It also gives people a sense of righteousness so they can judge others, often the childfree, from some higher moral plain. This is the "people who don't have kids are selfish" crowd
That is so bizarre and I never understood that. My mother would judge my aunt and say “she is so selfish and weird” for not having a child. My spirit knew this was bizarre and j argued with her at 13 years old. I said that it is her choice. My motto is live and let live. It showed me that there is something wrong with my mom.
I also feel like a lot of women (I'm a female so I am analyzing my experiences with women) want constant attention and having a kid not only adds to "the Susie show" but you are also bringing a human into the world that is inevitably going to give you a ton of attention. It's crazy being a female and socializing because I feel like most females I meet want audience members to their lives and they call it a friendship. There isn't any genuine connection, fun, or belly laughs. There's a lot of "listen to my drama and get invested in it w me" no matter how silly or insignificant. No thank you! :)
Yes! Those! Though I think your 2 middle points are facets of what Daniel was talking about with status and purpose. 13. That’s just what happens next. (Unquestioned adherence to the relationship escalator)
You havent stated that many woman dont feel real woman unless they are mother.. thats a very very common intergenerational injuries passed through mother to daughter.. Also society and woman would judge a woman with no children..
Very good point. In some/many countrys in Africa that ist the main reason for overpopulation. Women are getting so many children not because of religious reasons, not because of poverty or because they are not allowed to use contraception. They want many children because otherwise they're considered to be a fail. Which of course has something to do with the status argument, that was mentioned before...
Honestly the number one reason people I've known have had kids is because they were simply doing what everybody else seems to do, almost an unthinking fulfilment of what's expected of them
1. Like unprotected sex, and oops, got pregnant! 2. Lack of purpose or motivation. 3. Want someone to control. 4. Have personal on whom they can act out their unconscious. 5. Get money from government, parents, or partner. 6. Save a dying or unhealthy marriage. 7. Status. 8. Distraction from problems, pain, growth or emptiness. 9. Give first child a sibling (pet).
Mine had me for 7 but more specifically for 9, to offer a victim to my vicious, narcissistic borderline, abusive, sick sister whom they couldn't handle so the left me in her hands to abuse me (8 years older than me).... Ofc taking her to a psychiatrist was out of the question, bc "people would talk"...
@@7TheMrSeven7 If you are watching the video from your computer, then you can click on the three dots that are to the right under the video and open up the transcript.
Well, you would be very lucky if you have children who take care of you. On the other side, having children so they'll take care of you is often a far cry from reality. Also I think it's selfish to have children as an investment for your own future. If they want take care of you, great. But don't expect it. I like to help my parents, but that's because I had very loving and supportive parents (they are my adoptive parents, never knew my real parents). It's because I really WANT to take care.... but not because they are my parents.
For a parent, who in their childhood received conditional love based on their performance, having a child becomes a sort of a project through which they want to keep receiving their parents' approval. "Mom, Dad! Look at me! I'm doing the right thing. My family, my children are the way they're supposed to be." It's difficult for the parent to see their child's true emotional needs if the main purpose of having it (the child) is not to address them (the child's emotional needs) but to model the child so that it brings emotional gratification to the parent through receiving approval from his/her (the parent's) parents.
The main unhealthy reason I see people have kids is to fill their empty spaces and give them the love they never got in their own childhood. It makes the perfect little love object...they HAVE to love you, they have total control over the child, and they can force the child to give them the respect and love they never got. And it destroys the child completely. Alice Miller also says when people hit their children they are doing what they wish they could have done to their own parents.
As a mother who had children for the wrong reasons, I wish I wouldn't have. Bringing innocent children into my pile of shite is my biggest regret. They deserve so much better. I wish I would have known what I know now.
The fact you even acknowledge your own failings is a massive leap that most people are far too afraid to do. My guess is that your kids will be just fine.
There is not perfect way to do things for a human. If you recognize your problems you can make a huge difference my friend. And by working on it the curse can be stopped. Wish you all the best, honest human been!
I agree with Gerhard. My parents could never even understand. They had me (the oldest one) mostly because of number 7 and my sisters for other wrong reasons Daniel points out so well. Now when there are no grandchildren from any of us they put us down all the time for not having the children. Such a great parents.
I think it's revealing that we have different ways to describe procreation. "Having a child" vs "becoming a parent" as if it's an acquisition rather than an avocation. In my experience the first clue someone is having children for unhealthy reasons is when people say it has to be their genetic offspring, that they couldn't love someone else's child. When i hear that i hear "i could never love anyone and i'm miserable."
If you really think that you're a fool. Raising someone else's child is not the same thing as having one, period. No matter what you do, that person will never be your son, they will never be your daughter. You can call them that, but I can call the sky red.
Yeah that's a tough talking point. From my perspective, I've come to realise I love some people's children more than they do. But I would never take someone else's child into my custody for the same reasons I would not make a child myself. It's really painful to take everything into account, and it's all very hypothetical
There's this 20 year old dishwasher at my job. He has already fathered four children. He talks to me about his children and his baby mothers and I'm dying inside cause I literally can't say anything unsupportive of his life choices without becoming an asshole. "You know I'm glad I had my children Young..." Sure man, that was a great idea wasn't it.
Healing C-PTSD here. When I think about why I had so many kids (8) these are my reasons: 1. I was allowing god control over my womb (in a Christian cult since age 9), and I was obeying the fruitful command. My exhusband had no issues w/that. 2. Because I wanted a tiny, cuddly ball of responsibility that would be adored and be adorable. Yes, even through "terrible twos," 'tweens,' and twenties so far. 3. To prove my mother I am capable of being a mother much better than she was to me. 4. For my own people, my clan, to be accepted (finally) and practice inclusion, the opposite of what I've experienced. 5. To offer the world wonderful, loving, patient adult humans to make earth a better planet (and thus, fill heaven, because I was brainwashed by that aforementioned cult). I don't believe I had cruel intentions. Selfish, yeah, but not intrinsically. Jesus had instructions for their care, specifically, and if he loved them, I loved them. I'm a little too empathic towards others. When I received assistance from the government, I have been so grateful. Its been a challenge supplying all their needs. It breaks my heart they'll have voids because of my dreadful foresight & lack of money in a capitalist world. The kids and I are all learning to feel through our feelings and resolve traumas, now. We are cult-free and I cut ties w/my toxic mother & stepdad & friends & I divorced our abuser (their dad). Supplying all their needs is impossible alone; I'm learning to reach out & ask for help.
Another big one is that they get validation for their own life choices by their children choosing the same path (even manipulating or coercing the children through guilt).
Thank you Daniel🙏🏾❤️. Long time sub. I especially replay your videos about this subject because as a childless woman by choice, I get a lot of real and perceived pressure to have children or feel a certain way because I don't. Listening over and over again to your videos keeps reminding me that I am a sane, rational thinking adult! Grateful for you and your content.
I am 36 and consciously child-free (never had a desire or an itch to be pregnant/give birth/raise a child). Sending supportive, loving intentions your way🖤
You've hit the nail on the head again Daniel. It's so important to reflect deeply and honestly about these issues. They are central to all of our lives and are of great importance to us all. The problem is that many people live unconsciously, they repeat patterns from their parents and ancestors. In the Baha'i Faith (I'm a Baha'i) we call this "blind imitation of ancestors". My faith instructs me to engage in independent investigation of the truth and to look into all things with a searching eye. I value your videos because they encourage us all to be critically minded, to reflect deeply, and to do these things. You are offering a great service to the community. Please keep up the good work!!!
From my experience the people who are frantic about having children are all sociopaths.! It's come down to 1 of the biggest red flags for me... My heart breaks when I see what they do to their children after they have them.. and to the world.
The RUclips psychotherapist says that narcissistic parents do "pathological projective identification" to locate their sense of worthlessness in the child because invoking those feelings in others bring relief to them.
@Jane , Yes that’s exactly right. The child of these parents becomes an emotional tampon for the parent with NPD to project onto. Thank God those children are starting to wake up now and find there true identity’s.
