Tubeless Road Tyres, No Thanks!
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- Опубликовано: 30 июн 2023
- In this video:
Just my personal perspective on if it is worthwhile to switch a tubeless system.
Short answer… it’s not. 😅
Thank you for watching my video.
If you have any questions just ask in the comments and I will get back to you.
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Safe riding,
Reg. 
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Agreed.Tubeless only makes sense for MTB large volumn, low pressure setups. For road bikes it's pointless.
Agreed 👍🏻
Have you tired it? I've been running road tubeless for years. I have no intentions on going back to tubes.
@@DaveCM no
@@DanTuber Well, don't knock it until you've tried it.
@@DaveCM Rarely get a puncture with tubes so why switch? It's extra expense i don't need.
I'm not going tubeless either. Wasted 2 seconds of my life looking into it, that just caused me to pull my tubes in a little closer and hug them a little tighter. LOL FOOLS!
Thanks again for the great content.
Ha ha great comment 😆
exactly like everything that's marketed we should just spend our money on..
never had an issue with tubeless, i dont see what people issues are, its a bike like rim or discs, what ever works for you, guess i have just hit it lucky with the right tyre and wheel set up
While out riding the other week I saw this guy having a puncture, how did I know 🤔 well the spunk shot up over his back🤣 I shouted “now you know how your boyfriend feels “🤣 before of course offering my assistance, he laughed thankfully and said I’m gonna change back to inner tubes 😊
@@stephentait8734 issue is, mainly, that tubeless thecnology doesnt work with high pressure
Simplicyty is Divinity, and the TPU inners tick all the boxes for me, especially in the weight department.
Agreed! “Keep it simple stupid!” As they say. 😁👍🏻
I used to ride tubes until 2015 when I switched to tubeless. My experience is that when I had tubes, I was getting a puncture about once every 1000km on average. My first tubeless tyre was a bit rubbish but there wasn't a lot of choice back then. More recently I have found that the tubeless tyres, rims and sealant have become a better combined system. The last time I had puncture that required me to stop at the side of the road is 2018. What I can say is that I have substituted hassle at the roadside for hassle at home in the set up and maintenance. On balance, I prefer it this way.
So, what is your setup? I personally run tubeless with my gravel bike but tending to agree with Reg about TPUs for road wheels. Be interesting to hear more about your success story though.
Brother makes a good point. I’m glad it works for you and your lifestyle. 😊👍🏻
@@peterharrington8709 I am currently using Schwalbe Pro One TLE tyres and Silca Ultimate Tubless Sealant. It is a 2 part set up. 1st application you add the formula that contains the carbon strands and then subsequent top up applications is the latex fluid only to keep it liquid inside. Needs topped up 2/3 times a year. I just leave the dried up stuff inside the tyre. It seems to create a fairly even mess coated to the inside of the tyre, so don't see the point of cleaning it off until it is time to replace the tyre. My tyres do have little holes and slits in them, but the carbon/latex seems to be providing a good seal that holds pressure no worse than a new tyre. I run my tyres at around 70 psi.
@@hughjanus7354no it hasn't
I barely have punctures with tubes, every now n then i might have one.
Never ever tubeless come across my mind. All my 3 bikes runs comfortably with tubes. Only occasionally I need to pump the pressure before the ride. No messy sealant all over the bike, no worries of replacing expensive dried out sealant. Almost maintanance free 👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻
Excellent 👍🏻
Tubeless. Another way the bike industry wants to convince cyclists that they solve a problem that never existed in the first place, and with the added complexity that is added for it. If it is not broken, don't change it. (but let's not kid ourselves, their PR departments need to find "innovation" even in the expense of the actual user, i.e. cyclist.)
@@TheRimBrakeGuyexactly
@@TheRimBrakeGuy Let me guess, you're running a 10 speed with friction shifters because all this indexing crap the industry is pushing is too complicated and unnecessary? LOL.
🙄@@poxcr
Totally, totally, totally agree, tried the tubless system and hate it! Agree with all your points and just want mention that the tubeless tires alone can be a nightmare to mount, add that to the list!
Thanks
That’s very true, I can’t believe I missed that point. 😁👍🏻
I used tubeless for 2 years but have now gone back to tubes (RideNow). Your experience pretty much mirrors my own, but at least I tried...
Ha ha yes that’s true you did try. You get points for that. 👍🏻
😊
You just became my favorite bike mechanic on RUclips :). The amount of information and explanations is immense. I wasn't planning on going tubeless anyway, but now after this video i will never bother even thinking about it. TPU tubes will be the next i'll put on my wheels, currently running standard butyl with Conti GrandPrix tires (normal GPs, not 5000). Thanks a lot for your time invested in these videos where you really take your time explaining everything!
My pleasure! Glad you found it useful. Normally people complain I talk too much. 😆
@@reginaldscot165 Not just useful. Lifesaving! :)
i'm pretty lucky that cost doesn't influence my choice on this issue, however, I still agree with you, after using tubeless for several months on a new bike build there are numerous issues that, on a road bike, are just a complete pain in the arse...changing tyres being one significant issue. Ive been using the Tubolito tubes for a good few years now and absolutely love them, they feel great and I have had hardly any punctures... plus theyre so light I carry two spares around just in case.
Havent checked out the Ridenow tubes yet, will definitely watch your vid on those and have a look. cheers
Excellent, sounds like you are doing something that works well for you. 🙂
Safe happy riding! 👍🏻
Absolutely! Never go tubeless now that TPU tubes (and before that, latex tubes) are cheaply available on the market and lighter as a system….well done video!
Thank you 🙏🏻
I run Vittoria latex tubes with my GP5000s. Latex leaks like a sieve though and one must pump up tires before every ride, but I do that anyway. The performance is great.
