Historical "Cheap Shots" in European Martial Arts
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- Опубликовано: 8 июл 2024
- Not all techniques are artful and respectful. Hosts Nicole Smith & Jesse Tucker from Blood and Iron demonstrate a few "low blows", and cheap shots found in several manuscripts.
Music from filmmusic.io
"Skye Cuillin" by Kevin MacLeod (incompetech.com)
License: CC BY (creativecommons.org/licenses/b...)
"Olde Timey" by Kevin MacLeod (incompetech.com)
License: CC BY (creativecommons.org/licenses/b...)
At 2:20 we mean a caustic, corrosive, Blinding* powder. Not a black powder. Whoops. - Also, if anyone is interested in the STL files to be able to print their own Fiore Poison Polearm, Julian will be uploading the STL's of the components on Patreon within the next few days.
The recipe for the poison can be found in Fiore's manuscript :D
Alternative title: When the Fighter takes a Rogue dip
The knee strike looks absolutely brutal (and legit technique).
Apparently very risky, though.
hey everyone! We're back.
Upon the return to regular filming sessions, we've been messing around with our setup (lights, filming locations) again, so if the following few videos visually look different we're just trying to figure things out. This video was actually near the tail end of all that, but we wanted to get this episode out to you first. So this will be more-or-less closer to what to expect in the future.
Looks great! Good changes! :)
Julian, you're hot
glad to have you back!
*overgrips sword*
"What if I'd put my blade on top of yours?"
*blocked*
"haha just kidding :3"
*overgrips with crossguard*
"unless..?"
Interesting. I was reading Christian Cameron's historical fiction novel 'Sword of Justice', and it features Fiore as a secondary character and companion to the main character, William Cook, an English knight in the late 14th century. In that novel, there's a tournament duel in armor where Fiore is witness to someone using powdered arsenic concealed in a pollaxe head, I thought it was a fanciful invention on the part of the author!
I presume that last knife technique was from "The manual of the Baratero" lots of strange stuff in that one. Such as the sash or Cape thrown on the ground and pulled out from under the attacker.
Yeah, that last one is straight up "how to murder someone unaware". I could see feigning off-balance in a match and hoping they fall for it, but if my opponent were falling I'd just smack them, win, then help them up after.
but... they will be dead, right?
Never underestimate the power of the tactical flashlight! All you need is that opening!
You're talking a lot of trash for someone that's in poison powder polearm range.
THEY ARE BACK !! I love your work
Hmm, I wonder with that last one where you draw the line between "Martial Arts technique" and not. Not sure what to call "not" beyond maybe trickery or sleight of hand.
Yesss, new vid!
very nicely made video
love it
I love this
2:40 movie sets turn the lights off during fights
"I used to be a fencer like you until i took a pommel to the knee."
So... his knee was ended rightly?
@@caseydubois3645 The knee and half the neighborhood...
Wow. Great
They're back!
I am now very interested in that gypsy knife fighting manual
Cool!
Awesome the mighty Jesse Tucker congratulations. I hope to see you soon
I just saw the powder trick in fiore myself. Im curious what the counter to it is.
When the knight specs into some assassin skills
The last one is actually only an example amongst many assassination techniques. Hiding the blade under crossed arms, holding it in the same hand as a gift are some other notable examples.
Crossguard to the knee damit imagen that without wearing armor 😟 it hurts just thinking about it 😅
Can someone link me a pdf or tell me what that Gypsy fighting manual is? It has piqued my interest.
So you're saying theres more than just having a pocket full of sand? Time to step up my game.
Two pockets of sand, if you listen to Godinho :^)
I can see that these are effective, but not why theyre 'cheap' outside of a duelling context. The gypsy one definitely works and makes a lot more sense than challenging somebody to a knife fight.
The first wouldn't be very useful in an actual swordfight, since it only serves to draw a little blood from the head and win the conditions of a certain kind of sport duel. The second is extremely risky, as they mentioned in the video. The third wouldn't work outside of special duelling contexts, since you're not going to carry a polearm for self-defense and that powder stuff probably wouldn't be too practical to bring to a battlefield. The fourth only works if you're planning to ambush someone at night and thus are bothering to conceal your lantern. The fifth is flat-out murder (I don't really see how you would pull it off in a self-defense situation).
That's the thing though. These are "cheap" only in a duelling context, because a duelling context is the only context where there's any such thing as a "cheap shot". On the battlefield there's no etiquette, only a dead man and a living man. But as said, most of these techniques either wouldn't do anything useful on a battlefield (the one where you just lightly nick your opponent's scalp) and/or would be stunningly dangerous to try in a life-or-death situation, and thus probably not worth risking if there's safer, less "cheap" maneuvers one can do.
How do you defend against the first one if you don't want to be cut?
Very interesting :-D
that smallsword is beautiful, where did you get it?
Definitely going to whip out a pocket strobe light next time
Gypsi Figting manual?
Surprised that some of them can read?
What's the name of that gypsy knife fighting manual?
"Manual of the Baratero: The Art of Handling the Navajo, the Knife, and the Scissors of the Gypsies" is the name in English, I assume this is the book they were talking about because perhaps unsurprisingly this is apparently the only historical book on Romani martial arts.
I´ll save that last one till next gear check
the Italian Powder thing sounds brilliant
1:50 How can he be cut in the head if he's wearing armor??
