Come Follow Me | Jacob 7 | Lesson 15, Pt 1 - Sherem's Antichrist Parallels With Apostate Creeds
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- Опубликовано: 31 мар 2024
- We're releasing Part 1 for Lesson 15 a few days early since Part 2 on Constantine and the creeds will be released on Wednesday (April 3), when our weekly episode is usually published! Enjoy!
In Nephite history there were many antichrists who came among the people and taught their false philosophies. All of these men were cunning, possessing great power of language and charisma. The teachings of Sherem-and later a similar ideology among the Zoramites-can be compared to the false creeds of apostate Christianity that negatively influenced the early colonists of America as well as the 19th-century Christians at the time of Joseph Smith. These beliefs continue to cause confusion and incite contention today. Learn about the roots of sign-seeking, gifts of the spirit, the true nature of the Godhead, the Plan of Salvation, and the confusion introduced by the Athanasian and Nicene Creeds!
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As a recent convert, I. Must say your content is very valuable! Thank you!
Thank you so much for addressing the dangers of progressivism within our church!
Thanks for this! Never seizes to amazing me that people aren't reading the Book of Mormon.
You are truly a follower of Christ. God bless your effort and your beautiful life
Easily the best LDS channel out there. I love the meat of the gospel and you speak my language! You also dont mince words, which seems to really ruffle a lot of feathers, lol. Hit pigeons flutter....
I usually listen twice, sometimes more 😅 Your podcasts have become a permanent part of my personal library. (Say that three times fast) 😂
You have a gift Hannah! I feel the spirit when you speak. The words you say are powerful! Which is why I share share share because you are so much better at it than I am. Yet no one needs to hear it more than me. ❤❤❤
With You Tube now anyone's teachings or beliefs can reach many more people. I'm grateful to hear you and the truthful and clear things you talk about. Unfortunately I have also had many untruthful people pop up on my feed so I have had to discern between them and I'm grateful for the Holy Spirit which helps me to be not deceived. I appreciate your work on exposing some of the false prophets of our day. We need more voices like yours out there!
flood the earth challenge My cousin who I never have met in person and in whom I met onbrhw internet through doing family history work has now had her first discussion with the sister missionary's. They gave her a copy of the Book of Mormon...if you count that as if I gave it to her by setting this up that will be my 11th copy of the book of mormon placed ❤ ! She has been reading it with the sisters and plans to keep reading it on her own. I apologize for writing so much...I am just so darn excited over this. We talk nearly every day on messenger and she lives in Houston Texas and I live with my family in the Philippines!!!❤ brother Powers
That’s so exciting! ❤ Thanks for sharing that! 😊
Great video. In D&C 63:7-12, the Lord speaks all about sign seeking. Among the many powerful things He said, which you brought up, He explained that signs come by His will, not man's.
Thank you !! Always learn new TRUTHS !!!!
Miracles do indeed happen in the church today. I know from personal experience. I also know that there were miracles in the early days of the church because I have studied church history and some of my family history. I would read about even more miracles if I did more family history, but I haven’t made that as much as a priority as I should.
Agreed. I've had the opportunity to heal my wife with priesthood blessings on three occasions.
I believe too many members are comfortable and need not seek the closeness, comfort and feeling of walking with Christ or being taught, warned or lifted by the Holy Ghost! It is taught to press forward with a Perfect Brightness of hope …. So I hope that when trials of persecution come upon us we will be ready to answer to that hope!
It is true. I have used The Book of Mormon to recognize false doctrine. If all members had a firm testimony of the book, they would not be deceived by apostates.
Hannah, thank you for your testimony of the Spirit of Prophecy. He should be called that for that is what he is to us most often when not comforting us. Open Theism is trying to convince Latter-day Saints to believe that God can't really see across all time which would make him not God. This is a problem. I don't want to go too much into destiny but it is real and is not determinism. Mercy and justice are two sides of the same coin meaning they are not contrary but they are the same thing looked at from a different perspective and that is related to destiny.
