1) Join my new FSA Education online community for adult survivors on SUBSTACK at familyscapegoathealing.substack.com/. Subscribe for free to receive my FSA-related articles or become a paid subscriber to access Community features where you can engage with other FSA adult survivors via Group Chats and Discussion Threads. 2) Purchase my introductory book on Family Scapegoating Abuse (Rejected, Shamed, and Blamed) via this Universal Buy Link, which includes links to Amazon: books2read.com/intro2fsa.
Thank you Dr M. I have your R/S/Blamed book & appreciate how well articulated the info is presented! Thank you thank you. HEAVEN awaits ur arrival & furthermore my she-Satan, Sadistically Catholic, fake Christian ""MOMSTER"" LIKELY DOES NOT! 👀✔️
I have experienced a deep longing despite my lack of knowledge and my own denials in all of this that has kept me going and trying and constantly learning. Though I personally do still struggle with the social isolation because we do all have limitations as humans. 💜😮💨😮💨
My dad taught me that I was a bad person so I fear letting people see that in me. I have social anxiety and keep my distance from everyone. I never got married bc I feared that closeness. I have 3 dogs who are my family. My dad took my life from me by projecting his negative qualities onto me. Totally disinherited by a successful attorney father who gave everything to my only sibling, an older golden brother. After my father passed my brother offered me nothing and he shuns me - absolutely no empathy and all greed. It’s been a nightmare but thanks to scientists like you Ms Mandeville I have a sense that it was not my fault like I used to believe. Thank you!
Glad my FSA offerings are helpful and hopefully are shedding a light onto some dark places. Linking you to my resource list in case you are seeking additional support: familyscapegoathealing.substack.com/p/resources
My mother is to me how your dad was to you everyone is her victim except her golden child the younger sister it does hurt it’s a pain that never goes away a deep yearning ache for love that by nature should be inborn into parents but it’s not always that way there are indeed freaks of nature that do exist. God bless you find solace in your animals and within yourself you are worth the love you surround yourself with. 🌻
That's so sad. I am sorry for that! I had a similare story as you, except I was given some of the inheritance. But only, because I fawned all my later life as I moved out.. They have kept me in the familysystem with covertly blackmailing me not giving me anything, if I don't visit enough. My sister lately as it come to the point to decide who takes the money and who the house, was jellouse that I got the money.. Very strange. She was 1 year angry with me, not talking. I couldn't take the house, because my parents not recommend me to take the house, because they predicted me, that I don't get along with my sister!! So we can't live so close. My sisters house is attached to my parent's. They manipulated me all my life. I can only see now. Before I was a complete victim and depending on their wellwishes Still suffering of low self-esteem and selfdoubt😢
You are so handsome. Please get married or a girlfriend. You are worth it. We deserve to find back to normal. But it's in our hands. I will get back what they took from me. I cut off my family it was so much pain but it gets better now.
As I have said in more than one video here, what the (dysfunctional / narcissistic) family system cannot understand and/or control, it will reject and at times eject.
Social isolation can be a nice respite too, especially for the fighters. Also a good way to connect with your own self when there's nobody else around. Just you and the dog.
By their examples of back stabbing betrayals we scapegoats don't trust anyone. Not even our own perceptions. Safer to isolate. I voluntarily isolated by door slamming my entire family. Highly recommended. Then you learn to self validate internally. I learned to embrace rejection after being in sales; when a salesman gets rejected he just says "NEXT!" and moves on to the next potential customer. #s game. Peace.
Being in a sales job years ago also helped me work through rejection sensitivity. And, of course, being on social media for several years, replete with trolls and hate comments, was the icing on the cake (!)
@@beyondfamilyscapegoatingabuse😂yeah I learnt to fight and insult back on the internet, pretty good because I was physically safe. Cant hate the trolls
The first time I sought professional help for my abuse was 25 years ago. It took tremendous amounts of courage to make the appointment with a therapist. So at my first visit, as I was telling her what I was struggling with and my experiences, she responded with “what do you want me to do? Get mad at them for you?” I said no, i want to learn how to deal with it because it’s ruining my life. She must have been having a bad day because she didn’t offer anything of value to the session and she acted like she was annoyed by anything I had to say. I never went back to therapy again and I’ve never been able to seek counseling since that day. There are a lot of people out there who shouldn’t be giving counseling. You and your videos are so spot on and I want to say thank you for being a light for so many of us.
You're very welcome and I am deeply sorry to hear of your experience. I remember during my grad school training a mentor who later became a friend said to me that it is a sacred responsibility, this work we do, because a client who does not feel heard or seen may not ever reach out for help again. Glad you're here. You might want to check out this resource list I put together for FSA survivors as well: familyscapegoathealing.substack.com/p/resources
I had a similar experience with a counselor from the Division of Family Services - TWR. Despite police photos of burns and his large fist -imprinted bruises punched on my back & sexual abuse, the woman yelled, "You're F--king with me." I don't even think she looked at the pics. It took a lot of courage to start sharing just a tiny bit of truth with that assigned person, who I was told was safe to talk to. How someone like her can work with children, or anyone, is frightening. Later I learned Abuser-dad had (unlawfully?) visited her office, prior to my scheduled visit, to do his flirt & schmooze, & tell her Lord only knows what. I gather they had an affair, bc she left a giddy msg on our home answering machine (she must have meant to call his cell phone) - thanking him for lunch, and how she was looking fwd to seeing him again. All that did is reinforce - Never. Trust. Anyone. Speaking made matters worse. They wonder why abused, raped girls don't report, when they are sent right back for more. I believe most abused children and young adults are intentionally isolated from extended family or neighbors, and have no clue about hotlines, potential resources, shelter, transportation, etc. Everything required money, and could lead to more harm. I always thought if I were rich, I'd build an underground escape, like Ms Tubman, that brought kids to safe houses with new ID. How to ensure the adults will safe and loving though.
I'm sorry that you had such a horrible experience. People like that shouldn't be allowed to work with people; especially in any kind of health care. Therapy can help so much with the right therapist, but they are are few and far..
I had a boss for 10 years who had similar behaviour to my mother. The only time she treated me respectfully was wen everyone else was on holiday. As soon as they returned her behaviour reverted back. In particular I remember her frequently withholding information from me that she had told others. I only realised many many years later what had been going on. I also love animals and have a cat who is everything to me.
I can relate I've been mistreated by so many bosses that I'm just like done. It's crazy to me that if we were dating people would tell you to stop dating if you keep meeting toxic people but when you keep ending up and toxic workplaces everyone keeps saying oh just get back out there LOL
Its appalling and NOBODY appears to care. I am a nurse with 30 +yrs experience. I had a nurse manager who was so abusive that 100 nurses left in 2 years....He fired many, including me , who were vocal about his behavior. A highlight was being called to the office and asked why I never cried when called to the office. I had no idea about narcissistic abuse at the time despite being the scapegoat in my family. I was fired for a violation that was a lie and I had to fight to get my name cleared ....the whole thing was a sequel to my childhood. It led me to therapy though where im learning and healing....super slowly.
51 years old and your research on FSA has me flabbergasted. On top of a narcissistic mother and brother (golden child) i tried to take my life at 16. While on the psych unit my counselor helped me start the emancipation process. I moved out at 16. My father promised that if i kept my grades up HE would send me to college. I graduated w honors in spite of the insanity that ensued. Unfortunately he died my sophomore year. Mother was cruel and hateful toward me at the funeral. At 19 i struck out on my own for the next 8 years training and showing Arabian horses. I isolated. Went no contact w family. No time for friends. 8 years of finding myself. Should never have resumed contact. 😢😣 I lost myself. Allowed self loathing to seep in. I am very damaged. Extremely untrusting. And fiercely independent. This leads to isolation. Deep down i NEED deep healing! I want healing! But fear gets in the way. What if i start this PTSD therapy and the counselor quits or moves midway through? This has happened. Now I'm even more untrusting. Question? I grew up Gen X. Does this play a part in neglect? Is my generation unique? It seemed like we all had lack of parental supervision to a degree. We grew up fast. So extremely grateful i did not have to stay inside that hell of a house. Free range parenting probably save my life. Horses academics and sports saved my life. I want to love life not to just merely survive it.
Very glad you're here - I'm a horse person, btw, and horses helped me heal quite a bit from complex trauma symptoms, although I did not know about C-PTSD at the time. They are so very grounding. I am not sure about the Gen X piece, I'd just be guessing and would need to look into it more. I did want to link you to my resource list and I encourage you to read my introductory book on FSA, Rejected, Shamed, and Blamed - This will help you to sort out some of your experiences and may also answer some of your questions: familyscapegoathealing.substack.com/p/resources
What effect do you think interacting with horses had on your healing? I ask because I’m embarking on Equine Assisted Therapy and I was wondering if there is something innately healing about a horse’s energy.
I'm a baby boomer, scapegoats have been around since time began. Horrible parents have been around since time began. I understand wanting answers. I found my "people" "tribe" "gang" however you want to describe it. They range in age from 46 to 90 years old each with narcissist families. You have to be careful acquiring your "people" I am very blessed. Also I am 68. Hope this helped you a little bit 😊
@Hislittlelamb I have seen astonishing things. I currently am a part time manager at a therapeutic horse riding stable. I LOVE IT! We do mostly physical disabilities but have a few that suffer mental ailments. IT gives great confidence as it should. The horses ARE your therapist. I'm so glad you have the opportunity!
I may have bonded with kittens and cats on the farm growing up before I bonded with people and I have always had one or more pets throughout my life. They have helped me get through when I had no clue about any of this. Right now my maltese and 2 cats are still my best friends.
The Christmas period is the worst! While others are planning family gatherings, I go to ground and switch devices off, to limit opportunities to create issues with me
I was always screamed at “To shut the f**k up!!” in my family whenever I tried to talk to any of them. This had a massive impact on my social skills and moving around a lot didn’t help either. I’m thinking now I’m schizoid personality disordered or at least have strong traits. I’m not attached to my family which of course they blame me for.
Guess being a toxically bullied everywhere, school, home, shrinks, work, as a genx, fight didn't work against the establishments, they all hit back harder, learned to feeze, and not to need anyone else to validate me... changing social circles, eliminating boundary violators helped me survive. Alone, but very rarely lonely. Hyper independence. How many of us end up in the bdsm lifestyle where hard limits are discussed and established with a community that polieces itself? I know the sexual abuse plays a huge part going that direction and my short swinging lifestyle. My fur babies helped me regrow my heart. Gone now, but not forgotten. Thank you Rebecca, you are a life changer. 🙏
As a child I experienced this time and time again. I always felt like an outsider particularly in group settings and every time a new cycle in my life began I failed to connect to the new group and this cycle has repeated my whole life. I never understood why before. But knowing what I do now, it makes perfect sense!! And yeah, low self esteem and not living up to my potential. I have/had imposter syndrome. I was hyper aware of being an outsider as a child.
Seems like this video really struck a chord. Can't remember if you have my resource list already but here it is, just in case: familyscapegoathealing.substack.com/p/resources
Dr Rebecca I got attacked yesterday by my sick brother because I told him that he couldn’t live in my home anymore!! It hurt me real bad!! He acted like the victim. I’m so tired!
My struggles were with the 'should' socialise cues that bombard us all the time. Once I gave myself permission to enjoy the safe space that being alone provides, I began to luxuriate in it and meet my true self! I now find that when I CHOOSE to go out, I enjoy it far more. I still do not officially socialise ( going shopping is socialising for me 😅) but have very dear friends at a distance ( online and in other parts of the country). These are such loving and honest connections, a joy. I relish my pets. I'm grateful for a happy marriage. I embrace my reclusive nature, aware I am just beginning to heal after 2 years almost no contact with my family members. Life is promising. Isolating can feel like a much needed holiday after a lifetime of stress. 🎉😊
Wonderful! I think I will also do a video on the joys of solitude as well. There is a difference between a choosing solitude versus feeling socially isolated, deprived of support, and profoundly alone and disconnected - which is what this article was geared toward.
I am living in a different world right now. For years, I isolated myself from everything. My daughter was angry to ne about it. She wanted to see me happy with other people. But I met so nasty people, that I gave up hope to have fun in life. For many reasons, however, my life changed. First: I took no contact with my mom, who is, to me, toxic. Suddenly, I see myself working in the place as a superior, I have plenty of connections and surprisingly, I am visible. I am heard. These people listen to me! I even have fun at work! This is very odd. I can tell, it happened threw hardships. I just decided that I do not settle for tiny things and I will not give up my power. Always believe, that there is something better waiting for you than than the Devil in your life tries to convince. It us up to you what you decide to think and accept.
