Brilliant Stats my friend...for all those Kobe lovers, your generation needs something to dream about. Kobe's the nearest dream...but he's never gonna make you dream as big as when I watched MJ...
at 2:32 it says " 2 time finals mvp" so that means this was aired after he had only won 2 championships and after his 8th season in the league!!! Unbelievable when you think about what he did after that winning 4 more rings! Simply the best ever!!!!
I don't even consider MJ's comeback with the Wiz as a real comeback. That was just an encore, something fans could just enjoy and not really put expectations on. The guy was 39 yrs old for crying out loud. Whatever great performance he put on was a cherry on top of the icing.
hall of famers said these things about MJ before he had won 4 more championships, 2 more league mvps (lets be honest the only reason he didnt win it every year his entire career is because they wanted a change) and a ton of other accolades. He is simply, the best.
its easy to call him the best ever. How can you not call him this way? year after year he was winning everything, absolutely everything scoring tittles, mvps, steal leader, defensive player of the league etc etc. People dont realize how dominant he was. This clip should be at the beginning of every game just to remember god of b-ball
Thank you. You are right. There are too many brainwashed fans who are very ignorant of basketball history, yet, they want to argue against those who have knowledge. In one breath, Jordan fans say, "you can't compare eras/positions," but in another breath they call him the "greatest of all time." Isn't that contradictory? When one says that Jordan is the greatest of "all time," he/she is comparing Jordan to all players, at all positions, in all eras, but they are too stupid to realize that.
Keep preaching the facts. Jordan fans don't want to see them. Just by looking at what you've presented, I ask myself two questions: among all of the superstars listed, how come Jordan had the LEAST impact? If his impact was not as significant as the other greats mentioned, then how can he be the "greatest" player in NBA history? When Jordan left in 1993, his team did just fine without him. I have a question: how many of you expected the Bulls to win 50+ games WITHOUT Jordan? Liars!
Case in point... we used to manhandle all opponents in the Olympics. The games weren't even close, even back when we used to use college kids instead of pros we dominated. Then remember the original Dream Team? Total dominance. Now we have to fight like hell just to earn a medal, and many years don't. I think the Croatians, Yugoslavians and Greeks all beat us (and I may be leaving a few out) recently. Yes, the rest of the world has improved, but we have regressed at the same time.
Wow, I can't believe I see people in here suggesting that basketball was "weaker" during MJ's era than it is today. The exact opposite is true. The level of play was FAR superior back then than it is today. Kids were actually taught the fundamentals of the game back then. Now shoe deals and 15 minutes of fame on ESPN are more important than winning games and being a good teammate. Better athletes, but worse ballplayers.
I give Jordan far more credit then Russell is because Russell played in a league which through most of his career consisted of 9 NBA Teams only. Only during the latter end of the 60's did the teams go up to a whopping 12. Now that gives room for more stacked teams and the Celtics of the 60's were absolutely Stacked in contrast to all other teams, its not even close. Jordan won 6 Championships during the most defensive dominated era+his overall greater dominance puts him on another level.
Wilt does not have an argument either. He was alot of size and strengh in a league that did not have much of either one. Someone once said that the difference between Wilt and Michael was that wilt was a giant who dominated dwarfs but MJ was a dwarf who dominated giants. I think that was well put.
That is like if the League added a 4 point line and 15 years from now people will say so and so is better than Kobe because he was a better 4 point shooter. Mike slowly incorporated that shot into his game and became a good 3 point shooter.
ENOUGH! Enough of this Jordan and Kobe debate. Why can't we just sit back, watch, and enjoy the players we all admired. I'm a Jordan fan, but that doesn't mean I'm ignoring the fact that Kobe is the best player today and will be one of the greatest after he retires. Accomplishments, accolades, titles, or whatever should not be used in these debates because in the end, we all know that it all comes full circle; a debate that will never end. And now LeBron James is now being mentioned...
@mikenotnumber1 I don't know exactly what you mean here with this 80s talk, but the point is. Jordan is universally recognized as the best ever and a few disgruntled Junior pies are not going to change that anytime soon so sit and wait.
its not close...it was when he was winning his first 2 rings then it got to 3 then became mortal for a little while then after the 4th it was over. this guy is the bets player ever and really the best athlete ever. of all the great athletes he's the one people would want to watch
Silly logic. Bill Russell played in an era of about 8 teams. Jordan played with and against the greatest players and athletes in NBA historyr. Bill Russell played with individuals who dribbled the ball in front of them and wouldnt put the ball in there weak hand. Its just silliness to claim such a thing.
No Junmai, I wouldn't just dismiss Wilt. He was a very good Bball player, but I do stand by his numbers not likely being what they were had he played in a more recent time. His size and power advantage did cater to his huge numbers in those days, neither advantage of which Michael could resort to. There were times when Wilt himself seemed to resent Mike. You could see that during interviews.
"that he led the bulls to 6 nba championships in the 90s. i mean how many other guys have done that?" Bill Russell says hi. Pippen and Grant joined Jordan in 1987-88. Get your facts right.