Yes latex can be lovely 😊
I agree with you 110%. You made a strong case. I quit trying tubeless because almost every puncture I ever got never worked. You need a high pressure to ride a road bike and the sealant doesn't work to seal a puncture. The mess it made for me alone wasn't worth it. That shit goes everywhere. The industry wants you to use tubeless because it's more money for them. They actually screwed themselves for lying to me about tubeless because now I buy my tubes from China. 🤣🤣 I have a lot of tubeless valves and tape, special pump, etc., but I will never be tempted to do it again. I have been using TPU tubes this year so for and have yet to have a flat on the RideNow tubes. I bought a bundle which worked out to be a little over $7 US per tube. Good value in my book.
That’s awesome 👏🏻 all the best with the new tubes and safe riding! 🙂👍🏻
Sounds like you were doing something wrong. Oh well
Typical user error.....you dont NEED high pressure to ride a road bike! In a tubeless setup you need even less. Maybe you should have educated yourself before hand
@@66mikkim You should learn that condescending attitudes get frowned upon. I have more than 25 years with tubeless coming from a mountainbike backgraound. I used to set up tubeless when I had to cut innertubes to use the valve stem and we called it Getto tubeless. Road bikes are suppose to feel like road bikes not comfort bikes. I would never ride a road tire lower than 90psi. Not that long ago when I was on 23mm tires I used 120psi. If you use tubeless sealant and you ride in a group you should have to warn everyone so if the worst happens you don't get your mess all over other riders.
@@charlesmansplaining this just shows that you have no clue how modern Road bikes are set up tubeless. Like I stated in a other comment here, I ride over 25km a year, and haven't had a tubeless tire fail on me since going tubeless 4 years ago....
Thank you for sharing your experience and views it definitely puts things into another perspective. I've been thinking of buying a road bike for a while and I will keep this in mind. On my commuter bike I use a combination of tubeless ready tires and a inner tube didn't care about the tubeless feature I just chose them because they offer a good puncture protection with woven fabric in-between tyre walls.
Glad it was helpful! Thanks 😊
A tire once fell off the rim in my living room. Sealant everywhere. Since then I've been riding tubes again.
For me, tubeless and hookless are just dangerous ideas from the bicycle industry.
With normal tubeless tires I have the feeling that they bounce off tires faster than with a tube.
The tubeless tires on motorcycles are heavy and are not easy to install. The TPU solution for bicycles is definitely usable.
Agreed
I have always enjoyed repairing punctured tubes. I'm not saying changing a tube on the roadside is fun but I do like repairing tubes when I'm at home.😂
Glad to hear it. 😁👍🏻
Haha, me too!
If I was running narrow tyres at high pressures I would go with tubes. However these days I'm more interested in comfort than outright performance.
I'm running tubeless on my mountain and gravel bikes and would not go back to tubes. I run quite wide tyres at low pressures even for my road wheelset (34c at under 50psi). Was out for a ride a month ago and noticed there was a piece of wire sticking out of my back tyre. I pulled it out and it sealed within half a second. I don't carry tubes with me any more. I do carry shoestring plugs but have never needed them. Have only had one puncture which did not seal itself. That was a gash from a piece of metal that effectively destroyed the tyre.
Sure, for MTB or Low pressure it makes sense to me. 🙂👍🏻
There are 3 technological advances that were necessary for MTBs but are totally unnecessary and even counterproductive on road bikes. 1)Tubeless tires (eliminate pinch flats when running low pressure which is not at all an issue for road bikes) 2) disc brakes (great for improved braking in off road grimy, muddy conditions when the rim can get covered in mud, not an issue for road bikes) 3) Thru axles, will prevent a wheel from coming completely out of the dropout if the skewer were to open and the bike is airborne, like on a drop or jump, not an issue for road bikes. Each of these three things are not only unnecessary for road bikes, they have drawbacks with zero upside and should be avoided. Following closely behind these three are 1x drive trains and quick engagement rear hubs for road bikes.
Excellent comment 👍🏻👏🏻
Tubeless (on road) seems to work well for some and not for others. I've lost count the number of times I've got home to find sealant up my back and I just never knew I had even had a puncture during the ride, only ever had one that wouldn't seal on its own in 4 years but the tyre would have been a "walk home" even with tubes. If your rims aren't TLR and all you have is a low volume track pump to work with then its pretty big investment to find out, that probably isn't worth it. I'm not hookless though, that seems like one of those "works on paper" things rushed to market for all the wrong reasons.
So your back is slowly becoming waterproof! Nice. 😁👍🏻
Nothing better than being sprayed by Sealant in a group ride. For this alone i run tubes.
@@rothgartheviking858 I'll take sealant spray over having to wait or hold off so that rider can change a tube.
The determining factor is pressure and volume. Putting like 70+psi through skinny road tubeless tyres is really testing the limits of how fast sealant can coagulate. If you have quite large (by roadie standards) 36mm tyres, maybe because your roads are shit and/or mostly unsealed etc, you'll have a quite nice ride running them at like 35-50psi. At those pressures and often larger volumes it seems pretty successful for the gravel bike crowd.
Finaly someone speaking the truth!!! There is no reason at all to go tubless! It's just a massive pain in the A$$! AWESOME VIDEO btw!
Thank you very much. I try to be as honest and blunt as possible. 😎😁
Great video! I also tried tubeless and hated it. The cost was never a factor - but I tried due to the hype/trend surrounding tubeless. My issue that drove me back to tubes was the amount of dried sealant that collected on the tire and I also would get small seeps of watery/oily liquid on occasion. I never felt any advantage in speed or ride comfort and did experience sealant spraying out all over after picking up a very small hole (which I thought the sealant should have taken care of). I can leave my tubes in for a long time without messing with them but have to replenish sealant - no thanks. George Vargas is a great dude so glad to see you give him some credit.
Great comment, yes he’s very knowledgeable on many cycling subjects. 😁👍🏻
I whole heartedly agree! Screw tubeless. I just did a video about my choice of latex for me. Well done!
Thank you kindly! Safe riding! 🙂
Do any TPU tubes have removable valve cores so you could add sealant to the tubes?
