Enjoyed your imput on this video,good to point out some of the problems& such,keeps us informed. Glad we can still get a Class A '22 cal rifle from DPGunworks. Thanks for your tireless work you do to preserve the high standards of you rifles.
Can’t wait till I see what you do on the 17hm2 your building me love to see the info you put out thanks I took the lug out of one mine and shoots better with out
Interesting, I enjoy your perspective on rimfires. In my experience even current CZ barrels do vary considerably, I've had about 5 of em, and they've ranged from acceptable (consistent 0.5" groups at 50 with proven ammo lots) to exceptional, I had one skinny CM barrel rifle that would shoot better than 1.0" at 100M (109Y) with Eley Match. All this I think says is that there is a bit of a barrel lottery with most mass produced barrels, CZ no exception.
Thanks for interesting video. The injection moulded CZ 457 parts are brittle, mine did not take combination of use and normal gunoil, I got new parts on warranty, but chose to source parts machined in aircraft alu.
Excellent info! Can you toss that bad boy in your lapping machine and improve it? Or do you make the barrels a bit undersized and then ultimately lap to final diameter? (Aka lapping this finished barrel would result in it being overbore?) That recoil lug is crazy. I can’t imagine CZ will be able to keep their precision rimfire market share if they do stuff like that. Heck, I’ve been bedding my recoil lug into my chassis’s to take out as much slop as possible in the lug to stock fitment. The bore of that barrel was ugly. Have you seen a drop in quality and QC of the actions themselves lately too?
So, this together with the things you put me on to read is the answer to my previous question. If I understand correctly, it is surface smoothness that determines velocity out of different barrels rather than bore diameter. If i understand correctly, a smoother almost mirror finished barrel will cause the bullet to go slower and might influence the precision / accuracy.
Great video, is it common to have extractor cuts like this on the production CZ barrels? I thought I had damaged mine by catching with rod whist cleaning lol.
I would just use JB bore paste and focus on the chamber area of a new 22lr barrel if you see the circular tooling marks from the reamer on the chamber lead right at the area where you start to see the rifling. This will aid in reducing carbon fouling. I wouldn't go crazy down the bore
Kenny, THank you for all the great info that you provide and the transparency that you provide it. If one were to want to dip their toe into the world of better 22LR would and maybe try a little base class NRL would you suggest a Tikka T1x or a CZ 457? And in the CZs does going with the Varmint MTU make a difference? (Although that walnut stock does look good). Thank you.
I'm hoping that lose magazine well is because it is being made from a better plastic. I've had three CZ plastic magazine wells, on three different rifles, crack, possibly because of low resistance to Rimfire Blend. They were not over torqued.
Thank you kenny. The difference between wisdom and here say is. Is standing on the podium looking out, Or looking at the podium looking up. Can you machine lap my ten twenty two barrel.
@roberttomlin3143 the chromoly barrels seem to be better quality from what I'm seeing. The other 6 SS rifles I have are in worse condition than what I showed in this video and shot horrible.
I´ve really been trying to read up, but theres so much information out there. Is a CZ457 MTR or a Bergara B14-R a better basis for upgrades? And which one would you choose for mid tier Open class NRL22 rifle?
@bingoberra18 the B14r is a Rem 700 based 22lr so it allows for more options in accessories and chassis. However Bergara B14rs are riddled with issues in reliability and have the worst lock timing design. I personally would favor the CZ457 and the Timney trigger is a good option.
@ Thank you so much. I will in the future definitely get a bigger caliber rifle for PRS but rem 700 based seems to not be so popular for new builds anymore? If I settle on the CZ, do you have any recommendation regarding choosing a cheaper synthetic varmint variant and a chassis of some sort, vs a wood stock MTR or the more expensive LRP variant?
So much comes to mind: Most 'guys' will buy on reputation ''CZ457's shoot lights out, right?" so go buy one of those. Most 'guys' will cherry pick the heck out of their patterns, (sorry, I meant groups) and swear they shoot that all the time which is a lie. That rifle as tested 1 of 1 is just a plinker. There! I said it. 🙂
Not at the moment. The cost of components and an airgun supply with projectiles nears the cost of a custom 22lr build. Until the performance of an airgun can match the performance of a 22lr rifle at lower cost, I'm not interested in doing so. I've been down the PCP rabbit hole and unfortunately the air gun community is littered with excuses why their rifles don't perform, fast to blame a tune or some mechanical issue and poor sportsmanship in many PRS matches from my experience.
