Thanks for this video. I’ve tried nearly all the major plated super shoes and raced with them here in Colorado and other mountain/high desert ultras. A few lessons in keeping with your excellent dialogue: (1) the stiffer carbon plated models aren’t suitable for rocky/technical terrain, but can be brilliant on buffed trails, fire/mining/logging roads, and road-to-trail. The North Face Flight Vectiv models fall into that category, as does the New Balance; Craft Pure Trail, etc. (2) The Speedland GS, with its Carbitex insert, is the best all-around trail racer I’ve raced in for more technical ultras shy of 50 miles because it is wide enough, and has a moccasin fit, so that it maintains stability on all kinds of surfaces. (3) the Hoka Tecton X and X2 are arguably superior even to the Speedland GS line for 50-plus mile distances because the plate is softer (used them in my last 200 mile race) and (4) Salomon is on to something with the S/Lab Ultra d’Haene. Just got mine (from Lithuania; not available on the US web site yet from Salomon) and have about 50 miles in them so far, largely on snow/ice. Plan to race a 100 miler in them next weekend in the Cajun country of Louisiana. The plate isn’t carbon - it might be nylon or fiberglass, Salomon hasn’t said - and is just much smoother and especially stable on technical terrain. Happy trails!
Great run down mate. I had a few pairs of the speed goat evos on ice and I'm down to my last pair- am I getting anything better with the current racing shoes, it just seems like there is no option than a plated racer otherwise you have the weight gain with the more mass market options?
I know that in the US there are a lot of cross country events where spikes are banned as the ground is hard pack dirt and gravel so it makes sense that a carbon trail show would be beneficial in warmer climes. In Britain its just too wet and soft most of the time.
Useful perspective! No plates in trail shoes for me, at least not what's available now. Tried the Tecton X2 and even those sacrificed too much ground feel for me. Very comfy but just a bit tippy, laterally. No way I want to be on those 24h into some mountain trail race, sleep deprived and tired. Sticking to my trusty Sense Rides a little longer😛
Great discussion. In my opinion, plated trail shoe are great for racing or terrain that is dry and relative flat similar to road. Other than that it just throw you off. Imagine going downhill on loose rocks, plate might through you off. Maybe less stiffening plate that does not shift your momentum too much is plateable .
In the summer dry months you can get away with any regular trainer but in the winter and spring the rubber ideally 4mm grip is needed .I like the inov8 270 and asics trail shoes and Nike wilhorse line this year.
Think you're absolutely correct... Can only really see a benefit on section that are flat, non muddy, or on sections that are road between the trails, don't think they are detrimental but unless it's very dry there's not much to gain in the UK
Yep, I agree. It seems these are really a thing for the American market and other hotter climates. In US cross country events often ban spikes because they have significant hard pack and gravel sections whereas in Northern Europe its just a mud bath
Have the Tecton X2, it’s been really nice, they have been good on all terrain from buffed out to races in the Rocky Mountains but the carbon is more of a glorified rock plate, I don’t notice any real high energy rebound you couldn’t get from a better foam and plastic plate. The durability is also weak, as the internal fabrics are tearing. For $260CDN, I wouldn’t but again. In comparison to my Norda 001, I’ve put on double the KMs and show no wear, and the performance on 50-100k to me has been just as good. Thanks for the vid.
I'm usually looking for the fastest and most cushioned shoe, both on the road and on trail. I tested multiple trail racing shoes and, for shorter races, my top 2 are the Saucony Endorphin Edge (9.5oz, 35mm stack) and the S/Lab Pulsar SG (6.8oz, narrow fit, 28-31mm stack). For longer races, like ultras, then maybe the Ultrafly (10.1oz, wide fit, 38mm stack) or the Agravic Speed Ultra (9.5oz, wide forefoot, 38mm stack) but I think I might be tempted to use the Tecton X (8.9oz, 33mm stack) for an ultra since it's lighter and more traditional fit and stack (safer bet).
Hi, if I need to choose between the Velocity 2 and the Deviate 2 for a race that is 30% road and 70% light-medium trail, which one would you recommend?
Hi all, thank you for the video!!! I just (impulsively) got the SPARTAN by CRAFT Ultra Carbon Trail. Has anyone had the opportunity to run in those? Do you guys have any insight about them?
Any recommendations for a shoe for wet conditions. I live in Berlin and we just had our first snow, ist gonna be wet and slippery for the next three months.
