Apologies, I can't NOT ask you some questions with this new insight. The video indicates that the Giant-Conquering Hero's Grave was used during the Giant's war, before the Age of the Erdtree, and this was done with the blessing of the two fingers. So post-cleft of the celestial hand. You have long hinted at a video centered on the GEQ. Are you going to refer to this video to in that GEQ video?
he got some things wrong but most of them right the same as you, the reason you all keep getting it wrong is because you refuse to see marika and ranni as the villains as they were meant to and instead of blame the greater will that is probably long dead or at least inactive
I do like the idea of the gloam eyed queen going mad with ambition and attempting to make her age eternal by killing off any gods or empyreans that could stand against her. It lines up really well with why she would make the godskins
A hint that I discovered that may also indicate that the Gloam-eyed Queen is alive, is from the "Godskin Swaddling Cloth" talisman. The description of the talisman reads: "The Gloam-Eyed Queen cradles newborn apostles swaddled in this cloth. Soon they will grow to become the death of the gods." The verb "Cradles" is used in the present tense. I believe that if the GEQ was dead or somehow inactive than the aforementioned practice would have been described with "Cradled" instead. Item description that contains information about dead characters are all in past tense, at least those I skimmed through. The video was great btw! Even if some of it ends up being wrong, I still really enjoyed it.
Very nice insight, did you notice how the iron maidens, which were made in Rykards mothers image, is shown cradling a newborn? Kinda strange to picture what that things true form is, with all those snakes underneath
With how bad ER's translations can be at times, I really wouldn't put much hope in the past and present tense of things in item descriptions. It could originally be in past tense, or left intentionally ambiguous, but translated into present for the simply sake of flow and simplicity. It happened with other items already, so it wouldn't be a surprise with this one.
@@WildBandit300 I checked the Japanese Godskin Swaddling Cloth/神肌のおくるみ description, and it's a bit tricky. It did not use past tense for cradle, it uses simple present 抱かれる instead of past tense 抱かれた. The tricky part is "抱かれる" is practically a past tense because the more accurate translation is "to be embraced", it's a passive verb used on the subject (newborn apostles) and not an active verb to indicate what the queen is doing (it'll be 抱く to cradle/embrace instead); so more accurately the translation would be "The newborn apostles swaddled in this cloth, is embraced by the GEQ". I think the localizer team decided to use "cradles" to keep the present tense and while it's technically not wrong, it could be misconstrued like in rare cases such as this. So personally it's not a strong enough evidence of her current state, I think "flee" from the other description already implies she's alive at least. Though the last part "Soon they will grow to become the death of the gods" sounds more like "and then, they'll become the death of the gods (after being nurtured by GEQ)", there's no ominous future connotation.
@@eldenringpvpenthusiast1710I think it’s because the abductor virgins are sent out to capture and bring back maidens to birth new snakemen. Ryker’s has a cruel streak after all, makes sense he would put a dark joke on his abducting machines.
@@GreebleClown did Rykard use those things while in the golden order? It would imply Marika steals babies and converts them or reinstitutionalizes them. I'm not familiar with Rykards lore tbh though, volcano manor is one of those areas I'll bolt through, lol
This is an excellent theory and explains why there is so little information available about Marika's 'greatest victory': Marika 'the eternal' does not want people to know that there was a time before her, so all information on the GEQ, the previous god, was erased. If instead, the GEQ-Marika conflict had Marika on the defensive, her victory would have been lauded as equal among the feats of Godrick's conquest. Linking the twinbird and deathbirds to the GEQ also explains why there is little information on them, and raises some interesting topics. The Helphen Steeple mentions 'a lamplight similar to grace'. Was it the GEQ's equivalent of grace, a means to recycle warriors similar to how Marika's grace resurrects the tarnished?
There are some vague elements about how the spirits world and the material world relate, and how there might some mirroring going on there. There is even the cut 1.0 Chinese description of the Helphen steeple which raises so many questions as it mentions the curse of the rune of life
@@Kosmos_er with all the duality in this game, if there is a rune of death there is a rune of life, the entirety of the lands between is alchemical based "as above, so below" and with the Land of Shadow coming into play, we may get to see one aspect of that
Yeah, this makes a lot of sense, not gonna lie. If we somehow don't get new information on these topics in the DLC, this is probably going to be the theory that I subscribe to when it comes to the GEQ. That said, I'd be pretty disappointed if we didn't, since the spirit world idea seems more important than most initially assumed.
@@three_seashells I made my peace with it, and I still subscribe to this idea in the end. I just see the GEQ as ancient and mostly lost history. Her being the Queen of the previous order with Placidusax as her lord still holds up in more ways than one.
This is a really interesting concept kosmos, I had never thought to pair the Gloam eyed queen with the dragons. And your right, nobody ever acknowledges the period between Placidusaxs rule and Godfreys. Another thing I would point out is that if anyone had any skepticism regarding the theory of Placidusax being the king consort, they have to remember 2 things. The 1st thing being that there are always certain themes and concepts that Fromsoftware like to keep repeating with their games, there are particularly a lot of similarities between the dark souls games and Elden ring. Think about Quella and Miquella, Sif and Fortissax, Maidens as a concept, the list goes on, and to me, the dragon-person relationship between Placidusax and the Gloam-eyed queen reminds me a lot of Seath and Gwyndoline. The second thing I would add is that, maybe their relationship wasn’t as dragon and person but person and person, as we know, Lansseax possesses the ability to take human form, we know this from Vykes armour I think. But what if the union between Placidusax in human form and the Gloam-Eyed queen resulted in numerous Demi-gods, such Demi-gods could have been the either the bodies in the walking mausoleums or the targets of the god hunt for whatever reason. Or maybe they are potential dlc characters/bosses. Or maybe they just didn’t exist at all. I don’t know, but an interesting idea nonetheless.
Não sei se você tem a tradução automática de comentários mas vou responder mesmo assim Eu acho que os semi-deuses descendentes desses dois seriam Marika e os godskins Faria sentido porque ambos têm características draconianas, os godskins têm caudas e Marika parece ter literalmente pele de pedra já que a vemos rachada no final do jogo
This idea does make alot of sense, espcially in light of the previous videa that gives a compelling interpretation of Mleina's eye that isn't "she s the GEQ". If farum azula and the GEQ are tied together, it would imply the dragons sided with the GEQ, perhaps this explains the ancient dragon's attacking lleyndel.
It's not just the ancient dragons. Read the description of the protection of the Erdtree incantation. EVERYTHING was in opposition to the Erdtree. This means no one wanted Marika to use the life force of the land to create the Erdtree and went to war to stop her.
Id say the GEQ is definitely tied into Farum Azula as if she is a queen with a consort that is Placidusax it makes sense that her children have draconic features
@@skuruhai001 that would explain the serpentine attributes of the Godskin. They are, in a sense, imperfect dragons, aka serpents; like the primordial serpents in Dark souls, wich they also have humanoid features.
@@Demokaze one thing i dont like is that you are going in the direction of so many people that got it wrong, so long as you dont make the mistake of thinking that marika is a martyr and put the blame for all of her actions on the greater will then everything will be fine
One thing about Maliketh Maria's shadow. When we fought Maliketh and he activates the rune of death, the title that game gives him is MALIKETH SLAYER OF DEMIGODS. That raises the question, who are those Demigods that Malik2 slained to bare his title? Well Godskins in my point of view was the Gloam Eyed Queen's DEMIGODS LINEAGE and those are slained by Maliketh we must keep in mind to that also when we talk about Maliketh, because he was not only a tool to suppress the death rune alone, do 5 forget that
Great video! Just wanted to point out that Rennala is also a queen but not a god. GEQ could have just been an empyrean in the running for godhood against Marika. I like the theory that she was/is a great serpent. The godskins have ties to the volcano manor, serpentine features and an unusual birthing process like the man serpents. There is an ancient rivalry of snek vs Erdtree that could be inspired by GEQ's clash with Marika.
This actually fits with some theorizes I've been toiling over. Taking everything you said into account with my own thoughts on the previous age, I currently think the Gloom-Eyed Queen's body is likely the Fingerslayer Blade. Based on our own experience in game, when the vessel is threatened the Elden Beast emerges and wields a sacred weapon forged from the vessel. We see this when we fight Radagon/Marika. I agree Farum Azula was overthrown with a hostile attack from Leyndell. When they got to the Gloam-Eyed Queen, some place away from Farum Azula, this "final boss sequence" played out. The Elden Beast was defeated, its sacred blade shattered in the struggle, its body still scarred on its belly. This wounding moment was also likely the moment Destined Death was removed.
OH MY GOD. Idk if anyone noticed this but Ranni gives you the calling bell plus a summon of 3 wolves.. in Farum Azula, probably the place of rule for the Gloam eyed queen has tons of statues of a small child/woman with three wolves, anyone looked into this?
FINALLY! This has always made the most sense to me. Especially Placidusax being her consort. Thanks for connecting all the dots. Melina is still a wild card though. I definitely think shes related in some way. Could she be the daughter of both? Gender or sex wouldnt be an issue.
@@armandaneshjoo Let me rephrase: do you have any documents or articles you can link to to verify this information, or should we just believe it because you said so?
@@armandaneshjoo The dlc most certainly did not "prove" Metyr is the GEQ, not even circumstancially. Marika is still numen, that hasn't changed. And she's a royal because she's the reigning god of the Golden Order. And it was never said that Marika wasn't with Radagon before Godfrey. We just never had any evidence or reason to believe so until now. I think you're just mistaken. They just took the lore that GRRM wrote for the base and used what they didn't use before for the dlc.
Yes... YES!!! Finally I see this idea adressed! I truly believe the Gloam Eyed Queen to be the godess of the ancient time of beasts in Farum Azula, consorted by Placidusax! Some indicators I would like to add are that the power of the Godskins is nowhere stronger than in the temple of Farum Azula - and that the GEQ is not only named a queen but she and Marika are the only beings actually called "Queen" in the entire game, therefore I find it plausible to see them adressed on the same standing, hierchically speaking. Meaning, both probably were godesses. Also, her Godslayer Greatsword has the same helixlike structure as the Sacred Relic Sword - with its opening helix probably some kind of inverse to the weapon made from Marikas/Radagons body (with a weird connection to the Sword of Milos and the Fingerslayer Blade, but I digress). However, I believe the GEQ to be a god first and an Empyrean (again) thereafter - being fled from Farum Azula and abandoning her consort after a natural calamity, not a war with Marika. There probably was an epoch of the Eternal Cities, from which the Erdtree Religion arose, as stated by Tarnished Archaeologist, and by which Marika came to power and renown - quite a while after Farum Azulas Fall. And later there was a time of a first burning of the Erdtree, which I believe to be the culmination of the Godskin Apostacy and the Ending of the Age of Plenty. Therefore I believe (in broad strokes, there is not much time for details^^) that the GEQ fell into exile and hid in the Spiritcaller Cave in the Mountaintops (she might have been a Spiritcaller herself and Torrents former Master, anyway that could explain the stron presence of Godskins in said cave). There, she plotted her return, birthing an army of Godskins, which soon should become the death of the Gods. In the Godskin Apostacy, when Marika ruled, I believe her to have led her forces (probably in alliance with the pagans from Mt. Gelmir and Eiglays Ancestor) against the Erdtree and burning the Tree with her Black Flames, not unlike Melina does later. Here I believe, Maliketh battled her, defeated her and stole one eye of hers and also sealed her Rune of Death within himself (not his sword though, yet). But the Erdtree as a physical tree was destroyed and become more an object of faith - after he spread the Minor Erdtree Seeds over the Lands Between. Next, I see the connection of the GEQ with Melina as follows: The GEQ after her defeat was not dead, but imprisoned by Marika. And after Marikas trespass - the Shattering of the Elden Ring - when she was crucified within the Erdtree, she used whatever was left of the GEQ - burned and bodiless - to birth a new servant at the foot of the Erdtree. A new living being, but based on the remains of the God before her - a sibling to the twins Marika had with Radagon while conjoined to one God, and therefore earning her own, Smoldering Butterflies. Melina would only awaken more of the GEQ when confronted with the Age of Frenzy - and the death of her old steed, Torrent. But in all other cases she would know how to burn the Erdtree - since the GEQ did the same before. And she would know where to bring us just after that - to Farum Azula, the GEQs former palace of reign. There are so many more details I could elaborate on. Once you follow that premise of who the GEQ might have been, quite a lot of seemingly random details fall into place of a grand, comprehensive storyline. However, obviously I could overthink and analyse the heck out of that. So far, it's my favourite, personal theory, though and I love the fact that you adressed parts of that :) If you made it up to here - thank you so much :D I just had to share this. Maybe it is of help ;)
I love your videos, very interesting and compelling theories and often not following the popular current theories, you are willing to find what makes sense to you, love it :)
Great video! I love theories like that, that diverge from the mainstream without being exceptionally flawed or forced. May the blessing of the Fingers guide thee, tarnished!
I think that the Gloam Eyed Queen served a different Outer God than the Greater Will because of the Deathbird description mentioning they serve one i.e the God of Death. So Marika's uprising was quite literally the Greater Will removing the God of Death from the lands between and excerting their own control. The Elden Beast was certainly the meteor that took out Faram Azula so the Greater Will could literally transplant itself into the Elden Ring to control the world. As we know Marika is refered to being the vessel for both the Elden Ring and the Greater Will itself and with Marika's shattering of the Elden Ring the Greater Will imprisions Marika because if they disposed of her they would be disposing if themselves and their control of the lands between.
Cool ideas ! I have been surfing a similar strain of thoughts. I would only mention Stormveil Castle in the equation. Since I finished the game, I have found the parallels to the two places quite intriguing. Stormveil feels a mundane copy of a once great locale. It is rich with shallow honorifics to godfrey campaign, features eagles and lions but crassly modified with metal weaponery. The exiled knight are roaming. Hell, the place is intoxicated by Godwyn's presence, while shows sign of past death ritual in the very same vignette. Intriguingly, I retro-actively assumed that the intentional mere parallels of Stormveil's architect (Godrick ?) reveales on Farum Azula state before it got hit. A fortress found by the sea. And given Caelid rich draconic influence, the singular, godskin inhabited divine tower, the deathbirds, I let you guess where I'll put Farum Azula on the map. Defeating Radhan there and as a meteor strike Limbgrave to give us a path toward the ternal cities and Ranni's Age of Star, well, I can't help but NOT miss the irony at play. ( And what about killing Ranni's shadow in our path...) Although, even if I buy the ruler of Farum, Placidusax as consort and such I'm still not sure on Gloam-eyed queen characater. I found some of the propositions for her to be Marika's children to be interesting (it would be a nice parallel, GEQ/Godwyn and Malenia/Miquella, an empyrean contaminated by the influence of an outer god, another proposed as the prodigious child, owning the prospect of a new age stole from everyone by the intervention of ambitious relative. Plus, GEQ would have reason to dispise Marika if all she was entailed to was guarding Destined Death for its brother succes. Who's talking the perfect set up for a dlc ?) Anyway, absolutly adore what's going on with Farum Azula and found quite the excitement with your video ! (Did I mention the badlands, Godfrey barbaric legacy and such !)
This video makes a compelling case, great work! I would present a couple counter-arguments: first, the creation of the Golden Order is described as the removal of the Rune of Death, correct? I don't think that rune's removal and its sealing necessarily have to represent the same event. The Golden Order could've been established by removing the rune, and the GEQ could'be still gone on to wield its power in the age of the Erdtree - the same way we can utilize the Great Runes for our gain. And then at some point, Marika directed her shadow Maliketh to defeat the Queen and seal away Destined Death for good. Second, if the GEQ was the god of Farum Azula, why do we find no trace of the Godskins there? If that's where they were based, surely there would be something for us to find. All in all, it seems the most plausible to me that the GEQ was a rival empyrean, a competitor to Marika's Golden Order. That is why she wanted to hunt the gods, and why she had to be defeated. It makes sense for there to have been different candidates for godhood, the same way we have the three empyreans during the events of the game. Melina being a reincarnation of the GEQ also sounds sensible to me - after her death by burning, she was resurrected as a new person by Marika - perhaps she was among the first to be reincarnated under the Golden Order and its new logic of immortal essence, but that's purely my speculation.
For your first point. Even tho it would be odd I guess it is still technically possible. As for the second I don't think the godskins were necessarily integral to the culture of the previous ages, no more than the crucible knights are to the golden order. They were born for the godhunt, and so are a unit with specific goals. And tho the idea that she was a rival Empyrean is possible, considering the fact that Marika still had to get her elden ring from the previous god as far as I am concerned, and the overt presence of death in the age before the erdtree with the GEQ fitting the bill, It makes more sense to me that the GEQ and the previous god was the same person. As for traces of godskin in farum I think their main fight being there is something significant.
Didn't the windmill village have a god skin festival, with a god skin boss at the top. That could indicate that the god skins were important enough to be semi worshiped and celebrated, which would be more significant than the crucible knights to the golden order.
@@birthrite8254 if that was the case I don't see why they would stop the tarnished. Every godskin encounter gives them a good reason to fight them. Either they are guarding something related to the GEQ or we invade the place of an ally like rykard. I don't think they are allied or protecting maliketh, so it must be something like the dominula village where we are just walking on their turf
This video is a bit different so hopefully you guys like it, as usual feedback is very much appreciated. Enjoy! Ps: memo received about the music volume, i'll be sure to have it lower next time and have something calmer.
I love your videos and this one is no exception. The only criticism I have is that the background music, especially around 4:15, was a bit too loud for my taste.
All of this sounds very convincing. I wasn't sure about the idea that the Erdtree cannot exist in a world with Destined Death, yet after giving a lot of thought I think I've turned around on my previous idea *completely.* At the site of the First Curch, the echoes of Marika speaks of an "age of life." If the Gloam-Eyed Queen was the god of Placidusax and the dragons whilst also the inner god of death, it stands to reason that their society and culture was largely centred around death. An "Age of Death," if you will. Just look at their home of Farum Azula: it would then stand to reason that the opposition of this system would be just that; opposite, and that an "age of life" is then synonymous with an "age without death." After all, despite the Destined Death culture of the dragons, there was no shortage of life; in fact, it was a time of *chaotic* life through the crucible which birthed demi-humans and omen. All of this paints a very clear picture to me. The Golden Order opposes death in all forms. Those that live in death, the demi-humans whose traits were once revered as sacred in the "Age of Death" but are now shunned in the age of the Golden Order, seen as primitive and undesirable and the omen, a blatant reminder of the fundamental flaw in Marika's ideology. Even Erdtree burials, despite what I once thought it meant, does not necessitate death! In fact, we have hints of the opposite! The Golden Order facilitates rebirth instead, something that is hinted at through Radagon's parting gift to Rennala, the Sacred Amber, as well as her shard fragment being that of perfect rebirth. The Golden Order's judgement of those that do not fit in, as is evident by Miquella's Haligtree, truly speaks to Marika's distain towards anything that came before and all that was associated with the Age of Death. *This* is the flaw that the noble Goldmask discovers. Despite it all, a god is still a human ascended. They are not perfect. They carry with them their rash and emotional rationale such as the Gloam-Eyed Queens god hunt or Marika's ethnic prosecutions. Finally, when we see Marika in this light... it isn't hard to imagine how the death of her firstborn prodigy, at the hands of the very thing she waged wars to eradicate, affected her.. and so, the fallen leaves tell a story. The great Elden Ring was shattered.
