Is the Multiverse KILLING the MCU?

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  • Опубликовано: 4 дек 2024
  • Is the Multiverse killing the MCU? Please support our channel by shopping our MERCH STORE Here → screencrushmer...
    We are living in the Multiverse Age--not just Marvel movies, either. DC, theater, TV shows, and last years best picture winner, "Everything Everywhere All At Once"--they're all focused on the multiverse. So why are we--and giant corporations obsessed with this idea? And is this concept weighting down shared universes and making people feel apathetic? We explain.
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    Written by Colton Ogburn ( / coltonogburn )
    Hosted and co-written by Ryan Arey ( / ryanarey )
    Edited by Harriet Lengel-Enright, Randolf Nombrado, Andrew Finkenstaedt, and Lee Mazzio
    #Multiverse #MCU
    we aren’t just living in the Multiverse Saga of the MCU, we’re living in the multiverse saga of movies in general. The multiverse is everywhere, but why? I thnk understanding our culture;s obsession with the mutlievrse tells us a lot about the media we consume-which also tells us a lot about ourselves.
    So e a closer look at why multiversal storytelling has been so popular as of late-why it's been hit and miss-how this genre has secretly been around for decades.
    Multiverse appeal
    Now the multiverse is nothing new. It’s been featured in comics, Buffy the Vampire Slayer, Mr. Destiny, Rosanne, Fringe, Community-and even the classic Christmas movie, It’s a Wonderful Life. [clip]
    Doug: Now say do what now?
    Yeah, the writer Scot Roseann pointe dout that It’s a wonderful life is the first multiverse film-and it's the perfect example of what makes these films unique. It explored the concept of alternate realities, parallel universes, and how choices and one's own existence can drastically change life as we know it. [clip]
    To understand why we’re in the multiverse age, we have to answer the questions: what’s so appealing about the multiverse in the first place? Why do we, as humans, wonder and dream about these parallel realites?
    Things like nostalgia, 2nd chances, do-overs, and what-ifs are something we all ponder late at night when we’re trying to fall asleep. What if I’d studied a different major? What if my preferred political candidate had won? What if someone close to me hadn’t passed away? What would my life look like? [mr destiny clip] And all of those what-ifs essentially boil down to the same question-what if somewhere out there there’s a version of me who’s happier?
    Doug: Wow that got heavy.
    Well I mean think about it buddy, the past 8-ish years of real life have felt like we’re not living on “the main timeline.”
    Doug: What do you mean?
    Well think about it, the guy from Home Alone 2 became President. We had a global pandemic like something straight from a movie. The Capital was invaded by an extremist mob. The government is actually acknowledging the existence of UFO’s. Not to mention David Bowie, Prince, Harambe-
    Doug: Okay I’m convinced, call the TVA, let's prune this thing.
    Well hey don’t get me wrong, it hasn’t been all bad. But I do think that a large number of people are finding themselves looking back to what they view as simpler times.
    Regardless of your political party, everyone seems to be unhappy in America right now, so the one thing wvevryone cam agree on is that we’re all wondering-what if?
    This question, “what if,” is the central conceit of last year’s best picture winner, everything, everywhere, all at once. That film demonstrated that the multiverse could be an exceptional storytelling tool to explore character. But now, looking at the multiverse mess of the Flash and the MCU, it make sme wonder, what went wrong? Did they take it too far? [clip, I may have gone too far in a few places.]
    Multiverse in hollywood
    To some fans, the multiverse once felt like a fun new way to tell stories on an even grander scale-but is now becoming yet another Hollywood gimmick that audiences are growing tired of. [clip, everyones got a gimmick]
    In film, we’ve always understood the concept of different cinematic universes. For example, audiences have always understood that Tobey Maguire, Andrew Garfield, and Tom Holland are all Peter Parker and Spider-Man. But we also understand that each are reimaginings of the character that exist separately from one another-well until now. [clip]
    The introduction of multiversal storytelling makes anything possible. All three Peters Parker can swing around together, Patrick Stewart’s Professor X can meet Doctor Strange, Scott Lang can be a head in a jar in a zombie apocalypse. [clip]

Комментарии • 965

  • @BaithNa
    @BaithNa Год назад +200

    With each video, you put so much more thought and effort into the MCU than the writers ever did

    • @jayson-7577
      @jayson-7577 Год назад +2

      100%

    • @monsterjs2608
      @monsterjs2608 Год назад +3

      And these writers want a raise lmfao

    • @TheTuneShifter
      @TheTuneShifter Год назад +12

      POV: Wondering if you were paid as poorly and worked in as bad of conditions as a lot of writers, would you do any better or feel the drive to write well. I can guarantee that most people aren’t going to give a crap about doing their job if they’re treated poorly. People are spiteful that way.

    • @Chi-cd3ke
      @Chi-cd3ke Год назад +2

      ​@JosiahCiepiel-eq5tj Let me lose my company billions, then I'll surely get a raise. Love the logic

    • @ToxicTerrance
      @ToxicTerrance Год назад +2

      It's not the writers. The writers submit their work, the executives get to change whatever they want because it's their IP.
      Don't be reactionary and blame the writers. Learn how the process actually works and blame those responsible. The writers did nothing wrong.

  • @milosorian1320
    @milosorian1320 Год назад +180

    The real danger is that too much multiverse films could make you feel watching more of a menu of superheroes than an engaging trailblazer of a film.

  • @BoudicasQuest
    @BoudicasQuest Год назад +16

    your videos are so well-researched. i appreciate the time it must take to write, film, and edit these--especially in the current style, with reaction cutaways...thank you for these videos ~

  • @vkramis4999
    @vkramis4999 Год назад +59

    This video just shows importance of writers. I’m more scared of what’s going to happen after the writers strike

    • @BaithNa
      @BaithNa Год назад +8

      The writers are the ones that got us in this repetitive mess to begin with.