Make him not God because that power is inherent with God's role, so what you mean is the lack of that power would indicate they weren't really a God?
First time...this is fire. Great job.
Great video Hanna! Thx for your research and teaching whats right
Oh my goodness Hannah this is too good
I'm a holy ghoster too.
No wonder the scriptures repeatedly say, preach nothing but repentance. We need to repent daily and make the Sacrament each week very important.
Another informative and thoughtful podcast! Thank you Hannah!
Thank you for all your work putting these together.
Awesome! Thank you!
Great!
Love it. Thank you for sharing your gift for research combined with the spirit.
Faith Crisis 2 - is such a great book! - love your podcasts
If one wants to live a miraculous life, then they must first take upon them the name or character of Christ. Just because we have sinned in the past does not mean that we have to keep sinning. Faith unto repentance is the key to unlocking the power of godliness. The meek/humble shall inherit the earth. The proof that you love Jesus Christ is found in doing what he did that we can do. When we live up to this, then we can say that we truly believe and the signs that follow those who believe will follow us. How can I be so certain? Jesus said it, and his word is sure.
Craziest cliffhanger of 2024’
❤❤❤❤
warm fuzzy comes from Satin to see. It is not the burning of the busim
0:00 - President Benson on the purpose of the Book of Mormon to bring men to Christ by testifying of him and revealing his enemies
1:58 - Introduction to Sherem, the first anti-Christ in the Book of Mormon, and overview of his false teachings
4:30 - Joseph Smith's experience with a minister rejecting his First Vision account, showing skepticism of ongoing revelation
7:00 - Joseph Smith on the connection between sign-seeking and adultery
9:09 - The relationship between false doctrine and sin
11:55 - The importance of always having the Holy Ghost with us
14:09 - A Christian persecuted in China preferring spiritual gifts despite hardship over ease without the gifts
18:39 - The influence of progressive skepticism and denying spiritual gifts in the Church
20:15 - Issues with Leonard Arrington's approach to LDS history
24:48 - The necessity of personal spiritual experiences to properly understand and write about prophetic history
27:27 - Jacob recognizing Sherem's errors because of his own revelatory experiences
29:45 - Satan's agenda to destroy the ability to become unshakeable in the faith
30:50 - John Wesley on the loss of spiritual gifts in Christianity after Constantine
32:32 - The difference between proper spiritual gifts and sign-seeking
35:42 - Spiritual gifts flowing from faith to bless the faithful, not to convert people
37:24 - The need for discernment regarding spiritual experiences and caution in seeking gifts
38:26 - Lucifer cleverly mimicking revelation and spiritual gifts in our day
Thank you for taking the time to create this breakdown/shortcut timestamp list! Are you okay if we added it into the video's description?
@@JosephSmithFoundation yes, feel free to!
Thanks!
Supernatural signs are throughout the scriptures, and men of God have sought them since the beginning of time. This is only a problem when ("sign seeking") is given priority over the voice of His Spirit. When this happens the spiritual sin of adultry (which may have nothing to do with sex) is committed by the individual who prioritizes signs over His Spirit. Because...there is no greater sign than the internal word of God (see also D&C 29:34-35 lds).
I think the concept of adultery, while practically speaking is about sex, is actually symbolic of not being faithful to covenants to keep God's laws. Is that what you mean?
great video- thank you for your good work. just note that adultery specifically means infidelity to a covenant relationship, not immorality or sin in general. the nature of the fruit is the evidence of the nature of the roots. people who struggle with other sins or harmful behavior might correctly not see themselves as an adulterer.
This channel shares great information, but I am troubled by sweeping generalization, i.e., that spritualism is equivalent to Satanism and that the Saints nowadays are tending towards denying spiritual gifts. Regarding the latter, we are counseled to keep spiritual experiences sacred. I think there is more going on than what we are privy to. However, some public things we can mention include the gift of tongues that is manifested daily by thousands of missionaries worldwide. Other public displays include uplifting music and talks in our local meetings. Individuals follow the Spirit to use their unique gifts to bless others in their families, in their Church callings, and in their communities. I see it a lot, though it's seldom flashy.