Thinking about it further lead me down an interesting path... Destined Death is sealed and the Gloam-Eyed Queen was defeated. Accepting that she was both the god of Placidusax and the leader of the Godskins, it's inferred that she is still alive. The Golden Order being founded on the idea that there *is* no death and her defeat very obviously happening *after* it was sealed away, what kind of punishment is there left to give for the highest enemy of the new order? Melina is stated to be "burnt and bodiless." Her fate is intimately linked to the flame. She's hinted at being the child of Marika and she claims to have been born "at the foot of the Erdtree," yet she also expresses confusion over the concept of being born of a mother. Was the only conceivable punishment for the greatest enemy of the empire rebirth without a vessel? Was.. Melina given the first Erdtree Burial..?
@Sidhion Oakbranch hey. this is a good write-up. Good framing of these sorts of "invisible parallels" that exist all throughout the game thanks to the bygone age of death.
Thanks for the video and theory, I think the longer format was great and all the shots and editing. I like the theory and think it’s plausible. I’ve always found the information about Placidusax waiting for the return of his god quite ominous and interesting that the GEQ isn’t stated to be dead, despite being defeated, works well with that statement. For me the potential issue surrounds the Godskins and how little they feature into this theory. It’s from them that we get the most information about the GEQ and they seem so important to understanding her. However, there is nothing that links dragons and apostles. Yes there is the duo in Faram Azula, but nothing about that fight makes them fit there more than they fit at Volcano Manor for example. It says they have inhuman physiology, but not dragon I wouldn’t say. There’s no Godskin iconography at Farum, and nothing about skinning seems to connect to dragons. So for me, to buy into the theory a bit more I’d need to think more about how the apostles and their mission to skin gods(!) would relate to an age of dragons. But nonetheless I loved the video and all the stuff you put out.
Yeah thats the most speculative bit, a possibility but pure conjecture with little to go on, it can also be assumed they were in Farum Azula to obtain the rune of death for themselves. We still don't know who the statue depicts in Malikeths room. Could be anyone frankly.
Yeah. That's pretty cool idea. I like it. Maybe it would be justice that once the gloam eyed queen was killed, her body was absorbed by the Erd Tree. This allowed Marika to create a blank copy of her that would follow orders (Melina). Or maybe just give her enough memory to execute Marika's will. Once you side with the Frenzy god and burn the Erd Tree, Marika's last ditch effort to save her age is to unseal the rune of death, granting Melina those powers to hunt you down.
Awesome video. 8:35 we also know that humans were entwined with Farum Azula society because of the Draconian race we find in the character creation menu
Very interesting video, I do think you're on to something, as for the gloam eyed queens identity, although I really do think to solidfy that malenia is a part of that due to the frenzy ending. Also there's the issue with the storm lord, which I guess is Mr hyrda dragon. I only take issue with the timeline as where does the age of the cruible fit into this? I think tarnished archeologist provides some better description of events. Also the war with the dragons seemed pretty early on as Godwin had to befriend them and the tree knight sentinels became monstrosities. And why would they forgive the erd tree over Godwin? On top of all of this they use gold as a source of power. This would link the banished knights to the gloam eyed queen. But they also use dragon communion spells.
@@armandaneshjoo it didn't. But the golden order includes everything's from its birth. Age of the crucible isn't really a thing as it was never hugely influential.
This makes a LOT of sense, and considering its said the god of the dragonlord has fled, if it is her, its time to return to the lands between, with Marika and her order either crumbling or completely gone. You mentioned how her servants were those entities associated with death... in the promo image, the erdtree seems to be swallowed by deathroot, which could mean either her or Godwyn or both... ohhh this is even better than I was expecting before, I can't wait till 2024 goddamn...
There can be more than 1 empyrean at the same time similiar to ranni, miquella and malenia. I think GEQ was an empyrean similiar to Marika during the same age and both were chosen similiar to how ranni, miquella and malenia were chosen during the same age or period. The only difference being Marika became the god and GEQ didn't. I dont think GEQ was a god of the previous age but an empyrean that was contemporary to the time when marika also was an empyrean.
I understand the relevance of the music in the background due to its use in the game that is the topic of your video. But I just say the sheer volume and anxiety inducing, rousing effect of the battle music behind your delivery is extremely distracting and verges on input overload. I understand as an autistic person, this is my problem. But I just wanted to give this feedback cos I’m probably not the only autistic person that enjoys your videos. I had to replay several parts of your video several times because of the music drowning you out of my sensory perception several times. But that is my only critique. Fascinating content and I absolutely adore hearing and taking into consideration your takes as I attempt to better understand the world of Elden ring with your help and the help of a couple of other fantastic RUclipsrs producing exquisite content like yours. Thank you for sharing!❤
This also makes so much sense of why they went to fight the giants. Just as we need to go to the Flame she did as well as to have no challenge to that order. The only crux in all of this was Godweyn’s death. How could the order be perfect and allow the death of Marika’s favorite son?
I think you're right about most of this, but I still have the suspicion that it was the GEQ who destroyed Farum Azula, and ruled without an Elden Lord until Marika, Godfrey, and Maliketh defeated her. The reasoning for this is that there's no clear place where the Rune of Death fits into the Elden Ring in Farum Azula, suggesting it might be some kind of interloper, as it's treated very differently than every other kind of Rune. Then there's the fact that the GEQ's most lasting impact was her creation of the Godskins, some kind of artificial lifeform which she then swaddled and eventually clothed in the skins of gods. Who could these gods have been but the humanoid denizens of Farum Azula? The otherworldly ancestors of the Numen. The GEQ explicitly created the Godskins to overthrow an entire pantheon, so to speak, and with the exception of at least Marika, it would appear she had succeeded, which suggests she was in some part an outsider. In ASOIAF, the Targaryan royal family of dragon riders at one point have to deal with a series of uprisings lead by a line of Targaryan bastards vying for the throne, using their inheritance of the ancestral sword Blackfyre as proof of their claim. These uprisings were called the Blackfyre Rebellions. Their emblem is a 3-headed black dragon breathing black fire on a red background as well, and Targaryans as a whole are known for their violet eyes. It's by no means an air-tight theory, but the idea that there was a sort of "Long Night" period of time between Placidusax's reign, and the Golden Order being founded. Perhaps the Rune of Death being sealed triggered a slow reawakening of the Ancient Dragons from their stone forms, which lead to Godfrey and the Crucible Knights wrecking the place even further?
Thanks for the video! That was interesting. I can accept the GEQ to be the god of the previous age and Placidusax her consort, it makes a solid picture. But I have some qualms about the involvement of the Greater Will. The way the story is presented it seems the previous age was when several outer gods all had stakes in the lands between (the fell god, the god of rot, the stars, etc). However, the depictions in Farum would make it clear that the one with the biggest influence was the Twin Bird with the death birds as it's emissaries. There is no hint of the two fingers or the Greater Will being present back then. Since the elden beast arrived with a meteor, that should have been the one to destroy Farum Azula and introducing the Greater Will in the lands between. I assume that the Erdtree was brought by the meteor as well, infesting the much older great tree whose root network still spans the entire lands between. The depiction of the elden ring in Farum Azula makes me think the elden ring was embedded in the great tree's roots and the Erdtree was the way to take control of it.
Some information: Placidusax is a Elden Lored. The ancient dragons' body is inherently gold. The Black Blade, a high ranking clergymen of FA, is a shadow beast given to Marika by two fingers. What destroyed FA was a meteorite with gravitational force. FA's fragments are easy to glow light and are used to make items related to the fingers. And the light and the cipher of light are exactly the power/language of the two fingers. The Divine Tower that is similar to FA and not adapt to the modern city layout's planning is a place where the two fingers are worshiped, and red gold meteorites are also worshiped. The ending of Ranni and her moon is noted in the unpacking content as inheriting the rune of spirit. And in the official version, the Destined Death has another name, the Rune of Death. (By the way, the Golden Order's ending is the rune of life) 「テスト: s19_00_0020 エンディングＢ（精神ルーン継ぐ）」 IMO, Basically the various Orders/outer gods are the subset of the Elden Ring of the Greater Will.
@@user-em6rw2pc6n I disagree on many things here. To me placidusax is reddish, which would hint at the crucible. Also Godfrey was Elden lord, yet does not exhibit any such gold and even Radagon doesn't. The link between shadows and beasts is extremely unclear. Serosh was a regent and still somehow forced to become something like a shadow. I think the dragons are also linked to gravity, as the consumables are often found on and around their petrified wings. The fragment argument seems rather week. I could also argue that every place with a lamp is connected to the Helphen ^^ To me the divine towers bear little to no resemblance to the architecture of FA, especially the inside as well as the murals. They seem to be linked to the blackstone culture, which has little to no known lore as of now. I didn't get your ending argument in relation to the role of the greater will, sorry :)
1. Fingers are vassals of the Greater Will. The Gloam-Eyed Queen was an Empyrean chosen by the Fingers. (source: black flame ritual) 2. The description of the Ruins Greatsword says that the meteorite struck ruins. Therefore it either struck an already crumbling Farum Azula or one of its ruins scattered on land. 3. The Greater Will sent the Elden Ring/Beast with a golden star but there is another star falling event mentioned in the Founding Rain of Stars description which brought glintstone/sorcery to the Lands Between. There are faith-oriented elements on Farum but nothing about glintstone/sorcery. Therefore there was no sorcery during Farum's reign because the latter event had yet to happen. 4. The Ruins Greatsword is a STR/INT weapon, not a STR/FAI weapon. Therefore it's likely the meteorite that struck it came down during the aforementioned event that birthed sorcery not the event that brought the Elden Ring. 5. The Erdtree was created from red gold matter of the Crucible. (source: gilded greatshield) And the inhabitants of the Lands Between fought to stop it. (source: protection of the Erdtree) But they eventually lost, Marika bought enough time to complete it and made it the embodiment of Order (aka the new home of the Elden Ring).
@@Managarm I will only list some main information, if it is complete, it would be too long. 1、Ancient Dragon Smithing Stone：Smithing stone made by polishing a golden Gravel Stone. A scale of the Ancient Dragonlord, and hidden treasure of Farum Azula. Crucible Gauntlets：Gauntlets of the Crucible Knights who served Godfrey, the first Elden Lord. Hold the power of the crucible of life, the primordial form of the Erdtree. Aspects of the Crucible: Tail：One of the ancient Erdtree incantations. This is a manifestation of the Erdtree's primal vital energies-an aspect of the primordial crucible, where all life was once blended together. Gilded Greatshield：The red tinge in the gold coat mirrors the primordial matter that became the Erdtree. The color of homeward yearning. You have made a typical mistake of binding the Greater Will to the Golden Order. Not to mention Radagon, who further developed fundamentalism, the scholarship. Mending Rune of the Death-Prince：The Golden Order was created by confining Destined Death. Black Flame Ritual：The Gloam-Eyed Queen led the apostles. It is said that she was an Empyrean chosen by the Fingers. Gowry：An Empyrean...is no mere demigod. In the age of the Elden Ring, and Queen Marika, the precious Empyrean was born. A new god to forge a new Order. I have dedicated myself to her. And to the resplendence of the Order of Rot. The cycle of decay and rebirth." Edge 367# Miyazaki: This Golden Order is something that the Elden Ring may have once represented, but not directly. It's more about how you apply those rules and how you enforce them on the physical world and what effects they have on it. What can represent these rules and order but also not absolute? That was the question that ran through my mind when I created this image. And the tree really fits the bill nicely for that because the tree is something that's alive, it's something that grew, it's something that will eventually wither and die. 2、Serosh isn't a shadow. 3、Dragons have no gravitational force. but, Ruins Greatsword：The ruin it came from crumbled when struck by a meteorite, as such this weapon harbors its destructive power. Skill-Wave of Destruction：Raise the sword up high, then strike it against the ground to fire off a wave of gravitational force. 4、Ruin Fragment：These shards of stone are believed to have once been part of a temple in the sky. They glow with a faint light from within. Sanctuary Stone：It feeds and strengthens the light as it shines. They can only be used to make items related to light and the fingers. Warming Stone：Ruin Fragment blessed with an incantation of the Two Fingers. Scriptstone：Ruin Fragment with a cipher inscription. Cipher Pata：One of the weapons originating from the Two Fingers. A formless sequence of ciphers comprise its blade. The furtive inscription appears to hang in the air; the language of light spoken by the Two Fingers.
@@Demokaze 2., 3. and 4. mean that Farum Azula was not destroyed by an "int meteor", right? ;) 5. That's not what the shield's description says... "what became the Erdtree" is different from "from which the Erdtree was created". Let's stick to the facts here, okay? That being said, I don't have a good counter argument for 1 :) we could speculate that the GEQ was god for a while after the elden beast arrived, but there's nothing to back that up. The fact remains that there's no hint of the two fingers or the Greater Will in the era of Farum Azula.
Very cool video, thank you! The twilight queen is one of the titles of Hel, daughter of Loki and nordic goddess of death and underworld. Maybe the gloam is a reference to that. If true, Hel’s story may help understand Gloam Eyed Queen’s mystery. 😅
In those legends, is there anything similar to the ancient dragons? I want to understand the relationship between farum azula and the eternal cities, if there is any.
I love how " black flame" is constantly regarded as super powered, god level attack. Fairytail has god slayer flame Ds1, ds3 and Er have it. Slime isekai has it Bloodborne with accursed skull. Bleach with black ceros Naruto aswell Mabye more from anime / games i havent Seen yet.
This is an old write-up now, with some recent updates from the DLC. Marika is the Gloam/Dusk-Eyed Queen. - Red and black spike of death impales Marika and keeps her in place when we find her at the end. Only Maliketh wields this power, and only he could even defeat a God like Marika. But he's so loyal to her, why would he? - Maliketh "defeated" the Gloam/Dusk-Eyed Queen. We know Shadowbound hounds have to attack their former master if The Fingers feel like the Empyrean is acting against them. We play through this reality with Ranni's quest, and both she and Iji know Blaidd will go mad as she enacts her vision. How do they know this happens? They saw/heard of it happening to Maliketh and Marika already. - Only Marika would be able to guide Ranni to the location of the Rune of Death and how to use it for it to be stolen in the first place to forge the Black Knives. Remember, "Marika... is this what it is to sin?" "Why gull me..." Marika, after all, had only one use for Maliketh in the end, after the other work was done... a vessel to seal away Destined Death. And even then, she betrayed him. - The Beast Eye is a purple, scratched up eye. It's Marika's eye from being defeated and imprisoned by her Shadowbound. No other Queen or Empyrean is "defeated" but not slain, as the text implies there except Marika. And who but her purpose-made hound could even stop her, a God? The one entity empowered enough by the Ring/Fingers to be able to do so should the need arise. - Dominula Village is much like the Hinterlands and the Shaman Village. We find a skinning ritual and a Godskin Apostle there in Dominula. We learn that the "festival" is old and tacitly accepted by the Golden Order. The aesthetic of these villages is much the same, and they're intimately tied to Marika herself. - Gideon gives us a boon in the form of a secret rite known only to him, Black Flame Protection. He is alleged to have peered into the will of Queen Marika, and shuddered at the end that should not be. - The Scadutree is of a dual nature. So is Queen Marika. When Gold arose, so too was Shadow born. Gold and Shadow exist as necessary contrasts to each other, yet in a God, in Marika, this duality exists in coalesce, or it did once. - No other characters are named as Queen or Empyrean that aren't already accounted for/ruled out to be the GEQ, and by that I mean Melina, she was given purpose by her mother at the foot of the Erdtree and that means she is a daughter of Marika, not old enough to be the GEQ but possesses traits of both Marika and Radagon. Eye color and hair color are passed down traits we see in game. Well, sure enough, Melina shows us a purple/gloamy eye in one ending. Inherited trait from her mother, the Queen in Black. Marika's eyes are never shown to us, to judge their color. - Duskborn ending sees Godwyn rise to ascendancy and sees Death restored, with him as the Prince of Death itself. These titles aren't meaningless. Duskborn? The "Prince" of Death? Well, who would the Queen be? If Godwyn is Duskborn, and if he is a Prince, his mother would, of course, be associated with "Dusk" and be a Queen. And we know his mother is Queen Marika. - Fia is hooded with a black cloak and comes from some other land. She also helps create Godwyn's Duskborn ending and is Death-aligned. We see Marika wearing black hooded garb in a statue where she also is holding the twins Miquella and Malenia. Her tattered clothing as we find her at the end is also black. She is also associated with the Nox/Numen race and the Black Knife Assassins that come from there as well. - Statues of Marika in her crucified pose all show her with a flowing black cloth that wraps behind her in almost the exact same shape as the Godslayer Greatsword, which was the weapon or ritual sword of the GEQ/DEQ. You have to pivot the camera a bit to get a good view, but the shape is very similar. Coiled and then open, with one flap slightly longer than the other, same tip design on the Godslayer Greatsword. It's possible that she was propped up by the Hornsent culture and then part of the betrayal was killing other Gods in their pantheon, but what's maybe more possible is as Centered Tarnished pointed out, that Marika culled some other of her "unwanted" children after learning the truth of the broken Fingers and flawed foundations of her Order. - Godwyn is referred to as the "Prince of Gold" in an item description. If a Prince of Death could have been a Prince of Gold, why couldn't his mother hold this potential as well, even necessarily so? We see from the Death Knights that Gold and Death can somehow synergize even still... Gold and Shadow, born at the same time, same as it ever was. - Hewg prays to Queen Marika about his given task to craft a Godslaying weapon. Very interesting and specific task. Marika wants a God slain. He mentions "the sheer terror of Her..." regarding Marika. Godskins certainly take an interest in killing a God. Who was their leader? A "defeated" Queen who was once an Empyrean. Marika. - Raging Wolf Vargram is a would-be Shadow. Wolf imagery is on his armor. He wields the Godslayer Greatsword. The weapon art is "The Queen's Black Flame", of course. A statue of Marika exists in Farum Azula showing her with three wolves. - Marika learned the secrets of the Golden Order and realized her children would "amount only to sacrifices" as she instructed them. She knew the Erdtree was a soul parasite, and by sealing Death away, she weakened the Erdtree over time. She also had Godwyn buried at the roots of it, knowing that he would grow and overtake them, choking the Erdtree further. As he was, Godwyn was an "unwanted" child since he embodied the Golden Order, and she was a prisoner to it. He would end up much like Miquella would, a caged divinity of some kind. She was likely opposed to the Erdtree and Greater Will/Fingers for a long time, weaving plots in secret until the Shattering. She realized, only too late, that ultimate power has a way of becoming a curse when the truth of the nature of it all is finally revealed. Just as Marika shined so brightly with her Golden Order, another aspect of her was as deep as the abyss and as dark as any shadow.
Great video! I just watched a video about it being Melina on Sinclair Lore. It had me almost convinced. Expect I thought Melinas purpose was to burn the end tree as kindling from birth. Given to her by her mother. That's why they found Melina and burned her alive to prevent it. Now she is a spirit and works through you. Atleast when you find her weapon it's by the body armor of the person in charge of finding and burning her.
I do love this idea. But what of the Black Flame Monks? Their abandonment suggest that the time of the GEQ was after the war against the giants, when Marika was already Queen and God.
@Kosmos I agree, it just seems most likely to me that the Flame Monks would be better seduced by the full power of the Black Flame than its weakened state. The Noble Presence incantation also mirrors Wrath of Gold, an Erdtree incantation, and the GEQ is described as an Empyrean, rather than god, in items. I'm not trying to be contrarian, this one of my favourite GEQ theories so far.
I feel we just know too little about Elden Ring lore to speculate about characters's relations to each other: the current situation just feel like the old "Havel's friend" conundrum, where the community speculated wildly about his identity but simply had no way to know it until DS3.