Yes, the ones in my last video do🙂👍🏻
Great video, same experience, I am riding only latex tubes and good cotton tires from Veloflex, Wolpack and Challenge and maybe one flat per year, actually glass cut, not puncture, there is no tubeless that will seal that big cuts.
The feeling on cotton tires with latex tubes is far better that any tubeless I have tried.
Agreed and by the way that sounds like a great tyre and tube combination. 😍
Tubular still king for performance. The glue stays between the tire and the rim - even when flat. Cornering unmatched - so race tubs! Oh and you can ride a flat! Clinchers with tubes for training/commute - butyl for commutes - latex for fast rides. I think this works the best.
Agreed.
Tubular always and will always be the gold standard in performance and safety
Never tried tubeless and from experience riding in groups I never want to, from an explosion in a car (that took him a day to clean) to almost getting completely covered in bloody sealant when someone punctured (luckily I was a couple of riders back) so no thanks. BTW, for all the tubeless converts I will gladly take your old stock of inner tubes 😊
Ha ha, this chap gets it! Good plan. 😁👍🏻
Excellent summary. Presently, I have two bikes with one set-up tubeless and the other with latex tubes. For me the latex are way better in ride performance than the tubeless.
Tubeless like tubed are not immune from snagging a flat. However, when it comes to such situations the success of tubeless is all down to the size of the hole, the running tyre pressure and the quality and quantity of sealant on board all working in your favour. In the event your tubeless set-up fails though it is a major pain on the road-side to sort out.
Overall, I tend to feel a roadside hassle with a tubed wheel is way easier to deal with than a tubeless.
Excellent comment, thank you. 🙏🏻🙂
Major pain to sort out? It is the same as with a tube at that point, albeit the inside of tyre has some sealant on it.
I’m not willing to invest in a tubeless system but I have tried inner tube sealant which has worked for me flawlessly so far and I can’t really see the need to change as I’m not chasing marginal gains but just enjoy riding my bike.
Good point
One of the big reasons why I don't get roadies going tubeless is your although you're getting a "lighter weight setup", your spare kit gets significantly heavier.
Not only do you have a pump, a spare tube and tire levers, now you have to carry a plug, bacon strips, a small knife, potentially some more sealant too.
Inevitably, if you're really f*ed, you'll be getting a tube in anyway.
Also, for yearly maintenance, you'll now NEED to remove the tire, clean out the tire and then replace the sealant. Whereas with tubes, just top up the pressure and you're all sorted. Not to mention, there's ZERO risk of mess. On top of that, your home tools now need to have sealant remover, a shock pump to seat your tires, tubeless tape and valves.
Risk of punctures riding road compared to gravel or mtb are significantly lower. Not to mention due to higher pressures in skinnier tires, the tires are harder to seat and lose pressure quicker in the case of a puncture -- you'll need to pump more even if it's a minor puncture. Too spenny a setup for what you get out of it especially riding road.
Cost to benefit ratio for this choice just doesn't add up for me. For ref, I ride road/gravel with 38mm tires with tubes. No issues with setup so far.
Excellent points well made! 🙂👍🏻
I've had the experience of tubeless sealant spraying my bike, but that was on a mountain bike with relatively low pressure. That was an unusual occurrence because the sealant usually doesn't spray out of those tires. In fact, I have counted over 20 small punctures, all sealed on Schwalbe Knobby Nicks. But I have no intention of trying tubeless on my road bike based on other people's experience with those tires.
Thank you, safe riding. 🙂
I already decided for me that the „tubeless“ option is not mine - long before you published this video. The points are: lower rolling resistance with latex inner tubes, lower weight, easier mounting of the tyres and much much less fuss with maintenance. Once i put up a tyre/tube combo i can use it for years, only pumping up regularly, but i can leave it standing around for months without problems. This „tubeless“ thing is the same with this „discbrake“ thing: Plain bullshit for road racing bikes. Just inventions of a marketing industry that has been instructed to find ways to get more money out of cyclists wallets! I am still waiting for somebody to explain to me why techniques in cycling had to be replaced that were good enough for more than a hundred years. Possibly just to make more money? Because if you believe that you „need“ a disc brake bike now, you habe to ditch your rim brake bike, even if it is still good enough to do its job mor many more years to come. - Have you seen the pictures of these fully detached tyres from the rims of a rider (from Bahrain Victorious) in this year‘s edition of paris roubaix? Rims (and probably the frame) fully broken and done. Absolutely stupid and idiotic to change oit the good old tubular tyres for a tubeless solution.
I think you have the right attitude towards bikes and the bike industry in my opinion. 🙂👍🏻 Safe riding!
Me too.......I bought a set of Token Konax Pro tubeless ready, I took the sticky plastic and put cloth rim tape and a light inner tube with GP5000.
After finding out what a mess and pain tubeless can be, I opted for a no go.
Cool 👌🏻 🙂
Hello Social Tubeless Department, I need some guidance 🤣
You forgot to mention that you can run lower pressures with tubeless tires because you can't get pinch flats. That kind of defeat your argument about rigid sidewalls at 25:00 and your're supposed to get a more comfortable ride. At least that's what GCN&co claim. I've never run tubeless and probably never will (unlessl I'm forced to by companies no longer producing top tier tube type tires).
Well running low pressure would go against my personal needs, also I find latex and TUP extremely pinch flat resistant. Basically if it’s a pothole big enough to pinch my tyre then I should Bunney hop or I just lost my carbon rim! 😂
Thank you for the view! All the best! 👍🏻
Thanks to your video I have bought a TPU tube to try out. Tubeless seems crazy..even the pros seems to get plenty of punctures whilst using them.
Hope you like them! 😊👍🏻
I agree w you 100%, all your points, which are good and make sense, just reinforces my opinion that tubeless tires are not worth the hassles, thanks for the video.
Thank you. I appreciate the support. 👍🏻🙂
The high pressure required to make the tires "pop", is where the whole idea ends for me!
