I work at a large big box store. Recently I noticed a new employee cutting pressure-treated lumber for a customer. I waited until the customer walked away and asked the employee why he wasn't wearing a dust mask. He told me that it wasn't brought up in his training. I poke to a supervisor and he was clueless about the issue but promised to put a box of masks by the saw. That never happened nor as far as I can find out is it company policy to wear one. I plan to press this issue with the safety committee but I'm pretty shocked there's no policy in place. Big companies are always spouting off on how important employee safety is but since they are self-insured I'm convinced they are only concerned with injuries and not health issues. I'll let you know how I make out.
Sadly no updates. Called the company hotline and got an 'oh my gosh we need to look into this' response. Knew it was dead in the water then. But I'll keep trying
I like the redwood pixie dust you find in HD, under the fake cedar/redwood decking. I would yell "FOUR" through the intercom before cutting a strapped bundle of this twisty stuff!
I know there are definitely some harsh chemical in construction, deep. What do you think about the old arsenic? Extremely toxic? Or only in very high concentrations?
@@TheHonestCarpenter Arsenic is present as an arsenate anion in treated lumber and is very toxic as are other arsenic compounds. Also they are water soluble so eventually they will go into ground water 🥺
@@deepsudeep True, but without good treatment methods and a growing middle class in many areas of the world, this is only going to accelerate deforestation.
I stain my fence. Stain is absorbed into the wood. Also, overtime stain fades, i.e. ages gracefully. You can also apply more stain without having to sand. Unlike paint that peels off and becomes eye sore...
Be especially careful if you do the "pallet builds." As a machinist, our metals were delivered on anti-rust treated wood pallets. Toxic if inhaled in a dust form, like sanding.
In my limited experience (building two decks and stairways), the difference between CCA and the newer ACQ formulas is as clear as night and day. I have a deck built in 1994 with CCA that is still in relatively good condition, but the two stairways I built with ACQ both demonstrated rotting treads within just a few years after construction. I replaced the treads on one stairway a couple of years ago with WRC, and am getting geared up to replace the treads on the other stairway this summer. Luckily the latter stairway isn't used much, since the rotting is getting to dangerous condition.
The most important public service announcement advanced carpenters or beginners need to see . This video reminds me of Ethans earlier input about what people "think" they know about pallet wood . Respect sent .
I've been a carpenter for almost two decades now, and I absolutely despise treated wood lumber. It is garbage white pine that's oftentimes(much more in recent years) twisted, cupped, crowned, high moisture content, or all of the above and is absolutely terrible to work with. Fortunately, I work in an area most of the time that is a dry climate, so I steer my clients away from it as much as possible and get some nice and strong, high quality doug fir. Not to mention the health ramifications that could come from the treatment to both my client and myself.
I believe it is SYP. Southern Yellow Pine that is almost all treated lumber. Even telephone poles are SYP, but treated with much better rot resistant chemicals.
I agree! In reality, it will probably cost you more down the road. You’re better off buying high-quality wood and adding a sealant/finish to protect it from rot.
Thank you so much for this comment. I'm a single homeowner who tries to do the best I can afford. I recently replaced my rickety back stairs with a new wood landing and stairs and used douglas fir for most of it, and cedar handrails. The very bottom piece that is partially underground was treated, but the rest is not. I used a stain/sealer and will reapply every year. Other than having to wait 24 hours for foot traffic, staining is so much easier than painting!
FWIW: I've used ACQ on my decks since 2006 (my house; my build). I dry the lumber after purchase for 9 months, then I treat and semi-transparent stain the boards (especially the cut ends!) before installation. 14 years later, the boards still look great. Did I mention I'm kinda nuts? :D
No more nuts than I am, I pretty much do the exact same thing . I've waited about seven to eight months before chemical cleaning all my pressure treated wood and then presealing it before I even cut and built. Even with all of these measures in place I still have about a 50 to 100% cull rate on today's timber. We have huge decks at our place that were constructed around 2000 that still look like new with pressure treated pine except for general expected wear. But a couple of decks that were built in 08 and 12 are pathetically, prematurely aging even though they're treated with an oil base sealant every 3 to 4 years. When contacting the retailer at The big box store the general help is in awe about the premature aging and does not know how to address the questions. More education at that level needs to be had to make the customers aware. Like the report says I always expected to get no less than 30 to 40 years out of a properly installed project built out of pt lumber. The properly informed customer from the retailer can make a decision to select the proper products for their project regardless of the price. If your project's going to fall apart and 8 to 12 years it doesn't make sense to go to that expense when it goes south on you that quick. Wear a deck builder could really get in trouble is using a composite product on the deck and steps and their substructure made from your general PT, go bad in eight to 12 years. A real expense loss then. There's no doubt that the public has to be properly and adequately informed about the safety of these products as any but the positive twist here for the contractor is he gets to come back and do it all again in about half to a third the time expected. Essentially more repeat business for them sooner.
I can personally attest to the resilience of CCA treated lumber. I dug some fence posts out of the ground a couple summers ago and the tags, still legible and stapled to the posts, were from the early 80's and the posts looked only slightly worn. This is in heavy clay damp Midwestern soil. Same for dimensional lumber. Newer stuff is not holding up to humidity near as well.
I built raised beds with ground contact PT Doug fir lumber. I am tearing them down now. They lasted 13 years, barely. In another raised bed, the 4x4 corner post has rotted about half away in 5 years. When tearing down my beds, I noticed that in areas where the wood was covered with heavy duty ground cloth so that the soil was not directly against it, the PT wood was still structurally sound, but in areas where it was directly exposed to the raised bed soil, the wood was deeply decayed. That convinced me that in my new beds, the entire inner surface needs to be covered with heavy-duty landscaping fabric. If my original beds had been thus covered, I think they would have gone 20 years easily.
Hey thanks Honest Carpenter for making this helpful video. I'm always impressed by your natural teaching ability and clear explanations. If you make more videos about construction hazards, I'd be interested in your thoughts about wood dust, potential hazards, and what precautions you take.
I helped my dad build a large deck out of CCA lumber over 30 years ago. I gave it a close look this past Thanksgiving and it is in surprisingly good shape. Meanwhile I know many other people with newer decks that are rotting out. It is a shame we can't still use this product for decking as it doesn't seem to really be all that bad.
Retired GC here, and I am actually in the process of adding tiers to my raised beds as I type (taking a break). I get all of my PTL from the HD, as I want the color to match when I stain it. I've known this for a long time as well, and as soon as I explain this to others on their videos, they are happy to hear it. The copper leach is something like 0.2%, waaay below the EPA acceptable level of 4%, so I consider my food organic. Those who scream this is not organic, are going to get far sicker from simply inhaling city air.
