Lots of great talking points here ,, The toe cap talk at 24:00 ish in.. My Drews are 'soft toe' .. it's technically not a toe cap.. but they double up the leather under the toe instead of above.. (instead of using celastic..) the whole toe has shifted over the welt.. flattening out (as much as it can that is).. And my cordovan toe cap boots.. it dawned on me after.. I'll never have those nice toe vamp shell rolls.. just that one flex point at the ball.. and so id never do a toe cap shell boot again,, feel cheater out of flattering vamp roll lol These are the fine details you don't really process until you go through with it,, it's great to hear them actually brought up
I learnt that the hard way about heel height. Raised the heel by about half a cm. Now there isnt enough toe spring and my foot slides forward, squishing my toes. Shouldve just left that shit alone🥲
Yeah I wish they would remove some of these options they try and treat it like it's flexible and it's really not. At certain weights you can make it work but no toe spring makes the ball of my feet hurt.
Heel height reminds me: I haven't researched it but people say White's and Nick's (and I'd imagine other PNW makers) use different heel heights on the ubiquitous 55 last. Or even in the same maker, making Packer heels taller despite the last being the same height.
When I was a kid, my father refused take me to the candy store because he "didn't have all damn day". I guess that's why it took me three months to pick out a pair of PNW boots: too many options.
@@gvaldezcurrie molds are only so helpful and are expensive to offer. It wouldn't tell you anything with regards to the top of your foot if you pulled your foot up to remove it. So it wouldn't tell insteep, low heel, high heel, or circumference of ball. Nor would it tell uppers as your foot going down into the mold kills that. So it really would provide any info beyond arch, length, and width. All of which you can get from present methods. Except arch, but so bmvery few builders even offer arch. If the mold pulled away left/right it would have its own issues. You wouldn't be able to "step into it and put weight on it" because your foot would destroy all ability to measure insteep and uppers as it went down. So you'd have to hold your foot above the ground while you sandwich led your foot. Hard to do, lots of potential error, and no ability to jusge arch as you can't stand on it without screwing up other measurements. So while it seems like a great idea, and easier for consumer, it really isn't. You'd need to use both of those methods, tall enough for boot height, which would mean expensive to offer expensive for shipping, hard to correlate, higher chance of error, and not as accurate. Only thing that might work better than present is a podiatrist taking the right x-rays, and that might be pretty expensive, and definitely harder than the present way.
@@cloveroak5492 And now I am informed...seriously thank you Now i love the way Kangaroo hughes my foot as close to a skin like feeling I've ever experienced in boots that is. .
younger people don't seem very interested in color-matching and that kind of thing at all. of course, there were sneakers that were wild combos already back in the 80s and 90s, too, but they cost only about 60 bucks or something.
So Cal actually has a lot more cliquish fashionistas than maybe anywhere else, though, too. You dress too Blue Collar or whatever with the wrong people at some trendy bar or club and they will mock you for being TOO conservative or whatever if you're in this Zip Code instead of That One or whatever. Hardly anybody still dresses very Country / Western here anymore, but they don't very much dress like classic Vintage Surfers anymore, either. Etc.
I usually think if the boot is wrinkling [buckling?] at that point of the vamp upper or whatever, that's pretty much about where it shows me that it fits about correctly, even if has NO toe cap.
But most of the MTO boots that aren't from fancier companies or whatever have fake toe caps now, anyway, so not sure how much more rigid they are overall and such. If I was getting caps on my toes, it's usually because I feel like I need that extra leather, not because I'm worried about whether it looks good or not. Of course, the store-bought steel-toed ones I got DON'T have toe caps, that probably would need them the most before the steel wears thru the thinner leather if working tough jobs, etc.
Well, work boots, motorcycle boots, cowboy boots are already all different for a reason, too, but then you get guys who are too lazy to buy a different pair of boots and WANT to wear cowboy boots to work in or go hiking or something? That's not necessarily an MTO decision issue problem, but ... I guess the two motivating factors would still be look and fit or fit and function? [but also each style still has parameters and characteristics that if you deviate TOO MUCH, then is not really THAT style anymore, either?]
Awesome points on laces! Can't believe what a boot nerd I am.
Lots of great talking points here ,,
The toe cap talk at 24:00 ish in..
My Drews are 'soft toe' .. it's technically not a toe cap.. but they double up the leather under the toe instead of above.. (instead of using celastic..) the whole toe has shifted over the welt.. flattening out (as much as it can that is)..
