Rhythm Game Lessons: Scroll Speed
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- Опубликовано: 30 июн 2024
- Scroll speed is one of the most important aspects of rhythm games by far, so hopefully this video will give you some pointers on how to adjust accordingly!
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it only took him 2 years but he finally made this video
LOL I'm glad someone remembered about this.
The thing about some new players is that they don't want to experiment or find out, some people want to find first hand "what's the best thing for x game" or "what controller is the best for X thing", much of the competitive high-level aspects of a game rely on preferences, like yeah, some things are more consistent and reliable than others but if you can make it work, so be it.
Well for some things like non rythm games there are just known best things
Like whats the best sword or gun and stuff like that
@@RocketDCP yeah but usually they're the hardest to obtain and doesn't make sense asking right out starting. Any game is a personal journey.
@@prime98k4 true i never thought of that
I think they just simply want a cheap goal rather than going on their journey or smtg, assuming it's a new player asking that
For some reason I find myself can't react to faster speed and unable to read properly with lower speed, I'm not choosing a difficulty too far from my comfort zone either
I like high scroll speed because it means there is a physically bigger window for high judgment
found the o2jam player
@@lulzgaming I havent ever played o2jam
It is physically bigger but since it's going faster, it's the same in the end, but I understand the feeling
@@lulzgaming probably one of those funky friday nerds that get angry when you tell them fast scroll speed doesnt make them better/increase their accuracy
@@jayvan_ I mean, if you tried it first time, you will be worse. But scroll speed is a ladder, as times goes on you will be comfortable with higher scrolling speed.
another common issue i hear about is lower performing computers being stuck with low scroll speeds due to fps. raising speed can make the notes teleport and become unreadable, but lowering it can have the same issues you mentioned with low speed. as someone who dealt with this myself, it feels almost unfair on a competitive level due to being trapped on a speed you're not comfortable with.
So that's why high difficulty and dense maps in osu!mania become blurry for me... Someday I'll get a better computer. I genuinely think it might be holding me back. Sometimes I lose focus and my eyes have a hard time focusing. When the notes come down, before their image is a blurry version of it. I hear it's a problem in Taiko as well but I'm not well versed enough in that scene.
whoever says this is absolutely madcuzbad you can definitely reach 2 digit on a shit computer
@@nadavvvv if you're skilled enough then you can read notes on lower fps, but for a vast majority of players its just a blurry mess
@@BigFellaDj anyone can adjust to it if they play like this long enough
@@nadavvvv true
Completely agree with the thing about preference. The best scroll speed is the best scroll speed for you.
Etienne please carry on this series!!!!!!
funky friday motherfuckers realising that having a fast scroll speed doesn't automatically make you good at the game:
LMAO
Dumbass fnf players arguing what scroll speed is the best
Definitely makes you better tho
another common thing I notice is new players think "if I get used to really high speed then I'll be able to do denser patterns later"
not the case at all, I went from c890 to c650 last year, I can read so much better even on denser stuff
down to 630 now lol
They would actually be correct in thinking that to a certain extent. Unless you are using extremely big notes, anything below C800 will indeed hold your back in your improvement.
@@nikkkola99 low scroll speed better
I've always just been mentally slow, even on dense stuff. I've been playing rhythm games for over 5 years and I still prefer ar5 over ar10 in osu too, it's not just me being bad
it is true tho
It comes down to the players themselves actually, but I had the same case as you LOL (o!m: 28 to 26, Etterna: C950 to C850)
Meanwhile I'm here as an osu player where differing approach rates is a core aspect of the game and can be different between maps. It is interesting seeing how scroll speed is affected in other rhythm games tho, gives me a perspective on something I normally don't need to think about at all.
Thanks Etienne!
I personally use a box that covers the top of my bar so i can read better im sure there is a name for that but its genius.
Lane cover?
I just use the combo numbers
@@avee1210 lane cover yes!!
some games like IIDX have a green number to adjust how many frames of a note from top to bottom and that's very helpful in terms of adjusting hi-speed and lane cover
Also my scroll speed changes depending on the gamemode I´m playing, I´m primarily an osu mania 7k player and so I use a 22 set scroll speed to give me an easier time, But when I do go on to osu mania 4k I set my scroll speed to 27 as I´m comfortable with it. It varies.
This may be related to key/lane size. That's what I found at least
For me it’s the same notespeed. I’m mainly a 4K player who has some 7k scores and I mainly like note speed 31. It could be based on the skin you use? Not sure, or maybe it’s just preference.
@@kinuh I also have 31 scroll speed and it varies depending on the skin.