@@EagleEyeShooting may I ask for email, I would like to buy it tbh. we ve got small firearm shop here in Czech and from customer point of view ppl who buy airgun are willing to pay more (due to firearm restrction generally in EU)
People should complain. or just not buy CZ 457. seems like CZ is running on their brand name for making sales. their 10 shot steel mags jam and do not feed the next cartridge. so yes quality is going out the window.
@Mrpocketprospecting no. I'm working other alternatives as it simply doesn't fit my quality standards and is less of quality than what's currently in the markey
That is the million dollar question. Ill assume some ego is involved. However, they did design the 457 to remove the barrel easy enough. Should have stuck with the 452 threaded receivers lol
If they sold only the action they wouldnt also be making the markup on the stock and barrel. Im not saying its right but the popularity of the rifle dictates they would just lose money doing it.
Kenny, I’ve read about guys “hand lapping “ their barrels with a bore mop and bore paste . Would you care to comment on that ? Also , I’ve read about taper lapping . I’d be interested in hearing more from you on the subject . Thank you . Edit, that’s total crap on CZ s plastic recoil lug … that’s a real tell on where they are heading . The bean counters are running the design department . Disappointing . Not sure of the economics but I’ll bet you could turn out steel recoil lugs and sell them for $30 a piece 😂
The steel used in the barrel has nothing to do with the quality and accuracy of the barrel. Sure 416R SS is weaking and softer than 4150 chromomolly steel so it is easier on the machines and the mandrels and forms slightly easier. That said unlike button rifling I doubt any of this matter for CHF barrels. The key to a great CHF barrel is making sure the mandrels are clean and maintained and that the interior surface is clean on the barrel. Stress relief is important in all barrel manufacturing but especially CHF and button rifling even cut rifling or broaching can benifit from heat treat though otherwise you are at the mercy of what the mill sends you! There are plenty of $14,000 police and military sniper rifles in Europe that wear CHF barrels and all of the US Army sniper rifles and machine gun barrels and M4 barrels are all CHF. You can make a great barrel with any method of rifling or you can make a garbage barrel with any of the main methods. Like most things though you can not hope or wish to make a great barrel you have to set out to make a great barrel and do everything delibrately to end up with a great barrel no happy accidents in barrel making. ER SHAW turns out some terrible barrels and they button rifle which is also the method of Shielen, Lija, HART, Criterion, Douglas and many more. The only process I am a aware of where you do not have anyone making cheap barrels is cut rifling it is so slow and both time, energy and man power demanding that no one using this method makes cheap low grade barrels. So I think it is all about how much time, attention, details a company is willing to put into each step and what is done in QC. Ultimately if the customer demands something hard enough and long enough and are willing to pay for it usually a company will give them what they want.
As a manufacturer why the hell would you invest more money just to be worse than your original product? Probably like oh we got em hooked now lets be cheap asses
That does not look like a CHF barrel to me that looks like a button rifled barrel to me. If that is CHF it is the worst CHF barrel I have ever seen in my life. I own a lot of CHF barrels and some companies do them better than others but that is just horrible. The extreme tooling marks left behind and the nasty looking chamber is what makes me doubt this is CHF. That said I am wrong as often as am I am right on a good many things so we shall see what we see!
I agree. During my editing, I forgot to mention that the SS barrel appears button rifled because of the tooling marks as an indication of button slip during the rifling process. The CHF barrels I have do not have any of these tooling marks.
So sick of plastic. Pretty soon they’ll figure out how to create a disposable barrel made out of plastic. There’s nothing but a bunch of cheap shit being made these days because of the effed up Economy.
I bought two new cz457 mtrs. The two barrels look totally different from each other in the bores. Like they were cut on two different boring machines by an inexperienced machinist. Inconsistent patterns on paper are not a surprise anymore. These two guns absolutely suck! Recoil lugs are cheap plastic and fall out of stock with no persuasion. These are my first and last CZs. They are both crap. What a damn disappointment. Times 2!