The way I see it is that now is the time for speculation before er get more info. Lore we know for sure is cool but I wouldn't be interested in making videos about it.
@@Kosmos_er based answer. So much of what makes FromSoft games unique is their willingness to let the fans think for themselves as oppressed to telling them that they have to interpret their stories in a specific way. I can’t speak for everyone but if there was no room for speculations I doubt I’d be so invested in these games and their lore as I am.
Do you think there is any connection between the gloam eyed queen and the giants one eyed fell god? Flame colors don’t match, but the one eye thing could be a clue
I have been ruminating it. There might be some sort of connection between the forge and farum since that's how we get there. And the giants were made to watch over the flame by their god, who is said to have been killed by Marika. And the flame of ruin was described as black flames after u unleash DD in cut dialogue. But I'm not sure if I can make out anything of all that yet.
9:35 I haven't seen people not acknowledge the conquest of Farum Azula whenever it was spoken about the assumption I've seen is that Godfrey defeated the previous Order. On another note, Marika declares the Age of the Erdtree IMMEDIATELY after the defeat of the GIANTS, so she had the Ring at that point but her era had yet to begin, we can probably consider everything between the two battles as the Age of the Crucible. We also know that there was a short lived Age of Abundance the assumption that I've seen is that the Age of Abundance was cut short by the removal of the Rune of Death because Death is a natural part of life and that the Golden Order did not exist during this time as it was still a part of the Elden Ring but in the GEQs possession. Therefore a timeline would be >Farum Azula Order >Age of the Crucible >War Against the Giants >Age of Erdtree (Abundance) >Godskin Crisis >Birth of the Golden Order >Dragon War. We know from Incantation symbols that the Golden Order is different from the Erdtree and that the Dragon War is the earliest instance of the Abundance symbol no longer being in use.
THANK YOU! I have been saying this forever. People seem blind to the fact that God and Queen are used as nigh synonyms with regards to the Elden Ring. And Placidusax's "lost God" would have been his wife as he is an Elden Lord. (Which also makes their Divine sponsor The Great Will too.) Plus there's Maliketh's whole "demigod slayer" moniker.... I don't think he was known for killing the demigods of Marika's family... So there would have to have been another family of God, her Lord, and their demigod children.
It also fits that the beastmen of Faram were gifted intelligence and 5 fingers. The beastmen currently worship dragons, there are depictions of royal/noble humans on the structures of Faram, and the most important statue beneath the Elden Ring shows normal wolves surrounding a woman. Imo this implies that at the beginning of her rule, the beasts lacked intelligence, but over time the beasts were blessed with intelligence thanks to the ER and GW.
A youtuber propose an assumption that Gloam eyed queen was never a single entity, and when destined death is unbound there will always a gloam eyed queen, i like this idea a lot as Melina said "The one who walks alongside flame, Shall one day meet the road of Destined Death." she is a kindling maiden after all, i think Melina should be the next gloam eyed queen but she cant because the rune is bound.
I hold a similar opinion. the GEQ could be an entity that constantly reemerged. As Rykard says, "A serpent never dies", and eventually Tanith comes to take his place. So perhaps the GEQ, who also shares serpent imagery through the Godskins (and who we even see has influence in the volcano manor) also "never dies". It fits her theming too as she represents the inescapable fate of the gods. Like death, it can only be postponed or or temporarily contained, it can't be truly killed. Someone always comes to take her place.
kosmos, I don't think that the gloam eyed Queen was overthrown for hunting gods excessively, because I don't know why killing other gods would be a problem for the greater will, but that she was simply overthrown for refusing to take the death rune from the elden ring ? I was wondering after watching your video if Marika could be the daughter of Gloam Eyed Queen and Placidusax? all the empyreans we've seen so far seem to be born from a god and apparently being born from a single god makes you one. with that in mind it would kind of be necessary at some point for someone to become a god so that other empyreans could be born, and with the whole DLC revelation that the land of shadow is where Marika first set foot, I've been wondering if farum azula it is considered part of the rest of the lands in between.
I think this would explain why Godrick's obsession with his lineage seems to have so much to do with dragons and why Marika has descendants like Rykard and Messmer who have so much to do with snakes, and as we know in the souls franchise, snakes are almost always descendants of dragons or the less related to them, I would also like to mention that I think the gloam eyed is a numen of the eternal cities, this union would explain why the eternal cities have such an obsession with generating dragon warriors and giving lightning powers to the mimic tears , could she be an empyrean chosen from another god but who united with placidusax and the greater will? I have always theorized that the outer god of death is actually the shadow moon, could this union of the sun and moon be the reason she is called Gloam Eyed Queen?
@@armandaneshjoo bro I literally have been reading your posts about the geq and elden ring lore I’ve come across and I want too believe it so bad where can I find it or were you trolling?? I just want too know it seems like it could be real
Really good theory… have you considered that they were both fighting to claim as many runes of the Elden ring as possible as rival Emperions? Like the Tarnished or the demigods during the shattering. That the Gloam eyed queen possessed destined death and hence no other runes are mentioned? Don’t know if that could work, but it strikes me that the Elden ring could have been shattered by the meteorite (god killed?) and the two fingers elected emperions to fight for the remaining runes… it would explain why it is now smaller than in Faram Azula artworks…
I don't think the old elden ring has more runes, in fact if you look at the only parts that seem to be real runes are the ones in the center, the rest of the runes don't complete a full circle, I think because of the way they bright and the shape of this Ring that these runes are actually part of the root rune simulating the appearance of real runes
As the Shadow of the Elden Tree DLC approaches, I'm staking my bet on the Gloam-Eyed Queen's identity. She is Marika's older sister and Melenia's mother. The GEQ is like Marika, a former god who fell from the Greater Will's grace and like Marika is imprisoned in the Elden Tree...except it's the Elden Tree within the Shadowlands, not Marika's. Thus that allows Melenia's statement about her being born within the Elden Tree and given a task by her mother correct, except the task her mother the GEQ gives Melenia is destroy Marika's Elden Tree out of revenge. But what about Ranni's similarities? If Marika and the GEQ were sisters, that means they shared a mother that likely gave the gloam eye to the GEQ. Thus Ranni's possession of similar traits is from inheritance from her grandmother.
Gloam Eyed Queen = Marika, that's why Maliketh is guarding her the little girl statue in Maliketh arena is Marika with her red wolf of Radagon Marika wields black flames
Something im suprised you haent mentioned is that Malikeths armor looks like a crow, which supports the idea that he might be responsible for the seal in Melina's eye. Which explains why the eye only activates after you have killed maliketh in the Lord of Frenzy ending.
the twin birds, god of death, is sealed in melena as well is the fell god, god of flames, sealed in mesmer, since both gods are threats to the new order of life and the erd tree. mesmes and melena were the first demigods, born before the order of gold and because of that they were used to seal the enemies of the new order.
To me it's cear enough that the Gloam Eyed Queen channeled blackflame using the Godslayer Greatsword. She wielded Destined Death. The only other character that we see explicitelly chanelling flames and not producing them is Melina, the ONLY Kindling Maiden who's path is intricately woven with Destined Death as stated by the Blade of Calling. To me without relying on eye shenanigans we can infer that Melina is the Gloam Eyed Queen.
@@TheExai And the Gloam Eyed Queen was an Empyrean. Just like Ranni, Malenia and Miquella. She like other children of Marika probably saw that the Golden Order was bullshit and decided to try and overthrow the Greater Will. But she was severely punished for that and was brought back as Melina.
8:48 This needs to be clarified, that is misreading of the item description, it understandable because if not carefully read you might think it’s referring to Faram Azula itself. I will highlight the important details w/ Caps In the written text: “Originally rubble FROM a RUIN which FELL from the sky, this surviving fragment was honed into a weapon.” “The RUIN it came from CRUMBLED when STRUCK by a meteorite, as such this weapon harbors its destructive power.” This is talking about the pieces of Faram Azula you find around the Lands Between especially in Limgrave and Liurnia. Which is told through the Sanctuary stone reveal they’re from Faram. “A rare piece of stone fragment found near places where RUINS have FALLEN from the sky.” So the Ruin Greatsword is referring to THOSE ruins of Faram Azula being hit by a meteorite and from it can the sword. Not that Faram was destroyed by a meteorite. That is a big misconception, there’s no information in the game that states that Faram Azula was destroyed by a Meteorite AT ALL.
Farum azula is referred to as "slowly crumbling ruins in the skies" in the beastmen ashes. So farum azula are the ruins referenced in that item. Also, I don't know how you feel about cut content, but in 1.0 you could loot gravity stones in farum which served as a nother hint it was struck by meteor. Also considering the hovering state of some of the stone work and the spread of the ruins on the ground, it just makes sense it was hit by a meteor.
@@Kosmos_er That’s true for the ashes but that doesn’t disprove my point, the ruin greatsword is referring to a single ruin of Faram Azula, not the former mausoleum itself. If it was specifically a pre destroyed Faram it would specified w/ something like “piece of a former mausoleum” or “a piece of a during the crumbling of a former land.” It is specific in its wording, it came from a ruin, separate from Faram Azula itself. Even If you think it’s Post Faram destruction, than it still wouldn’t explain Faram’s end just that it was hit by meteorite at some point. As for cut content, I don’t think it’s wise to use material that can easily be changed post DLC but can be also be contradictory to the base game itself. I heavily dislike the communities trend of using CC to flesh out their lore especially since may other ER cut content hole sales contradicts the base game itself. If From wants us to know something, it’ll be in the game. I have my own theories on why FA was destroyed but to give a bone to you, when you defeat Radahn and unlock the path to Nokron, the hole it create has a striking similarity to Faram Azula minus the tornadoes. It can be referred that maybe Faram Azula was in that similar state, however that is the only in game reference you can use in the game. So I remain skeptical of the meteorite theory.
An interesting analysis. But one which ignores the Age of the Crucible. There was an Age of the Great Tree. Then the Great Tree was felled in some manner thus far unexplained. And the Age of the Crucible began. In this age, the ancient roots of the Great Tree sprouted with new life of many different kinds. Not at all unlike a real tree whose roots have survived when the trunk has been destroyed, by say, a fire. At some point the Erdtree was GRAFTED into this system, and became the dominant branch. You can actually see this progression in artwork and statuary in game. Statues of Marika surrounded by the many buds of the crucible age, which are very similar to simpler statues of Marika now tending a single, solitary growth. These statues, along with the Crucible Knights being front and center among Godfrey's earliest warriors, demonstrate that Marika herself presided over, or at the very least was present for, the Age of the Crucible. Now, it's tempting to associate the Crucible with Placidusax's reign. The Elden Ring of Farum Azula is not a representation of a tree, as are the later forms of it, but rather of a massive and likely ancient root system. This would seem to dovetail nicely with the idea that the tree component was not present, and the focus was on the surviving and still thriving roots. This could suit your theory, with the GEQ being the God of the Age of the Crucible, later overthrown by Marika to bring about the Age of the Erdtree. But there are a couple of things that bother me and make me ask questions. What happened to the Great Tree? How does Marika know that the Flame of the Giants is a threat to the Erdtree? How and why are the Eternal Cities important to the narrative beyond simply being a previous civilization in the Lands Between? Why are the Giants on the Mountaintop killed with Deathblight? Doesn't this imply that the Rune of Death was still a part of the Elden Ring as late as this victory that ushers in Marika's godhood? How does Radagon fit into this equation? Radagon doesn't get nearly enough attention from the lore community, as he is just about the most pivotal player in the whole thing. He's the penultimate boss, after all, with only his master in the Elden Beast challenging us in his wake. Why does Marika, if she wishes her Order to be eternal, have AT LEAST THREE plans to end her age and bring about a new one under a new God/Lord (Miquella, who is clearly intended to be her successor and seemingly with her blessing. Melina, a daughter whose purpose is to destroy the Erdtree and end it's Age, and the Tarnished, meant to overthrow Radagon and replace him as Elden Lord)? There is also the very deliberate naming of the Gloam Eyed Queen. Or, alternatively, the Dusk Eyed Queen. Gloam usually being associated with morning, while dusk with evening. One heralding the end of night and the beginning of a bright new day (perhaps the transition between the Nox age of night and the Age of the bright Erdtree) and the other the end of day and the fall of night (most clearly the end of the Age of the Erdtree and the start of Ranni's Age of Stars). I don't think we have all the answers yet.
My theory at this time: Placidusax is the Lord of the Age of the Great Tree. Which is synonymous with the Age of Night of the Nox and the Eternal Cities. An Age of Night and Death. Farum Azuls is OBSESSED with death. The trespass of the Eternal Cities was to turn against the Tree and the Greater Will, with the Finger Slayer Blade being crafted to slay the God of the age. This rebellion failed and the Eternal Cities were punished. This resulted in a small group of Nox becoming Tree worshippers, and they left the Eternal Cities before they were punished by the Greater Will, becoming the Numen. (There is evidence of tree worship among the Eternal Cities' population in Leyndell, which was built around the remains of the Nameless Eternal City before it collapsed into the Deeproot Depths.) Marika, as we would now call her but who may not have used this name back then, is a Numen, an Empyrean chosen by the Fingers and wishes to usher in her own age. She goes to war with the dragons. Ultimately vanquishing or driving off their god and defeating Placidusax. Then burning down the Great Tree with the Giants' Flame. Beginning the Age of the Crucible. This is an age of BALANCE. Both Life and Death. The cycle. This is the Age of the GEQ. The age between. The Age of Gloam and possibility. And yes, this makes Marika the GEQ. The still healthy root system sprouts anew, with a host of new life and competing visions for what comes next. The Godskins, who have long since lost their way from their true purpose, are created by the GEQ to prune this new life. To shape this new age. Marika works alongside the Greater Will in this endeavor, in hopes of becoming vessel to the Elden Ring and a God herself. But she has doubts about her partner. About the Greater Will. So she casts off part of herself, as Malenia accidentally cast off her warrior's pride in battle with Radahn, in an effort to plumb the depths of her doubts and find answers about the new age she is being led to create. It is this offshoot that we would now call Radagon. But back then SHE was a dead ringer for the being we NOW call Marika. Her twin sister, if you will. This new being, who would take the name Marika has plans of her own. She is chosen by the Greater Will to usher in the Age of the Erdtree. The Erdtree is not native to the Lands Between. It is GRAFTED into the root system during the Crucible age and then nurtured and defended until it is the only branch remaining. This "Marika" (again, Radagon) recruits Horah Loux and his Crucible Knights. This "Marika" is given Malekith as a shadow. This "Marika" CANNOT wield the power of the Elden Ring. She is NOT a God. But she wants to be, to replace her sister. So she goes to war. She overcomes every challenge, leaves the Erdtree as the sole remaining branch. But she knows the Giants' Flame is threat, so she goes to the Mountaintop to cage it. At this point, the Rune of Death is STILL WITHIN THE ELDEN RING. Thus, the Giants being killed by deathblight. With the Erdtree safe and all other challengers defeated, "Marika" turns on her sister. Malekith defeats the GEQ and seals the Rune of Death, ushering in the Golden Order. There is, however, a new problem. The Giants, though defeated, curse their foe. "Marika" is transformed, becoming Radagon. He can no longer be a vessel for the Elden Ring, no longer become a God. Worse, his entire age is built to worship Marika. So he imprisons his defeated sister within the Erdtree. It is she who is now named Queen Marika the Eternal. This is why every depiction of Marika, even at her First Church, depicts her in her imprisonment. The people have no idea of the context, but the Marika they worship is not the Marika they think it is. This is how "Radagon is Marika". Everything the Golden Order attributes to Queen Marika the Eternal is actually the work of Radagon. This is why the Erdtree's age of plenty ends so swiftly. This is why Marika is opposed to Radagon, why she has multiple succession plans, why Melina, who inherited her mismatched eyes from her mother, exists to burn the Erdtree, and even how and why Miquella can be a male Empyrean destined to become a matured, female God. This is why Godfrey is Tarnished. This is how the Gloam Eyed Queen can also be the Dusk Eyed Queen.
Eu não sei se você tem a tradução automática de comentários mas eu vou dar um completamento da sua teoria Eu acho muito possível que Marika seja filha da gloam eyed queen e placidusax Isso explicaria pq Marika é um empírio Já que aparentemente só os semi-deuses podem ser escolhidos como empírio como Ranni se eles não nascerem como um empírio vindo de um único deus Assim Marika seria escolhida como a herdeira para se tornar a nova deusa mas trairia a antiga ordem por uma de vida eterna na ordem áurea E isso pra mim é muito possível pelo fato da pele retratada em imagens e pinturas de Radago e Marika ter um tom muito estranho de branco e quando os encontramos na batalha final ela parece literalmente ser feita de pedra até pq invés de ser machucada por destruir o Elden ring, ela foi rachada, indicando que ela pode ter herdado a pele de pedra de seu pai placidusax
Nisso eu também acho que Serosh era provavelmente a sombra da gloam eyed Queen, já que ele é responsável pelos homens fera ganharem inteligência e as próximas sombras que viriam são homens fera eu acho que Serosh serviria como uma sombra primitiva que a Greater Will aprimoraria em maleketh
Eyes. It's always eyes, the gloam eye, the rune of death sealed in the eye that carried it, Melina's gloam eye, the gloam eyed (plural) queen, the eyes of shibari, Shibari referencing river blindness, the runes being eyes- Eyes on the inside- wait wrong game.
If Melina & Ranni are the body and yurei of the Gloam-eyed queen, then maybe synthetic [re]birth caused the separation. If Queen Rennala is still so in love with her ex-husband that she has a piece of her beloved ex in an erdtree sap egg then maybe Rennala helped the Gloam-eyed Queen with rebirthing because Rennala wants her ex-husband back (black knife arc). Maybe rebirthing a god/goddess has consequences like yurei & body separation. Perhaps, the Gloam-eyed Queen was rebirthed more than once and the first time created Marika (in line with greater will) which is why she becomes the next god while the other rebirths created Melina (original gloam-eyed queen) & Ranni (not-in line with greater will). Perhaps there's never a newly appointed queen maybe it's always the gloam-eyed queen to bear the ring but changes as the ring changes through some form of rebirth/birth-cycle. Yurei being of japanese lore but perhaps there's other IRL lore that explains consequences between natural (current natural method), ill-natural (non-current method for the times) & unnatural (synthetic) rebirths/birth-cycle. Izanami might be a great name to look into. Beastial Birth-Cycle system (natural but called ill-natural during erdtree, aka primordial) Erdtree Birth-Cycle system (synthetic but called natural during erdtree, aka societal) Miquella Birth-Cycle system (naturally synthetic or transitioned synthetically [hidden as if taboo just like omen were hidden], aka progressivistical) Rennala Rebirth (advanced synthetics by magic [similar to magic technology and digital as an advanced type of synthetics with similar regards], aka globalistical)
i agree with a lot of this but i do not think the fingers were what made her an empyrean, i feel like the outer god she followed gave her that power, and when her actions were too ambitious for the greater will they sent forth marika and maliketh to usurp a ruler that would go against their ideals
either that or something like the offspring of whoever the dragonlord was the elden lord for as that would mirror how marika's offspring are also shown as empyreans, and killing off the bloodline of the previous new age god does kind of fit with what the fingers entrust us to do with marika's offspring as we collect great runes
Great video! Do you think the snowy crone Ranni met and based her body on could have anything to do with GEQ? Ranni's magic is considered heretical without explicit reasons why. But it's really just frost magic. In a similar sense deathbird flames are Int frost also.
honestly i am personally not sure, the snowy crone is a big question mark here. I had her as a more active actor with her being torrent's former master but with the strong possibility that it could be miquella, i don't know anymore. We will have to wait and see if DLC gives us any crumbs
@Kosmos I can't wait for whatever it yields. I've been scraping all the little details for possible signs. One wrench in the process of it is a matter of explaining when death was removed and if the Godskins could have had any past with the Nox or not. A certain detail I make this point on is the Divine Towers being much inspired on the nature of each demigod for accessibility. Yet, for Radahn's it looks like a sealed off retreat a Godskin attempted to secure their treasure down. Sort of like the implications of Sellia being linked to Nokron, but the access to Nokron now being withheld by Radahn and Sellen's investigation on the matter being likely what locked her up.
