Paul definitely ignored the fact that his room is 9x12. The problem with big speakers in tiny rooms like that is that if you keep them away from the walls as Paul said, then you're into a very nearfield experience. And the problem with nearfield listening to speakers that are tall and skinny like the FRs are several, not the least of which is a lack of coherence between the drivers. A very close listening position mandated by such a tiny room like that would be MUCH better served by a concentric speaker such as a Tannoy, DeVore or perhaps even best, the KEF LS50. PSA is coming out with a bookshelf FR speaker so that could be a good option too. Low end should be handled by a subwoofer.
I think he prob thought he read 19X12..lol. 9X12 is a small bedroom. I have a 12X10X8 room and a pair of Sonusfaber Oly 1s and a few subs are a plenty.
Dyanudio Evoke 10 has the midbass and tweeter positioned very close to each other and also works well in my 9x9 study, with a surprising amount of quality bass to boot as per this demo - ruclips.net/video/at8oFv3tvJA/видео.html
I moved house & lost my beloved dedicated music room. Room is now 18x25. I had Dali rubicon 8's which I loved but were far too big & overloaded the room. Settled on the KEF LS60s, they work so well with the concentric driver in a smaller room.
I finally had the opportunity to listen to the Aspen fr20 at the Dutch Audio Event in Veldhoven(Netherland) very nice round sounding speakers, great job. I liked it very much. unfortunate Chris and you were'nt present. Would have like to have a little chat. Until the next show. Nice you are finally touching European grounds🔨
9 x 12 kind of fits my definition of a “little bedroom.” I’m not sure if Paul was really paying attention to the room dimensions as he read them. Paul said you need to have “a few feet behind them”, and the speaker is already nearly two feet deep, so even if you put them on the short wall firing down the long way on the room, the front of the speaker is going to be approaching the mid point of the room, and uncomfortably close to the listening position.
Agreed. The speakers could work, but don't plan to do anything else in the room or have more than one or two people in it. If they are on a 6' triangle with the baffle 4' from the wall behind the speakers, then the listener will be sitting with their head 2' from the rear wall. Tight but that will get them to image. Definitely want some treatment at the first reflection points.
@@user-od9iz9cv1w pretty much I am at a 5 ft 6 inch triangle and yes there's a few feet at best behind me. I run Olympica 1s and some subs. GIK panels all over. The 10X12 room is big enough for ONE listener.
Hi Paul. I’m in the industry, though I hardly claim to have your depth of knowledge. However….small rooms WILL have inherently greater issues with room modes. Bass wavelengths are long, as you know of course. And in a small room, you can have insane peaks and dips in response. Now what I think you were alluding to was a smaller speaker is better suited to a room in which it isn’t tasked with trying to energize a large acoustic space. But it is also true that large spaces have less dramatic room modes. This of course is one reason why for concert spaces and symphony halls, room modes just aren’t a thing. So an important distinction in my opinion to note that difference and understanding that the trade off of bass in a small room is that yes, it’s easier to energize. But the variation in response can be pretty nutty. Thanks for the always great and informative videos.
Heard them yesterday in The Netherlands at the Dutch Audio Event. Powered by a complete PS Audio set, they sounded magnificent! One of the best sets of the show, hands down.
The problem is that if you only have a room that size,then you most often don't have enough space to pull the speakers far enough away from the wall. You always see that in speaker-reviews: "this speaker is perfect for small rooms, you just have to make sure there's at least 3 to 4 feet distance to the wall". Most people can't do that, especially if it's a livingroom.
Interesting. My room is 10x12x9h and I have my speakers in a 6x6x6 equilateral triangle…speakers are about 3 feet into the room. Probably not ideal…but what is in this world. That said, the sound is pretty great - I’m pleased with soundstage width and depth, and I don’t hear any issues with driver coherence with it being a three-way tower. 🤷🏼♂️
@@finscreennamethe depth of the speaker is included in the distance from the wall.. the “required” distance is from the wall to the FRONT of the speaker !!!!
