Solar panel sealing test and lighting experiment.
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- Опубликовано: 10 сен 2024
- This is one of my favourite solar lights because it has quite a good quality of construction and is very serviceable. In this video I'm experimenting with a way to seal solar panels with silicone rubber to test how it applies and how it affects the efficiency of the panel in sunlight.
This is also a test of a large LED COB array being used as a source of 360 degree camera lighting. I drilled a hole in the middle of the panel with a stepped cone cutter, deliberately obliterating four LEDs in the process, and then exposed and bridged the copper tracks to give continuity to the other LEDs in that row. The COB is mounted on a shelf as a camera ledge and the camera looks through the hole.
The main issues so far are that the camera needs to be directly on the panel to give a clear view through the hole, and it gets quite hot when used at a good enough intensity for filming.
The wash of light is OK for matt objects, but causes significant reflections with shiny objects, particularly flat ones.
If you enjoy these videos you can help support the channel with a dollar for coffee, cookies and random gadgets for disassembly at:-
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I was a electrician for about 15 years, my dad was a electrician for 45 years and 1 thing I noticed and I asked my dad if he had seen tje same thing. Every electrical encloser my dad and I had seen always had moisture in it. I live and my dad did till his retirement in South Florida. He had a theory that since the humidity here rarely drops below 80%, that at night when the enclosure cooled the humid air would condensate inside the encloser and/or if it it had conduit attached you would get air movement because differences in temperature from one end of the run to the other. His practice, which I copied was to always put a weep hole in the bottom and keep your wire nuts up so they didn't fill with water like a cup. You would also get water in the conduit from a fitting somewhere in the run. On outside outlets or switches we would tear about a 1/4inch hole at the bottom of the gasket . I have gone back to a few places up to 10 years later and the enclosers that my dad or me installed had sometimes 95% less corrosion then others that were installed at the same location at the same time. Hope that helps and thank you Clive for all the videos, you have greatly increased my understanding of electronics.
That's been my experience too. Moisture will penetrate sealed enclosures via thermal expansion and contraction of the air. It's better to give it somewhere to drain out of and keep connections up high and well apart.
Hey thanks for the excellent information, it's little conversations like this that make all the difference.
Learning Electronics Cheaply now thats useable knowledge, thanks for that.
Learning Electronics Cheaply, going often into industrial environments, leaving a hole works until they use their high pressure or steam cleaners. We've had more than one thing go bang because of some holes that were never supposed to see water, suddenly received a jet of water under high pressure.
It's actually required in outdoor installation. There are marked holes that you need to punch out in every plug and switch for outdoor use in germany.
I prefer the old lighting setup. More texture visible on things. But that is a very neat solar light.
Hey Clive, hope your'e doing good. We all really appreciate what you do!
It'd be interesting to see you do a complete DIY solar light Clive.It'd be interesting .... good one we could make
You mentioned your new light. In the tech room of my computer repair center I use old laptop screens taken down to just the LCD and defuser on it mounted to the the bottom of the shelf just above the entire bench. They are all tied into a “bus” circuit of 12v running around the room with the old rocker power switches appropriated from old units to turn them on and if with. The power is from 12 volt batteries that get the their charge from a (can’t think of the name) which’s is tied to a battery charger and a solar panel. Works awesome and has cut my light bill down by about 20 to 40 a month just from that setup alone. Sorry for the ramble just thought I’d share! Thank you sir.
Great! The net is full of “folklore” about topics like what you can & can’t do with solar coating. Real information is freedom.
So I Just resealed a high-end solar light for my dad, for lighting up ole glory. It's Ben about a week now, working fantastic, I eliminated the on off switch the rubber and contacts had shit the bed. Letting moisture and rain water in. My dad was gonna toss in the Bin. Also its a setup that uses no photo cell. Just like the solar light you had reviewed a week or so ago.
Little trick on using acid type Silicone , when you want a real nice surface do same with putting it on , then while its still wet, get a fine misting spray bottle and mist the surface with lighter fluid , then spray your spreader same on edges that touch you will see a better results with being clear looking when it dry's ! Plummer's have used that for years for getting the perfect looking jobs when using silicone !