👍🏻
Hi Reginald. Good vid. Totally agree. Car wheels/tyres are both hookless and tubeless and very sucessful but they have a heavy/stiff bead around their rims (a bit like a non-folding clincher) and they require a deep well in the rim to help fit them. Bike tubeless tyres apear to be foldable (I've never had one so I rely on what I see on videos) so they do not have that safery feature. Car tyres start leaking around the rim after a salty cold winter corodes the aluminium (not an issue in the tropics I suppose).
The thing with hookless bike wheels and flexible tyre beads is that it is amazing that they ever stay on at all being as they rely on friction between the rim and tyre.
I must admit I had not thought of the antisocial aspect of spraying your pals with sealant. Surely that is reason enough for us ordinary mortals to avoid tubeless. Keep your friends better that way.
Yes and have you seen the machine they use to fit car tyres! Is had a mechanical turn table and a large wedge and a guy with a crowbar! 😁
@@reginaldscot165 Yes indeed, it is impressive. Imagine needing that for your puncture at the side of the road.
What are your thoughts on Tubular vs clincher?
Tubs are better for professional racing. Clincher are better for 99% of other riders. Just cheaper, easier.
I agree with your points. I live in Southern California. Where there is so much junk on the roads. Flats are a very frequent problem. About once a year, I hit something that ruins the tire, which no sealant is going to help with. But with a normal tire and tube, I can put in a boot, made from an old tire, a new tube, and get home. And hookless rims? Are you kidding me! I have been riding with the standard setup for 35 years, and like you, are very comfortable with it and see no reason to change. My titanium bike is 16 years old and still looks like new. How many carbon bike last 16 years and have 75,000+ miles on them. I don't jump on the latest trend or tech unless I can see a real benefit over my current setup.
Very true my friend! We are in good company. 😁 Titanium bikes forever! 👍🏻
Safe riding!
I think tubeless has more distinct advantages in the mtb and high volume tire gravel world. Much lower pressures mean the sealant is likely to work instead of just spraying and less chance to pinch flat. There are plenty of examples of mtb riders denting their rims and the tubeless tire beads still holding air. Regardless the same disadvantages still arise when the tire is slashed and no amount of sealant with plug the gash. In that case, tubes are your only option. I’ve been running butile tubes my whole life and never had issue. I’ve had maybe 4 flats total. 2 were pinch flats, one was a massive gash, and the other was a staple. You make a great case for the tpb tubes. I think I may have to pick a couple up and try them out for myself and see if I notice a difference. I’m not much afraid of getting a flat so the decrease in rolling resistance is quite enticing. Many tires nowadays on the gravel and mtb side of things are basically all tubeless compatible nowadays so it’s kind of impossible to get away from the weight. However for the most part riders in those disciplines seem to enjoy the advantages of a stiffer sidewall, as do I.
Yes I see the advantages in a MTB context for sure. 👍🏻
Oh definitely give TPU a try, even if you just use them as a backup. 🙂
I don’t know why the bicycle industry has over complicated
Itself.
I ride Continental
Gatorskins 23mm for close to 9 yrs.
with only two flats .
I’d. rather spend my time on the road rather than the side of the road.
Great video Reginald !
Yep me too, riding Gatorskins since 2010 only one puncture and slow one, only discovered the leak on next ride.
Same. And Gatorskins are pretty light too. Can't remember the last time I flatted.
That’s awesome 👏🏻 yes gators are some very reliable tyres. Takes a lot to kill them.
Tubeless isn't complicated so there is that.
I wish had your insight 2.5years ago, as I laboured through using tubeless, had 3 instances I had to call the other half to pick me up, because I just did not want to phaff around with sealant all over my hands, the shame of not being able to mount the tyre on the rim and finally wasting the CO2 canister trying to reseat the bead on the side of the road. Tubeless works for lower pressures but for road...........
Tubeless and hookless are just marketing strategy ideas. Manufacturers just want you to part with your cash, for the latest developments or the next big thing.
Unfortunately it seems to be the reason. Sorry you had a bad experience. 🙏🏻
I just ordered new rims. The bike shop (which took great care of me) suggested I go tubeless. I told them I'd wait. Now I might wait quite a while....thanks.
You are welcome 🙏🏻
I think both option work great, no big need to change one for the other. That being said, wider tires and lower psi gives more comfort with minimal performance loss. Any serious cyclist that rides 5+ hours a week would most likely be willing to sacrifice an hour of extra maintenance and an extra $50 for more comfort if they’re putting that much time on cycling so I don’t see that as a good argument. Any hole or puncture I’ve ever had that’s big enough for tubeless not to work, would probably also not work for a latex tube as the tube pokes out the tire and burst until the tire is fixed (other tubes may work, but latex is the fastest if you’re running tubes and are competitive cyclist). You also run the danger of pinch flats on installation with tubes, which can also lead to tire blowoffs 1/5/20 miles into a ride, I know multiple people this has happened to and crashed. Sure, this can happen with tubeless too, just saying this is a risk to both
Yes 🙂
Hello Scot, just found your channel. Thank you for the time and effort you put into cycling content. I'll stick with good old fashion tubes, however those new tubes your running have caught my eye-I'll give them a go.
Yeah check them out on my other video. Amazing product. Glad to have you as a viewer! 🙂👍🏻
Brilliant video, thanks.
Glad you enjoyed it! All the best.
Agreed. I run latex tubes. I like how they sound.
Yes, quite. 😁
Agree with you on the hookless rims. The rest not so much but "different stokes for different folks" I ride MTB, gravel and road. My MTB and gravel bikes are tubeless and for the last four years so is my road bike (hooked rims!!!) In four years, I've never had to put a tube in, never changed the rim tape. I carry a spare tube, extra sealant, a plug kit, CO2 and a pump. The spare tubes I used for my riding buddies but never myself. I've plugged my MTB and gravel bike tires often (2-3 times a year) and maybe once or twice my road bike in four years. Yes there is some preparation/work involved with tubeless but properly done it's at home and not on the road. You need to watch some of these MTBers, with a plug and CO2 at the ready they can plug a tire, air it up with CO2 and be back riding/racing in seconds (rim never comes off the bike). Actually I've never taken a rim off the bike out on a ride to fix a flat since going tubeless. Finally regarding the occasion squirt of sealant when you get a puncture well that is the same if put sealant in your tubes (as you mention in at about the 12 minute mark in the video). I recall washing my bike for the first time after going tubeless and on the back of the seat tube is a light coating of gunk and I realize it's sealant and I start laughing because I never knew to slow down much less stop. Before going tubeless I went thru about 4-6 tubes a year.