@@gauloise6442 This happened to me when my grandmother died in 2003. I was raised by her and my step grandfather for 17 years. At the age of 56, she was diagnosed with lung cancer. She passed away in May of 2003. I was a skinny, sheltered 17 year old kid that really knew nothing of the real world. A few days after the funeral, my step grandfather, my uncle and his then-girlfriend all got blackout drunk one night. They woke me up and hauled me downstairs to the kitchen table to tear me apart. Keep in mind that I had not had one drop of alcohol in my system at this time. I was roused out of my sleep and immediately ambushed by these people. They proceeded to tell me that I killed her. Not directly of course, but that I made her die quicker because I wasn't affectionate towards her. When I wasn't at school, I was spending all my time with my then-girlfriend Caitlin. I didn't think there was much I could for my grandmother. She was undergoing chemotherapy and my step grandfather mostly looked after her. At the kitchen table, these drunks were practically foaming at the mouth yelling at me. But it didn't stop there. My step grandfather looked at me and said something I will never forget. He said "You don't have to worry about anyone else trying to hurt you, because I'm going to kill you. You killed my wife!" And, with that, I went into survival mode and made a beeline for the patio door behind me. As I ran outside as fast as I could, I could feel someone grabbing onto my shoulder trying to pull me back inside. I flung my arm back and felt my elbow connect with something. It turns out it was my step grandfather's nose. I didn't mean to hurt anyone. I just wanted to evade the dangerous situation. It's clear to me now that I was the scapegoat during this time because I was the weakest one. I was the youngest, the poorest, the most inexperienced, and, last but not least, I was completely sober. In my experience, drunks don't act too kindly to those around them that aren't drinking. To this day I have a very difficult time trusting people. I feel like my parents are supposed to be the ones I can trust the most. After my step grandfather, who was my father for all intents and purposes threatened to kill me, I lost all trust I had for him. He's dead now also. He passed away in 2012 from stomach cancer. After I ran away from home that night, he lived it up. He sold the house, bought a brand new Honda Pilot, bought himself a boat. The best part is yet to come: he went to go live in England, married his ex-daughter-in-law, raised her daughter for the next six years until his death. In his obituary, I was not mentioned once. He raised me for 17 years, and I didn't even get mentioned. He was only in his wife's daughter's life for 5 years before he passed. She was mentioned in the obituary as his "daughter." It made me feel sick.
As a woman, other women say I should have a baby. First, why do they care? I feel like they want others to suffer as they do. Child rearing is difficult. It is unfortunate that relationships and having babies is so romanticized. Why does no one tell the truth? I think the decision to have a child should entail the sacrifices one has to make. Also people have, "FOMO" fear of missing out.
Excellent Content! I have a very good friend who wanted me to "get pregnant" with her, since she had just gotten pregnant! In the moment, I was appalled. I felt bad when I said no as a knee jerk reaction. I just could not fathom having another child with my husband since our marriage was on the rocks and I absolutely HATED being pregnant and then not having any help from my husband when our son was born. She said...well, the older ones can "help you" take care of the younger ones! Yikes again! She now has four kids, and I've got my one Wonderful Fantastic Young Man/Son, who will be 21 in a few days. When I was 40, I was a bit regretting "only" having one child, but I'm over it, and Very Grateful for the one I have. He was Very Planned, and I am so glad that I did not give in to impulse or whim. By the way, I am an "only" as well, which may have something to do with why I was more "okay" with my decision.
@@NightinGal89 i think its when people want kids as a solution for Exhistantial dredd When Someone think "ooh , Im gett'n old , but I haven't done anything in life " or "who will take care of me when Im old " or " Im bored , I wanna test something new "
That’s so sad. I’m 26 and I did see myself as someone who was trying to escape the workforce by getting married and becoming a stay at home mom. Basically, repeating what my other did. She was deeply insecure and I could feel it to my core. I have done a lot of work on myself and I want to be happy and then have a child. Children can feel if you are happy or not; they are highly intuitive because they have to be to survive. My goal is to be happy and full of purpose and then have a child.!
Thank you for still making videos! I'm watching all of your content in tandem with the book "Healing developmental Trauma" by Laurence Heller and Aline LaPierre and it really helps.
I was born from fear not from love. My mom told me she panicked when she was close to 30 decided to settle with my dad.. because it was "convenient" and they were at the "right circumstances". But truth is i think she was just desperately trying to find love because shes afraid of being alone. Fast forward to now, they are divorced and turns out my dad is a habitual liar and might be part of histrionic disorders. Mom said her life was "a lie" and I'm here despising my existence because i only feel like i was born to fill a hole.
It’s hard getting through these videos because they seem to scare me. You’re a soft spoken man with such an open mind without a rough masculine echo that doesn’t push too hard. It’s what these young men like me starve for as we literally all have parents who had us for unhealthy reasons. Propaganda has corrupted us into thinking things like this isn’t an issue. The closest we get is mental health, but that’s only referencing suicide rates. My point is just thank you for telling your truth. 🥲
@@bored_and_has_no_clueLife will continue no matter, but individually we can be more aware of our traumas and lessen the cause by not just ignoring red flags or bad habits of those around us. 🐝
@@bored_and_has_no_clue hmm, My only problem with that is the question of who does the regulating, and if it ends up being a government then generally they screw it all up and end up repressing people in some horrible way. I made about a video about this at some point recently, though I can’t exactly remember the title!
I direct a competitive dance program. I could not even work today because of the anxiety and pressure from the moms guilting me into spending every waking hour trying to make their daughters stars. They couldn’t care less if I need a holiday or time to heal from a loss. Basically they think it’s their job to fight for rehearsal time with the teacher for as many hours as they can get before those competitions. No matter how tired or sick the kid is, and no matter who loses out. So I think you left out living out dreams through their child. It’s more abusive than you would think.
I had 2 children when in my teens I was 17 with my husband . Later in life my husband had a vasectomy we both agreed on it. Our children were grown with their own children. I didn’t want anymore . I didn’t want to bring another child into this world the way it is going . So anyway guess what ? I became pregnant again .My husbands vasectomy didn’t work . I heard on the radio after that a lot of doctors were performing this operation and they were not even qualified to do it ! My husband and I were happy .We agreed that God intended for us to have another child . We did not know at the time of the vasectomy what we wanted but God did ! 😊
There are also a few unhealthy reasons NOT to have kids. According to Robert Firestone, by having kids we in a sense have to leave our own childhood behind, which causes grief to come up. So we defend against that grief by not taking this step. It is a form of never having to grow up and stay a child because we are still holding onto our lost, painful childhood instead of grieving it and letting it go forever. Another reason is that by having kids we are reminded that we are one step closer to are own death, which causes of course deep death anxiety.
1.) Animals (pets) are individual beings too and all of these apply to them as well. People should only adopt another being or bring another being into the world to love and care for them them and share the world with them the best they can. 2.) A lot of people have kids so that they can do all of the obnoxious anti-social things THEY'D like to do to others - through their kids. These are the parents who never tell their child "no", etc. They smirk beautifically as the brat crosses others' boundaries.
I agree totally! I saw several of my same age friends have a "surprise" in their 40s, which was more like a horrible shock to their long suffering husbands. So another twenty years of parenting, the older child suggesting termination. Then by the time they had any freedom back as such, all plans and dreams ruined....never the child's fault of course, but I had thought it was some form of sabotage. I can also say that my eldest daughter was fuming, quite rightly, when I had a "second family" when she was twelve....at a time when she did get pushed over whilst I was playing Mother Earth again. Daniel, you are so right with this.
Thats so difficult subject to raise as parents put their worth into their "role".. if you deconstruct this "role" and confront their emotional addictions MAN thats terrible for them.. they want to believe they are good parent and parent for the good reason... Thats a very difficult subject yet the central subject of psychological disorder of any being because 85% of our pain comes from this "education"..
I remember when I was going through a really dark moment in my life my mother told me I should have a child. Needless to say I wasn't even dating anyone (which makes the suggestion even worse) but I was absolutely dumbfounded. And I was supposed to be the mentally ill one.
I wonder, what are your thoughts on antinatalism, Daniel? It says that it is unethical to bring conscious beings into existence because there is a fundamental asymmetry between suffering and being happy.
() the presence of pain is bad, and that () the presence of pleasure is good. However, such a symmetrical evaluation does not seem to apply to the absence of pain and pleasure, for it strikes me as true that () the absence of pain is good,even if that good is not enjoyed by anyone, whereas () the absence of pleasure is not bad unless there is somebody for whom this absence is a deprivation.