Heard those FR20s at the Dutch Audio Event last Saturday. Amazing looking speakers that sounded great. Maybe it was the volume of the demo but I think they need enough space to breathe. For my listening room of about 6 x 4 meters I would probably go for the FR10's. Hope to see Paul and his team next year with the FR10 and FR5’s (and FR sub?) . p.s.: the FR20 costs 26,000 euros (27,500 dollars) here in The Netherlands. Unfortunately, due to VAT, import duties etc. that is a lot more than in the USA (15,000 dollars).
My dedicated music room is 9'W x 10'L x 11'H (small unused bedroom)! Had 2-way .5cf stand monitors playing beautiful "large soundstage acoustical" music these past 20 years...never considered full range towers! This past June and with a 27% sale and 30-day trial period, got in 3-way 1.5cf floor standing Towers that has blown my mind! Top to Bottom Sonic Improvements unveil themselves in every possible transducer/soundstage presentation category (realism, timbre, tonality, holographics, articulation, clarity, transients, details, dynamics, etc.)!!! Soundstage 3D Presentation has extended even further than before, now the room boundaries are Totally Blown Away ( Width=30ft, Depth=40ft, Height=50ft)! Believe what Paul has stated, the FR10 or FR20 Can work in a small listening space! How can this be for a small 90sf listening space...by a SYNERGISTIC Balance of Recording, Components, Speakers, Cabling, Setup and Room Acoustics!! 😉😎
My room is 4m wide by 5m long and 8ft high. Had to get rid of my floorstanders when I moved in, too boomy. I now have standmount speakers with treatment which works. I wouldn't dream of attempting to house those FR20's in my room. Think that's some bad advice Paul.
I would love to hear more about which speakers work better close to walls/corners and which "need some room to breath". If you have a room with large windows (floor to ceiling on 3 sides) but want to place the speakers and screen at one end (with glass behind and marble tiled floors) are there soe speakers that work better in this (without covering over the glass) OR will all sound lousy unless the glass is treated.
There’s no way a 12x9 room will easily accommodate those speakers. That’s a small room and as Paul said, they need breathing room behind the speakers which would put your listening position right on the back wall, which by the way, you also want to avoid. In my opinion, a room that size is best served with small towers or bookshelf speakers on stands and a quality subwoofer properly placed in room and calibrated.
Best room? Have the correct LxHxW formula for sound. Even if it is small, you are way ahead of the game. Then proper room treatment. The room is more important than the gear for best sound.
9x12, unless I’m missing something it pretty darn small, and could only imagine a chair and a lamp and hardly and room remaining for the equipment rack. Sounds to me like a room for stand mounted speakers and a small REL sub.
@@hushpuppykl My home office/listening room is a spare bedroom 12x12. Even with the extra 3 feet in one dimension there is no way I could comfortably listen to speakers that large in such a space. It’s absurd. My 12” x 36” x 14” (deep) bookshelf speakers on stands are already borderline.
The real test of any big speakers how well they play out in a big room because that’s why you have a big speaker. Sure they work in a 9 x 12 room but it’s overkill. Small speaker, small area. Large speaker, large area. Simple..
Missing a lot of parts in this video. Not just room size. Source material. ..amplifier power and amplifier headroom. DAC..?? Hi-res 24/192..?? Dolby Atoms..?? Spatial audio.??
Still don't understand the logic of the names... The FR30 should have been named FR40 (because the 4x woofers), FR30 for a 3x woofer setup, FR20 for the dual woofers and FR10 for a single woofer floorstanding (not counting the passive drivers).
I herd both 20 and 30s. Great sounding speakers and relatively cheap in context of high end HiFi. However, Paul's advice is completely wrong. Having near full range multi driver speaker 6 to 8 feet from listening position is not optimal and waste of money. I would go with KEF LS60 for room this size if you need 3 way speaker. Something like Reidho mini monitors would be perfect. I listened to them at Munich show in 2022, filling room at least 25 by 25 feet. Obviously only going down to 50Hz or so.
