Azog the Defiler - Explained
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- Опубликовано: 16 апр 2023
- In Deep Geek - Insight and intelligent discussion on Lord of the Rings, Game of Thrones, The Witcher and more.
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![TRASH or PASS! Eminem ( Houdini ) [REACTION!!!]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/cB1WrZcMwMc/mqdefault.jpg)
It's also canon that Bolg gave Azog a "best father in the world" mug for Christmas.
😂😂😂😂❤
It was actually a "#1 Dad" goblet
Or maybe a different detachable hand! Like a thumbs up one or a litter picking claw!
@@albertrodriguez156*you're both wrong its a pimp cup lil john style that says "They want me for my pimp juice"
@willclark4449 ah yes that sweet grog
After Dain slew Azog, he returned to his kin, but his face was ashen. When Thror declared "Khazad-dum is ours," Dain told him no. "It waits for you just beyond the gate, Durin's Bane." For Dain had seen the demonic holdover from the First Age waiting inside the door.
The dwarves, who normally build impressive cairns for their dead (see Balin's tomb in FOTR), were forced to settle for burning the vast number of dead after the battle. The only wood available was from the trees of Lothlorien, furthering the antagonism between the elves and dwarves. Dwarves spoke of the battle by proudly saying, "My ancestor was a burned dwarf."
Not Thror but Thrain
Elves: You’re telling us NOW is when you ran outta fucking coal?!
The inclusion of Azog in the movies aside, it's a real missed opportunity that he didn't appear all clad in black iron armour and a helmet like a skull. And Weta did come up with some intimidating designs that sadly never made it due to the troubled nature of the films' production.
Furthermore, Bolg *should* have been in Azog's place in the movies, perhaps even as a dark reflection of Thorin as the mutual family grudges and cycle of vengeance between Dwarf and Orc gets resolved by their deaths in the Battle of Five Armies.
They used his original design for the Orc that Galadriel kills rescuing Gandalf. Can see the scene in the extended edition of Battle of the Five Armies.
Agreed!
Cyclical blood fueds may actually have been the original inspiration because Norse stories are full of it. They're usually the main plot device in all the stories.
I really liked Azog in the Hobbit movies.
Not only was he a fearsome warrior but he was also a very good battle commander. Unlike basically everyone else, he stood at a high tower (or whatever that was) which allowed him to see the battlefield and used signal to command his troops and change battle formations accordingly.
Azog and Bolg ... not admired but at least acknowledged
...as far as it goes, if a human had created and carved a dynasty lasting 200 years they would be lauded. So...again, as with the Dunlendings...
I really liked Azog in the Hobbit movies. Someone who only talked black speech is a cool concept and having someone be the head of the evil army is a good idea for continuity and giving Thorin a nemesis. Just wish he wasn't all cgi. It's not even that I'm butthurt that they didn't use the design they already made, although I'd have prefered that, I actually like the "pale orc" design, just that it sticks out like a soar thumb when a real person, Thorin, is fighting a computer generate image
Unfortunately, all the black speech is made up by someone not Tolkien, a dude named David Salo (i googled this to find his name lol). I am pretty sure he is a Tolkien scholar and linguist so he’s no pushover. It still has the overall spirit of the themes. I think the only black speech ever recorded by Tolkien is the One Ring’s inscription.
Even though they played with the lore, I loved Azog as a villain. Also love Manu as an actor
These were strong Orcs, Azog & Bolg. No doubt.👍
Obviously it's all just fanfiction from a game developer, but the orcs in Shadow of Mordor and Shadow of War are amazing, brimming with personality. Some are dumb, some are smart. They are capable of cunning and treachery but also surprising acts of loyalty. They have wants and fears that are as individual as they are. Discount Aragorn aka Talion and their incredibly non-canon version of Celebrimbor are fine for what they are, but the orcs are the real stars of that game.
the first game was the most I've enjoyed the story in a computer game since Last of Us. Ranger/wraith logic was perfect. The Celebrimbor tragedy was by itself better than Amazon's whole TV series, and yeah, the orcs were fantastic.
