Agree 110%. Szell turns the symphony into an organic whole. Superb clarity and phrasing. Tempi are neither too fast nor too draggy. I "grew up" on his Eroica and later realized how I had been spoiled when listening to other versions.
Yes! Last night I listened carefully to this recording, having heard Blomstedt’s recent rendition a couple of nights ago with the Concertgebouw, which I found sounded antiseptic to me, especially with the way Blomstedt pulled back on the phrases to limit their impact. But now I know why I thought that - Szell gives every moment of the music its full measure, creating a world within every phrase, and making it all sound integrated, natural, and inevitable. It is a tapestry for the ears, with each musical idea clearly articulated and phrased by every member of the orchestra, and with purpose. Nobody was just playing notes to get through the session, as clearly everyone was expected to be a soloist, playing as equal parts of an ensemble. Now I also clearly understand why I have been so frustrated with other Beethoven cycles since Szell - Other conductors since then may emphasize one aspect or another as a thematic emphasis of the work (majestic, heroic, high energy, revolutionary), but to me none have captured all of the aspects that Szell exhibits here (all of the above plus pensive, introspective, poignant, etc.). Interestingly, I think if other conductors were to actually try this approach today, they would likely end up with something that sounded warped, overblown, or mannered, since I really don’t think they know how to do that anymore. There is something about that era that brought out the best recordings.
I must confess I'd never listened to the Szell recording until I watched your video. The final movement coda actually made me whoop with joy. It's thrilling!
Another great video. Sony is releasing a newly remastered box set of Szell Beethoven Symphonies on December 13 and this is one of the CDs in the set, it's so exciting!
Could not agree more with Dave's assessment of the particular merits of this unique recording. The fourth movement represented the mighty culmination of Beethoven's treatment of this same theme and variations over many years in a variety of forms. When this recording first came out in the late 1950s on open reel-to-reel tape, I remember being literally a bit frightened listening to the stupendous outburst of coiled energy at the outset of the coda, as if the sound was moving in waves from the orchestra into one's being. Fortunately, early stereo recordings benefitted from the early technology which minimized the number of microphones that better captured the sense of being in the actual presence of the orchestra in a concert hall. More than six decades later, this remarkable recording still provides that thrill of discovery and triumph.
I concur about the value of the interpretation, and I am so glad that someone went back to the "Epic Stereorama" [awesome] tapes and did a remastering that streams at 192kHz/24 bits to bring us as much as possible from the performance. Szell and the Cleveland band deserve it.
Sony has also released an SACD only (no CD layer) version of the February 1957 performance, presumably as a demonstration of the virtues of that format. Very good sound quality as one might expect.
Dave, I love your channel, and I’ve probably watched at least 100 videos by now. Reviewers always talk about the performance (obviously) but not so much about the recording techniques used to capture the performance. Clearly a great record must combine a great performance with a great recording of that performance, in order to be truly great. John Culshaw’s Ring Resounding is a great book that goes into incredible detail about not only Solti’s conducting of Wagner’s Ring, but also the advancements in recording techniques that made this such a colossal event for its time. Even in something as simple as recording a rock band, what kind of microphones are used, where they are placed in relation to the amplifiers that are being used by the musicians, etc. can have a gigantic impact on the final quality of the recording, and the ability to discern separation between the various instruments. How much more so for the recording of an entire orchestra! Maybe that’s a subject or theme that you could cover in the future? Thank you very much for helping me better appreciate the music I have already collected, and giving me ideas for further expansion of my collection.
Thanks for that, Dave. If Szell's Cleveland Eroica has been considered THE reference recording in British and French musical media, I have missed it. So I ordered it today, coupled with the 8th, and am expecting great things.
All you need to do is line up Szell with any other opening of the Finale. It is night and day - the clarity, the explosiveness, and those horns! -- especially in the coda. Simply spectaculaire!
Thanks, Dave, for this interesting and instructive series. It underscores the importance of objective aesthetic criteria irrespective of taste. Though the two can coincide, as they do for me with respect to the Szell "Eroica." It has long been my personal "reference" recording, and I'm pleased that at least in this case taste lines up with critical consensus. That was also the case with respect to Bernstein's Mahler 3, the subject of your previous reference recording talk. Also, I wanted to thank you for keeping up the Haydn Symphony Crusade, i continue to learn a whole lot from them.