Just a thought about above ground gardening... Start with cheap pine and start small. Many people get tired of gardening long before the pine boards rot. Filling deep beds with quality compost is NOT free for most of us. Gardening is a skill learned through trial and error. If you fall in love with food growing, then you can increase your investment as your gardening and food storage skills improve.
I've been using ground contact treated wood in raised a bed garden for about 10 years. It's still in great shape. I have soil analysis done every spring and have never had a problem.
THANK YOU so much for this information! I was having failure of pressure treated wood posts I had put into the ground some 12 years ago. I thought I had done something wrong in my installation, but I was unaware I was using inferior pressure treated wood (even when I used "for ground contact") compared to the wood fences I built back in the 1980s. It's that the pressure treating of yester-year was actually better at resisting rot/deterioration than the stuff of 2008 pressure treating. So it was not so much of the way I installed it, it's just that the materials aren't of the same quality. Time to re-design my fencing methods!
I have 3 -6 x 6 posts that are marine grade treated with CCA and they are in great condition after 30 years in the ground holding up my arbor. I have about 24 fence boards rotting after 7 years with the new stuff.
Thanks for the video! I didn't know there's an above ground only and a ground contact type. I check my wood's label and realized I build my little storage bin out of above ground only wood...I guess I'll have to put it on some bricks so it doesn't contact any soil
I really like how informative your videos are, and now that got me thinking what kind of lumber and treatment they use where I live. Thanks for that, I have some research to do now
Just for an interesting contrast between materials being discussed and commercial-use treated lumber: I built a shade cloth frame from creosote-treated recycled utility pole cross members. I had previously used them as a garden border for at least ten years in direct contact with the ground with no sign of rot. The down side to using this treated lumber is it stinks and it rotted the shade cloth in about a year where it was in direct contact with the plastic cloth. I plan to line the upper surface of the wood with aluminum flashing and replace the cloth.
I had a 30 year old 8’ cedar split sapling fence replaced in my southern New England yard. It was really falling apart. The in-ground set fence posts were pressure treated 6x6s. Installed by a reputable fence company I am sure they were near state-of-the-art for the period. I was stunned to see the fence posts were in excellent condition including those portions that had been sitting in there ground all these years. The fence guys took these away...obviously eyeing them for repurposing on their own home projects. I have a rear deck with PT 5/4 decking and dimensional PT framing that has held up very well since 1995.
PT wood rot is perfectly fine. My 300 sq ft deck that was built in the late 80's has mostly rotted away, but is still safe. It just looks disgusting, that's all.
Lol well this answers my question. I live in a super moist area. Everything invariably needs replacement-- wood is natural and it just rots. Period so I decided to just go cedar since it's abundant in my area, cheap and easy to access. My roof is actually metal for that reason too, the moss accumulates like a boss. Treated lumber makes sense in certain applications but I just prefer the ease of simplicity and what's the point if I have to replace it so I will go with cedar Thanks for the video!
I just rebuilt my front stairs and replaced porch deck boards because being south facing, they get full sun and rain, and the painting is just not working. The porch was built with closed front stairs, and surrounded by lattice. It always drove me nuts that leaves would get under there and I couldn't get to them. But it wasn't until I tore down the old stairs that I saw the leaves that had collected under the stringers. Much of it had mulched into soil, but it definitely hastened the demise of the stringers and surrounding attached wood, despite it sitting on concrete. I rebuilt the stairs to be open, which means more will get under the porch, but I'm also working on a redesign of the lattice and the new project will be better for cleaning out underneath. I think if we think about such things, we can make things last longer. Next is replacing 6 x 6 posts that have rotted at the bottom. I priced them out yesterday at HD and I'm not seeing much that looks visually appealing.
There was a case of a couple who died from exposure to arsenic from cutting treated wood, because they built a whole house from treated wood and cut the wood even inside the house they kept going to the doctors for being sick but the couldn't understand why, till they died . I saw it in an old episode of mystery diagnosis long time ago. Back when arsenic was used .
I handled some today and it seemed very wet still. This of course, made the lumber weigh so much more and coated me with maroon (preservative?). It washed off me easily, might just write gloves and clothes off. You educated me and I'm grateful, thanx.
I didn't know there was a difference in treated lumber in regards to ground contact. I will have to pay closer attention to those small labels that fall off easily now. Thanks.
Replacing a number of deck boards (2x6s) and one joist, two other joists have some rot but can be repaired, treated, and sistered with a second shorter 2x8. The whole time I'm thinking, this deck is barely 7 yrs old and sealed/stained regularly. Of course all the bad spots are located where water is concentrated from the roof or furniture and the sun rarely shines. Water control / prevention is next step. Your video was very informative, thanks.
I salvaged some really old barnwood in 2003. I've left it stacked and covered in a field. It's gray and a little warped but I am really surprised that nothing ever tried to get in it to this day. I assumed at some point that nothing of nutritional value was left for bugs? I am guessing from local history the original structure was built in the 1920's.
As I understand it, the fungal organisms that cause wood decay all require some minimum level of moisture to live. If the moisture content of your salvaged wood has remained below some particular threshold -- I believe something in the 15-18% range -- then it should remain decay-free pretty much indefinitely. That said, wood is a hygroscopic material and will tend to reach the same average humidity level as its surroundings over time. If you live in a fairly dry climate, it's not too surprising that your covered barnwood hasn't degraded much. Take all that with a grain of salt, though. I'm not a biologist or a forester; I'm just another amateur carpenter on the internet. :)
I moved in my home 12 years ago and my deck looks like I had for twenty. My wife wanted it laid over with brown stain I Didn’t even have the chance to protest. now almost every board has to be replaced. Also , trying out gardening in a raised bed for the first time. Thanks for pointing out the details for looking at the label 🏷. Next time I’ll pay closer attention.
Built my deck out treated lumber back in 1980, it is still going strong. Had to replace one board which was questionable when I installed it. I don’t know what this has to say about it but it sure has been durable.
I don't know if you 'll see this but an old farmers method is to use motor oil (used for a darker stain & new for a brighter one) on the wood. It's cheap compared to buying treated wood as well as using paints & stains.
What fascinates me is how this is all a very important aspect of the conversation and thank you for taking the time but the environment is never part of the conversation. It fascinates me how still today the environment is never part of the conversation The cost of getting the lumber to us environmentally is a comparison that's extremely important to making the choice along with personal financial and health costs. How about a conversation about a cost to our community for the conservation or destruction of the environment in the processing of straight cedar boards compared to treated boards compared to composite boards?
Copper in wood... no wonder it's so dang expensive. No proof (scientific) that CCA is bad, but let's ban it anyway!! Came here as a DIYer trying to figure out what MCQ meant. It means real expensive wood!!! Nice video and look forward to the label vid. Also, was looking up lumber after watching your pallet video and how truly bad pallet wood is! Thanks and keep up the good work!!