Sorry, but take a look at the record books once and note the amount of times you see that mans name (some of the numbers are ludicrous). I don't think it's nearly as easy as you suggest to just dismiss him, though your words certainly have much merit (and is in fact why I consider MJ ahead of him). Plus I'm from the Philadelphia area. I admit I may be a tad biased. I've seen a lot of great ballers come out of here. The mans 100 pt. game in Hershey is still legendary around these parts.
Michael Jordan is the best ever hands dowm. No question about it. Jordan won 6 NBA championship with only only one good player by his side(pipen).People who say that he's not the best are blind and insane. Jordan is the best by far............................. Kobe won three rings having a giant like shack by this side. When Kobe wins 6 rings without Shack, he can be compared with Michael Jordan.
@shaqpopcorn34 James is a great player and does have potential to prove that he's one of the greatest. However, to say that he is on MJ's level is an over-statement. 1) He needs to win at least 1 ring to prove that he' the leader that could lead his team to win 2) He needs to retire once he wins a 3-Peat, then come back to win another 3-Peat, something that only MJ has accomplished in the history of this league. 3) Lebron needs to produce the global cultural impact which only MJ did as well.
Jordan wasn't the ONLY player who played a significant role in them winning 72 games. Apparently, you have forgotten about Dennis Rodman. Had he not joined the team, the Bulls would not have won 72 games, and their interior rebounding and defense would have been exposed just like they were in the 1994-95 season. The mere presence of Jordan never made the Bulls a contender. If you disagree, then how come they weren't contenders before Pippen?
But when considering what either man did with what they had, and the consecuences each had to face, this is a no brainer. Anyway, Philly, no doubt, is home to great bball players. But I am from NY, man, the best ever came out of the Chicago area.
And please, No props on bounds. He was taller and stronger than most everyone else at the time. All he had to do was raise his hands. He hardly left the ground for them. So no compliments on shit he should have clearly been able to do. ok?
"Why can't we just sit back, watch, and enjoy the players we all admired?" Because AS LONG as U have these ignorant & uninformed kobe homers who "try" & discredit anyone NOT named kobe, just to level the field for them to make a "favorable" comparison for him, you'll ALWAYS have TRUE fans of the sport, who respect the FACTS of the matter & will DEFEND the integrity of those legends from these idiots. Homers disrespect the game & it's legends, so TRUE fans show them the SAME disrespect..
Man, these were not teams that the bulls were going to face in the playoffs. To make a case out of this is bullshit. Some of the greatest players played on that era and these expansion teams did not make them disappear. And with regards to the 3point line, are you saying that league was weaker because the 3 point line was made closer to the basket? Is that it, cause I want to get that clear.
yeah, you're right on it. Suaved and other michael's haters don't know anything about basketball. Suaved and efjhsdjfasjf are two Utah fans who can't forgive michael for denying them two rings hahahahahha.
He is the only player in sports with possibly "The Great One" that I have seen where 99% of his peers from all different eras are saying he's the best. Just a common sense observation. West, Bob Cousy, Elgin, Magic, Bird all say the same thing MJ was the GOAT. Not even the Babe gets that type of support, or ALI(people will say Tyson etc.). Anyone with a decent knowledge and understanding of sports can see this. I know kids yell Kobe is best but guys who follow BBall know that's not very factual
Again, Wilt was bigger and stronger than most everyone else at the time. This is an indisputable fact so don't even argue it unless you really want to start looking stupid. Would he have averaged 50+ points in a season against a league comprised of Shaq, Mutombo, Ewing, Mourning, and all the other more recent big men, or grabbed as many rebounds, not likely. But thinking of what Mike would have done against those bunnies that made up Wilt's era, well, that just makes me leaugh.
kobe has been to 5 nba finals actually, 3 with shaq where they one the 3 championships. he came back again in the finals but that time they still had shaq, malone, and payton. but didnt win, that makes 4 and the recent 1 was against the celtics last yr so that makes 5. just giving out facts...
When you blow up like that and have to resort to personal attacks, it makes you look bad, not me. It shows that you know I'm getting the better of this exchange and you're getting desperate.
It always amazes me at how defenses just let Jordan do anything they want. Except Detroit! Then once Detroit actually defended Mike, the NBA changed the rules. Jordan's entire career was fixed by the people who really run "organized" sports.
Im not saying arguments against MJ being #1 cant be made It's just the weakest argument compared to all players in other sports MJ was the most:complete, athletic, clutch, stylish, trendsetting , iconic, idolized, defensive, offensive, competitive, gifted player. No other athlete had all these things in 1 PKG. I mean MJ even stepped the race lines IMO. Just look at how big BBall got with him there, and Nike, and the Bulls franchise. This is why what he did for 2 yrs with the Wizzards meant 0
teans and having the 3pt line BROUGHT IN so he could become a 3pth "threat" is how Jordan's Bulls dominated. The MAGIC and LARRY dominated the Eighties, and their teams did too, because their teams were infinitely better than any teams that Michael faced in the Finals (including the 1991 Lakers who had DIVAC as their starting C, NOT Kareem), so if you think that the talent level in the NBA Finals was even close to what the 1980s teams brought, then you are delusional. Even a Laker fan like me
But can't this very logic be applied to those who saw Jordan, but didn't see the likes of Oscar, Wilt, Baylor, Russell, Abdul-Jabbar? Fans from the 1990's claim that Jordan was better than the previous greats (even though they NEVER saw them play), so why is it a surprise when today's youngsters claim that the new players are better than Jordan? That's what Jordan fans get for placing him on an undeserved pedestal.
