I really wish Lee had safer moves, or at least less punishable moves. He is like a Mishima in that way, but without the sauce, so why is he punishable like he has it.
It'll be interesting to see what happens as the tournaments go on through the year with how accurate the lists will be on character results, assuming the patches don't change too much.
I main Bryan and i dont think he is weak at all. He is hard to play but once i got u in a combo, is pretty much my round. Heat smash on block at the wall into 3+4,2 gimmicks won me countless rounds, its very strong.
What rank are you at? I main Bryan too and am in the blue tier. Heat smash at the wall and 3+4,2 gets stepped where I’m at. Bryan does have the damage, but he’s very easy to beat.
@@BustaNAugusta its impossible to step. If u dont charge the 2, u cant step it. Amd after the heat smash people are at -15, impossible to move after that either
@@davideguernieri5115You can definitely still move lol, down jab, jump punch and standing jab interrupts taunt after the blocked heat smash. If you charge after 3+2 you’re gettin jabbed, it’s easy to react to. I’d like Bryan to get an extra frame from hatchet, or ch added back to Mach kick. His damage is insane, but as you kno your average player isn’t pulling off what he’s capable of doing.
@@BustaNAugusta its not easy to react man, im tekken king. Its barely reactable, unless tou conditioned urself for hours in the lab, u cant react everytime, especially if u mix ur options. At -15 u cant step anything at all, 3+4 is 18 frames so 3 frames is not enough to do anything at all, they just have to take the gimmick. U can step the charge or interrupt yeah, but its very hard to do on reaction barely doable. I play with GODs players and they get caught too.
@@davideguernieri5115We agree then bro, I’m not arguing that you can step immediately after blocking the smash, just the rest isn’t guaranteed in which you also stated. I gotta give you your props because you only said it was very effective, not unbeatable…Bryan has no such thing to abuse. I too play god/gold ranks regularly, it’s the main reason I don’t spend barely any time in ranked. Since you added in using other moves besides 3+4, b1 into f3 (if blocked) is my fave besides taunt. Much respect bro and wishing nothing but continued improvement and joy ✊🏼.
Jin isn't just the best Mishima but the best Kazama as well. His Heat Smash wall carry and D2 are ridiculous and hope those things get nerfed going into S2. Also, we don't talk about Nina either in her current state considering how busted she was back in T5.0 as well.
his list i pretty close to what I think a well. I would have some changes but over all close to how I'd rate it. Lee is def low tier bottom B because he has nothing in heat he's the most base tekken 8 character its like playing tekken 2 Lee vs tekken 7 characters. on top of that if you know how to play against him its over pack it up.
Zafina's heat is not that great since the azazel moves deplete heat meter. She also has some of the worst launchers and punishment in the game with a 16 frame df2 and 17 frame hopkick. And she has the worst damage output in the game.
Nah... He said it for tournament purpose and he based this on fighting pro players if your a casual tier list means no shit only if your T7 leory level broken.
@@vlastermaster yeah, it does. It’s just that some moves are easier to read because they’re staple moves at specific ranges or in certain given game states. And Some moves of that type are easier to beat on a hard read than others. Sky rocket is easy to beat on a read because it’s very linear. Whereas a different hwoarang move like RFF+df3 (the homing mid heat engager) may be harder to beat on a hard read. You have to jab interrupt, because that’s its only counter play, which is harder and more dangerous to time than a simple sidestep. There’s a lot more to hard reads than just knowing the move is coming, my dude.