Just tore down a deck that was built in the late 80’s-early 90’s. I was surprised how well it held up. Now I know why. Glad I didn’t burn it. It was an option, but we went with a dumpster instead.
I built a ground level deck with PT GC ( post 2004 wood ) wood from 84 lumber, it rotten out in less than 4 years . 84 folks told me they had a problem with that vendor/ supplier and they were sorry. I was out over $1,000 and my time . The deck was buit next to other PT lumber benches, fences, and such that are now 40 years old and perfect . The new PT wood techniques are really not very sustainable either way. Waist of time / $$/ environmental issues/etc.... It was replaced and stained/treated but if I have to replace the deck again, I will use concrete instead :) .
Thanks for the video. Very informative and helpful. And I think a video on those lumber tags would be really helpful. I had no idea that those tags contained that kind of info.
I want to add a 96 SQFT screened in porch to the back of my house. 6 ft wide x 16 ft long. I was going to use treated lumber, but now don’t know what to use. Kansas City, MO area. Will be supported by ledger board, plus 6 vertical 6x6 bolted to buried concrete pillars. Notches cut out of 6x6 to support 2x6 for both floor and roof. Thinking about coating boards with something after cutting to size, but before attaching. That way, all surfaces are covered.
I have old pressure treated wood porch and steps. They are in sore need of new pain. Can I pressure wash it? How can I safely prepare the wood for painting.
I aint no carpenter but I built a small 15sq/m (-+43sq/ft) deck in my backyard in 2008 with untreated timber and burnt it using the shou ban technique, then applied weather-proof polyurethane and now in 2021 I still cannot see any obvious damage to the deck. I might need to reapply a coat of poly though, just to cover some of the normal wear. I live in the middle of Europe, so we have dry-ish warm summers, and rainy autumns and below freezing winters. Great video bro!
I live in Australia and cca treated pine is sold here. I have a lot of fence Pailings I’m wanting to use for a garden bed. I just read up that if the vegetables are grown above ground like the fruit, there is no chemicals in it so it should be safe for tomatoes cucumbers and things like that. I’m wanting to know so I don’t make my family sick.
My sons foot went through 12 year old pressure treated deck board this summer. I replaced them all and expect no more than another dozen years to failure.
My neighbors keep burning pressure-treated and compressed wood and also there's kind of bored that have the foam stuff on them turn like a peach color foam and it looks like it's compressed down tight wood that looks like wood shavings the burning legs all of that kind of stuff and then I don't know if this is normal or not but the kind of wood they're burning which I know is a Scots to be pressure treated wood or not but does pressure treated wood give you a copper taste in your mouth and make you have a nosebleed over time and also doesn't it also give you very bad migraine like headaches and then make you feel so dizzy that you end up paralyzed for like an few minutes or so
the way does anybody here believe that somebody who is burning their own trash which they literally don't even have a trash company they State why would we want to trash company if we could just burn where they literally stated by the way and I quote we don't know obey by the law we can do whatever we want in the yeah me and my mother have been literally basically forced to stay inside the house and you know what the fire department where I live said oh yeah they're just cooking I'm sorry did you not see the f****** trash bag in the damn f****** burn barrel when you on our property and they literally stated they're just cooking we told them to put it out if they don't then whatever and yeah they still have not put it out
I’ve cut a crazy amount of the stuff, Smith (though not as much as you), and that includes pre-2003 lumber. I never got the dermal problems that it’s said to cause. Admittedly, I didn’t mask up as much as I should have 😬 But I’ve always felt we would have seen more ongoing class action suits if it was highly toxic...
A friend of mine built a big deck with wolmanized lumber back in the 1990's and didn't mask up. He was severely poisoned with arsenic and his skin was a mess for the rest of his life. He always regretted exposing himself and not masking up. Be aware.
I’ve been using CCA treated timber for 34 years. Extensive use for landscaping & general construction plus the highest available treatment for piles etc in coastal region. I have zero skin irritations, respiratory or any other ailments and have never heard of such or any problems with anyone else in or out of the industry. It’s complete and utter balderdash.
Excellent, most informative video. Question ... now that copper is used to treat woods, does this affect di-similar metals. If copper treated wood is placed against softer metals, such as aluminum, etc., does this treatment process increase propensity for electrolysis?
Yes, there are rules to this, KA! I’ll try to team up with a materials company soon so I can cover it all-it gets fairly complex with so many new products out there.
Even though acq lumber seems to eat aluminum flashing and electrogalvanized nails, I've had severe failures with deck boards and handrail components within 10 years of environmental exposure.
The biggest question is what to use to seal the wood and seal out moisture, that _doesn't_ need to be reapplied every year or two to maintain it protective qualities?
I have used Treated Lumber in my Raised Garden beds for 3 years now but have lined them with Plastic sheeting I have yet to have much problem and no clear rot yet
I got deck that been build in 1997. Replaced part after tree fell on it ~8 years ego. All boards been sealed with semi transparent stain/sealer 6 years ego. I plan to replace whole deck surface this winter since both 1997 and 2012 boards look equally bad by now. Stain/sealer I used was only good for 1-2 years. Guess going forward I’ll either splurge on composite decking, plan on replacing wood one every 6-8 years or re-seal it every year.
The Arsenic in ACB is lower than it is in peach pits which is the seeds own termite protection. I treat my 22 year old redwood porch with Watco Teak oil every year using old socks (over gloves) as applicator / wiper - on with the right hand, excess off with left hand. Just like the Karate Kid LOL - easy as no sanding is required just washing and let dry first. The annual re oil takes very little of this $40/gallon oil after the first application. The socks and oil pick up most of the "stains" and I change to a clean pair when they get too crudy.
Thanks for the video. I just had my family room drywall opened up to replace hollowed out wood plates/studs from major termite damage. They replaced it with treated wood 2 x 4s and had to do some sawing in the house to fit them into place. The drywall won't be close back up for another two weeks. The construction area is partitioned off fairly good with plastic sheets. Am OK sitting in my family room watching tv etc. with the exposed treated lumber if it's behind plastic? I'm not handling the wood or my face is not close to it. I'm just worried about the sawdust and any fumes that might not be 100% contained during the intervening time when the drywall is put back up. Thanks.
My back treated deck stairs are around 12 years old and they are starting to get bad cracks in them. We flipped the stair treads over with the hope of getting another 5 years out of the wood. I was putting clear wood seal on it each year and it seem to keep out the rot but did not keep it from cracking because of UV. I am now trying a transparent stain to hopeful cut down on the UV effect. I have a wood picnic table out in the yard that has treated wood that is over 15 years old. I paint it with Redwood Solid Color Oil-Latex Exterior Wood Stain and it has no cracks or rot. I did the same with my lake wood dock. Both look great. It looks like solid stain maybe the way to go to preserve wood the longest. What do you think?