Good points of experience. 👍🏻
Appreciate this video. I tried tubeless and found it too much work and too expensive as pointed out in this video. I ride a touring bike decked out for the road and ride 38mm-42mm tires for comfort. Will purchase the RideNow tubes. Thank you.
Great choice, it’s an excellent upgrade! 😁👍🏻
Also suffered bad experience going tubeless just recently, that's why, I'm back again to inner tube! I will try the Latex or TPU to improve the rolling resistance. Still using the TLR tire until it wears out. Thanks for the info! GOD Bless!
Thank you kindly Sir! All the best. 🙏🏻
I've been thinking of at least trying tubeless for a long time. Watched the odd video on it. Thought it looked like more of a
hassle than what it's worth. Thanks for putting this one to bed mate. You showed us a lot of good reasons not to bother.
The big channels and companies will tell you that you'll turn into flash gordon if you use tubeless and hookless, but I'm sure like everything else in the world, it's all about dollars and not sense.
Besides that, I've bought the odd set of road tyres that were "tubeless ready" by mistake. You've nearly gotta be Arnold Schwarzenegger to get them on. Actually, I reckon all tyres have gotten tighter over the 5 or so years. I remember when tyres and tubes were easy to change....
Those were the days. Anyway, good job as always Reginald, we love your work
Thank you my friend I really appreciate that. 🙏🏻🙂
No idea what the hassle is. It takes me an extra 2min to run a wheel tubeless outside of initial tape(plenty of people use tubeless tape with tubes these days anyway). That's far better than all the time lost to running tubes and getting flats
@@lapisexilis2976 wow, you're an incredible detective!!!
@@veganpottertheveganYou don't get many flats if you put a decent amount of air in😂
@@veganpottertheveganyh, like most vegans, you don't waste time telling everyone🥱🥱
Excellent presentation.
Thank you so much 😊
Yes, tubeless needs maintenance. Just like everything else on a bike. Either I'm extremely lucky or they (tubeless) work. Brought my bike in for maintenance and the mechanic showed me 8 punctures in the tubeless tires. I never even knew it. That is 8 tubes at $10/USA and that is not cheap for all those tubes. Also, it is hot and humid where I live, and nothing drives more nuts in changing tubes (which I did for 30 years). Plus, some clinchers are extremely hard to take off and put back on. I have both systems. During the hot months, I will use tubeless. You bring up a lot of good points which are monetary base which makes all the sense in the world. I value the non-monetary value of not stopping in heat and changing tubes. Also, you brought up that if a tubeless tire is slashed it is over. I would say the same with tube tires. Pros and cons for each system and I would say that tubes have more pros. However, not dealing with flat tubes is just fantastic.
Good points 🙂👍🏻
Why wouldn't you patch your tubes?
@@barrytantlinger1033 I was also thinking the same.
@@barrytantlinger1033 Putting to many patches on a tube has caused wheel chatter to me on more than one occasion. That was caused by a wheel imbalance on light wheels. Not very much but noticable at speeds around 40 kph. Additionally, putting 8 patches on a tube seems silly to me. Just another point of failure on a performance bike.
@@barrytantlinger1033 One, latex tubes can't be patched. Never used a plastic tube. By the looks of it they are very expensive. Ignore the cost factor... Again, when it is hot/humid or cold/freezing I just don't want to deal with it. (I sweat really bad.) If you are cost sensitive that is fine go with tubes. To ME I don't like dealing with removing tires (and certain tires are extremely hard to remove, and you need to carry a tool just for that) as that take can a lot of time. And, if you are in a group ride everyone is standing around waiting for you and itching to go. I do group rides all the time and have dealt with several flats this year alone. The riders struggled to get the tire off the rim. Wasted 15-20 minutes dealing with that. Then the tube needs to be installed and hopefully the tube doesn't get pinched. If that occurs, you are down to patching. More time wasted. I do carry a patch kit with a spare tire. Just more time wasted and prayed the patch holds. Then what do you do when you get home? Replace the patch tube or keep riding on it? I assume you are riding with a steel frame and a threaded fork too. They have working on tubeless tires since the 1990's and now they work really well now cost beside the point.
I went from butyl to TPU. The cheapest weight upgrade ever and broke my PR on many occasions bcos of TPU. Btw how long do these TPU last?
Me too! Not sure, 8 months and counting! 😁
Excellent explanation of why road tubeless is utter insanity
Glad you liked it, makes my day! 😁
This is a really good video. Everything you said in the video is relevant to me; and I suspect also to most riders (who are unfortunately taken in by the marketing).
Thank you, nice comment. 🙏🏻🙂
The only people not better off running tubeless are people that live in areas with spotless roads without glass/goatheads, and possibly people that ride so little that their tires dryrot before they're 1/3 worn down
@veganpottertheveg Still being bitchy about strangers, i see
I run Marathon Plus tyres (not very light) and TPU tubes (light). Not the lightest but works for me.
Yes it’s a good balance, strong tyre and TPU. 👍🏻🙂
Tubeless on 28s. Zero Flats. Lower pressures for bad roads. No mess, just use Stans 2oz squeeze bottle through the valve stem = zero mess. Love my tubeless setup.
Cool 👍🏻
I'm running tubeless in the rear at 85psi and the front is a clincher with Conti Race 700x28 at 90 psi. I'm 90kg and I was getting some kind of flat almost weekly when I was running tubes on the rear!
Unlucky! 🫣
A pro tip about the Ridenow repair kit-
The patches are actually made from Ridenow inner tubes.