the amount of downplay with lee players is insane first thing they say oh he has no heat stuff omg bad 2nd thing oh he is punishable so punishable can u talk about the other stuff he is extremely good at good carry amazing wall game good combo damage good punishments from standing also (14 frame launcher from crouch where the strongest lows in the game are -14) his counter hit game is top notch not bad homing which u catch ppl stepping im a lee player myself and i find it really interesting that lee is bottom 3 lmao u cant convince me that asuka/dvj/raven/azu/zaf/lars/jack are stronger than lee lmao u cant be serious stop downplaying and play better maybe u will get out of the blue ranks thank you very much have a great day EDIT: some ppl think my comment on get out blue ranks was aimed at fightinggm, this is not the case it was aimed at lee players in general that keep downplaying the character when they dont know what are they talking about. i should've made this clearer
U should go win some tournament and get top 8 if he's so good lol. Arslan one of the best players in the world and he telling u lee Is ass so I dunno what to tell you
I agree with your points im also a lee player and I believe that he has a strong toolkit (best 10f punishment) sure he might not have the best heat or movement but that doesn't mean his move list is irrelevant or he is automatically bad, the only issue is that you need to play better than your opponent using the rest of your toolkit such as your CH moves. superakouma almost won against arslan so that implies lee is not a bad character, he is more difficult to use compared to the rest of the roster. but he is still really powerful and could turn around the match. regarding the tierlist, arslan does not play against lee players (in pakistan) so its understandable that he would put the char in the bottom of the tier, if superakouma won id bet he would be above where lee currently is
@@fightinggm thats irrelevant lmao u cant just skip all what i said and say just get top 8 first arslan himself said that this tierlist is not definitive things could change in the future when he understands the characters more. like he himself said when was talking about reina that he does not have much experience against her so some character maybe he need more time with. sure lets say lee is ass whatever but is he bottom 3 ass???????? really?? like i said before you can not convince me that lee is worse than the other characters in B tier u saying asuka is better than lee?? come on or dvj or jun really interesting
F tier in this game dont mean your shit it just means there's better options u can win with anybody but to win tournaments consistently its mostly the s ranks majority of the time
Huge fan my guy we faced each other awhile back and I got clapped lol I'm a god of destruction Hwoarang now and I would be honored with a FT5 whenever you wanna throw down 👌
Devil Jin has literally the worst DF1 in the game the worst flash punch with one of the worst jab range and also doesn't gave good lows at all besides down back + 2 His pokes are very bad tbh but as Arsenal said the generic Mishima tools makes him still decent
@@Chaoblahippo Carry him to be like bottom 6 tho ahah. And still DJ is HARD as fuck, with EWGF iWS2 wr3 out of wavedash and wavedash and movement in general also you have to visually confirm some moves (ch df1 2 or df2 into mc 2 2) all this effort to be such a mediocre character.. I would prefer Lars Jun or even Panda over him tbh
this shit is gold. gm giving tech to watch out for form every character. i feel Arslanash was only good with kunimitsu cuz it was hard to punishing her compare to the rest of the cast. which is why he having problems now in Tekken 8
@@anasmalik3263 everbody lost kazumi and geese when they came out but as time passed players learn how to deal with them. no one trains against Zafina like that so people including him took advantage. Kunimitsu knife never got patch so she was cheep.
Ling doesn’t win tournament bc she’s a garbage character that no other top players want to pick up because they know she’s not good. She’s at minimum frustrating to play against but one of the easiest characters to beat by turtling and patience. Not sure why every tier list overrates her. More than likely because community opinion drives buffs and nerfs and she’s not an accessible character, so having her be actual top tier in specialists hands can be too dangerous.
How are you gonna win against ling by turtling if she have 33/33/33 unreactable throw game, multiple knd lows, launching throw. No one plays her because she is boring and her design is uninspired.
She is not garbage, but definitely not as great as people make her out to be either. Upper-mid tier is probably fair. Like Arslan says, she has glaring weaknesses, like shitty poking, that get ignored by those who hate her, which unfortunately includes fightinggm, who tries to use the weak argument "Ling only fails in tournaments because the people playing her are bad". Like sure, buddy, okay. She will always be a character whose strengths are exaggerated by those who can't stand playing against her. All specialist and rulebreaker characters will get treated like this. We might as well get used to it. But good on you for giving this video some pushback, fightinggm is clearly emotional and biased as fuck.
@@odkgame693 you can step all her bt moves rendering her bt throw mixups useless. Her lows are fairly weak. There’s no reason to duck against her when she’s outside of heat. Literally the only task the opponent needs to do is prevent a situation where they are against the wall with her heat. That’s literally the only situation she’s strong with. No one plays her because they recognize that her tools are weak and takes too much effort to be competitive with her.