Cu acts as a Fungicidal in CCA. As. the Insecticide and Cr. the cellulose fixing agent. The 2 replacement Products mentioned here do not have the insecticide As or the stuff - Cr. that binds it all to the wood cellulose. No wonder the 2 Substitutes don't last more than 10yrs at a stretch; aside from the leeched Cu into the marine environment. Heard of Acetylated Wood? (Accoya is a Trade name for it)
Thankyou for this video. We are building a large chicken coop out of “treated pine”. I hope this won’t adversely effect our chickens. The perches will be normal hardwood.
1345/74D/Corrections I agree with almost all of what you said. But one thing that I keep seeing over and over again is that when I go to the lumber store (I will with hold the name, for the sake of the store. Until I am sure of the cause) I keep trying to get good lumber and there higher quality wood still looks like it is only grade B-C at best. Almost all of it has mold already growing in it. I have to get the best I can find, take it home dry it and sand it down just to try and start to use it (I.E. losing about another 1/8" W/H/L). So I guess I'm trying to figure out is it just the way the wood is now, or is it just bad storage???
I'm still enjoying a 40 year old deck built from treated 2x6's. It must've been the good stuff. It wasn't even sealed or stained for about a 15 year stretch. I've sanded and flipped a few boards and replaced some rotted nails with screws. It will probably need some reinforcement at the ground contact points within the next couple of years. Other than that, I bet the deck will last another 20 years.
I could have written this same post. My deck was over 40 years old, and I flipped the floorboards over once and pressure washed later. Just replaced the flooring. The wood frame was really good so just shored it up some with posts. Problem is I have these old boards now. I was hoping I could use them for garden boxes since I would think the poison has all leached out but I'm not sure. Can't figure out how to get rid of these bad boys.
@@coffeebreaktude I don't know, if they are the thicker 2x6s maybe run them thru a planer and repurpose them? But that's probably not a good idea cause of any old nails that might be in the wood.
I helped my dad build a deck which he then expanded after they had a sunroom built onto their house. We already have boards that have rotted that I will have to replace next summer. So I think there's evidence, at least in Ohio's weather, that they don't hold up as well. The deck they built off their second story around 91/92 is still fine.
I agree that newer treated lumber products don’t hold up as well as older variants produced many years ago. I start losing treated boards on my deck to rot and fissures in the grain at 5-8 years depending on the degree of exposure to the sun and weather. I have yet to find a deck stain or paint product that extends board life more than a couple of years.
I live in Mobile Alabama and with our rain levels my pressure treated yellow lumber deck lasted 6 years with a annual Thompson treatment. It’s infuriating and with the price of lumber going up, soon it won’t be an option. I’ll have to go with concrete.
How does the anti-corrosion chemicals hold up if you cut a piece of pressure treated lumber. If you had a 12 ft 4x4 post and you cut it in half to make two posts that is that carry the same pressure treat protection that uncut lumber carries. TIA
I bought a new house near the coast in NC, and just after 4 short years when I went to sell the home, I had rotted deck boards? It seemed very premature for that extent of damage, and it was sad to see the rotted boards.
Sorry to hear that, Brian. Salt air and beach humidity can be especially hard on newer treated lumbers.😕 I lived down in Emerald Isle for a while and got a real sense of wood corrosion there.
@@TheHonestCarpenter so what would you suggest for treated wood in NC coastal areas for piers, pilings, whalers, etc. ? On a side note, my grandfather, long gone now, used to creosote the bottom of his fence posts (usually Hedge) and they are still standing strong today, keeping cattle in 100 years later.
Posts going into the ground should be wrapped with felt or coated with asphalt. Joists and stringers should be covered on the top edge with joist tape. All pt wood should be field treated with copper naphthenate especially horizontal deck boards and rails.
ive been getting skin irritation when cutting exotic woods like lacewood, zebra wood and bobinga wood. Not sure which one it is or if its something that is used to treat the hardwood. Leaves me with ezcema like rashes on the inside elbow and back of the knees. occasionally in my waste band
I just bought a shed and it’s supposed to have treated plywood floors, but the color of the plywood is very lite. Is it normal for treated lumber to look very lite in color?
I work at a large big box store. Recently I noticed a new employee cutting pressure-treated lumber for a customer. I waited until the customer walked away and asked the employee why he wasn't wearing a dust mask. He told me that it wasn't brought up in his training. I poke to a supervisor and he was clueless about the issue but promised to put a box of masks by the saw. That never happened nor as far as I can find out is it company policy to wear one. I plan to press this issue with the safety committee but I'm pretty shocked there's no policy in place. Big companies are always spouting off on how important employee safety is but since they are self-insured I'm convinced they are only concerned with injuries and not health issues. I'll let you know how I make out.
Any updates?
Sadly no updates. Called the company hotline and got an 'oh my gosh we need to look into this' response. Knew it was dead in the water then. But I'll keep trying
@@joeadams8975keep up the good work mate, people don't realise how bad this really is
Good job paying attention to this!!
I like the redwood pixie dust you find in HD, under the fake cedar/redwood decking. I would yell "FOUR" through the intercom before cutting a strapped bundle of this twisty stuff!
I am a chemist and it amazes me what the industry gets away with without studying the consequences
I know there are definitely some harsh chemical in construction, deep. What do you think about the old arsenic? Extremely toxic? Or only in very high concentrations?
@@TheHonestCarpenter Arsenic is present as an arsenate anion in treated lumber and is very toxic as are other arsenic compounds. Also they are water soluble so eventually they will go into ground water 🥺
@@deepsudeep One is reminded of high concentrations of formaldehyde used in the production of paneling .
@@deepsudeep True, but without good treatment methods and a growing middle class in many areas of the world, this is only going to accelerate deforestation.
@@GyprockGypsy there are always safer alternatives. Just needs research and public awareness.
I stain my fence. Stain is absorbed into the wood. Also, overtime stain fades, i.e. ages gracefully. You can also apply more stain without having to sand. Unlike paint that peels off and becomes eye sore...
Be especially careful if you do the "pallet builds." As a machinist, our metals were delivered on anti-rust treated wood pallets. Toxic if inhaled in a dust form, like sanding.
Too late 🤣 thanks for the new information though!
@@jadensamuelson Every ticky tacky cable house flip show just HAS to have a pallet headboard, and barn doors everywhere.
In my limited experience (building two decks and stairways), the difference between CCA and the newer ACQ formulas is as clear as night and day. I have a deck built in 1994 with CCA that is still in relatively good condition, but the two stairways I built with ACQ both demonstrated rotting treads within just a few years after construction. I replaced the treads on one stairway a couple of years ago with WRC, and am getting geared up to replace the treads on the other stairway this summer. Luckily the latter stairway isn't used much, since the rotting is getting to dangerous condition.
