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A factor I think you need to take into account is the cost of the metal. Cadmium for instance is noted to be quite expensive, it does last a long time because the burner is slowed down but not long enough to last years
@@prestonc9059 I guess that is true, but in mistborn era 2 it is really expensive. I just looked up the modern day price and it is not all that expensive. So I guess if somebody wanted to use hundreds of dollars they could consivably put up a speed bubble for years
Keeping up riots, morale, anger, emotions up for multiple days at a time actually seems incredibly useful for maintaining momentum of movements, protests, operations, etc
A potential resonance for a flashwit might be instinctively predicting how the speed bubble will deflect projectiles, increasing aiming abilities. It's hard to know because resonances are hard to guess ahead of time, but the flashwit could still produce the same effect using the zincmind to calculate trajectories, so that makes them even more powerful, especially in a fight.
I just saw the part where you said Divine Breath can be stored in Nicrosil, and the intrusive thought must be expressed: Could a Nicrosil Compounder be given a Breath, store it in their Nicrosil, then burn it to get more Breaths? If so, that is insane, because unlike other compounding that you've talked about, Breaths can be given away, so with a single Breath they could create a (near) infinite amount and distribute them to anyone they wanted.
@@ExploringTheCosmere I really hope this gets explored once we see more magics coming together in future Cosmere :D I actually thought of two more things that could be interesting with Nicrosil Twinborn (non-compounding this time). Depending on what exactly "storing investiture" means, there's two interesting possibilities that can interact with the Allomantic metal that a twinborn can burn. One option: storing the investiture could mean storing the effect of the metal being burned. This would mean that a Nicrosil Twinborn burning pewter could be actively burning their metal, and experiencing no effect because the enhancements of pewter are being stored. Then at a later date, they can tap their Nicrosil and suddenly experience the effects of burning pewter. This would be cool, because they could effectively tap their allomantic pewter at a faster rate then they stored it, and so get huge bursts of the allomantic effect the way that typically is only possible with Feruchemical powers. The other option that storing investiture could mean could have to do with how some Allomancers are "weak" with their metal, and some are "strong" with it, and so experience different power levels when burning the same amount of the metal. Active storing of investiture into nicrosil could make someone only weakly able to use their allomantic metal, but then taping it could make them very strong at it, able to way more efficiently burn the metal and get stronger effects for less. With either of those two possibilities, I think there could be some really cool interactions for Twinborn Nicrosil Ferrings!
Allomantic brass or Zinc would pair impeccably with ferruchemical duralamin. Coupling emotional allomancy with boosted connection is borderline mind control.
Gold also is possible past selves. And the Cosmere rpg is implying that, since these alts have different experiences and skills, that you could learn new skills from yourself.
You haven't been taking into account the fact that cadmium bubbles' effects stack up, so if multiple people use them, they can travel into the future much faster. This will probably be relevant when we get to the space exploration era of the cosmere since people will be able to speed up the experience of their travel. An hourglass could allow others to do this by saving their ability to burn cadmium
That's a good point. Space age Cosmere is gonig to be so cool. I can't wait to see how the Scadrian FTL drive works. My guess is it will be like the Alcubierre drive and use cadmium and bendalloy bubbles to warp space time.
Just wanted to note: The Hourglass They could store the investiture of when they burn cadmium. Canceling the effect but building investiture. This investiture would presumably still be cadmium/preservation typed. One might be able to become a cadmium savant without actually having to travel through time… could lead to strange tricks with their investiture storage. The fact that feruchemical nicrosil stores investiture at will means it will store presumably any acting or present investiture of the same type into a metal mind. All this too say hour glass might be the most broken(i.e being able to throw or weaponize slow bubbles)
Or even, more crazily and kinda messed up.. they constant burn cadmium to charge metalminds with investiture, then those metal minds are used for hemalurgy….
