How to Identify and Escape a Spiritually Abusive Church Culture
HTML-код
- Опубликовано: 27 авг 2024
- Greg and Jill met with Pastor Steve Pierson and discussed a very relevant topic, spiritual abuse. You may be experiencing it without even recognizing it for what it is. Listening in on their discussion about Steve’s new book Spiritually Abused: How to Identify and Escape a Spiritually Abusive Church Culture, will provide good insight for yourself and for helping others. If you’ve ever been confused about the actions of a spiritual leader in your life, listening in could be eye-opening for you. You may have others in your life that have experienced spiritual abuse; this podcast will help you to learn how to help them. Steve’s book came out April 10 and is available here: www.amazon.com...
I am a widow who has been going through spiritual abuse for years, but I couldn't identify it until this summer. I didn't even know there was a name for it. I've heard of cults, but not spiritual abuse. God is so good to show me the cycle I was in and that I was making excuses for the abuse. This video helped my oldest son to see what I have been going through, because it is such a thick abusive culture, that we were apart of for over 10 years. Please pray for my kids and I and those that are staying, that they will see and be free. I can't even call the man a pastor because he has been so manipulative, bully like, shaming, harsh, falsely accusing, isolating people, controlling, not humble, not accountable, unrepentant, abusive, exploiting our weeknees of wanting a godly leader in our lives. He does not reflect a shepherd or Jesus, though he has done so many good things. This man needs prayer and humilty and the gift of repentance. He has sinned against God first. He needs our patient and kind Savior. It looks impossible, but God.
@christinefernandez559 thank you so much for your response. It is disheartening to hear your story, but also very encouraging to know that our interview with Pastor Steve was helpful to you. We will pray for your kids and the man who has sinned against you.
@christinefernandez559
Christine, thanks for the feedback! Since this podcast and the release of my book last April, I have received over 300 messages from all around the United States and from many different religious backgrounds telling some portion of their experience with religious abuse. It’s a human heart problem that losses sight of how important people are to the Lord. It’s particularly disturbing because this abuse of authority preys on the vulnerability of people seeking relationship with Jesus. Pastors are supposed to be the lowest of servants in the room. Their supposed to lay down their carnal desire for lordship over others in order to serve instead. They’re not supposed to lie to build their own reputation or manipulate in order to secure their own influence. I’m so sorry you had this experience! But please know that Jesus didn’t do this to you, a poor representative did. A flawed and possible self deceived man represented his own interests, not Gods! Don’t hold the whole of the church responsible for the neglect and abuse of one of its “parts.” Trust Jesus and diligently look for a church leadership that does the same! Blessings!
@2011makenna Thank you for responding!! I have your book. My dear sister, whose husband recently, and successfully, resigned from the "church board", whatever that is, she read it and gave it to me. They tried leaving 3 times in the last few years...they have also been going through the abuse, mostly the wife. Their daughter probably went through the worst, as the "pastor" protected her dangerously abusive husband. Anyway, about 1/3 of the steady part of that "church" has fled a couple of months ago. Some were abused, all were manipulated. We are going to those who had all of a sudden left over the years. They actually are opening up to us, which is a miracle, because they were so terrified to do so for so many years. I am so praying that the Body of Christ will be equipped to love, help, and protect the abused and vulnerable, rather than being unaware participants in an abuse culture. I'm so thankful you are a pastor. I have never been so ashamed to be a woman and portrayed that my voice is evil... When men are not gatekeepers, women, children, and the vulnerable get hurt, oppressed, and afflicted. Keep being a follower of Christ, He will never let you down. He will never leave you nor forsake you. He will give you, and His Body, His unfailing love and wisdom in each situation. You can trust Him. He has proven Himself faithful.
I am praying for an advocate for us over here. I live a block from the "pastor", a few blocks from the "church" and it's new building coming up, and 45 minutes from any other "healthy" "church". Pastors that have visited our church, and whom we know, will not respond to our cries for help. There isn't anyone holding this man accountable, besides God, of course. And He used to be a cop.