Being the youngest of 4 sisters they always put me down and i never felt as good as them. I met up with 1 sister last week for a drink, she was holding my hand saying do you not love me you're my baby sister 8 half years older than me) and you know i felt numb, i feel nothing, the 3 of them at times have been so cruel to me over the decades that i really feel nothing for them any more. Of course they will say its me.
I feel your pain. Same in my family. I did not fully realize the full extent of who my siblings were and how they really felt about me, until I was going through something horrendous. That is when their true colors shone through. My mother warned me right before she died but I didn’t believe her. It is so hard waking up to knowing the people you have loved are out there actively destroying you and then either blaming you or spreading rumors that you never take responsibility for the bad things that happen in your life - when they are the very ones that caused it!
It sucks being the last born in a family of 4 yearning for a boy. I say this as that's my cousin, rejected and long gone to live elsewhere. I find my cousins are way friendlier than my siblings.
@streaming5332 I am 4th girl, and I have a younger brother. The sad thing is my parents died when he was 10 and me 17. My parents were OK with me it's my siblings.
I would really like to write about how messed up EVERYONE is in their responses to victims. I see the abusers as just a small part of the problem. IMO victims don't isolate - they are rejected... & not necessarily because of anything to do with their mistrust or behaviour. This is a materialistic world, everyone is looking to move upward and avoid what is poor, weak, wounded. So who are these people that want to listen to trauma stories? Really.. I have been quite an extrovert, popular etc.. however.. on sharing even a small bit of my past or trauma, it becomes blatantly obvious 99% of people have zero interest and those that do, just can't grasp it. The only people that really want to hear that stuff, are generally predators. After years believing I had 'trust problems' - I'm now pretty confident the real issue - is that most people have an 'inability to listen or be interested in real difficulty/pain' problems.. (This notion that I have 'trust issues' has gotten me in a lot of trouble, because I didn't realise it was true but in the opposite sense I'd understood. I trusted too much.)
It is my experience that both can be true. The FSA target is rejected - and then isolates. There are many powerful awarenesses in your comment here. The last line, especially. There is a line from the Tao Te Ching I am thinking of: "The Sage trusts the trustworthy and the untrustworthy alike..."
There are some genuine souls out there that care. Cautiously finding their limits, and ours, is the dance we do. Are they educated about extreme abuse? Do they have experiences similar to yours wherein they can identify and have empathy? There is another type - the predator you mentioned. At 72 yrs I have found I can recognize narcissists fairly easily. The ones I am speaking of just want to talk about themselves. They may have fairly similar experiences but they become vampires. A trait I am learning is to tread cautiously about revealing experiences. The stranger, or aquaintance, may back off until they feel we are safe. And we will certainly do the same if we sense tension from them. Our community may be online with fairly similar survivors for now. We have our animals who love us. I respect your concerns. Chao
@@Rwanda1952 I have asked myself how would I respond if the roles were switched? I've come to understand it's really just outside of most people's experience. As I've lived with it all my life, I couldn't grasp that. A man once told me 'You see depth where there is none' he said those people are just shallow, speaking about a particular group.I literally couldn't grasp what it meant, to be shallow. Likewise I couldn't grasp what it meant not to have pretty deep pain, or compassion for pain. While most people have been through challenges.. the crazy pain of deep trauma has no meaninging to them personally . The depth of emotion, the depth of pain, vulnerability and need.. it's truly shocking to the average person. After years of trauma therapy giving me a place to let some of that pain out safely.. I'm starting to experience what it's like to be in life without extreme pain. This is giving me a better general understanding of people. A lot of people are not bad, not extremely selfish.. It's like the average person can help you with a surface wound, clean it and put a band aid on it. But they will be useless if they find you after a car accident, it simply needs professionals..
@@annastone5624 Your assessment is spot on. Actions that the truly sadistic enjoy inflicting on the vulnerable are so disgusting that many are turned from being a support system. We bury many incidents ourselves! I was taken under the wing of a professional for decades. We often had to unravel the day to day struggles enhanced by poverty and the scapegoated personality. Touching or embracing the severely tramatic experiences with another (professional), who also endured cruelty, brought great advances. Even at this late date, when asking myself why I continue to berate myself, the hidden becomes revealed. Online professional sites expose the tactics abusers use. The bizarre becomes normalized and exposed. We know not all professionals are solid. When I see a person's eyes become wide-open I sigh and realize I've gone too far. Again. I really like what you said and can't add to your insight. So many struggle alone.
I treasure your wisdom, empathy, affirmation and practical help. Raised by malignant narc pop and covert mom (believe me he provided tons of camouflage for her to run her game). I’m 67 years old. I’ve been isolated for 20+ years and intermittently before that. Somehow I became old while I wasn’t looking. I don’t dare live in regret - too much. I realize that God has scriptures that say when your mother and father reject you- he takes you up as his own and that he redeems that years that have been stolen. I’m bold enough to press in for that, … in other news, you are lookin chic today.
Thank you! BTW, I'd love to see you over at my new Substack community for FSA adult survivors. There is a very lovely and supportive group forming over there. You can join for free or become a paid subscriber to utilize the community features like 'Chat'. Link here: familyscapegoathealing.substack.com/
I choose to isolate now, in my 60's. I just don't need anymore drama. I was on my own at 16. I was the skapegoat and it does effect a person throughout their life. Therapy is important and learning self-care. I never seemed to pick people who had my best interest at heart. I've learned a lot about the red flags to avoid. I was married to a narcissist for 20 years and he just switched into a different person. He went with someone else. Everything you say is right on target!
"Solitude is the furnace of transformation!" Indeed, there is a difference between embracing solitude and preferring it versus experiencing profound isolation and disconnection from others, deprived of social support.
Yes, wonderful people here. If you are seeking a more private community experience (paid) or want my newsletter with my FSA articles (free) you can subscribe to my new Substack site here - quite a few RUclips people over there from my channel here: familyscapegoathealing.substack.com/
@@beyondfamilyscapegoatingabuse I'm probably both. But I have never been officially diagnosed. Thank you for the work you are doing. It has helped me a great deal.
@@beyondfamilyscapegoatingabuse Finally a chance to watch this. I wonder if it's possible to be both a fawner & a fighter because I feel I was ? Fawned with my mother, fighter with my father. I am currently sitting at home, unable to brave my grandchildren's play, it's sad but I'm trying to look after myself. One's nervous system can indeed only take so much.
Thank you so much for helping me realize the truth about my toxic narcissistic family cult system and my role in it. I’m in my late 40’s and battling my family to pull my own adult children to scapegoat me as well. It’s been a heartbreaking and eye opening. I’m trying to heal as I’m still caught up in the system as they pry on my children.
Yes, I referenced this aspect of the FSA phenomenon in a few videos here and plan on doing some informal surveys about this - scapegoated adult survivors having their children turned against them by a parent or other family members. It happens more than many might think - or wish to believe.
I hear what you’re saying about still being caught up in the system as they try and drag your adult children into it. This is what mine have been trying to do with my daughter for the past 2.5 years along with the help of my abusive ex husband who they’ve taken into the family too. It’s dreadfully difficult to go NC and truly find peace in this horrific situation
Is it so bad if you have no human connections? My kids are the only things that keep me connected to the outside world. That is enough for me. I don't crave human contact. I've been through too much and need a permanent break.
I don't judge this as 'bad' or 'good' at all. I went through a 10 year or so period where I felt much the same. If it is enough for you, that is what matters.
Hyper vigilance! I never noticed I was doing this until Covid and the masks. First time I went to the store and was confronted by all of the masked people I cried I was so terrified and I realized I had been scanning peoples faces my whole life to figure out if they were safe or not. It was horrible. I am very tough minded and plowed through but I was terrified every day.
That's interesting. I hate talking on the phone without visual cues for the same reason - perhaps we need to scan expressions and body language in addition to hearing the voice to feel secure in sussing people out. The need to constantly scan can feel overwhelming.
You've described the story of my life. At 61 I am trying to be my authentic self for the first time. I was everyone's scapegoat since I could walk. I had to eliminate every toxic, narcissistic relationship (which was most everyone) and trying to purge the shame, guilt and resentment (at myself and others) for tolerating intolerable abuse and rejection. Spent my whole life begging for love and acceptance and never found it, just like my mother predicted and worked tirelessly to make sure it happened. You have to leach out the lifetime of poison and scrape off the layers of protection you put on yourself to get down to who you were born to be before the abuse. Its not easy :/ But my life is filled with the love of my dogs who showed me the only unconditional love I have ever known.
There were six of us kids, two paternal half-siblings, one maternal half-siblings, and three full siblings. Our mother more than infrequently reminded some of us that she regretted we were born. She even tried to kill herself in front of all of us over her regrets, envy, sense of abandonment (especially when Dad was traveling for work). While I was likely her primary scapegoat, life wasn't any easier for any of us kids. You talk about the "fight response" among us scapegoats. I developed a keen sense for when I was being abused and became very reactive. My youngest brother would go around asking strangers and extended family, "Will you adopt me?"
Yes, having cats has really helped me to feel better. I just think of them always. Helps me to stop thinking about what my family does and how my family treats me.
You must mean forced isolation because I've been scapegoated extremely by my narcissistic family and I find almost all social interaction to be exhausting, and I'm a big introvert
Yes, there are many facets to this; my focus in this video was speaking to those FSA adult survivors who feel isolated socially and/or fear connecting with others and may not realize that this could be related to family scapegoating abuse dynamics. I have had many requests to do such a video from survivors experiencing this.
Thank you again for shining a light and articulating these issues/symptoms. I am so pleased that others (and myself) will have some real resources, support and answers to help move through FSA and receive meaningful healing. 💜💜💜
This was very good information. Parentification and hypervigilance are exhausting and socializing tends to lose out. Then come the lack of supports. The circle is hard to break.
Everything you are talking about is extremely familiar. Ive grown some in my ability to say 'no' and be more myself but Im still extremely isolated (amongst other issues).
Glad you're here. Linking you to my FSA survivor resource list in case something catches your eye, given you are resonating with my content here. familyscapegoathealing.substack.com/p/resources
I was allergic to groups. When I walked into a room at a family gathering everyone ignored me. Except my brother in law. I still struggle socially, I really only trust my oldest friend whom Ive known since I was 8.
A long time ago I jokingly told my boss "Why don't you put Scapegoat as my job title". I didn't even know then that Scapegoating was a thing. It was only decades later when these terms came up that I could match them to what I always intuitively knew but wasn't aware of the severity.
@@beyondfamilyscapegoatingabuse I intuitively knew a lot of things as early as 4 years old. That was when the scapegoating began and it suppressed my intuition for most of my life. But intuition never dies, so for many of us, it's a case of the resurrection of intuition!
I am finding out the painful truth of how being scapegoated by my three adult children who are wounded by their father’s drug addiction and death, has contributed to my feelings of not being loved wanted or safe. Life is quite a struggle atm.
I’m glad you had a quality research experience that lead to your book and work. My school experience led me back to having to live with my parents at 40. I avoid everyone.
I understand. in my grad program we were in a 'cohort' for two years and had to engage in group process with our cohort for one year. It was intense. Nearly half the class did not go on to do the licensing qualification portion of the program after that. They realized instead of wanting to be a therapist, they actually needed therapy.
Academia can be extremely cut throat and cult-like. I am sorry you had such an awful experience. I was very disappointed in seeing how administrators and academics and students became so competitive and nasty and either enabled or minimized the concerns and even abuse of others who were clearly targets. After my experience, I was not surprised to hear the small college I went to closed, and how it closed, folding like a cult that fell apart. Some of the enablers of the cult-like dynamics were graduates of the counseling program. Jane Sanders, Bernie's wife previously saved the college and restored it. Unfortunately, as a social worker herself, she could not deconstruct the cult dynamics within the institution.
@@beyondfamilyscapegoatingabuse did they need more therapy and have more compounded trauma following their experience within academia? Academia is RIFE with cult dynamics, sadly.
Our school was exceptional - strong emphasis on the transpersonal and overall a very supportive environment with caring professors - so I would say no in this case.
Children of ...should not have to struggle with the ramifications of social insolation. The system barely recognizes the Trauma and Chaos that comes from the environment of the folks who have no ability to empathize or show compassion. Some of these folks don't even offer basic human dignity...accept to strangers they are trying to recruit for their own supply and demands.