I feel like silverfish would be able to become basically immune to most form of outside investure, which could be really useful if they are fighting and invested person
Rousers would be good nightwatchers. A Rouser on watch could riot the emotions of their crew to wake them up when danger is near as will as riot a hostiles fear to deter them.
I think it is worth considering the resonances, beyond just compounding. Wax was said to have some additional powers because he is a twinborn steel and pewter, the two pushing physical metals. Originally, his "bubble," where he pushes lightly at everything around him, was intended to be a resonance, but I think Sanderson has decided to take it in a different direction. I would be curious to see what resonances would come from the enhancement or temporal metals. Like if someone had allomantic Nicrosil and feruchemical Duralumin, what if their Identity had some effect on the allomantic burst they can give?
I think Swiftbond stacks up better against Flashwit than how you've ranked it. For one thing, it sucks *way* less to store Connection than it does to store mental speed--which is a factor we shouldn't ignore--but you can also probably use Connection with a speed bubble to great effect. Yes, a Flashwit can throw up a speed bubble and work out a genius plan to deal with an opponent--but a Swiftbond can throw up a speed bubble *with their opponent in it*, tap Connection, and possibly convert that opponent over to being an ally. Granted, I'm not sure just how much Connection can play with things. If you were storing all of your Connection and suddenly started tapping as much as possible, what would the person you were talking to experience? At the very least, it ought to disorient them, but you could probably use it to manipulate them somehow--and you would have time to do it, within the bubble.
I wonder if you spiked a nicrosil ferring with a misting ability if they could store that misting ability in the nicrosil mind for a week or something then swap out the spike and draw on that misting ability when needed, even without having the hemalugic spike. I mean, it seems like it should work IF the ferring can store the ability to use invested arts. If it works that way the nicrosil ferring could be super strong and almost any nicrosil twin born could become crazy useful if the were spiked with the ability to store their identity to make unsealed metalminds which would grant temporary versions of their misting ability to anyone who used their nicrosil minds.
I think any Nicrosil twinborn might be able to do this, and if they also had access to feruchemical aluminum they might be able to create unsealed metalminds granting their allomantic ability to anyone who touched their nicrosil mind.
Question, why are we assuming Duralumin/Aluminum twinborn have no interaction between their Allomancy and their Feruchemy? You showed a WOB at 13:42 which says that Nicrosil and Chromium work on Feruchemists when they are tapping their metalmind. It seems very unlikely to me that the internal versions wouldn't work the same way. For aluminum, the applications are still fairly niche (e.g. instantly wipe a full metalmind for reuse), but it seems like a Duralumin twinborn would be able to "hyper-tap" their Feruchemical metal better than any non-Duralumin twinborn. I'd even imagine the Duralumin-enhanced tap would be more efficient than typical Feruchemical compounding (since Allomancy is end-positive). Not trying to get you to rerank all your Duralumin/Aluminum twinborn, btw lol. Just saw the WOB and couldn't get the idea out of my head!
I think your right. But, if I'm interpreting that WoB right, it sounds like you can only wipe kinetic investiture, so burning aluminum would _probably_ only wipe the the power that you've already drawn into yourself from the metalmind, not the entire metalmind's reserve. _Maybe_ burning duralumin could let the Feruchemist use all of their power at once with less loss of that power. If that's the case, then it could be really good, but I really don't know. It might only work on kinetic investiture too, which wouldn't be very useful. I like the idea!
@@ExploringTheCosmere Honestly, I think it's kind of ambiguous if tapping a metalmind makes all of the reserve kinetic or just the portion being drawn out. Like, I could see it going either way with the aluminum "canceling" the investiture as it flows out or "following" the flow into the metalmind and blanking everything. Probably a good question for someone to ask Brandon. You know, there's also the question of what happens when burning aluminum/duralumin and *filling* a metalmind. Does the aluminum twinborn gain the ability to reduce their attribute without actually storing anything (e.g. a Skimmer becomes lighter but the aluminum "destroys" the investiture as it is stored)? Does duralumin improve the rate at which an attribute can be stored? Does it make the effects of storing more extreme? Or is there no interaction at all. I feel like the answers to these questions could really affect the placement of these twinborn quite a lot. Even the alumnium ones have a handful of niche applications in the most interactive interpretations.