The orcs, even in the brief interactions with each other we see in the books, do seem to be as intelligent as men at least, but without the ability to have virtuous characteristics like compassion because of Morgoth's corruption of them in the 1st age.
Tolkien did work on the games
@@dbfurrer He didn't work on the games that came out 43 years after his death? How very insightful of you to point out.
@@coolbrotherf127how in the hell did you assume he meant "didn't" 😮
Absolutely love these profile specials. They really add depth to the story. The “baddies” have a history just as well as the “good guys”!!
I like The Hobbit movies for what they are. I am glad that you make videos that aren't vehemently dismissive of them like so many others. Yours is one of the few channels that takes The Hobbit trilogy and The Rings of Power seriously. You point out where in Tolkien's works they draw inspiration from, and point out the differences in a respectful manner. That's why I subscribe to you, even though I skip all of your non-Tolkien related videos.
I'm only stingy about RofP...I have issues with that one...😢
The non Tolkien ones are worth checking out too.
@@ranica47 But I've never seen those shows and have no interest in doing so. I'll stick to the Tolkien content.
“My name is Bolg. You killed my father. Prepare to die.”
I love the detail that Azog's head was impaled and a bag of coins was thrust in his mouth. Dwarf poetry.
Best subtitle ever: Children of Louis Vuitton for Children of Iluvatar.
I've always wondered if the Grest Goblin was a Lieutenant of Bolg's.
Aside from their proclivity towards violence, Tolkien wrote that the average life expectancy of an Orc was less than that of a Man. There were exceptions of course and the most common theory is that longer lived orcs were either the offspring of Maiar corrupted by Morgoth cross-breeding with regular orcs or such Maiar actually taking the form of Orcs. Neither Azog or Bolg was representative of average orcs and that applies to their life span as well.
Where did he write that?
@@MiningForPies I believe it is in the book "Morgoth's Ring" and perhaps in some of his letters from "The Letters of J.R.R. Tolkien."
"Average life expectancy" would include violent deaths, and given Orcish lifestyle, that number will be significantly lower than their potential lifespan. Also, if the corrupted elves theory of their origin is correct, or at least partially correct, then that would explain quite a bit of longevity.
Thanks for this. Azog was always one of the best antagonists
"They chopped off my father's head and carved runes into his forehead, with coins of little worth stuffed in his mouth. And you know, I took that personally." -Thraín.
Love the channel and, particularly, the Tolkien videos. There is a voluminous, red meat opportunity for the channel, I think, which would be hypothetical match up between characters. This is either not often covered, or not covered very well - I know Robert would do the topic justice and with an excellent narration.
That's odd. Azog the Defiler is my wife's pet name for me.
Keeping Azog alive was the one change i liked in the hobbit movies. Azog was a really threatening villain.
Great video!! Would never expect a delve into this characters history, but I definitely enjoyed it. Keep these up, please!
so many good illustrations in your videos
Very interesting. Would also enjoy seeing your analysis of the Orc Gothmog.
Only in the movie is he identified as an Orc. Tolkien's writings never specify what species he was so he could have also been a Man or a Nazgûl.
@@istari0 I think Tolkien would have said if Gothmog were a Nazgûl, especially given that Nazgûl were present at the Battle of Pelennor Fields. LOTRO imagines him as a wraith, but not one of the Nine.
Such a great explanation, thank you so much🙏
I do find it funny that this guy who had so much screen time is less memorable than the orc that led the army on Minas Tirith and had like 3 lines. Heck even the one that drop kicked an Urak-Hai at Cirith Ungol is so much more memorable.
I have a question I'm hoping your channel can answer. Is Mount Doom special in some way? Are its fires unique for forging and destroying the One Ring or is it just that the ring could only be destroyed in the same place it was forged? Or, is it just the only volcano in Middle Earth?
The last time I was this early, I was not a wizard. Because a wizard is never early.
