The thing people don’t understand about volume, is that volume accumulates over time, and it only counts if you are progressing. 2 years of consistent progressive strength will accumulate hundreds of thousands of effective reps. THAT volume is millions of times more effective than worrying about maximizing your acute volume within a single session. Especially if you’re constantly plateauing, injuring yourself, program hopping, or developing tendinitis like I experienced trying to do the average high volume bro approach
The best analogy for progressive overload is the soldier and the rifle. As a lifter, you are a soldier and progressive overload is your rifle. The bullets you fire from that rifle are like the individual variables that result in progressive overload (volume, frequency, technique, intensity techniques etc) And you wanna fire as few rounds from that rifle as possible in order to keep fighting in the lifting game, just like a soldier wouldnt want to use up all his ammo at once, you dont want to use up all the variables available to you in your training that can result in progressive overload at once. Use one at a time and keep those gains steady
The best part of this message was covered halfway through, " if you enjoy training", that's it, the rest is going to be fun. You'll make mistakes but you will jump on top of that shit tomorrow and make up for it, you won't be able to help yourself
I don't know how the fuck people can have these 5-day body parts splits and expect to do compound lifts and have it all be separated. Let's take for example a deadlift that works every muscle in the body. How do you put that into a split? Also barbell rows or dips they work so many muscles. A lot of that's why it's so much easier to work the body as a whole. Have the whole body work as a system and recover together then trying to do back and find your lower back is too sore and all this sort of thing.
That's about what I do, only 4-5 hard sets per compound per week and with overlap it comes to around 9 sets per muscle group. So Sunday 4-5 deadlifts and pull-ups, Tuesday 4-5 overhead press, Wednesday 4-5 back squats, Friday 4-5 bench presses supersetted with 4-5 inverse rows. There's accessory work scattered throughout that's done after each compound is done but I aim more for 40 reps total on each than a certain number sets. Currently I usually jump an average of 5 pounds in additional load each week.
That's what I've been doing and it's working great. One advantage is you still have energy in your workout to go hard on your accessory lifts. For example, I've been blowing up my biceps because I can actually go to serious intensity on barbell curl after my compounds.
9-12 is more like optimal, considering latest studies. 1-5 is low volume. And you can still have significant results with that volume, once again that what latest studies say. It probably wouldn't be optimal, but could be enough to see gainz.
This has been my secret for my gains 😅 Everyone is different but I do a lot better with low volume and lots of rest. Often I'll do 3-5 sets per exercise in a workout and people have asked me if I'm juiced lol
Very nice! I used to do 5 days a week and wandered why I platued 💯 Now I use my soreness and knots as an indicator wether I'm still healing or not and rest as long as required (4 days on average, 10 days all time max) This has resulted in more gains in the past 4 months than the previous 2 years! Everyone gives me the "Are you on gear?" compliments too, and I love it! 💪
8 - 12 sets for bigger muscles like chest,back, quads and 5 - 10 for smaller muscle groups like bis, tris, calves, rear delts, side delts etc is plently imo. My upper back and lats can handle a little more but thats just for me personally. Just because you CAN do 20 sets doesn't mean you always should.
"8 - 12 sets for bigger muscles like chest,back, quads and 5 - 10 for smaller muscle groups like bis, tris, calves, rear delts, side delts etc is plently" .... are you saying per week?
I follow one of those MS shitty routines when I started lifting in 2017 and spun my wheels for nearly the next 3 years.. my fault for not doing more research.
From my experience: - stopped going to gym and bought pullup bar and dip bar for home - all I do is weighted dips + skullcrushers and weighted pullups. I added bulgarian split squats and leg raises. - About 30 min workout (supersetting skullcrushers and pullups) - got better gains on mass than in 15 years in gym doing way more volume... My tip: add weight in babysteps...+1kg every 3 weeks to your weighted calisthenics. I am at +30 jg dips
@@joojotin still do it to this day. - Every other day (48 hours rest for the muscles) - 4 sets x 6 reps. That is the holy grail. 1,5 min rest in between. 4th set is hard. Don't do bs 10+ reps. Search myofibrillar muscle growth (6-8 reps) and sacroplasmic growth (9-15+ reps) and you see why. Muscle mass without explosiveness. If you can do more than 8 reps in first set increase weight in next session by a babystep +1 kg/2lb. Again: Always, always stick to 4x6. I have the training method from this guys video: ruclips.net/video/AeB4znuGuSo/видео.html He can dip +190kg btw.