That's what I was thinking. So, in that case, what would it let you do with BioChromatic Breath? Just store the ability to use Breath? Also, with Surges, does it just store the ability to take in stormlight and power certain Surges? If that's how it works, then it doesn't seem that useful to the user of the Feruchemical Nicrosil since they would already have to have access to those abilities to store them. Seems like it would only be useful in creating unsealed metalminds.
@@ExploringTheCosmere yeah I’ve always found it weird in that way, but here’s how I’m thinking about it: the ability to use allomancy/feruchemy is an addition to the spiritweb, and Brandon has described breaths also as an add-on to somebody’s spirit web so I think that’s why it works in that way
It’s more useful than you think though. Remember how Vin was stated by Ham to “get more out of her pewter” than usual? And how Ellend was more powerful than any other Mistborn in living memory? When we talk about storing your ability to use allomancy in a fNicrosil mind, we are adjusting this metric. If you were to tap a Nicrosilmind of aPewter capability, you could be as strong with it as an original Mistborn like Ellend, at least. Perhaps stronger. This is a metric that varies person to person just like their natural strength; the content of their Preservation Investiture which they were born with. Storing that investiture to have less Preservation, to tap it and have more Preservation later, is instantly S tier in my book.
@@hotwheels2621 Are we sure that's how F-Nicrosil functions though? Based on how the medallions worked in BoM, it seems to just be an on-off switch giving you the ability, rather than drawing out more or less of that investiture. Edit: Here's a WoB I found that seems to confirm this: wob.coppermind.net/events/316/#e11247
Regarding fAluminium, not how metalminds work. A Metalmind required both an identity that allows access to that metalmind as well as the ability to tap that type of metalmind in the first place. An aluminium ferring would only be able to tap other aluminium minds, but no other metals.
The reason I mentioned that as a potential possibility is because of this passage: “So if a person could store their Identity,” Marasi said, “as Waxillium does with his weight…” “They’d be without it for a time,” VenDell said. “A blank slate, so to speak.” “ *So they could use anyone’s metalmind?* ” Marasi asked. “ *Possibly* ,” VenDell said. He cycled through pictures of several more Feruchemists using their abilities before coming to rest on an image of a set of bracers. Simple metal bands, like wide bracelets, meant to be worn on the upper arms beneath clothing. It was impossible to tell the type of metal without color, but they had ancient Terris markings engraved on them. “ *Some have been experimenting with your idea,* ” VenDell said, “ *and early results are promising.* ” --BoM ch. 3
@@ExploringTheCosmere I think they're implying an aluminum ferring can tap another person's aluminummind while their identity is blanked--or, if they have multiple feruchemical abilities, another person's metalmind with those stored, like if Sazed blanked his identity he could use Tindwyll's copperminds.
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Rouser could make someone insane from not sleeping, rousing emotiond so the person can't sleep, while the rouser themselves are fine
My God, what a cruel way to kill someone.
hahahaha i love it, perfect for a Malazan-esque book
A factor I think you need to take into account is the cost of the metal. Cadmium for instance is noted to be quite expensive, it does last a long time because the burner is slowed down but not long enough to last years
That's pretty subjective both on time period and location, but idk
@@prestonc9059 I guess that is true, but in mistborn era 2 it is really expensive. I just looked up the modern day price and it is not all that expensive. So I guess if somebody wanted to use hundreds of dollars they could consivably put up a speed bubble for years
The books said that bendalloy was expensive
@@arkana9684 yeah but bendalloy is an alloy of cadium, and I am guessing that cadium is the expensive part of that metal
Rouser would make a great DJ, keep the party going all night.