I've seen one guy do that (but I thought he was just using water) when I got a new shower enclosure and he was sealing it up. But I thought he was doing that to get the silicone smoothly into the join against the wall. After he wet it, he ran his finger along it. Later, I found that I could just use my finger when I replaced some caulk around tiles in the kitchen where they met the bench top. After I caulked the join, I just ran my finger along it and then wiped off any excess with a dry paper towel. Didn't use any spray.
The spray just makes all easy over all, when doing final finish look, also overall out come ! There is a happy medium on spray being used on finger or tool ! after using lighter fluid for years, it is, less work, less clean up >I rarely use any over counter silicone today for much I like over all for sealing water proof Loctite products ,Now my old dead brain is trying to learn form bigchive on all of what I should have learned years ago but didn't take the time to do ! at 70 its slow going trying to pick up even some of what he puts out ! but slowly getting some knowledge I hope !
FWIW - I've had great luck with "Flowable Silicone Sealer" in this situation. Even if the surfaces aren't even, the sealer does a great job of getting into all the books and crannies that a shallow pudding of water does not penetrate and it dries away quickly in the sun! 👍
recommend getting your mitts on a roll of EVA (ethylene-vinyl acetate), it's the daddy as far as solar encapsulants go. (and the same stuff the make Crocs shoes and hot melt glue from!)
Try an aquarium shop for the neutral silicone, they may only have it in small tubes.
Farnell, and Radio spares have it as well, assuming those companies still exist. Can sometimes be called 'potting compound' rather than silicone sealant.
I think acid cure is preferred for aquariums. Not sure why exactly, I've always presumed because the acidity etches the glass slightly and improves adhesion.
One of my mom's favorite solar lights recently quit working. It happened to be the only one that had an exposed solar panel. It was really rainy in June and July and I figure water seeped in around the edges of the solar panel. This one had a column of moving LED's that would move upwards in a tube with a plastic watering can on top. Since I don't live in the same city as she, I went and got another solar light of the same thing and will experiment with coating over the panel to try and seal out water and see if that works. The original only lasted a couple months.
It'd be interesting to see you do a complete DIY solar light Clive. I'd like to try my hand at building one myself one day as a fun little project
Your new lighting set up is superb. Those nasty black shadows have gone, as effectively you now have a big ring light. For me slightly over exposed - but a vast improvement.
Audio sounds better on this one! : ]
I just realized why audio is so important on your videos - your voice is so enjoyable to listen to!
Good video as usual. I did a nice analysis of cheap solar panel some time ago. Banking panels and charging a car battery.
I bought my mom some beautiful solar lights today at the dollar general. $3 each!
Beautiful extremely thick “crackled glass” gazing ball design! The balls are about the size of a baseball maybe a bit bigger… And the lights must weigh three pounds each because of so much Beautiful thick Glass! The Crackle glass is beautiful especially when lit. The solar panels are good quality and all glass with no epoxy or polymer on top that will go cloudy over time. I couldn’t believe the price! And the beautiful thick crackled glass and everything else is stainless! Only the inside bits are plastic
Home improvement store is a good place for silicone sealant. Here we have GE silicone I and II, I is acid type and you can definitely smell it curing, II is the other type and no acidic smell at all. Probably way cheaper than any specialized store too.
Thought you'd like the "high cri led" better?
Brilliant stuff as always, thanks! My Mom has lots of decorative solar lights in her yard that I'm always trying to fix... most of them are working ok (for now) but 2 of them often won't turn on after dark unless I literally smack the plastic housing, then they turn on and off and work fine for a few days! All the contacts and circuits seem to be fine... any idea why? Thanks for all the great videos, cheers!
I've been using clear duct tape on the solar panels and I started spraying the circuit boards with lacquer and none of them have failed in the last two years.
I think using the silicone under the clear duct tape would make a good combo.
Great video already waiting and looking forward to the update on how they faired in the weather 😀
Hi Clive, the lighting doesn't look right in this video. The huge LED COB array needs to be dimmed a LOT. It only needs to just fill the shadows on your bench a tiny bit. The colour's off, as well. Not a huge success, but you'll get there!
The colour looks fine to me, just a little over exposed. The problem is that the light is centred so it appears dimmer out along all the ends/edges. He should really use a copy stand set up with lights in all 4 corners for even illumination (although this will make the shadows look odd).