Paul, when you say "fill the room", what volume level are you tallking about, moderate listening or are we talking very loud levels? I think the question your viewer asked needs further clarification. Knowing this info affects the decision. Thank you
@@artyfhartie2269 I’m pretty sure the cabinets and drivers are made in Asia. Whether enough of the assembly is done in the States to label them as “Made in the USA” isn’t clear.
I don’t think this is too difficult to figure out. Some want to “feel” the music. Others just want to “listen” to the music. Feel vs Listening. The listening group has the best advantage They can use small bookshelf speakers in a 30 X 30 X 10 foot room and listen just fine. No problem. It’s the Feel group that always has the most ongoing demanding issues. That is where the manufacturing profits comes into the picture. Feel means more 💰💰💰💰💰💰💰💰💰💰💰💰💰💰💰💰💰💰💰💰💰💰 The only side note to all this are.. .. the deaf groups and the mentally unstable groups.
A QUESTION: Should people with small rooms be audiophiles? If you don't have a decent size room, you're not going to get anything even close to approaching realism. So why bother? Those you listen nearfield with the speakers only 6 feet away; if they think they're hearing realism of imaging, they are great at pretending. Just isn't going to happen. With nearfield listening, it sounds like you are listening to 2D cardboard cutouts. You have to be sitting further away from the speakers than that, for the instruments themseves to sound truly 3D. It sounds like the instruments have a front but no back.
You have several problems. Speakers should be 4 foot from walls, your speakers are too close to the walls. For best imaging speakers should be 4 foot & 6 inches apart, then farther apart they lose imaging, & at 8 feet apart they wont image at all. Your speakers dont have seperate enclosers & ports for each driver like PSB speakers do, Large cabinets make speakers sound dull. Two woofers the same size are no better than one woofer the same sizw. A big boom has less bass, & less volume.
Наука
Paul definitely ignored the fact that his room is 9x12. The problem with big speakers in tiny rooms like that is that if you keep them away from the walls as Paul said, then you're into a very nearfield experience. And the problem with nearfield listening to speakers that are tall and skinny like the FRs are several, not the least of which is a lack of coherence between the drivers. A very close listening position mandated by such a tiny room like that would be MUCH better served by a concentric speaker such as a Tannoy, DeVore or perhaps even best, the KEF LS50. PSA is coming out with a bookshelf FR speaker so that could be a good option too. Low end should be handled by a subwoofer.
I think he prob thought he read 19X12..lol. 9X12 is a small bedroom. I have a 12X10X8 room and a pair of Sonusfaber Oly 1s and a few subs are a plenty.
Dyanudio Evoke 10 has the midbass and tweeter positioned very close to each other and also works well in my 9x9 study, with a surprising amount of quality bass to boot as per this demo - ruclips.net/video/at8oFv3tvJA/видео.html
I moved house & lost my beloved dedicated music room. Room is now 18x25. I had Dali rubicon 8's which I loved but were far too big & overloaded the room. Settled on the KEF LS60s, they work so well with the concentric driver in a smaller room.
I finally had the opportunity to listen to the Aspen fr20 at the Dutch Audio Event in Veldhoven(Netherland) very nice round sounding speakers, great job. I liked it very much. unfortunate Chris and you were'nt present. Would have like to have a little chat. Until the next show. Nice you are finally touching European grounds🔨
9 x 12 kind of fits my definition of a “little bedroom.” I’m not sure if Paul was really paying attention to the room dimensions as he read them.
Paul said you need to have “a few feet behind them”, and the speaker is already nearly two feet deep, so even if you put them on the short wall firing down the long way on the room, the front of the speaker is going to be approaching the mid point of the room, and uncomfortably close to the listening position.
Agreed. The speakers could work, but don't plan to do anything else in the room or have more than one or two people in it.
If they are on a 6' triangle with the baffle 4' from the wall behind the speakers, then the listener will be sitting with their head 2' from the rear wall. Tight but that will get them to image. Definitely want some treatment at the first reflection points.
@@user-od9iz9cv1w pretty much I am at a 5 ft 6 inch triangle and yes there's a few feet at best behind me. I run Olympica 1s and some subs. GIK panels all over. The 10X12 room is big enough for ONE listener.