Larry Bird has also stated that Magic was the best he had ever seen. Magic Johnson has stated that Bird was the best he had seen, and that he feared no man but Larry Bird. Just because they say Jordan is the "best" doesn't make it so. It's an unsubstantiated claim that hasn't been proven by criteria that can withstand scrutiny. Popular opinion does not necessarily equal the truth.
It was fixed. His retirement was fixed, his comebacks were fixed. I mean there's a reason why people called him "money". He made money for the right people and he was nothing more than a product--he's merchandise. He's a pawn in a huge scheme to get guys like you and other fanatics to give billionaires their money. Wake up!
@ReformBarackObama Russell had Lebron's body? He was a 220 lb undersized CENTER. Lebron is 6 8 250 he could have played center in the 60's and handle the ball. God knows what kind of numbers Lebron or MJ in his prime would have put up in the 60's. Don't you think there was a reason players put up video game stats in the 60's? The competition and quality of players in the 60's was laughable...yes there were good players but as a whole the league was weak.
....and I DISAGREE with many who say he is the "best" because there is no proof to support it. Who said anything about scientific proof? Larry and Magic stated this in the 1980's when Jordan was statistically a better player than he was in the 1990's. The 1990's Bulls teams could only win when the league watered itself down, which explains why they couldn't hack it in the glorious 1980's.
What do you mean he came back and blew it? He came back and won 3 more championships. Even with the Wizards, that was a horrid team and he turned them into a playoff team single handedly. Any objective person would acknowledge that the Bulls probably would have won those two years if Jordan hadn't decided to pursue other goals. I hated the Bulls, and even I admit it. Wilt Chamberlain is the only other player that may have an argument about MJ being the best the game has ever seen.
@ReformBarackObama lol at bringing up 1961 stats like they have any relevance in todays game...today's NBA is miles beyond the semi-pro pony league ball they were playing in 1961.
Just think about the Showtime teams and the BOS teams of the Eighties. When they faced off in the Finals, you had Magic, Larry, Worth, Kareem, Parrish, MaHale, Wilkes, Dennis Johnson, Norm Nixon, etc, all STARTING. And that does not include the fact that Lakers could bring Cooper ff of the bench, who was not only DPOY but 6th Man of the Year; and the Celtics had Walton on the bench. The 80s competiton was better than any Michael faced in the Nineties...easily. BEST EVER?? No. Top 10, yes
And you all fail at reading comprehension. This video was made what, ten to twelve years ago?? You honestly think that NO PLAYER WILL EVER be better than Jordan?? Can you predict the future of the NBA?? Why not just pull the plug on the NBA and tell the players to go home?? Gimme a break folks. Jordan dominated a decade in which the league watered down the competition so badly that even by the 2000s, you basically only needed 2 elite players to win, whereas in the Eighties, you needed 4.
Let us also not forget that Jordan's 3pt shooting was PATHETIC UNTIL 1996 when the NBA BROUGHT IN the 3pt line so he could score more from the 3pt line. Kobe can do EVERYTHING Jordan could do offensively, period. Defensively, maybe a better player, but overall, WITHOUT A DOUBT??? Gimme a break. This was before Kobe and LeBron played. This was at Jordan's pinnacle, and there was NO WAY anyone who said he was not the greatest would've been allowed on the air. It was pure 80s propoganda.
and now we're creating another debate on who's the greatest. WHO CARES?! There's no such thing as "the greatest player" in a team sport. It's a TEAM SPORT. Jordan didn't dominate the 80s, the Lakers and the Celtics did. And he didn't dominate the 90s as well, the Bulls did. You're all sucked into the hype of debates created by ESPN, sports magazines, radio talk shows, etc. We all can agree on one thing, the NBA is the greatest thing to watch :)
Ok, feel like getting schooled today, son? in answer to your last post, Bill Russell has 11 titles, but his role was more defensive than offensive. He was never much of a scoring weapon so he was never as versatile as Mike. Besides, there weren't as many games played back then, as teams were way fewer. So I take Michael's six over his 11 anytime. Anyway, comparing Bill to Mike is a joke. It doesn't really merit discussion.
Third, Michael shitted on everybody, including big men, not just the people on his position. and did it through agility and quickness cause he could not get away with just rasing a set of stinking no deodorant can save arms over shorties and just dunking. Four, say whatever the fuck you want to say, your man would not have achieved as much had we played in later times, that is a universally recognized notion.
And you are showing your bias then, because Kobe has already been to 5 NBA Finals before he was 30, and won 3 titles. Does that mean that he is better than Jordan? In your estimation, it does, because Kobe has been better, by your definition, than Jordan has. People talk about Jordan dominating and they NEVER EVER mention the Eighties. Why? Because he NEVER did. He never made his mark til after the Lakers, Pistons, Sixers and Celtics got old. Period. Dominating a decade with 2 expansion
Wilt? Please! He never played outside of 4 feet from the basket. Couldn't buy a freethrow if his whole heritage depended on it, only has two championships, with only one finals MVP, did not average as many points as Mike, with all that size and power was named to the all defensive team only two times, to Michael's 9. Outside of averaging 50 points and about 20 bounds on one season and once scoring a 100, what's your argument? Care to try again?