And those things are great, but there is an overall growing attitude in the church that spiritual gifts and experiences are rare and waning. The missionaries in my ward are teaching a new little family. The preteen girl said she visited our ward with her family and she saw something on the stand supporting those who were bearing their testimonies. No one said anything to her or treated her as if that was exciting or special. I later told her that even among the saints a spirit of unbelief had taken hold and not to feel too upset if people don't appreciate or believe you.
I realize you didn't actually put this as a limit but I think we're further along in the timeline than Jacob. My personal opinion is med-Helaman.
I’m a holy ghoster too 😂
"deceptive spiritual experiences" can you elaborate? Doesn't our temple covenants keep us safe from false spirits?
Sherem was such a lightweight compared to Marx, Darwin and Freud.
Marx was a complete loser, as I'm sure Darwin and Freud were too. I've read countless books on him. It's a sad indication of our society that we give them any weight at all. Total loser a long with everything he taught.
I always refer to what has been stated by Christ about the last days in the gospel of Mark…
21 And then if any man shall say to you, Lo, here is Christ; or, lo, he is there; believe him not:
22 For false Christs and false prophets shall rise, and shall shew signs and wonders, to seduce, if it were possible, even the elect.
23 But take ye heed: behold, I have foretold you all things.
I believe false christs and false prophets can come in the form of spirits too to show signs and wonders. We just need to know that through his holy prophets he has already forewarned us of ALL THINGS to watch for in the last days.
Tell me this though, assuming 99% of God’s children won’t even look to president Nelson as their prophet because of the craftiness of men, why can’t God use other means to speak to his children to prepare them for his return? There are a lot of Bible believing people that love the Lord, frankly even more than some LDS, that look for spiritual things to build their testimonies. Would we just assume that Satan is giving these people a false hope, or is it God giving these people more hope?
How would you know there were no other LDS at the meeting? Do you know all of them?
Hannah: Our family did a lot before the event trying to encourage friends, neighbors, ward members, and homeschoolers, etc. to go (Utah County crowd) but there was a general feeling of apathy. Believe me, it was more than obvious (and I have other witnesses to the fact) that members of the mainstream Church were not there. There was one fundamentalist family who answered our invitation to go. I have seen improvement in the last decade though-more members seem to be waking up to the plight of our persecuted brothers and sisters around the world. I would never say that 100% of all members of the Church are apathetic but it is telling that there is no organization run by a Latter-day Saint dedicated to serving persecuted Christians around the world (Asia, Middle East, etc.) They are all run by Christians from other denominations. I have a similar concern that it is Catholics and Evangelicals who are the most vocal and making the greatest changes in the pro-life movement. We should be the leaders-especially considering the prophets we have. I have personally heard from members who try to work with pro-life groups in Utah and Idaho express discouragement to me over the lack of involvement by members of the Church, and even the persecution they face in their wards. There are many members of the Church of Jesus Christ doing good, but we should be doing a lot more. We should be the leaders, not the other way around.
This may sound strong but just looking at the numbers and how many blessings and advantages we have, we can and should do a lot better. We have so many teachings from our leaders, the members need to do better. This is why the Book of Mormon continually warns over and over regarding the struggles the Nephite members of the Church had. Again, I do not throw all members under the bus or condemn, only encourage that we can do far more than we are and that is the message of the Book of Mormon to us. There is a reason the Lord said the Church is under condemnation for treating the Book of Mormon and other revelations lightly, or that Moroni boldly called us out for pride and not taking care of the poor in Mormon 8. Repentance is the message for our day and age-not for pointing fingers at the world-but for humbly asking ourselves, "Lord, is it I?" and cleansing the inner vessel.