@@jilljohnson5789 Thank you! Thank you! Thank you!
@@christinefernandez559I know many people who have escaped your church. 🙏
Edit/correction: "escaped a church like the one you have described "
Thanks so much. I recently left the Jehovah’s Witnesses because of exactly almost everything that was mentioned. I lost my children, wife , house and friends for leaving. So many people leave become atheists. I’m drawing strength from our Lord now.
Blessings to you all.
Thanks for listening in and we're so glad you are seeking Jesus Christ for your strength.
I litterally had to block a fellow " brother" of mine from church who constantly harassed me with scriptures over text. During that time I had to focus on work and can't have my phone blowing up like that. He ignored the request ( multiple times) so I had to block him. It's almost like he was searching for me to be miserable about, and couldn't stand my success due to my hard work. Yes, I miss the bond church game me, and my pastor was a great guide for me but I am over the church drama. I live my life as an atheist and in no way does it mean I am angry at God and sinning all the time. The lord knows he is working in me, and I like going out and meeting people. I just don't preach, pray, and consume myself with the religion. Oh, as far as the guy I blocked he was convinced Satin got a hold of me.
You don’t have to live your life as an atheist because you left the church. You don’t have to be in a physical building to worship God.
Many who left these controlling churches lost children and spouses
We think you are correct!
When the enemy decieves leadership you need to listen carefully to God before you get in the flesh .Intercession for their restoration is a must .Along time ago a leader said he was hurt by a church and it changed how I view abusive people and don't let what they say and do to or about me have a negative affect . The best thing I can do is difuse a situation if at all possible . We have evangelists taking a role as pastor and they are not equipped to deal with delicate matter . Many are out of their calling calling themselves prophet or apostle when they aren't .
Wow this is so great just went through a situation and I’ve realized I can’t control others or tell others that are abusive that they are abusive but I can control myself and be an example through Christ like Christ by showing love.
I left the church due to the unkindness I have seen, being lied about by a pastor’s wife and being told it is my problem when I was having difficulties. My trust in the church is damaged.
Very true desciption of what happens in churches that have taken ownership of the people instead of recognising that Jesus is building HIS church. The people are not theirs but Christs. It takes courage in this type of church to walk away because you were part of a family and lots of hurt results for you and some of them. Reconciliation only comes when we genuinely own that things have happenned on both sides that need forgiveness and both parties are willing to confess and rebuild. Thank you Steve.
Thank you for sharing some of the dangers and the heartache associated with being part of a spiritually abusive culture within a “Christian” organizations. I don’t think this type of shepherding is the heart of God and it shows how important it is to be in the Word yourself so that you can rightly discern the Truth. I can’t wait to read the book. So glad that God has preserved your family and brought about restoration of relationships and continued reconciliation. He will be Magnified. May this story and the scars be a reminder of His mark upon your life. I pray that others who have been through a similar situation will have the strength and fortitude to withstand the pressure and manipulation / control and be able to conquer their fear of man. I pray for healing and restoration for each individual who has experienced this type of trial.
Thank you for your tenacity Steve in writing this book and doing the hard work and standing firm even though you will probably be attacked by certain people, trapped by the culture of lies, who are still blind to the truth. I pray for an extra measure of grace and protection over the ministries of both RH church and Standing Together.
We all have to continually reflect in our own contribution to the situation and the effects of our behavior. Lord please help us to remain in a teachable position. Thank you Holy Spirit for the work you are continually doing in our lives. May we be a pleasing aroma and a living sacrifice.
Thanks Sara! Blessings to you and your family for your stands for truth and heart for the body of Christ!