Im making my own patches from the same single tube for over a year now.
I believe they are cut from the 36g tubes. 🙂👍🏻
What about the glue?
@@zedtony8110 I'm using regular contact glue for it. Though I have to say that I find the simple adhesive patches from aliexpress to work even better and easier
I got back into biking after a couple of years break. Prior to this break, I rode a 1991 Trek 7000. Tubed, rim brakes. I went for a new bike when i started up again, I didn't go for what I had intended to...I always pictured getting a higher performance mountain bike. I went for a fixie/single speed. I've yet to own, or ride more than a few minutes really, anything with disc brakes, hydraulic brakes, or suspension.
I am so happy I went the route I did. I've seen vids of changing brake fluids, bleeding brakes, and dealing with tubeless systems.
To be frank, I don't want to deal with that stuff. I like the simplicity. Do hydraulic disc brakes stop better? Yes, but rim brakes have always stopped me just fine. Do tubeless tires perform better and more reliable when a flat occurs? Yes, but I often bike through the streets, 20+km daily, and have only had a flat twice in my life. I also have no issue ripping around an average of 30kph, and blow past most any other cyclist, including people with high end road bikes. I'm also losing weight, so I'm only going to get faster...my old tech bike is no slow poke.
Yes I feel the same, it’s all a lot of hassle for not much. I work in a bike shop and I do maintenance for people with that stuff and it’s a real pain to fix and so expensive! 🙁
@reginaldscot165 I also find road bikes look like crap with disc brakes. Disc's give mountain bikes and such a dirt bike look, especially with full suspension, but on a road bike, discs just remove that clean, sleek look
My setup runs 28mm and up only, @~65psi or lower per my weight, and so far I've gone thru tires from Specialized, Schwalbe and Goodyear for more than 2 yrs and 20000km on road. I'd like to say all the maintenance cost is true, but so as the result. I've only got puncture beyond fix once, and it turned out to be my rim got cracked jumping over a curb. And I ride 'recklessly' thru all the manhole covers, cracks on road, speed bumps, etc. IMHO if you use narrower tires, needed higher pressure or ride your bike less than twice a week, get TPU/latex setup. Otherwise, you may consider to accept the cost of maintenance at home/LBS for more trouble free rides on road.
Interesting points. 👍🏻
As someone who rides track bikes on the streets, I find tubes to be more convenient as im constantly running through rear tires. I constantly getting holes and rips in the tires that hold solid with tubes but would make the tire useless in a tubeless scenario
I always wonder that about fixed gear Riders. But surely a rip or bald spot wouldn’t seal? 🤔
Any comment on the incompatibility of certain inner tube types with rim brakes?
Most TPU tubes I've seen, and I'm not sure about latex, specify that they *must not* be used with a rim brake wheel. The reason for this is because the heat generated when braking can melt the inner tube, forcing you to go back to butyl.
I've never encountered any trouble with tubeless being incompatible with rim brakes.
The RideNow tubes say on the box hood for rim and disc 🙂👍🏻
I got mine very hot and so far no issues.
So the question for me is: At what size tire/pressure does tubeless become preferable over tubes? Is it @ 50 mm and 40 psi?
I’d say definitely over 40mm, for gravel or some such thing. I still use standard tubes in my 37mm gravel tyres and I don’t remember getting a flat while gravel riding?
I bought a Giant Defy which came set up tubeless 32mm. I was expecting a plush ride. I got a wooden ride. I tried pressures down to 50 psi. No material change that I could notice. I thought maybe it’s the Giant tyres. So I switched to 28mm Pirelli. Slightly better but not much. So disappointing. Then there’s the maintenance. You really need to add air for every ride. The sealant cost and maintenance is extra work. There is no weight saving. I haven’t punctured but haven’t ridden them a lot. You have to carry spare tubes, tyre plugs, tool to remove tubeless valves, tyre boots. I’m thinking of putting tubes back in. Those Pirellis were expensive…. So the promised gain in ride quality just doesn’t seem to exist. I almost feel deceived. A bit like buying a HD ready tv and discovering few HD channels without big subscriptions….
I feel for your situation. 🙏🏻
Old fogie here -two bikes -both clincher set ups -no big issues - carry those new Plastic inner Tubes - have repaired punctures before - do it very quickly and am off !
If I was racing or doing TT's maybe tubeless !
🙂👍🏻
Darn, I thought Drake rode bikes
Was highly interested to hear his perspective
Sorry he stepped in front of my camera when I took the shot and I was out of film. 🤷🏻♂️
@@reginaldscot165 hate when that happens
I ride tubeless for 5 years and have 2 bigger punctures/problems only in this time. One was a branch in a 40 mm WTB tire and it didn't seal cause i have ride uphill and the weather was cold and it rain . Later on a dry place it sealed as i pump it up. Second was the first gp 5000 tl 32 mm and big nail puncture 2 holes in the sidewall. i must repair it with a tubeless patch cause at the side wall the sealant didn't work . I switch to Clincher a view month ago on my road bike ... After 2 punctures in 3 weeks at my daily commute to work early in the morning i must say tubeless all day for me..
Glad it works for you. 🙂👍🏻
Interesting. I wasn't aware of tpu tubes. However for my riding on hybrid after fitting continentals a few years ago and since on my new Ribble schwalbe marathons e plus I haven't had punctures. Slime tubes block up the valve like the sealant described.
Yes it all depends on your tyre choices. 🙂
the Giant TCR i bought this year came with a tubeless setup, changed them to gp5000 32c clincher tires with butyl inner tubes, just had my first flat which was a pinch flat 2 days ago, if i were still on the stock tubeless system, the flat wouldn't have happened, that being said, i still don't want to go tubeless, just the fact that i have to periodically refresh the sealant is something i don't want to deal with.
Sounds like a sensible perspective to me. 🤷🏻♂️👍🏻🙂
Great video. Most ordinary mortals only need to hear your horror story at 9m45s to be cured of thoughts of tubeless for life.