I really wish Lee had safer moves, or at least less punishable moves. He is like a Mishima in that way, but without the sauce, so why is he punishable like he has it.
They be doing like first to 60s and 100s offline in Pakistan
Lol
Insane
@showtimefu1234 that's how you truly get good at a game like this. Unfortunately not many of us have this luxury.
That's why they winning
I really like what GM was saying. I think it’s because GM speaks in a simple and direct way. Great video.
It'll be interesting to see what happens as the tournaments go on through the year with how accurate the lists will be on character results, assuming the patches don't change too much.
I think he ment backlash not skyrocket. Because he said to duck it.
This tier list would be way more accurate if Lee and yoshi swapped places.
🤣 🤣 🤣 🤣
Nope youshimitsu is strong in tekken 8
@@AncientVegetable everyone is strong in tekken 8
@@scowlingmoongod yeah but youshimitsu got more annoying moves now , now flash can be used frequently thats why
@@AncientVegetable flash is -15 on block and -40 on whiff.
Arslan says he has 18 frame reactions 💀
you should put a filter on ur mic so it doesnt pick up ur fan i use nvidia broadcast echo and noise removal
I main Bryan and i dont think he is weak at all. He is hard to play but once i got u in a combo, is pretty much my round. Heat smash on block at the wall into 3+4,2 gimmicks won me countless rounds, its very strong.
What rank are you at? I main Bryan too and am in the blue tier. Heat smash at the wall and 3+4,2 gets stepped where I’m at. Bryan does have the damage, but he’s very easy to beat.
@@BustaNAugusta its impossible to step. If u dont charge the 2, u cant step it. Amd after the heat smash people are at -15, impossible to move after that either
@@davideguernieri5115You can definitely still move lol, down jab, jump punch and standing jab interrupts taunt after the blocked heat smash. If you charge after 3+2 you’re gettin jabbed, it’s easy to react to. I’d like Bryan to get an extra frame from hatchet, or ch added back to Mach kick. His damage is insane, but as you kno your average player isn’t pulling off what he’s capable of doing.
@@BustaNAugusta its not easy to react man, im tekken king. Its barely reactable, unless tou conditioned urself for hours in the lab, u cant react everytime, especially if u mix ur options.
At -15 u cant step anything at all, 3+4 is 18 frames so 3 frames is not enough to do anything at all, they just have to take the gimmick. U can step the charge or interrupt yeah, but its very hard to do on reaction barely doable. I play with GODs players and they get caught too.
@@davideguernieri5115We agree then bro, I’m not arguing that you can step immediately after blocking the smash, just the rest isn’t guaranteed in which you also stated. I gotta give you your props because you only said it was very effective, not unbeatable…Bryan has no such thing to abuse. I too play god/gold ranks regularly, it’s the main reason I don’t spend barely any time in ranked. Since you added in using other moves besides 3+4, b1 into f3 (if blocked) is my fave besides taunt. Much respect bro and wishing nothing but continued improvement and joy ✊🏼.
Jin isn't just the best Mishima but the best Kazama as well. His Heat Smash wall carry and D2 are ridiculous and hope those things get nerfed going into S2. Also, we don't talk about Nina either in her current state considering how busted she was back in T5.0 as well.
Eddy placement is correct for a dlc character feels unfinished and forgotten about but when Lidia comes she’s gonna be cracked
Great video, GM! Your input is interesting
his list i pretty close to what I think a well. I would have some changes but over all close to how I'd rate it. Lee is def low tier bottom B because he has nothing in heat he's the most base tekken 8 character its like playing tekken 2 Lee vs tekken 7 characters. on top of that if you know how to play against him its over pack it up.
If your heat is OD then you’re already a good character 🙌🏿🙌🏿 facts
I like how y'all talk like GM 😂
no way Lee is bottom 3 and DVJ is that higher xD
Most accurate tier list so far
Yeah, especially the part about Jun made my day🙂↔️
💀 Jun abuser coping through arslan@@AleksandrKlimanev
kappa
If Jun is F-tier then I am a GOD lol
lol 😂same bro I’ll give her an A
He put her in B not F
omm 🤣🤣
Dragunov is strange in that he's clearly the best character in the game (and has been since release imo) but he still feels....honest? Idk
His moves are not too deceptive. When I get hit by drag, I know it's my fault and not because the move had crazy evasive properties.