And my cordovan toe cap boots.. it dawned on me after.. I'll never have those nice toe vamp shell rolls.. just that one flex point at the ball.. and so id never do a toe cap shell boot again,, feel cheater out of flattering vamp roll lol
These are the fine details you don't really process until you go through with it,, it's great to hear them actually brought up
Really good discussion, guys. Thanks.
I really enjoy nerding out on these videos. Keep them coming please!
I learnt that the hard way about heel height.
Raised the heel by about half a cm. Now there isnt enough toe spring and my foot slides forward, squishing my toes. Shouldve just left that shit alone🥲
Yeah I wish they would remove some of these options they try and treat it like it's flexible and it's really not. At certain weights you can make it work but no toe spring makes the ball of my feet hurt.
Heel height reminds me: I haven't researched it but people say White's and Nick's (and I'd imagine other PNW makers) use different heel heights on the ubiquitous 55 last. Or even in the same maker, making Packer heels taller despite the last being the same height.
@@seedubhuntx yes, that is true. Different models and choices can exist even with the last staying the same.
When I was a kid, my father refused take me to the candy store because he "didn't have all damn day". I guess that's why it took me three months to pick out a pair of PNW boots: too many options.
@@michaelwhynot7215 ain't that the truth!
I'll do the every pannel and wear the darn heck out of them if they match and they are free
Kangaroo has fantastic elasticity for weight changes.What say you? AND Wouldn't a foot mold help for sizing?
@@gvaldezcurrie molds are only so helpful and are expensive to offer. It wouldn't tell you anything with regards to the top of your foot if you pulled your foot up to remove it. So it wouldn't tell insteep, low heel, high heel, or circumference of ball. Nor would it tell uppers as your foot going down into the mold kills that. So it really would provide any info beyond arch, length, and width. All of which you can get from present methods. Except arch, but so bmvery few builders even offer arch.
If the mold pulled away left/right it would have its own issues. You wouldn't be able to "step into it and put weight on it" because your foot would destroy all ability to measure insteep and uppers as it went down. So you'd have to hold your foot above the ground while you sandwich led your foot. Hard to do, lots of potential error, and no ability to jusge arch as you can't stand on it without screwing up other measurements.
So while it seems like a great idea, and easier for consumer, it really isn't. You'd need to use both of those methods, tall enough for boot height, which would mean expensive to offer expensive for shipping, hard to correlate, higher chance of error, and not as accurate.
Only thing that might work better than present is a podiatrist taking the right x-rays, and that might be pretty expensive, and definitely harder than the present way.
@@cloveroak5492 And now I am informed...seriously thank you Now i love the way Kangaroo hughes my foot as close to a skin like feeling I've ever experienced in boots that is. .
younger people don't seem very interested in color-matching and that kind of thing at all. of course, there were sneakers that were wild combos already back in the 80s and 90s, too, but they cost only about 60 bucks or something.
So Cal actually has a lot more cliquish fashionistas than maybe anywhere else, though, too. You dress too Blue Collar or whatever with the wrong people at some trendy bar or club and they will mock you for being TOO conservative or whatever if you're in this Zip Code instead of That One or whatever. Hardly anybody still dresses very Country / Western here anymore, but they don't very much dress like classic Vintage Surfers anymore, either. Etc.
I usually think if the boot is wrinkling [buckling?] at that point of the vamp upper or whatever, that's pretty much about where it shows me that it fits about correctly, even if has NO toe cap.
I don't have monkey boots.
But most of the MTO boots that aren't from fancier companies or whatever have fake toe caps now, anyway, so not sure how much more rigid they are overall and such. If I was getting caps on my toes, it's usually because I feel like I need that extra leather, not because I'm worried about whether it looks good or not. Of course, the store-bought steel-toed ones I got DON'T have toe caps, that probably would need them the most before the steel wears thru the thinner leather if working tough jobs, etc.
Well, work boots, motorcycle boots, cowboy boots are already all different for a reason, too, but then you get guys who are too lazy to buy a different pair of boots and WANT to wear cowboy boots to work in or go hiking or something? That's not necessarily an MTO decision issue problem, but ... I guess the two motivating factors would still be look and fit or fit and function? [but also each style still has parameters and characteristics that if you deviate TOO MUCH, then is not really THAT style anymore, either?]