@@ihatescamo 0-2 reps in reserve on first 3. Last one I do dropset and myoreps. So dropping weight, then 10 sec rest then go again as much as I can do then 10 sec rest again etc...2-3 times to absolute failure. Training to failure is crucial and my goal
The wheel has already been invented. Basic full body 2 to 3 times per week. 3 to 6 compound exercises max. Cycle between 20 rep breathing squat style, 3 sets of 8 to 12, and 5 x 5. The 8 hour arm workout comes from the pre-steroid era. I don't know how Piana did it? The OGs would ingest some form of protein at least every hour. Some every half hour in an effort to saturate the blood w/ amino acids. They didn't work to annihilate the muscle, but to get and keep a pump. The idea was to push as much amino acid rich blood into the muscle as they could, and keep it there as long as they could. They felt this would speed growth. This method was often done w/ arms, but I've seen it done w/ other body parts also. I've also so seen it done for 10 and 12 hours.
Love this channel, but my best growth I've received was when I did my highest volume and eating a ton of food. I do hard training, and 20 sets for some muscle groups seems sorta low per week. Low rep training I think is important not necessarily low volume. But do whatever works for you. Great video John, you look like a beast so obviously it's worked for you in any case
@@Madchris8828 Yeah, IF you have tried everything else then its safe to say that what you are doing works for you well. I wish the individual range wasnt so big but fortunately most people get better results with less volume and can always inccease if plateaus happen.
Hey man, idk if you'll see this but I've been stressing out about my training recently because I'm in college and will start to have to work full time as well in a few weeks. I'm probably going to have to cut my volume in 3, basically doing 4 sets of bench (and variations, weighted dip, etc) a week for chest spread out into two sessions (two sets monday two sets thursday), 4 sets biceps, triceps, etc. You think if i work on getting stronger with those 4 sets I'll still see growth? Mentally I took a hit pretty hard, needing someone to gaslight me into thinking that I'll still progress as usual 😂
Hey man! I had a period like that as well. I went to college, had an internship, worked, worked out, and still had homework lol. Just keep on the grind :) I would say the question depends on how long have you been working out? You can still see gains with very low volume but it will just be slower than typical. Worst case scenario is you mostly maintain during this period of time. You can always try to modify your workouts to something like Jeff Nippards Essentials which are 45 minute sessions.
I think a beginner getting newbie gains should do lower intensity and learn the exercises. Once they know what they are doing and things start to get more intense, drop some volume, gradually. Even for more advanced, when shredding do more isolation exercises and volume, when bulking gradually go harder, more compound movements and less volume, but do it gradual too
I dunno. Generally I don't change the program if I am trying to lose weight or not. Many people just keep it the same. I'm not sure if it makes a difference or not.
Everybody has a different volume needs, they might ven change throught the training carrier. 9-12 sets is waaay too much for me at the moment, I do 6 sets for main body parts and 4-5 sets for other body parts.
good videos man i agreed with alot but how can you do romanian deadlifts on the b day and then heavy deadlift of the ground on friday i could never do that lol i get sore af from romanian deadlift
Do you know any big, potentially natural, bodybuilders who cliam they train mostly HIT? I see people like the style of training but I don't know someone who has gotten good results from it.
![Kodak Black - Versatile 4 [Official Video]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/VcP_1Ua__vY/mqdefault.jpg)
The thing people don’t understand about volume, is that volume accumulates over time, and it only counts if you are progressing. 2 years of consistent progressive strength will accumulate hundreds of thousands of effective reps. THAT volume is millions of times more effective than worrying about maximizing your acute volume within a single session. Especially if you’re constantly plateauing, injuring yourself, program hopping, or developing tendinitis like I experienced trying to do the average high volume bro approach
The best analogy for progressive overload is the soldier and the rifle. As a lifter, you are a soldier and progressive overload is your rifle. The bullets you fire from that rifle are like the individual variables that result in progressive overload (volume, frequency, technique, intensity techniques etc) And you wanna fire as few rounds from that rifle as possible in order to keep fighting in the lifting game, just like a soldier wouldnt want to use up all his ammo at once, you dont want to use up all the variables available to you in your training that can result in progressive overload at once. Use one at a time and keep those gains steady
Love it
Good Stuff!! Lady subscriber here. I only train 2-3x week and have gotten much bigger doing so. So I totally agree.