Clearly, the explosive breakneck speed of the coda, presented with phenomenal clarity and precision by the CO, is really a hallmark of this performance. But there are other masterfully pleasing sections of this recording that stand out second to none in this recording. Take, for example, the wonderful horn trio in the scherzo. I have yet to hear a more articulate and dynamically pleasing rendition than that presented by the CO horns, lead by the incomparable Myron Bloom, principle horn.
I'm not the one to quibble with the choice of the Szell recording as a reference recording as it is part of my Eroica-reference-triptych. The other components are: Klemperer's 1955 mono recording with the Philharmonia Orchestra. In my opinion the best of Klemperer's studio recordings of this score, that you without hyperbole could claim he to some extent owned... with his slightly rugged approach and the trademark timbral allure (woodwinds to the fore, the slightly granitic quality to tutti passages, that fits the Beethovian from-struggle-to-victory to a 't'), entailing a wealth of details without ever letting go of the (almost awe-inspiring) grasp of the overarching, architectural structure of the symphony. Finally, but not lastly, Furtwängler's 1944-recording with the Vienna Philharmonia. You don't have to scurry around to find the best of his interpretations, this is THE Furtwängler Eroica to own. I have to grant mr. Hurwitz, that there might be a problem in obtaining the performance in a transfer of better quality (the SACD-version of the now defunct TAHRA-label is the best I've come across so far - and for sure not belaguered by "iffy sound" ). But I assure you the search is worth your while! Furtwängler's rendition is a shattering experience, the last word on tragic poise and, against all odds, the flickering flame of hope in the hour of utmost despair. I'm not quite sure, whether Dave might not share this point of view in one of his more nuanced takes on Furtwängler (fx as represented by his discussion on Furtwängler with Rob Cowan, his fellow critic - and probably the only reviewer at the British magazine, 'The Gramophone', that he respects)? Rob Cowan certainly does share it, as does Ardoin in his (almost nerdy) entreprise to review all, the known Furtwängler recordings, studio as well as live. On the recording in question, Ardoin states, that it "is .... Furtwängler's noblest and most compelling Eroica". And with the consensus criteria for a reference recording in play, it is, indeed, even more a great comfort to know, that Jed Distler, mr. Hurwitz' eminent colleague at Classicstoday, shares my enthusiasm for this rendition, too!
I love your classics today review on the P.Jarvi/DKB recording and how you compared Szell's recording favourably. A review that I found really helpful. Thankyou Dave
Dave, this is a great and insightful series for critical judgement, thank you! You reviewed 5th december 2022 the complete Sony recordings box of Frieder Bernius, and you mentioned the complete Schutz Carus recordings by Hans-Christoph Rademann and the Dresdener Kammerchor. Maybe you can review this project in your series " most important recording projects ever". Schutz is an important composer and he is not well known. So this an important project by an independent label to give Schutz the recognition he deserves and his spiritual music is wonderful.
My favorite piece of Beethoven music of all and now off to get a reference recording. I wonder what Beethoven would have thought about the recording, and of the conductor Szell and of the orchestra. Would he have torn the title page yet again?
I would like to think, in obviously a truly mystical and fanciful way, that Mr. Szell and deceased members of the CO perform the Beethoven Symphonies ad infinitum: they are in Heaven after all (we all wish). And sitting in the audience front row with hearing acuity completely restored is Lou. He is smiling!
Wonderful series. I'like to ask if you could continue the one where you talk about the works x composer wrote in a specific narrow period of his life. I believe you only made a Schubert episode. Thanks
And we have "bingo!" I once heard Szell and the Cleveland doing the Eroica "live from Severance Hall" on the radio in the late sixties and was transfixed by the transparent inevitability of the entire thing. This recording captures Szell's mastery of this symphony. None better.
The "Eroica" is a glorious mess of a symphony. I wouldn't regard it as my favorite of Beethoven's symphonies, but it might well be the most interesting. I just checked my hard drive, and I see sixteen recordings of the Eroica, but surprisingly, this one isn't there. (Or it wasn't... I just bought and downloaded Szell's Beethoven symphony cycle, so Eroica No. 17 now resides on my hard drive. Since the set isn't expensive, I figure that it can't hurt to have Szell's other Beethoven recordings too.) For this popular but rather strange piece of music, I think it makes sense to have a recording that is considered by many to be a reference. Given the recent influence of the HIPsters on performances of Beethoven, whether you approve of their work or not, it is valuable to hear the old favorite recordings from before this movement really got going. My opinion on the HIPsters is mixed, so it is good for me to hear the best of their work alongside the best examples of the performance practices that preceded them. I have to give the HIPsters some credit, though. I used to have a bit of a hard time getting into Beethoven. The HIPsters somehow cracked the code for me, and after this, I went back to the older recordings and found that I liked them better than I did before.