But I can't play with different skins at all.
I'm similar when it comes to DDR. My scroll speed for singles is a decent bit faster than for doubles.
usually depends on what hitpos+combopos+judgepos im using when i do scroll speed. tbh its very dynamic and depends on what you have
My scroll speed history. Stepmania ~2004-2007: quickly went up to c400, stayed there for some time, then went to c800. O2jam 2007-2009: most songs I played hx4, except if they were just too fast or slow. Osu std, 2011-mania released: quickly got used to ar8, slowly built up towards ar10. Osu mania, late 2012-now: before fixed speeds, I played 150 BPM at 15, and adjusted up or down for every 10 BPM difference. When fixed speeds were introduced, I settled on 28, until I switched to flashlight mod, and dropped my scroll speed to 14. Now I can't read high speeds in mania. But I can still handle like c1100 or so in sm/etterna (but only when playing windowed)
I raise my scroll speed high just bcoz the chart looks cooler with it
Love ur vids 🙌
I prefer lower scroll speeds (C555) with a lane cover because I can force myself to focus on a specific point while recognizing patterns easier.
EDIT: Spelling
yeah lane cover + slow speed is the shit
High speed scares me
I personally can’t use lane cover, it just makes me unable to read the notes as fast without it.
I've always gravitated towards slower scroll speeds, largely because if an object is moving too fast it blurs up and becomes really hard for my eyes to subconsciously track it. Back when I was at my peak grinding StepMania Index, I never set my default scroll speed above C600, and in K-Shoot/SDVX I currently play with a HI-SPEED setting of 200. When I started I definitely found it intimidating how fast everyone had their scroll speed in whatever game I was playing, and I definitely had to teach my younger self to not feel bad for not being able to play at a "pro" scroll speed.
nice, can't wait to apply that
Very well made
Last year I had to go through the fun of changing my comfort speed on ddr from 600 to 450 with bigger notes because I moved to an at home setup where my screen is both father away than and of a different aspect ratio.
what i do is when i feel like or when my scroll speed needs to go up because i know i have the skill for some charts but i cant read them, i just increase it to the point where it dont look too fast, but barley faster if that makes sense. Then ill just use that scroll speed for now and on until i run into the same issue
I changed my scroll speed in etterna from the default 400 to 600 and jesus the difference is noticeable. Doing much better, but still not great compared to most lol
yay a new video
I normally change depending on the skin like going from lane cover and small to big arrows and also depending on the hit error
I hate so many custom Beat Saber maps that would be totally playable but have such high scroll speeds that there’s no time to react.
As a slow reader, the inability for me to change note speed on Beat Saber drives me away lol
scroll speed is the most important aspect of rythm games,
taiko: bpm = scroll speed and you cant adjust it
He talks about taiko at the beginning
@@IN-pr3lw ik
I mean taiko is also a drum game- imagine a drum playing at a different bpm then a song. it won't work.
EDIT: In the swich games you can add a positive multiplier, so dence songs can work
Another element that has some warrant to be mentioned in deciding your scroll speed is visibility mods. This means Hidden, Sudden, ScreenCut, or a mixture of these mods. (Like Osu!Mania's FL mod hiding everything but the middle.)
On Etterna, I use HiddenOffset to cover exactly half of the screen, and so I only see the half that is further from the receptors. When half of the screen is covered, I need more precise adjustments to find an ideal speedmod that suits me. Too slow and you have the same clutter, but too fast is more punishing since you have less space to process the notes as they come in.
Along with using 60% or 70% note scale I have additional variables that influence how I decide on a scroll speed. Right now I use in the range of c1100-1150 to read optimally, but if I played without HiddenOffset then I would likely be playing around c1200-1250.
In the time between your first video essay, "what is true consistency", and now, I've picked up osu!mania, found the right scroll speed of 28, reached about 45k rank in it, quit, haven't played all too seriously in years, and am down to like 80-something thousand rank now. And I'm sure others have the same experience.
This is just a long-winded way of saying why did this take so long to become a video of yours, all in good fun of course. KEKW
When I got decent at osu!mania (I'm talking understanding how to use fundamentals and use which finger for which key) I noticed that I kept having terrible acc. Then I put the scroll speed to 20 and quite literally instantly now get near consistent 97% on anything below 2.7*. I recently beat a few maps that I'd been working on for quite a while. They were challenging for me so they weren't even 90% in a lot of cases, but scroll speed can really help!
Well thank you
I find that I use different scroll speeds for different styles and difficulties. I guess it all comes down to how dense something is. The more dense, the faster I set the speed. That same speed on like a 10-12 (Etterna standards) would seem too fast where as I can't see clear clusters of arrows making a pattern.