Similar experience. I stopped using treated wood about 5 years ago.
Isn't pressure treated wood necessary over concrete to prevent mold n mildew?
The most important public service announcement advanced carpenters or beginners need to see . This video reminds me of Ethans earlier input about what people "think" they know about pallet wood . Respect sent .
Thank you, Quantum! 😄
This is wonderful. People like you should be encouraged by governments to educate public.
I've been a carpenter for almost two decades now, and I absolutely despise treated wood lumber. It is garbage white pine that's oftentimes(much more in recent years) twisted, cupped, crowned, high moisture content, or all of the above and is absolutely terrible to work with. Fortunately, I work in an area most of the time that is a dry climate, so I steer my clients away from it as much as possible and get some nice and strong, high quality doug fir.
Not to mention the health ramifications that could come from the treatment to both my client and myself.
I believe it is SYP. Southern Yellow Pine that is almost all treated lumber. Even telephone poles are SYP, but treated with much better rot resistant chemicals.
I agree! In reality, it will probably cost you more down the road. You’re better off buying high-quality wood and adding a sealant/finish to protect it from rot.
so where can I buy untreated wood? I've looked online but no specifcations are listed.
Thank you so much for this comment. I'm a single homeowner who tries to do the best I can afford. I recently replaced my rickety back stairs with a new wood landing and stairs and used douglas fir for most of it, and cedar handrails. The very bottom piece that is partially underground was treated, but the rest is not. I used a stain/sealer and will reapply every year. Other than having to wait 24 hours for foot traffic, staining is so much easier than painting!
FWIW: I've used ACQ on my decks since 2006 (my house; my build). I dry the lumber after purchase for 9 months, then I treat and semi-transparent stain the boards (especially the cut ends!) before installation. 14 years later, the boards still look great. Did I mention I'm kinda nuts? :D
No more nuts than I am, I pretty much do the exact same thing . I've waited about seven to eight months before chemical cleaning all my pressure treated wood and then presealing it before I even cut and built. Even with all of these measures in place I still have about a 50 to 100% cull rate on today's timber. We have huge decks at our place that were constructed around 2000 that still look like new with pressure treated pine except for general expected wear. But a couple of decks that were built in 08 and 12 are pathetically, prematurely aging even though they're treated with an oil base sealant every 3 to 4 years. When contacting the retailer at The big box store the general help is in awe about the premature aging and does not know how to address the questions. More education at that level needs to be had to make the customers aware. Like the report says I always expected to get no less than 30 to 40 years out of a properly installed project built out of pt lumber. The properly informed customer from the retailer can make a decision to select the proper products for their project regardless of the price. If your project's going to fall apart and 8 to 12 years it doesn't make sense to go to that expense when it goes south on you that quick. Wear a deck builder could really get in trouble is using a composite product on the deck and steps and their substructure made from your general PT, go bad in eight to 12 years. A real expense loss then. There's no doubt that the public has to be properly and adequately informed about the safety of these products as any but the positive twist here for the contractor is he gets to come back and do it all again in about half to a third the time expected. Essentially more repeat business for them sooner.
That's a good and thorough protocol! TY 🙏
@@ronhumphrey5355
Summed up nicely.
I'm going to try that. thks
I can personally attest to the resilience of CCA treated lumber. I dug some fence posts out of the ground a couple summers ago and the tags, still legible and stapled to the posts, were from the early 80's and the posts looked only slightly worn. This is in heavy clay damp Midwestern soil. Same for dimensional lumber. Newer stuff is not holding up to humidity near as well.
I built raised beds with ground contact PT Doug fir lumber. I am tearing them down now. They lasted 13 years, barely. In another raised bed, the 4x4 corner post has rotted about half away in 5 years. When tearing down my beds, I noticed that in areas where the wood was covered with heavy duty ground cloth so that the soil was not directly against it, the PT wood was still structurally sound, but in areas where it was directly exposed to the raised bed soil, the wood was deeply decayed. That convinced me that in my new beds, the entire inner surface needs to be covered with heavy-duty landscaping fabric. If my original beds had been thus covered, I think they would have gone 20 years easily.
I put up a privacy fence and I've painted it with oil-based barn paint which has helped a lot.
Helped with what exactly? Lol
Hey thanks Honest Carpenter for making this helpful video. I'm always impressed by your natural teaching ability and clear explanations. If you make more videos about construction hazards, I'd be interested in your thoughts about wood dust, potential hazards, and what precautions you take.
Not only a great conversation starter, but your topic is thought provoking…thank you for sharing.
I helped my dad build a large deck out of CCA lumber over 30 years ago. I gave it a close look this past Thanksgiving and it is in surprisingly good shape. Meanwhile I know many other people with newer decks that are rotting out. It is a shame we can't still use this product for decking as it doesn't seem to really be all that bad.
You are correct, you will only get ten years at the most out of treated lumber now.
Retired GC here, and I am actually in the process of adding tiers to my raised beds as I type (taking a break). I get all of my PTL from the HD, as I want the color to match when I stain it. I've known this for a long time as well, and as soon as I explain this to others on their videos, they are happy to hear it. The copper leach is something like 0.2%, waaay below the EPA acceptable level of 4%, so I consider my food organic. Those who scream this is not organic, are going to get far sicker from simply inhaling city air.
Just a thought about above ground gardening... Start with cheap pine and start small. Many people get tired of gardening long before the pine boards rot. Filling deep beds with quality compost is NOT free for most of us. Gardening is a skill learned through trial and error. If you fall in love with food growing, then you can increase your investment as your gardening and food storage skills improve.
I've been using ground contact treated wood in raised a bed garden for about 10 years. It's still in great shape. I have soil analysis done every spring and have never had a problem.
Thanks for this. Do you line your raised beds with black plastic?
@@ginamac8136 I don't, actually.
Soil analysis pertaining to what?
THANK YOU so much for this information! I was having failure of pressure treated wood posts I had put into the ground some 12 years ago. I thought I had done something wrong in my installation, but I was unaware I was using inferior pressure treated wood (even when I used "for ground contact") compared to the wood fences I built back in the 1980s. It's that the pressure treating of yester-year was actually better at resisting rot/deterioration than the stuff of 2008 pressure treating. So it was not so much of the way I installed it, it's just that the materials aren't of the same quality. Time to re-design my fencing methods!
I have 3 -6 x 6 posts that are marine grade treated with CCA and they are in great condition after 30 years in the ground holding up my arbor. I have about 24 fence boards rotting after 7 years with the new stuff.