Thank you 🙏🏻 😊
@@reginaldscot165 As a lifelong Butyl Being I had not realised that TPU tubes can be patched. I will try them out for sure, thanks.
Most tubeless tapes seem to be junk. I read consumer reviews saying: tears easily, adhesive/glue fails does not stick.
I experienced that with Schwalbe tape, I had to remove tiny bits tape bits, I jumped off stairs, and I lost all air at the landing, good it was the front wheel and had Cush Core in and it was only around 1 m.
I read about all the issues I had with the Schwalbe tape about the Continental tape, I suspect it might be the same tape, just rebranded, even read about same issues with Effetto Caffelatex.
Stan's Tubeless Tape:
tape quality varies, one weird edges somewhere between a half meter and a meter in on the roll, another had scratches on top of the tape. If using this tape you have to use a rag or microfiber tower to get the tape to sit properly.
Some use Gorilla Tape:
Don't do it unless you have to. It's not 100% sealed, as it has holes in it, you can see it if you put it up to the light, it's thicker, leaves a lot of residue if you are brutal ripping the tape off, so be slow and gentle, it leaves minimal residue then, but once the tape is worn to the point of leaking, and sealant going beneath and tape has curled up then it might result in lots of residue anyway.
I don't know which tape is the perfect tape.
Informative comment 🙂👍🏻
Love the video!
Would be nice to see how each tube system looks on the wheel from the get go. I am not too familiar with tubeless systems. Would be best for comprehension.
One of the most crucial points 9:52
Thank you 🙏🏻 very
I have so many amazing testimonies to say about road tubeless tires. I had over 9 punctures during a 12-day tour in Europe last year. Never had to even pump up the pressure.
Yes it’s fantastic, until something goes wrong… then it’s a horrible, time consuming and expensive mess. 🤷🏻♂️ As for testimonials, my English friends always tell me how nice some Italian restaurant is, but when I go it’s not to my standard and I’m disappointed. For another example, people tell the the Mazda CX9 is a good car… my wife has one and I think it’s in the top 5 worst cars I’ve ever driven. 😅
@reginaldscot165 still it'd worth much more than countless puncture repairs or tube replacement.
And when the worst comes, don't whine. just fix a tube!
Question are tpu for road use only? What about for light gravel.
Yeah that make them for everyone, but I can’t vouch for anything but road use. Personally for off road I wouldn’t bother.
@@reginaldscot165 good to know cheers mate
Whats wrong with electrical insulating tape for rims?
It doesn’t work, it slides around, it moves in hot weather, it’s not strong enough to protect against sharp holes in the rim. I tried it. It was a massive failure. 😁
Why are you using 23mm tires? What pressures are you running and why?
A number of reasons:
I ride titanium bikes so comfort is not an issue for me unlike people who ride modern carbon aero bikes or aluminium.
The 23mm are the most aerodynamic fit on my 2020 hyper carbon wheels.
They are lighter than 25s and 28s
They have lower rolling resistance.
They fit all my bikes, old and new.
They look good.
I run them at about 96 psi front 98psi rear.
I have used latex and TPU tubes on my steel Restomod MTB. The Latex tubes have constantly lost pressure and I have had to pump the tire every 2 or 3 days. After a couple of month the Vittoria Latex tubes usually ripped open at the seam and had to be replaced.
The expensive Schwalbe Aerothan TPUs were nearly impossible to fix. Once a puncture, I mostly tried to repair but gave up. I tried several patches and glues ans never found a working system.
I am back to lightweight butyl. Cheaper and more reliable. Though I am tempted to try the RideBow tubes...
Why not! 😁👍🏻
Request: I would LOVE to see you make a vid doing a 1 minute roadside flat change, and you have to use that 22g pump!
1 minute is to remove the old tube and put in the new one, but yes pumping takes extra time. If you are in a hurry CO2 is your best option.
i have to agree , just wanting to make the upgrade to latex , just seems easier and more cost effective to just have tubes
Agreed 👍🏻
I ran tubless for around 3 years, but went to tpu last summer after a tubless failure. I couldn't get valve out so I could put a tube in, and couldn't get a boot to stick to cover the hole. Plugs didn't work either. Yes, tubes would have failed in the same situation, but i would have been able to repair them at the side of the road. Tubless works well until it goes wrong, then it generally results and a phone call for recovery.
Yes I have heard many people say something similar about their experiences with tubeless 🙂
Works on my machine
After needing some new wheels two years ago I decided to get some TLR rims, rim tape was a necessary purchase anyway. Price was about the same for a Velox rim strip, that of which I did not completely exhaust, doubled up, and have not had any issues with it expiring on the rim. BUT I have a more particular use case of mixed gravel/road and touring, a tire lasts me long enough that I need to add sealant 2-3 times (5-7k miles, GK Slicks) which is about as often as I would get a puncture, if not less. I love the comfort and there is no placebo perceived increase of speed or slowness that comes from a latex tubed to TLR setup ime. Blowoffs do happen; but this depends entirely on rim/tire combo, looking at you RH, since not everything is manufactured to the same spec or tolerance. But to be honest, I have had more tires blow off running latex tubes than I have running tubeless (none). I still keep a couple TPU tubes on my long rides, though. But I would be doing that regardless and I'm not concerned about an extra 300g on my 9.5kg steel bike. But does all of this make me a slow retrogrouch? Not at all, I love speed and feel like I am a capable rider. I'm just not looking for marginal gains eeking out max KOMs on Strava, but that doesn't stop me.
Now, if I were running a TT tire and heavily concerned about powertrain loss and weight? TPU all day. Tubes are generally easier, work and fail more reliably and predictably. I think most people should stick with tubes. But if I want to take the perceived risk, I think that's my judgement call to make.
I think this is a very sensible comment. And I think you are making very logical decisions. Good for you! Happy riding. 🙂👍🏻
Only one problem , out of date data. The latest Schwalbe Pro One tle 25mm weights in at 245g. The rolling resistance data is also now obsolete as it has been surpassed.