@@JosephSmithFoundation Criticism is rarely a great motivator, unless it’s your boss holding a paycheck over your head. If you are wanting people to come to an event that you help put on, and they don’t come, maybe you can look inward and think about how you are leading. Are you coming across self-righteous, judgmental, critical or angry? Since you do not have a stewardship over your neighbors or other members of our church in Utah, all you can do is encourage. Our prophet leads us by encouragement and love and he is extremely positive. Even when encouraging us to correct our course, it is done with so much love and positivity, but it is his stewardship to correct us. On your RUclips channel you can teach from the Scriptures or from the Prophets which in turn is a wonderful reminder of the course we should be on.
If I had known about the lecture on China and had been in the vicinity, I would not have been able to go. My husband and I “hear Him” differently than how you “hear Him”. I believe we are both hearing Him. We have adopted many kids from foster care, some having disabilities and behavior issues, and we find that we can go to very few events. We are hands on 24/7! Going to a lecture on Christians in China sounds like such a marvelous luxury to me that I hope someday to be able to participate in again. I pray for the people in countries that do not have religious freedoms. I also pray for those kids in foster care that are longing for a family to adopt them and I hope others will, “hear him” the way that we have and desire to adopt those kids. However, I would never put that on you or someone else. I know how difficult this path is so I choose to pray for those kids instead. I know many people that are serving directly with other people, and have very busy lives that would also feel like going to a lecture is a luxury. You are longing to educate others and I understand that and I hope you are successful. You have a great presentation and style, and as you teach humbly and lovingly the doctrines of Jesus Christ, I believe you will be successful.
I also want to say that there are many in the church that are doing much to make inroads in China without any fanfare. I know this fact personally. Sadly, there are Christians that have broken the China laws and have snuck Bibles into the country which has made the leaders in China crack down more on Christianity. I love how our church is forming and strengthening relationships with government leaders, and impeccably following every single law in China. They are aboveboard and are working on building trust, and there is progress being made!
Hannah, I get the impression that you are backing off the seer stone position. Just curious if that is the case.
Hannah: No, I still stand by everything I wrote in "Seer Stone v. Urim & Thummim." My most recent interview on the subject was in September with The Stick of Joseph channel, "Joseph Smith, Treasure Digging, and The Translation of The Book of Mormon." ruclips.net/video/bULCzFxVKbs/видео.html Hope that helps!
@@JosephSmithFoundation Thank you for that. It was because of that interview I asked. I got the impression, perhaps mistakenly, that you were not taking that position as I felt you pivoted away from the subject when they first asked. I agree with you 100%. I'm no scholar, but just reading the Church History books the other day and it seems pretty clear what Joseph was using.
What does it mean to be "adulterous"? There's the dictionary definition: voluntary sexual intercourse between a married person and someone other than that person's current spouse or partner. So adultery is done on the part of someone who is already committed in marriage. In other words, a covenant breaker. Someone whose heart is lusting for something forbidden, something unlawful. Could it be that there are laws in Heaven governing signs, and the same lust that motivates an adulterer has something in common with breaking the laws governing signs? Why though? Could it be that revealing a sign is like the revealing of God, revealing the bride of a marriage, removing her veil? It's reserved for the one who is committed to her, ie the faithful believers?
Almost twenty years ago I was on my mission and a guy was calling our apartment, harassing us, demanding a sign from us. The spirit brought these words of joseph smith to my mind and a spiritually prompted anger came into me unlike anything I've ever felt in my mission and I called him an adulterer and hung up. When he called back, another missionary picked up and talked with him further and asked him point blank if it was true. The man never denied it.
It’s almost as if the Sherem’s words were _inspired_ by the Christian creeds…
I think maybe you need to back off your condemnation of Richard Bushman. I recently heard him bear his testimony during a podcast of one of the BYU-connected podcasts. His perspective and faith may have matured over the past 40 years or so since Rough Stone Rolling. There have been many within the Church who have served in prominent roles who have had their doubts and were not particularly gifted in faith, but have used other gifts in beneficial ways.