There used to be leaders in my church one of them was the pastor's wife. She kept insisting that I be friends with people that were abusive people that cause my PTSD to get way out of control.... She even went as far as to blame me for having PTSD.... Because it was all about the way that I reacted. Not the way other people were treating me.... It was like she just wouldn't let me move on from the concept of friendship and forgiveness... I also wound up being picked on while in Bible study..... Apparently being single is something I should be picked on for.... And they'll just sharpening your Christianity is what the old leader and the pastor's wife said.... I'm so glad they left! .. I don't think I'd be still here if it was left up to them
I was in a church years ago where the pastor's wife tried to get me to befriend two younger single women who had real problems, to the extent they were causing several people there a lot of stress, one of them in particular. I couldn't do it. I tried to explain to her how their behaviour made this v difficult for us, including married couples. But she wouldn't have it. Just said they didn't do it to her. When I pointed out this was because she was the pastor's wife she still wouldn't accept it. Eventually I left, for various good reasons. Now she's cool & distant towards me & I sincerely believe she has a prejudice against me. She's so distant towards some others too, & when I told her I had cancer she wasn't really interested. It bothers me that these people have such influence over congregations. She's so cold and uncaring. Best stay away from her.
@@susandumbill8805 iam soo glade those leaders left to charch to preach else where.... I hope you have found a new charch....
Controling churches dobt let anyone discern anything
Me and my husband work in soundbooth and we tried talking to our controlling pastor but he likes to do all the talking. He’s right, your wrong. He’s said during preaching one time that if you want to leave, go. He won’t drag you back. He tells people at end of every service that “he loves you and theres nothing you can do about it.” That’s funny because we didn’t feel loved. We left the church right after Christmas. We’ve been to that church 21 years. He’s only been there 3 years. We aren’t the only ones who left because of that pastor.
This is a sad story to hear. May God be with you as you find and connect with a new Christian community!
New Christians need to be taught coming into a fellowship.
#1. We welcome hard questions, and your point of view.
#2. We are striving to mirror servant leadership.
#3. Our leadership is not more important than you are.
This was an awesome Podcast.
i have listened to a few on Spiritual Abuse, but this one
was so clear and full of wisdom and practical ways to deal
with this type of abuse.
I am so grateful to the Holy Spirit for leading me to
this ministry, which I have just subscribed to.
God Bless
Excellent podcast. Thanks to Pastor Steve Pierson and his wisdom in this area. Well done!
Thanks for listening
Excellent teaching
Thank you so much. You all spoke the truth!
Been spiritual abused with Jesus with a relationship please keep the man who had the part of abuse. Healing from Him being abusive
Just the gas lighting alone by using the Bible is awful.. this is a great book. So glad you wrote it cuz we need to stop and be more discerning by reading the Word. What about when you volunteer and they use you your gifts and you doing it for the Lord and you getting up early and being at church all day and you think I'm doing good for the lord but they're taking advantage of you. That's another type of abuse
This is an excellent teaching! Spot on! Thank you guys!
My situation is unlike any other.
Mine as well.
I'm almost speechless listening to this. Soo on point!
Do you know what his email is? I couldn’t find it
I just went through this for a few years, only I didn't know there was such a thing as spiritual abuse, thank you for the knowledge, unfortunately I am still trapped by this church I left , I can't join my new church without my formers leaders letter of transfer. Need prayer
Thanks for listening. Prayers for you.
Maybe you could visit some other churches, where they don't require this? I've never heard of this, & it doesn't make sense, as sometimes people have to leave a church because of abusive leadership & are not going to give such a letter. You may need to travel a bit, but I really hope you find a suitable alternative. Somewhere healthy. Really do hope it all works out ❤️
You're free to go anywhere you want, especially a church! Never heard of a letter of transfer, just leave
Fear is a tool abusers of all stripes use. So is shame and guilt.
Thankful to have run across this today ... having just recently gone through a similar experience like the one Mr. Pierson described, hearing his testimony...and yours, has blessed me today and given me hope. I realize, no matter what, God is worthy of our worship. However, after dealing with the experience we had, I struggle with wanting to attend church at all. Watching this today was helpful.
Wow, this is incredible. Praise God.
Top equals inner circle
Wowwwww. Spot on
14:24: Yes!