1 cm at 100m in a 22 rimfire? Repeatedly? Groups of more than 3 shots? Takes way more than just a good barrel to shoot a rimfire like that. If your gunsmith can promise that kind of accuracy out of a rimfire then I want his name.
@austinkroe yes sire i always shoot 5 shoots and only which the good ammo lapua long range and or midas +. That shoots just perfect eley not 3 or 4 times bigger
Enjoyed your imput on this video,good to point out some of the problems& such,keeps us informed. Glad we can still get a Class A '22 cal rifle from DPGunworks. Thanks for your tireless work you do to preserve the high standards of you rifles.
Great vid mate, thanks for showing us what the go is, plastic lugs is crazy, will be interesting to see what Josh thinks of them, cheers Yogi ✌️
Can’t wait till I see what you do on the 17hm2 your building me love to see the info you put out thanks I took the lug out of one mine and shoots better with out
Interesting, I enjoy your perspective on rimfires. In my experience even current CZ barrels do vary considerably, I've had about 5 of em, and they've ranged from acceptable (consistent 0.5" groups at 50 with proven ammo lots) to exceptional, I had one skinny CM barrel rifle that would shoot better than 1.0" at 100M (109Y) with Eley Match. All this I think says is that there is a bit of a barrel lottery with most mass produced barrels, CZ no exception.
Thanks for interesting video. The injection moulded CZ 457 parts are brittle, mine did not take combination of use and normal gunoil, I got new parts on warranty, but chose to source parts machined in aircraft alu.
Didnt even know this was a thing lol. Good video brother
Excellent info!
Can you toss that bad boy in your lapping machine and improve it? Or do you make the barrels a bit undersized and then ultimately lap to final diameter? (Aka lapping this finished barrel would result in it being overbore?)
That recoil lug is crazy. I can’t imagine CZ will be able to keep their precision rimfire market share if they do stuff like that. Heck, I’ve been bedding my recoil lug into my chassis’s to take out as much slop as possible in the lug to stock fitment.
The bore of that barrel was ugly. Have you seen a drop in quality and QC of the actions themselves lately too?
So, this together with the things you put me on to read is the answer to my previous question. If I understand correctly, it is surface smoothness that determines velocity out of different barrels rather than bore diameter. If i understand correctly, a smoother almost mirror finished barrel will cause the bullet to go slower and might influence the precision / accuracy.
Both influences accuracy and velocity. This is why shilen taper lap barrels are slower than other barrels
Thanks Kenny.
Great video, is it common to have extractor cuts like this on the production CZ barrels? I thought I had damaged mine by catching with rod whist cleaning lol.
great video are your barrels cut rifle or button milled
Great video and explaining for us Dummies
What type of lapping compound should you use on a new cz barrel? Will it make a big difference? Should do a before and after video.
I would just use JB bore paste and focus on the chamber area of a new 22lr barrel if you see the circular tooling marks from the reamer on the chamber lead right at the area where you start to see the rifling. This will aid in reducing carbon fouling. I wouldn't go crazy down the bore
@@EagleEyeShooting Thanks for the input. I just might send a cz to you for some upgrades. Love your videos.
Very informative review
Kenny, THank you for all the great info that you provide and the transparency that you provide it. If one were to want to dip their toe into the world of better 22LR would and maybe try a little base class NRL would you suggest a Tikka T1x or a CZ 457? And in the CZs does going with the Varmint MTU make a difference? (Although that walnut stock does look good). Thank you.
Thank you. The T1x is known for good accuracy but lacks aftermarket support. The CZ457 would be my choice. Specially the MTR model
@ Thank you. I am some day going to play in the world of great 22s. And yours are at the top of the list.
I'm hoping that lose magazine well is because it is being made from a better plastic. I've had three CZ plastic magazine wells, on three different rifles, crack, possibly because of low resistance to Rimfire Blend. They were not over torqued.
I would just upgrade it to an aftermarket aluminum mag well. Ive seen many of these crack also
@@EagleEyeShooting yes sir.