Great to hear 😊
The best part of this message was covered halfway through, " if you enjoy training", that's it, the rest is going to be fun. You'll make mistakes but you will jump on top of that shit tomorrow and make up for it, you won't be able to help yourself
I don't know how the fuck people can have these 5-day body parts splits and expect to do compound lifts and have it all be separated. Let's take for example a deadlift that works every muscle in the body. How do you put that into a split? Also barbell rows or dips they work so many muscles. A lot of that's why it's so much easier to work the body as a whole. Have the whole body work as a system and recover together then trying to do back and find your lower back is too sore and all this sort of thing.
That's about what I do, only 4-5 hard sets per compound per week and with overlap it comes to around 9 sets per muscle group. So Sunday 4-5 deadlifts and pull-ups, Tuesday 4-5 overhead press, Wednesday 4-5 back squats, Friday 4-5 bench presses supersetted with 4-5 inverse rows. There's accessory work scattered throughout that's done after each compound is done but I aim more for 40 reps total on each than a certain number sets. Currently I usually jump an average of 5 pounds in additional load each week.
How old are you if you don’t mind me asking?
That's what I've been doing and it's working great. One advantage is you still have energy in your workout to go hard on your accessory lifts. For example, I've been blowing up my biceps because I can actually go to serious intensity on barbell curl after my compounds.
Hommie, 9-12 sets ain't low volume, that's moderate volume.
What's your version of low?
Might be, but for most people that would be considered low
9-12 is more like optimal, considering latest studies. 1-5 is low volume. And you can still have significant results with that volume, once again that what latest studies say. It probably wouldn't be optimal, but could be enough to see gainz.
@@john-atallahfor actual low-volume training see Stuart McRobert’s book Brawn.
Do you guys allocate 9-12 sets for legs entirely (quads + hams) or 9-12 sets per muscle group (quads 9 sets, hams 9 sets)?
This has been my secret for my gains 😅 Everyone is different but I do a lot better with low volume and lots of rest. Often I'll do 3-5 sets per exercise in a workout and people have asked me if I'm juiced lol
Very nice! I used to do 5 days a week and wandered why I platued 💯
Now I use my soreness and knots as an indicator wether I'm still healing or not and rest as long as required (4 days on average, 10 days all time max)
This has resulted in more gains in the past 4 months than the previous 2 years!
Everyone gives me the "Are you on gear?" compliments too, and I love it! 💪
Can you share your complete program with us?
Workout please?
Guess they're not sharing
8 - 12 sets for bigger muscles like chest,back, quads and 5 - 10 for smaller muscle groups like bis, tris, calves, rear delts, side delts etc is plently imo. My upper back and lats can handle a little more but thats just for me personally. Just because you CAN do 20 sets doesn't mean you always should.
True words!
"8 - 12 sets for bigger muscles like chest,back, quads and 5 - 10 for smaller muscle groups like bis, tris, calves, rear delts, side delts etc is plently" .... are you saying per week?
@@NJN23 yep . Per week.
@@trainwithtaku thanks!
@@NJN23 no worries!
Drop everything to 2 sets and it's almost perfect
9-12 is moderate volume not low volume.
I follow one of those MS shitty routines when I started lifting in 2017 and spun my wheels for nearly the next 3 years.. my fault for not doing more research.
From my experience:
- stopped going to gym and bought pullup bar and dip bar for home
- all I do is weighted dips + skullcrushers and weighted pullups.
I added bulgarian split squats and leg raises.
- About 30 min workout (supersetting skullcrushers and pullups)
- got better gains on mass than in 15 years in gym doing way more volume...
My tip: add weight in babysteps...+1kg every 3 weeks to your weighted calisthenics. I am at +30 jg dips
That's awesome! Seems like the minimalist approach worked for you.
How much volume did you do and how frequently?
@@joojotin still do it to this day.
- Every other day (48 hours rest for the muscles)
- 4 sets x 6 reps. That is the holy grail.
1,5 min rest in between. 4th set is hard.
Don't do bs 10+ reps. Search myofibrillar muscle growth (6-8 reps) and sacroplasmic growth (9-15+ reps) and you see why. Muscle mass without explosiveness.
If you can do more than 8 reps in first set increase weight in next session by a babystep +1 kg/2lb.
Again: Always, always stick to 4x6.
I have the training method from this guys video:
ruclips.net/video/AeB4znuGuSo/видео.html
He can dip +190kg btw.
@@whoknows8223 so are you going to failure on every set?