Me too, and I have been questioned a few times as to why I don’t just play one constant scroll speed per rhythm game lmfao
I found what my preferred scroll speed now but now that i learned that Experimenting with the Scroll speed too much would give a negative income kinda had my heart beating.
Since i did alot of tinkering.
I usually use big notes with fast note speed
Are there any good tutorials on learning how to read charts better?
No one likes this answer, but play more! It’s honestly the best advice from my personal experience
dont know any tutorials but here are some tips from experience:
play more but for direction
- mess around your scroll speed. you can find that neat sweet spot. other skins might also help as well as lane covers e.x FL, HD, FI for osu (if you like to play speed change gimmick charts in the long run, lane cover usage is not a great idea)
- dont brute force / keep grinding the same chart. while its ok for mastery of the chart you risk mindblocking and losing out on learing how to read other stuff
- (for non-4k) use random. if you keep getting new stuff, there's a ton of room to see new patterns. keep playing to develop reading for multiple things.
Most rhythm games gradually introduce new types of patterns as you climb chart difficulty. So as you keep practicing a particular difficulty range, you'll master its patterns, giving you a good foundation to learn even more tech when you advance. The upshot of all of this is, you don't need to worry too much - the game will match your ability to read tech and complex patterns as you get better at it.
@hobo I love the Metal Gear Rising: Revengeance reference there
I noticed for me that it depends on the skin I'm using. In mania I play at a scroll speed of 24-26 with the main large circle skin I use but using a bar skin I play at a speed of 26-28. With 7 key and above I hardly go above 26 but can go as low as 20 if it's a 10 key chart.
This is coming from someone who's beat a 2 star chart from every key count (not including those weird graveyarded 1-3 key and anything above 10 key)
Personal preferences is important.
My personal scroll speed is C950 found it after an hour of experimenting with etterna.
When a friend came over and played with my settings he said something's wrong with me
Is it bad i use xmod 3.0 on etterna
And dont change much on mania...
Im learning bms/mania style games after playing osu for 3 years so theres that
Me a Muse Dash player:
Scroll speed? Is that some kind of cheese?
I use 9 in clone hero, although I've tried 10 and might just switch to it!
Etienne, how can you change the scroll/note size in etterna?
cmods are cruise control for cool
This is how i play paradoxx on stepmania by changing the scroll speed until im comfortable by it
I've always been a fan of the "race pace" approach; like a race pace, your scroll speed should be about 70-90% as fast as you can read/play, at all out. Practice should be working up towards 100%, then backing down to go the distance.
The Scroll Speed Cuve
my scroll speed on Arcaea is 5.6 - 5.8, if im gonna try to sightread something, then its a 5.3 - 5.5
on another game called Malody, my speed is 12 - 14
finally
i go up in scroll speed as i warm up lol
I always play fast with scroll speed. It improves my reaction time
Bearing in mind, I'm a guitar hero player.
Before watching this video I didn't even know that you can change scroll speed and thought that the scroll speed changes depending on the song. I did recently start getting into rhythm games so I probably was not experienced enough to be in the know.
Taiko is like that, so it does not apply if you play that
@@R8Spike oh ok, although I dont play that; it was just more of an assumption from only playing like 3 rhythm games
Me still dont even know what my scroll speed is till this day
Currently I’m playing C1150 and 80% mini on a 23 inch screen (distant not overhead)
Do you ever talk about Arcaea? It's a SDVX clone but an amazing one.
I didn't even know you can change your scroll speed.....
I started with 25 scroll speed on osu mania but as I got much better I use 35 now and everyone calls me crazy
I was just messing around with Osu's scroll speed and managed to be better at the game at x20 speed
Update : 1 month has passed, i am now playing at 30x scroll speed
Update 2 : 10 months has passed and I found myself comfortable with using 31-32 scroll speed for 4k and 28 scroll speed for 7k
project sekai being on here caught me so off-guard
how do you change the speed btw im a begginer
and idk how
Go to settings, most rhythm games let you but some rhythm games don't
video about lane cover when
lets gooo
anyone got the outro song name ? nice video btw
Philanthrope & G Mills - Sand Castles
@@timed_ thank you mate
@@Iloveyusomuch yw
Ah so this is why all the GH/CH FCs I seen have "Hyperspeed" on anything that isn't DragonForce/Freedom Dive or any other fast song
it is just me im using bpm scale (scroll speed following the song bpm) in mania?
but how do i change it?
whats that game at 3:54?