Hannah: I never mentioned Richard Bushman in this podcast :) but if we are speaking in my general life, I definitely have nothing against him personally. However, I cannot in good conscience stand by silently and watch the name and character of Joseph Smith be maligned and falsely slandered when he is innocent and not here to defend himself. We should be as quick to defend the Prophet Joseph Smith, who sacrificed his life for all of us, as current authors and scholars. If the day came when Richard Bushman had a change of heart and retracted his book, I would be overjoyed and do what I could to publicly share his new perspective. I should clarify that I have seen no indication of this, and especially judging from a recent conversation between a family member and himself, he still holds pretty strongly to his revisionist progressive perspective of Joseph Smith's history.
Excellent video as always.
Your neck looks a little swollen, maybe have your thyroid checked??
Stay well and keep up the good work!
Hannah: Yes, everyone wonders. :) I've been to a number of different doctors and specialists. It's completely benign, mostly an aesthetic issue. Thank you for checking! Appreciate the concern. Glad you enjoyed the video!
Great news and apologies for being a bit personal, but very happy all is well! Wouldn’t want anything to happen to you, you’re one of the good ones…intelligent, honorable, beautiful, etc. keep up the good work!
It seems a bit condemning that you thought other LDS did not go to the evangelical church featuring the man from China. How many people knew about this meeting? How do you know that there weren’t other LDS at that meeting? It seems that in actuality you don’t know if others knew about it or if there were other LDS there, but instead, this was a chance for you to pat yourself on the back.
Hannah: Our family did a lot before the event trying to encourage friends, neighbors, ward members, and homeschoolers, etc. to go (Utah County crowd) but there was a general feeling of apathy. Believe me, it was more than obvious (and I have other witnesses to the fact) that members of the mainstream Church were not there. There was one fundamentalist family who answered our invitation to go. I have seen improvement in the last decade though-more members seem to be waking up to the plight of our persecuted brothers and sisters around the world. I would never say that 100% of all members of the Church are apathetic but it is telling that there is no organization run by a Latter-day Saint dedicated to serving persecuted Christians around the world (Asia, Middle East, etc.) They are all run by Christians from other denominations. I have a similar concern that it is Catholics and Evangelicals who are the most vocal and making the greatest changes in the pro-life movement. We should be the leaders-especially considering the prophets we have. I have personally heard from members who try to work with pro-life groups in Utah and Idaho express discouragement to me over the lack of involvement by members of the Church, and even the persecution they face in their wards. There are many members of the Church of Jesus Christ doing good, but we should be doing a lot more. We should be the leaders, not the other way around.
This may sound strong but just looking at the numbers and how many blessings and advantages we have, we can and should do a lot better. We have so many teachings from our leaders, the members need to do better. This is why the Book of Mormon continually warns over and over regarding the struggles the Nephite members of the Church had. Again, I do not throw all members under the bus or condemn, only encourage that we can do far more than we are and that is the message of the Book of Mormon to us. There is a reason the Lord said the Church is under condemnation for treating the Book of Mormon and other revelations lightly, or that Moroni boldly called us out for pride and not taking care of the poor in Mormon 8. Repentance is the message for our day and age-not for pointing fingers at the world-but for humbly asking ourselves, "Lord, is it I?" and cleansing the inner vessel.
As Church Historian, Arrington opened up many archives to researchers, which had been locked away for decades prior under Joseph Fielding Smith, who only allowed a select few to see them under his scrutinizing inspection. Joseph Fielding Smith was not always honest in his portrayal of history. Although he knew better, Joseph Fielding Smith denied that Brigham Young taught that Adam is God the Father, despite it being taught in *far more* than "one sermon." Many church members believed this for years, simply because Joseph Fielding Smith said so, and when voluminous sources were discovered to the contrary thanks to researchers who had been allowed in, many members lost their faith due to Joseph Fielding Smith's dishonesty on this point. To single out Arrington as "the bad guy" is not exactly a balanced representation of history. The historical archives were in dire need of no longer being sequestered under lock and key.