Indisputably the right choice. As a native Cleveland and grandson of Szell enthusiasts, this recording will always be my yardstick for evaluating all other Eroicas. That applies to at least a few other of the Szell/Cleveland/Beethoven recordings I think, particularly if we cheat and count the even-numbered symphonies and No. 1. It is I suppose arguable whether all of those truly have reference recordings as you indicate, but I think the term can probably be slapped on all of LVB’s symphonies (and maybe overtures too).
Typical strategy for the end of the Eroica--conduct it as fast as you can and hope the musicians can play all the notes. Szell's strategy--conduct it as fast as you can and threaten anyone who misses a note with instant death. Everyone practiced a lot and it came out great!
The CD you hold in your Hand I am guessing it is Deutche Gramaphone Re Szell and Cleveland Symphony Orchestra.... where can you buy a copy from....cover looks a bit pop art ish...maybe...... Really really enjoyed this Erioica......!!! Thank you......
Have I understood correctly that a 'reference recording' is defined as the one which a consensus of critical opinion has identified as the best? I can think of a few statistical queries, if that is the case. But I may have misunderstood. Anyway, very informative video, as always.
First time commenter. I only hope you haven't shot the Szell wad with this one performance Dave (deserving as it is). When I saw you were doing this new series I thought of four reference recordings - all of them by Szell. Haydn 93 & 96, Hindemith Symphonic Metamorphosis, and above all- Mozart 39. Yes, they're my favorites. But, I think they are legitimate reference recordings as well. I sure hope you do something about Mozart 39 in some format. It doesn't get nearly enough attention IMHO.😊
My personal reference is still the Toscanini 1953 recording. Best balance of performance and sound. If his 1939 were in stereo or even excellent mono, it would be my choice. (His 1949 RCA can be set aside.) For all practical purposes, sure, Szell is the pick. However, for a genuinely cathartic, gut wrenching experience, Fricsay's 20 minute funeral march is unique. Probably not a "reference" but not to be missed.
Yesterday I was about to post a comment with my predictions for this series. Szell's Eroica was among them. I didn't expect that my prediction would be fulfilled so quickly, though :P I also bet most of the following will make it your list: Bernstein's first Mahler 7 Dutoit's The Planets Karajan's first Strauss Metamorphosen + Tod un Verklärung on DG (the one from the 80s) Dohnányi/Cleveland's Dvorak 9 There others which could qualify but I'm not so sure if you would agree: Jansons first Tchaikovsky 5th, Wand's Bruckner 4 with the BPO and his Bruckner 8 with the NDR at Lübeck, and Haitink's Bruckner 7 with the Concertgebouworkest (the '79 one).
It’s possible to cheat and look them up at classicstoday. Or if you’ve seen the survey videos for any of these works (off the top of my head I know that you’re right about Mahler 7).
David, you know you say you have a problem with finale's coda. Far from telling what the master should have done to his composition, but I think Beethoven should have held that last note, alah his 5th symphony, which is very similar, albeit, in a different key. 🤔. What do you think.
Respectfully, it doesn't work. If you notice, most of Beethoven's orchestral works, including the concertos, end on short, definitive notes. This is contrary the brooding Brahms, who languished in prolonged ending notes. It seems Beethoven's compositions were of such high moving drama that the only way to end these pieces was with a quick definitive brush stroke.
Mindful of your definition of "reference recording" (as opposed to other criteria, like "my favourite," or "the best", or what not), although you've never wavered in identifying this as "the reference", it's notable how seldom (and sometimes not at all) the BRITISH musical press highlights this recording as THE reference Eroica. I think they're mental, frankly, but you can't deny that the seem to omit this one from the top (or even top 5) when discussing how to build a library and, yes, pick a "reference" recording, using that very term. Just look at the surveys in Gramophone, where it's mentioned (as marvelous, admittedly) but left out of the top 4 or 5. I remember being astounded when I listed to a "Building a Library" on BBC Radio 3 and Szell's Eroica WASN'T EVEN MENTIONED (not even in passing). They seem to think it's forgettable, and I say that for the obvious reason that they routinely, and literally, forget to mention it. I'm not disagreeing that it's a reference (obviously is), just noting that you can't point to the British press and say they acknowledge it, because that doesn't seem borne out by the evidence.