    • @slack__
      @slack__ Год назад +5

      the importance of *good* writers - and directors. you can't just throw poop at a wall, hoping it sticks. you need to know what you're doing first, and do it well.

    • @lorensoth4365
      @lorensoth4365 Год назад +4

      Yeah... the so called "writers" with the MCU are standing on the shoulder of giants who already wrote most of this. Yet they can't even get it right.... it is handed on a silver plater.

  • @Hoopergames
    @Hoopergames Год назад +57

    The poor execution is killing multiverse stories in general

    • @Hoopergames
      @Hoopergames Год назад +7

      I should have watched the video before commenting lmao

    • @Dan55888
      @Dan55888 Год назад +1

      Yep, too many sloppy shows and awkward movies, some even heavily reliant on bad shows like Dr Strange

    • @mohdamerulaidilbinrazisahm7317
      @mohdamerulaidilbinrazisahm7317 Год назад

      To be honest,the multiverse storyline is just their another attempt on fan service. Take a look at Multiverse of Madness.

    • @antoinewright1425
      @antoinewright1425 Год назад +1

      same bro we have seen 2 great examples of multiverse storytelling literally this year both movies did great spiderverse and everything everywhere at once proved its not so much the fatigue of superheroes or the multiverse concept it's the execution of it

  • @gerrigarrick
    @gerrigarrick Год назад +51

    Well said. The thing the Disney+ shows have done best is deliver character deep dives...Wanda and her grief journey, Loki and Moonknight struggling with identity and Sam figuring out what it means for a black man to be Captain America in America. Secret Invasion started out as a deep dive into Fury's friendship with Talos, but the emotional weight was pulled out from under it by killing Talos and then changing the show's driving theme in the process(and ignoring Talos' death btw.) Notice I haven't even mentioned the multiverse, so I agree 100% the multiverse is a cool little touch when we get to see fun things like characters from past films that we love, but tell a character-driven narrative first, or we will check out and not care!!

    • @petertomshany
      @petertomshany Год назад +4

      Well said.

    • @lordsxman
      @lordsxman Год назад +5

      I also really hated how they ignored Talos' death. Smh

    • @gerrigarrick
      @gerrigarrick Год назад +2

      @lordsxman as a viewer we needed to see Fury, the protagonist affected by the loss. They built this theme of friendship for four episodes, and then we don't see our hero grieve the friend?! The bottom fell out when Talos was ignored. Fury should have at least screamed at the Prez on the phone at that the end.. Talos saved your life! Something.

    • @lisamarieligreci-newton7804
      @lisamarieligreci-newton7804 Год назад +6

      100% - WandaVision and Moon Knight were among my favorites. I also think Ms. Marvel did a great job exploring the family dynamics and honestly, I enjoyed that more than the big bad stuff. Even She-Hulk was fine when it actually tried to be a silly 90s era lawyer sitcom (imo) - I would have loved to see more superhero law questions.

    • @gerrigarrick
      @gerrigarrick Год назад +1

      Yes me too @lisamarieligreci-newton7804 I enjoyed SheHulk, including the finale where she changed her own story, but it felt a bit unsatisfying because we didn't see her saving the day in court with her real superpower.. intelligence. She struggled the whole series with thinking "just jen" wasn't enough. How great would it have been to see her nail the baddies who stole her personal information, in court. Sure they got arrested but we cut right to the cute family barbecue. Jen winning the case in court, proving to herself that Jen is awesome and THEN bringing Matt Murdock to meet the family would have been more fulfilling. Win. Win.

  • @Optimus-Prime-Rib
    @Optimus-Prime-Rib Год назад +555

    Multiverse isnt. But 💩 storytelling is

    • @Last-Scar-5675
      @Last-Scar-5675 Год назад +12

      Lol what shit story telling? The only bad thing in this phase is the end of Secret Invasion

    • @Newton-Reuther
      @Newton-Reuther Год назад +47

      ​@@Last-Scar-5675Lol. She-Hulk and Quantumania as well

    • @king_vision4085
      @king_vision4085 Год назад +14

      And the fan base is killing it

    • @king_vision4085
      @king_vision4085 Год назад +23

      @@Newton-Reutherquantimania was good, people act like phase 1-3 didn’t have bad movies too

    • @agrey832
      @agrey832 Год назад +2

      💯

  • @rachelthornton4442
    @rachelthornton4442 Год назад +123

    I think the reason why the Multiverse isn’t working as a threat/concept is that it doesn’t really have an emotional/thematic anchor in the MCU.
    In Everything, Everywhere, the Multiverse is a way to interrogate questions of life, what kind of paths in life we take, what kind of people we become, how important are connections to other people.
    In Spiderverse, it’s a way to express the creative and cultural legacy of Spider-Man, in all of the character’s many forms, deconstructing the formula of the character.
    In the MCU, the Multiverse is….just there. It doesn’t matter how many times Doctor Strange parrots about how the Multiverse is “in danger.” Why should we care that it’s in danger? What is our emotional attachment to the Multiverse? Why does this story *need* to be told as a part of a Multiverse, and not just stand on its own?
    I don’t care if, at the end of the day, The Multiverse is just meant to be a big conceptual playground for characters from recognisable IPs to meet/fight each other. That’s fine. But make us care about the playground.

    • @Aurelyn
      @Aurelyn Год назад +13

      That's probably one of the reasons sure. But we don't even have an avengers team and we don't have anyone like robert downey jr to hold the universe together until the team is formed.

    • @CalvinHobbes94
      @CalvinHobbes94 Год назад +1

      ​@@Aurelynboth of these are very good points

    • @dangerfly
      @dangerfly Год назад +3

      If there are infinite universes out there why care about any in particular? It's why Rick Sanchez is drunk all the time. Comics love to kill off alternate versions of heroes in a shocking way which only adds to inherent multiversal nihilism. If they show me it doesn't matter then why would I care?