@bigclivedotcom Actually the regular vinegar based silicone is not a good idea for solar cells and PCBs since the acids can damage electronics. Also there're are different types of silicone for indoor and outdoor use; I think the indoor kind doesn't like cold weather and might get porous. Also In my own experience clear silicone exposed to sun gets cloudy over time...
UV does cloud it eventually, acid cure is nasty the dried silicone holds the acid in contact with the electronics eventually you are left with a green paste negative of your component leads. Very annoying.
He knows that and refers to the issue with acidity
@bigclivedotcom You should search for 705 silicone on aliexpress.
It is a clear, easy flowing coating silicone that comes in tubes. Used for coating straingauges and other electronics.
It has a "brother" the 704 silicone too that is same but comes in black and white. It's used for potting electronics.
Love the stuff.
Clive, look for 704 and 705 (silicone)adhesives on ebay, they are electronics grade, one is white and one is clear, both are also lower viscosity than average silicone sealant which is nice. they are under $2 for a 50ml tube which is great.
I prefer the warmer color of your previous lighting setup. This is less cozy. But maybe it will seem normal after a while.
Nice 👍
BC, I know this is a 3 v cell but I have some solar lights that use a 1.3v cell, so how does that drive a 3v LED? thanks in anticipation, cheers, Andy
The solar garden lights use a small inductor that looks like an oddly coloured resistor to boost the voltage up with a series of pulses. They can often drive several LEDs in series.
BC thanks, Andy
I have a few very nice solar lights, one of them stays on when its bright out side and doesn't shut off during the day, what would cause that issue? Id like to at least try and fix it.
Very nice video
The silicone may be UV resistant but you might have issue with the factory poly coating. It may well turn cloudy dispite being under the silicone. Might do a 6 month capacity comparison.
I'm wondering if the stuff you put to try to seal the solar panel costs more than just buying a new light when it dies naturally.
Hi Clive, nearly 12 months on. Have you checked up on this and the one done with the polythene sheet method to see how they're bearing up?
Maybe try a quick drying spray lacquer or varnish to seal the unit?
Could you use a clear polyester casting resin to seal the solar cell and top of the lamp?
you might try a rotatable polarized filter over the lens and the leds to see if that helps with the glare
Nice to know that silicone (well, the one you used) doesn't seem to filter out the required wavelengths for these little panels - be interesting to see what happens when the silicone has gone bit 'off' under the sun for a few months.... I have a larger PV panel with a ragged front face which is peeling - it's been in the sun for about, er, 30 years I think - so I might try out a silicone skin over it like this. Also, I have no experience of LiFePO4 cells at all - very interesting to hear what they 'do' :o)
LiFePO4 batteries are becoming real popular among electric bikes and e-scooters.
They can be charged over 3000 times and still poses 80% capacity. Compare that to the Li-Ion which is 1000 times.
Prices is still a bit higher. A $1200 Li-Poly battery pack will cost $1500 if you go the LiFePO4 route.
Assuming your charger is top notch, and not some shit Chinese work of art.
How about clear resin? Or would that get too hot during curing?
Clive, great video. To reduce the chance of overheating the resistor and circuit during higher voltage situations would it be possible and practical to allow the led to illuminate even during the daylight? Resulting in lower heat. I realize it would require a different circuit config.
Slowly turning into Trigger's brush :)
I still maintain that the resin-potted solar panels are crap. They rot after a few months in the Summer sun in Australia. The glass-based ones, however, are still OK after a few years.
You can repolish the surfaces, but I tend to agree - our variety of sunshine is very hard on epoxy coated cells. Best to replace any potted cells with glass faced ones (via the usual sources!)
Gary Rumain put the small resin panels inside a "pet" bottle ie coke or sim & that will protect the panel from uv, lasts for years
Gary Rumain Those resin coated panals do the same here in the UK, after a year or so outside, even industry grade ones used on solar powered road signs and bollards go cloudy after a few years. I've tried car polish on them, it works for a few weeks but they then turn completely white!
It's not just UV. I found some 50x50mm. square ones that sit on the top of metal posts on eBay. These were perfect for the posts that support my garden fences so I bought some. They fit perfectly. One day, after some overnight rain, I noticed there was some white residue on the surface of the resin. I thought it was some soot that remained after the rain drops had dried up. But I couldn't rub it off. I noticed it got worse and worse as it rained. Very odd.