Generally I agree with Mr. Horowitz, but I find Szell's recording a tad too clinical and dry. I've long preferred Hans Schmidt-Isserstedt and the Vienna Philharmonic on Decca. Indeed, not just the Eroica, but his whole cycle of the Nine, and in particular THE recording of the Ninth. I just wish these recordings were better known!
Agree 110%. Szell turns the symphony into an organic whole. Superb clarity and phrasing. Tempi are neither too fast nor too draggy. I "grew up" on his Eroica and later realized how I had been spoiled when listening to other versions.
And it's "STEREORAMA"!
Yes! Last night I listened carefully to this recording, having heard Blomstedt’s recent rendition a couple of nights ago with the Concertgebouw, which I found sounded antiseptic to me, especially with the way Blomstedt pulled back on the phrases to limit their impact. But now I know why I thought that - Szell gives every moment of the music its full measure, creating a world within every phrase, and making it all sound integrated, natural, and inevitable. It is a tapestry for the ears, with each musical idea clearly articulated and phrased by every member of the orchestra, and with purpose. Nobody was just playing notes to get through the session, as clearly everyone was expected to be a soloist, playing as equal parts of an ensemble.
Now I also clearly understand why I have been so frustrated with other Beethoven cycles since Szell - Other conductors since then may emphasize one aspect or another as a thematic emphasis of the work (majestic, heroic, high energy, revolutionary), but to me none have captured all of the aspects that Szell exhibits here (all of the above plus pensive, introspective, poignant, etc.). Interestingly, I think if other conductors were to actually try this approach today, they would likely end up with something that sounded warped, overblown, or mannered, since I really don’t think they know how to do that anymore.
There is something about that era that brought out the best recordings.
I must confess I'd never listened to the Szell recording until I watched your video. The final movement coda actually made me whoop with joy. It's thrilling!
Same experience for me Here, I‘m absolutely blown away by the Szell-Recording. It‘s awesome
Another great video. Sony is releasing a newly remastered box set of Szell Beethoven Symphonies on December 13 and this is one of the CDs in the set, it's so exciting!
Could not agree more with Dave's assessment of the particular merits of this unique recording. The fourth movement represented the mighty culmination of Beethoven's treatment of this same theme and variations over many years in a variety of forms. When this recording first came out in the late 1950s on open reel-to-reel tape, I remember being literally a bit frightened listening to the stupendous outburst of coiled energy at the outset of the coda, as if the sound was moving in waves from the orchestra into one's being. Fortunately, early stereo recordings benefitted from the early technology which minimized the number of microphones that better captured the sense of being in the actual presence of the orchestra in a concert hall. More than six decades later, this remarkable recording still provides that thrill of discovery and triumph.
I concur about the value of the interpretation, and I am so glad that someone went back to the "Epic Stereorama" [awesome] tapes and did a remastering that streams at 192kHz/24 bits to bring us as much as possible from the performance. Szell and the Cleveland band deserve it.
Sony has also released an SACD only (no CD layer) version of the February 1957 performance, presumably as a demonstration of the virtues of that format. Very good sound quality as one might expect.
Lucky me. The first box set I bought when I was a know-nothing teen in the early 70s was the Szell Beethoven symphonies.
Exactly.
100% on the mark in my opinion! In fact, I have personally been thrilled by that coda consistently for 35 years now.
Dave, I love your channel, and I’ve probably watched at least 100 videos by now.
Reviewers always talk about the performance (obviously) but not so much about the recording techniques used to capture the performance. Clearly a great record must combine a great performance with a great recording of that performance, in order to be truly great.
John Culshaw’s Ring Resounding is a great book that goes into incredible detail about not only Solti’s conducting of Wagner’s Ring, but also the advancements in recording techniques that made this such a colossal event for its time.
Even in something as simple as recording a rock band, what kind of microphones are used, where they are placed in relation to the amplifiers that are being used by the musicians, etc. can have a gigantic impact on the final quality of the recording, and the ability to discern separation between the various instruments. How much more so for the recording of an entire orchestra!
Maybe that’s a subject or theme that you could cover in the future?
Thank you very much for helping me better appreciate the music I have already collected, and giving me ideas for further expansion of my collection.