Well actually as I was watching this video Greg was demonstrating abusive behavior too, that everyone ignored or didn’t comment. He didn’t give time for his wife to speak up and it was almost like she needed to fight to speak; he publicly called severs churches out by name which is not okay too because it’s his personal opinion; he invalidated feelings of the Steve by brushing over it and saying that it was all good at the end when pastor went through one of the most horrific times of his life full of losses on all levels. We all need desperately more knowledge on emotional intelligence 🙏
Thanks for the encouragement guys! God is using it to help many.
Our pleasure!
Such a good discussion---one I needed to hear today. THANKS
Glad you enjoyed it!
Brethren, this is amazing. By any chance, do you have a Spanish version of this episode? God bless.
This sounds like a woman escaping an abusive marriage.
It is! I've left the church, now in process of starting therapy to leave my husband. Same abuse, covert narcissism. Awful 😔
Hey there community, I need some advice. I’ve experienced spiritual and physical abuse at the hands of the lead pastor at my church, to the point where it became physical abuse tonight at my son’s basketball game.
He laid hands on my son, and when I approached him about it, he began getting physically aggressive with me, laying hands unwanted hands on me shoving me and yelling in front of the whole gym. The cameras in the gym did not have the angle to see it after the police said they investigated concluded that he never touched my son (my son insists that he did and he’s not lying and there are witnesses) . But they did conclude that he laid his hands on me. I escalated it to a corporal who made the conclusion. The initial investigating officer said he didn’t see any contact from the pastor with me or my son.
After I asked him about it, he started yelling and stated that he was busy coaching a game, so I offered to talk to him later about it, but he pursued me got in my face at that point. He was trying to goad me knowing I’m a trained Marine but I held restraint through the whole ordeal as he was coming at me. I know know that his immediate act of aggression and battery was an attempt to egg me on to throw a punch. Which I didn’t. But I need to talk to someone who’s been through this. I don’t know what to do. He’s the untouchable pastor of a church. I need to know what to do. I’ve been praying and listening for God. The police officer that did the investigation was very lazy in his investigation, didn’t ask any witnesses, and I’m sure the pastor and his minions did a great job of covering it up. I don’t want my kids having to go back to Public schooling, it’s terrible. I’m sorry for dumping on you, I don’t know what to do at this point.
Ryan, this is a tough deal. The easiest answer is to remove yourself from this pastor if at all possible. You certainly should not attend his church. If there are circumstances that require you to be around this pastor, then I would suggest seeking a mediator to engage him with you to see what could be done to deescalate the anger you feel he has. Pastor Steve and I both have been around abusive leadership in the church and the best thing is to remove yourself from their leadership and if possible related this information to any level of authority in the church (elder board, deacon, etc) and if it continues to be a problem than continue to alert the police.
I wouldn’t risk my child’s wellbeing for anything. I’m not being a jerk here but I fail to see the conundrum. What would it take for you to “know what to do?” How many more warnings and red flags have to show themselves?
Paul said fight a good foght. Fightr is good
Yes, but who's the enemy? It's not the saints!
Here is a subject that you did not cover. Men who abuse their wives are drawn to abusive churches, because the leader(s), enable the man to keep abusing his wife by shaming and blaming the woman. Control. The narcissist leadership doesn't want to lose the tithes and numbers of people. I was told this outright by the leadership, "we know that your husband is cheating and beating you, we can't address it because if it is known, we can lose tithes. Be a good girl and just submit to your husband more and then you husband will not have to hurt you. " I've talked to dozens of women who have the same story. Narcissist pastors abusing the flock.
AMEN! Thisis EXACTLY what I was told. Yes, some pastors and churches are enablers. I did divorce my narcissist husband and because of my experience I realized that narcissists are drawn to the ministry because they get attention and power. They wanted power over me.
What is even more sad is that I have seen women praised for staying married to abusive and adulterous husbands at the church I fled. The "pastor" called them "strong women".