I've been reviewing states that have laws against coersive control today. I wish there was more consideration of coersive control as so much of family scapegoating abuse, as well as the nature of operational cults, is rooted in coersive control. The State and Commonwealth (as well as the medical system and all levels of law enforcement) where I live in Massachusetts, is also deeply enmeshed systemically in coersive control, so much so that FSA can actually be paid for by the state. It's easy for abusers to use professional authorities abusively. And there are many professionals and authorities who enable it and some seem to enjoy it. It's an absolute nightmare. I hope some recent true crime cases will make change locally and nationally but I am not going to hold my breath. I've also been asking for help to the point where I'm nearly blue in the face. I was writing a doc today on being Threatened into Silently Retreating to Avoid Abuse.
I've heard a little bit about this. I'll do a google search but do you recommend any particular sites or articles? I always wonder about the laws around that if it does become a thing. I imagine you'd have to prove it in a court of law. (?) Edit: I went and looked up my state to see if we have it here and we don't. No surprise there though.
Yes, Rebecca @beyondfamilyscapegoatingabuse That is part of my document that I am working on. I have had family in medicine, law, and the military, as well as in intelligence and at globally renowned academic institutions and medical establishments (including the hospital famously depicted in multiple movies in Belmont, Mass). Medicine and Academia become more of an industrial complex and machine, it seems, as we move forward in time.
Thank you you are speaking to my heart and its eye opening to know this situation is not unique to me. Been feeling very alone but these videos are healing. Hugs to all the scapegoats out there you are worthy of love!❤
You're definitely not alone. You may want to consider subscribing to my new online FSA community over on Substack. You can join as a free or paid subscriber. Some great people are there: familyscapegoathealing.substack.com/
Was diagnosed with OSDD(suspected DID) 80 days ago now.. I'm an eldest daughter of an abusive, dysfunctional, and, assumed, narcissistic family as well as unrecognized and not acknowledged generational trauma... Your work brings solice to my mind. Thank you for all you do. Being a voice for many. ❤
Losing the authentic self in the fawn response, and trying to hold onto it with a fight response, which is inevitably punished (as often and as thoroughly as the fawn response is rewarded) … a vicious cycle
Yes, this is another way of saying, "I'm done." What I ask my clients next is, "Done - with what?" Often they are done with being abused / maltreated. Which is a good thing. They just don't see a way out. Linking you to my resource list for FSA survivors here for further education and support: familyscapegoathealing.substack.com/p/resources
I have felt this way since I was about 5 years old, I have wanted to just Go back to God in Heaven, and not be on Earth. I always thought it was just me. Almost 59 yrs old and I still have times of feelings like this., not suicidal just very lonely and born into the wrong family. 3 years of absolutely NO Contact with the 250 relatives I HAD to invite to my wedding, but I have never been a invited to any where near 250 family events in my life time but I have been excluded from a LOT of events gatherings etc that I was not invited or told to about until After the events, and told I had been invited and new, Gaslighted after They leave me out, then blame Me for not attending. It is a type of abuse that really does a number on a child to Adult relationships. I do not Trust anyone.
Having been scapegoated in my own extended family and in my husband's family has degraded my overall faith in humanity but I am still cautiously optimistic I will meet a person or people who might restore at least some of that faith. I was fortunate to have loving parents, one wonderfully loving relative and a wonderful husband.
Yes, they are out there. One of the reasons I created a more private community for FSA adult survivors to chat and connect: familyscapegoathealing.substack.com/
I sent you a message via Chat on my Substack site. If you aren't seeing the Welcome email with information in it to help you navigate the site let me know here so I can help. Good to see you over there!
Thank You for this. Scapegoated by inlaws 37 years ago. We cut all ties with his immediate family as a result and any other family that couldn't understand the situation. I have spent all this time not understanding how or why someone I expected to care for me could do this to another person. I relive it over and over, and I exhibit several of the traits you mention for CPTSD. I've read your book and followed you for some time now but this video really hit home.
I'm sorry this happened to you. I went through a similar experience with (former) in-laws so I understand how traumatizing this can be. Linking you to my resource list in case you are seeking additional support: familyscapegoathealing.substack.com/p/resources
@@beyondfamilyscapegoatingabuse ❤I received the link and joined for Free (for now). I want to look it over in more depth because yes, I think there are options there for my benefit.
You are describing on point how I feel and what I’m experiencing right now.. i never go out and I been depressed I believe low energy a super fatigue.. i don’t have friends and have only my dog to talk.. some days I don’t have energy to get out of bed..
We call that 'hypo-arousal' - It can be associated with complex trauma symptoms (the fatigue, inertia, etc). Linking you to my resource list in case something looks like it could be helpful: familyscapegoathealing.substack.com/p/resources
my trauma response is to call out bullshit, then leave/run away. so you can imagine how difficult this makes it to get and then keep a job, i dont start fawning like a good employee i start doing fighty things like being defensive and argumentative and passive aggressive or straight up aggressive when im around narcissistic people or situations. i dont know how im gonna make money so i decided to refocus on healing. therapy isnt an option cuz i both dont trust people or myself not to throw objects at people triggering me. so i started trying to heal alone by myse;f which of course had me flung further into the scapegoat role as on the surface im an unemployed hippy dependent on cannabis to sleep and eat, instead of the OCD-ridden high achieving academic and athlete my parents groomed me to be, with the constant knife to my back that i was wasting their life by being mediocre unless i LITERALLY got 100% as a grade or 1st place in competition. could you do a video on the rate of unemployment and its relation to family scapegoat abuse, especially how fight response makes you a terrible or impossible employee given that the standard for employees is to put up with abuse with a charming smile.
This is an excellent idea. I plan to get some more surveys out this summer and this would be a good survey to do, and I can then address this issue in a video. Appreciate your being here.
I totally see this - I was a teacher (now just sub) , but I would quit on a dime when i felt blamed or scapegoated. I never had the verbal skills or confidence to deal with the strong personalities (other teachers, administrators)
I read your book and loved it. Now, gkad I found you here. This topic really hits home. It is me. Im 69 years old and have been in and out if therapy for years. Therorists, therapists, no one has been able to voice how I've felt to a point. Thank you so much
Good to have you here. I'm over on my Substack most of the time and that's where I publish my articles and have an FSA survivor community. More info' here, in case you're interested: familyscapegoathealing.substack.com/about
I have so much hyper-vigilance, I developed Autonomic Dysfunction finally diagnosed 12 years ago, and according to my neurologist, my autonomic nervous system is so upsidedown that it will never reverse, hed never seen it so "upside down" he said...back then I accepted the "it's genetic" cause, but now I'm starting to think it may be predisposition, but triggered by tremendous emotional neglect and scapegoating, and often cruelty in my upbringing by my mother and her "golden child" as they both have extreme mean streaks they only show to a few ppl...
This is very possible. Or, it can be both, and not either / or. Much more awareness regarding individual trauma and intergenerational trauma is needed within medical and mental health systems. Its impact on the brain is significant in many cases and should not be overlooked in treatment settings.
Every stranger that may have MADE the mistake of saying something positive ABOUT me as a child would stop my dna-dad in his tracks to explain to every stranger ever encountered that although he & wife love me equal to my GC older sibling & the FAMILY intended to birth a girl. Pop passed when I was 46, never once saying he loves me, his ACTIONS proved what was never spoken!
I'm a proud owner of your book & look forward to seeing that very book being gifted to "someone" of whom like me (@60) that the problem in this family isn't so much me but the problem is the three "Special NEEDS" Elders in an Authoritarian Christian hierarchy. Being born last doesn't mean in the end I'm still last.
This is not a joke. I used to think I could never get married because my dad would do everything to embarass, harass and humiliate me and I could not do that on my wedding day. I actually thought about that all the time, how would I just not invite him? Never thought that I could go no contact. That would mean totally eliminating valuable other family I thought. Now, all these many years later I'm living within a mile of all my family for the first time in 25 years and the amount of pain I have been in is just indescribable being in contact with them. For the first time in my life I am considering changing my name, cancelling my long time cell number and going 100% no contact.
Isolation is a coping mechanism spread especially in western society. The hyper vigilance is an uncomfortable felt sense, which costs lots of energy. So true. I know that that feeling, other peoples vibe of hyper vigilance, I can't stand so i avoid it. As I became more self aware how critical some people look at me outside my home, I rather not share my energy with them. Not like the way they watch me. That reminds me on my narc. mother, which had an constant critical gaze on me. So, no wonder I avoid contact with people. Most of them in the head and have that sharp look. That harsh energy is triggering my childhood trauma. I have been beaten on daily base, and thought that normal. To see those sharp peoples look I know it's NOT NORMAL. I feel even that the healed people stay rather at home.. Thank Rebecca for that video. That's key to embrace myself for isolating, not banishing and feeling bad. I am even proud of myself for having that sensitivity to protect myself of radical behaivoring people. Looking with knife eyes. I like to not call my healthy choice, not wanting to crapfit with peoples energy doesn't please me, Isolation, That makes me again to something awkward and ill. I feel healthy.. I just understand and support My personal individual vibe. And many people maybe cant fit to that, because I still. mirror their unprocessed pain.
Yes, I have been scapegoated in many relationships in my life. Thank goodness I went to counseling and understand myself more thoroughly and now help others with their family traumas! Full circle.
As scapegoated by my mother who passed in 2018 at age 101 🥵, and older sister who is still alive, 🙄, I find strength in my capabilities, my talents & resourcefulness. The love of my grand children & their parents, lol my busy kids, and the appreciation of my husband of 40 years. I still have many hurts and don’t understand why some people are so uncaring. But, nothing is equal, life is not fair. We have to make the best of what we are Blessed with. Thank you, Rebecca, you beautiful Doll. 🙏🏼🤍🙏🏼
Thank you, Christina, for your inspiring message, one which suggests you have come to a place of hart-earned 'radical acceptance' regarding the impact of FSA.
I am still the scapegoat. I wasn't really when I was younger. But now I am somehow. Because I tell the truth against abusers and narcissists that surround me. So yes indeed I isolate a lot. Because I'm gaslit all the time and blamed for absolutely everything.
Very glad you're here! And thank you. Linking you to my FSA survivor resource list in case you are seeking additional support ideas: familyscapegoathealing.substack.com/p/resources
I have seen one who was not allowed to be an individual,if they at all ever tried were shut down by the gang,so not existing became a safe narrative,which then created a loss of self,so the chameleon would come out,this individual would mirror anyone they were with so as to fit in and be ok. Been very interesting to watch this
This has described me to a T. I believe I was the family scapegoat. I've recently went no contact with my family. Definitely a ton of complex trauma. I've always been very socially isolated. I'm married with two children but I have virtually no friends. I enjoy being alone at home but I do long to have authentic connections. I also struggle with feeling like there isn't anyone that I actually CAN connect with. Our family cat Honey is an amazing emotional support animal.
If that's the case, you may want to read my introductory book on FSA - it's linked at the top of my FSA survivor resource list here: familyscapegoathealing.substack.com/p/resources
Great information, thanks! I'd love to hear a little more about what the latest research on the development of PDs is. You touched on what sounds like some interesting new insights. 🤔
I'll need to look into that. I did post an article awhile back with the latest research on narcissism, which is always a hot topic, as come refuse to believe that there can be brain differences or severe trauma fueling the the NPD presentation.
I think my experiences with family of origin and ex partners who seemed to be NPDs, and doing enough healing work to accept what my needs are and what I want, has made me no longer force myself to be interested in compromising for impulsive superficial interactions which go no where. It's lonely to not care about what the general population seems to care about. This explains why I settled for NPD relationships most of my life. If it were up to me, I'd be in a *safe*, close wonderful marriage, and have *safe*, close connected relationships with relatives. But not with my relatives (besides my awesome kids). And I don't have a best friend or partner. A lot of my needs go unmet.
Sounds very wise and that you have experiences some profound awarenesses that now support your healing. Thank you for sharing this with us here. Linking you to my resource list in case you are interested in exploring other sources of support: familyscapegoathealing.substack.com/p/resources
I identify with this. I always feel so exposed and judged in group settings. I work in the field in my company, but weekly we have meetings and they are like torture. I'm fine meeting with patients one on one, but in a group I just get so much anxiety and feel like I don't belong even when people go out of their way to include me. After the meetings I dissect everything I said and did to see if I did anything embarrassing or worthy of criticism.
Thank you for this insightful video! I love your work so much and you’ve been so helpful to me. And thank you so so much for changing the chime. Was so much easier to listen to your video in my car as I’m driving! ❤🤗 I commented about this a few weeks ago and I appreciate you allowing me to be my authentic self and your ability to respond so thoughtfully and graciously. As you know, that’s not always our experience.. I appreciate that very much.