Thanks for that, Dave. If Szell's Cleveland Eroica has been considered THE reference recording in British and French musical media, I have missed it. So I ordered it today, coupled with the 8th, and am expecting great things.
All you need to do is line up Szell with any other opening of the Finale. It is night and day - the clarity, the explosiveness, and those horns! -- especially in the coda. Simply spectaculaire!
Another one for the collection. Excellent.
Thanks, Dave, for this interesting and instructive series. It underscores the importance of objective aesthetic criteria irrespective of taste. Though the two can coincide, as they do for me with respect to the Szell "Eroica." It has long been my personal "reference" recording, and I'm pleased that at least in this case taste lines up with critical consensus. That was also the case with respect to Bernstein's Mahler 3, the subject of your previous reference recording talk. Also, I wanted to thank you for keeping up the Haydn Symphony Crusade, i continue to learn a whole lot from them.
I know this is a new series/category of videos, but I'm really digging it 👍
Clearly, the explosive breakneck speed of the coda, presented with phenomenal clarity and precision by the CO, is really a hallmark of this performance. But there are other masterfully pleasing sections of this recording that stand out second to none in this recording. Take, for example, the wonderful horn trio in the scherzo. I have yet to hear a more articulate and dynamically pleasing rendition than that presented by the CO horns, lead by the incomparable Myron Bloom, principle horn.
Thank you. I am going to buy this.
In this case the reference recording happens also to be my personal favorite.
I'm not the one to quibble with the choice of the Szell recording as a reference recording as it is part of my Eroica-reference-triptych. The other components are:
Klemperer's 1955 mono recording with the Philharmonia Orchestra. In my opinion the best of Klemperer's studio recordings of this score, that you without hyperbole could claim he to some extent owned... with his slightly rugged approach and the trademark timbral allure (woodwinds to the fore, the slightly granitic quality to tutti passages, that fits the Beethovian from-struggle-to-victory to a 't'), entailing a wealth of details without ever letting go of the (almost awe-inspiring) grasp of the overarching, architectural structure of the symphony.
Finally, but not lastly, Furtwängler's 1944-recording with the Vienna Philharmonia. You don't have to scurry around to find the best of his interpretations, this is THE Furtwängler Eroica to own. I have to grant mr. Hurwitz, that there might be a problem in obtaining the performance in a transfer of better quality (the SACD-version of the now defunct TAHRA-label is the best I've come across so far - and for sure not belaguered by "iffy sound" ). But I assure you the search is worth your while! Furtwängler's rendition is a shattering experience, the last word on tragic poise and, against all odds, the flickering flame of hope in the hour of utmost despair.
I'm not quite sure, whether Dave might not share this point of view in one of his more nuanced takes on Furtwängler (fx as represented by his discussion on Furtwängler with Rob Cowan, his fellow critic - and probably the only reviewer at the British magazine, 'The Gramophone', that he respects)? Rob Cowan certainly does share it, as does Ardoin in his (almost nerdy) entreprise to review all, the known Furtwängler recordings, studio as well as live. On the recording in question, Ardoin states, that it "is .... Furtwängler's noblest and most compelling Eroica". And with the consensus criteria for a reference recording in play, it is, indeed, even more a great comfort to know, that Jed Distler, mr. Hurwitz' eminent colleague at Classicstoday, shares my enthusiasm for this rendition, too!
I love your classics today review on the P.Jarvi/DKB recording and how you compared Szell's recording favourably. A review that I found really helpful. Thankyou Dave
I love Szell’s recording. I also really love the Erich Kleiber Decca recording.
Kleiber's Vienna recording you mean? Because he made a Concertgebouw recording a few years before, which is also fabulous.
Vienna recording
Dave, this is a great and insightful series for critical judgement, thank you! You reviewed 5th december 2022 the complete Sony recordings box of Frieder Bernius, and you mentioned the complete Schutz Carus recordings by Hans-Christoph Rademann and the Dresdener Kammerchor. Maybe you can review this project in your series " most important recording projects ever". Schutz is an important composer and he is not well known. So this an important project by an independent label to give Schutz the recognition he deserves and his spiritual music is wonderful.
My favorite piece of Beethoven music of all and now off to get a reference recording. I wonder what Beethoven would have thought about the recording, and of the conductor Szell and of the orchestra. Would he have torn the title page yet again?