Zafina's heat is not that great since the azazel moves deplete heat meter. She also has some of the worst launchers and punishment in the game with a 16 frame df2 and 17 frame hopkick. And she has the worst damage output in the game.
Arslan was high when he was making this tier list
Nah... He said it for tournament purpose and he based this on fighting pro players if your a casual tier list means no shit only if your T7 leory level broken.
Ever think about doing anti character guides GM? Youd prolly be the best at it
Maybe soon bro
Definitely need to see an anti-Feng video, GM plays into feng so well
Alisa 41:39 minor update.
For you everyone is S tier. Game over
Wrong
"you could put eyes on his Skyrocket" ...wtf does that even mean dawg?
He means you can read it. You can get a read on your opponent and beat sky rocket if you’ve read them correctly.
@@The_Buff_Guy ya that applies to basically EVERY single move in the game lol
@@Chaoblahippo you as well, bro.
@@vlastermaster yeah, it does. It’s just that some moves are easier to read because they’re staple moves at specific ranges or in certain given game states. And Some moves of that type are easier to beat on a hard read than others.
Sky rocket is easy to beat on a read because it’s very linear. Whereas a different hwoarang move like RFF+df3 (the homing mid heat engager) may be harder to beat on a hard read. You have to jab interrupt, because that’s its only counter play, which is harder and more dangerous to time than a simple sidestep.
There’s a lot more to hard reads than just knowing the move is coming, my dude.
@@The_Buff_Guy ya but still, to read is not the same as to react, to read has more to do with the player than to the move itself thats my point
He is not talking about normal players he is talking about pro player perspective
Yea I know and I'm a pro player reacting to this tier list lol
@@fightinggm he is talking from 1% of the pro player base
You gotta do your research on GM...
ravens clones in heat are only -3. df1 will stop his pressure
Really? They feel plus.
What is od
the amount of downplay with lee players is insane
first thing they say oh he has no heat stuff omg bad
2nd thing oh he is punishable so punishable
can u talk about the other stuff he is extremely good at
good carry
amazing wall game
good combo damage
good punishments from standing also (14 frame launcher from crouch where the strongest lows in the game are -14)
his counter hit game is top notch
not bad homing which u catch ppl stepping
im a lee player myself and i find it really interesting that lee is bottom 3 lmao
u cant convince me that asuka/dvj/raven/azu/zaf/lars/jack are stronger than lee lmao u cant be serious
stop downplaying and play better maybe u will get out of the blue ranks
thank you very much have a great day
EDIT: some ppl think my comment on get out blue ranks was aimed at fightinggm, this is not the case it was aimed at lee players in general that keep downplaying the character when they dont know what are they talking about. i should've made this clearer
U should go win some tournament and get top 8 if he's so good lol. Arslan one of the best players in the world and he telling u lee Is ass so I dunno what to tell you
I agree with your points
im also a lee player and I believe that he has a strong toolkit (best 10f punishment)
sure he might not have the best heat or movement but that doesn't mean his move list is irrelevant or he is automatically bad, the only issue is that you need to play better than your opponent using the rest of your toolkit such as your CH moves.
superakouma almost won against arslan so that implies lee is not a bad character, he is more difficult to use compared to the rest of the roster. but he is still really powerful and could turn around the match.
regarding the tierlist, arslan does not play against lee players (in pakistan) so its understandable that he would put the char in the bottom of the tier, if superakouma won id bet he would be above where lee currently is
@@space6890the same akuma that loses in pools?
@@fightinggm thats irrelevant lmao u cant just skip all what i said and say just get top 8
first arslan himself said that this tierlist is not definitive things could change in the future when he understands the characters more. like he himself said when was talking about reina that he does not have much experience against her so some character maybe he need more time with.
sure lets say lee is ass whatever but is he bottom 3 ass???????? really??
like i said before you can not convince me that lee is worse than the other characters in B tier
u saying asuka is better than lee?? come on
or dvj
or jun
really interesting
@@Omar12521 you're telling the best Lee in the world to get out of Blue Ranks. Who's going to take you seriously after that?
the part about ling and ling players was hilarious. Thank you GM!