Wait for what? MJ played ~900 games when ending with the Bulls. Kobe will be at 900 games in 2 more seasons. You think he'll have 10 scoring titles by then? How about 6 rings? 5 NBA MVP's? Defensive Player of the Year? 6 Finals MVP's? Highest career scoring average? 1st team all defense 9 times? All NBA 1st team 10 times? Lead league in stls 3 times? 100 blks/200 stls in a season - twice (only guard to ever do it too). 3 All Star MVP's - maybe. Kobe's good -no hating- but he's no MJ.
@mikenotnumber1 Well, many of us do not subscribe to your view. We could be here arguing for days but I can see that has already been done. We can argue stats but you're gong to spin yours. Listen, you have a right to your belief. No one will ever deny you of that but on the basketball world stage, as of now, Jordan is seen by most as the greatest and nothing you can say on your posts can change that. Public opinion does not favor you. Bottom line.
You're the one that can't be taken seriously here, not me. You're the one taking not only an unpopular position, but one hardly anybody else would agree on you with. I don't have to substantiate myself to you, it's to the contrary, and you're arguments are weak. The Rockets couldn't win a title until Jordan left, and were unable to win any more after he came back and won 3 more titles. That evidence is far more compelling than a few regular season conquests.
Also. You want to downplay Mike's 6 titles because he played alongside overrated ass Pippen but credit Jabbar for titles he won while playing with Magic? Stop using crack. Dude, whatever answers you come up with, see who the man is during the final two minutes of a game that counts. 6 rings, 6 finals MVPs.
@mikenotnumber1 Yes he is because as of now, most people on this planet believe that MJ is the greatest, not Wilt, regardless of how envious of Jordan he was, or Magic or Bird, or Robertson or any other past or present. MJ just felt sorry for old man Wilt but that's all. Homework? I'd leave that for junior pies. You may not want to admit that MJ is the goat, but I keep telling you, buba, you're in the minority. Face it and get on with your miserable life.
@magicjohnsonist : yeah not very impressive when you have like 8 HOFers helping you & there's only 8 team in the league that don't have as much talent probably like 2 or 3 HOFers on the other teams.
Junior, even on this blog you're in the minority. You dare suggest that Jordan is not looked upon as the greatest in basketball? Man, there are those who think of Jordan as the greatest sports icon of all time, let alone the best basketball player. I mean, this is where I start really wondering about you. Get off the crack and go back to school. Up against most fans, most players and most coaches. Just give it up, Barbie.
@mikenotnumber1 Russell scored too? hahahahahahahahahahahahahahah, Junior, you ought to go spot Wilt on benching 501 pounds. Sorry, I forgot he is dead. This is where you being young does not favor you. If you don't know that Russell was never an offensive weapon, in fact, Russell could not hit a freethrow if his mama's ass depende on it, then I just have to give up on you. Hate on MJ all you want, 6 rings 6 finals MVP, however. This is never going to get done again, son. Keep sobbing.
People need to stop saying Kobe is an amazing 3 point shooter when his 3p% is 34%. That's not "Good" in the NBA. Let's talk about FG% though. Jordan 49.7% career. Kobe hasn't even hit that mark in one season, let alone his career. And Kobe is a good player, this is not KOBEHATE this is just retarded that you even think he's better for no real reason :(
Come on, man! Expansionism? So you add two new teams that will suck at first. So what? I don't see how this automatically erases every other challenge you had league wise. Shorter 3 point lines, yeah, except it was the same for everybody, not just Jordan, so what's your point? Anyway, Discussing eras is pointless, but the bulls played under greater scrutiny than every other team before them or since, and Jordan had to perform under the watchful eye of the whole world. Consider that.
a true legend....his name will live on. a global icon.
that's what Lebron an Kobe fans today don't get, Jordan's game was flawless
MJ had HEART....period...That's why he is the greatest ever.
Brilliant Stats my friend...for all those Kobe lovers, your generation needs something to dream about. Kobe's the nearest dream...but he's never gonna make you dream as big as when I watched MJ...
Kobe will never, I repeat NEVER be near MJ's greatness. Greatness means the ability to surpass those of your time your past and the future
oh my, so emotive at the end...almost made me cry.
at 2:32 it says " 2 time finals mvp" so that means this was aired after he had only won 2 championships and after his 8th season in the league!!! Unbelievable when you think about what he did after that winning 4 more rings! Simply the best ever!!!!
the nba legend!!! MJ
magic is so right in the end!
yea !! he is really the best !! for good !!! i love him ^^
THE GREATEST EVER FOR EVER
dude he played in the 80's too. he dominated even then
Awesome video. Thanks. Some great commentary by Jerry West.
This was before he won 4 more championships according to the subtitles. And he was been regarded as the greatest already.
My left ear enjoyed this video.😆
It makes perfect sense... beginning of story
I don't even consider MJ's comeback with the Wiz as a real comeback. That was just an encore, something fans could just enjoy and not really put expectations on. The guy was 39 yrs old for crying out loud. Whatever great performance he put on was a cherry on top of the icing.
hall of famers said these things about MJ before he had won 4 more championships, 2 more league mvps (lets be honest the only reason he didnt win it every year his entire career is because they wanted a change) and a ton of other accolades. He is simply, the best.
jordan is the ONE OF ONE NONE BEFORE NONE TO COME
So many Hall of Famers will never speak of Kobe or LeBron like this.