You are so welcome! I actually realized my nervous system (and my ears) was also bothered by the chime so I figured it might bother others. So I'm glad you wrote in because that made my decision to switch to something else easy!
Just to think about, and considering FSA is an issue all on its own. How does social transformation engineering influence this in all environments? It’s supposed to reflect better and better evidence-based outcomes, but seems to be worse and worse. Hegelian dialectic structuring? Society at large off-loading on families that increase internal family stress. As a symptom of Societal Scapegoat Abuse (SSA) systems. For further underside research, it is real.
You nailed it. Thank you. You may be interested in a more transpersonal 2-part video series I did on systemic splitting and FSA. Part 2 is linked to the end of part 1: ruclips.net/video/4CFqA0yWPhs/видео.html
Thank you so much for posting this video. I'm struggling with cptsd due to scapegoat trauma and it helps me understand why I feel so depressed in groups in the workplace especially. I feel like this traumatic family game is playing over and over again when I'm around colleagues or bosses. It's so terrific that I feel the urge to escape. Work is like jail to me with fake parents and siblings all over the place. Gosh, it's so exhausting. How can we overcome this?
With my clients, I start by treating complex trauma. I do have an FSA survivor resource list here, feel free to peruse it in case you see something potentially helpful: familyscapegoathealing.substack.com/p/resources
No, these are separate. Substack is where I am starting to consolidate all of my work but I plan to remain here on RUclips as well. My Substack has community features like group chat for paid subscribers. Free subscribers receive my articles and newsletter in their inbox or can access them from the Substack mobile phone app.
I have been trying to go to a shoe store across town. for over 2 weeks. My brain cannot make my body go. Taking special forms of low thc cannabis helps me leave the house but I have decided to take a break for my brain chemistry. It shouldn’t take weed to make me leave the house. Wtf? c-PTSD is hellish.
Thank you for explaining all of this I feel normal now having this understanding. I do want friends but don’t know how to do that I was punished as a child for bringing friends home.
For me, it's not that I feel like I am worthless but I feel unwanted. The difference is, I know I deserve better but no one cares that I do. Therefore, I pull back and do things for myself despite of everything. When I let people in, they are fine if it appears that I'm not doing anything but when it is clear that I was working for something and I starting to see results then they hate me...treating me like I don't deserve it. I disagree and I know that I do. I do fawn so that they won't hurt me but I find a way to get away from them (no contact).
Sounds like you have a great deal of self-awareness, which is very helpful when on the recovery path. Linking you to my resource list for FSA survivors for more education and support: familyscapegoathealing.substack.com/p/resources
I have a cousin who like me was the family scapegoat. I am the only family member she remains in contact with. My golden child sister is really down on this cousin and says she's on the autism spectrum. This may be true, but my sister herself is much further along the spectrum IMO! The hypocrisy is sickening. Nobody in the family asks WHY she is not in contact. The fact she suffered violence from her father and brother is explained away. She was stubborn and difficult they say. As if that's an excuse for violence. All the family's resources, financial, emotional, time resources went into the brother, even though he was violent, tortured animals, came home drunk etc. When he died it was a relief. Nobody except me has reached out to her. I understand because my experience is similar to hers.
Thank you Rebecca. I really like the egg analogy. I experienced further scapegoating in churches. I think more traumatic for me than FOO and that was bad. I have dogs. Known as ANNE'S mom. My beloved pet, family, and friend. Absolutely adorable.. I survived growing up by riding my horse down long country roads with my dog at my side. Dreaming that God made a great big beautiful world and some day I would see it. And dreamed about moving away to the Pacific NW (I didn't even know what that meant or where it was). There's a reason you haven't heard from me. I will explain when we DO connect. Thank you, appreciate you so much. Jane Green
Oh goodness, we are both horse people, I didn't realize that! Yes, looking forward to hearing from you, I'll tell April to alert me and I'll answer you personally when you write.
@@beyondfamilyscapegoatingabuse Yes! I grew up on the back of a horse. Did my first Barrel Racing competition at 4 yrs old! Horses have such gentle souls. Here's a funny story for you...when I was very young my brother and I shared a horse. We were riding double around the farm and a summer thunderstorm popped up so mom let us ride our horse into the house so our saddle wouldn't get wet! Lol My brother had a massive stroke, tomorrow morning the plug will be pulled and he will be riding in heaven.
@@beyondfamilyscapegoatingabuse Yes, and as you well know in the dysfunctional family there is ALOT more to the story. Thank you Rebecca, I appreciate your kind words and understanding. Jane
Hello Rebecca I really enjoy watching your channel; it is the only one that I know of that deals primarily with family-scapegoating abuse. My parents were narcissists, and I was their scapegoat. Over the last few years, I have been gradually unravelling how this has affected my mind. I am trying to learn as much as I can, and I see that you are happy to answer questions, so I was wondering whether you would be able to answer the following ones for me, please: 1. Which is worse -- two NPD parents or two BPD ones? 2. Is communal narcissism a form of covert narcissism? 3. Can someone with NPD be a "people pleaser", and if they can, does that mean that they're a narc/empath hybrid? 4. Can an empath have NPD or BPD? 5. Can empaths have narcissistic traits? 6. Is an empath a narcissist with high empathy? 7. If NPD is a disorder, then does that mean that the narc's real personality is 'underneath' the disorder? Thanks very much!
Would it be fair to say that a reason we are scapegoated at work and other places is because people unconsciously pick up on our lack of confidence and self-esteem and sink the boot in?
This can sometimes be the case, but what is often at the root is unconscious projection processes carried over from one's original famiiy system. I'm releasing an article on projection processes over on my Substack tomorrow - you can subscribe for free to access it once it is release at 8 am PST. familyscapegoathealing.substack.com/
Absolutely. It is very much an issue. One reason in my case (and I'm sure in many others) is parents who scapegoat their ecosystem is very much with others with a similar mindset so you don't have friends of the family who can help you either. This puts you an extreme disadvantage. In my case also part of my religious upbringing in my case it was Jewish schools also sometimes private school have blame the victim mindsets. And so you can't even rely on anyone in your own ecosystem. Which makes it very hard. I recently was seeing someone who reached out to me and sadly I see she is basically victim blaming me. My family hasn't invited for holidays for over 25 years which is not normal. There also is an extreme gender ideas in my family.
Very well said. I agree with your summation, and I also like your 'ecosystem' reference. This goes hand-in-hand with Family Systems theory, btw. Thank you for your insightful comment.
A narcissistic family is primarily influenced by a parent (or other influential 'power-holding' family member) with Narcissistic Personality Disorder (NPD) and this is typically what is fueling the scapegoating, versus the Family Projective Identification Process common in highly traumatized dysfunctional family systems that scapegoat. I have some videos on this but you might start with these two resources here: 1) www.scapegoatrecovery.com/2021/08/21/recognizing-narcissistic-family-abuse/ 2) and my article / video here: www.scapegoatrecovery.com/2023/02/04/scapegoating-in-narcissistic-family-systems/
Hello Rebecca, thank you for sharing your knowledge and experience, and for all of the work you've put into the videos on your channel. I am curious about the concept of enmeshment of people in the family system. I've heard this concept mentioned several times in various videos on dysfunctional families, but my understanding of this phenomena still feels murky. From what I can piece together, it sounds like enmeshment is when there is a highly sensitized reactivity in the family emotional system to the emotional states and responses of other significant family bonds, such that family members become overly responsive to or disproportionately impacted by the emotions and/or perspectives of other family members. What am I missing in this description? Anybody interested in adding any details?
Great question - and very insightful. Your question(s) can be answered in part by what Family Systems theorist Murray Bowen (who I reference in my introductory book on FSA, 'Rejected, Shamed, and Blamed') calls the 'Nuclear Family Emotional System'. The focus is on differentiation versus intense fusion between nuclear family members and the consequences to the system based on the dynamics playing out. This ties directly into enmeshment in dysfunctional family systems. I invite you to take a look at this here PDF here and then get back to me with your thoughts: courses.aiu.edu/FUNDAMENTALS%20OF%20FAMILY%20THEORY/SESSION%206/6.pdf
1) Join my new FSA Education online community for adult survivors on SUBSTACK at familyscapegoathealing.substack.com/. Subscribe for free to receive my FSA-related articles or become a paid subscriber to access Community features where you can engage with other FSA adult survivors via Group Chats and Discussion Threads.
2) Purchase my introductory book on Family Scapegoating Abuse (Rejected, Shamed, and Blamed) via this Universal Buy Link, which includes links to Amazon: books2read.com/intro2fsa.
Thank you Dr M.
I have your R/S/Blamed book & appreciate how well articulated the info is presented! Thank you thank you. HEAVEN awaits ur arrival & furthermore my she-Satan, Sadistically Catholic, fake Christian ""MOMSTER"" LIKELY
DOES
NOT! 👀✔️
The public DOES need to be educated about Family Scapegoat Abuse. It's 100% real.
They will twist everything as usual, but yeah it needs a part in popular culture.
Most therapists need this education, too. It's so difficult to find someone who understands this phenomenon.
They crack your shell and scramble your insides….
Well put.
@@mountainstream8351 Clinically speaking this is in part due to the lack of reflection of the developing self, as mentioned in this video.
Yep
I have experienced a deep longing despite my lack of knowledge and my own denials in all of this that has kept me going and trying and constantly learning. Though I personally do still struggle with the social isolation because we do all have limitations as humans. 💜😮💨😮💨
@@tabithab33 there does seem to be a longing that seems to never go away.
My dad taught me that I was a bad person so I fear letting people see that in me. I have social anxiety and keep my distance from everyone. I never got married bc I feared that closeness. I have 3 dogs who are my family. My dad took my life from me by projecting his negative qualities onto me. Totally disinherited by a successful attorney father who gave everything to my only sibling, an older golden brother. After my father passed my brother offered me nothing and he shuns me - absolutely no empathy and all greed. It’s been a nightmare but thanks to scientists like you Ms Mandeville I have a sense that it was not my fault like I used to believe.
Thank you!
Glad my FSA offerings are helpful and hopefully are shedding a light onto some dark places. Linking you to my resource list in case you are seeking additional support: familyscapegoathealing.substack.com/p/resources
My mother is to me how your dad was to you everyone is her victim except her golden child the younger sister it does hurt it’s a pain that never goes away a deep yearning ache for love that by nature should be inborn into parents but it’s not always that way there are indeed freaks of nature that do exist. God bless you find solace in your animals and within yourself you are worth the love you surround yourself with. 🌻
That's so sad. I am sorry for that!
I had a similare story as you, except I was given some of the inheritance. But only, because I fawned all my later life as I moved out.. They have kept me in the familysystem with covertly blackmailing me not giving me anything, if I don't visit enough.
My sister lately as it come to the point to decide who takes the money and who the house, was jellouse that I got the money.. Very strange. She was 1 year angry with me, not talking.
I couldn't take the house, because my parents not recommend me to take the house, because they predicted me, that I don't get along with my sister!! So we can't live so close.
My sisters house is attached to my parent's. They manipulated me all my life. I can only see now.
Before I was a complete victim and depending on their wellwishes
Still suffering of low self-esteem and selfdoubt😢
❤
You are so handsome. Please get married or a girlfriend. You are worth it. We deserve to find back to normal. But it's in our hands. I will get back what they took from me. I cut off my family it was so much pain but it gets better now.
Codependent compliance and servitude or full scorched earth rejection those were the only menu options available.
As I have said in more than one video here, what the (dysfunctional / narcissistic) family system cannot understand and/or control, it will reject and at times eject.
@beyondfamilyscapegoatingabuse profound words, true. Hopefully it would happen sooner rather than later.😊
Peaceful..
Social isolation can be a nice respite too, especially for the fighters. Also a good way to connect with your own self when there's nobody else around. Just you and the dog.
Very true. It can be viewed as 'solitude' versus isolation.
By their examples of back stabbing betrayals we scapegoats don't trust anyone. Not even our own perceptions. Safer to isolate. I voluntarily isolated by door slamming my entire family. Highly recommended. Then you learn to self validate internally. I learned to embrace rejection after being in sales; when a salesman gets rejected he just says "NEXT!" and moves on to the next potential customer. #s game. Peace.
Being in a sales job years ago also helped me work through rejection sensitivity. And, of course, being on social media for several years, replete with trolls and hate comments, was the icing on the cake (!)