Thanks for the video! I didn't know there's an above ground only and a ground contact type. I check my wood's label and realized I build my little storage bin out of above ground only wood...I guess I'll have to put it on some bricks so it doesn't contact any soil
I really like how informative your videos are, and now that got me thinking what kind of lumber and treatment they use where I live. Thanks for that, I have some research to do now
You’re welcome, Fernando! Just pull those lumber stickers 🙂
@@TheHonestCarpenter Love your videos. Isn't most all lumber treated with chemicals? And therefore problematic at some level?
Have you made a video about reading lumber stickers yet?
Just for an interesting contrast between materials being discussed and commercial-use treated lumber: I built a shade cloth frame from creosote-treated recycled utility pole cross members. I had previously used them as a garden border for at least ten years in direct contact with the ground with no sign of rot. The down side to using this treated lumber is it stinks and it rotted the shade cloth in about a year where it was in direct contact with the plastic cloth. I plan to line the upper surface of the wood with aluminum flashing and replace the cloth.
I had a 30 year old 8’ cedar split sapling fence replaced in my southern New England yard. It was really falling apart. The in-ground set fence posts were pressure treated 6x6s. Installed by a reputable fence company I am sure they were near state-of-the-art for the period.
I was stunned to see the fence posts were in excellent condition including those portions that had been sitting in there ground all these years. The fence guys took these away...obviously eyeing them for repurposing on their own home projects. I have a rear deck with PT 5/4 decking and dimensional PT framing that has held up very well since 1995.
Yes, I put in a deck in 2006 and now in 2020, I have to replace it. Actually its had rotted spot for years.
PT wood rot is perfectly fine. My 300 sq ft deck that was built in the late 80's has mostly rotted away, but is still safe. It just looks disgusting, that's all.
Lol well this answers my question. I live in a super moist area. Everything invariably needs replacement-- wood is natural and it just rots. Period so I decided to just go cedar since it's abundant in my area, cheap and easy to access.
My roof is actually metal for that reason too, the moss accumulates like a boss.
Treated lumber makes sense in certain applications but I just prefer the ease of simplicity and what's the point if I have to replace it so I will go with cedar
Thanks for the video!
I just rebuilt my front stairs and replaced porch deck boards because being south facing, they get full sun and rain, and the painting is just not working. The porch was built with closed front stairs, and surrounded by lattice. It always drove me nuts that leaves would get under there and I couldn't get to them. But it wasn't until I tore down the old stairs that I saw the leaves that had collected under the stringers. Much of it had mulched into soil, but it definitely hastened the demise of the stringers and surrounding attached wood, despite it sitting on concrete. I rebuilt the stairs to be open, which means more will get under the porch, but I'm also working on a redesign of the lattice and the new project will be better for cleaning out underneath. I think if we think about such things, we can make things last longer. Next is replacing 6 x 6 posts that have rotted at the bottom. I priced them out yesterday at HD and I'm not seeing much that looks visually appealing.
There was a case of a couple who died from exposure to arsenic from cutting treated wood, because they built a whole house from treated wood and cut the wood even inside the house they kept going to the doctors for being sick but the couldn't understand why, till they died . I saw it in an old episode of mystery diagnosis long time ago. Back when arsenic was used .
I handled some today and it seemed very wet still. This of course, made the lumber weigh so much more and coated me with maroon (preservative?). It washed off me easily, might just write gloves and clothes off. You educated me and I'm grateful, thanx.
Great subject! I had no idea that copper was used now and was much less toxic! Thank you for all your videos, I enjoy watching and learning from them.
I didn't know there was a difference in treated lumber in regards to ground contact. I will have to pay closer attention to those small labels that fall off easily now. Thanks.
Replacing a number of deck boards (2x6s) and one joist, two other joists have some rot but can be repaired, treated, and sistered with a second shorter 2x8. The whole time I'm thinking, this deck is barely 7 yrs old and sealed/stained regularly. Of course all the bad spots are located where water is concentrated from the roof or furniture and the sun rarely shines. Water control / prevention is next step. Your video was very informative, thanks.
I am impressed with the amount of research you have done. Thank you for sharing.
Built my deck 9 years ago and it's starting to split and rot. I will have to replace it next spring.
I salvaged some really old barnwood in 2003. I've left it stacked and covered in a field. It's gray and a little warped but I am really surprised that nothing ever tried to get in it to this day. I assumed at some point that nothing of nutritional value was left for bugs? I am guessing from local history the original structure was built in the 1920's.
As I understand it, the fungal organisms that cause wood decay all require some minimum level of moisture to live. If the moisture content of your salvaged wood has remained below some particular threshold -- I believe something in the 15-18% range -- then it should remain decay-free pretty much indefinitely. That said, wood is a hygroscopic material and will tend to reach the same average humidity level as its surroundings over time. If you live in a fairly dry climate, it's not too surprising that your covered barnwood hasn't degraded much.
Take all that with a grain of salt, though. I'm not a biologist or a forester; I'm just another amateur carpenter on the internet. :)
Awesome video, Ethan! Love your channel. You always have great content.
Thank you, Bill! I appreciate the positive feedback :)
I moved in my home 12 years ago and my deck looks like I had for twenty. My wife wanted it laid over with brown stain I Didn’t even have the chance to protest. now almost every board has to be replaced. Also , trying out gardening in a raised bed for the first time.
Thanks for pointing out the details for looking at the label 🏷. Next time I’ll pay closer attention.
"Is treated wood bad for you?" ---- Depends how much you eat.
Built my deck out treated lumber back in 1980, it is still going strong. Had to replace one board which was questionable when I installed it. I don’t know what this has to say about it but it sure has been durable.
I bet it’s rotting and you need to replace it lol. Pressure treated decks are junk
Did you wear a mask?
this was very very helpful, thank u sir.
I don't know if you 'll see this but an old farmers method is to use motor oil (used for a darker stain & new for a brighter one) on the wood. It's cheap compared to buying treated wood as well as using paints & stains.
What fascinates me is how this is all a very important aspect of the conversation and thank you for taking the time but the environment is never part of the conversation. It fascinates me how still today the environment is never part of the conversation The cost of getting the lumber to us environmentally is a comparison that's extremely important to making the choice along with personal financial and health costs. How about a conversation about a cost to our community for the conservation or destruction of the environment in the processing of straight cedar boards compared to treated boards compared to composite boards?
Great balanced video, thank you!
Copper in wood... no wonder it's so dang expensive. No proof (scientific) that CCA is bad, but let's ban it anyway!! Came here as a DIYer trying to figure out what MCQ meant. It means real expensive wood!!! Nice video and look forward to the label vid. Also, was looking up lumber after watching your pallet video and how truly bad pallet wood is! Thanks and keep up the good work!!