Good stuff! I never saw this one before.
thanks for the upload and great clip!
its easy to call him the best ever. How can you not call him this way? year after year he was winning everything, absolutely everything scoring tittles, mvps, steal leader, defensive player of the league etc etc. People dont realize how dominant he was.
This clip should be at the beginning of every game just to remember god of b-ball
Thank you. You are right. There are too many brainwashed fans who are very ignorant of basketball history, yet, they want to argue against those who have knowledge.
In one breath, Jordan fans say, "you can't compare eras/positions," but in another breath they call him the "greatest of all time." Isn't that contradictory? When one says that Jordan is the greatest of "all time," he/she is comparing Jordan to all players, at all positions, in all eras, but they are too stupid to realize that.
Keep preaching the facts. Jordan fans don't want to see them.
Just by looking at what you've presented, I ask myself two questions: among all of the superstars listed, how come Jordan had the LEAST impact? If his impact was not as significant as the other greats mentioned, then how can he be the "greatest" player in NBA history?
When Jordan left in 1993, his team did just fine without him. I have a question: how many of you expected the Bulls to win 50+ games WITHOUT Jordan? Liars!
Case in point... we used to manhandle all opponents in the Olympics. The games weren't even close, even back when we used to use college kids instead of pros we dominated. Then remember the original Dream Team? Total dominance.
Now we have to fight like hell just to earn a medal, and many years don't. I think the Croatians, Yugoslavians and Greeks all beat us (and I may be leaving a few out) recently. Yes, the rest of the world has improved, but we have regressed at the same time.
And one more fact - with or without Pippen, Chicago made their titles when Jordan was in the team. SO Yea, JORDAN = BEST ATHLETE ever.
Wow, I can't believe I see people in here suggesting that basketball was "weaker" during MJ's era than it is today. The exact opposite is true. The level of play was FAR superior back then than it is today. Kids were actually taught the fundamentals of the game back then. Now shoe deals and 15 minutes of fame on ESPN are more important than winning games and being a good teammate. Better athletes, but worse ballplayers.
With all the things the folk in video said , add to them this: MICHAEL JORDAN IN HEBREW LITERALLY MEANS one like God who has descended. Okay, DONE!
Jerry 'I'm the frickin' logo for the NBA' West: Michael Jordan is..."Superman".
I give Jordan far more credit then Russell is because Russell played in a league which through most of his career consisted of 9 NBA Teams only. Only during the latter end of the 60's did the teams go up to a whopping 12.
Now that gives room for more stacked teams and the Celtics of the 60's were absolutely Stacked in contrast to all other teams, its not even close. Jordan won 6 Championships during the most defensive dominated era+his overall greater dominance puts him on another level.
Wilt does not have an argument either. He was alot of size and strengh in a league that did not have much of either one. Someone once said that the difference between Wilt and Michael was that wilt was a giant who dominated dwarfs but MJ was a dwarf who dominated giants. I think that was well put.
Uh oh....not those damn facts again!
Good post my dude.
mj is the best ever by far if u disagree you don't know basketball
That is like if the League added a 4 point line and 15 years from now people will say so and so is better than Kobe because he was a better 4 point shooter. Mike slowly incorporated that shot into his game and became a good 3 point shooter.
beacase there won't be another one,that's for sure...
ENOUGH! Enough of this Jordan and Kobe debate. Why can't we just sit back, watch, and enjoy the players we all admired. I'm a Jordan fan, but that doesn't mean I'm ignoring the fact that Kobe is the best player today and will be one of the greatest after he retires. Accomplishments, accolades, titles, or whatever should not be used in these debates because in the end, we all know that it all comes full circle; a debate that will never end. And now LeBron James is now being mentioned...
:45. magic is right. "there wont be another one, thats for sure"
don't forget he ran a 4 seconds flat in a 40 yard dash.
@mikenotnumber1
I don't know exactly what you mean here with this 80s talk, but the point is. Jordan is universally recognized as the best ever and a few disgruntled Junior pies are not going to change that anytime soon so sit and wait.
its not close...it was when he was winning his first 2 rings then it got to 3 then became mortal for a little while then after the 4th it was over.
this guy is the bets player ever and really the best athlete ever.
of all the great athletes he's the one people would want to watch
Silly logic. Bill Russell played in an era of about 8 teams. Jordan played with and against the greatest players and athletes in NBA historyr. Bill Russell played with individuals who dribbled the ball in front of them and wouldnt put the ball in there weak hand. Its just silliness to claim such a thing.
Just wait on Kobe...
No Junmai, I wouldn't just dismiss Wilt. He was a very good Bball player, but I do stand by his numbers not likely being what they were had he played in a more recent time. His size and power advantage did cater to his huge numbers in those days, neither advantage of which Michael could resort to. There were times when Wilt himself seemed to resent Mike. You could see that during interviews.
i think its that one guy the hornets drafted.
Hehe....Magic said set your VCR's....for all you kids that don't know what those are google them....like an old school TIVO.