@@siryoucantdothat9743 I was thinking about this assymetry of pain and plessure and I relaized this Would you rather have a life with pain and plessure in a random ratio or a meh life with no pain or plessure you chose 1st one right bcz the 2nd one is Boring but what is Boredom if not a form of PAIN This and the argument prooves Pain is intertwined with life , but Plessure is a superficial thing
radical acceptance/unconditional love , with healthy boundaries no enmeshment , you use guilt not shame as a method of upbringing, you make the dynamic as a friendship instead of “ father “ “ children “ dynamic… you speak to your child as if he / she is an adult who can carry responsibilities you don’t withdraw the responsibility when a fault is made you let them reap the fruit and the thorns so they feel internal locus of control over their life and a sense of accomplishment and fulfillment you simply guide not command , you teach them about spirituality not religion but if they associated with religion you let them be whatever they want , you dont let them abuse your love by keeping boundaries from their problems they might bring from this kind of upbringing its total freedom anything can happen but they learned to reap the thorns early in their childhood so they wont feel abandoned example ( you teach the child its important to sleep early so they go to school , you dont yell or use bad language you simply let them misbehave , they go to school drowsy and tired , you tell them that what will happen everyday if they dont sleep , they misbehave again you simply take something they want like an ipad as a punishment because they did something wrong not because they are bad , you let them experience this cycle for a while these children eventually will be responsible ) you use the method for everything else until a certain age then its up to them how they dictate their lives i would say 12- 14 is the right age where kids are on puberty as a Rite of passage they could feel the change physical so you enhance the experience spiritually and emotionally “ you are an adult “ now they would feel thrilled for sure , you teach them to love each other just how you love them and they will view each other by your eyes because the way we love ourselves is the way our parents loved us , you be there for them in hard and joyful times they fuse you into their lives because you are them and them are you because you didnt taint the relationship with shame so they accept you fully it creates a beautiful bond where even a parent can share their darkest secrets , fears and desires when the children are adult now so the timing is important because you want to teach them that authenticity is the way to live with the right people not with everyone, you pass out your ideas and teachings to them so they could live a healthy lives as well , you learn from them next because its their time and age now and many more i could think of its just one thing that bathers me … what if you get a psychopathic child or an evil that is inherent here where things get dicy or child with disabilities that it would break your heart to see them suffer in life with their needs and desires never truly be met is that a life worth living … because think of this. () the presence of pain is bad, and that () the presence of pleasure is good. However, such a symmetrical evaluation does not seem to apply to the absence of pain and pleasure, for it strikes me as true that () the absence of pain is good ,even if that good is not enjoyed by anyone, whereas () the absence of pleasure is not bad unless there is somebody for whom this absence is a deprivation. You have created this scenario of the absence of most good and the presence of most bad you have committed a moral abomination in the right of your child now hes in great pain and a life not worth living which is what most lives are full of painful memories , even if there is a curtain amount of good there is a threshold of badness that would make any life not worth living like someone has 10 bad and 20 good is better than someone having 50 bad and 70 because there is so much suffering so the absence of suffering is >>>>> the presence of good thus non existent have an advantage of existence
I recently went to the hospital and I have no family. I wish I would have had a child because I would have someone who would advocate on my behalf. I know kids aren't guaranteed to help their parent, but it would have been nice possibility to have a 30-something year old to talk to when I'm alone in the world. I am a woman and regret not having children.
Number 9 is so socially acceptable. I always thought it was weird to have another child to keep the first child company. Most people I know don't have great relationships with their adult siblings -probably because they were expected to be each other's keeper.
I don't think I've ever known a parent to have a reason to have children that wasn't selfish. Parents don't have children for the children's sake. Childless people do not have children for the children's sake.
I currently work at a daycare and I see this exact thing., some women have 3 kids from their first marriage, they gotten a divorce, then they met someone new who also has one or two kids from their previous marriage & they decide to get married, then they get pregnant with yet another child when they have teenagers at home. And the justifications as to why they wanted yet another child are absolutely ridiculous from we love each other so much so we want to have our own child, like collecting souvenirs from every men they slept with , to we need a sibling for our first one, to God made us so we can procreate, to ooh if you don’t have children you shorten your life because you live through your kids and the future generations.
So powerful video. I think its the top of the videos to put out there, becouse is so important - and alot of people would feel uncomfortable with themselfes bringing out children. But maybe some future parents would think twice before having one. It also rings many bells for me when it comes to my childhood.
Someone mentioned positive reasons for having children...I would say having an abundance of love,care and energy to give to a child because by their very nature children have great needs and to be healthy and happy have to have those needs met. Having said this I think society is set up in such a way that it makes it very difficult even for those who may be the best suited to being parents but who may struggle due to the dog eat dog nature of our society and with little community support available so those nuclear families who are more self absorbed and self centred do very well even though they have no concern very often for the wider community but merely their own "progeny" or lineage...abit like the mafia.Their children to them are very much about immortalising their own memory or DNA rather than thinking of wider community concerns. I think in the times we are living in now with the climate crisis so obviously a factor then anyone who brings children into the world and is not thinking about resources and how they might be bringing up a child to be a responsibly aware human being concerned about what they might be giving and taking and playing a responsible role in their community just seems to be the most selfish self serving thing a person can do.
Even if you are a psychologically healthy person, finding another responsible, psychologically healthy person who will co-parent well is so incredibly, incredibly difficult. A lot of child-free people are that way, simply because they never met someone who had the emotional maturity to be a parent.
9. Is so very true. My mother has one child and that is me and, someone said she should give me a sibling and she said no. The pets issue I agree with Daniel because it’s like a child. You bring a sibling into the world and neglect the first born, it will cause havoc and that’s the same with pets. You have one pet and you end up bring another pet into your home, some people will favor the new pet and ignore the previous one.
10. "Prove" to yourself than you're better than other family membera who remained unmarried. My narc sister had a family only to beat me and our other sisters in the popularity competition that exists only in her mind. I also suspect my mom had 4 kids only to beat her sister by having 1 more child than her.
To me, the main (and unhealthy) reason that people have children is because they want someone to love them. Young children unconditionally love their parents and hate to see them upset. If the parent is upset, the child gets upset, and can even blame themselves for somehow causing the parent's upsetness. Adults who are desperate for love and attention - but aren't getting it in their life - often want to have children because children watch every single move that the parent makes. A similar, but slightly different, reason is that the parent feels lonely and wants a friend. They expect their child to be their friend and have similar tastes or hobbies or a similar personality. If the child is different and wants to go off on a different tangent, the parent gets angry. The parent feels abandoned by their child. In relationships where the adults are in conflict with one another, one of them may want to have a child who they can manipulate to be on "their side" and help them to fight against the other adult.
I've been watching most of his videos and I've read his book, Toward Truth; and he has optimism that humanity will, eventually, give children human rights and also, grown-ass-adults will figure out how to be Parent's with a capital P. And while I started out with, what I refer to now, as naive-optimism; last year when I'd first been introduced to his work... I'm not anymore as I can't have faith in our over-evolved-ape, species; so no, he's not antinatalist (yet/anymore?). Miserable breeders, breed Miserable breeders; humanity isn't above the nature we're so blessed/cursed with.
@@sojournerkarunatruth4406 So much truth, I feel the same way about people who choose to have kids. I don't see us breaking away from this miserable cycle. Thanks for the insight, I have watched a lot of his videos (never read his books) and I couldn't tell whether he still held on to that optimism you describe. Thanks for your response!
1/3/4 are my parents. Your explanation of no. 4 is as if you knew my father personally, lol. Most folks I know have parents who have created so much trauma in their lives...it's horrible. I 100% never want to have children...I just don't have any interest in doing so but also don't want to cause them any pain/trauma.
I think there are tons of people who have children because as parents they want to feel loved, important and taken care of by their children. I could have been this type of parent... But fortunately I've done psychotherapy ;) .
8:08 How to explain that the first kids more often that rare are the ones asking for a little sister/brother? Perhaps first kids asking for a sibling is a sign of loneliness and lack of company from their parents?
Daniel, Daniel, I have a strong feeling you’ve been snooping around my huge extended and immediate family, lol! JK, nevertheless, you’re so right, I wish I had a rewind and a delete button, which I would probably use a lot since listening to your videos. 😱😭😂
@@ginagg200 yeh i agree it doesnt make sense at all... i mean does anyone really know who their great great grandparents are? After a certain amount of years being dead no one really cares about the life you had... unless you left something like art, music, science, literature that cultures stil absorb then I really dont know what the average person leaves behind at all that makes a difference...
@@ginagg200 yes i believe in God, but my mother is an atheist... she always tells me “I gave you life” and i always tell her “if you gave me life, then you also gave me death” .... its interesting how the narcissists ultimate goal, is actually to gain meaning in their own life by essentially becoming your god.
What really makes me upset is when people have children for rather selfish reasons. For instance, people have children so that they'll have caregivers when up in their old age years. I have yet to hear a great and wonderful legit reason as to why a person decided to have children.
@@Archonbuster Sorry for your experience. Mine is different...people without children are more open minded and less judgmental of other ways of living.
1 reason I've heard that might be subsumed in the other's for having shoulder and he's not to be alone anymore I've heard women state that they were lonely and it having a child with cure the loneliness this doesn't seem to me to be a good reason to have a child either
Methinks, thou dost protest too much. Why would people who don't believe in a God want to have children? They struggle and they suffer, and to what end? Only to die forever, in their minds. To that mind - yours, I believe - having a child could be little more than disguised selfishness.