Hm, looks like the pepperbox warhammer could be made better by slanting the holes towards the tip, that would move the spray cone so that the head is in the middle. Because if you want to blind someone with tremendous pain, you may as well be efficient about it.
hahah, for sure, I had around...2 days to design and print and fabricate the whole thing, so there's definitely some inefficiencies XD
''CALL AN AMBULANCE! CALL AN AMBULANCE!
...BUT NOT FOR ME!''
Jesse!!!!!!!!!
Are you sure that guard strike to knee would do much damage through mail and some steel plate armor? I mean isn't the point of warhammers with spike is because if you hit with hammer part on plate it wont do much?
It'll still do plenty of crushing damage. Yes, the plate will absorb a lot of the damage, but a blunt strike to the knee will at the very least hurt. It could even buckle the knee plate, making it harder to bend that knee and thus move around, or straight-up transfer enough blunt force trauma (even accounting for what's stopped by the soft padding) to shatter the knee joint. IIRC, plate armour was almost impregnable against slashing and stabbing damage, but didn't do quite so well against blunt force, which is exactly why pommel and guard strikes were invented - if you didn't have a pole-arm or a warhammer handy, you at least had SOME way to defend yourself against a guy in full plate.
PSA: Todd's Workshop has been hijacked. While I don't want to use another Creator's space to point out this issue, It is something that hits the HEMA/historical community as a whole and we need to stick together. Here is the Metatron channel with the specifics.
ruclips.net/video/0X5txoRiMrQ/видео.html
There is no sh sound anywhere in Leckkuechner, guys. Ch is pronounced like h in "happy".
So... no ending them rightly?
and nightly
That gypsy knife shot was dirtyyyyy
Yes, fill the void with Lye and ground red pepper. 👍😬
2:20 - everybody expects bleach in milkshakes, not an actual weapon! XD
I would imagine that a skill differential between two opponents would be fairly common. That would leave the less skilled with the option of running away, being killed, or using a dirty trick. I find it quite credible that fencing teachers didn't want their students to use such techniques, in part because they're dishonorable, but also because they're risky, and their students should have enough skill that they shouldn't need to rely on them. They'd still need to know about them, to defend against less skilled and more sneaky opponents.
The Gypsy one was nasty, and more an assassination technique than a fighting technique. Get the liver or the aorta, and there won't be any fighting. I can easily imagine that a pick-pocket-turned-assassin would have the acting skills to pull it off.
"There wouldn't be any fighting"
How long does it take to die of a stab to the liver? I would have thought at least long enough to fight back a little, but then shock is a thing. I know belly wounds can take minutes or hours to die of, and they're a surgeon's _nightmare_ because of all the blood supply, organs that need stitching back carefully in place, and the horrendous amounts of bacteria in the intestines.
@@rollingthunder1043 These aren't random gut wounds. If the aorta is severely lacerated, as in would be if a professional killer made an unobstructed attack on it from close range, the blood pressure will go to zero, immediately, resulting in instant loss of consciousness. In fact, it'll fall faster than with a stab through the heart. The liver will take slightly longer, but the pain will be excruciating, and certainly stun the victim long enough for the attacker to get out of range. We're still talking about death within a minute or so, unconsciousness before that, and weakness before that. For silent knife kills, commandos still go for the liver; you've almost certainly seen pop-culture versions of the technique. In reality, it takes a little longer than the 5 seconds shown in movies, but not all that much.
I used an umbrella with a long metal tip, to great effect on a pick pocket. Out side the pirate bar in New Orleans. Played his ribcage like a xylophone, I did. Then got the tip stuck between notes. He was quite indisposed after the fact.👍😯
Well, I guess people tried to not die.
Lethal Ron Swanson
no flying pommels? ;)
we figured that there wasn't much point in beating a dead horse ;)
Dustin Morton don‘t want a copyright lawsuits from skall...
Dustin Morton don‘t want a copyright lawsuits from skall...
No Godinho's pocket sand and the bag of rocks from that one German rapier treatise... I'm disappointed.
I practice Asian style of fencing and they see working from the bind as a cheap shot and it actually allows me to score against opponents that are far better than me. This makes me wonder why they never practice binds as they do happen accidentally.
1:44 Please don't misinform. The is no way in hell that shot would "destroy the knee" in armor. Maybe possible if you reach the back of the knee with that crossguard. This is coming from someone that had his knee destroyed in bohurt.
Considering the efficacy of blunt impact weapons on armour, it'd be easy to assume that it would cause significant damage to a weak joint. But if you have literal experience in the matter then we stand corrected ;)
@@HEMASimian From my own experience, I can tell that in order to damage a knee of armoured opponent you have to either overextend his knee or use some serious power and by that I mean a polearm or a mace although I saw guys that could take several shots even from those. I'm not saying that the technique you showed doesn't work but I find it hard to believe it would do any significant damage with just one hit.
@@kamilszadkowski8864 Yes, that's what I also thought.
It's nice to hear from someone with actual experience.
thanks for sharing, I thoguht same thing, but maybe if they wear mail without plate armour on leg then it'd work? when messers started being used? something like 1300? then I guess it's possible to meet someone with mail on their legs
@@favkisnexerade Yeah, but if someone's legs are protected just with mail chauses there is really no need to use a crossguard. Any clean shot to the knee with a blade of a sword even could potentially end the fight.