@@beyondfamilyscapegoatingabuse😂yeah I learnt to fight and insult back on the internet, pretty good because I was physically safe. Cant hate the trolls
The first time I sought professional help for my abuse was 25 years ago. It took tremendous amounts of courage to make the appointment with a therapist.
So at my first visit, as I was telling her what I was struggling with and my experiences, she responded with “what do you want me to do? Get mad at them for you?” I said no, i want to learn how to deal with it because it’s ruining my life. She must have been having a bad day because she didn’t offer anything of value to the session and she acted like she was annoyed by anything I had to say.
I never went back to therapy again and I’ve never been able to seek counseling since that day.
There are a lot of people out there who shouldn’t be giving counseling.
You and your videos are so spot on and I want to say thank you for being a light for so many of us.
You're very welcome and I am deeply sorry to hear of your experience. I remember during my grad school training a mentor who later became a friend said to me that it is a sacred responsibility, this work we do, because a client who does not feel heard or seen may not ever reach out for help again. Glad you're here. You might want to check out this resource list I put together for FSA survivors as well: familyscapegoathealing.substack.com/p/resources
Yeah mine broke my confidentiality. I don’t seek therapy now and I’m healing in my own way. Rebecca certainly helps and some others.
I had a similar experience with a counselor from the Division of Family Services - TWR. Despite police photos of burns and his large fist -imprinted bruises punched on my back & sexual abuse, the woman yelled, "You're F--king with me." I don't even think she looked at the pics. It took a lot of courage to start sharing just a tiny bit of truth with that assigned person, who I was told was safe to talk to. How someone like her can work with children, or anyone, is frightening. Later I learned Abuser-dad had
(unlawfully?) visited her office, prior to my scheduled visit, to do his flirt & schmooze, & tell her Lord only knows what. I gather they had an affair, bc she left a giddy msg on our home answering machine (she must have meant to call his cell phone) - thanking him for lunch, and how she was looking fwd to seeing him again. All that did is reinforce - Never. Trust. Anyone.
Speaking made matters worse. They wonder why abused, raped girls don't report, when they are sent right back for more. I believe most abused children and young adults are intentionally isolated from extended family or neighbors, and have no clue about hotlines, potential resources, shelter, transportation, etc. Everything required money, and could lead to more harm. I always thought if I were rich, I'd build an underground escape, like Ms Tubman, that brought kids to safe houses with new ID. How to ensure the adults will safe and loving though.
This thread is so relatable. And makes me so sad. As though what we’ve gone through isn’t bad enough.
I'm sorry that you had such a horrible experience. People like that shouldn't be allowed to work with people; especially in any kind of health care. Therapy can help so much with the right therapist, but they are are few and far..
I had a boss for 10 years who had similar behaviour to my mother. The only time she treated me respectfully was wen everyone else was on holiday. As soon as they returned her behaviour reverted back. In particular I remember her frequently withholding information from me that she had told others. I only realised many many years later what had been going on. I also love animals and have a cat who is everything to me.
Good example, thanks.
😉😻👍❤️🐈
I can relate I've been mistreated by so many bosses that I'm just like done. It's crazy to me that if we were dating people would tell you to stop dating if you keep meeting toxic people but when you keep ending up and toxic workplaces everyone keeps saying oh just get back out there LOL
Its appalling and NOBODY appears to care. I am a nurse with 30 +yrs experience. I had a nurse manager who was so abusive that 100 nurses left in 2 years....He fired many, including me , who were vocal about his behavior. A highlight was being called to the office and asked why I never cried when called to the office. I had no idea about narcissistic abuse at the time despite being the scapegoat in my family. I was fired for a violation that was a lie and I had to fight to get my name cleared ....the whole thing was a sequel to my childhood. It led me to therapy though where im learning and healing....super slowly.
Systems enable these toxic managers. Usually upper management is loathsome. @user-tn8fu1gx3v
51 years old and your research on FSA has me flabbergasted. On top of a narcissistic mother and brother (golden child) i tried to take my life at 16. While on the psych unit my counselor helped me start the emancipation process. I moved out at 16. My father promised that if i kept my grades up HE would send me to college. I graduated w honors in spite of the insanity that ensued. Unfortunately he died my sophomore year. Mother was cruel and hateful toward me at the funeral. At 19 i struck out on my own for the next 8 years training and showing Arabian horses. I isolated. Went no contact w family. No time for friends. 8 years of finding myself. Should never have resumed contact. 😢😣
I lost myself. Allowed self loathing to seep in. I am very damaged. Extremely untrusting. And fiercely independent. This leads to isolation. Deep down i NEED deep healing! I want healing! But fear gets in the way. What if i start this PTSD therapy and the counselor quits or moves midway through? This has happened. Now I'm even more untrusting.
Question? I grew up Gen X. Does this play a part in neglect? Is my generation unique? It seemed like we all had lack of parental supervision to a degree. We grew up fast. So extremely grateful i did not have to stay inside that hell of a house. Free range parenting probably save my life. Horses academics and sports saved my life. I want to love life not to just merely survive it.
Very glad you're here - I'm a horse person, btw, and horses helped me heal quite a bit from complex trauma symptoms, although I did not know about C-PTSD at the time. They are so very grounding. I am not sure about the Gen X piece, I'd just be guessing and would need to look into it more. I did want to link you to my resource list and I encourage you to read my introductory book on FSA, Rejected, Shamed, and Blamed - This will help you to sort out some of your experiences and may also answer some of your questions: familyscapegoathealing.substack.com/p/resources
What effect do you think interacting with horses had on your healing? I ask because I’m embarking on Equine Assisted Therapy and I was wondering if there is something innately healing about a horse’s energy.
I'm a baby boomer, scapegoats have been around since time began. Horrible parents have been around since time began. I understand wanting answers.
I found my "people" "tribe" "gang" however you want to describe it. They range in age from 46 to 90 years old each with narcissist families.
You have to be careful acquiring your "people" I am very blessed. Also I am 68.
Hope this helped you a little bit 😊
Kim, just curious how you found your tribe? It’s so difficult, especially as you get older.
@Hislittlelamb I have seen astonishing things. I currently am a part time manager at a therapeutic horse riding stable. I LOVE IT! We do mostly physical disabilities but have a few that suffer mental ailments. IT gives great confidence as it should. The horses ARE your therapist. I'm so glad you have the opportunity!
I may have bonded with kittens and cats on the farm growing up before I bonded with people and I have always had one or more pets throughout my life. They have helped me get through when I had no clue about any of this. Right now my maltese and 2 cats are still my best friends.
And thank you for all you do. You look rested today ❤️.
Thank you, it happens sometimes!
The Christmas period is the worst! While others are planning family gatherings, I go to ground and switch devices off, to limit opportunities to create issues with me
Yes! I dread Christmas every year
It's an entirely different reality than the one portrayed on Hallmark cards.
Everytime I trust someone, they show me why I should'nt have.
You learn the skills to be cautious and vigilant beyond FSA.
Yes, sadly this can happen. Been there myself.
I recently lost my beloved dog. I’m lost without him.
I'm so very sorry, I know all too well how painful such a loss can be. I hope you are taking time to self-nurture and heal.
I'm sorry to see this. We lost ours a couple of weeks ago. It's horrible. They mean so much.
@@beyondfamilyscapegoatingabuse thank you. I’m trying to.
@@jenni4claire I’m sorry for your loss as well. It is terribly painful.
I am so sorry, it is indeed, very painful.
I was always screamed at “To shut the f**k up!!” in my family whenever I tried to talk to any of them. This had a massive impact on my social skills and moving around a lot didn’t help either. I’m thinking now I’m schizoid personality disordered or at least have strong traits. I’m not attached to my family which of course they blame me for.
Structural dissociation is also a possibility in such situations: ruclips.net/video/mYDXc16bxro/видео.html
When you do say no, expect plenty of guilt trips, coercion and even bribery. But sick to it anyway, don't fall for it. Don't let them bully you.
You may want to watch my video here, based on your comment: ruclips.net/video/gLptzBP_Arw/видео.html
Guess being a toxically bullied everywhere, school, home, shrinks, work, as a genx, fight didn't work against the establishments, they all hit back harder, learned to feeze, and not to need anyone else to validate me... changing social circles, eliminating boundary violators helped me survive. Alone, but very rarely lonely. Hyper independence.
How many of us end up in the bdsm lifestyle where hard limits are discussed and established with a community that polieces itself? I know the sexual abuse plays a huge part going that direction and my short swinging lifestyle.
My fur babies helped me regrow my heart. Gone now, but not forgotten. Thank you Rebecca, you are a life changer. 🙏
Good to see you here in the comments again - Yes, they are never forgotten. Such connections with our cherished four-legged friends are eternal.
Absolutely!! ❤hugs 🫂
I can relate
As a child I experienced this time and time again. I always felt like an outsider particularly in group settings and every time a new cycle in my life began I failed to connect to the new group and this cycle has repeated my whole life. I never understood why before. But knowing what I do now, it makes perfect sense!! And yeah, low self esteem and not living up to my potential. I have/had imposter syndrome. I was hyper aware of being an outsider as a child.
Seems like this video really struck a chord. Can't remember if you have my resource list already but here it is, just in case: familyscapegoathealing.substack.com/p/resources
Yes I’m a victim of narcissistic abuse within my narcissistic family system and scapegoating abuse and suffer from PTSD and Trauma
Hi Darren. Sounds like you are in the right place. Welcome.
Welcome Darren.❤️
Dr Rebecca
I got attacked yesterday by my sick brother because I told him that he couldn’t live in my home anymore!! It hurt me real bad!! He acted like the victim. I’m so tired!
You might want to read about 'DARVO' (Dr. Jennifer Freyd). en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DARVO
My struggles were with the 'should' socialise cues that bombard us all the time. Once I gave myself permission to enjoy the safe space that being alone provides, I began to luxuriate in it and meet my true self! I now find that when I CHOOSE to go out, I enjoy it far more. I still do not officially socialise ( going shopping is socialising for me 😅) but have very dear friends at a distance ( online and in other parts of the country). These are such loving and honest connections, a joy. I relish my pets. I'm grateful for a happy marriage. I embrace my reclusive nature, aware I am just beginning to heal after 2 years almost no contact with my family members. Life is promising. Isolating can feel like a much needed holiday after a lifetime of stress. 🎉😊
Wonderful! I think I will also do a video on the joys of solitude as well. There is a difference between a choosing solitude versus feeling socially isolated, deprived of support, and profoundly alone and disconnected - which is what this article was geared toward.
I am living in a different world right now. For years, I isolated myself from everything. My daughter was angry to ne about it. She wanted to see me happy with other people. But I met so nasty people, that I gave up hope to have fun in life.
For many reasons, however, my life changed. First: I took no contact with my mom, who is, to me, toxic.
Suddenly, I see myself working in the place as a superior, I have plenty of connections and surprisingly, I am visible. I am heard. These people listen to me! I even have fun at work!
This is very odd. I can tell, it happened threw hardships. I just decided that I do not settle for tiny things and I will not give up my power.
Always believe, that there is something better waiting for you than than the Devil in your life tries to convince. It us up to you what you decide to think and accept.
Being the youngest of 4 sisters they always put me down and i never felt as good as them. I met up with 1 sister last week for a drink, she was holding my hand saying do you not love me you're my baby sister 8 half years older than me) and you know i felt numb, i feel nothing, the 3 of them at times have been so cruel to me over the decades that i really feel nothing for them any more. Of course they will say its me.
Yes, the finger is generally pointed at the scapegoat in such families.
I feel your pain. Same in my family. I did not fully realize the full extent of who my siblings were and how they really felt about me, until I was going through something horrendous. That is when their true colors shone through. My mother warned me right before she died but I didn’t believe her. It is so hard waking up to knowing the people you have loved are out there actively destroying you and then either blaming you or spreading rumors that you never take responsibility for the bad things that happen in your life - when they are the very ones that caused it!
It sucks being the last born in a family of 4 yearning for a boy. I say this as that's my cousin, rejected and long gone to live elsewhere. I find my cousins are way friendlier than my siblings.
@streaming5332 I am 4th girl, and I have a younger brother. The sad thing is my parents died when he was 10 and me 17. My parents were OK with me it's my siblings.
I am so grateful for your WISDOM ❤❤❤
Hard earned. Happy to share it. And thanks.
I would really like to write about how messed up EVERYONE is in their responses to victims.
I see the abusers as just a small part of the problem. IMO victims don't isolate - they are rejected... & not necessarily because of anything to do with their mistrust or behaviour. This is a materialistic world, everyone is looking to move upward and avoid what is poor, weak, wounded. So who are these people that want to listen to trauma stories? Really..