Nor is he late! He arrives precisely when he means to! 😂❤🍻
Nice work dude thanks
Have you ever thought of doing videos on Terry Brooks' Shannara books? They're awesome fantasy and great books! I honestly love them more than LotR, and thats saying a lot because I love LotR too!
Thanks so much!
Great video Robert.
One nit pick that keeps bugging me every time I watch it: the battle is called "Azanulbizar", not "Azanulzibar" as you said it a few times. I know it's a mouthful and probably took you several takes to get consistent but still.
thank you Robert
very good work
Subscribed for “and much more” I should have much earlier, your analysis and theories are great ty for your hard work
Excellent video
My favorite character from the book!
That's well done! 😁🍻
Have you done a History of Moria video? I cannot get the timeline straight in my head.
Well-done once again, Robert! Do you think that the humanity of a villain gives them a tragic flavor?
My god, a popular culture commentator that speaks in full sentences.
And isn't overwrought and over dramatic like many other fantasy lore people.
Bro your killing me with these ps2 looking character models for references🤣🤣
Hehe enjoyed those Old Warhammer Orc images.
You should do a series of just lord of the rings read alongs.
“So, you think his defiling days are over!?” 😂
I could listen to this man read a phone book.
If it still existed! Perhaps nowadays we should say we would hear him read the terms of service. Which I would.
Someone must have said it by now, but the Defiler is a spot on description of what he did to those beloved movies.
More on this topic please. Not enough done by others and it's one of my favorite parts, that and the balrogs
Could listen to anything g from in deep geek
Azorg was a good person, chivalrous and selfless. He was far better than the greedy line of Durin. His death left many good hearts broken, may God bless Azorg the bold.
He'd been dead for 142 years before the happenings in The Hobbit. His son Bolg leads the goblin forces in the Battle of Five Armies.
Makes you wonder if Orcs live just as long as Elves if they lived peacefully.
@@melkhiordarkfell4354 Maybe not like the Elves, but probably like the Dwarves (at least those who we meet in LOTR and The Hobbit)
*Azog(tm) seems to have very serious anger issues that proper medication and therapy might help to alleviate but then again he might just be a real antisocial jerk and sociopath and a truly not at all nice being to start with*
😂😂😂🍻
Great video, but just a small correction: it's not Azanulzibar, but Azanulbizar.
Fun fact: Azog spelled backwards sounds like Gozer, the baddie from Ghostbusters.
The whole notion of no one knowing that Durin's Bane was a balrog is curious. One would have thought that the wise, including Gandalf, who knew everyone, would have spoken long and hard to Durin's folk about this over the next century. Sure, dwarves were tight-lipped, but many hundreds of surviving dwarves must have seen the Balrog when Moria was lost. Later, Dain himself looked upon the Balrog ... and Dain was actually alive during LOTR. It's amazing that Gandalf never chatted up Dain. Ten minutes of frank discussion would have told Gandalf all he needed to know.
Knowing that a balrog was there might even have had convinced Glorfindel to accompany the Fellowship, through Moria at least. He likely would have liked a little payback over Gondolin, eh?
Fantastic channel inspired me to reread lotr
consider doing something on púkel-men from return of the king?
U are the best
This is just one of the reasons why The Hobbit trilogy didn't work out as expected because of the rushed re-writes.
"Azanulbizar" not "Azanulzibar" ;)
You say you cover the Witcher, but it's been a very long time since you've actually did a Witcher video.
Beorn is my favorite character in The Hobbit
What luck, 22 seconds after post
Same.
Could you do a character video on Tauriel...my wife's favorite character in the Hobbit movie...
She doesn’t exist in the books
Not much to talk about. She was created specifically for the movies as they needed a strong female character and for some reason a "forbidden love" plotline,
He is also Azog the amputator
Wasn't he also mentioned to be a Goblin by Gandalf and Thorin in the Hobbit, not an Orc?
Tolkien uses Goblin and Orc interchanging in the early works. He always intended them to be the same just that Goblin was a common English term for the less popular Orc name.
After 30 sec!!!