    • @dsfddsgh
      @dsfddsgh Год назад +5

      @@Aurelyn Not having a big team up movie until Avengers 5 is killing the MCU at the moment. By the time that movie comes out whenever it comes out it will be at least 7 years or more since Endgame. Feige should have realized that is way to long for the next big team up movie considering we were used to not waiting more then 3 years at best. And the way the Avengers question has been handled since Phase 4 is just plain stupid at least have someone like Sam, Hulk or Antman address what happened and not act like no one wants to know.

    • @lifeinjersey9846
      @lifeinjersey9846 Год назад +2

      Personally this is why marvels and I don't mean the MCU but the comics multiverse stories have always been rather weak. They're just there to have teams fight. DC comics does the multiverse better seeing heroes take different paths, different choices. Its why Flashpoint was so popular because 1 choice changed everything. The mcu is struggling with the multiverse because there is no emotional attachment. We aren't getting a movie with Tony stark not being a hero, etc. What if kind of filled the gap but its animated. No way home honored the legacy of the previous movies. But right now there is no emotional attachment to the multiverse we're not seeing heroes we know evolve differently. Instead its being used as fan service, oh professor x, black bolt, Reed Richard's. Like the doctor strange what if episode was amazing but it was short. Can you imagine the reaction if that was the plot of the doctor strange 2 movie? He desperately tries to save Christine, ends up tearing his universe apart. We feel emotional attachment. The current mcu multiverse just relies on fan service so we aren't emotionally attached to it as a whole

  • @robertobuenafe
    @robertobuenafe Год назад +25

    I think the freedom that a multiverse gives actually made writers lazier and less creative. Even a multiverse should have an established rule and writers should never break those rules once established.

    • @Novastar.SaberCombat
      @Novastar.SaberCombat Год назад +2

      Award-winning author here. You're correct. Further, once Time-travel is introduced and absolutely no hard-coded rules are set, then ALL deaths, consequences, physics, etc. become utterly meaningless. That's a TERRIBLE thing in high stakes storytelling, too. Obviously! 😂 Nothing matters when you could simply wave your magic Wanda and teleport here, there, or anywhere. Strange too that after every film, a character's "already limitless" powers double or quadruple, and yet they are purported to have "no way to save the world" in the next film. Time travel is only feasible when it works for the "writers". Otherwise , the characters just... don't. 🤔 But then, an uneducated, snarky teenager invents "Super Duper Time Travel Plus" in their mom's basement (or in their bedroom, depending on the film's budget). Exemplary writing truly begins to take shape from there, folks! 🙄 Multiverses get Leeloo Dallas multPASSES. 🤮 Especially if the CEOs are filthy wealthy and godlike with their corporate power.
      "YOU UNDERESTIMATE MY POWWAAAH!" --Bob Igerkin Skywalker, probably
      🐲✨🐲✨🐲✨

    • @AloneInThePark
      @AloneInThePark 3 месяца назад

      The thing about the MCU is it has always had goofy shit but it was believable, it's fucking absurd now.

  • @AnthologyOfDave
    @AnthologyOfDave Год назад +88

    Im really comforted to know that I'm not alone in the feeling that we're in the worst timeline and have been for at least 8 to 10 years. Things do feel really off.

    • @dtuitt79
      @dtuitt79 Год назад +14

      At 1st I thought you were talking about the MCU, then I realized you were talking about life.😂

    • @katiearkie
      @katiearkie Год назад +6

      I'm old enough to say been there, done that. None of the "8 to 10" years is new. Maybe we're stuck in a loop lol.

    • @drewhollywood9964
      @drewhollywood9964 Год назад +2

      Phase 4 was really off. None of the movies or shows really connected organically like the previous movies.

    • @AnthologyOfDave
      @AnthologyOfDave Год назад

      Yeah, I was talking about life in general but the MCU has been pretty crap since Endgame.
      Although I think its always been pretty hit or miss, THOR 2, both villains from Ironman 2, 3, and Antman and the Wasp. None of them have been perfect but after Thanos, a near perfect villain, in two near perfect movies, are expectations are too high.
      I thought Quantumania was pretty good for an Antman movie, Love and Thunder was pretty awful, MOM was disconnected, and the Disney+ other than Loki and Moonknight, were instantly forgettable.

    • @AnthologyOfDave
      @AnthologyOfDave Год назад +1

      @@katiearkie idk, he made some valid points, Game show pres, Aliens being acknowledged, turning 47, it all checks out as the worst timeline. ;)

  • @josephjohnpalarca5301
    @josephjohnpalarca5301 Год назад +6

    Very on point about atonement. The main strong point I had for the What If series was Dr. Strange doing whatever it took to change his past yet it was all for nothing. It hits hard that even superheroes cannot save the ones they love.

  • @shadowyblackness
    @shadowyblackness Год назад +33

    I like some of the movies and shows from phases 4-5 as well, but I do feel like you've made the most compelling argument I've heard about the MCU in pandamic years. Finally, someone who can answer the question without blaming superhero fatigue, franchise fatigue, or, god forbid, wokeness!😑

    • @KozyKoti
      @KozyKoti Год назад +2

      Most movies have been shit storywise.

  • @joelsbowlsarejoelsgoals9636
    @joelsbowlsarejoelsgoals9636 Год назад +6

    I like how in GotG Gamora doesn't have the memories as the Gamora that Peter knew and that made it mean something to lose her. The story between them in GotG 3 was really well done. That was a good ass movie.

  • @schools6555
    @schools6555 Год назад +65

    Loki season two is fast approaching and I am absolutely pumped! The first season was so excellent I watched the whole season numerous times. I am hopeful season two will be as good as the first if not even better! Tom Hiddleston Loki has become my favorite Marvel character!