If only people who are healed enough would be allowed to have children, you wouldn't fly in a plane, live anywhere, or have anything, in one generation, because no one on this planet even comes close....and then what?
Very true. The fact is, yes people have children for selfish and/or poorly thought-out reasons. But that is the human condition. We are all selfish and screwed up to one degree or another, which brings about a "he who has not sinned cast the first stone" scenario. Any time people start playing with the idea of population control, or "who can and cannot qualify for procreation" things get fascist really quick. To have offspring is a human right. Whether or not one exercises that is entirely their business. Unfortunately, this often results in people having children for foolish reasons. Fortunately, these foolish motives don't necessarily guarantee that child's fate. The child will grow up in this wretched world with imperfect parents like the rest of us, but that doesn't mean he is unable to grow up to be a model member of the human race. Good men are often born in hard circumstances.
@@bcj842 Wauw! What an amazing reply, couldn't have said it better!! I love Daniel and his vids, but if he wants to keep traveling and walk down the road or get money from his bank or go to a hospital if needed or go to a supermarket to buy foods and stuffs, live in a house or apartment someone built, he must be happy that he is able to do all of that, for if there would not be screwed up people in a multitude on this planet, and people would have to qualify for procreation (which most would fail) the world would be empty pretty soon forever! Thats for sure! his insights are very useful I really enjoy Daniel, but on this subject, he is totally short-sighted. Healing from the human condition and becoming a better person (like he himself did) is possible and a great Blessing to us all, though it is rare, as Daniel also says and that is the TRUTH.
I think, for example, because through this control they receive a false sense of self-value, a sense of self-importance, coming from the fact that the other person is dependent on them. Also, possibly, out of fear of being lonely, feeling unneeded, out of fear of lack of control in their own life (if we're talking about relationships). In a word, to act out various traumas on the controlled person.
@@jane9469 To love the child is hardly a healthy reason. It's the same reason why we have an industry of forced parental separation around pets so we can play the saviour and "love them". And you can also adopt children and love them and raise them to be healthy people, which means that that isn't even a reason necessarily to have your own child.
@@merry6671 you make good points. I think a parents job should be to do everything they can for their child and accept them. That means they also have an obligation to be as healthy as possible befote they even conceive them. For some people, like myself (due to the direction this world is headed) having children isnt in our plans. If i were to have a child it would be an adoption, and only once i was perfectly secure and was able to help that child in every way possible. In a way "be there" for a child in a way in which that child needs you.
do you think there are healthy reasons to have children? what could they be? or do you think our species should die? I think more and more people become antinatalists, we will for sure have demographic decline. and this shows in high to mid income/education range the most. I wonder what future looks like
I think it's bleak. There's really no reason why our species needs to go on when you think about it. Do you know how many species have been destroyed by humans? All in the name of profit, I might add. Guys killing tigers for their pelts that can be sold for big money. Makes me sick. You may ask why should the human race cease to exist. You can also ask why it should continue to exist. I think there's more evidence pointing to the extinction of the human race being beneficial for the universe than detrimental to it.
@@revokdaryl1 isnt that the small portion of humanity that does that though? is there a reason for lions existance with the same logic? probably the answer is that they are not that destructive, and I understand that point of view as well. I just have faith in humanity left, although Ive seen the worst in my life as well, I dont think we should be eradicated as such, but hopefully evolution or nature does its job as it always does to bring it to balance. also depends on where are you coming from. I appreciate the creativity of humankind immensely, the art and music we create, the eay we study and appreciate our existance, more phiosophical types I mean. I dont know, thats me
@@violetmushroom6 Thanks for replying. I'm a big music fan myself. I'm currently trying to learn piano. It's definitely not easy for me to pick it up. You make a good point in that the majority of people don't agree with killing tigers and lions for profit. I'm just using them as an example because I always loved cats, big and small. Lol. Now that you mention it, my favourite composer is Vangelis. He made a song in 1983 with Jon Anderson from the band Yes called "Horizon". It's here on RUclips if you want to check it out. The lyrics actually talk about how the human race is going to persevere and overcome evil and other hurdles. It's a tad on the religious side, but don't let that sway you. It's probably one of the best songs ever made. I can honestly say that Vangelis' music has brought me back from the edge more than once.
Mine, too. And I'm the third one - as they were going bankrupt. Like wtf were you thinking? But of course, society is offended that I would ask such a question. Especially since the answer is, "we weren't."
There is never a good "reason" to have kids. It's a biological impulse. It's not rooted in reasons. But because we have large brains, we have the ability to rationalize "reasons" to do it. If we were animals, like deer and panthers, we wouldn't have to go thru that extrat step to rationalize what is otherwise an indivdually self destructive act.
Right, No one is asking to come here to this Cesspit Hellish Zoo...The Ultimate form of Love and Compassion is sparing the unborn this Horrible Existence.
@Tracy I used to watch his videos on the regular now I’m pretty sure that he’s an overgrown child who has not fully dealt with his own issues and is content to pathologise them onto others via his platform. Children happen naturally when men and women “know” each other, the idea that there are “bad” reasons to have children frames having children as a choice and not the byproduct of natural human relationships. And I just don’t accept that.
@Tracy All I see is a middle aged man with no wife and kids trying to lecture people on children, I think it’s dumb. Why do you care so much about defending him, do you wanna have his babies for his approved reasons? LOL.
It also gives people a sense of righteousness so they can judge others, often the childfree, from some higher moral plain. This is the "people who don't have kids are selfish" crowd
That is so bizarre and I never understood that. My mother would judge my aunt and say “she is so selfish and weird” for not having a child. My spirit knew this was bizarre and j argued with her at 13 years old. I said that it is her choice. My motto is live and let live. It showed me that there is something wrong with my mom.
@Victoria Bergman Thank you for proving my point.
@Victoria Bergman this is the most non-based thing I've ever heard. Read a book that isn't fiction
People who don't have children are NOT selfish. Some people (not everyone) have children for rather selfish reasons than selfless reasons.
Deciding to not have children is selfless. 1 less human to contribute to polluting the earth and robbing it of it's resources.
The healthier you are the less likely you will have children.
The healthier you are the more you will struggle to set a better stage.
I also feel like a lot of women (I'm a female so I am analyzing my experiences with women) want constant attention and having a kid not only adds to "the Susie show" but you are also bringing a human into the world that is inevitably going to give you a ton of attention. It's crazy being a female and socializing because I feel like most females I meet want audience members to their lives and they call it a friendship. There isn't any genuine connection, fun, or belly laughs. There's a lot of "listen to my drama and get invested in it w me" no matter how silly or insignificant. No thank you! :)
this is me. sadly. thank you for your insight.
I agree. Is love to be friends with you!
10. Religious reasons.
11. To show the world how 'mature' and grown up they are.
11. Boredom.
12. As an insurance policy against old age.
Yes! Those! Though I think your 2 middle points are facets of what Daniel was talking about with status and purpose.
13. That’s just what happens next. (Unquestioned adherence to the relationship escalator)
12. You bet! And they even say it as it is!
Agreed!
13. Ignorance :)
I think the first “11” is very true. At least in Japan.
You havent stated that many woman dont feel real woman unless they are mother.. thats a very very common intergenerational injuries passed through mother to daughter..
Also society and woman would judge a woman with no children..
Yes, true.
I agree. If you are a childless woman society and women consider you as worthless.
Very good point. In some/many countrys in Africa that ist the main reason for overpopulation. Women are getting so many children not because of religious reasons, not because of poverty or because they are not allowed to use contraception. They want many children because otherwise they're considered to be a fail. Which of course has something to do with the status argument, that was mentioned before...
Honestly the number one reason people I've known have had kids is because they were simply doing what everybody else seems to do, almost an unthinking fulfilment of what's expected of them
1. Like unprotected sex, and oops, got pregnant!
2. Lack of purpose or motivation.
3. Want someone to control.
4. Have personal on whom they can act out their unconscious.
5. Get money from government, parents, or partner.
6. Save a dying or unhealthy marriage.
7. Status.
8. Distraction from problems, pain, growth or emptiness.
9. Give first child a sibling (pet).
If you had the minutes it would become perfect, but thank you nonetheless!
Thanks
Mine had me for 7 but more specifically for 9, to offer a victim to my vicious, narcissistic borderline, abusive, sick sister whom they couldn't handle so the left me in her hands to abuse me (8 years older than me).... Ofc taking her to a psychiatrist was out of the question, bc "people would talk"...
@@7TheMrSeven7 If you are watching the video from your computer, then you can click on the three dots that are to the right under the video and open up the transcript.
Both my parents in a nutshell. My father molested me, my trauma was claimed as a disability, and then I was put on disability benefits 🙃🙃
Some people have children so they could live vicariously through them and relive their unfulfilled dreams and expectations through them.