OH! Ok so here's an order for what happens around the time of the game: 1) Marika is having thoughts against the Greater Will (perhaps ambitions of some kind) and so she loses her tarnished that had been given the grace of gold (visions (ie prophecies) of the erdtree). 2) Radagon is recalled to her for the purpose of creating some Empyreans that could bring in the new age. I think given that eternity is a fundamental of the Golden Order that the ideal Empyrean would be most similar to Marika (all the potential Emperyans so far have been women (as so far as Miquella has a feminine aspect)) 3) The Empyreans of this age aren't happy with Marika because the eternal stagnation she's brought upon the world is causing them trouble. Also because noone can die other outer gods can start meddling with all that free time. The Greater Will doesn't like that. 4) Miquella is the first to come close to bringing in the new age, and also I think the closest to Marika. If I can step back a bit, I think Marika was able to claim the Elden Ring and bring in a new age because she had someone die and it became a source of huge motivation for her, that's why her age (represented by the erdtree and the lack of death) was precipitated by removing the Rune of Death. Plus the Greater Will was ready to shuffle on the Gloam Eyed Queen. So Miquella is desperate to save his sister, and his Rune is hinted (through cut content) to have been the Rune of Abundance. I like to think that this infers that each Emperyan (and to a lesser extent each demigod) has an affinity with an existing rune of the Elden Ring, which will also come to define their age. I think Abundance is pretty close to Eternal, so it's the first pick by the Greater Will for who will ascend. I think he got pretty damn close - I think through St Trina he was close to replacing death with dreams as a way to soothe his sister, who can never know peace. I think the Fundamentals of the Golden Order were important to him before (and why he was the favourite to ascend), even if he had begun to look elsewhere (the Eclipse). Malenia is having too bad a time to even think about how to shape a world order. She loves her brother and she'll be his Elden Lord (not in like, a sexual way, but I do think she would play a huge roll in his world of abundance as an arbiter of decay - she would help a stagnant world move again, and abundance requires cycles of life and death). Actually, now that I think about it, she may have been co-vessal of the Elden Ring with him, and St Trina would be the face of the operation. At the same time, Ranni is getting some Heresy Lessons from Renna and is thinking maybe it's not such a great idea to have everyone's lives dictated by ANY Outer Gods (so not the front runner to take over). I think Ranni and Miquella probably shared notes on a few things (the Eclipse being one). I don't know if either of them knew it would be Godwyn who was slain. 5) The death of Godwyn changes things for Miquella, no more time to fuck around, it's time to metamorphosise. What has happened here is his sister is now under the threat of dying, not just suffering. Now his passion was high and an aspect of his world as a God began to sprout. I can't remember in this moment if the Haligtree was already established before the death of Godwyn, but now is when Miquella decides to fuse with the tree. I think, given that unlike when the erdtree overtook the crucible the Haligtree is in a separate part of the world, that Miquella may be attempting to create a new world order separate from the Elden Ring, by metamorphosing his being into what the Elden Beast is to the Elden Ring, thereby becoming the literal governing structure of a new world order. I mean hey, the Elden Ring was in tatters, so obviously that wasn't such a robust system. Miquella now needs the Eclipse to happen asap. I think maybe (strong maybe) the Greater Will might be the sun, or the sun acts as a conduit of some kind. Unfortunately Radhan is holding onto all the stars and so shit isn't moving. Malenia is dispatched to maybe treaty with him, or maybe just merc him. Either way while she's out Mogh comes in and nabs Miquella so now the Haligtree world order plan is caput. 6) Before the Greater Will can set up a new plan (and with its control on the world not as infallible due to the shattered Elden Ring), Malenia decides to kill Radhan. Maybe she knew Miquella was gone and was in Caelid (right over Mogh's palace) to get down to him somehow. Maybe she hoped that killing Radhan would bring down a meteorite that her brother had predicted would crash through Selia, and maybe she deduced that it was targeting Mogh for heresy. Maybe she really had been sent to kill him from the very beginning and didn't know Miquella was gone. Either way, she tries to kill Radhan and blooms. Maybe something inate to the Lands Between loves trees, but Malenia's tree at the Heart of Aoenia is very different to the Erdtree, or the Great Tree of the Crucible, or to the Haligtree. All of these trees are rendered similarly, and I think that's due to the ideals of the Greater Will being conveyed through the Elden Ring. When the Haligtree was conceived (as an embodiment of the ideals of a blooming world order) Miquella's study of Fundamentalism meant that his world order was not that different, just incrementally better. No, Malenia's tree is twisted despair from all the rot she has dealt with - not a well constructed world view. But she still loved her brother, and so the tree is budding with flowers, and wildflowers grow at the base of the tree. If she had been left here I think she would have bloomed again into the Godess of Rot, vessal for the Outer God of Rot, and her tree would have taken over the world. But she was carried back to the Haligtree where her lost brother still blessed her with unwaking sleep. 7) So two new ages have nearly come into blossom without the oversite of the Greater Will and the second one almost brought in an age under the influence of another Outer God, so the Greater Will gets desperate and puts out a siren call to any desperate tarnished to see if anyone can patch up Marika well enough to salvage control over the world. Needless to say, the events of the game happen. Notes: Ranni's ending doesn't repair the Elden Ring at all. Ranni doesn't get her ending because she was an Empyrean (she cast off that flesh anyway), she gets it because there is no Outer God meddling so no need to be a vessel for anything. There is no new Tree. The world will be as it is, not a manifestation of something (or someone's) ideals. Godwyn is absolutely now an Empyrean if not a God in his own right due to the shard of death stuck in his body. I think Ranni's discarding of her flesh tells us that's the god-holding part. Godwyn has no soul to instil any ideals into the vessel beyond the Rune yelling DEATH, so now his age is coming (as the DLC).
Other notes: Miquella and Malenia are both able to metamorphise a new world independently of The Greater Will. This is represented by their butterflies. The third kindling butterfly may be related the Frenzy Flame which had been gaining traction in the lands between with regular folk and tarnished - maybe you become an Empyrean as the vessel of the Frenzied Flame. You are chosen by its fingers after all. Melina may still by rights be the daughter of The Gloam Eyed Queen and also Empyrean potential. Maybe watching you burn down the world insights a passion in her that awakens her potential. God-devouring serpent probably sensed a growing passion (or dispassion) in Rykard and so was able to gain power by devouring a proto-god. Or perhaps the fragment of the Elden Ring was what caused a gain in power - maybe the god-devouring serpant specifically feeds on laws of reality and that's what the Elden Ring is made of. Malenia's Great Rune is described as having meant to be the most powerful. Cut content also suggests it's the Rune of Decay. I think if she were not afflicted by the Rot her world order would see that her brother can live a full life, which necessitates growing old and eventually decaying. Decay is also necessary for new life, for iteration and improvement. The Rune is powerful because it hinders forces too destructive and nourishes budding life. The real problem is when she had the Rune in her possession it got corrupted by another God so it just amplified the sad times :(
Hey there! Great stuff! I am inclined to agree with your take that the Gloam eyed Queen was someone of the previous age. I think we have a name for that in the 'Sun Realm'. From the item 'Sun realm shield'. 🛡 the item description mentions a city bathed in sunlight now long gone. Perhaps this was the city Faram Azula once was conjoined to? Food for thought!
@@es-rh8oo references in fromsoft games are derived from unimportant events and/or information... The “Sun realm” is too important & significant of a subject to be downplayed as “a reference” This is a thing to remember for ALL fromsoft games. If the information feels intrinsic to the game’s world, then it is not just a reference
It's less about them beating the gods in combat (clearly maliketh did it) but more about facing a civilization backup by a god and the ancient dragons in war. We the tarnished arrive at an already shattered lands between that has mostly already destroyed itself. Taking the elden ring from a golden order still functioning would be impossible. This is where the support of the greater will with what I think is the meteor that struk farum comes in.
The elden ring is like the Anti Life Equation. A mathematical equation thag governs reality. The golden order is a certain way to arrange the runes and also the order that follows this veiw of reality. The outer gods wish to rearrange the order of the runes to change their vision for reality in the lands between.
Maybe she's her mother who knows? Definitely related since to be an Empyrian, Marika has to be a demi-god, and to be a demi-god one has to be in a familial relation to the current god or lord/consort.
@@armandaneshjoo I watched the Kosmos video, but there's still nothing about GRRM's vs Miyazaki's mythos thing. I just want to know where you got that information. There's no comment search function so I think it might be unrealistic of me to find your other comment, unless it's a top comment.
Ive always been of the opinion that "gloam eyed something" became a position that could be mantled by anyone (including Melina) once death was removed from the order as a necessary concept would always attempt to return. I dont think that conflicts your theory either.
This is convincing but I’m still more convinced that the GEQ is the historical Marika, and the Marika that the golden order talks about is a figurehead. That Maliketh defeated the gloam eyed queen and that he talks about Marika’s sins and that she’s been stabbed with destined death all tell me that the GEQ is a nickname for Marika. (The Blaidd/Ranni story hints this). I think the god of the old age is Gransax or the actual Elden Beast. Marika’s just a figure head for the entire history of the golden older. The age of the dragons was pre-Christian Rome, and the Age of the Erdtree is after Rome co-opts and takes over Rome. The crucible described the area between Jesus’s birth but before an orthodox Christianity is established and there’s many different interpretations of Christianity and it is blending with a lot of other faiths as well. Your interpretation definitely could be correct but the Jesus Christ imagery surrounding Marika seems too numerous to not use that to fill in gaps in the lore. She’s a vessel for the Elden Ring, which can be interpreted as Logos or The Word which makes her literally The Word Made Flesh. She also is very directly tied to the Erdtree which seems like a stand in for the Tree of Life, another symbol tied to Jesus Christ. Much like Christianity promotes a story about Jesus Christ that is probably not the historical Jesus of Nazareth, I think the Golden Order does the same. They have an image and a belief system they want to create order and control, but that may not coincide with who Jesus actually was and what his goals were.
I don't have a direct counter argument, but this requires a lot of additional assumptions to integrate all the other hints and cues we get. Marika coming from the eternal cities, her documented story with Godfrey and Radagon, the existence of her bed chamber, her speeches in the churches.... That's a little too much lore bending to make it believable for me.
@@Managarm why would it require any assumptions for those? Or at least any more assumptions than we’ve already made. Godfrey is Peter. Radagon is later popes who act as if they’re literally speaking for God/Jesus. And the Nox are definitely Jews in the game. They were followers of the Greater Will before anyone else was. They seemed to be oppressed by the ancient dragons like the Jews were oppressed by Rome. There’s also a good chance they rejected Marika as a messianic figure. It’s only requiring different interpretations of the lore from the ways people jumped to interpret it. And those initial interpretations leave a ton of contradictions and extra mysteries in the lore anyways.
Why are we sure that it was the greater will whose vessel was the Gloam eyed queen? could a different Outer god use the elden ring with the same ritual, and use the Gloam eyed queen as vessel? If yes, what if the Turning point of the war between Marika and the GEQ was a bargain or agreement between Marika and the greater will? She becomes a vessel and gets to be an empyrean for now with promises of becoming a god later, Her army gets superpowers with the guidance of grace, She gets Malekith as her shadow, and with this a fighting chance against the overwhelming power of the GEQ and Placidusax and the Godskins, beastmen, Dragons ETC. What if the Greater will was a new player who took an opportunity when the GEQ started hunting down anyone with prospects of godhood? Better yet, what if The meteor that Shattered Furum Azula was the elden beast itself, and the golden meteors on the top of the divine towers were used to pull him onto the lands between, basically Nuking the enemy's capital AND getting the Greater Will onto the board? We know Gold is connected to outer gods, Miquella's needle proves it. Do we know if Unalloyed gold can only be used to repel the meddling of outer gods, or if the Exact opposite is also possible? I think it is. The greater will seems parasitic at times, so its not unthinkable that it just replaced the previous god of the lands between, twisted Its rituals to his end, removed the Rune of death and rearranged the other greater runes to cement his own order, Grafted his own tree on top of the old one, and erased history of anyone that came before, just as Marika deemed herself Eternal (which implies the lack of a beginning just as lack of an end), and Godfrey was named the First Elden Lord. I do base this theory on the assumption that the Greater Will IS for all intents and purposes an Outer God, even if the fundamentalists say otherwise. If i was an outer god vying for exclusive control of the lands between i would lie and say that im Way above the pathetic entities such as the Formless mother to consolidate power.
Look, I think what is messing everybody up is the assumption that the Gloam Eyed Queen and Marika were not one in the same person. Think about it, how can the GEQ go against Marika wielding Destined Death if it could simply be sealed by Marika? Willing to bet Maleketh was known as "Death of the Demigods" because he was Marika's right hand during the Godhunt, and when Malaketh defeated the GEQ and her Godskins he actually defeated Marika for transgression against the Two Fingers because she burned the Erdtree, and that is why Malaketh has the stone right eye that is a gloam eye, because it is Marika's eye, because he took it from her as GEQ. His job as shadowbound beast to Marika is to turn on Marika should she piss off the Two Fingers. I think as GEQ she actually burned the first tree. She committed the first cardinal sin. That got not only her power sealed but a watchdog, Radagon, who could monitor her actions, become the perfect empyrean making counterpart, and serve as a perfect punishment to Marika by becoming all of he opposites in hopes of making a perfect Rebis capable of making a perfect being, and this was the beginning of the Golden order, the punishment of Marika to become the vessel. Radagon, as a person however, always sought perfection, not the Golden Order. I think the Elden Beast was trying to perfect itself and that is why this particular punishment was given, to make Marika the vessel. I think this is why Ranni is so willing to go to any length to shed her empyrean flesh, because of what happened to Marika. I think ever since Marika became Radagon, Radagon has slowly been taking over her over time, and that's why Radagon seems to become more active as Marika becomes less active thru the timeline of the game, and I think this seeking of perfection by the Elden Ring, thru Radagon, is actually what starts the transition to Golden Order Fundamentalism the more Radagon takes hold. I think Marika was punished twice, first as GEQ for burning the Erdtree via Malaketh and Radagon, 2nd by imprisonment in the Erdtree for shattering the Elden Ring, and this is why she mocks Radagon, saying "thou have yet to become me, thou have yet to become a god." Because at the end of the day she is the vessel not him, which is why she wins out and shatters the Elden Ring. In fact it may be the reason she is upset about Godwyn and that's the reason for it, it may be because Godwyn seems to be her only non-Omen child she didn't have with Radagon. If so, that may make him able to be the one Empyrean she could have truly outside of Two Fingers influence. If she was the GEQ, plotting against the two fingers the whole time, this would make more sense than any other reason I have heard. Of course, we could be about to find out that Melina was a child Marika had with Messmer, and that is why she is the kindling maiden. I think Messmer may have helped Marika burn the Erdtree as GEQ. But why have children with Radagon tho? It may be as a Nox, she thought Radagon could become the perfect substitute for a Silver Tear Albinuric in the making of a true Lord of Night, but after having Miquella Malenia, and Melina, maybe she realized the Two Fingers would control/influence her children as well, and gave the only one who didn't have a body for the Two Fingers to control, Melina, a very special mission only she could do. Return Destined Death to the world, either by burning, or by becoming. IDK.....I think everything just makes a lot more sense this way.
Hey, Could you please link the music you used in the video? If it's from Epidemic, can you please name which tracks you used in that case? Particularly the first track is really amazing
No one ever talks about who might the snow witch be. You know rani's mentor. Could it have been the gloam eye queen? If she would be alive somewere lol
Love the video. Got me thinking if the girl in maleketh's boss room under the old elden ring is the gloam eyed queen then she looks alot like the character in the promotional poster for the extension shadows of the erdtree. I don't think anyone has mentioned this. It's the Gloam Eyed Queed not miquella in the image. Mind blown. Please keep making your videos love them so much.
I think the person in the image represents Miquella, the tree being strangled by the other crooked tree represents Godwyn and the graves in the fields represent the gloam eyed queen, the expansion would about these 3 characters
This puts so much together… The Age of the Crucible - Age of Chaos death The age of the Erdtree - Age of life and order Both are extremes that didn’t workout. Both are called queens and serve an ages God.
This is fantastic. Kudos.
Apologies, I can't NOT ask you some questions with this new insight. The video indicates that the Giant-Conquering Hero's Grave was used during the Giant's war, before the Age of the Erdtree, and this was done with the blessing of the two fingers. So post-cleft of the celestial hand. You have long hinted at a video centered on the GEQ. Are you going to refer to this video to in that GEQ video?
What legendary shoutout between lorechads
he got some things wrong but most of them right the same as you, the reason you all keep getting it wrong is because you refuse to see marika and ranni as the villains as they were meant to and instead of blame the greater will that is probably long dead or at least inactive
@@AmryLI love that he ignored you lmfao
Blessings from the Archeologist himself
I do like the idea of the gloam eyed queen going mad with ambition and attempting to make her age eternal by killing off any gods or empyreans that could stand against her. It lines up really well with why she would make the godskins
A hint that I discovered that may also indicate that the Gloam-eyed Queen is alive, is from the "Godskin Swaddling Cloth" talisman. The description of the talisman reads: "The Gloam-Eyed Queen cradles newborn apostles swaddled in this cloth. Soon they will grow to become the death of the gods." The verb "Cradles" is used in the present tense. I believe that if the GEQ was dead or somehow inactive than the aforementioned practice would have been described with "Cradled" instead. Item description that contains information about dead characters are all in past tense, at least those I skimmed through.
The video was great btw! Even if some of it ends up being wrong, I still really enjoyed it.
Very nice insight, did you notice how the iron maidens, which were made in Rykards mothers image, is shown cradling a newborn? Kinda strange to picture what that things true form is, with all those snakes underneath
With how bad ER's translations can be at times, I really wouldn't put much hope in the past and present tense of things in item descriptions. It could originally be in past tense, or left intentionally ambiguous, but translated into present for the simply sake of flow and simplicity.
It happened with other items already, so it wouldn't be a surprise with this one.
@@WildBandit300 I checked the Japanese Godskin Swaddling Cloth/神肌のおくるみ description, and it's a bit tricky. It did not use past tense for cradle, it uses simple present 抱かれる instead of past tense 抱かれた. The tricky part is "抱かれる" is practically a past tense because the more accurate translation is "to be embraced", it's a passive verb used on the subject (newborn apostles) and not an active verb to indicate what the queen is doing (it'll be 抱く to cradle/embrace instead); so more accurately the translation would be "The newborn apostles swaddled in this cloth, is embraced by the GEQ".
I think the localizer team decided to use "cradles" to keep the present tense and while it's technically not wrong, it could be misconstrued like in rare cases such as this. So personally it's not a strong enough evidence of her current state, I think "flee" from the other description already implies she's alive at least.
Though the last part "Soon they will grow to become the death of the gods" sounds more like "and then, they'll become the death of the gods (after being nurtured by GEQ)", there's no ominous future connotation.