It's not always easy to find the glass ones in the right size. Now, if I go to Bunnings and look, I'll only consider the ones with glass.
how do you record your videos? do you use tripod or other mount?
how do you make your Pcb boards and can a home guy do it . thanks for your time
Can these things be adapted to run off 18650 without blowing up the led etc?
Can you do a video on resistance, reactance and impedance? I'm really struggling to get my head around it.
I wonder if it would have been better to lay the silicone down first then put the panel down on top of it?
what about dissolving the raw silicone in xylene type paint thinners and spraying it on? Works for coating clothe and glass for multitouch screens.
I too like mixing silicone rubber with xylene. Xylene is a nice solvent to have on hand. I often make a watery mixture, and then pour it or dab it on. Being waterier it smooths out nicely, and dries thinner.
Wayne Sallee
Wayne@WayneSallee.com
I've seen results of people taking damaged large panels (cracked glass over the panels rather than damage to the cells) and having used silicone to seal them up, and in the sun the silicone seemed to peel up over time, so may not last too long compared to your usual polytunnel tape method...
neutral cued silicon is the only one to use as others will corrode over time
It should also be possible to use the same technique for potting that the lightweight camping folks use for "DIY SilNylon", where they dissolve SIlicone Caulk in Mineral Spirits or other suitable solvent then soak their nylon camping fly in that and let the solvent dissolve, to Silicone coat their camping fly - Only use a solvent that won't attack your electronics, and far less solvent, just enough to let the mixture seep through to pot it all?
gonna do this to my power bank for when i spill ale on it.
do you have an aquarium store or the like they have silicone that is acid free and works well with electric items
After 6 years, I wonder how it's holding up?
Interesting on the LiFePO4 charger. I'm guessing it shunts but maintains the cell at 3.65V ish? It has been shown that this will lower the longevity of the cells. They should be allowed to drop to resting voltage after achieving the chosen maximum charge voltage otherwise there is a risk of plating and capacity reduction.
AFIAA, all diy silicone sealant liberates acetic acid on curing. A good, but expensive source of the other type is a dental supply company. We use silicone materials a lot and for obvious reasons, do not use acetic acid producing ones. Ours are opaqie though. Regarding the lighting, I don't like it for the very reasons you mentioned.
Aquarium supply shops might be a source of neutral-cure silicone. It's used to seal fish-tanks.
Rob Fenwitch Used an aquarium one recently and it still released acetic acid, certainly smelled like it anyway. I think the main difference is it doesn't contain fungicide as it's poisonous to fish.
Perhaps I was lucky. Also it was in the mid/late 70's...
I can't work at why you many times says that glass solar panels fail, i got tons of cheap lights and they are killed by moisture in 2 weeks, but there are survivors that lived for more than a full year and i think i got only one situation where water damaged one and i had to replace the panel, more times i broke the thin wires soldered to the panel and couldn't get them back. Im testing now covering all the metal concats inside with hot glue and that's seems to fix my issue, but need to test for whole year to be sure.
Also, don't buy solar panels from ebay, most of them are more expensive than they should be and with fake ratings. you can get better value on aliexpress
You outta check out flexible solar panels. Its a neat concept, mounting solar panels on flex PCBs.
Which panels put more power outage the blue plastic multicrystaline ones or the amorphous glass ones I’d like to know for in the future when buying new one.
The blue ones put out much more current than the brown ones. But each has advantages.
bigclivedotcom what about in a shady position which one would you suggest.
Funny, I haven't had any fail this year. Must be the dry hot weather.
I feel like I saw this already, didn't you make video about the same subject before?
Didn't you do something similar in the past? I remember watching you smear silicone on a solar panel for an outdoor light before.
Yes I did. This video actually pre-dates that one, but I didn't want to put out two fairly similar videos together.
Ah, that's fair. How are the lights holding up? Have you had to replace anything in them or the whole unit itself?
Clive! What’s the difference between a common anode and common cathode RGB LED?
In a common anode LED all the LEDs will have their positive connected to one pin and when the other pins are made negative the LEDs will light.
In a common cathode LED it's the other way around with all the LEDs commoned to negative and then their other pins taken positive to make them light.
bigclivedotcom is there one that you prefer over the other? I’m trying to come up with some projects of my own, and purchase some of yours.