Yes, child
Actors
That’s the worst
Some people? Try the vast majority of them.
sounds like my parents
I told my mother that I was never going to have children with which she responded "who's going to look after you when your old?"
Well, you would be very lucky if you have children who take care of you. On the other side, having children so they'll take care of you is often a far cry from reality. Also I think it's selfish to have children as an investment for your own future. If they want take care of you, great. But don't expect it. I like to help my parents, but that's because I had very loving and supportive parents (they are my adoptive parents, never knew my real parents). It's because I really WANT to take care.... but not because they are my parents.
For a parent, who in their childhood received conditional love based on their performance, having a child becomes a sort of a project through which they want to keep receiving their parents' approval.
"Mom, Dad! Look at me! I'm doing the right thing. My family, my children are the way they're supposed to be."
It's difficult for the parent to see their child's true emotional needs if the main purpose of having it (the child) is not to address them (the child's emotional needs) but to model the child so that it brings emotional gratification to the parent through receiving approval from his/her (the parent's) parents.
@TehJoeJr Thank you, I appreciate that.
The main unhealthy reason I see people have kids is to fill their empty spaces and give them the love they never got in their own childhood. It makes the perfect little love object...they HAVE to love you, they have total control over the child, and they can force the child to give them the respect and love they never got. And it destroys the child completely. Alice Miller also says when people hit their children they are doing what they wish they could have done to their own parents.
As a mother who had children for the wrong reasons, I wish I wouldn't have.
Bringing innocent children into my pile of shite is my biggest regret. They deserve so much better.
I wish I would have known what I know now.
The fact you even acknowledge your own failings is a massive leap that most people are far too afraid to do.
My guess is that your kids will be just fine.
There is not perfect way to do things for a human.
If you recognize your problems you can make a huge difference my friend. And by working on it the curse can be stopped.
Wish you all the best, honest human been!
I agree with Gerhard. My parents could never even understand. They had me (the oldest one) mostly because of number 7 and my sisters for other wrong reasons Daniel points out so well. Now when there are no grandchildren from any of us they put us down all the time for not having the children. Such a great parents.
@@threethrushes Thank you for the encouraging words.
@@atiger4716 Thank you for your encouragement!
I think it's revealing that we have different ways to describe procreation. "Having a child" vs "becoming a parent" as if it's an acquisition rather than an avocation. In my experience the first clue someone is having children for unhealthy reasons is when people say it has to be their genetic offspring, that they couldn't love someone else's child. When i hear that i hear "i could never love anyone and i'm miserable."
If you really think that you're a fool. Raising someone else's child is not the same thing as having one, period. No matter what you do, that person will never be your son, they will never be your daughter. You can call them that, but I can call the sky red.
Yeah that's a tough talking point. From my perspective, I've come to realise I love some people's children more than they do. But I would never take someone else's child into my custody for the same reasons I would not make a child myself.
It's really painful to take everything into account, and it's all very hypothetical
There's this 20 year old dishwasher at my job. He has already fathered four children. He talks to me about his children and his baby mothers and I'm dying inside cause I literally can't say anything unsupportive of his life choices without becoming an asshole.
"You know I'm glad I had my children Young..."
Sure man, that was a great idea wasn't it.
Oh, shit, that must be so frustrating for you 😫 (ps: I am a vegan, too)
Much love🖤
Unfortunately, his behavior is learned/taught behavior... having multiple females and multiple offspring aka no self control.
Unfortunately, that's learned/taught behavior... having multiple females and multiple offspring aka no self control...smh
Healing C-PTSD here.
When I think about why I had so many kids (8) these are my reasons:
1. I was allowing god control over my womb (in a Christian cult since age 9), and I was obeying the fruitful command. My exhusband had no issues w/that.
2. Because I wanted a tiny, cuddly ball of responsibility that would be adored and be adorable. Yes, even through "terrible twos," 'tweens,' and twenties so far.
3. To prove my mother I am capable of being a mother much better than she was to me.
4. For my own people, my clan, to be accepted (finally) and practice inclusion, the opposite of what I've experienced.
5. To offer the world wonderful, loving, patient adult humans to make earth a better planet (and thus, fill heaven, because I was brainwashed by that aforementioned cult).
I don't believe I had cruel intentions. Selfish, yeah, but not intrinsically. Jesus had instructions for their care, specifically, and if he loved them, I loved them. I'm a little too empathic towards others.
When I received assistance from the government, I have been so grateful.
Its been a challenge supplying all their needs. It breaks my heart they'll have voids because of my dreadful foresight & lack of money in a capitalist world.
The kids and I are all learning to feel through our feelings and resolve traumas, now. We are cult-free and I cut ties w/my toxic mother & stepdad & friends & I divorced our abuser (their dad).
Supplying all their needs is impossible alone; I'm learning to reach out & ask for help.
Hey, thank you for sharing. I appreciate you sharing your experience.
Another big one is that they get validation for their own life choices by their children choosing the same path (even manipulating or coercing the children through guilt).
Thank you Daniel🙏🏾❤️. Long time sub. I especially replay your videos about this subject because as a childless woman by choice, I get a lot of real and perceived pressure to have children or feel a certain way because I don't. Listening over and over again to your videos keeps reminding me that I am a sane, rational thinking adult!
Grateful for you and your content.
Congratulations!
I really commend you.
You are definitely a sane, rational and thinking adult. Peace be upon you.
I am 36 and consciously child-free (never had a desire or an itch to be pregnant/give birth/raise a child). Sending supportive, loving intentions your way🖤
You've hit the nail on the head again Daniel. It's so important to reflect deeply and honestly about these issues. They are central to all of our lives and are of great importance to us all. The problem is that many people live unconsciously, they repeat patterns from their parents and ancestors. In the Baha'i Faith (I'm a Baha'i) we call this "blind imitation of ancestors". My faith instructs me to engage in independent investigation of the truth and to look into all things with a searching eye. I value your videos because they encourage us all to be critically minded, to reflect deeply, and to do these things. You are offering a great service to the community. Please keep up the good work!!!
From my experience the people who are frantic about having children are all sociopaths.! It's come down to 1 of the biggest red flags for me... My heart breaks when I see what they do to their children after they have them.. and to the world.
I love this, Daniel! Delightful.
The RUclips psychotherapist says that narcissistic parents do "pathological projective identification" to locate their sense of worthlessness in the child because invoking those feelings in others bring relief to them.
RUclips psychotherapist Jay Reid*
@@jane9469 This is interesting. I think it's true, linked into supply theory but going deeper with projection. I'll look into this more. Thanks Jane.
@Jane , Yes that’s exactly right. The child of these parents becomes an emotional tampon for the parent with NPD to project onto. Thank God those children are starting to wake up now and find there true identity’s.
This is the textbook definition of a scapegoat, a sacrificial offering for the community to place their shame and blame onto before they destroy it.
@@gauloise6442 This happened to me when my grandmother died in 2003. I was raised by her and my step grandfather for 17 years. At the age of 56, she was diagnosed with lung cancer. She passed away in May of 2003. I was a skinny, sheltered 17 year old kid that really knew nothing of the real world. A few days after the funeral, my step grandfather, my uncle and his then-girlfriend all got blackout drunk one night. They woke me up and hauled me downstairs to the kitchen table to tear me apart. Keep in mind that I had not had one drop of alcohol in my system at this time. I was roused out of my sleep and immediately ambushed by these people. They proceeded to tell me that I killed her. Not directly of course, but that I made her die quicker because I wasn't affectionate towards her. When I wasn't at school, I was spending all my time with my then-girlfriend Caitlin. I didn't think there was much I could for my grandmother. She was undergoing chemotherapy and my step grandfather mostly looked after her. At the kitchen table, these drunks were practically foaming at the mouth yelling at me. But it didn't stop there. My step grandfather looked at me and said something I will never forget. He said "You don't have to worry about anyone else trying to hurt you, because I'm going to kill you. You killed my wife!" And, with that, I went into survival mode and made a beeline for the patio door behind me. As I ran outside as fast as I could, I could feel someone grabbing onto my shoulder trying to pull me back inside. I flung my arm back and felt my elbow connect with something. It turns out it was my step grandfather's nose. I didn't mean to hurt anyone. I just wanted to evade the dangerous situation. It's clear to me now that I was the scapegoat during this time because I was the weakest one. I was the youngest, the poorest, the most inexperienced, and, last but not least, I was completely sober. In my experience, drunks don't act too kindly to those around them that aren't drinking. To this day I have a very difficult time trusting people. I feel like my parents are supposed to be the ones I can trust the most. After my step grandfather, who was my father for all intents and purposes threatened to kill me, I lost all trust I had for him. He's dead now also. He passed away in 2012 from stomach cancer. After I ran away from home that night, he lived it up. He sold the house, bought a brand new Honda Pilot, bought himself a boat. The best part is yet to come: he went to go live in England, married his ex-daughter-in-law, raised her daughter for the next six years until his death. In his obituary, I was not mentioned once. He raised me for 17 years, and I didn't even get mentioned. He was only in his wife's daughter's life for 5 years before he passed. She was mentioned in the obituary as his "daughter." It made me feel sick.