Kazuya In heat on a floor break stage 10:32
Did you see Jun beat Jdcr Dragunov recently! No way she is that low.
With that logic Eddy should be higher jeondding got to grand finals with him in the same tournament
F tier in this game dont mean your shit it just means there's better options u can win with anybody but to win tournaments consistently its mostly the s ranks majority of the time
Take a shot every time he says OD
Huge fan my guy we faced each other awhile back and I got clapped lol I'm a god of destruction Hwoarang now and I would be honored with a FT5 whenever you wanna throw down 👌
No way you said Raven does a lot of damage
lee top 4 character very strong, b3,3 too broken
As a Bryan main, I’ll say it.
He’s strong as fuck now.
He hits u once and it's a wrap
You seen the line up. It was free as shit. I could’ve won 😂
He’s downplaying some of his characters
@@Chaoblahippo only because he has to with that character, Jun should be much higher.
Devil Jin has literally the worst DF1 in the game the worst flash punch with one of the worst jab range and also doesn't gave good lows at all besides down back + 2
His pokes are very bad tbh but as Arsenal said the generic Mishima tools makes him still decent
@@Chaoblahippo Carry him to be like bottom 6 tho ahah. And still DJ is HARD as fuck, with EWGF iWS2 wr3 out of wavedash and wavedash and movement in general also you have to visually confirm some moves (ch df1 2 or df2 into mc 2 2) all this effort to be such a mediocre character.. I would prefer Lars Jun or even Panda over him tbh
good video
this shit is gold. gm giving tech to watch out for form every character. i feel Arslanash was only good with kunimitsu cuz it was hard to punishing her compare to the rest of the cast. which is why he having problems now in Tekken 8
Only good with kunimitsu? Bro he rule the whole world with his kazumi in 2019 and as well with geese and zafina
@@Chaoblahippo she cheep ass character that ain't get patch he don't get no points for that.
@@anasmalik3263 everbody lost kazumi and geese when they came out but as time passed players learn how to deal with them. no one trains against Zafina like that so people including him took advantage. Kunimitsu knife never got patch so she was cheep.
You are on some drugs brother wtf are you talking about@@kingjookz2151
How he having problems in tekken 8? Lol he just won evo and another few tournaments already .. wtf you talking about?
Ling doesn’t win tournament bc she’s a garbage character that no other top players want to pick up because they know she’s not good. She’s at minimum frustrating to play against but one of the easiest characters to beat by turtling and patience. Not sure why every tier list overrates her. More than likely because community opinion drives buffs and nerfs and she’s not an accessible character, so having her be actual top tier in specialists hands can be too dangerous.
How are you gonna win against ling by turtling if she have 33/33/33 unreactable throw game, multiple knd lows, launching throw. No one plays her because she is boring and her design is uninspired.
Ling is garbage? lmao nice one
She is not garbage, but definitely not as great as people make her out to be either. Upper-mid tier is probably fair. Like Arslan says, she has glaring weaknesses, like shitty poking, that get ignored by those who hate her, which unfortunately includes fightinggm, who tries to use the weak argument "Ling only fails in tournaments because the people playing her are bad". Like sure, buddy, okay.
She will always be a character whose strengths are exaggerated by those who can't stand playing against her. All specialist and rulebreaker characters will get treated like this. We might as well get used to it. But good on you for giving this video some pushback, fightinggm is clearly emotional and biased as fuck.
@@odkgame693 you can step all her bt moves rendering her bt throw mixups useless. Her lows are fairly weak. There’s no reason to duck against her when she’s outside of heat. Literally the only task the opponent needs to do is prevent a situation where they are against the wall with her heat. That’s literally the only situation she’s strong with. No one plays her because they recognize that her tools are weak and takes too much effort to be competitive with her.
@@Cal3000 I mean... you're a Ling main tho, no?