@@ihatescamo 0-2 reps in reserve on first 3. Last one I do dropset and myoreps. So dropping weight, then 10 sec rest then go again as much as I can do then 10 sec rest again etc...2-3 times to absolute failure.
Training to failure is crucial and my goal
The wheel has already been invented. Basic full body 2 to 3 times per week. 3 to 6 compound exercises max. Cycle between 20 rep breathing squat style, 3 sets of 8 to 12, and 5 x 5. The 8 hour arm workout comes from the pre-steroid era. I don't know how Piana did it? The OGs would ingest some form of protein at least every hour. Some every half hour in an effort to saturate the blood w/ amino acids. They didn't work to annihilate the muscle, but to get and keep a pump. The idea was to push as much amino acid rich blood into the muscle as they could, and keep it there as long as they could. They felt this would speed growth. This method was often done w/ arms, but I've seen it done w/ other body parts also. I've also so seen it done for 10 and 12 hours.
Love this channel, but my best growth I've received was when I did my highest volume and eating a ton of food. I do hard training, and 20 sets for some muscle groups seems sorta low per week. Low rep training I think is important not necessarily low volume. But do whatever works for you. Great video John, you look like a beast so obviously it's worked for you in any case
Might be a "work horse" like GVS describes
@@john-atallah very possible. When I mention how many sets I do to friends or even other buddies at the gym they think I'm crazy 🤪 lol
I get better results with one set compared to 20 sets. If I always did 20 sets i wouldnt gain an inch of muscle.
@joojotin if that works for you than keep doing it. Im a weird outlier and it can be annoying
@@Madchris8828 Yeah, IF you have tried everything else then its safe to say that what you are doing works for you well.
I wish the individual range wasnt so big but fortunately most people get better results with less volume and can always inccease if plateaus happen.
Hey man, idk if you'll see this but I've been stressing out about my training recently because I'm in college and will start to have to work full time as well in a few weeks. I'm probably going to have to cut my volume in 3, basically doing 4 sets of bench (and variations, weighted dip, etc) a week for chest spread out into two sessions (two sets monday two sets thursday), 4 sets biceps, triceps, etc. You think if i work on getting stronger with those 4 sets I'll still see growth? Mentally I took a hit pretty hard, needing someone to gaslight me into thinking that I'll still progress as usual 😂
Hey man! I had a period like that as well. I went to college, had an internship, worked, worked out, and still had homework lol. Just keep on the grind :)
I would say the question depends on how long have you been working out? You can still see gains with very low volume but it will just be slower than typical. Worst case scenario is you mostly maintain during this period of time. You can always try to modify your workouts to something like Jeff Nippards Essentials which are 45 minute sessions.
Great video bro thanks!!
You bet
I think a beginner getting newbie gains should do lower intensity and learn the exercises. Once they know what they are doing and things start to get more intense, drop some volume, gradually. Even for more advanced, when shredding do more isolation exercises and volume, when bulking gradually go harder, more compound movements and less volume, but do it gradual too
I dunno. Generally I don't change the program if I am trying to lose weight or not. Many people just keep it the same. I'm not sure if it makes a difference or not.
Everybody has a different volume needs, they might ven change throught the training carrier. 9-12 sets is waaay too much for me at the moment, I do 6 sets for main body parts and 4-5 sets for other body parts.
That's awesome. Keep volume low until you need it 😊
I miss rich dude was hilarious and genuine surprisingly honest for a bodybuilder influencer at that time 😂
He really connected with 14 year old John for some reason lol
good videos man i agreed with alot but how can you do romanian deadlifts on the b day and then heavy deadlift of the ground on friday i could never do that lol i get sore af from romanian deadlift
Can always switch it to day one if it beats you up to much
From rdl i am sorry for days even when i do IT with deload methods lol
I've found the same tbh
💪
I come here to hear 6 sets a week. T T
Is total volume per week or total Volumen per Workout more important?
I would say both are important
Bring on the gain train.
And 3.) Rich Piana is dead.
Should've mentioned that one
So as Mike mentzer though
You look like 🇱🇧
Natural or not, HIT aka Mentzer and Yates is the way to go, but, you have to learn how to lift, you're not throwing weights.
Do you know any big, potentially natural, bodybuilders who cliam they train mostly HIT? I see people like the style of training but I don't know someone who has gotten good results from it.
No wonder hes dead
RIP Rich
Great video, dawg 💯
Much appreciated 👍