As a woman, other women say I should have a baby. First, why do they care? I feel like they want others to suffer as they do. Child rearing is difficult. It is unfortunate that relationships and having babies is so romanticized. Why does no one tell the truth? I think the decision to have a child should entail the sacrifices one has to make. Also people have, "FOMO" fear of missing out.
Omg so true. This is exactly how I feel about making children. FOMO
So hard to get rid of, it seems engrained in my brain or hormones or whatnot
Oh man, some parents I know tick ALL those boxes... I feel so bad for their children
Excellent Content! I have a very good friend who wanted me to "get pregnant" with her, since she had just gotten pregnant! In the moment, I was appalled. I felt bad when I said no as a knee jerk reaction. I just could not fathom having another child with my husband since our marriage was on the rocks and I absolutely HATED being pregnant and then not having any help from my husband when our son was born. She said...well, the older ones can "help you" take care of the younger ones! Yikes again! She now has four kids, and I've got my one Wonderful Fantastic Young Man/Son, who will be 21 in a few days. When I was 40, I was a bit regretting "only" having one child, but I'm over it, and Very Grateful for the one I have. He was Very Planned, and I am so glad that I did not give in to impulse or whim. By the way, I am an "only" as well, which may have something to do with why I was more "okay" with my decision.
Wow, great work Daniel! Thanks:)
Dad had me at 36 and I’m pretty sure I was a panic-baby.
Whats a panic baby
@@NightinGal89 i think its when people want kids as a solution for Exhistantial dredd
When Someone think
"ooh , Im gett'n old , but I haven't done anything in life "
or "who will take care of me when Im old "
or " Im bored , I wanna test something new "
@@NightinGal89 what kulathunga said
Underrated video. Should be a mandatory part of school syllabus
That’s so sad. I’m 26 and I did see myself as someone who was trying to escape the workforce by getting married and becoming a stay at home mom. Basically, repeating what my other did. She was deeply insecure and I could feel it to my core. I have done a lot of work on myself and I want to be happy and then have a child. Children can feel if you are happy or not; they are highly intuitive because they have to be to survive. My goal is to be happy and full of purpose and then have a child.!
@Happiness wanna hug
Thank you for still making videos! I'm watching all of your content in tandem with the book "Healing developmental Trauma" by Laurence Heller and Aline LaPierre and it really helps.
I was born from fear not from love. My mom told me she panicked when she was close to 30 decided to settle with my dad..
because it was "convenient" and they were at the "right circumstances". But truth is i think she was just desperately trying to find love because shes afraid of being alone.
Fast forward to now, they are divorced and turns out my dad is a habitual liar and might be part of histrionic disorders.
Mom said her life was "a lie" and I'm here despising my existence because i only feel like i was born to fill a hole.
It’s hard getting through these videos because they seem to scare me.
You’re a soft spoken man with such an open mind without a rough masculine echo that doesn’t push too hard.
It’s what these young men like me starve for as we literally all have parents who had us for unhealthy reasons. Propaganda has corrupted us into thinking things like this isn’t an issue. The closest we get is mental health, but that’s only referencing suicide rates.
My point is just thank you for telling your truth. 🥲
Aw, thanks. Wishing you the best. Daniel
@@bored_and_has_no_clueLife will continue no matter, but individually we can be more aware of our traumas and lessen the cause by not just ignoring red flags or bad habits of those around us. 🐝
@@bored_and_has_no_clue hmm, My only problem with that is the question of who does the regulating, and if it ends up being a government then generally they screw it all up and end up repressing people in some horrible way. I made about a video about this at some point recently, though I can’t exactly remember the title!
^ A License to Have Children: My Conflicted Thoughts ruclips.net/video/uqCp-c9V-eM/видео.html
Hi Daniel, thanks for your video.
This video needs to go viral.
I direct a competitive dance program. I could not even work today because of the anxiety and pressure from the moms guilting me into spending every waking hour trying to make their daughters stars. They couldn’t care less if I need a holiday or time to heal from a loss. Basically they think it’s their job to fight for rehearsal time with the teacher for as many hours as they can get before those competitions. No matter how tired or sick the kid is, and no matter who loses out.
So I think you left out living out dreams through their child. It’s more abusive than you would think.
Well said. Yes.
I had 2 children when in my teens I was 17 with my husband . Later in life my husband had a vasectomy we both agreed on it. Our children were grown with their own children. I didn’t want anymore . I didn’t want to bring another child into this world the way it is going . So anyway guess what ? I became pregnant again .My husbands vasectomy didn’t work . I heard on the radio after that a lot of doctors were performing this operation and they were not even qualified to do it ! My husband and I were happy .We agreed that God intended for us to have another child . We did not know at the time of the vasectomy what we wanted but God did ! 😊
I love your videos. Pure intelligent philosophical thinking. F
A quick red pill and a slap to society :) I hear it already: "Oh Daniel, why you need to remind us of what we pushed out of our conscience"
There are also a few unhealthy reasons NOT to have kids. According to Robert Firestone, by having kids we in a sense have to leave our own childhood behind, which causes grief to come up. So we defend against that grief by not taking this step. It is a form of never having to grow up and stay a child because we are still holding onto our lost, painful childhood instead of grieving it and letting it go forever. Another reason is that by having kids we are reminded that we are one step closer to are own death, which causes of course deep death anxiety.
This video is wonderful and should be played at every high school around the world before graduation day.
1.) Animals (pets) are individual beings too and all of these apply to them as well. People should only adopt another being or bring another being into the world to love and care for them them and share the world with them the best they can.
2.) A lot of people have kids so that they can do all of the obnoxious anti-social things THEY'D like to do to others - through their kids. These are the parents who never tell their child "no", etc. They smirk beautifically as the brat crosses others' boundaries.
I agree totally! I saw several of my same age friends have a "surprise" in their 40s, which was more like a horrible shock to their long suffering husbands. So another twenty years of parenting, the older child suggesting termination. Then by the time they had any freedom back as such, all plans and dreams ruined....never the child's fault of course, but I had thought it was some form of sabotage. I can also say that my eldest daughter was fuming, quite rightly, when I had a "second family" when she was twelve....at a time when she did get pushed over whilst I was playing Mother Earth again. Daniel, you are so right with this.
Thats so difficult subject to raise as parents put their worth into their "role".. if you deconstruct this "role" and confront their emotional addictions MAN thats terrible for them.. they want to believe they are good parent and parent for the good reason...
Thats a very difficult subject yet the central subject of psychological disorder of any being because 85% of our pain comes from this "education"..
I remember when I was going through a really dark moment in my life my mother told me I should have a child. Needless to say I wasn't even dating anyone (which makes the suggestion even worse) but I was absolutely dumbfounded. And I was supposed to be the mentally ill one.
I wonder, what are your thoughts on antinatalism, Daniel? It says that it is unethical to bring conscious beings into existence because there is a fundamental asymmetry between suffering and being happy.
Antinatalism is just primitive ignorance around intelligent and mobile life and its integrated systems.
@@merry6671 What is “mobile life” ?
@@L_Martin Referring to life that has mobility (that can move)
() the presence of pain is bad, and that
() the presence of pleasure is good.
However, such a symmetrical evaluation does not seem to apply
to the absence of pain and pleasure, for it strikes me as true that
() the absence of pain is good,even if that good is not enjoyed by anyone,
whereas
() the absence of pleasure is not bad unless there is somebody
for whom this absence is a deprivation.
@@siryoucantdothat9743 I was thinking about this assymetry of pain and plessure
and I relaized this
Would you rather have a life with pain and plessure in a random ratio
or a meh life with no pain or plessure
you chose 1st one right
bcz the 2nd one is Boring
but what is Boredom if not a form of PAIN
This and the argument prooves Pain is intertwined with life , but Plessure is a superficial thing
Perfect timing. Just had a conversation with a friend who wants to become a father and I shared some of my reasons why he should wait.
His reasons would be 2. and 8.
Could you do a video on 'healthy reasons to have children'? Or is it always unhealthy?