Keeping up riots, morale, anger, emotions up for multiple days at a time actually seems incredibly useful for maintaining momentum of movements, protests, operations, etc
A potential resonance for a flashwit might be instinctively predicting how the speed bubble will deflect projectiles, increasing aiming abilities. It's hard to know because resonances are hard to guess ahead of time, but the flashwit could still produce the same effect using the zincmind to calculate trajectories, so that makes them even more powerful, especially in a fight.
I just saw the part where you said Divine Breath can be stored in Nicrosil, and the intrusive thought must be expressed: Could a Nicrosil Compounder be given a Breath, store it in their Nicrosil, then burn it to get more Breaths? If so, that is insane, because unlike other compounding that you've talked about, Breaths can be given away, so with a single Breath they could create a (near) infinite amount and distribute them to anyone they wanted.
Yeah, that's probably possible. Definitely OP lol. They could have more breaths than the God King in an instant.
@@ExploringTheCosmere I really hope this gets explored once we see more magics coming together in future Cosmere :D
I actually thought of two more things that could be interesting with Nicrosil Twinborn (non-compounding this time). Depending on what exactly "storing investiture" means, there's two interesting possibilities that can interact with the Allomantic metal that a twinborn can burn.
One option: storing the investiture could mean storing the effect of the metal being burned. This would mean that a Nicrosil Twinborn burning pewter could be actively burning their metal, and experiencing no effect because the enhancements of pewter are being stored. Then at a later date, they can tap their Nicrosil and suddenly experience the effects of burning pewter. This would be cool, because they could effectively tap their allomantic pewter at a faster rate then they stored it, and so get huge bursts of the allomantic effect the way that typically is only possible with Feruchemical powers.
The other option that storing investiture could mean could have to do with how some Allomancers are "weak" with their metal, and some are "strong" with it, and so experience different power levels when burning the same amount of the metal. Active storing of investiture into nicrosil could make someone only weakly able to use their allomantic metal, but then taping it could make them very strong at it, able to way more efficiently burn the metal and get stronger effects for less.
With either of those two possibilities, I think there could be some really cool interactions for Twinborn Nicrosil Ferrings!
Allomantic brass or Zinc would pair impeccably with ferruchemical duralamin.
Coupling emotional allomancy with boosted connection is borderline mind control.
Yep! I put both of those in the BUSTED! tier in another part of this series
@@ExploringTheCosmere I wonder if Sigzil could use a Malwish duralamin medallion to conceal his presence from the Night Brigade.
Gold also is possible past selves. And the Cosmere rpg is implying that, since these alts have different experiences and skills, that you could learn new skills from yourself.
You haven't been taking into account the fact that cadmium bubbles' effects stack up, so if multiple people use them, they can travel into the future much faster. This will probably be relevant when we get to the space exploration era of the cosmere since people will be able to speed up the experience of their travel. An hourglass could allow others to do this by saving their ability to burn cadmium
That's a good point. Space age Cosmere is gonig to be so cool. I can't wait to see how the Scadrian FTL drive works. My guess is it will be like the Alcubierre drive and use cadmium and bendalloy bubbles to warp space time.
Storing investiture is going to be VERY useful when Scadrial and Roshar have a fight as is mentioned in The Sunlit Man.
Just wanted to note:
The Hourglass
They could store the investiture of when they burn cadmium. Canceling the effect but building investiture.
This investiture would presumably still be cadmium/preservation typed.
One might be able to become a cadmium savant without actually having to travel through time… could lead to strange tricks with their investiture storage.
The fact that feruchemical nicrosil stores investiture at will means it will store presumably any acting or present investiture of the same type into a metal mind.
All this too say hour glass might be the most broken(i.e being able to throw or weaponize slow bubbles)
Or even, more crazily and kinda messed up.. they constant burn cadmium to charge metalminds with investiture, then those metal minds are used for hemalurgy….