I have been quite an extrovert, popular etc.. however.. on sharing even a small bit of my past or trauma, it becomes blatantly obvious 99% of people have zero interest and those that do, just can't grasp it.
The only people that really want to hear that stuff, are generally predators.
After years believing I had 'trust problems' - I'm now pretty confident the real issue - is that most people have an 'inability to listen or be interested in real difficulty/pain' problems..
(This notion that I have 'trust issues' has gotten me in a lot of trouble, because I didn't realise it was true but in the opposite sense I'd understood. I trusted too much.)
It is my experience that both can be true. The FSA target is rejected - and then isolates. There are many powerful awarenesses in your comment here. The last line, especially. There is a line from the Tao Te Ching I am thinking of: "The Sage trusts the trustworthy and the untrustworthy alike..."
There are some genuine souls out there that care. Cautiously finding their limits, and ours, is the dance we do. Are they educated about extreme abuse? Do they have experiences similar to yours wherein they can identify and have empathy? There is another type - the predator you mentioned. At 72 yrs I have found I can recognize narcissists fairly easily. The ones I am speaking of just want to talk about themselves. They may have fairly similar experiences but they become vampires. A trait I am learning is to tread cautiously about revealing experiences. The stranger, or aquaintance, may back off until they feel we are safe. And we will certainly do the same if we sense tension from them. Our community may be online with fairly similar survivors for now. We have our animals who love us. I respect your concerns. Chao
@@Rwanda1952 I have asked myself how would I respond if the roles were switched?
I've come to understand it's really just outside of most people's experience. As I've lived with it all my life, I couldn't grasp that.
A man once told me 'You see depth where there is none' he said those people are just shallow, speaking about a particular group.I literally couldn't grasp what it meant, to be shallow. Likewise I couldn't grasp what it meant not to have pretty deep pain, or compassion for pain.
While most people have been through challenges.. the crazy pain of deep trauma has no meaninging to them personally . The depth of emotion, the depth of pain, vulnerability and need.. it's truly shocking to the average person. After years of trauma therapy giving me a place to let some of that pain out safely.. I'm starting to experience what it's like to be in life without extreme pain. This is giving me a better general understanding of people.
A lot of people are not bad, not extremely selfish.. It's like the average person can help you with a surface wound, clean it and put a band aid on it. But they will be useless if they find you after a car accident, it simply needs professionals..
@@annastone5624 Your assessment is spot on. Actions that the truly sadistic enjoy inflicting on the vulnerable are so disgusting that many are turned from being a support system. We bury many incidents ourselves!
I was taken under the wing of a professional for decades. We often had to unravel the day to day struggles enhanced by poverty and the scapegoated personality. Touching or embracing the severely tramatic experiences with another (professional), who also endured cruelty, brought great advances. Even at this late date, when asking myself why I continue to berate myself, the hidden becomes revealed. Online professional sites expose the tactics abusers use. The bizarre becomes normalized and exposed.
We know not all professionals are solid. When I see a person's eyes become wide-open I sigh and realize I've gone too far. Again. I really like what you said and can't add to your insight. So many struggle alone.
Also I been betrayal trauma abuse
You may want to watch this video here on betrayal trauma and FSA: ruclips.net/video/0RXlyIFrb7k/видео.html
I treasure your wisdom, empathy, affirmation and practical help. Raised by malignant narc pop and covert mom (believe me he provided tons of camouflage for her to run her game). I’m 67 years old. I’ve been isolated for 20+ years and intermittently before that. Somehow I became old while I wasn’t looking. I don’t dare live in regret - too much. I realize that God has scriptures that say when your mother and father reject you- he takes you up as his own and that he redeems that years that have been stolen. I’m bold enough to press in for that,
… in other news, you are lookin chic today.
Thank you! BTW, I'd love to see you over at my new Substack community for FSA adult survivors. There is a very lovely and supportive group forming over there. You can join for free or become a paid subscriber to utilize the community features like 'Chat'. Link here: familyscapegoathealing.substack.com/
I choose to isolate now, in my 60's. I just don't need anymore drama.
I was on my own at 16. I was the skapegoat and it does effect a person throughout their life. Therapy is important and learning self-care. I never seemed to pick people who had my best interest at heart. I've learned a lot about the red flags to avoid.
I was married to a narcissist for 20 years and he just switched into a different person. He went with someone else.
Everything you say is right on target!
"Solitude is the furnace of transformation!" Indeed, there is a difference between embracing solitude and preferring it versus experiencing profound isolation and disconnection from others, deprived of social support.
Im so happy theres a community here for us with FSA❤
Yes, wonderful people here. If you are seeking a more private community experience (paid) or want my newsletter with my FSA articles (free) you can subscribe to my new Substack site here - quite a few RUclips people over there from my channel here: familyscapegoathealing.substack.com/
No matter where I work the narcissists go into attack mode almost immediately.
Curious if you identify as being an Empath type or HSP (Highly Sensitive Person)...?
@@beyondfamilyscapegoatingabuse I'm probably both. But I have never been officially diagnosed. Thank you for the work you are doing. It has helped me a great deal.
Good to hear. Linking you to my resource list in case you haven't seen it yet: familyscapegoathealing.substack.com/p/resources
I've been hurt so often and so deeply by many who were supposed to love me, that I enjoy being with myself and my kids only.
So many feel this way. One's nervous system can only take so much.
@@beyondfamilyscapegoatingabuse Finally a chance to watch this. I wonder if it's possible to be both a fawner & a fighter because I feel I was ? Fawned with my mother, fighter with my father. I am currently sitting at home, unable to brave my grandchildren's play, it's sad but I'm trying to look after myself. One's nervous system can indeed only take so much.
Yes, absolutely, both can be true - and there are a few more trauma responses, such as freeze, flight, and force...
Thank you so much for helping me realize the truth about my toxic narcissistic family cult system and my role in it. I’m in my late 40’s and battling my family to pull my own adult children to scapegoat me as well. It’s been a heartbreaking and eye opening. I’m trying to heal as I’m still caught up in the system as they pry on my children.
Yes, I referenced this aspect of the FSA phenomenon in a few videos here and plan on doing some informal surveys about this - scapegoated adult survivors having their children turned against them by a parent or other family members. It happens more than many might think - or wish to believe.
Going through this too.
I hear what you’re saying about still being caught up in the system as they try and drag your adult children into it. This is what mine have been trying to do with my daughter for the past 2.5 years along with the help of my abusive ex husband who they’ve taken into the family too. It’s dreadfully difficult to go NC and truly find peace in this horrific situation
@@kimpeterson4846 I’m sorry! I wouldn’t wish this on my worst enemy! No one deserves this torment.
Is it so bad if you have no human connections? My kids are the only things that keep me connected to the outside world. That is enough for me. I don't crave human contact. I've been through too much and need a permanent break.
I don't judge this as 'bad' or 'good' at all. I went through a 10 year or so period where I felt much the same. If it is enough for you, that is what matters.
Hyper vigilance! I never noticed I was doing this until Covid and the masks. First time I went to the store and was confronted by all of the masked people I cried I was so terrified and I realized I had been scanning peoples faces my whole life to figure out if they were safe or not. It was horrible. I am very tough minded and plowed through but I was terrified every day.
I could definitely see that happening - but had never thought about it before! As a child, I focused more on the eyes...
Eyes don’t look friendly over a mask to me anyhow 🤣
That's interesting. I hate talking on the phone without visual cues for the same reason - perhaps we need to scan expressions and body language in addition to hearing the voice to feel secure in sussing people out. The need to constantly scan can feel overwhelming.
This sounds like a twilight zone episode where people wore masks
You've described the story of my life. At 61 I am trying to be my authentic self for the first time. I was everyone's scapegoat since I could walk. I had to eliminate every toxic, narcissistic relationship (which was most everyone) and trying to purge the shame, guilt and resentment (at myself and others) for tolerating intolerable abuse and rejection. Spent my whole life begging for love and acceptance and never found it, just like my mother predicted and worked tirelessly to make sure it happened. You have to leach out the lifetime of poison and scrape off the layers of protection you put on yourself to get down to who you were born to be before the abuse. Its not easy :/ But my life is filled with the love of my dogs who showed me the only unconditional love I have ever known.
There were six of us kids, two paternal half-siblings, one maternal half-siblings, and three full siblings. Our mother more than infrequently reminded some of us that she regretted we were born. She even tried to kill herself in front of all of us over her regrets, envy, sense of abandonment (especially when Dad was traveling for work). While I was likely her primary scapegoat, life wasn't any easier for any of us kids.
You talk about the "fight response" among us scapegoats. I developed a keen sense for when I was being abused and became very reactive. My youngest brother would go around asking strangers and extended family, "Will you adopt me?"
Yes, having cats has really helped me to feel better. I just think of them always. Helps me to stop thinking about what my family does and how my family treats me.
Cats are endlessly entertaining as well (mine is, at least!)
Omg😭 my eyes are open 😭😭😭
You must mean forced isolation because I've been scapegoated extremely by my narcissistic family and I find almost all social interaction to be exhausting, and I'm a big introvert
Yes, there are many facets to this; my focus in this video was speaking to those FSA adult survivors who feel isolated socially and/or fear connecting with others and may not realize that this could be related to family scapegoating abuse dynamics. I have had many requests to do such a video from survivors experiencing this.
Thank you again for shining a light and articulating these issues/symptoms. I am so pleased that others (and myself) will have some real resources, support and answers to help move through FSA and receive meaningful healing. 💜💜💜
You're welcome, my pleasure!
This was very good information. Parentification and hypervigilance are exhausting and socializing tends to lose out. Then come the lack of supports. The circle is hard to break.
Everything you are talking about is extremely familiar. Ive grown some in my ability to say 'no' and be more myself but Im still extremely isolated (amongst other issues).
Glad you're here. Linking you to my FSA survivor resource list in case something catches your eye, given you are resonating with my content here. familyscapegoathealing.substack.com/p/resources
I was allergic to groups. When I walked into a room at a family gathering everyone ignored me. Except my brother in law. I still struggle socially, I really only trust my oldest friend whom Ive known since I was 8.
A long time ago I jokingly told my boss "Why don't you put Scapegoat as my job title". I didn't even know then that Scapegoating was a thing. It was only decades later when these terms came up that I could match them to what I always intuitively knew but wasn't aware of the severity.
Wow. That is amazing that you nailed it without having much information to go on. I do believe many of us do intuitively know...
@@beyondfamilyscapegoatingabuse I intuitively knew a lot of things as early as 4 years old. That was when the scapegoating began and it suppressed my intuition for most of my life. But intuition never dies, so for many of us, it's a case of the resurrection of intuition!
Yes! I somehow hung onto mine life long. But paid a big price for doing so.
@@beyondfamilyscapegoatingabuse Better than being the Golden Child that's fer sure!
I agree. "Golden handcuffs."
I am finding out the painful truth of how being scapegoated by my three adult children who are wounded by their father’s drug addiction and death, has contributed to my feelings of not being loved wanted or safe.
Life is quite a struggle atm.
So sorry to hear it. Glad you're here. Linking you to my resource list for FSA adult survivors: familyscapegoathealing.substack.com/p/resources
I’m glad you had a quality research experience that lead to your book and work. My school experience led me back to having to live with my parents at 40. I avoid everyone.
I understand. in my grad program we were in a 'cohort' for two years and had to engage in group process with our cohort for one year. It was intense. Nearly half the class did not go on to do the licensing qualification portion of the program after that. They realized instead of wanting to be a therapist, they actually needed therapy.
Academia can be extremely cut throat and cult-like. I am sorry you had such an awful experience. I was very disappointed in seeing how administrators and academics and students became so competitive and nasty and either enabled or minimized the concerns and even abuse of others who were clearly targets. After my experience, I was not surprised to hear the small college I went to closed, and how it closed, folding like a cult that fell apart. Some of the enablers of the cult-like dynamics were graduates of the counseling program. Jane Sanders, Bernie's wife previously saved the college and restored it. Unfortunately, as a social worker herself, she could not deconstruct the cult dynamics within the institution.
You "have" to live with them or you "choose" to live with them?
@@beyondfamilyscapegoatingabuse did they need more therapy and have more compounded trauma following their experience within academia? Academia is RIFE with cult dynamics, sadly.
Our school was exceptional - strong emphasis on the transpersonal and overall a very supportive environment with caring professors - so I would say no in this case.