Hi Paul. I’m in the industry, though I hardly claim to have your depth of knowledge. However….small rooms WILL have inherently greater issues with room modes. Bass wavelengths are long, as you know of course. And in a small room, you can have insane peaks and dips in response. Now what I think you were alluding to was a smaller speaker is better suited to a room in which it isn’t tasked with trying to energize a large acoustic space. But it is also true that large spaces have less dramatic room modes. This of course is one reason why for concert spaces and symphony halls, room modes just aren’t a thing. So an important distinction in my opinion to note that difference and understanding that the trade off of bass in a small room is that yes, it’s easier to energize. But the variation in response can be pretty nutty. Thanks for the always great and informative videos.
Heard them yesterday in The Netherlands at the Dutch Audio Event. Powered by a complete PS Audio set, they sounded magnificent! One of the best sets of the show, hands down.
Do they have a official dealer in the Netherlands? Never saw a lot of PS audio products here.
Not in The Netherlands, but Aspera Audio is the Benelux dealer. They are based in Brasschaat, Belgium
Was there too. Very nice speaker. Unfortunate the fr30 were not available for demo. Would have been exciting to hear them 2🔥
The problem is that if you only have a room that size,then you most often don't have enough space to pull the speakers far enough away from the wall.
You always see that in speaker-reviews: "this speaker is perfect for small rooms, you just have to make sure there's at least 3 to 4 feet distance to the wall".
Most people can't do that, especially if it's a livingroom.
3 feet from the wall and your chair 3 feet from the back wall means the speakers are sitting 6 feet from you in a 12 foot room. Not ideal.
@@finscreenname The speakers themselves are 19 inches deep
@@gotham61 Now you are 3 and half feet from them.....
Interesting. My room is 10x12x9h and I have my speakers in a 6x6x6 equilateral triangle…speakers are about 3 feet into the room. Probably not ideal…but what is in this world. That said, the sound is pretty great - I’m pleased with soundstage width and depth, and I don’t hear any issues with driver coherence with it being a three-way tower. 🤷🏼♂️
@@finscreennamethe depth of the speaker is included in the distance from the wall.. the “required” distance is from the wall to the FRONT of the speaker !!!!
Heard those FR20s at the Dutch Audio Event last Saturday. Amazing looking speakers that sounded great. Maybe it was the volume of the demo but I think they need enough space to breathe. For my listening room of about 6 x 4 meters I would probably go for the FR10's. Hope to see Paul and his team next year with the FR10 and FR5’s (and FR sub?) . p.s.: the FR20 costs 26,000 euros (27,500 dollars) here in The Netherlands. Unfortunately, due to VAT, import duties etc. that is a lot more than in the USA (15,000 dollars).
Would love to see more videos with the FR10's
My dedicated music room is 9'W x 10'L x 11'H (small unused bedroom)! Had 2-way .5cf stand monitors playing beautiful "large soundstage acoustical" music these past 20 years...never considered full range towers!
This past June and with a 27% sale and 30-day trial period, got in 3-way 1.5cf floor standing Towers that has blown my mind! Top to Bottom Sonic Improvements unveil themselves in every possible transducer/soundstage presentation category (realism, timbre, tonality, holographics, articulation, clarity, transients, details, dynamics, etc.)!!! Soundstage 3D Presentation has extended even further than before, now the room boundaries are Totally Blown Away ( Width=30ft, Depth=40ft, Height=50ft)!
Believe what Paul has stated, the FR10 or FR20 Can work in a small listening space! How can this be for a small 90sf listening space...by a SYNERGISTIC Balance of Recording, Components, Speakers, Cabling, Setup and Room Acoustics!! 😉😎
If I put fr20s in my small living room and have them room to breathe I'd have to put the couch out on the patio. fr10s are more suited for 9x12 room.
Paul previously said the FR30s have a switch in the crossover to help alleviate the need for back space. Do the 5s, 10s and 20s have it too?