"that he led the bulls to 6 nba championships in the 90s. i mean how many other guys have done that?"
Bill Russell says hi.
Pippen and Grant joined Jordan in 1987-88. Get your facts right.
Anyway, it is good to have exchanged words with someone here other than this, Mikenotnumberone" character. This guy is a headache.
Sorry, but take a look at the record books once and note the amount of times you see that mans name (some of the numbers are ludicrous). I don't think it's nearly as easy as you suggest to just dismiss him, though your words certainly have much merit (and is in fact why I consider MJ ahead of him).
Plus I'm from the Philadelphia area. I admit I may be a tad biased. I've seen a lot of great ballers come out of here. The mans 100 pt. game in Hershey is still legendary around these parts.
@geocgeo : (not a sarcastic reply)...thanks for the info
They lost WITHOUT MJ IN 1995. if Jordan hadn't retired for two years. The bulls would've won 8 straight.
Michael Jordan is the best ever hands dowm. No question about it. Jordan won 6 NBA championship with only only one good player by his side(pipen).People who say that he's not the best are blind and insane. Jordan is the best by far.............................
Kobe won three rings having a giant like shack by this side. When Kobe wins 6 rings without Shack, he can be compared with Michael Jordan.
@shaqpopcorn34 James is a great player and does have potential to prove that he's one of the greatest. However, to say that he is on MJ's level is an over-statement. 1) He needs to win at least 1 ring to prove that he' the leader that could lead his team to win 2) He needs to retire once he wins a 3-Peat, then come back to win another 3-Peat, something that only MJ has accomplished in the history of this league. 3) Lebron needs to produce the global cultural impact which only MJ did as well.
Jordan wasn't the ONLY player who played a significant role in them winning 72 games. Apparently, you have forgotten about Dennis Rodman. Had he not joined the team, the Bulls would not have won 72 games, and their interior rebounding and defense would have been exposed just like they were in the 1994-95 season.
The mere presence of Jordan never made the Bulls a contender. If you disagree, then how come they weren't contenders before Pippen?
And one more fact - Jordan came into the league and made from 27-55, to 38-44 and made PO after three-year pause. SO STFU, Jordan = BEST ATHLETE EVER.
But when considering what either man did with what they had, and the consecuences each had to face, this is a no brainer. Anyway, Philly, no doubt, is home to great bball players. But I am from NY, man, the best ever came out of the Chicago area.
And please, No props on bounds. He was taller and stronger than most everyone else at the time. All he had to do was raise his hands. He hardly left the ground for them. So no compliments on shit he should have clearly been able to do. ok?
Who's Next?
a m-m-m-m-man whose cup is never full lol
LOOK at 3:53 aint nobody in the NBA got this kind of heart NOBODY not KG,not Lebron, or Wade. Kobe is the only one who comes close.
"Why can't we just sit back, watch, and enjoy the players we all admired?"
Because AS LONG as U have these ignorant & uninformed kobe homers who "try" & discredit anyone NOT named kobe, just to level the field for them to make a "favorable" comparison for him, you'll ALWAYS have TRUE fans of the sport, who respect the FACTS of the matter & will DEFEND the integrity of those legends from these idiots.
Homers disrespect the game & it's legends, so TRUE fans show them the SAME disrespect..
iiitrey23 just embarassed the hell out of you Deadpool013. yeah i'll wait on Kobe, i ain't holding my breath tho.
Man, these were not teams that the bulls were going to face in the playoffs. To make a case out of this is bullshit. Some of the greatest players played on that era and these expansion teams did not make them disappear. And with regards to the 3point line, are you saying that league was weaker because the 3 point line was made closer to the basket? Is that it, cause I want to get that clear.
yeah, you're right on it. Suaved and other michael's haters don't know anything about basketball. Suaved and efjhsdjfasjf are two Utah fans who can't forgive michael for denying them two rings hahahahahha.
He is the only player in sports with possibly "The Great One" that I have seen where 99% of his peers from all different eras are saying he's the best. Just a common sense observation. West, Bob Cousy, Elgin, Magic, Bird all say the same thing MJ was the GOAT. Not even the Babe gets that type of support, or ALI(people will say Tyson etc.). Anyone with a decent knowledge and understanding of sports can see this. I know kids yell Kobe is best but guys who follow BBall know that's not very factual
Again, Wilt was bigger and stronger than most everyone else at the time. This is an indisputable fact so don't even argue it unless you really want to start looking stupid. Would he have averaged 50+ points in a season against a league comprised of Shaq, Mutombo, Ewing, Mourning, and all the other more recent big men, or grabbed as many rebounds, not likely. But thinking of what Mike would have done against those bunnies that made up Wilt's era, well, that just makes me leaugh.
kobe has been to 5 nba finals actually, 3 with shaq where they one the 3 championships. he came back again in the finals but that time they still had shaq, malone, and payton. but didnt win, that makes 4 and the recent 1 was against the celtics last yr so that makes 5. just giving out facts...
When you blow up like that and have to resort to personal attacks, it makes you look bad, not me. It shows that you know I'm getting the better of this exchange and you're getting desperate.
It always amazes me at how defenses just let Jordan do anything they want. Except Detroit! Then once Detroit actually defended Mike, the NBA changed the rules. Jordan's entire career was fixed by the people who really run "organized" sports.