@@eldenringpvpenthusiast1710I think it’s because the abductor virgins are sent out to capture and bring back maidens to birth new snakemen. Ryker’s has a cruel streak after all, makes sense he would put a dark joke on his abducting machines.
@@GreebleClown did Rykard use those things while in the golden order? It would imply Marika steals babies and converts them or reinstitutionalizes them. I'm not familiar with Rykards lore tbh though, volcano manor is one of those areas I'll bolt through, lol
This is an excellent theory and explains why there is so little information available about Marika's 'greatest victory': Marika 'the eternal' does not want people to know that there was a time before her, so all information on the GEQ, the previous god, was erased. If instead, the GEQ-Marika conflict had Marika on the defensive, her victory would have been lauded as equal among the feats of Godrick's conquest.
Linking the twinbird and deathbirds to the GEQ also explains why there is little information on them, and raises some interesting topics. The Helphen Steeple mentions 'a lamplight similar to grace'. Was it the GEQ's equivalent of grace, a means to recycle warriors similar to how Marika's grace resurrects the tarnished?
There are some vague elements about how the spirits world and the material world relate, and how there might some mirroring going on there.
There is even the cut 1.0 Chinese description of the Helphen steeple which raises so many questions as it mentions the curse of the rune of life
@@Kosmos_er with all the duality in this game, if there is a rune of death there is a rune of life, the entirety of the lands between is alchemical based "as above, so below" and with the Land of Shadow coming into play, we may get to see one aspect of that
Yeah, this makes a lot of sense, not gonna lie.
If we somehow don't get new information on these topics in the DLC, this is probably going to be the theory that I subscribe to when it comes to the GEQ.
That said, I'd be pretty disappointed if we didn't, since the spirit world idea seems more important than most initially assumed.
Unlucky.
@@three_seashells I made my peace with it, and I still subscribe to this idea in the end. I just see the GEQ as ancient and mostly lost history. Her being the Queen of the previous order with Placidusax as her lord still holds up in more ways than one.
@@TheRealTetroComing to this theory after the dlc and I definitely subscribe to it
@@KaliTakumi At this point it's pretty much the only thing that makes sense in my opinion, if you're going to be tying everything together.
This is a really interesting concept kosmos, I had never thought to pair the Gloam eyed queen with the dragons. And your right, nobody ever acknowledges the period between Placidusaxs rule and Godfreys. Another thing I would point out is that if anyone had any skepticism regarding the theory of Placidusax being the king consort, they have to remember 2 things. The 1st thing being that there are always certain themes and concepts that Fromsoftware like to keep repeating with their games, there are particularly a lot of similarities between the dark souls games and Elden ring. Think about Quella and Miquella, Sif and Fortissax, Maidens as a concept, the list goes on, and to me, the dragon-person relationship between Placidusax and the Gloam-eyed queen reminds me a lot of Seath and Gwyndoline. The second thing I would add is that, maybe their relationship wasn’t as dragon and person but person and person, as we know, Lansseax possesses the ability to take human form, we know this from Vykes armour I think. But what if the union between Placidusax in human form and the Gloam-Eyed queen resulted in numerous Demi-gods, such Demi-gods could have been the either the bodies in the walking mausoleums or the targets of the god hunt for whatever reason. Or maybe they are potential dlc characters/bosses. Or maybe they just didn’t exist at all. I don’t know, but an interesting idea nonetheless.
Não sei se você tem a tradução automática de comentários mas vou responder mesmo assim
Eu acho que os semi-deuses descendentes desses dois seriam Marika e os godskins
Faria sentido porque ambos têm características draconianas, os godskins têm caudas e Marika parece ter literalmente pele de pedra já que a vemos rachada no final do jogo
This idea does make alot of sense, espcially in light of the previous videa that gives a compelling interpretation of Mleina's eye that isn't "she s the GEQ". If farum azula and the GEQ are tied together, it would imply the dragons sided with the GEQ, perhaps this explains the ancient dragon's attacking lleyndel.
It's not just the ancient dragons. Read the description of the protection of the Erdtree incantation. EVERYTHING was in opposition to the Erdtree. This means no one wanted Marika to use the life force of the land to create the Erdtree and went to war to stop her.
@@Demokaze that’s interesting
Id say the GEQ is definitely tied into Farum Azula as if she is a queen with a consort that is Placidusax it makes sense that her children have draconic features
@@skuruhai001 that would explain the serpentine attributes of the Godskin. They are, in a sense, imperfect dragons, aka serpents; like the primordial serpents in Dark souls, wich they also have humanoid features.
@@Demokaze one thing i dont like is that you are going in the direction of so many people that got it wrong, so long as you dont make the mistake of thinking that marika is a martyr and put the blame for all of her actions on the greater will then everything will be fine
One thing about Maliketh Maria's shadow.
When we fought Maliketh and he activates the rune of death, the title that game gives him is MALIKETH SLAYER OF DEMIGODS. That raises the question, who are those Demigods that Malik2 slained to bare his title? Well Godskins in my point of view was the Gloam Eyed Queen's DEMIGODS LINEAGE and those are slained by Maliketh we must keep in mind to that also when we talk about Maliketh, because he was not only a tool to suppress the death rune alone, do 5 forget that
Great video! Just wanted to point out that Rennala is also a queen but not a god. GEQ could have just been an empyrean in the running for godhood against Marika. I like the theory that she was/is a great serpent. The godskins have ties to the volcano manor, serpentine features and an unusual birthing process like the man serpents. There is an ancient rivalry of snek vs Erdtree that could be inspired by GEQ's clash with Marika.
wow that sounds great it would explain why serpents never die "they are death"
This actually fits with some theorizes I've been toiling over. Taking everything you said into account with my own thoughts on the previous age, I currently think the Gloom-Eyed Queen's body is likely the Fingerslayer Blade. Based on our own experience in game, when the vessel is threatened the Elden Beast emerges and wields a sacred weapon forged from the vessel. We see this when we fight Radagon/Marika.
I agree Farum Azula was overthrown with a hostile attack from Leyndell. When they got to the Gloam-Eyed Queen, some place away from Farum Azula, this "final boss sequence" played out. The Elden Beast was defeated, its sacred blade shattered in the struggle, its body still scarred on its belly. This wounding moment was also likely the moment Destined Death was removed.
Doesnt the finger slayer blade say, that the eternal citys created it, and thus getting themselves shadowbanned underground?
Great video. This doesn’t even seem like speculation. It seems as if some of the puzzle has been pieced together perfectly.
OH MY GOD. Idk if anyone noticed this but Ranni gives you the calling bell plus a summon of 3 wolves.. in Farum Azula, probably the place of rule for the Gloam eyed queen has tons of statues of a small child/woman with three wolves, anyone looked into this?
Interesting how now with the DLC; Messmer has Godskin anotomical features. Regardless of who is who, I really hope to learn more about Melina.
FINALLY! This has always made the most sense to me. Especially Placidusax being her consort. Thanks for connecting all the dots.
Melina is still a wild card though. I definitely think shes related in some way. Could she be the daughter of both? Gender or sex wouldnt be an issue.
@@armandaneshjooSource?
@@armandaneshjoo Let me rephrase: do you have any documents or articles you can link to to verify this information, or should we just believe it because you said so?
@@armandaneshjoo The dlc most certainly did not "prove" Metyr is the GEQ, not even circumstancially. Marika is still numen, that hasn't changed. And she's a royal because she's the reigning god of the Golden Order. And it was never said that Marika wasn't with Radagon before Godfrey. We just never had any evidence or reason to believe so until now.
I think you're just mistaken. They just took the lore that GRRM wrote for the base and used what they didn't use before for the dlc.
Finally a coherent gloam eyed queen theory!
@@armandaneshjoo where did you get that? it sounds correct and i agree but i want to know where you got that from
@@armandaneshjoo yess we need the source, if you don't mind telling
Yes... YES!!!
Finally I see this idea adressed! I truly believe the Gloam Eyed Queen to be the godess of the ancient time of beasts in Farum Azula, consorted by Placidusax! Some indicators I would like to add are that the power of the Godskins is nowhere stronger than in the temple of Farum Azula - and that the GEQ is not only named a queen but she and Marika are the only beings actually called "Queen" in the entire game, therefore I find it plausible to see them adressed on the same standing, hierchically speaking. Meaning, both probably were godesses. Also, her Godslayer Greatsword has the same helixlike structure as the Sacred Relic Sword - with its opening helix probably some kind of inverse to the weapon made from Marikas/Radagons body (with a weird connection to the Sword of Milos and the Fingerslayer Blade, but I digress). However, I believe the GEQ to be a god first and an Empyrean (again) thereafter - being fled from Farum Azula and abandoning her consort after a natural calamity, not a war with Marika.
There probably was an epoch of the Eternal Cities, from which the Erdtree Religion arose, as stated by Tarnished Archaeologist, and by which Marika came to power and renown - quite a while after Farum Azulas Fall. And later there was a time of a first burning of the Erdtree, which I believe to be the culmination of the Godskin Apostacy and the Ending of the Age of Plenty. Therefore I believe (in broad strokes, there is not much time for details^^) that the GEQ fell into exile and hid in the Spiritcaller Cave in the Mountaintops (she might have been a Spiritcaller herself and Torrents former Master, anyway that could explain the stron presence of Godskins in said cave). There, she plotted her return, birthing an army of Godskins, which soon should become the death of the Gods. In the Godskin Apostacy, when Marika ruled, I believe her to have led her forces (probably in alliance with the pagans from Mt. Gelmir and Eiglays Ancestor) against the Erdtree and burning the Tree with her Black Flames, not unlike Melina does later. Here I believe, Maliketh battled her, defeated her and stole one eye of hers and also sealed her Rune of Death within himself (not his sword though, yet). But the Erdtree as a physical tree was destroyed and become more an object of faith - after he spread the Minor Erdtree Seeds over the Lands Between.
Next, I see the connection of the GEQ with Melina as follows: The GEQ after her defeat was not dead, but imprisoned by Marika. And after Marikas trespass - the Shattering of the Elden Ring - when she was crucified within the Erdtree, she used whatever was left of the GEQ - burned and bodiless - to birth a new servant at the foot of the Erdtree. A new living being, but based on the remains of the God before her - a sibling to the twins Marika had with Radagon while conjoined to one God, and therefore earning her own, Smoldering Butterflies. Melina would only awaken more of the GEQ when confronted with the Age of Frenzy - and the death of her old steed, Torrent. But in all other cases she would know how to burn the Erdtree - since the GEQ did the same before. And she would know where to bring us just after that - to Farum Azula, the GEQs former palace of reign.
There are so many more details I could elaborate on. Once you follow that premise of who the GEQ might have been, quite a lot of seemingly random details fall into place of a grand, comprehensive storyline. However, obviously I could overthink and analyse the heck out of that. So far, it's my favourite, personal theory, though and I love the fact that you adressed parts of that :)
If you made it up to here - thank you so much :D I just had to share this. Maybe it is of help ;)
I like your theory, and it makes the most sense
Great write up.
All very sound and I'm taking it as head canon
Renalla, QUEEN of the Full Moon proves that the GEQ and Marika aren't the only ones referred to as Queen in the game.
@@zeropat0000 True, also there are the Demihuman Queens. The connection between the title Queen and godhood is not valid, I concede that.
I love your videos, very interesting and compelling theories and often not following the popular current theories, you are willing to find what makes sense to you, love it :)
Great video! I love theories like that, that diverge from the mainstream without being exceptionally flawed or forced. May the blessing of the Fingers guide thee, tarnished!
I think that the Gloam Eyed Queen served a different Outer God than the Greater Will because of the Deathbird description mentioning they serve one i.e the God of Death. So Marika's uprising was quite literally the Greater Will removing the God of Death from the lands between and excerting their own control. The Elden Beast was certainly the meteor that took out Faram Azula so the Greater Will could literally transplant itself into the Elden Ring to control the world. As we know Marika is refered to being the vessel for both the Elden Ring and the Greater Will itself and with Marika's shattering of the Elden Ring the Greater Will imprisions Marika because if they disposed of her they would be disposing if themselves and their control of the lands between.
Cool ideas ! I have been surfing a similar strain of thoughts. I would only mention Stormveil Castle in the equation. Since I finished the game, I have found the parallels to the two places quite intriguing. Stormveil feels a mundane copy of a once great locale. It is rich with shallow honorifics to godfrey campaign, features eagles and lions but crassly modified with metal weaponery. The exiled knight are roaming. Hell, the place is intoxicated by Godwyn's presence, while shows sign of past death ritual in the very same vignette. Intriguingly, I retro-actively assumed that the intentional mere parallels of Stormveil's architect (Godrick ?) reveales on Farum Azula state before it got hit. A fortress found by the sea. And given Caelid rich draconic influence, the singular, godskin inhabited divine tower, the deathbirds, I let you guess where I'll put Farum Azula on the map. Defeating Radhan there and as a meteor strike Limbgrave to give us a path toward the ternal cities and Ranni's Age of Star, well, I can't help but NOT miss the irony at play. ( And what about killing Ranni's shadow in our path...) Although, even if I buy the ruler of Farum, Placidusax as consort and such I'm still not sure on Gloam-eyed queen characater. I found some of the propositions for her to be Marika's children to be interesting (it would be a nice parallel, GEQ/Godwyn and Malenia/Miquella, an empyrean contaminated by the influence of an outer god, another proposed as the prodigious child, owning the prospect of a new age stole from everyone by the intervention of ambitious relative. Plus, GEQ would have reason to dispise Marika if all she was entailed to was guarding Destined Death for its brother succes. Who's talking the perfect set up for a dlc ?) Anyway, absolutly adore what's going on with Farum Azula and found quite the excitement with your video ! (Did I mention the badlands, Godfrey barbaric legacy and such !)
This video makes a compelling case, great work! I would present a couple counter-arguments: first, the creation of the Golden Order is described as the removal of the Rune of Death, correct? I don't think that rune's removal and its sealing necessarily have to represent the same event. The Golden Order could've been established by removing the rune, and the GEQ could'be still gone on to wield its power in the age of the Erdtree - the same way we can utilize the Great Runes for our gain. And then at some point, Marika directed her shadow Maliketh to defeat the Queen and seal away Destined Death for good.
Second, if the GEQ was the god of Farum Azula, why do we find no trace of the Godskins there? If that's where they were based, surely there would be something for us to find.
All in all, it seems the most plausible to me that the GEQ was a rival empyrean, a competitor to Marika's Golden Order. That is why she wanted to hunt the gods, and why she had to be defeated. It makes sense for there to have been different candidates for godhood, the same way we have the three empyreans during the events of the game. Melina being a reincarnation of the GEQ also sounds sensible to me - after her death by burning, she was resurrected as a new person by Marika - perhaps she was among the first to be reincarnated under the Golden Order and its new logic of immortal essence, but that's purely my speculation.
For your first point. Even tho it would be odd I guess it is still technically possible.
As for the second I don't think the godskins were necessarily integral to the culture of the previous ages, no more than the crucible knights are to the golden order. They were born for the godhunt, and so are a unit with specific goals.
And tho the idea that she was a rival Empyrean is possible, considering the fact that Marika still had to get her elden ring from the previous god as far as I am concerned, and the overt presence of death in the age before the erdtree with the GEQ fitting the bill, It makes more sense to me that the GEQ and the previous god was the same person.
As for traces of godskin in farum I think their main fight being there is something significant.
Didn't the windmill village have a god skin festival, with a god skin boss at the top. That could indicate that the god skins were important enough to be semi worshiped and celebrated, which would be more significant than the crucible knights to the golden order.
@@Kosmos_er I always assumed the Godskins we find in FA were there to recover the rune of death from Maliketh.
@@ruperthart5190 yes that's possible as well ofc
@@birthrite8254 if that was the case I don't see why they would stop the tarnished.
Every godskin encounter gives them a good reason to fight them. Either they are guarding something related to the GEQ or we invade the place of an ally like rykard.
I don't think they are allied or protecting maliketh, so it must be something like the dominula village where we are just walking on their turf
This video is a bit different so hopefully you guys like it, as usual feedback is very much appreciated.
Enjoy!
Ps: memo received about the music volume, i'll be sure to have it lower next time and have something calmer.
I love your videos and this one is no exception. The only criticism I have is that the background music, especially around 4:15, was a bit too loud for my taste.
Well done! Probably going to take this as part of my head cannon now!
Rly great video! I just gotta agree about the music. Can genuinely be quite hard to hear you over it.
what music did you use in this video? Spesifically the chores played during the Godhood & the Elden Ring part at 1:00
@@lindaeriksson1208 Borislav Slavov | Sins and Gods (Choir Version) | Divinity: Original Sin 2
The thumbnail makes me think the gloam eyed queen was Godwyn, and that’s why America killed him
All of this sounds very convincing. I wasn't sure about the idea that the Erdtree cannot exist in a world with Destined Death, yet after giving a lot of thought I think I've turned around on my previous idea *completely.* At the site of the First Curch, the echoes of Marika speaks of an "age of life." If the Gloam-Eyed Queen was the god of Placidusax and the dragons whilst also the inner god of death, it stands to reason that their society and culture was largely centred around death. An "Age of Death," if you will. Just look at their home of Farum Azula: it would then stand to reason that the opposition of this system would be just that; opposite, and that an "age of life" is then synonymous with an "age without death." After all, despite the Destined Death culture of the dragons, there was no shortage of life; in fact, it was a time of *chaotic* life through the crucible which birthed demi-humans and omen. All of this paints a very clear picture to me. The Golden Order opposes death in all forms. Those that live in death, the demi-humans whose traits were once revered as sacred in the "Age of Death" but are now shunned in the age of the Golden Order, seen as primitive and undesirable and the omen, a blatant reminder of the fundamental flaw in Marika's ideology. Even Erdtree burials, despite what I once thought it meant, does not necessitate death! In fact, we have hints of the opposite! The Golden Order facilitates rebirth instead, something that is hinted at through Radagon's parting gift to Rennala, the Sacred Amber, as well as her shard fragment being that of perfect rebirth. The Golden Order's judgement of those that do not fit in, as is evident by Miquella's Haligtree, truly speaks to Marika's distain towards anything that came before and all that was associated with the Age of Death. *This* is the flaw that the noble Goldmask discovers. Despite it all, a god is still a human ascended. They are not perfect. They carry with them their rash and emotional rationale such as the Gloam-Eyed Queens god hunt or Marika's ethnic prosecutions. Finally, when we see Marika in this light... it isn't hard to imagine how the death of her firstborn prodigy, at the hands of the very thing she waged wars to eradicate, affected her.. and so, the fallen leaves tell a story. The great Elden Ring was shattered.
Thinking about it further lead me down an interesting path... Destined Death is sealed and the Gloam-Eyed Queen was defeated. Accepting that she was both the god of Placidusax and the leader of the Godskins, it's inferred that she is still alive. The Golden Order being founded on the idea that there *is* no death and her defeat very obviously happening *after* it was sealed away, what kind of punishment is there left to give for the highest enemy of the new order? Melina is stated to be "burnt and bodiless." Her fate is intimately linked to the flame. She's hinted at being the child of Marika and she claims to have been born "at the foot of the Erdtree," yet she also expresses confusion over the concept of being born of a mother. Was the only conceivable punishment for the greatest enemy of the empire rebirth without a vessel? Was.. Melina given the first Erdtree Burial..?
@Sidhion Oakbranch hey. this is a good write-up. Good framing of these sorts of "invisible parallels" that exist all throughout the game thanks to the bygone age of death.