By other more expensive tyres yes.
I totally agree tubeless seems way to much expense and potentially heavier on the roadie works great on my mtb and makes sense
Yes for MTB it makes sense 👍🏻🙂
I run tubeless not because I wanted too but my bike came with them automatically. But I see both arguments. For me the best results I found was using a race tire like vittoria corsas with latex inner tubes.
For sure 👌🏻
Awesome information 😎👍💯 But, Tubeless system also has a lot of advantages - especially on Mountainbikes 😎
Oh yeah for MTB it makes sense. 👍🏻
I am now retired and have taken on cycling. I am old school and prefer tubes. The setup of a tube, tire and sealant is 10% of the cost of going tubeless. I prefer to replace the inner tube every two years due to sealant getting old. I don't have any problems.
Great point!
I still remember when some private cars still uses tubes. Yes I'm that old, I'll bet lots of people said tubes were better than tubeless too bck then.
Good point 👍🏻
I gave a like because you mentioned that sealant can be used in the inner tubes too, the tubeless fanboys seem to be willingly ignorant of this fact.
Yes well I have been riding long enough to remember when that was a thing. Also I actually have a customer who rides a gator skin tyre, with an armour strip in it and puts sealant in his tubes. He rides until you see the white canvas of the tyre and never gets a flat. 😅
I run tubes on both of my bikes and have no plans to change to tubeless. I have no idea which system is more convenient but I do know that I can’t be bothered changing over to a new system and going through a learning curve. The season (where I live) is short and I don’t want to spend more time working on the bike. Tubes are like me. Cheap and simple.
Sounds logical to me. 👍🏻
I had zero experience with tubeless. I tried a year ago and the reason is I'm riding 20km at night 4 times a week to work. The streets are sh!t where I live and the last thing I want is a flat at night with barely any lights on the road. I now have tubeless with an insert and 40psi in 38mm tires. During that year I never experienced a flat. So, what type you use is completely a matter of personal choice and how riding makes you feel.
That’s very true, but I have a customer who just puts the sealant in his tubes. 🙂
I agree with you in not to use road tubeless, i have been running this expensive rort and going back to tubes simply because the unreliability of tubeless with sealent not always working and i have used the best sealents and tyres and still lets me down. I have taken my zipp 303s to work shop to get my Schwalbe Pro One tubeless tyres to seat because we dont all have air compressor at home. Their very tight to get on and seat and you will most likely take to bike shop. I have had sealent shower and it is terrible and sticky mess which you dont want. The maintenance is expensive and constantly replacing presta valves due to blockage from sealent.
That all makes sense to me and is certainly the experience of many of my customers. 🤷🏻♂️🙂
Tubeless are perfect suit for Criterium Race. Low pressure, high grip, and low resistance. After puncture, Tubeless can help me to hang on a few laps to help my teammates.
If one does not race or participate in a drop ride. Then a Tubeless is not necessary.
Interesting 🤔
I still ride rubber tubes with mr Tuffy's, have not had a flat in 20+ years. The plastic tubes lose air too fast for me. Maybe a little slower, but at the same time I can drop anybody in my club any time I want, how fast do need to be.
Nice 👌🏻😎
Great video. I have three bikes and the only one that is setup tubeless has 27.5x2.25" mountain bike tires on it that I ride through goat head territory with 18.5 PSI.
Thank you kindly! That seems very sensible to me. 😁👍🏻
At 2:45 you mention latex tubes are more time consuming, is that just for the re-inflation everyday or are you referring to other issues?
You prefer TPU over latex?
I'm happily running those Vittoria latex tubes with 40mm tyres, was going to buy some spares whilst on special, but am open to TPU option if it preferable.
Can/have patched latex with standard butyl patches, thought the TPU tubes were more problematic patching and more fragile. Only limited recent experience with TPU (Tubolitto) is on a 24" wheel folding bike, liked not having to inflate for weeks (though daily inflation is not a concern on main bike), but failed at valve seam when re-inflating after bike was not ridden for 2 months.
PS - first video of yours I've seen, nicely arranged/presented. Impressed with you responding to every comment (don't wreck yourself doing it though!)
Ok I won’t reply to this one then. 😜
Yes it’s frustration at having to pump up latex 1 or even 2 times a day. 😁 Yes I definitely prefer TPU, 3 out of 4 of my bikes are now running them. 👍🏻
Spot on. Have moved away from tubeless for the reasons mentioned
Glad I got something right 😁👍🏻
@@reginaldscot165 great minds, great minds…
As a guy being a little bit anxious on long rides even briging with me 2 spare tubes, tube fixing kit and a spare tire, just by using my common sense, I thought using tubeless is a pretty bad idea. After watching your video, I was still far from the truth! Very strong arguments.
Also I was curious, do you have any experience with Veloflex tires? My frame builder strongly recommend those tires to me, switching from GP5000 to Veloflex Corsa Evo made me faster by a significant margin, they are lighter and have incredible grip and cushoning. However they seem to be less durable than GP5000.
Hello, great comment. No but you aren’t the first person to recommend them to me. They sound great, but I have always thought the GP5000 was not durable enough so the idea of switching to something less durable isn’t high on my list… but having said that less weight and better grip sounds awesome… what a difficult decision! 😁
Safe riding!
I agree for road bike, I use tubes for my road bike but tubeless on my gravel bike, works for me.
Yes that makes sense to me. 🙂👍🏻
Although my gravel bike uses tubes and so far I never had a flat. Maybe the gravel is not sharp here? 🤷🏻♂️
I run std Schwalbe tubes 120g for training on conti 5000 23/25 width at 6bar. Haven't had a flat for ~10 years and need re-pump once per month.
For races I have a light wheelset with 70g tubes.
Was thinking going tubeless for race. You saved my life and money 🥰. Will try TPU tubes in the future but not more.
All the best! 10 years! That’s amazing!
@@reginaldscot165 Our roads are quite good and clean in Switzerland. Just stay 40cm from the border where the dirt and glass is. The flat was in Italy.