Im not saying arguments against MJ being #1 cant be made It's just the weakest argument compared to all players in other sports MJ was the most:complete, athletic, clutch, stylish, trendsetting , iconic, idolized, defensive, offensive, competitive, gifted player. No other athlete had all these things in 1 PKG. I mean MJ even stepped the race lines IMO. Just look at how big BBall got with him there, and Nike, and the Bulls franchise. This is why what he did for 2 yrs with the Wizzards meant 0
teans and having the 3pt line BROUGHT IN so he could become a 3pth "threat" is how Jordan's Bulls dominated. The MAGIC and LARRY dominated the Eighties, and their teams did too, because their teams were infinitely better than any teams that Michael faced in the Finals (including the 1991 Lakers who had DIVAC as their starting C, NOT Kareem), so if you think that the talent level in the NBA Finals was even close to what the 1980s teams brought, then you are delusional. Even a Laker fan like me
But can't this very logic be applied to those who saw Jordan, but didn't see the likes of Oscar, Wilt, Baylor, Russell, Abdul-Jabbar?
Fans from the 1990's claim that Jordan was better than the previous greats (even though they NEVER saw them play), so why is it a surprise when today's youngsters claim that the new players are better than Jordan?
That's what Jordan fans get for placing him on an undeserved pedestal.
Don't worry they're trying to bring Michael Jordan's basketball skill down because they're probably Knicks Jazz or Cavs fans. I'd hate him too! lol
Larry Bird has also stated that Magic was the best he had ever seen. Magic Johnson has stated that Bird was the best he had seen, and that he feared no man but Larry Bird.
Just because they say Jordan is the "best" doesn't make it so. It's an unsubstantiated claim that hasn't been proven by criteria that can withstand scrutiny.
Popular opinion does not necessarily equal the truth.
It was fixed. His retirement was fixed, his comebacks were fixed. I mean there's a reason why people called him "money". He made money for the right people and he was nothing more than a product--he's merchandise. He's a pawn in a huge scheme to get guys like you and other fanatics to give billionaires their money. Wake up!
@ReformBarackObama Russell had Lebron's body? He was a 220 lb undersized CENTER. Lebron is 6 8 250 he could have played center in the 60's and handle the ball. God knows what kind of numbers Lebron or MJ in his prime would have put up in the 60's. Don't you think there was a reason players put up video game stats in the 60's? The competition and quality of players in the 60's was laughable...yes there were good players but as a whole the league was weak.
....and I DISAGREE with many who say he is the "best" because there is no proof to support it. Who said anything about scientific proof?
Larry and Magic stated this in the 1980's when Jordan was statistically a better player than he was in the 1990's. The 1990's Bulls teams could only win when the league watered itself down, which explains why they couldn't hack it in the glorious 1980's.
What do you mean he came back and blew it? He came back and won 3 more championships. Even with the Wizards, that was a horrid team and he turned them into a playoff team single handedly. Any objective person would acknowledge that the Bulls probably would have won those two years if Jordan hadn't decided to pursue other goals. I hated the Bulls, and even I admit it.
Wilt Chamberlain is the only other player that may have an argument about MJ being the best the game has ever seen.
Just trying to accentuate how separated from reality you seem to be, bro. That's all
@ReformBarackObama lol at bringing up 1961 stats like they have any relevance in todays game...today's NBA is miles beyond the semi-pro pony league ball they were playing in 1961.
Just think about the Showtime teams and the BOS teams of the Eighties. When they faced off in the Finals, you had Magic, Larry, Worth, Kareem, Parrish, MaHale, Wilkes, Dennis Johnson, Norm Nixon, etc, all STARTING. And that does not include the fact that Lakers could bring Cooper ff of the bench, who was not only DPOY but 6th Man of the Year; and the Celtics had Walton on the bench. The 80s competiton was better than any Michael faced in the Nineties...easily. BEST EVER?? No. Top 10, yes
And you all fail at reading comprehension. This video was made what, ten to twelve years ago?? You honestly think that NO PLAYER WILL EVER be better than Jordan?? Can you predict the future of the NBA?? Why not just pull the plug on the NBA and tell the players to go home?? Gimme a break folks. Jordan dominated a decade in which the league watered down the competition so badly that even by the 2000s, you basically only needed 2 elite players to win, whereas in the Eighties, you needed 4.
Let us also not forget that Jordan's 3pt shooting was PATHETIC UNTIL 1996 when the NBA BROUGHT IN the 3pt line so he could score more from the 3pt line. Kobe can do EVERYTHING Jordan could do offensively, period. Defensively, maybe a better player, but overall, WITHOUT A DOUBT??? Gimme a break. This was before Kobe and LeBron played. This was at Jordan's pinnacle, and there was NO WAY anyone who said he was not the greatest would've been allowed on the air. It was pure 80s propoganda.
and now we're creating another debate on who's the greatest. WHO CARES?! There's no such thing as "the greatest player" in a team sport. It's a TEAM SPORT. Jordan didn't dominate the 80s, the Lakers and the Celtics did. And he didn't dominate the 90s as well, the Bulls did. You're all sucked into the hype of debates created by ESPN, sports magazines, radio talk shows, etc. We all can agree on one thing, the NBA is the greatest thing to watch :)
Ok, feel like getting schooled today, son? in answer to your last post, Bill Russell has 11 titles, but his role was more defensive than offensive. He was never much of a scoring weapon so he was never as versatile as Mike. Besides, there weren't as many games played back then, as teams were way fewer. So I take Michael's six over his 11 anytime. Anyway, comparing Bill to Mike is a joke. It doesn't really merit discussion.