Just tore down a deck that was built in the late 80’s-early 90’s. I was surprised how well it held up. Now I know why. Glad I didn’t burn it. It was an option, but we went with a dumpster instead.
I’ve torn down 30-year old decks that were solid! Just and incredible difference.
My deck boards only last about 5 years. They rot out around knot holes and the deck screws. I am constantly replacing some of them every year
I built a ground level deck with PT GC ( post 2004 wood ) wood from 84 lumber, it rotten out in less than 4 years . 84 folks told me they had a problem with that vendor/ supplier and they were sorry. I was out over $1,000 and my time . The deck was buit next to other PT lumber benches, fences, and such that are now 40 years old and perfect . The new PT wood techniques are really not very sustainable either way. Waist of time / $$/ environmental issues/etc.... It was replaced and stained/treated but if I have to replace the deck again, I will use concrete instead :) .
Thanks for the video. Very informative and helpful. And I think a video on those lumber tags would be really helpful. I had no idea that those tags contained that kind of info.
Thanks for watching, Clark!
This guy and Project Farm does a great job of digging for truth.
How about pressure treating them with linseed oil.
Thank God that natural mechanisms exist that can come clean up after man's unsightly messes.
I would agree with you. We get about 50% life of our treated lumber as of today.
I'm interested in knowing how you built those shelves in the back ground of your work shop.
He has used a french cleat system on the back of his shelf brackets
Just found your channel I'm so great full it's exactly what I've been looking for thank you for your clarity & honesty 🙏
I want to add a 96 SQFT screened in porch to the back of my house. 6 ft wide x 16 ft long. I was going to use treated lumber, but now don’t know what to use. Kansas City, MO area. Will be supported by ledger board, plus 6 vertical 6x6 bolted to buried concrete pillars. Notches cut out of 6x6 to support 2x6 for both floor and roof. Thinking about coating boards with something after cutting to size, but before attaching. That way, all surfaces are covered.
I have old pressure treated wood porch and steps. They are in sore need of new pain. Can I pressure wash it? How can I safely prepare the wood for painting.
I aint no carpenter but I built a small 15sq/m (-+43sq/ft) deck in my backyard in 2008 with untreated timber and burnt it using the shou ban technique, then applied weather-proof polyurethane and now in 2021 I still cannot see any obvious damage to the deck. I might need to reapply a coat of poly though, just to cover some of the normal wear. I live in the middle of Europe, so we have dry-ish warm summers, and rainy autumns and below freezing winters. Great video bro!
I live in Australia and cca treated pine is sold here. I have a lot of fence Pailings I’m wanting to use for a garden bed. I just read up that if the vegetables are grown above ground like the fruit, there is no chemicals in it so it should be safe for tomatoes cucumbers and things like that. I’m wanting to know so I don’t make my family sick.
Excellent content. Thanks so much.
My sons foot went through 12 year old pressure treated deck board this summer. I replaced them all and expect no more than another dozen years to failure.
My neighbors keep burning pressure-treated and compressed wood and also there's kind of bored that have the foam stuff on them turn like a peach color foam and it looks like it's compressed down tight wood that looks like wood shavings the burning legs all of that kind of stuff and then I don't know if this is normal or not but the kind of wood they're burning which I know is a Scots to be pressure treated wood or not but does pressure treated wood give you a copper taste in your mouth and make you have a nosebleed over time and also doesn't it also give you very bad migraine like headaches and then make you feel so dizzy that you end up paralyzed for like an few minutes or so
the way does anybody here believe that somebody who is burning their own trash which they literally don't even have a trash company they State why would we want to trash company if we could just burn where they literally stated by the way and I quote we don't know obey by the law we can do whatever we want in the yeah me and my mother have been literally basically forced to stay inside the house and you know what the fire department where I live said oh yeah they're just cooking I'm sorry did you not see the f****** trash bag in the damn f****** burn barrel when you on our property and they literally stated they're just cooking we told them to put it out if they don't then whatever and yeah they still have not put it out
Excellent video! I learned so much.
Long time ago I built lots of 100s of decks with treated lumber for 8 years .Im 71 years old now and I'm still alive and healthy.
I’ve cut a crazy amount of the stuff, Smith (though not as much as you), and that includes pre-2003 lumber. I never got the dermal problems that it’s said to cause. Admittedly, I didn’t mask up as much as I should have 😬 But I’ve always felt we would have seen more ongoing class action suits if it was highly toxic...
@@TheHonestCarpenter I never masked up baxk then either or now
I. dont understand how I'm still alive!
A friend of mine built a big deck with wolmanized lumber back in the 1990's and didn't mask up. He was severely poisoned with arsenic and his skin was a mess for the rest of his life. He always regretted exposing himself and not masking up. Be aware.
I’ve been using CCA treated timber for 34 years. Extensive use for landscaping & general construction plus the highest available treatment for piles etc in coastal region. I have zero skin irritations, respiratory or any other ailments and have never heard of such or any problems with anyone else in or out of the industry. It’s complete and utter balderdash.
Excellent, most informative video. Question ... now that copper is used to treat woods, does this affect di-similar metals. If copper treated wood is placed against softer metals, such as aluminum, etc., does this treatment process increase propensity for electrolysis?
Yes, there are rules to this, KA! I’ll try to team up with a materials company soon so I can cover it all-it gets fairly complex with so many new products out there.
Even though acq lumber seems to eat aluminum flashing and electrogalvanized nails, I've had severe failures with deck boards and handrail components within 10 years of environmental exposure.
Thanks for the video. As usual, very educational.
excellent research and info, thanks!
Thank you for making that fact very clear.
The biggest question is what to use to seal the wood and seal out moisture, that _doesn't_ need to be reapplied every year or two to maintain it protective qualities?
You mentioned that board used in aquatic applications are different. Can you explain what kind of treatment they have?
I have used Treated Lumber in my Raised Garden beds for 3 years now but have lined them with Plastic sheeting I have yet to have much problem and no clear rot yet
You're SO awesome, man. Thank you SO much for your incredible content!
Thank you, Sekrit!! 😄
Thanks for the information. This helps out quite a bit.
A redwood slat porch swing rots out purty quick in south Louisiana.
I don’t want to say too much....you are very correct ....I just ....you know.....use cedar
I got deck that been build in 1997. Replaced part after tree fell on it ~8 years ego. All boards been sealed with semi transparent stain/sealer 6 years ego.
I plan to replace whole deck surface this winter since both 1997 and 2012 boards look equally bad by now.
Stain/sealer I used was only good for 1-2 years. Guess going forward I’ll either splurge on composite decking, plan on replacing wood one every 6-8 years or re-seal it every year.