Children of ...should not have to struggle with the ramifications of social insolation. The system barely recognizes the Trauma and Chaos that comes from the environment of the folks who have no ability to empathize or show compassion. Some of these folks don't even offer basic human dignity...accept to strangers they are trying to recruit for their own supply and demands.
All too true.
I've been reviewing states that have laws against coersive control today. I wish there was more consideration of coersive control as so much of family scapegoating abuse, as well as the nature of operational cults, is rooted in coersive control. The State and Commonwealth (as well as the medical system and all levels of law enforcement) where I live in Massachusetts, is also deeply enmeshed systemically in coersive control, so much so that FSA can actually be paid for by the state. It's easy for abusers to use professional authorities abusively. And there are many professionals and authorities who enable it and some seem to enjoy it. It's an absolute nightmare. I hope some recent true crime cases will make change locally and nationally but I am not going to hold my breath. I've also been asking for help to the point where I'm nearly blue in the face. I was writing a doc today on being Threatened into Silently Retreating to Avoid Abuse.
And sometimes the professional authorities are one's own (scapegoating) family members...
That is deep
I've heard a little bit about this. I'll do a google search but do you recommend any particular sites or articles? I always wonder about the laws around that if it does become a thing. I imagine you'd have to prove it in a court of law. (?)
Edit: I went and looked up my state to see if we have it here and we don't. No surprise there though.
@@beyondfamilyscapegoatingabuse yes I have zero trust for any authority
Yes, Rebecca @beyondfamilyscapegoatingabuse That is part of my document that I am working on. I have had family in medicine, law, and the military, as well as in intelligence and at globally renowned academic institutions and medical establishments (including the hospital famously depicted in multiple movies in Belmont, Mass). Medicine and Academia become more of an industrial complex and machine, it seems, as we move forward in time.
Traumatic invalidation, wow. The wording, sparks healing!❤️❣️
You may want to watch this video here, if that's the case: ruclips.net/video/8BQ5Vrarp1g/видео.html
Thank you you are speaking to my heart and its eye opening to know this situation is not unique to me. Been feeling very alone but these videos are healing. Hugs to all the scapegoats out there you are worthy of love!❤
You're definitely not alone. You may want to consider subscribing to my new online FSA community over on Substack. You can join as a free or paid subscriber. Some great people are there: familyscapegoathealing.substack.com/
Thank you so much I will check that out for sure!! 😊
Was diagnosed with OSDD(suspected DID) 80 days ago now.. I'm an eldest daughter of an abusive, dysfunctional, and, assumed, narcissistic family as well as unrecognized and not acknowledged generational trauma...
Your work brings solice to my mind. Thank you for all you do. Being a voice for many. ❤
Losing the authentic self in the fawn response, and trying to hold onto it with a fight response, which is inevitably punished (as often and as thoroughly as the fawn response is rewarded) … a vicious cycle
I find myself frequently thinking “I can’t wait to die”, not at all in a suicidal way.
Yes, this is another way of saying, "I'm done." What I ask my clients next is, "Done - with what?" Often they are done with being abused / maltreated. Which is a good thing. They just don't see a way out. Linking you to my resource list for FSA survivors here for further education and support: familyscapegoathealing.substack.com/p/resources
I have felt this way since I was about 5 years old, I have wanted to just Go back to God in Heaven, and not be on Earth. I always thought it was just me. Almost 59 yrs old and I still have times of feelings like this., not suicidal just very lonely and born into the wrong family. 3 years of absolutely NO Contact with the 250 relatives I HAD to invite to my wedding, but I have never been a invited to any where near 250 family events in my life time but I have been excluded from a LOT of events gatherings etc that I was not invited or told to about until After the events, and told I had been invited and new, Gaslighted after They leave me out, then blame Me for not attending. It is a type of abuse that really does a number on a child to Adult relationships. I do not Trust anyone.
Having been scapegoated in my own extended family and in my husband's family has degraded my overall faith in humanity but I am still cautiously optimistic I will meet a person or people who might restore at least some of that faith. I was fortunate to have loving parents, one wonderfully loving relative and a wonderful husband.
Yes, they are out there. One of the reasons I created a more private community for FSA adult survivors to chat and connect: familyscapegoathealing.substack.com/
Thanks!
Wow - This is most unexpected - and very much appreciated, Suzanne, thank you!!
@@beyondfamilyscapegoatingabuse dear lady, if I has the privilege to sit before you in person it would cost much more ❤️
I sent you a message via Chat on my Substack site. If you aren't seeing the Welcome email with information in it to help you navigate the site let me know here so I can help. Good to see you over there!
Thank You for this. Scapegoated by inlaws 37 years ago. We cut all ties with his immediate family as a result and any other family that couldn't understand the situation. I have spent all this time not understanding how or why someone I expected to care for me could do this to another person. I relive it over and over, and I exhibit several of the traits you mention for CPTSD. I've read your book and followed you for some time now but this video really hit home.
I'm sorry this happened to you. I went through a similar experience with (former) in-laws so I understand how traumatizing this can be. Linking you to my resource list in case you are seeking additional support: familyscapegoathealing.substack.com/p/resources
@@beyondfamilyscapegoatingabuse ❤I received the link and joined for Free (for now). I want to look it over in more depth because yes, I think there are options there for my benefit.
Glad to see new insightful content on your channel!
You are describing on point how I feel and what I’m experiencing right now.. i never go out and I been depressed I believe low energy a super fatigue.. i don’t have friends and have only my dog to talk.. some days I don’t have energy to get out of bed..
We call that 'hypo-arousal' - It can be associated with complex trauma symptoms (the fatigue, inertia, etc). Linking you to my resource list in case something looks like it could be helpful: familyscapegoathealing.substack.com/p/resources
my trauma response is to call out bullshit, then leave/run away. so you can imagine how difficult this makes it to get and then keep a job, i dont start fawning like a good employee i start doing fighty things like being defensive and argumentative and passive aggressive or straight up aggressive when im around narcissistic people or situations. i dont know how im gonna make money so i decided to refocus on healing. therapy isnt an option cuz i both dont trust people or myself not to throw objects at people triggering me. so i started trying to heal alone by myse;f which of course had me flung further into the scapegoat role as on the surface im an unemployed hippy dependent on cannabis to sleep and eat, instead of the OCD-ridden high achieving academic and athlete my parents groomed me to be, with the constant knife to my back that i was wasting their life by being mediocre unless i LITERALLY got 100% as a grade or 1st place in competition.
could you do a video on the rate of unemployment and its relation to family scapegoat abuse, especially how fight response makes you a terrible or impossible employee given that the standard for employees is to put up with abuse with a charming smile.
This is an excellent idea. I plan to get some more surveys out this summer and this would be a good survey to do, and I can then address this issue in a video. Appreciate your being here.
I totally see this - I was a teacher (now just sub) , but I would quit on a dime when i felt blamed or scapegoated. I never had the verbal skills or confidence to deal with the strong personalities (other teachers, administrators)
You are spot on for so many things I was confused about.❤ I genuinely appreciate you and your efforts. Thank you
3:49
Happy to help! And thank you for supporting my FSA content with your channel membership.
I read your book and loved it. Now, gkad I found you here. This topic really hits home. It is me. Im 69 years old and have been in and out if therapy for years. Therorists, therapists, no one has been able to voice how I've felt to a point. Thank you so much
Good to have you here. I'm over on my Substack most of the time and that's where I publish my articles and have an FSA survivor community. More info' here, in case you're interested: familyscapegoathealing.substack.com/about
@@beyondfamilyscapegoatingabuse I actually signed up for Substack.
I have so much hyper-vigilance, I developed Autonomic Dysfunction finally diagnosed 12 years ago, and according to my neurologist, my autonomic nervous system is so upsidedown that it will never reverse, hed never seen it so "upside down" he said...back then I accepted the "it's genetic" cause, but now I'm starting to think it may be predisposition, but triggered by tremendous emotional neglect and scapegoating, and often cruelty in my upbringing by my mother and her "golden child" as they both have extreme mean streaks they only show to a few ppl...
This is very possible. Or, it can be both, and not either / or. Much more awareness regarding individual trauma and intergenerational trauma is needed within medical and mental health systems. Its impact on the brain is significant in many cases and should not be overlooked in treatment settings.
Every stranger that may have MADE the mistake of saying something positive ABOUT me as a child would stop my dna-dad in his tracks to explain to every stranger ever encountered that although he & wife love me equal to my GC older sibling & the FAMILY intended to birth a girl. Pop passed when I was 46, never once saying he loves me, his ACTIONS proved what was never spoken!
Heartbreaking. And to think society does not acknowledge this form of abuse. Hence my mission to get the word out about FSA.
I'm a proud owner of your book & look forward to seeing that very book being gifted to "someone" of whom like me (@60) that the problem in this family isn't so much me but the problem is the three "Special NEEDS" Elders in an Authoritarian Christian hierarchy. Being born last doesn't mean in the end I'm still last.
This is not a joke. I used to think I could never get married because my dad would do everything to embarass, harass and humiliate me and I could not do that on my wedding day. I actually thought about that all the time, how would I just not invite him? Never thought that I could go no contact. That would mean totally eliminating valuable other family I thought. Now, all these many years later I'm living within a mile of all my family for the first time in 25 years and the amount of pain I have been in is just indescribable being in contact with them. For the first time in my life I am considering changing my name, cancelling my long time cell number and going 100% no contact.
It's no joke, indeed. Linking you to my resource list for FSA survivor for more education and support: familyscapegoathealing.substack.com/p/resources
Great job, so helpful and healing for so many. May everything get healthier through understanding these concepts better. Thank you
You're very welcome!
Isolation is a coping mechanism spread especially in western society. The hyper vigilance is an uncomfortable felt sense, which costs lots of energy. So true. I know that that feeling, other peoples vibe of hyper vigilance, I can't stand so i avoid it.
As I became more self aware how critical some people look at me outside my home, I rather not share my energy with them. Not like the way they watch me. That reminds me on my narc. mother, which had an constant critical gaze on me.
So, no wonder I avoid contact with people. Most of them in the head and have that sharp look. That harsh energy is triggering my childhood trauma. I have been beaten on daily base, and thought that normal. To see those sharp peoples look I know it's NOT NORMAL. I feel even that the healed people stay rather at home..
Thank Rebecca for that video. That's key to embrace myself for isolating, not banishing and feeling bad. I am even proud of myself for having that sensitivity to protect myself of radical behaivoring people. Looking with knife eyes.
I like to not call my healthy choice, not wanting to crapfit with peoples energy doesn't please me, Isolation, That makes me again to something awkward and ill.
I feel healthy.. I just understand and support My personal individual vibe.
And many people maybe cant fit to that, because I still. mirror their unprocessed pain.
u r smart
43 and still in isolation, everyday in public gets better and better as I know who I am and becoming conscious of that.
Good to hear.
Yes, I have been scapegoated in many relationships in my life. Thank goodness I went to counseling and understand myself more thoroughly and now help others with their family traumas! Full circle.
Paying it forward!
As scapegoated by my mother who passed in 2018 at age 101 🥵, and older sister who is still alive, 🙄,
I find strength in my capabilities, my talents & resourcefulness. The love of my grand children & their parents, lol my busy kids, and the appreciation of my husband of 40 years. I still have many hurts and don’t understand why some people are so uncaring. But, nothing is equal, life is not fair. We have to make the best of what we are Blessed with. Thank you, Rebecca, you beautiful Doll. 🙏🏼🤍🙏🏼
Thank you, Christina, for your inspiring message, one which suggests you have come to a place of hart-earned 'radical acceptance' regarding the impact of FSA.
I am still the scapegoat. I wasn't really when I was younger. But now I am somehow. Because I tell the truth against abusers and narcissists that surround me. So yes indeed I isolate a lot. Because I'm gaslit all the time and blamed for absolutely everything.
Understandable. Here's my resource list, in case you are seeking more education or support: familyscapegoathealing.substack.com/p/resources
I am so glad to have found you, Rebecca C. Mandeville. I think you are wonderful. Thank you so much for sharing your insight! ❤
Very glad you're here! And thank you. Linking you to my FSA survivor resource list in case you are seeking additional support ideas: familyscapegoathealing.substack.com/p/resources
I have seen one who was not allowed to be an individual,if they at all ever tried were shut down by the gang,so not existing became a safe narrative,which then created a loss of self,so the chameleon would come out,this individual would mirror anyone they were with so as to fit in and be ok. Been very interesting to watch this
You summarize this process very well.
Yes, that was a big shock for me as well when I realized this (!)