Third, Michael shitted on everybody, including big men, not just the people on his position. and did it through agility and quickness cause he could not get away with just rasing a set of stinking no deodorant can save arms over shorties and just dunking. Four, say whatever the fuck you want to say, your man would not have achieved as much had we played in later times, that is a universally recognized notion.
And you are showing your bias then, because Kobe has already been to 5 NBA Finals before he was 30, and won 3 titles. Does that mean that he is better than Jordan? In your estimation, it does, because Kobe has been better, by your definition, than Jordan has. People talk about Jordan dominating and they NEVER EVER mention the Eighties. Why? Because he NEVER did. He never made his mark til after the Lakers, Pistons, Sixers and Celtics got old. Period. Dominating a decade with 2 expansion
Mike could also get to the rim, so why bother shooting from 25ft away! haha
Wilt? Please! He never played outside of 4 feet from the basket. Couldn't buy a freethrow if his whole heritage depended on it, only has two championships, with only one finals MVP, did not average as many points as Mike, with all that size and power was named to the all defensive team only two times, to Michael's 9. Outside of averaging 50 points and about 20 bounds on one season and once scoring a 100, what's your argument? Care to try again?
Wait for what? MJ played ~900 games when ending with the Bulls. Kobe will be at 900 games in 2 more seasons. You think he'll have 10 scoring titles by then? How about 6 rings? 5 NBA MVP's? Defensive Player of the Year? 6 Finals MVP's? Highest career scoring average? 1st team all defense 9 times? All NBA 1st team 10 times? Lead league in stls 3 times? 100 blks/200 stls in a season - twice (only guard to ever do it too). 3 All Star MVP's - maybe. Kobe's good -no hating- but he's no MJ.
@mikenotnumber1
Well, many of us do not subscribe to your view. We could be here arguing for days but I can see that has already been done. We can argue stats but you're gong to spin yours. Listen, you have a right to your belief. No one will ever deny you of that but on the basketball world stage, as of now, Jordan is seen by most as the greatest and nothing you can say on your posts can change that. Public opinion does not favor you. Bottom line.
You're the one that can't be taken seriously here, not me. You're the one taking not only an unpopular position, but one hardly anybody else would agree on you with. I don't have to substantiate myself to you, it's to the contrary, and you're arguments are weak. The Rockets couldn't win a title until Jordan left, and were unable to win any more after he came back and won 3 more titles. That evidence is far more compelling than a few regular season conquests.
Also. You want to downplay Mike's 6 titles because he played alongside overrated ass Pippen but credit Jabbar for titles he won while playing with Magic? Stop using crack. Dude, whatever answers you come up with, see who the man is during the final two minutes of a game that counts. 6 rings, 6 finals MVPs.
@mikenotnumber1
Yes he is because as of now, most people on this planet believe that MJ is the greatest, not Wilt, regardless of how envious of Jordan he was, or Magic or Bird, or Robertson or any other past or present. MJ just felt sorry for old man Wilt but that's all. Homework? I'd leave that for junior pies. You may not want to admit that MJ is the goat, but I keep telling you, buba, you're in the minority. Face it and get on with your miserable life.
@magicjohnsonist : yeah not very impressive when you have like 8 HOFers helping you & there's only 8 team in the league that don't have as much talent probably like 2 or 3 HOFers on the other teams.
Junior, even on this blog you're in the minority. You dare suggest that Jordan is not looked upon as the greatest in basketball? Man, there are those who think of Jordan as the greatest sports icon of all time, let alone the best basketball player. I mean, this is where I start really wondering about you. Get off the crack and go back to school. Up against most fans, most players and most coaches. Just give it up, Barbie.
@mikenotnumber1
Russell scored too? hahahahahahahahahahahahahahah, Junior, you ought to go spot Wilt on benching 501 pounds. Sorry, I forgot he is dead. This is where you being young does not favor you. If you don't know that Russell was never an offensive weapon, in fact, Russell could not hit a freethrow if his mama's ass depende on it, then I just have to give up on you. Hate on MJ all you want, 6 rings 6 finals MVP, however. This is never going to get done again, son. Keep sobbing.
you better stop doing drugs
People need to stop saying Kobe is an amazing 3 point shooter when his 3p% is 34%. That's not "Good" in the NBA. Let's talk about FG% though. Jordan 49.7% career. Kobe hasn't even hit that mark in one season, let alone his career. And Kobe is a good player, this is not KOBEHATE this is just retarded that you even think he's better for no real reason :(
Come on, man! Expansionism? So you add two new teams that will suck at first. So what? I don't see how this automatically erases every other challenge you had league wise. Shorter 3 point lines, yeah, except it was the same for everybody, not just Jordan, so what's your point? Anyway, Discussing eras is pointless, but the bulls played under greater scrutiny than every other team before them or since, and Jordan had to perform under the watchful eye of the whole world. Consider that.