Hannah: Joseph Fielding Smith was not dishonest and I am happy to have this debate with anyone. Joseph Fielding Smith never denied Brigham Young's teachings, he simply explained in Doctrines of Salvation that Brigham Young was misunderstood and misinterpreted. I have personally studied this topic pretty extensively and I agree with Joseph Fielding Smith's suggestion that what Brigham Young was trying to teach has been completely missed. I would love to do a book on this one day because I see a lot of people leaving the Church over the "Adam-God" controversy and it just isn't necessary!
From a traditionalist worldview, Leonard Arrington, however well meaning, produced a history which was not accurate. I think we make this case very well in our two-volume set, Faith Crisis.
@@JosephSmithFoundation Could you please briefly explain how you believe Brigham Young was misinterpreted? He taught very clearly that Adam / Michael is the Father of Jesus Christ, the Heavenly Father we pray to, on dozens of occasions-not the least of which was when he effectively canonized it in the Lecture at the Veil at the St. George Temple. This doctrine is what Joseph Fielding Smith took issue with and revised. By focusing exclusively on one sermon (i.e., engaging in special pleading, and by resorting to a tortuous reading of even that sermon), he labeled as false doctrine what Brigham Young in actuality taught, and thereby denied it. When examining the totality of his teachings, I don't see how one can honestly reinterpret Brigham Young's words to mean anything else. The same doctrine was also explicitly taught by President Young's contemporaries including Heber C. Kimball, George Q. Cannon, Eliza R. Snow, Helen Mar Kimball, and many others, who all credited President Young with expounding the doctrine-who all articulated it according to exactly what Joseph Fielding Smith condemned.
I hope I don't sound combative in writing what I've written above, as I genuinely would like to understand how you believe Brigham Young was misunderstood or misinterpreted. I don't personally see how that's possible in my reading of his teachings, but I'd also like to hear your take on it, if you feel comfortable sharing it.
You are alright! No offense taken. I understand where you are coming from. I just believe it is unfair and inaccurate to accuse Joseph Fielding Smith of being dishonest when he was one of the most honest men to live and his "crime" here is having a different interpretation of doctrine. The topic is too difficult to cover in a RUclips comment (would need sources, etc.) but a number of years ago, my dad and I spent hours going through Drew Briney's "Understanding Adam-God Teachings" compilation as well as other research and very carefully analyzed the quotes and source material. There are Brigham Young quotes that sound like the traditional fundamentalist interpretation, but then there are others where Brigham Young appears to be teaching the opposite and 100% lined up with Joseph Fielding Smith, etc. President Young was not schizophrenic, and I believe 100% that he knew what he was talking about. The question is, do we? We also carefully lined up all of Joseph Smith's teachings plus the Pearl of Great Price, which are more authoritative than Brigham Young. I think Brigham Young harmonizes with Joseph Fielding Smith, he just knew even more about the premortal life, etc. and went far deeper than the Saints in his day (and ours) were ready for but those two great men are not in conflict. My dad went through his research and perspective with a few influential fundamentalists who admitted that although they held to their original interpretation, it was a matter of INTERPRETATION, not accepting history or not, and they could see logically where we came to the conclusions that we did. I fully intend to come back to this topic at some point in the future, when it is the right priority. At the moment, the Book of Mormon, homesteading, working to pay the bills and family is keeping us busy and out of trouble! Not avoiding taking on that research project at all-just literally struggling to find time to sleep these days so I have to take one project at a time. :) I'd be more than happy to talk more in the future. @@terminuselectron6900
@@JosephSmithFoundation Thank you for explaining that. I appreciate you sharing your perspective. I hope your personal / family situation eases up.
@@JosephSmithFoundation Seems very sad to me that Leonard Arrington's son (the actor) had to coach his father how to bear testimony. Bushman and Arrington are cut from the same cloth. Prior to Bushman's Rough Stone Rolling book in 2005, all the church magazines and lesson manuals promoted the Urim and Thummim. After 2005, the false seer stone in a hat has been pushed. The deceptions and lies in Saints Vol 1 prove that the scholars are hijacking church history.