Tecton x2 and Fuji speed 2 haven't worked for me. Done 150 miles in them both and I still don't feel good in them. Trabuco max 2 and inov8 g270 V2 are my favourites at the moment
i have some carbon road shoes and i really like em. from nike and adidas. But for the trails it just feels gimmicky! yeah if its only buffed out trails they are probably nice. But here i Norway with the rooty slippery muddy rocky "trails"nah. I just start thinking about what my ankles grave stone would say, just looking at them adidas ones. shesh
Seems to me these are really for the american market where trails and cross country events are often hard pack dirt and gravel. In Britian, it's just too wet and soft
what's the difference between carbon plates and rock plates that's been in trail shoes for long time? i see you disabled comments on your video review of xodus ultra 2. are the comments that bad? i'm wondering how bad could comments be in a shoe review
Rock plate more for protection not propulsion, difference in shaping and placement, not sure on materials used too. We had to turn comments off on a few vids because of a weird spam thing that was happening a few weeks back, lots of one word comments, luckily that stopped now but we haven't got round to turning comments back on! As you say, comments are rarely that bad on shoe reviews haha
Thanks for the video, great discussion. I just can't justify the cost for plated trail shoes. The Speedgoat 5 have seen me right for 400 miles, they're such a great all rounder and I'm never going to have the confidence to go all out on trail in the same way as I would on a road, so it just seems like a waste of money and a bit of an unnecessary risk to take. When these bottom out I'll either buy another pair of Speedgoats, or maybe switch to the Saucony Xodus Ultra 2.
The relative inability to clearly and concisely explain the ‘why’ at the start of the video really says it all. Trail shoes that work well on hard, flat surfaces, ummm OK. To much money, too little value. Thanks Run Testers a great video.
It's for the American market mostly where trails are often hard pack dirt and gravel. Many cross country events in the US ban spikes as the ground is so hard. In Northern Europe the ground is just too soft and wet
Thanks for this video. I’ve tried nearly all the major plated super shoes and raced with them here in Colorado and other mountain/high desert ultras. A few lessons in keeping with your excellent dialogue: (1) the stiffer carbon plated models aren’t suitable for rocky/technical terrain, but can be brilliant on buffed trails, fire/mining/logging roads, and road-to-trail. The North Face Flight Vectiv models fall into that category, as does the New Balance; Craft Pure Trail, etc. (2) The Speedland GS, with its Carbitex insert, is the best all-around trail racer I’ve raced in for more technical ultras shy of 50 miles because it is wide enough, and has a moccasin fit, so that it maintains stability on all kinds of surfaces. (3) the Hoka Tecton X and X2 are arguably superior even to the Speedland GS line for 50-plus mile distances because the plate is softer (used them in my last 200 mile race) and (4) Salomon is on to something with the S/Lab Ultra d’Haene. Just got mine (from Lithuania; not available on the US web site yet from Salomon) and have about 50 miles in them so far, largely on snow/ice. Plan to race a 100 miler in them next weekend in the Cajun country of Louisiana. The plate isn’t carbon - it might be nylon or fiberglass, Salomon hasn’t said - and is just much smoother and especially stable on technical terrain. Happy trails!
Great run down mate. I had a few pairs of the speed goat evos on ice and I'm down to my last pair- am I getting anything better with the current racing shoes, it just seems like there is no option than a plated racer otherwise you have the weight gain with the more mass market options?
@@palmyarmyswim well said. And yes. Miss my Speedgoat EVOs; lacked your vision!
I know that in the US there are a lot of cross country events where spikes are banned as the ground is hard pack dirt and gravel so it makes sense that a carbon trail show would be beneficial in warmer climes. In Britain its just too wet and soft most of the time.
which shoe would you wear for a terrain like sierre zinal?
@@gudboyngdisyerto a lighter shoe such as the Naked T/r or the NNormal Kjerag.
Useful perspective!
No plates in trail shoes for me, at least not what's available now. Tried the Tecton X2 and even those sacrificed too much ground feel for me. Very comfy but just a bit tippy, laterally. No way I want to be on those 24h into some mountain trail race, sleep deprived and tired. Sticking to my trusty Sense Rides a little longer😛
I picked up the NB Fuelcell SuperComp Trail, and think it's a great option.
I got my for something like 95€ (or 80£), so it was cheap to be honest, even compared to non carbon plated shoes.
Great discussion. In my opinion, plated trail shoe are great for racing or terrain that is dry and relative flat similar to road. Other than that it just throw you off. Imagine going downhill on loose rocks, plate might through you off. Maybe less stiffening plate that does not shift your momentum too much is plateable .
In the summer dry months you can get away with any regular trainer but in the winter and spring the rubber ideally 4mm grip is needed .I like the inov8 270 and asics trail shoes and Nike wilhorse line this year.