So that grooms shame to leave abuse. Who knew that's what Christians are like?
And because I am no longer staying at that spiritually abusive church, I am considered "sensitive".
I'm a widow who was called up numerous times, often by myself, to my "pastor" and verbally and spiritually and mentally pummeled and falsley accused for years. I was just one of many. I'm sorry, if he just outright gave me a black eye, things might be more easily discerned, but I even doubt that. It's because it's not just a man, it's a spirit of abuse and deception.
There is so many documented cases showing how this Church operated and was toxic under toxic leadership. I will say I wasn't around for Steve but I witnessed the fall out as well as seen with my own experience.
God does Not dwell in Hand made temples and the Christ said let "no man" deceive you. 😮 Verse>> Acts 7:48. KJV
I’m a recovering Baptist
U dont have a mail to contact you abput abuse...the page gives contact for thise who wanna visit
God calls us but Minister are keeping us set in pews doing nothing
TNT Most leaders do not want to address this Topic instead they play Victim causing people like feel Condemned
Telling on me ministry is not gosdip. Jesids said prockaim it upon the house tops.
John the Baptist calked them vipers! Stay mad forever!
I served on the leadership team at the church Steve is referring to as “abusive” and saw what happened. Steve wanted to be sent out as a pastor but wasn’t mature enough and became resentful. After several attempts to lead young adults away to start a church on his own, he finally succeeded in splitting the church by starting a viscous rumor about the Pastor (that proved to be false). That church healed and is thriving, and I’ve since left to serve in another state. This “church abuse” campaign is Steve’s attempt to justify his split and gaslight more people to support him as a”victim”. It’s very sad, and I sincerely pray he comes to terms with it and repents.
I was one of the first and longest staff members of the church Matt L is referring to. I was the youth pastor, children's pastor, young adults pastor and eventually the associate pastor. I served with Steve for almost a decade, served alongside him and I can not only vouch for his character but I can confirm what Matt L is saying is not only not true but is purposefully misleading.
Steve never started any vicious rumors and never tried to pull young adults away and start another church. I was the young adult pastor at the time and can vouch that this is another blatant lie.
Matt L was not a leader when Steve was being "disciplined" by the senior pastor but I was. I was in every meeting and saw everything concerning Steve first hand. Matt became a "leader" of the church years after Steve had already left the church and a year after I left the church. The church was in the midst of a massive fall out due to the senior pastors abusive and toxic leadership been discovered and exposed. Matt L was brought on the leadership board as an advocate for the pastor at the time because no one on staff or any other elder or leader would vouch for the senior pastors character. All the staff and pastors and elders who remained, except Matt, ended up stepping down and resigning on the same day.
Comments like this show you WHY so many people are so afraid of standing up to abusive leadership because the gaslighting, lies and "smear" campaigns never end. Steve has not once publicly talked about the church and doesn't even name it in the book. Abusive churches and toxic leadership will do anything to hide the truth, silence the abused and to maintain their image and control.
This is my 2nd public comment about the abuse I experienced since leaving the church 7 years ago. I didn't even leave the church because of the abuse, I left because I felt called to be apart of another church but when did I was called a liar, in sin, hurtful, unfaithful, betrayed the senior pastor and had so many lies and a massive "smear campaign" against me. We had life long friends saying we were in sin and that they could no longer talk to us. It was so bizarre and confusing at the time. It was like you couldn't leave. It was only when I left that I could see things clearly.
Pastor Steve did not write the book to justify the "split and gaslight more people to support him as a 'victim'" as Matt implies. Most people know nothing about this church cause it is small and has very little influence in our area. He is writing the book because there are many churches with abusive and toxic leadership and he is wanting to help others find sanity and healing in the midst of the chaos and control.
I am SO thankful for Steve's courage in writing this book to help other discover what church abuse looks like, discover it, how to move forward in it and how to find healing and hope from it.
Proud of you Steve!! Grace, grace!!