    • @Dan55888
      @Dan55888 Год назад +9

      Loki season 2 has my remaining faith in MCU

    • @BassLineProductionsI
      @BassLineProductionsI Год назад +3

      Second this!

    • @nogrecords
      @nogrecords Год назад +1

      Same here

    • @nicolasherrera8164
      @nicolasherrera8164 Год назад

      @@BassLineProductionsI😅😮😅😮😅😅😢😮u😅😅😅😅😢😅😅😅😅😅 7:42 😮😅i😅t😮😅pp😮😅😢w😮😢😮😅😮😮😅😊😮😅😅😮😢🎉😅😊😮😮e🎉😊🎉😮

    • @DontAsk-fc4ox
      @DontAsk-fc4ox Год назад +1

      Loki was mid at best.. you just to used to watching junk now

  • @scottking8189
    @scottking8189 Год назад +30

    I think people’s obsession with the concept of multiverses in real life is because of their want to believe that they did something different in another universe because they’re not happy with their life, it’s a way people can go well I wonder if in this other life I didn’t make that decision and I’d be rich now, making them constantly unhappy in their life

    • @TheFilmSpace1
      @TheFilmSpace1 Год назад

      💯

    • @feverpyretic
      @feverpyretic Год назад

      It's not always about the individual. The actions you take can have a profound effect on others. It isn't always about looking back in regret but imagining that if another version of a person did things differently, then they could have been better, and instead of thinking how you made mistakes, thinking about how they didn't.
      It isn't all about you (The individual)

  • @NorthernRealmJackal
    @NorthernRealmJackal 10 месяцев назад +1

    @10:39 The MCU multiverse is not "confusing as hell", it's simply just messy and inconsistent. For every new MCU film or show that mentions the multiverse, there's a new set of rules, a new visual language and new stakes. They literally took it as a get-out-of-jail-free card to do whatever, and now you never know what rules to apply with new MCU titles. Even Loki S2 wasn't exempt from making up shit as it went along. It's beyond frustrating imo.

  • @MyHusbandIsLame
    @MyHusbandIsLame Год назад +26

    Andrew Garfield's redemption moment makes me cry every time too. AND YOU PUT THAT CLIP IN HERE TWICE! The feels man.

    • @commandershepard9920
      @commandershepard9920 Год назад +2

      Ok fair point; I feel like that is one of the few exceptions that worked very well. I'm not even particularly a fan of the Garfield films, but in the second film, when Peter grieves and stands by the tombstone while time goes by; just typing this I'm feeling it, good Lord what a scene.
      So him going full circle and saving MJ in the multiverse, and when she says, "Are you ok?" - agreed, the feels, the pure feels.

    • @DirectorsChoice
      @DirectorsChoice Год назад +2

      It was a great way to resolve a character's story line and show character growth all in one movie that had maybe a 5th of screen time of the old Spider-Mans. And Tobey Maguire's Spider-Man stepping up into a real mentor role.

    • @mattfoley4128
      @mattfoley4128 Год назад +3

      That shiz was lame

  • @TheLowLandGardener
    @TheLowLandGardener 3 месяца назад +1

    I loved the pre multiverse mcu because the plots are simpler and fans used to speculate how it ends. Now everything is solved by multiverse plot. There is no real stake anymore.

  • @joeyskunk
    @joeyskunk Год назад +5

    A Christmas Carol is the first multiverse story since Scrooge visits his alternative future if he does not change.

    • @sgrey9181
      @sgrey9181 Год назад

      Somebody has been watching too many Chris and Jack sketches

  • @petertomshany
    @petertomshany Год назад +1

    The death of Vision and the grief it causes are the best writing in recent Marvel stories, imo.
    Wanda’s story effectively connects TV/streaming with the films, because it took its time developing over several projects, and it’s not even complete yet!
    In the medium jump (film to tv and back to film) it takes experimentalism in production/writing to make it work (Wandavision).
    By the way, the shot where Wanda breaks the 4th wall and looks at “us” is (at least close to) my favorite moment in the MCU. It includes “us” in the multiverse story and took the fricking genius of Sam Raimi to pull it off.
    Finally, any long form story that takes many writers to complete will vary in quality from chapter to chapter. This is fundamental to comics, particularly. If there was a “bad” issue of a comic, when I was collecting in the 80s, it didn’t matter. I never asked “is Marvel dying?”! No way. For us and our short attention spans to mire a creative project like the MCU with our hangups would be pointless.

  • @purple12334
    @purple12334 Год назад +4

    This was a great take on the multiverse films. Storytelling has to be compelling to be enjoyable and the concepts should be thoroughly fleshed out. And we should care about the characters while following their journeys.

  • @Gzilla313
    @Gzilla313 Год назад +2

    The problem isn't super hero movies, the problem is mid/bad super hero movies as a result of flooding the market. This year Spider-Verse, Guardians Vol 3, and TMNT: Mutant Mayhem have all been great.

    • @carlosatausupa8429
      @carlosatausupa8429 Год назад

      Across the Everything everywhere all at Spider-Verse.
      EEAO

  • @SingTingz31
    @SingTingz31 Год назад +4

    The What If Dr. Strange episode was so much better than what we got in MoM. It hit all the points of what you mentioned about what happens when you try to change the past and force a perfect reality.

  • @petefischer3820
    @petefischer3820 Год назад +1

    Dickens Christmas Carol explored alternate reality before It's A Wonderful Life. Scrooge got to see what would happen if he died before he reformed with Christmas Future.

  • @spinjitzumasterfalcon
    @spinjitzumasterfalcon Год назад +10

    Seeing the 2012 TMNT series made me smile a bit. 😅 A surprise to he sure, but a welcomed one.