Think you're absolutely correct... Can only really see a benefit on section that are flat, non muddy, or on sections that are road between the trails, don't think they are detrimental but unless it's very dry there's not much to gain in the UK
Yep, I agree. It seems these are really a thing for the American market and other hotter climates. In US cross country events often ban spikes because they have significant hard pack and gravel sections whereas in Northern Europe its just a mud bath
Currently on peg 4 react and speedgoats. Both great. Do want to try the Slabs
The Hoka TectonX certainly benefits me when going uplhill. It enhances the knee-speed forward to maintain short and fast steps. Less effort uphill.
Have the Tecton X2, it’s been really nice, they have been good on all terrain from buffed out to races in the Rocky Mountains but the carbon is more of a glorified rock plate, I don’t notice any real high energy rebound you couldn’t get from a better foam and plastic plate. The durability is also weak, as the internal fabrics are tearing. For $260CDN, I wouldn’t but again. In comparison to my Norda 001, I’ve put on double the KMs and show no wear, and the performance on 50-100k to me has been just as good. Thanks for the vid.
Durability is a major issue for every Hoka shoe, especially the trail ones.
Any trail that's smooth enough so you'll get a benefit from super trail shoes, would be smooth enough to just use a road shoe!
Love my Aggra-Vich and Vective Pro toos.
I'm usually looking for the fastest and most cushioned shoe, both on the road and on trail. I tested multiple trail racing shoes and, for shorter races, my top 2 are the Saucony Endorphin Edge (9.5oz, 35mm stack) and the S/Lab Pulsar SG (6.8oz, narrow fit, 28-31mm stack). For longer races, like ultras, then maybe the Ultrafly (10.1oz, wide fit, 38mm stack) or the Agravic Speed Ultra (9.5oz, wide forefoot, 38mm stack) but I think I might be tempted to use the Tecton X (8.9oz, 33mm stack) for an ultra since it's lighter and more traditional fit and stack (safer bet).
Hi, if I need to choose between the Velocity 2 and the Deviate 2 for a race that is 30% road and 70% light-medium trail, which one would you recommend?
Hi all, thank you for the video!!! I just (impulsively) got the SPARTAN by CRAFT Ultra Carbon Trail. Has anyone had the opportunity to run in those? Do you guys have any insight about them?
Any recommendations for a shoe for wet conditions. I live in Berlin and we just had our first snow, ist gonna be wet and slippery for the next three months.
"Tom here from the thing that you are watching", thanks for reminding me, I never know where to look up the name of the channel 🤣
love the long sky 2 matryx , sod all that plate stuff :)
Tecton x2 and Fuji speed 2 haven't worked for me. Done 150 miles in them both and I still don't feel good in them. Trabuco max 2 and inov8 g270 V2 are my favourites at the moment
What a great video!
i have some carbon road shoes and i really like em. from nike and adidas. But for the trails it just feels gimmicky! yeah if its only buffed out trails they are probably nice. But here i Norway with the rooty slippery muddy rocky "trails"nah. I just start thinking about what my ankles grave stone would say, just looking at them adidas ones. shesh
Seems to me these are really for the american market where trails and cross country events are often hard pack dirt and gravel. In Britian, it's just too wet and soft
what's the difference between carbon plates and rock plates that's been in trail shoes for long time?
i see you disabled comments on your video review of xodus ultra 2. are the comments that bad? i'm wondering how bad could comments be in a shoe review
Rock plate more for protection not propulsion, difference in shaping and placement, not sure on materials used too. We had to turn comments off on a few vids because of a weird spam thing that was happening a few weeks back, lots of one word comments, luckily that stopped now but we haven't got round to turning comments back on! As you say, comments are rarely that bad on shoe reviews haha
Thanks for the video, great discussion.
I just can't justify the cost for plated trail shoes. The Speedgoat 5 have seen me right for 400 miles, they're such a great all rounder and I'm never going to have the confidence to go all out on trail in the same way as I would on a road, so it just seems like a waste of money and a bit of an unnecessary risk to take. When these bottom out I'll either buy another pair of Speedgoats, or maybe switch to the Saucony Xodus Ultra 2.
is the fuji speed 1 good?
For me; Yes
If you can comfortably afford them.. Then Get Them.
The relative inability to clearly and concisely explain the ‘why’ at the start of the video really says it all. Trail shoes that work well on hard, flat surfaces, ummm OK. To much money, too little value. Thanks Run Testers a great video.
It's for the American market mostly where trails are often hard pack dirt and gravel. Many cross country events in the US ban spikes as the ground is so hard. In Northern Europe the ground is just too soft and wet
Why does Nick looked handsome all of a sudden?