Thank you kenny. The difference between wisdom and here say is. Is standing on the podium looking out, Or looking at the podium looking up. Can you machine lap my ten twenty two barrel.
As usual great content. Keep up the good work.
Good one Kenny. Thanks!!!
Please post a link to the benchrest, I'm very interested
Normally with stainless the machining is slightly finer. I was shocked to see the inside of that bore.😳
Have you bore scoped a CZ457 LRP barrel for comparison as they are supposed to be better CZ barrels
@roberttomlin3143 the chromoly barrels seem to be better quality from what I'm seeing. The other 6 SS rifles I have are in worse condition than what I showed in this video and shot horrible.
I´ve really been trying to read up, but theres so much information out there. Is a CZ457 MTR or a Bergara B14-R a better basis for upgrades? And which one would you choose for mid tier Open class NRL22 rifle?
@bingoberra18 the B14r is a Rem 700 based 22lr so it allows for more options in accessories and chassis. However Bergara B14rs are riddled with issues in reliability and have the worst lock timing design.
I personally would favor the CZ457 and the Timney trigger is a good option.
@ Thank you so much. I will in the future definitely get a bigger caliber rifle for PRS but rem 700 based seems to not be so popular for new builds anymore? If I settle on the CZ, do you have any recommendation regarding choosing a cheaper synthetic varmint variant and a chassis of some sort, vs a wood stock MTR or the more expensive LRP variant?
Off-topic, but is the X Tripod front shooting rest (the SEB Mini knockoff) still on the market?
I don't think so. I belive the Canadian company received a cease and assist for the design copy. I haven't seen it available for quite some time
@ thank you!
Interesting Kenny I may need to rebarrel mine.
Great video, thanks for the info👍🏽👍🏽
Learning Precision together 😀👍.
Great info. as usual Kenny. Whats your take on the Vector scope ?
Thank you. I have 3 of these 10-40 scopes and I think they are a great affordable scope for benchrest shooting
@@EagleEyeShooting Yea I have a couple myself. I think they are hard to beat for the price for sure
During the target footage, is it the scope of the camera that's making everything blurry and tinted?
Combination of camera lens from the trigger cam. The scope is a lot clearer than that shown in the video.
@EagleEyeShooting solid
So much comes to mind: Most 'guys' will buy on reputation ''CZ457's shoot lights out, right?" so go buy one of those. Most 'guys' will cherry pick the heck out of their patterns, (sorry, I meant groups) and swear they shoot that all the time which is a lie. That rifle as tested 1 of 1 is just a plinker. There! I said it. 🙂
May i ask if u make airgin barrels or thinking about that? 700mm slug liner for fx ❤
Not at the moment. The cost of components and an airgun supply with projectiles nears the cost of a custom 22lr build. Until the performance of an airgun can match the performance of a 22lr rifle at lower cost, I'm not interested in doing so. I've been down the PCP rabbit hole and unfortunately the air gun community is littered with excuses why their rifles don't perform, fast to blame a tune or some mechanical issue and poor sportsmanship in many PRS matches from my experience.
@@EagleEyeShooting may I ask for email, I would like to buy it tbh. we ve got small firearm shop here in Czech and from customer point of view ppl who buy airgun are willing to pay more (due to firearm restrction generally in EU)
People should complain. or just not buy CZ 457. seems like CZ is running on their brand name for making sales. their 10 shot steel mags jam and do not feed the next cartridge. so yes quality is going out the window.
Good stuff, you never come up on my feed fyi.
the new chassis vid coming soon?
@Mrpocketprospecting no. I'm working other alternatives as it simply doesn't fit my quality standards and is less of quality than what's currently in the markey
I’ve got a Remington 40 X. Can you convert it to a magazine fed repeater
22lr
So why can't these manufacturers just sell the public the action/bolt only? There has to be a reason, and I'm not sure what that is.
That is the million dollar question. Ill assume some ego is involved. However, they did design the 457 to remove the barrel easy enough. Should have stuck with the 452 threaded receivers lol
If they sold only the action they wouldnt also be making the markup on the stock and barrel. Im not saying its right but the popularity of the rifle dictates they would just lose money doing it.