@@SamuelPGonzales Sam, I don't know what happened with you, but I was present to witness the things I mentioned firsthand for several years, including as a board member before, during and after the split. I was in the room on May 7th, 2017 when Steve confessed to the board of Elders (with his wife present) that he received a call from a certain former Pastor (who coincidentally moved to Montana to be a part of another church) asking if he had "heard the rumor" about the Senior Pastor. Spreading it in various conversations from there, the rest became history... I was told Steve denies this confession happening now, but I was there with six witnesses (including his wife), and have it recorded. Again, I was present for all I mentioned and by God's Grace, served to help prevent the full destruction that the enemy wanted.
I was also present in the "Exchange" outreach leadership meeting where Steve (his wife present as witness here as well) confessed and tearfully repented for attempting to lead a group of young adults to secretly start a new church, thus kicking off his sabbatical.
I haven't been associated with that church for 3 years now, and have nothing to gain here, but the truth matters. I am crystal clear on what occurred, from the rumor that Steve started to the failed destruction of a local church in an area that needs it most. I was never told to unfriend or "not speak to those who left" or anything like that. In fact, Steve "unfriended" me after he left. I understand that you may believe what you're saying, Sam, but you have confirmed that you are capable of being spiritually deceived, and that is exactly what has happened. I am disappointed that even after all the marriage/family/friendship/mental destruction caused by his false rumor and subsequent church split, Steve has not found repentance yet. I will continue to trust the Lord only. He alone is sovereign and will not be mocked. What the enemy meant for evil, God will use for good. Steve's lies are being exposed and God will have the victory.
@@TheMattMan67
Here is a prime example of what spiritual abuse looks like. I wanted to unfold it line by line for the readers but RUclips doesn't allow a comment that long!! I hope this causes people to read Steve's book so they do not have to go through the hell and confusion we went through.
Here is a brief summary of what I wanted to write. ** Sam, I don't know what happened with you".
First Tactic: You are SHAMED for your position. Shame is a common tactic of abusive leaders.
** 2nd Tactic: Your facts, opinions and feelings are ignored and the only thing that matters is their truth, facts and opinions. AKA, “The truth”. Which is a narrative designed to do one thing, protect the leader and hide the abusive culture.
You will notice nothing I say or said is acknowledged or addressed even though I was one of the most celebrated and respected pastors there for 10 years.
** I was in the room on May 7th, 2017 when Steve confessed to the board of Elders" Third Tactic: A battle of “facts” and subtle and blatant gas lighting. You are BOMBARDED with other "facts", precise dates, quotes, and distortions of events that you were not present with to cause doubt and confusion to your own story and to distract you from the REAL stories, The abusive church culture.
Truth: In 2017 Steve already planted his church and I was gone for an entire year and this event was not a confession but an investigation from the interim pastor at that time. I talked to both Steve and his wife, and not only did they both deny these allegations as bold face lies, the better question is, if Steve confessed the way he did why did ALL the elders (except Matt), all the pastors and staff members all resign shortly after this event? Something smells fishy to me.
**” …he received a call from a certain former Pastor (who coincidentally moved to Montana to be a part of another church) asking if he had "heard the rumor" about the Senior Pastor." "
Fourth Tactic: Making the victims the villains and anyone who supports them. If you didn't catch it, the former pastor (who "coincidentally" moved to Montana) was me! For those who do not know me, my name is Samuel Gonzales and I was a campus pastor for Fresh Life Church for 4 years after I “coincidentally" moved to Montana. Lol. Nice to meet you! Suddenly anyone who stands up or goes against the abusive church culture becomes a villain and part of the problem. Not the abusive leader and toxic church culture. It’s EVERYONE else.
** Fifth Tactic: They keep you distracted from the real story. You will notice that Matt keeps going back to "rumor", other stories and keeps us distracted from the main story, the abusive culture in this case created and cultivated but he senior pastor. In this case there are “100s” of stories of abuse from this church including most of the pastor, elders and staff members and tons of old church members. Notice how the abuser is created to look like a victim, and the "narrative" is created to distract us from the real story, EVERYONE else's narrative of abuse.