  • @muscular-lr6er
    @muscular-lr6er Год назад +1

    There's never a simpler time. When we're adults it does get very hard. We shouldn't have to be living in the past all the time. It doesn't make us grow. Children don't have to worry about what's going on until they graduate from high school. Will always have these issues in our society.

  • @jarlaxle2421
    @jarlaxle2421 Год назад +12

    Yes it is. When you introduce time travel and a multiverse there is no reason to care about the characters and no reason to trust anything. Like Rick Sanchez said, nothing matters because there are infinite possibilities. If Spiderman dies we can just get another

  • @Ray-ko1lm
    @Ray-ko1lm Год назад +1

    I’m enjoying it and I’m sick of listening to people complain about it.

  • @_TheViewer_
    @_TheViewer_ Год назад +3

    15:21 that’s the surface-view/thought people have, but don’t understand that every individual universe got its thing going, it’s not pointless or meaningless, it just got multiple meanings/reasons all coexisting.

  • @bizzybrown8372
    @bizzybrown8372 Год назад +1

    You guys really should be patient with Marvel. You know when its all said and done its going to be fire!

  • @quinnsnextstep
    @quinnsnextstep Год назад +4

    Sliders was one of my favorites. Even if the writing/acting went off course. Fun concept.

  • @vn43twelve
    @vn43twelve Год назад +1

    Doug was unhinged in this video

  • @JoseGarcia-zr2hf
    @JoseGarcia-zr2hf Год назад +4

    I think the multi-verse is just starting it’s done right they can use it to tell so many stories. The options are endless. You can reboot or soft reboot with the multi-verse, keeping the infinity saga close to everyone’s heart while trying to sell another story if done, right

  • @ProdSun83
    @ProdSun83 Год назад

    Can we all just appreciate that He Who Remains had this ish running smooth! Thanks Sylvie!

  • @MusicLover-my6fo
    @MusicLover-my6fo Год назад +4

    Atonement being the theme of the multiverse saga does sound like a really grounded and relatable theme. Hopefully a writer brings this up to Kevin Feige when the WGA-SAG strikes end.

    • @hayestoph
      @hayestoph Год назад

      I think a writer just did.
      Ryan, hope you get an opportunity.

  • @ScottLaBlanc
    @ScottLaBlanc Год назад +2

    Excellent video, thank you all for putting in such great work!

  • @indecisivecouple9171
    @indecisivecouple9171 Год назад +5

    I mentioned this to my family and my sister asked - wouldn’t A Christmas Carol (released 8 years prior to IAWL) be the first Multiversal film? It uses the same themes of “What if” that IAWL does right?

    • @MFAniki6390
      @MFAniki6390 Год назад

      I don't know about that, since Scrooge is seeing past versions of his life, the present lives of Bob Cratchit and his family, and a possible future outcome of his life, rather than seeing other possible outcomes from the choices he made. It's about learning from the mistakes of his past and fearing his death. Also, he's a passive observer for most of his journey, only interacting with the spirits rather than the world around him so I don't think it would count as a multiverse movie. Though I wouldn't disagree if you claimed A Christmas Carol was a time travel story.

  • @ScreenCrush
    @ScreenCrush  Год назад +15

    Is the Multiverse Saga working?

  • @IsiahBradley
    @IsiahBradley Год назад +2

    THANKS for this, Doug and Ryan!!!! Some of your chyrons are wrong ("Adventures of Superman" TV show date, "Crisis on *Infinite Earths* " ), but I like the very accurate and interpretative things you've both said here! And a special thanks for remembering the greatness of the 1990s animated "Spider-Man" finale!!!

  • @vacapsfan
    @vacapsfan Год назад +3

    DC, I think, started the multiverse in the Comics to have multiple Earths to handle the length of time that had gone on, since the characters weren't aging. And it took them many issues to describe the story. I loved Earth-1, Earth-2 stories when I was younger. I loved the JSA and each had a Superman, Batman and several other characters. But it took them a good while to explain the Multiverse. The movies are trying to make you understand in 15 minutes (so to speak.) I agree, they need to tell better stories.

  • @TheReally4rob
    @TheReally4rob Год назад +2

    Instead of "It's a Wonderful Life." can we argue that the future visions for Scrooge in "Christmas Carol" were the first multiverse?

  • @CourtneyGlasper
    @CourtneyGlasper Год назад +5

    Ok hear me out (cause I LOVE this channel): but I think it would be super insightful if you guys made a video about what role social media reviewers like yourselves play in the "downfall of the MCU". There are so many instances where the pondering and theorizing over these movies leads to unrealistic expectations (mephisto or the fantasric 4 not being in wandavision for example) for regular moviegoing fans. I went back and watched multiverse of madness, and realized it's a perfectly fine movie ..but all the expectations around it at the time made it hard to ever feel satisfied. Anyway ..it's just a thought and I think this channel would be the only group I think could have that discussion properly and without bias.

    • @rabbitrabbit-13
      @rabbitrabbit-13 Год назад +2

      My friends and I use to do this to ourselves before access to the internet was widely available. People who allow themselves to get hyped up over someone else's made up speculations have no one to blame but themselves.

    • @theuniversalmind967
      @theuniversalmind967 Год назад +1

      Great point, would be a great video topic!

    • @thabomashale6728
      @thabomashale6728 Год назад +3

      You Basically read my mind with this bro
      The amount of theories before movies come is just hard to even catch up with on social media
      They get you excited you end up forgetting that the people making these theories are not the people Makin this movies so u end up thinking they are actually part of movie making and the movie will definitely be similar
      and when it doesn't you go back to social media you find a review that has the title "did marvel mess up ?"

    • @marshsundeen
      @marshsundeen Год назад +1

      That is 100% accurate. The expectations leave people dissatisfied.