Thanks for the video and theory, I think the longer format was great and all the shots and editing. I like the theory and think it’s plausible. I’ve always found the information about Placidusax waiting for the return of his god quite ominous and interesting that the GEQ isn’t stated to be dead, despite being defeated, works well with that statement.
For me the potential issue surrounds the Godskins and how little they feature into this theory. It’s from them that we get the most information about the GEQ and they seem so important to understanding her. However, there is nothing that links dragons and apostles. Yes there is the duo in Faram Azula, but nothing about that fight makes them fit there more than they fit at Volcano Manor for example. It says they have inhuman physiology, but not dragon I wouldn’t say. There’s no Godskin iconography at Farum, and nothing about skinning seems to connect to dragons.
So for me, to buy into the theory a bit more I’d need to think more about how the apostles and their mission to skin gods(!) would relate to an age of dragons. But nonetheless I loved the video and all the stuff you put out.
Yeah thats the most speculative bit, a possibility but pure conjecture with little to go on, it can also be assumed they were in Farum Azula to obtain the rune of death for themselves. We still don't know who the statue depicts in Malikeths room. Could be anyone frankly.
Yeah. That's pretty cool idea. I like it. Maybe it would be justice that once the gloam eyed queen was killed, her body was absorbed by the Erd Tree. This allowed Marika to create a blank copy of her that would follow orders (Melina). Or maybe just give her enough memory to execute Marika's will. Once you side with the Frenzy god and burn the Erd Tree, Marika's last ditch effort to save her age is to unseal the rune of death, granting Melina those powers to hunt you down.
I think you nailed it here.
Awesome video. 8:35 we also know that humans were entwined with Farum Azula society because of the Draconian race we find in the character creation menu
For sure, but some would argue that could have come latter with the creation of the dragon cult and dragons taking human form to commune with people
Very interesting video, I do think you're on to something, as for the gloam eyed queens identity, although I really do think to solidfy that malenia is a part of that due to the frenzy ending. Also there's the issue with the storm lord, which I guess is Mr hyrda dragon.
I only take issue with the timeline as where does the age of the cruible fit into this? I think tarnished archeologist provides some better description of events. Also the war with the dragons seemed pretty early on as Godwin had to befriend them and the tree knight sentinels became monstrosities. And why would they forgive the erd tree over Godwin? On top of all of this they use gold as a source of power. This would link the banished knights to the gloam eyed queen. But they also use dragon communion spells.
There is no such thing as an age of the crucible per say. Anything from early golden order and back could be described as such
@@armandaneshjoo it didn't. But the golden order includes everything's from its birth.
Age of the crucible isn't really a thing as it was never hugely influential.
@@armandaneshjoo But what caused the transition between the great tree and the crucible era?
This makes a LOT of sense, and considering its said the god of the dragonlord has fled, if it is her, its time to return to the lands between, with Marika and her order either crumbling or completely gone. You mentioned how her servants were those entities associated with death... in the promo image, the erdtree seems to be swallowed by deathroot, which could mean either her or Godwyn or both... ohhh this is even better than I was expecting before, I can't wait till 2024 goddamn...
There can be more than 1 empyrean at the same time similiar to ranni, miquella and malenia. I think GEQ was an empyrean similiar to Marika during the same age and both were chosen similiar to how ranni, miquella and malenia were chosen during the same age or period. The only difference being Marika became the god and GEQ didn't. I dont think GEQ was a god of the previous age but an empyrean that was contemporary to the time when marika also was an empyrean.
I understand the relevance of the music in the background due to its use in the game that is the topic of your video. But I just say the sheer volume and anxiety inducing, rousing effect of the battle music behind your delivery is extremely distracting and verges on input overload. I understand as an autistic person, this is my problem. But I just wanted to give this feedback cos I’m probably not the only autistic person that enjoys your videos. I had to replay several parts of your video several times because of the music drowning you out of my sensory perception several times.
But that is my only critique. Fascinating content and I absolutely adore hearing and taking into consideration your takes as I attempt to better understand the world of Elden ring with your help and the help of a couple of other fantastic RUclipsrs producing exquisite content like yours. Thank you for sharing!❤
This also makes so much sense of why they went to fight the giants. Just as we need to go to the Flame she did as well as to have no challenge to that order. The only crux in all of this was Godweyn’s death. How could the order be perfect and allow the death of Marika’s favorite son?
I’m just glad someone else appreciates the DOS2 soundtrack 🙏
I think you're right about most of this, but I still have the suspicion that it was the GEQ who destroyed Farum Azula, and ruled without an Elden Lord until Marika, Godfrey, and Maliketh defeated her. The reasoning for this is that there's no clear place where the Rune of Death fits into the Elden Ring in Farum Azula, suggesting it might be some kind of interloper, as it's treated very differently than every other kind of Rune. Then there's the fact that the GEQ's most lasting impact was her creation of the Godskins, some kind of artificial lifeform which she then swaddled and eventually clothed in the skins of gods. Who could these gods have been but the humanoid denizens of Farum Azula? The otherworldly ancestors of the Numen. The GEQ explicitly created the Godskins to overthrow an entire pantheon, so to speak, and with the exception of at least Marika, it would appear she had succeeded, which suggests she was in some part an outsider. In ASOIAF, the Targaryan royal family of dragon riders at one point have to deal with a series of uprisings lead by a line of Targaryan bastards vying for the throne, using their inheritance of the ancestral sword Blackfyre as proof of their claim. These uprisings were called the Blackfyre Rebellions. Their emblem is a 3-headed black dragon breathing black fire on a red background as well, and Targaryans as a whole are known for their violet eyes.
It's by no means an air-tight theory, but the idea that there was a sort of "Long Night" period of time between Placidusax's reign, and the Golden Order being founded. Perhaps the Rune of Death being sealed triggered a slow reawakening of the Ancient Dragons from their stone forms, which lead to Godfrey and the Crucible Knights wrecking the place even further?
so is the geq marika's mother then?
Thanks for the video! That was interesting.
I can accept the GEQ to be the god of the previous age and Placidusax her consort, it makes a solid picture. But I have some qualms about the involvement of the Greater Will.
The way the story is presented it seems the previous age was when several outer gods all had stakes in the lands between (the fell god, the god of rot, the stars, etc). However, the depictions in Farum would make it clear that the one with the biggest influence was the Twin Bird with the death birds as it's emissaries. There is no hint of the two fingers or the Greater Will being present back then. Since the elden beast arrived with a meteor, that should have been the one to destroy Farum Azula and introducing the Greater Will in the lands between.
I assume that the Erdtree was brought by the meteor as well, infesting the much older great tree whose root network still spans the entire lands between. The depiction of the elden ring in Farum Azula makes me think the elden ring was embedded in the great tree's roots and the Erdtree was the way to take control of it.
Some information:
Placidusax is a Elden Lored.
The ancient dragons' body is inherently gold.
The Black Blade, a high ranking clergymen of FA, is a shadow beast given to Marika by two fingers.
What destroyed FA was a meteorite with gravitational force.
FA's fragments are easy to glow light and are used to make items related to the fingers. And the light and the cipher of light are exactly the power/language of the two fingers.
The Divine Tower that is similar to FA and not adapt to the modern city layout's planning is a place where the two fingers are worshiped, and red gold meteorites are also worshiped.
The ending of Ranni and her moon is noted in the unpacking content as inheriting the rune of spirit. And in the official version, the Destined Death has another name, the Rune of Death. (By the way, the Golden Order's ending is the rune of life)
「テスト: s19_00_0020 エンディングＢ（精神ルーン継ぐ）」
IMO, Basically the various Orders/outer gods are the subset of the Elden Ring of the Greater Will.
@@user-em6rw2pc6n I disagree on many things here.
To me placidusax is reddish, which would hint at the crucible. Also Godfrey was Elden lord, yet does not exhibit any such gold and even Radagon doesn't.
The link between shadows and beasts is extremely unclear. Serosh was a regent and still somehow forced to become something like a shadow.
I think the dragons are also linked to gravity, as the consumables are often found on and around their petrified wings.
The fragment argument seems rather week. I could also argue that every place with a lamp is connected to the Helphen ^^
To me the divine towers bear little to no resemblance to the architecture of FA, especially the inside as well as the murals. They seem to be linked to the blackstone culture, which has little to no known lore as of now.
I didn't get your ending argument in relation to the role of the greater will, sorry :)
1. Fingers are vassals of the Greater Will. The Gloam-Eyed Queen was an Empyrean chosen by the Fingers. (source: black flame ritual)
2. The description of the Ruins Greatsword says that the meteorite struck ruins. Therefore it either struck an already crumbling Farum Azula or one of its ruins scattered on land.
3. The Greater Will sent the Elden Ring/Beast with a golden star but there is another star falling event mentioned in the Founding Rain of Stars description which brought glintstone/sorcery to the Lands Between. There are faith-oriented elements on Farum but nothing about glintstone/sorcery. Therefore there was no sorcery during Farum's reign because the latter event had yet to happen.
4. The Ruins Greatsword is a STR/INT weapon, not a STR/FAI weapon. Therefore it's likely the meteorite that struck it came down during the aforementioned event that birthed sorcery not the event that brought the Elden Ring.
5. The Erdtree was created from red gold matter of the Crucible. (source: gilded greatshield) And the inhabitants of the Lands Between fought to stop it. (source: protection of the Erdtree) But they eventually lost, Marika bought enough time to complete it and made it the embodiment of Order (aka the new home of the Elden Ring).
@@Managarm I will only list some main information, if it is complete, it would be too long.
1、Ancient Dragon Smithing Stone：Smithing stone made by polishing a golden Gravel Stone. A scale of the Ancient Dragonlord, and hidden treasure of Farum Azula.
Crucible Gauntlets：Gauntlets of the Crucible Knights who served Godfrey, the first Elden Lord. Hold the power of the crucible of life, the primordial form of the Erdtree.
Aspects of the Crucible: Tail：One of the ancient Erdtree incantations. This is a manifestation of the Erdtree's primal vital energies-an aspect of the primordial crucible, where all life was once blended together.
Gilded Greatshield：The red tinge in the gold coat mirrors the primordial matter that became the Erdtree. The color of homeward yearning.
You have made a typical mistake of binding the Greater Will to the Golden Order. Not to mention Radagon, who further developed fundamentalism, the scholarship.
Mending Rune of the Death-Prince：The Golden Order was created by confining Destined Death.
Black Flame Ritual：The Gloam-Eyed Queen led the apostles. It is said that she was an Empyrean chosen by the Fingers.
Gowry：An Empyrean...is no mere demigod. In the age of the Elden Ring, and Queen Marika, the precious Empyrean was born. A new god to forge a new Order. I have dedicated myself to her. And to the resplendence of the Order of Rot. The cycle of decay and rebirth."
Edge 367# Miyazaki:
This Golden Order is something that the Elden Ring may have once represented, but not directly. It's more about how you apply those rules and how you enforce them on the physical world and what effects they have on it.
What can represent these rules and order but also not absolute? That was the question that ran through my mind when I created this image. And the tree really fits the bill nicely for that because the tree is something that's alive, it's something that grew, it's something that will eventually wither and die.
2、Serosh isn't a shadow.
3、Dragons have no gravitational force.
but, Ruins Greatsword：The ruin it came from crumbled when struck by a meteorite, as such this weapon harbors its destructive power. Skill-Wave of Destruction：Raise the sword up high, then strike it against the ground to fire off a wave of gravitational force.
4、Ruin Fragment：These shards of stone are believed to have once been part of a temple in the sky. They glow with a faint light from within.
Sanctuary Stone：It feeds and strengthens the light as it shines.
They can only be used to make items related to light and the fingers.
Warming Stone：Ruin Fragment blessed with an incantation of the Two Fingers.
Scriptstone：Ruin Fragment with a cipher inscription.
Cipher Pata：One of the weapons originating from the Two Fingers. A formless sequence of ciphers comprise its blade. The furtive inscription appears to hang in the air; the language of light spoken by the Two Fingers.
@@Demokaze 2., 3. and 4. mean that Farum Azula was not destroyed by an "int meteor", right? ;)
5. That's not what the shield's description says... "what became the Erdtree" is different from "from which the Erdtree was created". Let's stick to the facts here, okay?
That being said, I don't have a good counter argument for 1 :) we could speculate that the GEQ was god for a while after the elden beast arrived, but there's nothing to back that up.
The fact remains that there's no hint of the two fingers or the Greater Will in the era of Farum Azula.
Very cool video, thank you! The twilight queen is one of the titles of Hel, daughter of Loki and nordic goddess of death and underworld. Maybe the gloam is a reference to that. If true, Hel’s story may help understand Gloam Eyed Queen’s mystery. 😅
In those legends, is there anything similar to the ancient dragons? I want to understand the relationship between farum azula and the eternal cities, if there is any.
I love how " black flame" is constantly regarded as super powered, god level attack.
Fairytail has god slayer flame
Ds1, ds3 and Er have it.
Slime isekai has it
Bloodborne with accursed skull.
Bleach with black ceros
Naruto aswell
Mabye more from anime / games i havent Seen yet.
Very hard to make fire devoid of light, so ofc
This is an old write-up now, with some recent updates from the DLC.
Marika is the Gloam/Dusk-Eyed Queen.
- Red and black spike of death impales Marika and keeps her in place when we find her at the end. Only Maliketh wields this power, and only he could even defeat a God like Marika. But he's so loyal to her, why would he?
- Maliketh "defeated" the Gloam/Dusk-Eyed Queen. We know Shadowbound hounds have to attack their former master if The Fingers feel like the Empyrean is acting against them. We play through this reality with Ranni's quest, and both she and Iji know Blaidd will go mad as she enacts her vision. How do they know this happens? They saw/heard of it happening to Maliketh and Marika already.
- Only Marika would be able to guide Ranni to the location of the Rune of Death and how to use it for it to be stolen in the first place to forge the Black Knives. Remember, "Marika... is this what it is to sin?" "Why gull me..." Marika, after all, had only one use for Maliketh in the end, after the other work was done... a vessel to seal away Destined Death. And even then, she betrayed him.
- The Beast Eye is a purple, scratched up eye. It's Marika's eye from being defeated and imprisoned by her Shadowbound. No other Queen or Empyrean is "defeated" but not slain, as the text implies there except Marika. And who but her purpose-made hound could even stop her, a God? The one entity empowered enough by the Ring/Fingers to be able to do so should the need arise.
- Dominula Village is much like the Hinterlands and the Shaman Village. We find a skinning ritual and a Godskin Apostle there in Dominula. We learn that the "festival" is old and tacitly accepted by the Golden Order. The aesthetic of these villages is much the same, and they're intimately tied to Marika herself.
- Gideon gives us a boon in the form of a secret rite known only to him, Black Flame Protection. He is alleged to have peered into the will of Queen Marika, and shuddered at the end that should not be.
- The Scadutree is of a dual nature. So is Queen Marika. When Gold arose, so too was Shadow born. Gold and Shadow exist as necessary contrasts to each other, yet in a God, in Marika, this duality exists in coalesce, or it did once.
- No other characters are named as Queen or Empyrean that aren't already accounted for/ruled out to be the GEQ, and by that I mean Melina, she was given purpose by her mother at the foot of the Erdtree and that means she is a daughter of Marika, not old enough to be the GEQ but possesses traits of both Marika and Radagon. Eye color and hair color are passed down traits we see in game. Well, sure enough, Melina shows us a purple/gloamy eye in one ending. Inherited trait from her mother, the Queen in Black. Marika's eyes are never shown to us, to judge their color.
- Duskborn ending sees Godwyn rise to ascendancy and sees Death restored, with him as the Prince of Death itself. These titles aren't meaningless. Duskborn? The "Prince" of Death? Well, who would the Queen be? If Godwyn is Duskborn, and if he is a Prince, his mother would, of course, be associated with "Dusk" and be a Queen. And we know his mother is Queen Marika.
- Fia is hooded with a black cloak and comes from some other land. She also helps create Godwyn's Duskborn ending and is Death-aligned. We see Marika wearing black hooded garb in a statue where she also is holding the twins Miquella and Malenia. Her tattered clothing as we find her at the end is also black. She is also associated with the Nox/Numen race and the Black Knife Assassins that come from there as well.
- Statues of Marika in her crucified pose all show her with a flowing black cloth that wraps behind her in almost the exact same shape as the Godslayer Greatsword, which was the weapon or ritual sword of the GEQ/DEQ. You have to pivot the camera a bit to get a good view, but the shape is very similar. Coiled and then open, with one flap slightly longer than the other, same tip design on the Godslayer Greatsword. It's possible that she was propped up by the Hornsent culture and then part of the betrayal was killing other Gods in their pantheon, but what's maybe more possible is as Centered Tarnished pointed out, that Marika culled some other of her "unwanted" children after learning the truth of the broken Fingers and flawed foundations of her Order.
- Godwyn is referred to as the "Prince of Gold" in an item description. If a Prince of Death could have been a Prince of Gold, why couldn't his mother hold this potential as well, even necessarily so? We see from the Death Knights that Gold and Death can somehow synergize even still... Gold and Shadow, born at the same time, same as it ever was.
- Hewg prays to Queen Marika about his given task to craft a Godslaying weapon. Very interesting and specific task. Marika wants a God slain. He mentions "the sheer terror of Her..." regarding Marika. Godskins certainly take an interest in killing a God. Who was their leader? A "defeated" Queen who was once an Empyrean. Marika.
- Raging Wolf Vargram is a would-be Shadow. Wolf imagery is on his armor. He wields the Godslayer Greatsword. The weapon art is "The Queen's Black Flame", of course. A statue of Marika exists in Farum Azula showing her with three wolves.
- Marika learned the secrets of the Golden Order and realized her children would "amount only to sacrifices" as she instructed them. She knew the Erdtree was a soul parasite, and by sealing Death away, she weakened the Erdtree over time. She also had Godwyn buried at the roots of it, knowing that he would grow and overtake them, choking the Erdtree further. As he was, Godwyn was an "unwanted" child since he embodied the Golden Order, and she was a prisoner to it. He would end up much like Miquella would, a caged divinity of some kind. She was likely opposed to the Erdtree and Greater Will/Fingers for a long time, weaving plots in secret until the Shattering. She realized, only too late, that ultimate power has a way of becoming a curse when the truth of the nature of it all is finally revealed.
Just as Marika shined so brightly with her Golden Order, another aspect of her was as deep as the abyss and as dark as any shadow.
Great video! I just watched a video about it being Melina on Sinclair Lore. It had me almost convinced. Expect I thought Melinas purpose was to burn the end tree as kindling from birth. Given to her by her mother. That's why they found Melina and burned her alive to prevent it. Now she is a spirit and works through you. Atleast when you find her weapon it's by the body armor of the person in charge of finding and burning her.
I do love this idea. But what of the Black Flame Monks? Their abandonment suggest that the time of the GEQ was after the war against the giants, when Marika was already Queen and God.
The black flame monks could have appeared at anytime really, since the godskin apostacy continued on after the GEQ's defeat .
@Kosmos I agree, it just seems most likely to me that the Flame Monks would be better seduced by the full power of the Black Flame than its weakened state.
The Noble Presence incantation also mirrors Wrath of Gold, an Erdtree incantation, and the GEQ is described as an Empyrean, rather than god, in items. I'm not trying to be contrarian, this one of my favourite GEQ theories so far.
This was excellent and I had not noticed the connection to that tomb.
I feel we just know too little about Elden Ring lore to speculate about characters's relations to each other: the current situation just feel like the old "Havel's friend" conundrum, where the community speculated wildly about his identity but simply had no way to know it until DS3.