I would like to think, in obviously a truly mystical and fanciful way, that Mr. Szell and deceased members of the CO perform the Beethoven Symphonies ad infinitum: they are in Heaven after all (we all wish). And sitting in the audience front row with hearing acuity completely restored is Lou. He is smiling!
Talking about mono recordings, probably Ancerl’s Shostakovich 10th will appear in this series
Wonderful series. I'like to ask if you could continue the one where you talk about the works x composer wrote in a specific narrow period of his life. I believe you only made a Schubert episode. Thanks
And we have "bingo!" I once heard Szell and the Cleveland doing the Eroica "live from Severance Hall" on the radio in the late sixties and was transfixed by the transparent inevitability of the entire thing. This recording captures Szell's mastery of this symphony. None better.
I think that this performance is on youtube. It is very exciting.
The "Eroica" is a glorious mess of a symphony. I wouldn't regard it as my favorite of Beethoven's symphonies, but it might well be the most interesting. I just checked my hard drive, and I see sixteen recordings of the Eroica, but surprisingly, this one isn't there. (Or it wasn't... I just bought and downloaded Szell's Beethoven symphony cycle, so Eroica No. 17 now resides on my hard drive. Since the set isn't expensive, I figure that it can't hurt to have Szell's other Beethoven recordings too.) For this popular but rather strange piece of music, I think it makes sense to have a recording that is considered by many to be a reference. Given the recent influence of the HIPsters on performances of Beethoven, whether you approve of their work or not, it is valuable to hear the old favorite recordings from before this movement really got going. My opinion on the HIPsters is mixed, so it is good for me to hear the best of their work alongside the best examples of the performance practices that preceded them. I have to give the HIPsters some credit, though. I used to have a bit of a hard time getting into Beethoven. The HIPsters somehow cracked the code for me, and after this, I went back to the older recordings and found that I liked them better than I did before.
May I suggest a review on the oratorio Paradise and the Peri by Schumann? a completely unknown masterpiece. Thank you.
Indisputably the right choice. As a native Cleveland and grandson of Szell enthusiasts, this recording will always be my yardstick for evaluating all other Eroicas. That applies to at least a few other of the Szell/Cleveland/Beethoven recordings I think, particularly if we cheat and count the even-numbered symphonies and No. 1. It is I suppose arguable whether all of those truly have reference recordings as you indicate, but I think the term can probably be slapped on all of LVB’s symphonies (and maybe overtures too).
Typical strategy for the end of the Eroica--conduct it as fast as you can and hope the musicians can play all the notes. Szell's strategy--conduct it as fast as you can and threaten anyone who misses a note with instant death. Everyone practiced a lot and it came out great!
You are right on this one. It's the one that was always recommended back in the day. And I just happen to agree.
Szell is always great!
No, but most of the time.
Are both available Sony Essential Classics releases the same as this "Stereo Rama" recording from 1957?
Yes.
@@DavesClassicalGuide thanks for your prompt reponse!
The CD you hold in your Hand I am guessing it is Deutche Gramaphone
Re Szell and Cleveland Symphony Orchestra.... where can you buy a copy from....cover looks a bit pop art ish...maybe......
Really really enjoyed this Erioica......!!!
Thank you......
No, it's Sony, from the big Szell box--original jacket art.
Dave, can you do an essential works for beginners on Joaquin Rodrigo?
Thanks Dave
Have I understood correctly that a 'reference recording' is defined as the one which a consensus of critical opinion has identified as the best? I can think of a few statistical queries, if that is the case. But I may have misunderstood. Anyway, very informative video, as always.
Would Günther Wand's recording of Beethoven 9 be a reference recording? It's certainly the best that I've heard.
It should be, but it isn't.
First time commenter. I only hope you haven't shot the Szell wad with this one performance Dave (deserving as it is).
When I saw you were doing this new series I thought of four reference recordings - all of them by Szell. Haydn 93 & 96, Hindemith Symphonic Metamorphosis, and above all- Mozart 39. Yes, they're my favorites. But, I think they are legitimate reference recordings as well. I sure hope you do something about Mozart 39 in some format. It doesn't get nearly enough attention IMHO.😊
My personal reference is still the Toscanini 1953 recording. Best balance of performance and sound. If his 1939 were in stereo or even excellent mono, it would be my choice. (His 1949 RCA can be set aside.) For all practical purposes, sure, Szell is the pick. However, for a genuinely cathartic, gut wrenching experience, Fricsay's 20 minute funeral march is unique. Probably not a "reference" but not to be missed.