I feel like silverfish would be able to become basically immune to most form of outside investure, which could be really useful if they are fighting and invested person
Rousers would be good nightwatchers. A Rouser on watch could riot the emotions of their crew to wake them up when danger is near as will as riot a hostiles fear to deter them.
Look forward to these!!! Let's Go
I think it is worth considering the resonances, beyond just compounding. Wax was said to have some additional powers because he is a twinborn steel and pewter, the two pushing physical metals. Originally, his "bubble," where he pushes lightly at everything around him, was intended to be a resonance, but I think Sanderson has decided to take it in a different direction. I would be curious to see what resonances would come from the enhancement or temporal metals. Like if someone had allomantic Nicrosil and feruchemical Duralumin, what if their Identity had some effect on the allomantic burst they can give?
What if someone who has feruchemical Nicrosil and allomantic Chromium could store the Investiture that they take when they wipe someone's reserves?
Cadmium grenade food preservation.
I think Swiftbond stacks up better against Flashwit than how you've ranked it. For one thing, it sucks *way* less to store Connection than it does to store mental speed--which is a factor we shouldn't ignore--but you can also probably use Connection with a speed bubble to great effect. Yes, a Flashwit can throw up a speed bubble and work out a genius plan to deal with an opponent--but a Swiftbond can throw up a speed bubble *with their opponent in it*, tap Connection, and possibly convert that opponent over to being an ally. Granted, I'm not sure just how much Connection can play with things. If you were storing all of your Connection and suddenly started tapping as much as possible, what would the person you were talking to experience? At the very least, it ought to disorient them, but you could probably use it to manipulate them somehow--and you would have time to do it, within the bubble.
I wonder if you spiked a nicrosil ferring with a misting ability if they could store that misting ability in the nicrosil mind for a week or something then swap out the spike and draw on that misting ability when needed, even without having the hemalugic spike. I mean, it seems like it should work IF the ferring can store the ability to use invested arts. If it works that way the nicrosil ferring could be super strong and almost any nicrosil twin born could become crazy useful if the were spiked with the ability to store their identity to make unsealed metalminds which would grant temporary versions of their misting ability to anyone who used their nicrosil minds.
A burst ticker is basically using ferruchemical copper to be a dick.
Swiftbond is better than you think as storing connection will make you harder to notice, pairing well with the speed bubble
Yes store connection when bubble is down make you a crazy hard person to tag in combat
I think it would be cool if a metal born could store their allomantic ability in metal minds.
I would call that metal born an allochemist.
I think any Nicrosil twinborn might be able to do this, and if they also had access to feruchemical aluminum they might be able to create unsealed metalminds granting their allomantic ability to anyone who touched their nicrosil mind.
@@swinkscalibur8506 Imagine if by some miracle, said twinborn got ahold of a bead of lerasium.
Question, why are we assuming Duralumin/Aluminum twinborn have no interaction between their Allomancy and their Feruchemy? You showed a WOB at 13:42 which says that Nicrosil and Chromium work on Feruchemists when they are tapping their metalmind. It seems very unlikely to me that the internal versions wouldn't work the same way. For aluminum, the applications are still fairly niche (e.g. instantly wipe a full metalmind for reuse), but it seems like a Duralumin twinborn would be able to "hyper-tap" their Feruchemical metal better than any non-Duralumin twinborn. I'd even imagine the Duralumin-enhanced tap would be more efficient than typical Feruchemical compounding (since Allomancy is end-positive).
Not trying to get you to rerank all your Duralumin/Aluminum twinborn, btw lol. Just saw the WOB and couldn't get the idea out of my head!
I think your right. But, if I'm interpreting that WoB right, it sounds like you can only wipe kinetic investiture, so burning aluminum would _probably_ only wipe the the power that you've already drawn into yourself from the metalmind, not the entire metalmind's reserve.
_Maybe_ burning duralumin could let the Feruchemist use all of their power at once with less loss of that power. If that's the case, then it could be really good, but I really don't know. It might only work on kinetic investiture too, which wouldn't be very useful.