The way I see it is that now is the time for speculation before er get more info.
Lore we know for sure is cool but I wouldn't be interested in making videos about it.
@@Kosmos_er based answer. So much of what makes FromSoft games unique is their willingness to let the fans think for themselves as oppressed to telling them that they have to interpret their stories in a specific way. I can’t speak for everyone but if there was no room for speculations I doubt I’d be so invested in these games and their lore as I am.
Marika with the wolves statue in Farum Azula is a mirror to Capitoline (She wolf) with the R Twins statues in Rome. Think about it.
Do you think there is any connection between the gloam eyed queen and the giants one eyed fell god? Flame colors don’t match, but the one eye thing could be a clue
I have been ruminating it. There might be some sort of connection between the forge and farum since that's how we get there. And the giants were made to watch over the flame by their god, who is said to have been killed by Marika.
And the flame of ruin was described as black flames after u unleash DD in cut dialogue.
But I'm not sure if I can make out anything of all that yet.
9:35 I haven't seen people not acknowledge the conquest of Farum Azula whenever it was spoken about the assumption I've seen is that Godfrey defeated the previous Order.
On another note, Marika declares the Age of the Erdtree IMMEDIATELY after the defeat of the GIANTS, so she had the Ring at that point but her era had yet to begin, we can probably consider everything between the two battles as the Age of the Crucible.
We also know that there was a short lived Age of Abundance the assumption that I've seen is that the Age of Abundance was cut short by the removal of the Rune of Death because Death is a natural part of life and that the Golden Order did not exist during this time as it was still a part of the Elden Ring but in the GEQs possession.
Therefore a timeline would be >Farum Azula Order >Age of the Crucible >War Against the Giants >Age of Erdtree (Abundance) >Godskin Crisis >Birth of the Golden Order >Dragon War.
We know from Incantation symbols that the Golden Order is different from the Erdtree and that the Dragon War is the earliest instance of the Abundance symbol no longer being in use.
THANK YOU!
I have been saying this forever.
People seem blind to the fact that God and Queen are used as nigh synonyms with regards to the Elden Ring.
And Placidusax's "lost God" would have been his wife as he is an Elden Lord. (Which also makes their Divine sponsor The Great Will too.)
Plus there's Maliketh's whole "demigod slayer" moniker.... I don't think he was known for killing the demigods of Marika's family... So there would have to have been another family of God, her Lord, and their demigod children.
It also fits that the beastmen of Faram were gifted intelligence and 5 fingers. The beastmen currently worship dragons, there are depictions of royal/noble humans on the structures of Faram, and the most important statue beneath the Elden Ring shows normal wolves surrounding a woman.
Imo this implies that at the beginning of her rule, the beasts lacked intelligence, but over time the beasts were blessed with intelligence thanks to the ER and GW.
God tier as usual. Can't wait for more
A youtuber propose an assumption that Gloam eyed queen was never a single entity, and when destined death is unbound there will always a gloam eyed queen, i like this idea a lot as Melina said "The one who walks alongside flame, Shall one day meet the road of Destined Death." she is a kindling maiden after all, i think Melina should be the next gloam eyed queen but she cant because the rune is bound.
I hold a similar opinion. the GEQ could be an entity that constantly reemerged. As Rykard says, "A serpent never dies", and eventually Tanith comes to take his place. So perhaps the GEQ, who also shares serpent imagery through the Godskins (and who we even see has influence in the volcano manor) also "never dies".
It fits her theming too as she represents the inescapable fate of the gods. Like death, it can only be postponed or or temporarily contained, it can't be truly killed. Someone always comes to take her place.
"the realm of divinity"
then dos2 music starts playing
kosmos, I don't think that the gloam eyed Queen was overthrown for hunting gods excessively, because I don't know why killing other gods would be a problem for the greater will, but that she was simply overthrown for refusing to take the death rune from the elden ring ? I was wondering after watching your video if Marika could be the daughter of Gloam Eyed Queen and Placidusax? all the empyreans we've seen so far seem to be born from a god and apparently being born from a single god makes you one. with that in mind it would kind of be necessary at some point for someone to become a god so that other empyreans could be born, and with the whole DLC revelation that the land of shadow is where Marika first set foot, I've been wondering if farum azula it is considered part of the rest of the lands in between.
I think this would explain why Godrick's obsession with his lineage seems to have so much to do with dragons and why Marika has descendants like Rykard and Messmer who have so much to do with snakes, and as we know in the souls franchise, snakes are almost always descendants of dragons or the less related to them, I would also like to mention that I think the gloam eyed is a numen of the eternal cities, this union would explain why the eternal cities have such an obsession with generating dragon warriors and giving lightning powers to the mimic tears , could she be an empyrean chosen from another god but who united with placidusax and the greater will? I have always theorized that the outer god of death is actually the shadow moon, could this union of the sun and moon be the reason she is called Gloam Eyed Queen?
I was just telling my friend this morning that what if the gloam eyed queen was the god before marika.
@@armandaneshjoo bro I literally have been reading your posts about the geq and elden ring lore I’ve come across and I want too believe it so bad where can I find it or were you trolling?? I just want too know it seems like it could be real
Really good theory… have you considered that they were both fighting to claim as many runes of the Elden ring as possible as rival Emperions?
Like the Tarnished or the demigods during the shattering. That the Gloam eyed queen possessed destined death and hence no other runes are mentioned?
Don’t know if that could work, but it strikes me that the Elden ring could have been shattered by the meteorite (god killed?) and the two fingers elected emperions to fight for the remaining runes… it would explain why it is now smaller than in Faram Azula artworks…
I don't think the old elden ring has more runes, in fact if you look at the only parts that seem to be real runes are the ones in the center, the rest of the runes don't complete a full circle, I think because of the way they bright and the shape of this Ring that these runes are actually part of the root rune simulating the appearance of real runes
As the Shadow of the Elden Tree DLC approaches, I'm staking my bet on the Gloam-Eyed Queen's identity. She is Marika's older sister and Melenia's mother. The GEQ is like Marika, a former god who fell from the Greater Will's grace and like Marika is imprisoned in the Elden Tree...except it's the Elden Tree within the Shadowlands, not Marika's. Thus that allows Melenia's statement about her being born within the Elden Tree and given a task by her mother correct, except the task her mother the GEQ gives Melenia is destroy Marika's Elden Tree out of revenge.
But what about Ranni's similarities? If Marika and the GEQ were sisters, that means they shared a mother that likely gave the gloam eye to the GEQ. Thus Ranni's possession of similar traits is from inheritance from her grandmother.
thank you for this video and also i appreciate having the soundtrack of one of my other favorite games dos2!
Gloam Eyed Queen = Marika, that's why Maliketh is guarding her
the little girl statue in Maliketh arena is Marika with her red wolf of Radagon
Marika wields black flames
Something im suprised you haent mentioned is that Malikeths armor looks like a crow, which supports the idea that he might be responsible for the seal in Melina's eye. Which explains why the eye only activates after you have killed maliketh in the Lord of Frenzy ending.
the twin birds, god of death, is sealed in melena as well is the fell god, god of flames, sealed in mesmer, since both gods are threats to the new order of life and the erd tree. mesmes and melena were the first demigods, born before the order of gold and because of that they were used to seal the enemies of the new order.
To me it's cear enough that the Gloam Eyed Queen channeled blackflame using the Godslayer Greatsword.
She wielded Destined Death.
The only other character that we see explicitelly chanelling flames and not producing them is Melina, the ONLY Kindling Maiden who's path is intricately woven with Destined Death as stated by the Blade of Calling. To me without relying on eye shenanigans we can infer that Melina is the Gloam Eyed Queen.
but Melina is clearly the daugher of Marika, as she refers to her as "mother"
@@TheExai And the Gloam Eyed Queen was an Empyrean. Just like Ranni, Malenia and Miquella. She like other children of Marika probably saw that the Golden Order was bullshit and decided to try and overthrow the Greater Will. But she was severely punished for that and was brought back as Melina.
@@armandaneshjoo Where do you pull that out of ? Sources ? Who's Mari ?
8:48 This needs to be clarified, that is misreading of the item description, it understandable because if not carefully read you might think it’s referring to Faram Azula itself. I will highlight the important details w/ Caps In the written text:
“Originally rubble FROM a RUIN which FELL from the sky, this surviving fragment was honed into a weapon.”
“The RUIN it came from CRUMBLED when STRUCK by a meteorite, as such this weapon harbors its destructive power.”
This is talking about the pieces of Faram Azula you find around the Lands Between especially in Limgrave and Liurnia. Which is told through the Sanctuary stone reveal they’re from Faram.
“A rare piece of stone fragment found near places where RUINS have FALLEN from the sky.” So the Ruin Greatsword is referring to THOSE ruins of Faram Azula being hit by a meteorite and from it can the sword. Not that Faram was destroyed by a meteorite. That is a big misconception, there’s no information in the game that states that Faram Azula was destroyed by a Meteorite AT ALL.
Farum azula is referred to as "slowly crumbling ruins in the skies" in the beastmen ashes. So farum azula are the ruins referenced in that item.
Also, I don't know how you feel about cut content, but in 1.0 you could loot gravity stones in farum which served as a nother hint it was struck by meteor.
Also considering the hovering state of some of the stone work and the spread of the ruins on the ground, it just makes sense it was hit by a meteor.
@@Kosmos_er That’s true for the ashes but that doesn’t disprove my point, the ruin greatsword is referring to a single ruin of Faram Azula, not the former mausoleum itself. If it was specifically a pre destroyed Faram it would specified w/ something like “piece of a former mausoleum” or “a piece of a during the crumbling of a former land.” It is specific in its wording, it came from a ruin, separate from Faram Azula itself. Even If you think it’s Post Faram destruction, than it still wouldn’t explain Faram’s end just that it was hit by meteorite at some point. As for cut content, I don’t think it’s wise to use material that can easily be changed post DLC but can be also be contradictory to the base game itself. I heavily dislike the communities trend of using CC to flesh out their lore especially since may other ER cut content hole sales contradicts the base game itself. If From wants us to know something, it’ll be in the game. I have my own theories on why FA was destroyed but to give a bone to you, when you defeat Radahn and unlock the path to Nokron, the hole it create has a striking similarity to Faram Azula minus the tornadoes. It can be referred that maybe Faram Azula was in that similar state, however that is the only in game reference you can use in the game. So I remain skeptical of the meteorite theory.
An interesting analysis. But one which ignores the Age of the Crucible. There was an Age of the Great Tree. Then the Great Tree was felled in some manner thus far unexplained. And the Age of the Crucible began. In this age, the ancient roots of the Great Tree sprouted with new life of many different kinds. Not at all unlike a real tree whose roots have survived when the trunk has been destroyed, by say, a fire. At some point the Erdtree was GRAFTED into this system, and became the dominant branch. You can actually see this progression in artwork and statuary in game. Statues of Marika surrounded by the many buds of the crucible age, which are very similar to simpler statues of Marika now tending a single, solitary growth. These statues, along with the Crucible Knights being front and center among Godfrey's earliest warriors, demonstrate that Marika herself presided over, or at the very least was present for, the Age of the Crucible.
Now, it's tempting to associate the Crucible with Placidusax's reign. The Elden Ring of Farum Azula is not a representation of a tree, as are the later forms of it, but rather of a massive and likely ancient root system. This would seem to dovetail nicely with the idea that the tree component was not present, and the focus was on the surviving and still thriving roots. This could suit your theory, with the GEQ being the God of the Age of the Crucible, later overthrown by Marika to bring about the Age of the Erdtree. But there are a couple of things that bother me and make me ask questions.
What happened to the Great Tree? How does Marika know that the Flame of the Giants is a threat to the Erdtree? How and why are the Eternal Cities important to the narrative beyond simply being a previous civilization in the Lands Between? Why are the Giants on the Mountaintop killed with Deathblight? Doesn't this imply that the Rune of Death was still a part of the Elden Ring as late as this victory that ushers in Marika's godhood? How does Radagon fit into this equation? Radagon doesn't get nearly enough attention from the lore community, as he is just about the most pivotal player in the whole thing. He's the penultimate boss, after all, with only his master in the Elden Beast challenging us in his wake. Why does Marika, if she wishes her Order to be eternal, have AT LEAST THREE plans to end her age and bring about a new one under a new God/Lord (Miquella, who is clearly intended to be her successor and seemingly with her blessing. Melina, a daughter whose purpose is to destroy the Erdtree and end it's Age, and the Tarnished, meant to overthrow Radagon and replace him as Elden Lord)?
There is also the very deliberate naming of the Gloam Eyed Queen. Or, alternatively, the Dusk Eyed Queen. Gloam usually being associated with morning, while dusk with evening. One heralding the end of night and the beginning of a bright new day (perhaps the transition between the Nox age of night and the Age of the bright Erdtree) and the other the end of day and the fall of night (most clearly the end of the Age of the Erdtree and the start of Ranni's Age of Stars).
I don't think we have all the answers yet.
My theory at this time: Placidusax is the Lord of the Age of the Great Tree. Which is synonymous with the Age of Night of the Nox and the Eternal Cities. An Age of Night and Death. Farum Azuls is OBSESSED with death. The trespass of the Eternal Cities was to turn against the Tree and the Greater Will, with the Finger Slayer Blade being crafted to slay the God of the age. This rebellion failed and the Eternal Cities were punished. This resulted in a small group of Nox becoming Tree worshippers, and they left the Eternal Cities before they were punished by the Greater Will, becoming the Numen. (There is evidence of tree worship among the Eternal Cities' population in Leyndell, which was built around the remains of the Nameless Eternal City before it collapsed into the Deeproot Depths.)
Marika, as we would now call her but who may not have used this name back then, is a Numen, an Empyrean chosen by the Fingers and wishes to usher in her own age. She goes to war with the dragons. Ultimately vanquishing or driving off their god and defeating Placidusax. Then burning down the Great Tree with the Giants' Flame. Beginning the Age of the Crucible. This is an age of BALANCE. Both Life and Death. The cycle. This is the Age of the GEQ. The age between. The Age of Gloam and possibility. And yes, this makes Marika the GEQ. The still healthy root system sprouts anew, with a host of new life and competing visions for what comes next. The Godskins, who have long since lost their way from their true purpose, are created by the GEQ to prune this new life. To shape this new age. Marika works alongside the Greater Will in this endeavor, in hopes of becoming vessel to the Elden Ring and a God herself. But she has doubts about her partner. About the Greater Will. So she casts off part of herself, as Malenia accidentally cast off her warrior's pride in battle with Radahn, in an effort to plumb the depths of her doubts and find answers about the new age she is being led to create.
It is this offshoot that we would now call Radagon. But back then SHE was a dead ringer for the being we NOW call Marika. Her twin sister, if you will. This new being, who would take the name Marika has plans of her own. She is chosen by the Greater Will to usher in the Age of the Erdtree. The Erdtree is not native to the Lands Between. It is GRAFTED into the root system during the Crucible age and then nurtured and defended until it is the only branch remaining. This "Marika" (again, Radagon) recruits Horah Loux and his Crucible Knights. This "Marika" is given Malekith as a shadow. This "Marika" CANNOT wield the power of the Elden Ring. She is NOT a God. But she wants to be, to replace her sister. So she goes to war. She overcomes every challenge, leaves the Erdtree as the sole remaining branch. But she knows the Giants' Flame is threat, so she goes to the Mountaintop to cage it. At this point, the Rune of Death is STILL WITHIN THE ELDEN RING. Thus, the Giants being killed by deathblight. With the Erdtree safe and all other challengers defeated, "Marika" turns on her sister. Malekith defeats the GEQ and seals the Rune of Death, ushering in the Golden Order.
There is, however, a new problem. The Giants, though defeated, curse their foe. "Marika" is transformed, becoming Radagon. He can no longer be a vessel for the Elden Ring, no longer become a God. Worse, his entire age is built to worship Marika. So he imprisons his defeated sister within the Erdtree. It is she who is now named Queen Marika the Eternal. This is why every depiction of Marika, even at her First Church, depicts her in her imprisonment. The people have no idea of the context, but the Marika they worship is not the Marika they think it is. This is how "Radagon is Marika". Everything the Golden Order attributes to Queen Marika the Eternal is actually the work of Radagon. This is why the Erdtree's age of plenty ends so swiftly. This is why Marika is opposed to Radagon, why she has multiple succession plans, why Melina, who inherited her mismatched eyes from her mother, exists to burn the Erdtree, and even how and why Miquella can be a male Empyrean destined to become a matured, female God. This is why Godfrey is Tarnished. This is how the Gloam Eyed Queen can also be the Dusk Eyed Queen.
Eu não sei se você tem a tradução automática de comentários mas eu vou dar um completamento da sua teoria
Eu acho muito possível que Marika seja filha da gloam eyed queen e placidusax
Isso explicaria pq Marika é um empírio
Já que aparentemente só os semi-deuses podem ser escolhidos como empírio como Ranni se eles não nascerem como um empírio vindo de um único deus
Assim Marika seria escolhida como a herdeira para se tornar a nova deusa mas trairia a antiga ordem por uma de vida eterna na ordem áurea
E isso pra mim é muito possível pelo fato da pele retratada em imagens e pinturas de Radago e Marika ter um tom muito estranho de branco e quando os encontramos na batalha final ela parece literalmente ser feita de pedra até pq invés de ser machucada por destruir o Elden ring, ela foi rachada, indicando que ela pode ter herdado a pele de pedra de seu pai placidusax
Nisso eu também acho que Serosh era provavelmente a sombra da gloam eyed Queen, já que ele é responsável pelos homens fera ganharem inteligência e as próximas sombras que viriam são homens fera eu acho que Serosh serviria como uma sombra primitiva que a Greater Will aprimoraria em maleketh
What is the music playing during the first 5 minutes??? Its so good, pls I need to know
The greater will is probably the dude impaled with the rune in the trailer.He has something to do with it all.
Music in the back too loud
what is the name of the background music in this video? Spesifically the chores played during the Godhood & the Elden Ring part at 1:00
Eyes. It's always eyes, the gloam eye, the rune of death sealed in the eye that carried it, Melina's gloam eye, the gloam eyed (plural) queen, the eyes of shibari, Shibari referencing river blindness, the runes being eyes- Eyes on the inside- wait wrong game.
I really loved it! Great video! Subscribed!
If Melina & Ranni are the body and yurei of the Gloam-eyed queen, then maybe synthetic [re]birth caused the separation. If Queen Rennala is still so in love with her ex-husband that she has a piece of her beloved ex in an erdtree sap egg then maybe Rennala helped the Gloam-eyed Queen with rebirthing because Rennala wants her ex-husband back (black knife arc). Maybe rebirthing a god/goddess has consequences like yurei & body separation. Perhaps, the Gloam-eyed Queen was rebirthed more than once and the first time created Marika (in line with greater will) which is why she becomes the next god while the other rebirths created Melina (original gloam-eyed queen) & Ranni (not-in line with greater will). Perhaps there's never a newly appointed queen maybe it's always the gloam-eyed queen to bear the ring but changes as the ring changes through some form of rebirth/birth-cycle. Yurei being of japanese lore but perhaps there's other IRL lore that explains consequences between natural (current natural method), ill-natural (non-current method for the times) & unnatural (synthetic) rebirths/birth-cycle. Izanami might be a great name to look into.
Beastial Birth-Cycle system (natural but called ill-natural during erdtree, aka primordial)
Erdtree Birth-Cycle system (synthetic but called natural during erdtree, aka societal)
Miquella Birth-Cycle system (naturally synthetic or transitioned synthetically [hidden as if taboo just like omen were hidden], aka progressivistical)
Rennala Rebirth (advanced synthetics by magic [similar to magic technology and digital as an advanced type of synthetics with similar regards], aka globalistical)
The divinity soundtrack and Elden Ring content threw me off
GEQ? It's simply miqella, all part of marika's plan.