Great points! thank you!🙏
Glad it was helpful.
This has described me to a T. I believe I was the family scapegoat. I've recently went no contact with my family. Definitely a ton of complex trauma. I've always been very socially isolated. I'm married with two children but I have virtually no friends. I enjoy being alone at home but I do long to have authentic connections. I also struggle with feeling like there isn't anyone that I actually CAN connect with. Our family cat Honey is an amazing emotional support animal.
If that's the case, you may want to read my introductory book on FSA - it's linked at the top of my FSA survivor resource list here: familyscapegoathealing.substack.com/p/resources
Another excellent Rebecca, thank you 💚
Video lol
Glad you enjoyed it!
Let me introduce myself....Rebecca just did it for me. Thank you Rebeca
!! Glad you're here. Linking you to my resource list in case you are seeking additional support: familyscapegoathealing.substack.com/p/resources
@@beyondfamilyscapegoatingabuse Thank you Rebecca, I'm watching from Australia
Down under!
This is an awesome share! Thank you for doing this. 👍👍👍
You are so welcome!
Thank you, education empowers! 🙏
You're welcome 😊 You may want to subscribe to my Substack for FSA survivors as well - More info' here: familyscapegoathealing.substack.com/about
Great information, thanks! I'd love to hear a little more about what the latest research on the development of PDs is. You touched on what sounds like some interesting new insights. 🤔
I'll need to look into that. I did post an article awhile back with the latest research on narcissism, which is always a hot topic, as come refuse to believe that there can be brain differences or severe trauma fueling the the NPD presentation.
@@beyondfamilyscapegoatingabuse Oh, I'll have a look at that article you've got. Thanks. 👍
I think my experiences with family of origin and ex partners who seemed to be NPDs, and doing enough healing work to accept what my needs are and what I want, has made me no longer force myself to be interested in compromising for impulsive superficial interactions which go no where. It's lonely to not care about what the general population seems to care about. This explains why I settled for NPD relationships most of my life.
If it were up to me, I'd be in a *safe*, close wonderful marriage, and have *safe*, close connected relationships with relatives. But not with my relatives (besides my awesome kids). And I don't have a best friend or partner. A lot of my needs go unmet.
Sounds very wise and that you have experiences some profound awarenesses that now support your healing. Thank you for sharing this with us here. Linking you to my resource list in case you are interested in exploring other sources of support: familyscapegoathealing.substack.com/p/resources
I identify with this. I always feel so exposed and judged in group settings. I work in the field in my company, but weekly we have meetings and they are like torture. I'm fine meeting with patients one on one, but in a group I just get so much anxiety and feel like I don't belong even when people go out of their way to include me. After the meetings I dissect everything I said and did to see if I did anything embarrassing or worthy of criticism.
I hope this video did give you a bit of insight as to why this could be the case. Glad you're here.
Thank you Rebecca ❤
Hi Leslie! You're welcome.
Thank you for this insightful video! I love your work so much and you’ve been so helpful to me. And thank you so so much for changing the chime. Was so much easier to listen to your video in my car as I’m driving! ❤🤗 I commented about this a few weeks ago and I appreciate you allowing me to be my authentic self and your ability to respond so thoughtfully and graciously. As you know, that’s not always our experience.. I appreciate that very much.
You are so welcome! I actually realized my nervous system (and my ears) was also bothered by the chime so I figured it might bother others. So I'm glad you wrote in because that made my decision to switch to something else easy!
Just to think about, and considering FSA is an issue all on its own. How does social transformation engineering influence this in all environments? It’s supposed to reflect better and better evidence-based outcomes, but seems to be worse and worse. Hegelian dialectic structuring? Society at large off-loading on families that increase internal family stress. As a symptom of Societal Scapegoat Abuse (SSA) systems. For further underside research, it is real.
You nailed it. Thank you. You may be interested in a more transpersonal 2-part video series I did on systemic splitting and FSA. Part 2 is linked to the end of part 1: ruclips.net/video/4CFqA0yWPhs/видео.html
Thank you so much for posting this video. I'm struggling with cptsd due to scapegoat trauma and it helps me understand why I feel so depressed in groups in the workplace especially. I feel like this traumatic family game is playing over and over again when I'm around colleagues or bosses. It's so terrific that I feel the urge to escape. Work is like jail to me with fake parents and siblings all over the place. Gosh, it's so exhausting. How can we overcome this?
With my clients, I start by treating complex trauma. I do have an FSA survivor resource list here, feel free to peruse it in case you see something potentially helpful: familyscapegoathealing.substack.com/p/resources
❤️
Does RUclips membership to your channel also include membership to the sub stack? Thank you Rebecca
No, these are separate. Substack is where I am starting to consolidate all of my work but I plan to remain here on RUclips as well. My Substack has community features like group chat for paid subscribers. Free subscribers receive my articles and newsletter in their inbox or can access them from the Substack mobile phone app.
Thanks again
Always welcome
I have been trying to go to a shoe store across town. for over 2 weeks. My brain cannot make my body go. Taking special forms of low thc cannabis helps me leave the house but I have decided to take a break for my brain chemistry. It shouldn’t take weed to make me leave the house. Wtf? c-PTSD is hellish.
Sorry to hear it. I discuss complex trauma and FSA in detail on my playlist for clinicians and survivors on the home page of my channel here.
100%
Thank you for explaining all of this I feel normal now having this understanding. I do want friends but don’t know how to do that I was
punished as a child for bringing friends home.
So sorry to hear this. Linking you to my FSA survivor resource list for more education and support: familyscapegoathealing.substack.com/p/resources
For me, it's not that I feel like I am worthless but I feel unwanted. The difference is, I know I deserve better but no one cares that I do. Therefore, I pull back and do things for myself despite of everything.
When I let people in, they are fine if it appears that I'm not doing anything but when it is clear that I was working for something and I starting to see results then they hate me...treating me like I don't deserve it. I disagree and I know that I do.
I do fawn so that they won't hurt me but I find a way to get away from them (no contact).
Sounds like you have a great deal of self-awareness, which is very helpful when on the recovery path. Linking you to my resource list for FSA survivors for more education and support: familyscapegoathealing.substack.com/p/resources
I have a cousin who like me was the family scapegoat. I am the only family member she remains in contact with.
My golden child sister is really down on this cousin and says she's on the autism spectrum. This may be true, but my sister herself is much further along the spectrum IMO! The hypocrisy is sickening.
Nobody in the family asks WHY she is not in contact. The fact she suffered violence from her father and brother is explained away. She was stubborn and difficult they say. As if that's an excuse for violence. All the family's resources, financial, emotional, time resources went into the brother, even though he was violent, tortured animals, came home drunk etc. When he died it was a relief.
Nobody except me has reached out to her. I understand because my experience is similar to hers.
I addressed this very thing in a recent video: "The hypocrisy is sickening.
Nobody in the family asks WHY she is not in contact."
Thank you Rebecca.
I really like the egg analogy.
I experienced further scapegoating in churches.
I think more traumatic for me than FOO and that was bad.
I have dogs. Known as ANNE'S mom. My beloved pet, family, and friend. Absolutely adorable..
I survived growing up by riding my horse down long country roads with my dog at my side.
Dreaming that God made a great big beautiful world and some day I would see it. And dreamed about moving away to the Pacific NW (I didn't even know what that meant or where it was).
There's a reason you haven't heard from me. I will explain when we DO connect.
Thank you, appreciate you so much. Jane Green
Oh goodness, we are both horse people, I didn't realize that! Yes, looking forward to hearing from you, I'll tell April to alert me and I'll answer you personally when you write.
@@beyondfamilyscapegoatingabuse Yes! I grew up on the back of a horse. Did my first Barrel Racing competition at 4 yrs old!
Horses have such gentle souls.
Here's a funny story for you...when I was very young my brother and I shared a horse. We were riding double around the farm and a summer thunderstorm popped up so mom let us ride our horse into the house so our saddle wouldn't get wet! Lol
My brother had a massive stroke, tomorrow morning the plug will be pulled and he will be riding in heaven.
Oh, I'm so very sorry to hear this, Jane. Now I understand why your writing back has been delayed. Sending healing thoughts and prayers your way...
@@beyondfamilyscapegoatingabuse Yes, and as you well know in the dysfunctional family there is ALOT more to the story.
Thank you Rebecca, I appreciate your kind words and understanding.
Jane
Hello Rebecca
I really enjoy watching your channel; it is the only one that I know of that deals primarily with family-scapegoating abuse.
My parents were narcissists, and I was their scapegoat. Over the last few years, I have been gradually unravelling how this has affected my mind.
I am trying to learn as much as I can, and I see that you are happy to answer questions, so I was wondering whether you would be able to answer the following ones for me, please:
1. Which is worse -- two NPD parents or two BPD ones?
2. Is communal narcissism a form of covert narcissism?
3. Can someone with NPD be a "people pleaser", and if they can, does that mean that they're a narc/empath hybrid?
4. Can an empath have NPD or BPD?
5. Can empaths have narcissistic traits?
6. Is an empath a narcissist with high empathy?
7. If NPD is a disorder, then does that mean that the narc's real personality is 'underneath' the disorder?
Thanks very much!
Glad you're finding my content helpful. Great questions - but too many for me to answer here. I'll add them to my topics list.
@@beyondfamilyscapegoatingabuse Thanks, Rebecca -- I'll watch out for them!
👍
Consider joining my Substack community for FSA survivors as well, its on my resource list here: familyscapegoathealing.substack.com/p/resources
Would it be fair to say that a reason we are scapegoated at work and other places is because people unconsciously pick up on our lack of confidence and self-esteem and sink the boot in?
This can sometimes be the case, but what is often at the root is unconscious projection processes carried over from one's original famiiy system. I'm releasing an article on projection processes over on my Substack tomorrow - you can subscribe for free to access it once it is release at 8 am PST. familyscapegoathealing.substack.com/
Absolutely. It is very much an issue. One reason in my case (and I'm sure in many others) is parents who scapegoat their ecosystem is very much with others with a similar mindset so you don't have friends of the family who can help you either. This puts you an extreme disadvantage. In my case also part of my religious upbringing in my case it was Jewish schools also sometimes private school have blame the victim mindsets.
And so you can't even rely on anyone in your own ecosystem. Which makes it very hard. I recently was seeing someone who reached out to me and sadly I see she is basically victim blaming me. My family hasn't invited for holidays for over 25 years which is not normal.
There also is an extreme gender ideas in my family.
Very well said. I agree with your summation, and I also like your 'ecosystem' reference. This goes hand-in-hand with Family Systems theory, btw. Thank you for your insightful comment.
CPTSD keeps me isolated 😔
Yes, this definitely happens. Here's my follow up video with steps one can take to overcome social isolation: ruclips.net/video/UimjZ5graRc/видео.html
Could you expand on your definition of “narcissist family”? Like a parent that leads with a “My way or the highway mentality”?
A narcissistic family is primarily influenced by a parent (or other influential 'power-holding' family member) with Narcissistic Personality Disorder (NPD) and this is typically what is fueling the scapegoating, versus the Family Projective Identification Process common in highly traumatized dysfunctional family systems that scapegoat. I have some videos on this but you might start with these two resources here: 1) www.scapegoatrecovery.com/2021/08/21/recognizing-narcissistic-family-abuse/ 2) and my article / video here: www.scapegoatrecovery.com/2023/02/04/scapegoating-in-narcissistic-family-systems/
Hello Rebecca, thank you for sharing your knowledge and experience, and for all of the work you've put into the videos on your channel. I am curious about the concept of enmeshment of people in the family system. I've heard this concept mentioned several times in various videos on dysfunctional families, but my understanding of this phenomena still feels murky. From what I can piece together, it sounds like enmeshment is when there is a highly sensitized reactivity in the family emotional system to the emotional states and responses of other significant family bonds, such that family members become overly responsive to or disproportionately impacted by the emotions and/or perspectives of other family members. What am I missing in this description? Anybody interested in adding any details?
Great question - and very insightful. Your question(s) can be answered in part by what Family Systems theorist Murray Bowen (who I reference in my introductory book on FSA, 'Rejected, Shamed, and Blamed') calls the 'Nuclear Family Emotional System'. The focus is on differentiation versus intense fusion between nuclear family members and the consequences to the system based on the dynamics playing out. This ties directly into enmeshment in dysfunctional family systems. I invite you to take a look at this here PDF here and then get back to me with your thoughts: courses.aiu.edu/FUNDAMENTALS%20OF%20FAMILY%20THEORY/SESSION%206/6.pdf