To me personally Azog and the romance scene between the dwarf and elf didn't need to be included in the movies. There was plenty of content to not change the movie from the way the book was written. It took away the pristine feel of the book that could have been in the movies.
I didn't like Peter Jacksons padding out the movies. Honestly did the have to be almost 4 hours long each? Also Azog The Defiler and Thorin Oaken Shield never met in actual battle in the books. Like you said Dain killed Azog in the Orc war, and Bolg was killed by Beorn. So Thorin just died in battle due to the overwhelming odds!
Finally some Orc representation
He accomplished many great feats. Terrible, yes, but great none the less. In the LOTR trilogy, there are a few leaders, but most of them seem to be mindless murdering foot soldiers. It seems to me that the bad guys have a lot more character development in the Hobbit and other works that pre date the LOTR
Azog: WAAAAAAGGGGGGHHHHHH
Wait how long _can_ orcs live?
even within the first few pages of reading the hobbit I realized that the movies were very different
So are there female orc as well?
“Stupid idea from bad creative.”
-Chris Jericho
a great goblin, as it were
I thought that orcs had short lifespans. This notion of them living into their hundreds seems off to me.
His son 😮
I thought Azog was named as a goblin. Unless it’s a miss print my Hobbit says he is goblin.
Goblin and Orc are the same in the books.
Tolkien uses Goblins and Orcs interchangeably. They are ultimately the same.
So, are Orc wives like Dwarven wives.... They look the same as the males?
"Azog was among them""
Hmmm...
IDG!!!!!
Not NINE. NAY-in.
Not DYNE. DAY-in.
The defiler is a real jerk at cocktail parties...
How is kicking an enemy in the leg during a battle "playing dirty"? That is just trying to kill the opponent while surviving yourself as anyone would do in a battle lol
Are images from LOTR Online added here cause these characters appear in the game?
Also, get real. The villain did not become dimensional at all until the Hobbit movies
How is that playing dirty???
Since the original orcs were just elves that Morgoth tortured and twisted, do you suppose that their children are born just looking like elf babies, but are then tortured and twisted by their parents until they are similarly orcish?
By this time that twisted nature is genetic.
I hope Azog will embrace his inner child one day. And hopefully pursue his dream of becoming a pilot.
23:00 Isn’t that the definition of facism?
23:00?
I was watching another video and responded to that. Don’t understand how it ended up here.
We need more orc characters and more stories from the orcs point of view...
what about the wheel of time
🌝
8 mim
ugh, that thumbnail just makes me regretful yet again that they used CGI rather than practical effects for the orcs.
Are there actually Orc females who give birth to their babies the same as human females? Or do the Orcs take female prisoners from the human villages they pillage and use them as breeders? Jonathan French has written a series of books about The Grey Bastards, bands of half-Orcs born of human women raped by Orcs. They ride on hogs and patrol the borders of the badlands where horrible creatures lurk. They're like a motorcycle gang, tough, strong, foul-mouthed, funny and sarcastic by turns, but they always manage to hold back the baddies from the border and get little thanks for it from the human settlers they're protecting. Check 'em out at your local library or bookstore.
Maybe there are just a lot of orcs , because they are corrupted elves they have a long life.
I feel like Tolkien is too black and white with good and evil. I think he ignores the banal evil of the average person. The average person isn’t purely good or evil and are filled with love and hate. There’s ignorant people who just live their lives but don’t hurt others.
Are Orcs immortal? (Assuming they aren’t killed by violence.)
Maybe there's different breeds of Orc. The first were descended from Elves, so they were likely immortal, but perhaps later orcs, like Saruman's Orc-men, were mortal the way men are, having descended from Men.
No, they are not. But one of the theories to explain particularly long-lived orcs was that they were Maiar that took the form of Orcs so they would be immortal.
Wait... does that mean there are female orcs?
I think he touched on that a while back, with the short answer being "Probably, but Tolkien didn't like thinking about it." Which is fair to him, given how Orc bloodlines get their start.
Yes it does. They reproduced like the other incarnates did.
Live laugh love