's going to be right, and function. Then it needs to be kept cleaned and also I am a full believer in carrying ammo slightly less powerful than the gun can handle to prevent extra gunk and case expansion, and if you can get carry ammo in nickel plated cases even better as the nickel really does inhibit over swelling of cases and also drops out smoother in reloads.
I think that what Gun Sam is saying is: the revolver is better for the average, under practiced Joe.....................
@@swnorcraft7971 You're about a year late.
Really enjoyed this because I have a 38 and I have a 9 mm
Thanks again
.....keeep with Jesus....
Thanks. I hear this a lot. The typical situation though is a lot of guys who have bigger 9mm's often also have something like a S&W J-frame .38.
@@GunSam I've noticed a lot of the same thing people have 38 /9/ and 357
I really like the 38 special. I can carry standard pressure or plus p. I can reload to a really light load and shoot easily or load it hot and make it snappier. I have more versatility with how I load. I don’t have to worry about the slide and loading another round in a chamber and extracting and ejecting another round. Over all it works for me. I have 9mm, 380 and 45acp. I just tend to carry a 38 more often.
Same here.
Well done. Enjoyed!
Really nice setup at the range
Another interesting thing I discovered when comparing 9mm to 38 spc is ammo weight. With 9mm if you include the weight of the magazine itself along with the ammo and you compare it to loose 125 grain 38 spc ammo the 38 spc ammo is lighter weight. So you're carrying around less weight with 10 rds of 38 spc ammo than you are with carrying around a 10 rd mag of 9mm. I realize once you factor in the weight of a speed loader that changes, but one of the good factors about most revolvers is you don't need a speed loader. Sure they help making a reload faster, but they are not required like a magazine is required for a semi auto. So if you're ever in a situation where weight matters, like hiking or camping, then it might save you some weight choosing a light weight revolver like the 3" Ruger LCRx
I never thought about that. I do however know it seems weird how bad some double stack pistols balance. All the weight in the grip, really flops around if you belt carry one.
I'd rather have just a 2nd compact piece vs. carrying speed loaders or extra mags. Snubby + auto + cell phone as I see it. The snubby can be handled or operated while concealed, or else whenever arm-extension (and likely firm wrist) is hindered or else infeasible, ie firing "T-Rex" style vs. attacker in your face, or else suddenly to the side or rear as required. An auto-loader virtually requires a preferred shooting stance, arm-extension, and firm wrist, and clearance for slide-movement, while these may not be feasible if/when ambushed or rushed.
@@xxxYYZxxx There's pros and cons to either as you pointed out some, but there are still more. My main comment was focused on carry weight in situations when it really matters, like camping or hiking in the wilderness. In situations like that there's a saying that goes, " ounces = pounds and pounds = pain "
@@Prepare2Survive When carry weight is an issue, another option for a 2nd "pocket piece" is a Derringer. The pocket option seems pointless when hiking, and is presented as "urban" carry scenario, but either way a Derringer can be very light weight and compact. In an urban scenario, threats could appear suddenly, and you can't just unholster a 9mm every time a shady character appears when nearly everyone's shady, so hence the pocket idea.
@@xxxYYZxxx I'm a big fan of pocket carry for several reasons, but don't care for a derringer because the capacity to weight factor is not very good compared to a snubby hammerless revolver like the ruger LCR in 38spc or 9mm. Even the Sig P365 has a very good capacity to weight factor and it's easy to pocket carry. Plus the derringers are single action which means they take more time and fine motor skills to shoot in a stressful situation.
44 Special
I like .44 Special in a .44 Mag revolver. Seems like there are a lot of people who can't stand .44 Special, especially in a .44 Mag revolver, but I like it. Either a hot and heavy .44 Special or light and low loaded .44 Mag seem to both do well.
When I worked law enforcement I used a 357 mag! That is what many used! Some departments didn't allow 357, but many officers used the 357 pistol but put 38 special in them, because they handled better! There is 2 sides to how far into something the bullet goes. I don't want the bullet to stay in the person I shoot and dump all its power into them and not come out the other side and maybe hit someone I didn't want to hit.
Nice job! I enjoy your revolver content and I learned a few new things tonight about some unique qualities about the revolver and its ammo.
Thank you.
Gotta love the New York reload! I think the stats for the .38 tell a HUGE story. The 9mm is the trendy round right now, even knocked the .40 out of 1st place for some reason. People forget about the bad rap the 9mm has. Historically it is known for overpenetration. The British Special Air Services (England's Delta Force) always use the double tap because of the lack of stopping power. Granted they are using FMJ, however that reputation continued on police using HP ammo, hence the .40's adoption by most law enforcement in the US until recently. The downfall of the .38 in law enforcement was not the rounds lack of power, but the revolver's capacity. For the average conceal carry permit holder or home defender, the .38 is an excellent choice. It will do the job very well.
Makes me wonder about some of the data. Almost seems skewed. From what I see and believe, the .40 S&W was and is a very effective cartridge, tended to stop the fight fast. But there's so many factors, mostly in ammo that it's hard to really call any cartridge better than another, as high loads of any cartridge can be more effective than low end loads of a seemingly more effective round. For instance, of course a 9mm+P+ with a bonded bullet beats a Win white box FMJ .40 S&W. The problem is people seem to cherry pick numbers to support their carry firearm choice rather than really looking at the numbers. What we can see though, is that pretty much any cartridge from .380 ACP to .44 Mag can be excellent carry cartridges if the right load is used.
"for some reason" Its cheaper and female officers can handle it better.
@@GunSam 9 mm+p+ has a higher pressure as 40S&W. It will wear down your gun faster than 40 S&W, it dont have less recoil and is also expencive. Thats where they deceive themself shooting cheap 9mm with weak standard loads. The german army shot their HK USPs with 9mm +p+ that was also used for their MP5 which cracked the slide often. So now they use weaker loads. The USP is designed for the stronger 40S&W and not known for any problems but with a steady diet of 9mm +p+ the germany army cracked the USP.
@@Gieszkanne I will not use plus p plus.... plus p in a strong design is my limit
To bad everyone has their mind stuck on 180grn. 40sw loads. 40sw has same pressure as 9mm.,it just has more powder capacity. 135grn. and 150/155 grain 40sw driven at 1300/1400fps will hit like 357mag. Sad that the public is so influenced by government agencies and ammo manufacturers. A lot of cops and civilians could die dumping mags of 9mm. into drugged or adrenaline pumped perps. I have never heard anyone complain about recoil from my M&P 2.0 with Corbon 135grain 40sw loads.