Yesterday I was about to post a comment with my predictions for this series. Szell's Eroica was among them. I didn't expect that my prediction would be fulfilled so quickly, though :P
I also bet most of the following will make it your list:
Bernstein's first Mahler 7
Dutoit's The Planets
Karajan's first Strauss Metamorphosen + Tod un Verklärung on DG (the one from the 80s)
Dohnányi/Cleveland's Dvorak 9
There others which could qualify but I'm not so sure if you would agree: Jansons first Tchaikovsky 5th, Wand's Bruckner 4 with the BPO and his Bruckner 8 with the NDR at Lübeck, and Haitink's Bruckner 7 with the Concertgebouworkest (the '79 one).
It’s possible to cheat and look them up at classicstoday. Or if you’ve seen the survey videos for any of these works (off the top of my head I know that you’re right about Mahler 7).
Oh no, not trying to predict the master wizard yet again!
@@geertdecoster5301 lol
You've got all of these wrong (except maybe one of them).
@@DavesClassicalGuide oh well... 😅
Is this the same veion as in the Sony box set of complete symphonies by George Szell?.
There is only one version.
@@DavesClassicalGuide thanks Dave.
David, you know you say you have a problem with finale's coda. Far from telling what the master should have done to his composition, but I think Beethoven should have held that last note, alah his 5th symphony, which is very similar, albeit, in a different key. 🤔. What do you think.
Respectfully, it doesn't work. If you notice, most of Beethoven's orchestral works, including the concertos, end on short, definitive notes. This is contrary the brooding Brahms, who languished in prolonged ending notes. It seems Beethoven's compositions were of such high moving drama that the only way to end these pieces was with a quick definitive brush stroke.
This recording is not available anymore. Is it available under some other label? This information is important for collectors.
Yes, it is available pretty easily.
@@DavesClassicalGuide Well, a google search did not reveal any available source for the cd. Unless it's under some other label, not Stereorama.
Mr. Horowitz. Where do you get that CD you're holding in the video Beethoven's Eroica symphony? I don't see it at Amazon
It's in the Szell big box.
Thank you @@DavesClassicalGuide
Ludwig 55555, i also like hearing Dave Horowitz play the Piano or is it Vladimir Hurwitz????🤔
There are many Eroicas I enjoy, including (please forgive me) the period recording by Collegium Aureum....but yes, this Szell is darned near perfect.
I enjoy Collegium Aurem too. But as I keep saying, what we like isn't really the point here.
@@DavesClassicalGuide I understand that, which is why I agreed that Szell is a perfect reference recording for this work.
Can you have a reference recording with superb interpretation and mediocre Sonics/recording?
Of course.
How about a reference recording with a superb interpretation and dreadful sonics/recording?
Mindful of your definition of "reference recording" (as opposed to other criteria, like "my favourite," or "the best", or what not), although you've never wavered in identifying this as "the reference", it's notable how seldom (and sometimes not at all) the BRITISH musical press highlights this recording as THE reference Eroica. I think they're mental, frankly, but you can't deny that the seem to omit this one from the top (or even top 5) when discussing how to build a library and, yes, pick a "reference" recording, using that very term. Just look at the surveys in Gramophone, where it's mentioned (as marvelous, admittedly) but left out of the top 4 or 5. I remember being astounded when I listed to a "Building a Library" on BBC Radio 3 and Szell's Eroica WASN'T EVEN MENTIONED (not even in passing). They seem to think it's forgettable, and I say that for the obvious reason that they routinely, and literally, forget to mention it. I'm not disagreeing that it's a reference (obviously is), just noting that you can't point to the British press and say they acknowledge it, because that doesn't seem borne out by the evidence.
Fortunately we aren't limited to the British press.
Oh, come on...what do the Brits know about classical music and gourmet food! Even if they did commission B9.
Generally I agree with Mr. Horowitz, but I find Szell's recording a tad too clinical and dry. I've long preferred Hans Schmidt-Isserstedt and the Vienna Philharmonic on Decca. Indeed, not just the Eroica, but his whole cycle of the Nine, and in particular THE recording of the Ninth. I just wish these recordings were better known!
Watch the video at 6:17… this new video series is not about “favourites”, it’s about the reference recordings that are used for critical comparisons.
Too driven for my taste. Mrs Szell was dead on the money when she said of her husband, "George, gemutlich he ain't"...