** “but I was there with six witnesses (including his wife), and have it recorded"
Sixth Tactic: You against the mob. The abusive leader tries to make it sounds like you are the ONLY person who thinks this way and your perspective is wrong and everyone else is on his side. Usually this happens by isolating you and not allowing you to talk to the others because if you do you are divisive and in sin. This can only happen by isolating you and making it appear it is you against the mob.
Matt’s mistake is, I KNOW all these witnesses he refers to and I talked to Steve and his wife and they said he is lying about the facts of this event. I also talked to another former pastor who also said that Matt lied constantly in their board meetings when it came to protecting the senior pastor. Again all these "witnesses" stepped down and left the church because of abuse. But that fact will be constantly ignored.
** I was also present in the "Exchange" outreach leadership meeting where Steve (his wife present as witness here as well) confessed and tearfully repented for attempting to lead a group of young adults to secretly start a new church, thus kicking off his sabbatical."
Seventh Tactic: Subtle distortions mixed with bold face lies on old events you know little to nothing about. or what I like to call "What The Hell Are You Talking About?"
What in the world is the "Exchange"? Why is this date NOT mentioned? As one of the pastors of the church at this time why was I not informed of this event, this confession and of Steve's attempt to lead a group of young adults to secretly start a new church?
This specific event happened 10 years ago in 2013 and Steve was never accused of trying to start a church until after Steve left in 2015 and I don’t think even at that time he was accused of trying to "pull" the young adults away.
It is common that events are distorted and mixed with bold face lies to get your eyes off the abuser and to make the victims look like villains and cause doubt to the abused narratives.
** I was never told to unfriend or "not speak to those who left" or anything like that."
Eight Tactic: Hide the Truth
Was Matt never told to unfriend me or Steve? I don't know. What I do know is I was told that I could not associate with Steve cause he was in sin when he left the church, many people told me they could not talk to me cause I was in sin when I left the church and I heard the recording when the pastor told everyone in the church service that two pastors were in sin and held a private/public meeting after the service and told everyone we were in sin and that the Bible said not to associate with divisive people. This was very commonly taught in this church and is one of the signs of a cult.
** Ninth Tactic: Attack the Victims with more shame and invalidate their witness
"Sam, but you have confirmed that you are capable of being spiritually deceived, and that is exactly what has happened."
You are once again being gaslighted and that told that the only people seeing the situation clearly is the abusive leadership and toxic culture. And once again are shamed for your views, opinions and perspective.
** Last Tactic: The most dangerous one. If you are against the leadership, you are against God!!
"Steve has not found repentance yet. I will continue to trust the Lord only. He alone is sovereign and will not be mocked. What the enemy meant for evil, God will use for good. Steve's lies are being exposed and God will have the victory.
This is the most dangerous and abusive tactic. To make you feel that if you are against the leadership you are against GOD himself. This causes so much fear in a person that will paralyze them. Even though the abusive leader doesn't care how many people are hurt and they do not seem to have the "same" fear, giving the appearance of a fake self confidence, the abusive leadership knows that the best way to control people is with the FEAR OF GOD!
@@SamuelPGonzales Wow Sam, that took a lot of time and effort. Like I said, I don’t know what happened with your situation but my recap is clear and honest. Truth is not a tactic.
If your going to be to chicken to really call things what they really are. I definitely won't be listening long. You came in real cowardly.
Rubbish
The perfect church on Earth does not exist and you cannot make the perfect church. If you can prove me wrong and find this church DO NOT JOIN IT!!! If you do you will spoil it.
I'm so sick of reading this same comment over and over again - a copied statement, dismissive and so annoying. It's not original, you didn't think of it, it's doing the rounds and is not helpful in any way at all. It's like one of those comments, it could have been worse, we're all in a battle, on a journey, bla bla bla. Annoying. For me anyway 😂