The Arsenic in ACB is lower than it is in peach pits which is the seeds own termite protection. I treat my 22 year old redwood porch with Watco Teak oil every year using old socks (over gloves) as applicator / wiper - on with the right hand, excess off with left hand. Just like the Karate Kid LOL - easy as no sanding is required just washing and let dry first. The annual re oil takes very little of this $40/gallon oil after the first application. The socks and oil pick up most of the "stains" and I change to a clean pair when they get too crudy.
Hi, It was good and to the point. I wish you mentioned fasteners too.
Thanks for the video. I just had my family room drywall opened up to replace hollowed out wood plates/studs from major termite damage. They replaced it with treated wood 2 x 4s and had to do some sawing in the house to fit them into place. The drywall won't be close back up for another two weeks. The construction area is partitioned off fairly good with plastic sheets. Am OK sitting in my family room watching tv etc. with the exposed treated lumber if it's behind plastic? I'm not handling the wood or my face is not close to it. I'm just worried about the sawdust and any fumes that might not be 100% contained during the intervening time when the drywall is put back up. Thanks.
My back treated deck stairs are around 12 years old and they are starting to get bad cracks in them. We flipped the stair treads over with the hope of getting another 5 years out of the wood. I was putting clear wood seal on it each year and it seem to keep out the rot but did not keep it from cracking because of UV. I am now trying a transparent stain to hopeful cut down on the UV effect. I have a wood picnic table out in the yard that has treated wood that is over 15 years old. I paint it with Redwood Solid Color Oil-Latex Exterior Wood Stain and it has no cracks or rot. I did the same with my lake wood dock. Both look great. It looks like solid stain maybe the way to go to preserve wood the longest. What do you think?
Use a water sealer it will help get more life out of those boards. 20 bucks a gallon of Thompson sealer will do wonders.
Our cca deck is 35 years old and no rot.. above or below ground.
Cu acts as a Fungicidal in CCA. As. the Insecticide and Cr. the cellulose fixing agent. The 2 replacement Products mentioned here do not have the insecticide As or the stuff - Cr. that binds it all to the wood cellulose. No wonder the 2 Substitutes don't last more than 10yrs at a stretch; aside from the leeched Cu into the marine environment. Heard of Acetylated Wood? (Accoya is a Trade name for it)
Thankyou for this video. We are building a large chicken coop out of “treated pine”. I hope this won’t adversely effect our chickens. The perches will be normal hardwood.
Cedar is a whole lot better alternative to that trust me it impervious to insects and wel weather best to oil seal it for weather purposes
If it's outside then the effect will be much less impactful than indoors, where particles can concentrate.
1345/74D/Corrections
I agree with almost all of what you said. But one thing that I keep seeing over and over again is that when I go to the lumber store (I will with hold the name, for the sake of the store. Until I am sure of the cause) I keep trying to get good lumber and there higher quality wood still looks like it is only grade B-C at best. Almost all of it has mold already growing in it. I have to get the best I can find, take it home dry it and sand it down just to try and start to use it (I.E. losing about another 1/8" W/H/L). So I guess I'm trying to figure out is it just the way the wood is now, or is it just bad storage???
Thank you - well explained and to the point!
Did I just see a deck board with a flat head screw in it 🤔 thanks for the knowledge, now all I have to do is memorize it and share it with the guys 👍
What screws
@@irenejellison8656 bro… rewatch till you see it
Who makes wooden tool boxes?
I'm still enjoying a 40 year old deck built from treated 2x6's. It must've been the good stuff. It wasn't even sealed or stained for about a 15 year stretch. I've sanded and flipped a few boards and replaced some rotted nails with screws. It will probably need some reinforcement at the ground contact points within the next couple of years. Other than that, I bet the deck will last another 20 years.
I could have written this same post. My deck was over 40 years old, and I flipped the floorboards over once and pressure washed later. Just replaced the flooring. The wood frame was really good so just shored it up some with posts. Problem is I have these old boards now. I was hoping I could use them for garden boxes since I would think the poison has all leached out but I'm not sure. Can't figure out how to get rid of these bad boys.
@@coffeebreaktude I don't know, if they are the thicker 2x6s maybe run them thru a planer and repurpose them? But that's probably not a good idea cause of any old nails that might be in the wood.
@@bgarr99 I like that idea. Thanks!!
I helped my dad build a deck which he then expanded after they had a sunroom built onto their house. We already have boards that have rotted that I will have to replace next summer. So I think there's evidence, at least in Ohio's weather, that they don't hold up as well. The deck they built off their second story around 91/92 is still fine.
I agree that newer treated lumber products don’t hold up as well as older variants produced many years ago. I start losing treated boards on my deck to rot and fissures in the grain at 5-8 years depending on the degree of exposure to the sun and weather. I have yet to find a deck stain or paint product that extends board life more than a couple of years.
I live in Mobile Alabama and with our rain levels my pressure treated yellow lumber deck lasted 6 years with a annual Thompson treatment. It’s infuriating and with the price of lumber going up, soon it won’t be an option. I’ll have to go with concrete.
That's nuts. Here in Florida is close but not as bad
How does the anti-corrosion chemicals hold up if you cut a piece of pressure treated lumber. If you had a 12 ft 4x4 post and you cut it in half to make two posts that is that carry the same pressure treat protection that uncut lumber carries. TIA
I bought a new house near the coast in NC, and just after 4 short years when I went to sell the home, I had rotted deck boards? It seemed very premature for that extent of damage, and it was sad to see the rotted boards.
Sorry to hear that, Brian. Salt air and beach humidity can be especially hard on newer treated lumbers.😕 I lived down in Emerald Isle for a while and got a real sense of wood corrosion there.
@@TheHonestCarpenter so what would you suggest for treated wood in NC coastal areas for piers, pilings, whalers, etc. ?
On a side note, my grandfather, long gone now, used to creosote the bottom of his fence posts (usually Hedge) and they are still standing strong today, keeping cattle in 100 years later.
The coast is different, it's just like that. Or near any salt water area. Stuff decays like 4 times faster
Posts going into the ground should be wrapped with felt or coated with asphalt. Joists and stringers should be covered on the top edge with joist tape. All pt wood should be field treated with copper naphthenate especially horizontal deck boards and rails.
Some great and healthful information! Thanks for all you do!
ive been getting skin irritation when cutting exotic woods like lacewood, zebra wood and bobinga wood. Not sure which one it is or if its something that is used to treat the hardwood. Leaves me with ezcema like rashes on the inside elbow and back of the knees. occasionally in my waste band
I just bought a shed and it’s supposed to have treated plywood floors, but the color of the plywood is very lite. Is it normal for treated lumber to look very lite in color?
What about framing lumber (fur)? Is that toxic?
Nope, that’s just kiln-dried natural lumber, Garlos. Shouldn’t be any chemicals in it. 👍
The Honest Carpenter thanks man. I’ve been digging your channel. Very informative