What music are you using? I love it.
Thank you for the video! Great suggestion about the timeline, does it mean that Glom Eyed Queen was connected to Numen somehow?
My speculation is that only Numen can be empyreans. Hoping to get more material on the subject in the DLC
i agree with a lot of this but i do not think the fingers were what made her an empyrean, i feel like the outer god she followed gave her that power, and when her actions were too ambitious for the greater will they sent forth marika and maliketh to usurp a ruler that would go against their ideals
either that or something like the offspring of whoever the dragonlord was the elden lord for as that would mirror how marika's offspring are also shown as empyreans, and killing off the bloodline of the previous new age god does kind of fit with what the fingers entrust us to do with marika's offspring as we collect great runes
Is it possible that in addition to what you discuss, the Gloam Eyed Queen is Renna, the snowy crone, and Ranni's secret mentor?
I agree to almost all
Great video! Do you think the snowy crone Ranni met and based her body on could have anything to do with GEQ? Ranni's magic is considered heretical without explicit reasons why. But it's really just frost magic. In a similar sense deathbird flames are Int frost also.
honestly i am personally not sure, the snowy crone is a big question mark here. I had her as a more active actor with her being torrent's former master but with the strong possibility that it could be miquella, i don't know anymore.
We will have to wait and see if DLC gives us any crumbs
@Kosmos I can't wait for whatever it yields. I've been scraping all the little details for possible signs. One wrench in the process of it is a matter of explaining when death was removed and if the Godskins could have had any past with the Nox or not. A certain detail I make this point on is the Divine Towers being much inspired on the nature of each demigod for accessibility. Yet, for Radahn's it looks like a sealed off retreat a Godskin attempted to secure their treasure down. Sort of like the implications of Sellia being linked to Nokron, but the access to Nokron now being withheld by Radahn and Sellen's investigation on the matter being likely what locked her up.
OH! Ok so here's an order for what happens around the time of the game:
1) Marika is having thoughts against the Greater Will (perhaps ambitions of some kind) and so she loses her tarnished that had been given the grace of gold (visions (ie prophecies) of the erdtree).
2) Radagon is recalled to her for the purpose of creating some Empyreans that could bring in the new age. I think given that eternity is a fundamental of the Golden Order that the ideal Empyrean would be most similar to Marika (all the potential Emperyans so far have been women (as so far as Miquella has a feminine aspect))
3) The Empyreans of this age aren't happy with Marika because the eternal stagnation she's brought upon the world is causing them trouble.
Also because noone can die other outer gods can start meddling with all that free time. The Greater Will doesn't like that.
4) Miquella is the first to come close to bringing in the new age, and also I think the closest to Marika.
If I can step back a bit, I think Marika was able to claim the Elden Ring and bring in a new age because she had someone die and it became a source of huge motivation for her, that's why her age (represented by the erdtree and the lack of death) was precipitated by removing the Rune of Death. Plus the Greater Will was ready to shuffle on the Gloam Eyed Queen.
So Miquella is desperate to save his sister, and his Rune is hinted (through cut content) to have been the Rune of Abundance. I like to think that this infers that each Emperyan (and to a lesser extent each demigod) has an affinity with an existing rune of the Elden Ring, which will also come to define their age. I think Abundance is pretty close to Eternal, so it's the first pick by the Greater Will for who will ascend. I think he got pretty damn close - I think through St Trina he was close to replacing death with dreams as a way to soothe his sister, who can never know peace.
I think the Fundamentals of the Golden Order were important to him before (and why he was the favourite to ascend), even if he had begun to look elsewhere (the Eclipse).
Malenia is having too bad a time to even think about how to shape a world order. She loves her brother and she'll be his Elden Lord (not in like, a sexual way, but I do think she would play a huge roll in his world of abundance as an arbiter of decay - she would help a stagnant world move again, and abundance requires cycles of life and death). Actually, now that I think about it, she may have been co-vessal of the Elden Ring with him, and St Trina would be the face of the operation.
At the same time, Ranni is getting some Heresy Lessons from Renna and is thinking maybe it's not such a great idea to have everyone's lives dictated by ANY Outer Gods (so not the front runner to take over).
I think Ranni and Miquella probably shared notes on a few things (the Eclipse being one). I don't know if either of them knew it would be Godwyn who was slain.
5) The death of Godwyn changes things for Miquella, no more time to fuck around, it's time to metamorphosise.
What has happened here is his sister is now under the threat of dying, not just suffering. Now his passion was high and an aspect of his world as a God began to sprout. I can't remember in this moment if the Haligtree was already established before the death of Godwyn, but now is when Miquella decides to fuse with the tree. I think, given that unlike when the erdtree overtook the crucible the Haligtree is in a separate part of the world, that Miquella may be attempting to create a new world order separate from the Elden Ring, by metamorphosing his being into what the Elden Beast is to the Elden Ring, thereby becoming the literal governing structure of a new world order. I mean hey, the Elden Ring was in tatters, so obviously that wasn't such a robust system.
Miquella now needs the Eclipse to happen asap. I think maybe (strong maybe) the Greater Will might be the sun, or the sun acts as a conduit of some kind. Unfortunately Radhan is holding onto all the stars and so shit isn't moving. Malenia is dispatched to maybe treaty with him, or maybe just merc him. Either way while she's out Mogh comes in and nabs Miquella so now the Haligtree world order plan is caput.
6) Before the Greater Will can set up a new plan (and with its control on the world not as infallible due to the shattered Elden Ring), Malenia decides to kill Radhan.
Maybe she knew Miquella was gone and was in Caelid (right over Mogh's palace) to get down to him somehow. Maybe she hoped that killing Radhan would bring down a meteorite that her brother had predicted would crash through Selia, and maybe she deduced that it was targeting Mogh for heresy. Maybe she really had been sent to kill him from the very beginning and didn't know Miquella was gone.
Either way, she tries to kill Radhan and blooms. Maybe something inate to the Lands Between loves trees, but Malenia's tree at the Heart of Aoenia is very different to the Erdtree, or the Great Tree of the Crucible, or to the Haligtree. All of these trees are rendered similarly, and I think that's due to the ideals of the Greater Will being conveyed through the Elden Ring. When the Haligtree was conceived (as an embodiment of the ideals of a blooming world order) Miquella's study of Fundamentalism meant that his world order was not that different, just incrementally better. No, Malenia's tree is twisted despair from all the rot she has dealt with - not a well constructed world view. But she still loved her brother, and so the tree is budding with flowers, and wildflowers grow at the base of the tree. If she had been left here I think she would have bloomed again into the Godess of Rot, vessal for the Outer God of Rot, and her tree would have taken over the world.
But she was carried back to the Haligtree where her lost brother still blessed her with unwaking sleep.
7) So two new ages have nearly come into blossom without the oversite of the Greater Will and the second one almost brought in an age under the influence of another Outer God, so the Greater Will gets desperate and puts out a siren call to any desperate tarnished to see if anyone can patch up Marika well enough to salvage control over the world.
Needless to say, the events of the game happen.
Notes:
Ranni's ending doesn't repair the Elden Ring at all. Ranni doesn't get her ending because she was an Empyrean (she cast off that flesh anyway), she gets it because there is no Outer God meddling so no need to be a vessel for anything. There is no new Tree. The world will be as it is, not a manifestation of something (or someone's) ideals.
Godwyn is absolutely now an Empyrean if not a God in his own right due to the shard of death stuck in his body. I think Ranni's discarding of her flesh tells us that's the god-holding part. Godwyn has no soul to instil any ideals into the vessel beyond the Rune yelling DEATH, so now his age is coming (as the DLC).
Other notes:
Miquella and Malenia are both able to metamorphise a new world independently of The Greater Will. This is represented by their butterflies. The third kindling butterfly may be related the Frenzy Flame which had been gaining traction in the lands between with regular folk and tarnished - maybe you become an Empyrean as the vessel of the Frenzied Flame. You are chosen by its fingers after all.
Melina may still by rights be the daughter of The Gloam Eyed Queen and also Empyrean potential. Maybe watching you burn down the world insights a passion in her that awakens her potential.
God-devouring serpent probably sensed a growing passion (or dispassion) in Rykard and so was able to gain power by devouring a proto-god. Or perhaps the fragment of the Elden Ring was what caused a gain in power - maybe the god-devouring serpant specifically feeds on laws of reality and that's what the Elden Ring is made of.
Malenia's Great Rune is described as having meant to be the most powerful. Cut content also suggests it's the Rune of Decay. I think if she were not afflicted by the Rot her world order would see that her brother can live a full life, which necessitates growing old and eventually decaying. Decay is also necessary for new life, for iteration and improvement. The Rune is powerful because it hinders forces too destructive and nourishes budding life. The real problem is when she had the Rune in her possession it got corrupted by another God so it just amplified the sad times :(
Hey there! Great stuff! I am inclined to agree with your take that the Gloam eyed Queen was someone of the previous age. I think we have a name for that in the 'Sun Realm'. From the item 'Sun realm shield'. 🛡 the item description mentions a city bathed in sunlight now long gone. Perhaps this was the city Faram Azula once was conjoined to? Food for thought!
I find it really hard to say anything about the sunrealm, hopefully we get something in the dlc
Isn't it a casual reference to Anor Londo?
@@es-rh8oo references in fromsoft games are derived from unimportant events and/or information...
The “Sun realm” is too important & significant of a subject to be downplayed as “a reference”
This is a thing to remember for ALL fromsoft games. If the information feels intrinsic to the game’s world, then it is not just a reference
@@HeevaEgo fair enough
Divinity OST? Based
I still think if she's anyone we meet in the game, she's Tanith.
even our character faces a god before our supposed ascension, so godfrey and marika facing dragonlord and its god seems plausible.
It's less about them beating the gods in combat (clearly maliketh did it) but more about facing a civilization backup by a god and the ancient dragons in war.
We the tarnished arrive at an already shattered lands between that has mostly already destroyed itself. Taking the elden ring from a golden order still functioning would be impossible.
This is where the support of the greater will with what I think is the meteor that struk farum comes in.
The elden ring is like the Anti Life Equation. A mathematical equation thag governs reality. The golden order is a certain way to arrange the runes and also the order that follows this veiw of reality. The outer gods wish to rearrange the order of the runes to change their vision for reality in the lands between.
My theory if the gloam eyed queen isn't Melina, is that she was sister to Marika
Maybe she's her mother who knows? Definitely related since to be an Empyrian, Marika has to be a demi-god, and to be a demi-god one has to be in a familial relation to the current god or lord/consort.
@@armandaneshjoo may I ask for sauce?
@@shira_yone bro Is just waffling, I have no idea how they came to these conclusions😂
@Zayn_Bass he actually knows his shit. I mean, dude is exactly spot on.
@@armandaneshjoo I watched the Kosmos video, but there's still nothing about GRRM's vs Miyazaki's mythos thing. I just want to know where you got that information.
There's no comment search function so I think it might be unrealistic of me to find your other comment, unless it's a top comment.
Wasnt the elden beast a meteor that fell from the sky along with the elden ring?
Ive always been of the opinion that "gloam eyed something" became a position that could be mantled by anyone (including Melina) once death was removed from the order as a necessary concept would always attempt to return. I dont think that conflicts your theory either.
Awesome!
This is convincing but I’m still more convinced that the GEQ is the historical Marika, and the Marika that the golden order talks about is a figurehead. That Maliketh defeated the gloam eyed queen and that he talks about Marika’s sins and that she’s been stabbed with destined death all tell me that the GEQ is a nickname for Marika. (The Blaidd/Ranni story hints this).
I think the god of the old age is Gransax or the actual Elden Beast. Marika’s just a figure head for the entire history of the golden older.
The age of the dragons was pre-Christian Rome, and the Age of the Erdtree is after Rome co-opts and takes over Rome. The crucible described the area between Jesus’s birth but before an orthodox Christianity is established and there’s many different interpretations of Christianity and it is blending with a lot of other faiths as well.
Your interpretation definitely could be correct but the Jesus Christ imagery surrounding Marika seems too numerous to not use that to fill in gaps in the lore. She’s a vessel for the Elden Ring, which can be interpreted as Logos or The Word which makes her literally The Word Made Flesh. She also is very directly tied to the Erdtree which seems like a stand in for the Tree of Life, another symbol tied to Jesus Christ. Much like Christianity promotes a story about Jesus Christ that is probably not the historical Jesus of Nazareth, I think the Golden Order does the same. They have an image and a belief system they want to create order and control, but that may not coincide with who Jesus actually was and what his goals were.
I don't have a direct counter argument, but this requires a lot of additional assumptions to integrate all the other hints and cues we get. Marika coming from the eternal cities, her documented story with Godfrey and Radagon, the existence of her bed chamber, her speeches in the churches.... That's a little too much lore bending to make it believable for me.
@@Managarm why would it require any assumptions for those? Or at least any more assumptions than we’ve already made. Godfrey is Peter. Radagon is later popes who act as if they’re literally speaking for God/Jesus. And the Nox are definitely Jews in the game. They were followers of the Greater Will before anyone else was. They seemed to be oppressed by the ancient dragons like the Jews were oppressed by Rome. There’s also a good chance they rejected Marika as a messianic figure.
It’s only requiring different interpretations of the lore from the ways people jumped to interpret it. And those initial interpretations leave a ton of contradictions and extra mysteries in the lore anyways.
Why are we sure that it was the greater will whose vessel was the Gloam eyed queen? could a different Outer god use the elden ring with the same ritual, and use the Gloam eyed queen as vessel?
If yes, what if the Turning point of the war between Marika and the GEQ was a bargain or agreement between Marika and the greater will? She becomes a vessel and gets to be an empyrean for now with promises of becoming a god later, Her army gets superpowers with the guidance of grace, She gets Malekith as her shadow, and with this a fighting chance against the overwhelming power of the GEQ and Placidusax and the Godskins, beastmen, Dragons ETC. What if the Greater will was a new player who took an opportunity when the GEQ started hunting down anyone with prospects of godhood?
Better yet, what if The meteor that Shattered Furum Azula was the elden beast itself, and the golden meteors on the top of the divine towers were used to pull him onto the lands between, basically Nuking the enemy's capital AND getting the Greater Will onto the board? We know Gold is connected to outer gods, Miquella's needle proves it. Do we know if Unalloyed gold can only be used to repel the meddling of outer gods, or if the Exact opposite is also possible? I think it is.
The greater will seems parasitic at times, so its not unthinkable that it just replaced the previous god of the lands between, twisted Its rituals to his end, removed the Rune of death and rearranged the other greater runes to cement his own order, Grafted his own tree on top of the old one, and erased history of anyone that came before, just as Marika deemed herself Eternal (which implies the lack of a beginning just as lack of an end), and Godfrey was named the First Elden Lord.
I do base this theory on the assumption that the Greater Will IS for all intents and purposes an Outer God, even if the fundamentalists say otherwise. If i was an outer god vying for exclusive control of the lands between i would lie and say that im Way above the pathetic entities such as the Formless mother to consolidate power.
What if she is Merika?
Look, I think what is messing everybody up is the assumption that the Gloam Eyed Queen and Marika were not one in the same person. Think about it, how can the GEQ go against Marika wielding Destined Death if it could simply be sealed by Marika? Willing to bet Maleketh was known as "Death of the Demigods" because he was Marika's right hand during the Godhunt, and when Malaketh defeated the GEQ and her Godskins he actually defeated Marika for transgression against the Two Fingers because she burned the Erdtree, and that is why Malaketh has the stone right eye that is a gloam eye, because it is Marika's eye, because he took it from her as GEQ.
His job as shadowbound beast to Marika is to turn on Marika should she piss off the Two Fingers. I think as GEQ she actually burned the first tree. She committed the first cardinal sin. That got not only her power sealed but a watchdog, Radagon, who could monitor her actions, become the perfect empyrean making counterpart, and serve as a perfect punishment to Marika by becoming all of he opposites in hopes of making a perfect Rebis capable of making a perfect being, and this was the beginning of the Golden order, the punishment of Marika to become the vessel. Radagon, as a person however, always sought perfection, not the Golden Order.
I think the Elden Beast was trying to perfect itself and that is why this particular punishment was given, to make Marika the vessel. I think this is why Ranni is so willing to go to any length to shed her empyrean flesh, because of what happened to Marika. I think ever since Marika became Radagon, Radagon has slowly been taking over her over time, and that's why Radagon seems to become more active as Marika becomes less active thru the timeline of the game, and I think this seeking of perfection by the Elden Ring, thru Radagon, is actually what starts the transition to Golden Order Fundamentalism the more Radagon takes hold.
I think Marika was punished twice, first as GEQ for burning the Erdtree via Malaketh and Radagon, 2nd by imprisonment in the Erdtree for shattering the Elden Ring, and this is why she mocks Radagon, saying "thou have yet to become me, thou have yet to become a god." Because at the end of the day she is the vessel not him, which is why she wins out and shatters the Elden Ring. In fact it may be the reason she is upset about Godwyn and that's the reason for it, it may be because Godwyn seems to be her only non-Omen child she didn't have with Radagon. If so, that may make him able to be the one Empyrean she could have truly outside of Two Fingers influence. If she was the GEQ, plotting against the two fingers the whole time, this would make more sense than any other reason I have heard. Of course, we could be about to find out that Melina was a child Marika had with Messmer, and that is why she is the kindling maiden. I think Messmer may have helped Marika burn the Erdtree as GEQ.
But why have children with Radagon tho? It may be as a Nox, she thought Radagon could become the perfect substitute for a Silver Tear Albinuric in the making of a true Lord of Night, but after having Miquella Malenia, and Melina, maybe she realized the Two Fingers would control/influence her children as well, and gave the only one who didn't have a body for the Two Fingers to control, Melina, a very special mission only she could do. Return Destined Death to the world, either by burning, or by becoming.
IDK.....I think everything just makes a lot more sense this way.
Hey,
Could you please link the music you used in the video? If it's from Epidemic, can you please name which tracks you used in that case? Particularly the first track is really amazing
Songs are
ORI ost, midnight burrow
Gods and sins, divinity original sin 2
Elden ring ost, godskin apostle and godfrey
@@Kosmos_er Thanks a lot!
No one ever talks about who might the snow witch be. You know rani's mentor. Could it have been the gloam eye queen? If she would be alive somewere lol
Melina could be the Gloam Eyed queen if the time loop theory is realized.
Anybody else notice the blasphemous blade without that...stuff kind looks like the God Slayer Blade from the hilt?
Love the video. Got me thinking if the girl in maleketh's boss room under the old elden ring is the gloam eyed queen then she looks alot like the character in the promotional poster for the extension shadows of the erdtree. I don't think anyone has mentioned this. It's the Gloam Eyed Queed not miquella in the image. Mind blown. Please keep making your videos love them so much.
I think the person in the image represents Miquella, the tree being strangled by the other crooked tree represents Godwyn and the graves in the fields represent the gloam eyed queen, the expansion would about these 3 characters
Divinity Original Sin 2 music
A meteor absolutely can defeat a kingdom ruled by a god.
Tipical L dino take
Just wanted to say I was sent here by TA, curious to see what's what :P
Title of background music?
This puts so much together…
The Age of the Crucible - Age of Chaos death
The age of the Erdtree - Age of life and order
Both are extremes that didn’t workout. Both are called queens and serve an ages God.