    • @CourtneyGlasper
      @CourtneyGlasper Год назад

      Don't get me wrong, I love speculating and thinking about what could happen. But there has to be a better way for us all to not throw tantrums every time nova, Galactus, or dr. Doom don't show up in a film. I just wish there was more "wouldn't it be cool if?..." Talk as opposed to "GUESS who is DEFINITELY going to be in the next ____ movie..and here's proof!" Videos

  • @justinx3132
    @justinx3132 Год назад +2

    Man, I love your videos! thanks for the hard work all involved :)

  • @BaithNa
    @BaithNa Год назад +1

    The multiverse has always been a part of media but its more common now because the people that grew up with it are now creating media

  • @JS-uk7du
    @JS-uk7du Год назад +1

    The underdog line up saves the multiverse so there could have been a phase 4 and 5 that was good in other realities just not their own.

  • @Thonking
    @Thonking Год назад +1

    Multiversal concepts are inherently fine. The problem is a combination of rushed projects and sacrificing strong, standalone stories for the sake of a grander, interconnected cinematic universe. I'm not a fan of Avengers (2012) but phase 1 almost perfectly set it up with stingers and easter eggs.

  • @m1ss1ngnumb3r
    @m1ss1ngnumb3r Год назад +2

    Would’ve personally preferred if the Multiverse Saga incorporated the multiverse more aside from like just five main realities. Like imagine instead of the Mavel Zombies What If continuation we got a Marvel Zombies movie directed by Sam Raimi with Tobey, Snipes, and Hugh Jackman as the main trio? And then eventually all of these different movies taking place in different universes (including some of the main MCU variants) then collided when Battle World takes place in Secret Wars?

    • @E_o_D
      @E_o_D Год назад

      That’s sounds way more interesting. Kinda like “What if” but on a bigger scale. Make a couple movies taking place in different universes with different versions of characters we know or new characters we haven’t seen before but on different universes(the X-men and fantastic four come to mind), that could even help to simplify their origin stories without having to tie them to the main mcu continuity with the blip and all of that stuff. And then at the end of some of these movies, have the characters get transported to the main timeline (or battle world). Leaving the audience like “wow that character is now in the timeline we know, can’t wait to see how that unfolds”. Would’ve help to create expectations for future stuff, also to give the timeline we have been seeing a like break after endgame.

  • @F-Society-Mr.Robot-
    @F-Society-Mr.Robot- Год назад +1

    The timeline branched when they killed Harambe…that’s where it all went wrong

  • @gregorypontius251
    @gregorypontius251 Год назад +2

    I called this at the end of Endgame... The multiverse was going to be too complicated and too confusing for casual fans and will not be as successful as the Infinity Saga...

    • @gregorypontius251
      @gregorypontius251 Год назад

      True comic fans and "nerds" will like it, but casuals won't like it as much... Add the shotty story telling, and here we are...

    • @AloneInThePark
      @AloneInThePark 3 месяца назад

      It's not even confusing it's just inconsistent and completely fucks it. The only people that care about it are hardcore comic nerds. Most former MCU fans like myself don't care.

  • @bizzybrown8372
    @bizzybrown8372 Год назад +1

    Marvel is laying out the rules and mechanics in many of their projects that create stakes and challenges for the multiverse . They already made clear multiverse hopping can drastically alter timelines and create incursions. Those are the stakes.

  • @mon_nobi
    @mon_nobi Год назад +1

    To date, the best standalone multiverse story that the MCU has told so far has been episode 4 of What If, the Dr. Strange loses his heart episode. In my opinion it is still the best project in the MCU that makes effective use of its runtime to tell a personal character based story with a scope that affects the multiverse, expands on ideas of how the multiverse works (absolute points in time), and comes back to tie into other storylines (his return for the Infinite Ultron arc). Loki hits all three too, personal character story, expands on the multiverse via variants, apocalypse theory, & Kang, and ties into other stories via Kang, but I don’t think it made as effective use of its runtime as the Dr. Strange episode of What If did. No other multiverse story in the MCU (not including Sony animated Spiderverse), was even close to hitting all three, and that includes No Way Home despite that being a fun movie.

  • @ElChris816
    @ElChris816 Год назад +1

    Ryan, this is THE BEST breakdown of how many of us feel about the current MCU. Hell, you brought up points that I didn't even know I had. Can someone send this to Marvel Entertainment.

  • @marcakins3373
    @marcakins3373 Год назад +1

    I really enjoy your videos and the points you make keep up the good work

  • @Hoosier765
    @Hoosier765 Год назад +1

    The mental gymnastics Ryan displays daily to make sense of this crap that Disney writes is commendable.

  • @samchambers-de3tj
    @samchambers-de3tj Год назад +1

    I'd be happy with a Marvel/DC crossover with Henry Cavill as Superman 😅

  • @ritonix
    @ritonix Год назад +1

    I think that the Multiverse will explode in phase six, it will be so great, every project will be focused to fix this mess. People thought that infinity war would be complicated, reuniting so many heroes seemed a crazy move and Marvel showed us how it was possible. I believe that they will be able to connect every reality in one big story, with many paths that will end in a satisfying conclussion.

  • @OriginalRyan
    @OriginalRyan Год назад +2

    It's exactly what you said, greedy executives trying to raise the stock. If writers & the entire team were given more time, we'd have better quality. Executives don't see it like that for fear of missing out on billions of potential dollars. Shows like "Dark"on Netflix did a really great job of time travel storytelling. Given the proper time to put out a quality product and chances are you'll actually make MORE money.

  • @alexz.8302
    @alexz.8302 Год назад

    Marvel's Multiverse was introduced when Marvel barely explored their time travel concept.

  • @johanandersson8646
    @johanandersson8646 Год назад

    This is the best video from you that I've seen! Great work!

  • @mathiaskolding3241
    @mathiaskolding3241 Год назад

    Videos like this are why I’m subscribed to your channel. Great work!!