The healthy reason is want to raise a healthy adult who is happy
radical acceptance/unconditional love , with healthy boundaries no enmeshment , you use guilt not shame as a method of upbringing, you make the dynamic as a friendship instead of “ father “ “ children “ dynamic… you speak to your child as if he / she is an adult who can carry responsibilities you don’t withdraw the responsibility when a fault is made you let them reap the fruit and the thorns so they feel internal locus of control over their life and a sense of accomplishment and fulfillment you simply guide not command , you teach them about spirituality not religion but if they associated with religion you let them be whatever they want , you dont let them abuse your love by keeping boundaries from their problems they might bring from this kind of upbringing its total freedom anything can happen but they learned to reap the thorns early in their childhood so they wont feel abandoned example ( you teach the child its important to sleep early so they go to school , you dont yell or use bad language you simply let them misbehave , they go to school drowsy and tired , you tell them that what will happen everyday if they dont sleep , they misbehave again you simply take something they want like an ipad as a punishment because they did something wrong not because they are bad , you let them experience this cycle for a while these children eventually will be responsible ) you use the method for everything else until a certain age then its up to them how they dictate their lives i would say 12- 14 is the right age where kids are on puberty as a Rite of passage they could feel the change physical so you enhance the experience spiritually and emotionally “ you are an adult “ now they would feel thrilled for sure , you teach them to love each other just how you love them and they will view each other by your eyes because the way we love ourselves is the way our parents loved us , you be there for them in hard and joyful times they fuse you into their lives because you are them and them are you because you didnt taint the relationship with shame so they accept you fully it creates a beautiful bond where even a parent can share their darkest secrets , fears and desires when the children are adult now so the timing is important because you want to teach them that authenticity is the way to live with the right people not with everyone, you pass out your ideas and teachings to them so they could live a healthy lives as well , you learn from them next because its their time and age now and many more i could think of its just one thing that bathers me … what if you get a psychopathic child or an evil that is inherent here where things get dicy or child with disabilities that it would break your heart to see them suffer in life with their needs and desires never truly be met is that a life worth living … because think of this.
() the presence of pain is bad, and that
() the presence of pleasure is good.
However, such a symmetrical evaluation does not seem to apply
to the absence of pain and pleasure, for it strikes me as true that
() the absence of pain is good ,even if that good is not enjoyed by anyone,
whereas
() the absence of pleasure is not bad unless there is somebody
for whom this absence is a deprivation.
You have created this scenario of the absence of most good and the presence of most bad you have committed a moral abomination in the right of your child now hes in great pain and a life not worth living which is what most lives are full of painful memories , even if there is a curtain amount of good there is a threshold of badness that would make any life not worth living like someone has 10 bad and 20 good is better than someone having 50 bad and 70 because there is so much suffering so the absence of suffering is >>>>> the presence of good thus non existent have an advantage of existence
I've observed #1 being the most common... also #3 #4 #5 and #6...
I recently went to the hospital and I have no family. I wish I would have had a child because I would have someone who would advocate on my behalf. I know kids aren't guaranteed to help their parent, but it would have been nice possibility to have a 30-something year old to talk to when I'm alone in the world. I am a woman and regret not having children.
Yes I have seen all of those things and experienced some of them too.Nice one as always bro
Number 9 is so socially acceptable. I always thought it was weird to have another child to keep the first child company. Most people I know don't have great relationships with their adult siblings -probably because they were expected to be each other's keeper.
I don't think I've ever known a parent to have a reason to have children that wasn't selfish.
Parents don't have children for the children's sake.
Childless people do not have children for the children's sake.
Right, Because no one is asking to come here...The Ultimate form of Love and Compassion is sparing the unborn this Horrible Existence.
Love this.
I currently work at a daycare and I see this exact thing., some women have 3 kids from their first marriage, they gotten a divorce, then they met someone new who also has one or two kids from their previous marriage & they decide to get married, then they get pregnant with yet another child when they have teenagers at home. And the justifications as to why they wanted yet another child are absolutely ridiculous from we love each other so much so we want to have our own child, like collecting souvenirs from every men they slept with , to we need a sibling for our first one, to God made us so we can procreate, to ooh if you don’t have children you shorten your life because you live through your kids and the future generations.
My observations #1 is the most common and #6.
So powerful video. I think its the top of the videos to put out there, becouse is so important - and alot of people would feel uncomfortable with themselfes bringing out children. But maybe some future parents would think twice before having one. It also rings many bells for me when it comes to my childhood.
Someone mentioned positive reasons for having children...I would say having an abundance of love,care and energy to give to a child because by their very nature children have great needs and to be healthy and happy have to have those needs met.
Having said this I think society is set up in such a way that it makes it very difficult even for those who may be the best suited to being parents but who may struggle due to the dog eat dog nature of our society and with little community support available so those nuclear families who are more self absorbed and self centred do very well even though they have no concern very often for the wider community but merely their own "progeny" or lineage...abit like the mafia.Their children to them are very much about immortalising their own memory or DNA rather than thinking of wider community concerns.
I think in the times we are living in now with the climate crisis so obviously a factor then anyone who brings children into the world and is not thinking about resources and how they might be bringing up a child to be a responsibly aware human being concerned about what they might be giving and taking and playing a responsible role in their community just seems to be the most selfish self serving thing a person can do.
Even if you are a psychologically healthy person, finding another responsible, psychologically healthy person who will co-parent well is so incredibly, incredibly difficult. A lot of child-free people are that way, simply because they never met someone who had the emotional maturity to be a parent.
9. Is so very true. My mother has one child and that is me and, someone said she should give me a sibling and she said no. The pets issue I agree with Daniel because it’s like a child. You bring a sibling into the world and neglect the first born, it will cause havoc and that’s the same with pets. You have one pet and you end up bring another pet into your home, some people will favor the new pet and ignore the previous one.
I greatly appreciate your work, I wonder if you’d do a video analyzing your view of agoraphobia?
10. "Prove" to yourself than you're better than other family membera who remained unmarried. My narc sister had a family only to beat me and our other sisters in the popularity competition that exists only in her mind. I also suspect my mom had 4 kids only to beat her sister by having 1 more child than her.
To me, the main (and unhealthy) reason that people have children is because they want someone to love them. Young children unconditionally love their parents and hate to see them upset. If the parent is upset, the child gets upset, and can even blame themselves for somehow causing the parent's upsetness. Adults who are desperate for love and attention - but aren't getting it in their life - often want to have children because children watch every single move that the parent makes.
A similar, but slightly different, reason is that the parent feels lonely and wants a friend. They expect their child to be their friend and have similar tastes or hobbies or a similar personality. If the child is different and wants to go off on a different tangent, the parent gets angry. The parent feels abandoned by their child.
In relationships where the adults are in conflict with one another, one of them may want to have a child who they can manipulate to be on "their side" and help them to fight against the other adult.
what a slam dunk, or even better...What a two-handed block of a slam-dunk?! bestilled.
Great vid
I will only have a child if I am with someone I love so much so that it a child of love is born naturally but not for just the sake of having a child
Always love your commentary on the topic of people having children! Do you identify as an antinatalist?
I've been watching most of his videos and I've read his book, Toward Truth; and he has optimism that humanity will, eventually, give children human rights and also, grown-ass-adults will figure out how to be Parent's with a capital P.
And while I started out with, what I refer to now, as naive-optimism; last year when I'd first been introduced to his work... I'm not anymore as I can't have faith in our over-evolved-ape, species; so no, he's not antinatalist (yet/anymore?).
Miserable breeders, breed Miserable breeders; humanity isn't above the nature we're so blessed/cursed with.
@@sojournerkarunatruth4406 So much truth, I feel the same way about people who choose to have kids. I don't see us breaking away from this miserable cycle.
Thanks for the insight, I have watched a lot of his videos (never read his books) and I couldn't tell whether he still held on to that optimism you describe. Thanks for your response!
@@lisaraye6241I don't think the masses of ppl will either... because of Humanity Endless craving and desire for sex...smh
1/3/4 are my parents. Your explanation of no. 4 is as if you knew my father personally, lol. Most folks I know have parents who have created so much trauma in their lives...it's horrible. I 100% never want to have children...I just don't have any interest in doing so but also don't want to cause them any pain/trauma.
My observations #1 is the most common #4 #5 and #6... the most common is #1.
You are also correct... babies are just the end result of 2 ppl that NEEDED to quench their craving and desire for six... Nothing more
I think there are tons of people who have children because as parents they want to feel loved, important and taken care of by their children.
I could have been this type of parent... But fortunately I've done psychotherapy ;) .
8:08 How to explain that the first kids more often that rare are the ones asking for a little sister/brother? Perhaps first kids asking for a sibling is a sign of loneliness and lack of company from their parents?
Thank you Daniel!
'He forgot the rubbers.'
Saving a dying relationship. That's common here
Spot on
Never wanted them, never will. Children should be 100% wanted. There's a 0% want here.