You could also use clear vinyl like they use on vehicle clear bras.
i believe that glass lens would be classified as a sort of fresnel lens.
It may be a condensation problem, so seal off the contacts too.
book cover plastic trasparent sheet . normaly use it to cover book not to break to pieces. Ask at any bookstore the will have it .it is waterproof as well
i like to use food wrap plastic to make a smooth surface on the silicone
BigCliveDotCom Why not a glass disk glued around the perimeter with silicone? That would “NEVER” leak.
Is it possible that you will go through that charging / light circuit in greater detail (with schematic) ?
It relies on the solar panel to limit the charge current to what it can actually put out. The bulk of the circuitry is under a plastic blob (COB) and it appears to be a shunt regulator and a voltage level sensor to turn on the LED when the solar panel stops putting out current at night.
Thx!
I believe you might correctly refer to the glass lense as a refractor. (At least, that's the term commonly used in street lighting.)
I told you so (for your previous video). you can easily buy electronics safe silicone on regular China channels(eBay, AliExpress)
Wonder how long the silicone will last, I've seen it perish after a few years out in the weather.
He can always cover it with his UV-resistant tape.
LiFePO4 is not such a good battery technology for outdoor use- if you get below freezing then you can fry the battery by trying to put much of any current into it. It's great for any reasonable outdoor non-freezing temperature though.
Clive, probably better to use clear CT1. Joe.
what about moisture damaging the cheap switches?
You can always desolder the switch and bridge the contacts.
For non acid silicone try craft shops but they are not cheap!
Water. The universal solvent...
I use clear epoxy and run that into the gap between the panel and case
Dip the whole light fixture i n silicon sealant and see if that will work
Epoxy Resin? You can polish this for a clear finish.
Next time use ACF-50 instead of hot snot, if you're looking to prevent corrosion.
That silicone sealant is hygroscopic so, not only does it exude acetic acid, it also absorbs moisture. An unfortunate combination if your aim is to *prevent* corrosion!
just glue a large pice of glass on top of the lamp.
or put the silicone BEFORE puting in the solar panels. silicone works best wen compressed between 2 things.
So you home now?
I think he uploaded it in advance and just flicked the private/public video mode
2:21 Couldn't you just hot glue it?
I just consumed some cannabis and thought of a video I'd like to see, reverse engineer a smartphone screen. How does a capacitive touch screen work?
maybe the word for the glass would be scatterer, IF that is a word :)
Clive, have you ever taken apart one of those small LED fake tea light candles which flicker in order to immitate the flickering of a candle? How is this done? I guess they have multiple LEDs for that? How many? All those questions - but maybe you have made a video about it and I just haven't found it yet? So if that is the case, I'd appreciate the correct search term to find it - and if it isn't, I hereby state my interest in how these things work, so if you can get your hands on them and tear one apart on camera for your viewers pleasure, I would strongly encourage you to do so! :)
Seegal Galguntijak The LED is a special type that emulates the flicker of a flame. Those things are just a button cell and a flickering LED. Look for them on eBay and have fun playing with them. Lots of cool things you can do with them.
Silicon doesn't stick to glass very good and will be peeling off in a couple of years.
I have exact panels from AliExpress and made a 3p2s with the cells, and only used a dab of epoxy on the contacts after soldering the wires, and exposed areas underneath.
The front is covered with epoxy as you can see. I just hope their epoxy doens't turn all yellow in a couple years under the Sun.
UV is a bitch.
Pish.
Don’t see the point in repairing these 99p £1.49
consider the case as a building block
Because A: You can, and B: Every bit of practice and experience helps. And C: It's a hobby, they don't make sense.
BIG T. It’s not a matter of economics, it’s because you can. Sometimes it is more fun to spend $2 to fix a $1 light.
There is always the environmental issues, better to only add the led and solar panel to landfill than the whole thing. Not that I see Clive as a tree hugger, Swampy type especially with the pollution created on his rotting fish eating parties. 😁
This are not the super cheap ones.
The last time i came this early, my girlfriend was really disappointed.....
Fortunately for her I popped around to do the job properly while you were away at work the next day.
Might try the clear spray flex seal or similar but different brand. I bought something similar from the white lighting brand. It's decent stuff and I paint for a living. It reminded me of the silicon coating they used on my trucks computer board.