  • @intelligenthuman3262
    @intelligenthuman3262 4 месяца назад +2

    I cant stand multiverse crap, I don’t want retellings or reimagined stories, i dont want characters like the X-Men, spider-man villains or the fantastic four just being characters that exist in a separate universe when they should all exist in the same universe like they did before the multiverse crap came into play. I also hate the idea of character variants and having an infinite number of them, it creates ZERO stakes and makes their death meaningless plus when you kill a character and bring in a variant from another universe then its a different version of them with different memories so the emotional connection to the character is lost. The worst reason for me though is how like in spider-man the multiverse characters just went home at the end of the film making their existence meaningless and pointless and finally, if a story happens or takes place in a different universe, i could care less about it, the fact that the MCU used to all be connected and contained within one universe and all the stories and characters were connected is what made it interesting and worthy of investment, the multiverse ruins that.

  • @ERRexFut
    @ERRexFut Год назад

    Your content is unbelievably in touch and highly intelligent. I'm glad I stumbled on to your channel.

  • @andreajayavelu4813
    @andreajayavelu4813 Год назад

    Wow! What a great video. I really love this team’s ability to unpack these themes and to give such insight! Keep it up!

  • @hawsrulebegin7768
    @hawsrulebegin7768 Год назад

    A Very well written piece. Have to applaud the work that went into this and other videos you’ve done. There’s a depth to the work that isn’t often present in other similar channels. Thanks for the quality!

    • @drasvader1
      @drasvader1 Год назад

      Another fake comment 😂

  • @sketchtc
    @sketchtc Год назад

    The interest in throwing away making a good movie in favor of pushing a never ending episodic narrative is what’s killing the everything with the MCU. Just make good movies that could stand alone well; multiverse saga or not. The connected threads are supposed to be an added bonus to build excitement. If the movies don’t work on their own the connecting threads are only going to go so far.

  • @iloveentertainment
    @iloveentertainment Год назад +1

    Hang on Ryan. It seems like the MCU phases 4-5 have all been about the heroes grappling with their past and all that ending stuff you just said. So…there is a connective tissue? 🤔✌️Great video 👍Thanks

  • @drewsears2959
    @drewsears2959 Год назад

    Incredible use of the grand tour. Well done

  • @mattyboyb523
    @mattyboyb523 Год назад +1

    I think most if not all of these stories look great on paper. One of jobs of a great producer and director is to envision whether the story will continue to be great on film. With marvel getting as huge as it has with the MCU a I think it’s easy to loose track of what works and fits into a connected storyline and what doesn’t. WB and the DC people(excluding Nolan and Snyder) are just not good at this and was time for them to go.

  • @irishaarbear
    @irishaarbear Год назад +2

    The MCU should have gone with a full reset TBH

  • @meepinandmorpin
    @meepinandmorpin Год назад

    I'm not one for BetterHelp ads (or ads in general) but MAN it would've been a great sponsor for this video. When Doug says "prune it all, I don't wanna exist anymore" I was like "oh my god, here he goes, Ryan got me on this one..." but it WASN'T YOUR AD READ

  • @mistercard3599
    @mistercard3599 4 месяца назад +1

    No, the Multiverse is just stupid. When you have people saying we can use it to bring in characters that should already exist in the MCU, we’ve gone full stupid.

  • @probotprobert
    @probotprobert Год назад +1

    No stakes. Same with Skrulls- it’s an easy out

  • @jbell2288
    @jbell2288 Год назад +1

    The scripts have become increasingly worse. At this point, Werewolf By Night is the only segment of the Marvel universe I have genuine excitement over.
    I hope things course correct.

  • @TheSideShowLOUNGE
    @TheSideShowLOUNGE Год назад

    Keep making these! You are amazing!

  • @lordsxman
    @lordsxman Год назад

    Great video Ryan! You really hit at the core of what it means to be a human with regrets. This is probably my favorite video from you to date. 😢👍🏿

  • @manuprasadgopinath
    @manuprasadgopinath Год назад

    great video! thanks Ryan!

  • @Damnstargazers
    @Damnstargazers Год назад

    It’s time for Ryan to do a superhero landing and start writing these movies 👏

  • @CinemaGuyTy
    @CinemaGuyTy Год назад

    This was a great video! I completely agree; the multiverse has to have a story. It can’t just be a host of cameos that lead to nothing. The tough task for Marvel and DC, and whoever wants to be multiverse storytelling, is making the audience care. Especially with Marvel; the MCU is HUGE. Personally, I don’t care about any of the multiversal threats because I’m not rooting for any of the characters yet. How can audiences in characters that don’t mean anything to them?

  • @JustinStarrPhotography
    @JustinStarrPhotography Год назад

    In my opinion, I feel like the recent multiverse movies have not felt particularly focused because to some degree they’re all telling the same story - “an introduction to the multiverse” - but we don’t know need that. Loki did a masterful job of introducing us to the multiverse and setting up the coming stakes of a new Big Bad. The three multiverse films (No Way Home, Multiverse of Madness, Quantumania) all just feel like they’re treading movie instead of moving forward. It just feels like everything has stalled since Loki.

  • @WL.Mixxxx
    @WL.Mixxxx Год назад

    Bro, your charisma & Doug made this my favorite channel

  • @russrichardson991
    @russrichardson991 Год назад

    Thank you Colton Ogburn & Ryan

  • @mrsealmayr
    @mrsealmayr Год назад

    Ryan, you and Doug slay me like dragon, every time! Thanks for another great video!! Character first!!!