Why are all of Daniel's video lookin like they're shot in the early 2000's😉
He got that casually dressed scruffy dude look on lock 🔐
There are anthropological reasons to have children like parents making sure they would be looked after when they are old.
Daniel, Daniel, I have a strong feeling you’ve been snooping around my huge extended and immediate family, lol! JK, nevertheless, you’re so right, I wish I had a rewind and a delete button, which I would probably use a lot since listening to your videos. 😱😭😂
Yes yes yes
Thank you
You forgot maybe the most important one, lonelyness!
Guys I know always say they had kids to “Leave a legacy”… it sounds so odd, what does that mean? Does anyone know?
When they die some of them is left behind. It’s a bit sick because God created child; a human is just a vessel.
@@ginagg200 yeh i agree it doesnt make sense at all... i mean does anyone really know who their great great grandparents are? After a certain amount of years being dead no one really cares about the life you had... unless you left something like art, music, science, literature that cultures stil absorb then I really dont know what the average person leaves behind at all that makes a difference...
@@personalfreedom2700 it’s usually people who see their children as an extension of them (narcissistic)
@@ginagg200 yes i believe in God, but my mother is an atheist... she always tells me “I gave you life” and i always tell her “if you gave me life, then you also gave me death” .... its interesting how the narcissists ultimate goal, is actually to gain meaning in their own life by essentially becoming your god.
@@personalfreedom2700 she’s not my God, she’s bot even someone I would be friends with
Hear hear!
* Have children who will take care of the parents, when the parents get old.
* to be a farmhand
* to have family to whom they can pass down the estate
What really makes me upset is when people have children for rather selfish reasons. For instance, people have children so that they'll have caregivers when up in their old age years. I have yet to hear a great and wonderful legit reason as to why a person decided to have children.
Sir, what is a good reason to have a child? (in your opinion)
In my experience people without children are the most opinionated of those with kids.
@@Archonbuster Sorry for your experience. Mine is different...people without children are more open minded and less judgmental of other ways of living.
@@maureene2729 We are all judgmental depending on our experience. All living in our own individual truth
@@Archonbuster Agreed!
1 reason I've heard that might be subsumed in the other's for having shoulder and he's not to be alone anymore I've heard women state that they were lonely and it having a child with cure the loneliness this doesn't seem to me to be a good reason to have a child either
Methinks, thou dost protest too much. Why would people who don't believe in a God want to have children? They struggle and they suffer, and to what end? Only to die forever, in their minds. To that mind - yours, I believe - having a child could be little more than disguised selfishness.
I agree with all of this.
So perceptive!
What are some good reasons to have kids?
Anybody else picturing the beginning of Idiocracy?
If only people who are healed enough would be allowed to have children, you wouldn't fly in a plane, live anywhere, or have anything, in one generation, because no one on this planet even comes close....and then what?
Very true. The fact is, yes people have children for selfish and/or poorly thought-out reasons. But that is the human condition. We are all selfish and screwed up to one degree or another, which brings about a "he who has not sinned cast the first stone" scenario. Any time people start playing with the idea of population control, or "who can and cannot qualify for procreation" things get fascist really quick. To have offspring is a human right. Whether or not one exercises that is entirely their business. Unfortunately, this often results in people having children for foolish reasons. Fortunately, these foolish motives don't necessarily guarantee that child's fate. The child will grow up in this wretched world with imperfect parents like the rest of us, but that doesn't mean he is unable to grow up to be a model member of the human race. Good men are often born in hard circumstances.
@@bcj842 Wauw! What an amazing reply, couldn't have said it better!! I love Daniel and his vids, but if he wants to keep traveling and walk down the road or get money from his bank or go to a hospital if needed or go to a supermarket to buy foods and stuffs, live in a house or apartment someone built, he must be happy that he is able to do all of that, for if there would not be screwed up people in a multitude on this planet, and people would have to qualify for procreation (which most would fail) the world would be empty pretty soon forever! Thats for sure! his insights are very useful I really enjoy Daniel, but on this subject, he is totally short-sighted. Healing from the human condition and becoming a better person (like he himself did) is possible and a great Blessing to us all, though it is rare, as Daniel also says and that is the TRUTH.
Why do some people have a need to control other people?
I think, for example, because through this control they receive a false sense of self-value, a sense of self-importance, coming from the fact that the other person is dependent on them.
Also, possibly, out of fear of being lonely, feeling unneeded, out of fear of lack of control in their own life (if we're talking about relationships).
In a word, to act out various traumas on the controlled person.
Trauma
@Ela Olejova nailed it
It really sounds like there are no good reasons to have a child then?
Great 😊
What are the appropriate motivations to have children?
To love the child and raise them to be a healthy person.
@@jane9469 To love the child is hardly a healthy reason. It's the same reason why we have an industry of forced parental separation around pets so we can play the saviour and "love them".
And you can also adopt children and love them and raise them to be healthy people, which means that that isn't even a reason necessarily to have your own child.
Probably the opposite of what Daniel is saying?
@@merry6671 you make good points. I think a parents job should be to do everything they can for their child and accept them. That means they also have an obligation to be as healthy as possible befote they even conceive them. For some people, like myself (due to the direction this world is headed) having children isnt in our plans. If i were to have a child it would be an adoption, and only once i was perfectly secure and was able to help that child in every way possible. In a way "be there" for a child in a way in which that child needs you.
there is no unselfish reason every desire is selfish
do you think there are healthy reasons to have children? what could they be? or do you think our species should die?
I think more and more people become antinatalists, we will for sure have demographic decline. and this shows in high to mid income/education range the most. I wonder what future looks like
I think it's bleak. There's really no reason why our species needs to go on when you think about it. Do you know how many species have been destroyed by humans? All in the name of profit, I might add. Guys killing tigers for their pelts that can be sold for big money. Makes me sick. You may ask why should the human race cease to exist. You can also ask why it should continue to exist. I think there's more evidence pointing to the extinction of the human race being beneficial for the universe than detrimental to it.
@@revokdaryl1 isnt that the small portion of humanity that does that though? is there a reason for lions existance with the same logic? probably the answer is that they are not that destructive, and I understand that point of view as well. I just have faith in humanity left, although Ive seen the worst in my life as well, I dont think we should be eradicated as such, but hopefully evolution or nature does its job as it always does to bring it to balance. also depends on where are you coming from. I appreciate the creativity of humankind immensely, the art and music we create, the eay we study and appreciate our existance, more phiosophical types I mean. I dont know, thats me
@@violetmushroom6 Thanks for replying. I'm a big music fan myself. I'm currently trying to learn piano. It's definitely not easy for me to pick it up. You make a good point in that the majority of people don't agree with killing tigers and lions for profit. I'm just using them as an example because I always loved cats, big and small. Lol. Now that you mention it, my favourite composer is Vangelis. He made a song in 1983 with Jon Anderson from the band Yes called "Horizon". It's here on RUclips if you want to check it out. The lyrics actually talk about how the human race is going to persevere and overcome evil and other hurdles. It's a tad on the religious side, but don't let that sway you. It's probably one of the best songs ever made. I can honestly say that Vangelis' music has brought me back from the edge more than once.
What would you consider a healthy reason to have children?
It is taboo to talk about this sort of thing, if you want to carry on with the typical light or ironic diversionary chatter.
There are some people who should have never have children like my parents.
Mine, too. And I'm the third one - as they were going bankrupt. Like wtf were you thinking? But of course, society is offended that I would ask such a question. Especially since the answer is, "we weren't."
What are the reasons why you yourself would choose to have a child with someone, Daniel?
There is never a good "reason" to have kids. It's a biological impulse. It's not rooted in reasons. But because we have large brains, we have the ability to rationalize "reasons" to do it. If we were animals, like deer and panthers, we wouldn't have to go thru that extrat step to rationalize what is otherwise an indivdually self destructive act.
no one should have children cuz they will experience the undeniable suffering, besides they can't give consent, they are not asking to be born.
Right, No one is asking to come here to this Cesspit Hellish Zoo...The Ultimate form of Love and Compassion is sparing the unborn this Horrible Existence.
Imagine someone with no children, lecturing people about having children.
@Tracy I used to watch his videos on the regular now I’m pretty sure that he’s an overgrown child who has not fully dealt with his own issues and is content to pathologise them onto others via his platform.
Children happen naturally when men and women “know” each other, the idea that there are “bad” reasons to have children frames having children as a choice and not the byproduct of natural human relationships. And I just don’t accept that.
@Tracy All I see is a middle aged man with no wife and kids trying to lecture people on children, I think it’s dumb. Why do you care so much about defending him, do you wanna have his babies for his approved reasons? LOL.