I like high scroll speed because I like making people that watch me feel stupid
I use 25/30 speed on mania
From 25 to 30 there is a HUGE difference so ur comment makes no sense
@@burnchicken5734 not really, they could use 25 on sv charts that speed up and 30 on static scroll charts
Friday Night Funkin Fans: COMMIT ALL SCROLLS SPEEDS!!!
Context: Scroll speed is on the song,the creator is the one that decides it
What’s the game at 3:54
4:56 skin name?
"The Scroll Speed Cuve"? Is that misspelled?
No
You didn't talk about lane cover at all
I figured it was a bit too niche at first, but now that I look back, I think it would have been something neat/useful to mention. Noted!
DDR: 1200 or 300 pick you poison
Discord gang poggies
(hi smug)
yo
whats the skin at 1:18?
r skin 3.0 narrow: drive.google.com/file/d/11n5GFXb2FvWIuUa4pQZUF0yZUFKOB8py/view
how change the scroll speed?
Settings, some rhythm games won't let you
project sekai representation pog
Also if you feel that your scrollspeed is already perfect, but you still keep hitting early or late, you should try out methods to adjust your visual- or audio offset.
If you hit at the wrong time on easy wristjacks such as chordjacks, where you most likely time them by hearing, you should change your audio offset.
For most other stuff where you are most likely timing the hits by sight, you should adjust visual delay. In Etterna I would highly recommend moving the playfield, towards the incoming notes if you're hitting early, further away if you're hitting late.
I use speed 37 in osu mania and its perfect
Wtf?
Holy
What skin? i used to use 37 too but lowered it to 35. (i use an edited version of jakad's old 4k arrow skin)
damn, with 37 notes go near the speed of light lol... personally, i've been using 28 for months now and never changed it, it's perfect
37 gang
hehehe note go WHEEEEEEEEE
✅
Meanwhile phigros :
1:18 where is this clip from? I need that skin
r skin 3.0 narrow: drive.google.com/file/d/11n5GFXb2FvWIuUa4pQZUF0yZUFKOB8py/view
@@overcomplexification you're a legend
ADOFAI/Taiko(etc.) players : Yeah... nice video.
cant wait till osu adds scroll speed :)
it's kinda already in it, AR is osu's equivalent of scroll speed but it's set by mappers and not players
4:04 which game is this
Project sekai colorful stage
3:54 what is this game?
Sonolus or project sekai
Danny doesnt use scroll speed and hes good lol
is nonadjustable scroll speed (among other things) why mania is considered mediocre?
osu mania has adjustable scroll speed, f3 and f4 iirc
@@CumKitten09 ye i just opened the game yesterday and found out thanks for pointing it out. why else is mania deemed mediocre?
@@stanleychen2584 od varies between the songs but the rainbow 300 window doesn't, which makes it harder to compare scores overall
it gives virtually no reward for good ma unless you're going for leaderboard spots because the top 2 timing windows both give 100% accuracy. This kinda gets fixed with scorev2 but that's unranked and also adds combo scoring
the only rate mods are 0.75, 1 and 1.5x, which when moving up by 0.1 is a massive change on higher levels is pretty much meaningless because 99% of stuff will either be way too hard with dt or way too easy with ht
no separate leaderboards for the different key modes and a difficulty calculator that basically says nps=difficulty so to get higher on the leaderboards you'd need to learn 7k
from a stepmania player's perspective, lns svs and no snap colours makes the game bad
but in the end it really doesn't matter, people enjoy the game and it is the most popular vsrg right now with a ton of really good players so it's fine
What games is that 4:00
Project sekai colorful stage
@@xyphoes345 thankyou!
Annoying Orange
This is such a bad take "Don't use scroll speed as a method for reading patterns better outside of gimmick charts"
Huh???? You do know offset and lane cover options are available to accomdate scroll speed to read better. This is one of the PERFECT ways to LEARN to read patterns. It let's you dissect patterns on the spot.
Higher scroll speed is easily countered with high offset. It reduces clutter and you can adjust your timing to it.
Extremely applicable with 7k+
This video is for scroll speed in general, not for 4k only.
C650 gang
ñ
Ñ
i like faster scroll speeds
the notes are less stacked on each other and therefore easier to read
the only good scroll speed is 0x
I only play osu!standard why am I watching a video about scroll speed
AR
@@nadavvvv but AR isn't like scroll speed. every map has a different AR and mods change the AR (ez, ht, hr, dt) and you have to practice and get used to different note density with low AR and speed with high AR.
also your right to left name makes it really hard to reply
@@your_average_cultured_dude its literally the same as taiko tho which is scroll speed
69 comments :/