  • @langdonplaster491
    @langdonplaster491 Год назад

    I thought that the Flash was an amazing movie. the end CGI (especially Helen Slater, and Christopher Reeve) was fairly weak, but I was floored by how good it was, and Michael Keaton was just an anchor that I could have watched for the entire runtime and never tired of it. Ezra Miller is a troubled individual, and I hope that he gets help. but I loved his portrayal of the Flash in the DCEU and am so sorry that their troubles in real life overshadowed what should have been an amazing film. I see why James Gunn loved the film, and why it was for him the perfect capstone for the Snyder-verse. I believe that when it is viewed without the lens of the failed DCEU, or the troubled star, it will one day be seen as a good story, and a good multiverse movie, that exists as a way to serve nostalgia, and service fans of The DC heroes both old and new.

    • @NorthernRealmJackal
      @NorthernRealmJackal 10 месяцев назад

      Yeah I guess compared to all the Zack Snyder films, at least The Flash was fun and silly. CGI cameos were cringe, of course, well.....

  • @MrCFH420
    @MrCFH420 Год назад +1

    People are getting spoiled and expect too much.

  • @zoemalcolm2897
    @zoemalcolm2897 Год назад +2

    I think it’s a two prong issue. The companies like multiverse series because you get to reuse characters, scenes, sets, etc… which makes for a cheaper way to create a variety of stories. Because of this, it is always a cheap shot. But - it can be saved if it is accompanied by great (not just good) storytelling that allows the multiverse to have stakes. So I’m annoyed because, it is cheap. But I loved No Way Home!! So, you’re right. Just make good stories… and maybe they don’t have to have a multiverse. They can just be good.

    • @marshsundeen
      @marshsundeen Год назад +1

      The Multi verse allows different actors to play the same role. It is an easy way to replace long time actors when they retire from the character.

  • @ryan.noakes
    @ryan.noakes Год назад

    Juxtaposing the moment Andrew Garfield comes through the portal with his redemption moment saving MJ was just a chef's kiss nailed it.
    If the studios will chill a bit and let the writers do their thing without excessive meddling, theyll likely make the insane money they want with these movies. Irony is always lost on bean counting suits.

  • @chaosmarklar
    @chaosmarklar Год назад +1

    Community had a multiverse too, the darkest timeline came up several times

  • @matthew-jy5jp
    @matthew-jy5jp Год назад +1

    It's channels like this and fans that have talked Marvel into producing content after content without any quality.

  • @jasonlscott1stmillionairem91
    @jasonlscott1stmillionairem91 Год назад +1

    I liked the show "Sliders" as well

  • @MrWynder777
    @MrWynder777 Год назад

    Loved this video. Great explanation

  • @MrLeche69
    @MrLeche69 Год назад +1

    My favorite multiverse movie definitely has to be the Jetsons meet the flintstones

  • @phoolishroc1849
    @phoolishroc1849 Год назад +1

    I feel like that has always been the argument, but ppl wanted to assume it was because our expectations weren’t met or some gender thing… just tell a good story, make it make sense within context to the story, and make sure that story is being shown and not told…oh and keep celebs out of politics

  • @fritzperpignand8176
    @fritzperpignand8176 Год назад

    Great video and very valid points. It’s nice to see different variants or cameos but that doesn’t make the movie. The underlying story and being able to relate to characters.
    The other thing is some characters are better off just being in team up movies instead of getting their own solo films. If everyone in a team up gets a solo film, fatigue will definitely happen. But doing some duos makes sense. Thor Ragnorak was a great example.

  • @johangarciafelix2344
    @johangarciafelix2344 Год назад +1

    I think the story telling that weird should be because of the writers trying to sabbotage the stories because they were giving hints about their writers strike.

    • @56redgreen
      @56redgreen Год назад

      If you read the current writing process and studios trying to be cheap with writers I can understand why the writing is so bad.

  • @megwilcox2878
    @megwilcox2878 Год назад

    Totally agree. Story has got to take centre stage. EEAAO worked because the multiverse was just a tool to provide what the story needed, and it worked great. A kaleidoscope of visual possibilities loses its novelty faster than Nebula being broken repeatedly and having to rebreak herself to bend back into shape. Just make it stop. I don't need the "science" to work. A lot of jargon is wasted on me, and the actors. Just accept that it's possible, choose a plausible mechanism to make use of it, and tell a good tale. I'll watch. As it is, Loki is the only multiverse I care about now. As you said, Ryan, every fictional tale is, in essence a step into the multiverse. Let's have interesting ones!

  • @srayj
    @srayj Год назад

    Interestingly, I just read the book The Midnight Library and in it they do exactly what you were describing. It’s about one woman who realizes her life‘s regrets, so she tries out different lives to see if she is happier and if those lives are better. But, the reason it works is because she is the main character. Every alternate choice is based around her, though it has far reaching consequences for the other people in her life as well, some choices making their lives seemingly better, but in other cases making their lives worse. I think that’s why it’s difficult to tell a multi-versal story with several different characters. A change to Wanda’s life may ruin Strange’s life, or a change to Peter’s life ruined May’s life, but the overall consequences have felt small, like it’s just that group who has been affected, rather than sweeping, like the fall of SHIELD or Thanos’s snap, which would make us all feel it so much more.

  • @adyashhad
    @adyashhad Год назад

    Brilliant video, Ryan

  • @studioseppuku9454
    @studioseppuku9454 Год назад

    The Multiverse is hitting a nerve because of the pandemic and the 'what if' lost futures we all had.
    I had a massive 2020 planned and it was all gone in like 2 months, some people lost their jobs, homes, relationships and loved ones.
    To a degree we all had future plans that were taken away and the longing of what could have been lingers.

  • @king_vision4085
    @king_vision4085 Год назад +1

    I think toxic internet trolls are killing it for all fan bases in all genres

  • @fxtnr4490
    @fxtnr4490 Год назад

    i think what made marvel movies so good, is that they were stories about people, who happened to be superheroes, now i think it’s just superheroes with no focus on character