I like the idea!
@@ExploringTheCosmere Honestly, I think it's kind of ambiguous if tapping a metalmind makes all of the reserve kinetic or just the portion being drawn out. Like, I could see it going either way with the aluminum "canceling" the investiture as it flows out or "following" the flow into the metalmind and blanking everything. Probably a good question for someone to ask Brandon.
You know, there's also the question of what happens when burning aluminum/duralumin and *filling* a metalmind. Does the aluminum twinborn gain the ability to reduce their attribute without actually storing anything (e.g. a Skimmer becomes lighter but the aluminum "destroys" the investiture as it is stored)? Does duralumin improve the rate at which an attribute can be stored? Does it make the effects of storing more extreme? Or is there no interaction at all. I feel like the answers to these questions could really affect the placement of these twinborn quite a lot. Even the alumnium ones have a handful of niche applications in the most interactive interpretations.
fNicrosil would allow you to store the ability to burn pewter, not the other thing
That's what I was thinking. So, in that case, what would it let you do with BioChromatic Breath? Just store the ability to use Breath? Also, with Surges, does it just store the ability to take in stormlight and power certain Surges?
If that's how it works, then it doesn't seem that useful to the user of the Feruchemical Nicrosil since they would already have to have access to those abilities to store them. Seems like it would only be useful in creating unsealed metalminds.
@@ExploringTheCosmere yeah I’ve always found it weird in that way, but here’s how I’m thinking about it: the ability to use allomancy/feruchemy is an addition to the spiritweb, and Brandon has described breaths also as an add-on to somebody’s spirit web so I think that’s why it works in that way
It’s more useful than you think though. Remember how Vin was stated by Ham to “get more out of her pewter” than usual? And how Ellend was more powerful than any other Mistborn in living memory? When we talk about storing your ability to use allomancy in a fNicrosil mind, we are adjusting this metric. If you were to tap a Nicrosilmind of aPewter capability, you could be as strong with it as an original Mistborn like Ellend, at least. Perhaps stronger.
This is a metric that varies person to person just like their natural strength; the content of their Preservation Investiture which they were born with. Storing that investiture to have less Preservation, to tap it and have more Preservation later, is instantly S tier in my book.
@@hotwheels2621 I think this is part of how the lord ruler was so powerful, compounding fNicrosil!
@@hotwheels2621 Are we sure that's how F-Nicrosil functions though? Based on how the medallions worked in BoM, it seems to just be an on-off switch giving you the ability, rather than drawing out more or less of that investiture.
Edit: Here's a WoB I found that seems to confirm this: wob.coppermind.net/events/316/#e11247
Regarding fAluminium, not how metalminds work. A Metalmind required both an identity that allows access to that metalmind as well as the ability to tap that type of metalmind in the first place. An aluminium ferring would only be able to tap other aluminium minds, but no other metals.
Exactly
Just because you have no identity doesn't mean you can access investiture that is keyed to someone else's identity
The reason I mentioned that as a potential possibility is because of this passage:
“So if a person could store their Identity,” Marasi said, “as Waxillium does with his weight…”
“They’d be without it for a time,” VenDell said. “A blank slate, so to speak.”
“ *So they could use anyone’s metalmind?* ” Marasi asked.
“ *Possibly* ,” VenDell said. He cycled through pictures of several more Feruchemists using their abilities before coming to rest on an image of a set of bracers. Simple metal bands, like wide bracelets, meant to be worn on the upper arms beneath clothing. It was impossible to tell the type of metal without color, but they had ancient Terris markings engraved on them.
“ *Some have been experimenting with your idea,* ” VenDell said, “ *and early results are promising.* ”
--BoM ch. 3
@@ExploringTheCosmere I think they're implying an aluminum ferring can tap another person's aluminummind while their identity is blanked--or, if they have multiple feruchemical abilities, another person's metalmind with those stored, like if Sazed blanked his identity he could use Tindwyll's copperminds.