Kenny, I’ve read about guys “hand lapping “ their barrels with a bore mop and bore paste . Would you care to comment on that ? Also , I’ve read about taper lapping . I’d be interested in hearing more from you on the subject . Thank you .
Edit, that’s total crap on CZ s plastic recoil lug … that’s a real tell on where they are heading . The bean counters are running the design department . Disappointing . Not sure of the economics but I’ll bet you could turn out steel recoil lugs and sell them for $30 a piece 😂
The lug in my 2024 mtr is not metal and loose fitting. As loose as it is, I'm surprised they even put one in anymore
The steel used in the barrel has nothing to do with the quality and accuracy of the barrel. Sure 416R SS is weaking and softer than 4150 chromomolly steel so it is easier on the machines and the mandrels and forms slightly easier. That said unlike button rifling I doubt any of this matter for CHF barrels. The key to a great CHF barrel is making sure the mandrels are clean and maintained and that the interior surface is clean on the barrel. Stress relief is important in all barrel manufacturing but especially CHF and button rifling even cut rifling or broaching can benifit from heat treat though otherwise you are at the mercy of what the mill sends you!
There are plenty of $14,000 police and military sniper rifles in Europe that wear CHF barrels and all of the US Army sniper rifles and machine gun barrels and M4 barrels are all CHF.
You can make a great barrel with any method of rifling or you can make a garbage barrel with any of the main methods. Like most things though you can not hope or wish to make a great barrel you have to set out to make a great barrel and do everything delibrately to end up with a great barrel no happy accidents in barrel making. ER SHAW turns out some terrible barrels and they button rifle which is also the method of Shielen, Lija, HART, Criterion, Douglas and many more. The only process I am a aware of where you do not have anyone making cheap barrels is cut rifling it is so slow and both time, energy and man power demanding that no one using this method makes cheap low grade barrels. So I think it is all about how much time, attention, details a company is willing to put into each step and what is done in QC.
Ultimately if the customer demands something hard enough and long enough and are willing to pay for it usually a company will give them what they want.
Accuracy bumps, their choke points, i heard expensive barrels have these
@@Brez1969 😆
You will see cost cutting from now on. Colt got their nose under the tent and they are bad news.
As a manufacturer why the hell would you invest more money just to be worse than your original product? Probably like oh we got em hooked now lets be cheap asses
That does not look like a CHF barrel to me that looks like a button rifled barrel to me. If that is CHF it is the worst CHF barrel I have ever seen in my life. I own a lot of CHF barrels and some companies do them better than others but that is just horrible.
The extreme tooling marks left behind and the nasty looking chamber is what makes me doubt this is CHF. That said I am wrong as often as am I am right on a good many things so we shall see what we see!
I agree. During my editing, I forgot to mention that the SS barrel appears button rifled because of the tooling marks as an indication of button slip during the rifling process. The CHF barrels I have do not have any of these tooling marks.
So sick of plastic. Pretty soon they’ll figure out how to create a disposable barrel made out of plastic. There’s nothing but a bunch of cheap shit being made these days because of the effed up Economy.
Typical put cheaper parts in and increase the price.
I bought two new cz457 mtrs.
The two barrels look totally different from each other in the bores. Like they were cut on two different boring machines by an inexperienced machinist. Inconsistent patterns on paper are not a surprise anymore.
These two guns absolutely suck!
Recoil lugs are cheap plastic and fall out of stock with no persuasion.
These are my first and last CZs. They are both crap.
What a damn disappointment. Times 2!
I let my gunsmit make a barrel just for me now i shoot groops of minus 1 cm at 100 m .
Omg that is ugly 😵😵😵😵😵
1 cm at 100m in a 22 rimfire? Repeatedly? Groups of more than 3 shots? Takes way more than just a good barrel to shoot a rimfire like that. If your gunsmith can promise that kind of accuracy out of a rimfire then I want his name.
@austinkroe yes sire i always shoot 5 shoots and only which the good ammo lapua long range and or midas +. That shoots just perfect eley not 3 or 4 times bigger
@austinkroe o by the way i Miss olso sometimes but that is the shooter not wapen and ammo
Sub 4 tenths at 100?
Too bad you can't post pictures.
I'd love to see that.