I've checked it at the show and there was no tweeter in the back of the fr20
My room is 4m wide by 5m long and 8ft high. Had to get rid of my floorstanders when I moved in, too boomy. I now have standmount speakers with treatment which works. I wouldn't dream of attempting to house those FR20's in my room. Think that's some bad advice Paul.
You need room treatment. Just because one set of speakers are boomy in room doesn't mean all are.
@@Pete.across.the.street pretty much a good rule of thumb. Floorstanders don't do well in small rooms.. First day of hi fi school. 🙄
@@johnbritton895 mine do great in a small room
@@Pete.across.the.street What speakers? And what size of room? 🤔
I would love to hear more about which speakers work better close to walls/corners and which "need some room to breath". If you have a room with large windows (floor to ceiling on 3 sides) but want to place the speakers and screen at one end (with glass behind and marble tiled floors) are there soe speakers that work better in this (without covering over the glass) OR will all sound lousy unless the glass is treated.
There’s no way a 12x9 room will easily accommodate those speakers. That’s a small room and as Paul said, they need breathing room behind the speakers which would put your listening position right on the back wall, which by the way, you also want to avoid. In my opinion, a room that size is best served with small towers or bookshelf speakers on stands and a quality subwoofer properly placed in room and calibrated.
Best room? Have the correct LxHxW formula for sound. Even if it is small, you are way ahead of the game. Then proper room treatment. The room is more important than the gear for best sound.
What would be the max size room for the FR20s?
1" !.... youre blessed. ive shrunk 3"
9x12, unless I’m missing something it pretty darn small, and could only imagine a chair and a lamp and hardly and room remaining for the equipment rack. Sounds to me like a room for stand mounted speakers and a small REL sub.
2 12" Rythmiks work.
15K a pair? Must be nice.
Inches. We all lose height during the day as our spine’s discs lose hydration. Just a hifi diversion !!
Waiting for the FR5's for $2000?
When do the FR- .25's come out? The 10's are still big speakers.
FR5's will be small monitor speakers.
I'd love to have a dedicated listening room, but none of the rooms in my house are anywhere near big enough. 😞
Those massive things in a 9x12 room? With “a couple feet” behind them? You sure Paul?
2’ to front wall
1’ for speakers
6’ to sitting position
1’ for chair
2’ to rear wall
That’s all. 😂
@@hushpuppyklspeakers are nearly 2’ deep
I agree
@@hushpuppykl My home office/listening room is a spare bedroom 12x12. Even with the extra 3 feet in one dimension there is no way I could comfortably listen to speakers that large in such a space. It’s absurd. My 12” x 36” x 14” (deep) bookshelf speakers on stands are already borderline.
The real test of any big speakers how well they play out in a big room because that’s why you have a big speaker. Sure they work in a 9 x 12 room but it’s overkill. Small speaker, small area. Large speaker, large area. Simple..
fr 40 with 10 inch woofers and fr 50 with 12" .. and one or two bookshef monitors.
Missing a lot of parts in this video. Not just room size.
Source material. ..amplifier power and amplifier headroom. DAC..?? Hi-res 24/192..??
Dolby Atoms..?? Spatial audio.??
Still don't understand the logic of the names...
The FR30 should have been named FR40 (because the 4x woofers), FR30 for a 3x woofer setup, FR20 for the dual woofers and FR10 for a single woofer floorstanding (not counting the passive drivers).
I herd both 20 and 30s. Great sounding speakers and relatively cheap in context of high end HiFi.
However, Paul's advice is completely wrong.
Having near full range multi driver speaker 6 to 8 feet from listening position is not optimal and waste of money.
I would go with KEF LS60 for room this size if you need 3 way speaker.
Something like Reidho mini monitors would be perfect.
I listened to them at Munich show in 2022, filling room at least 25 by 25 feet.
Obviously only going down to 50Hz or so.
Is there anywhere on the east coast I can listen to this series of speakers? Thanks
Maybe they will be exhibiting at the Capital Audio Fest next month near DC
@@gotham61 I asked Paul directly recently and they are not going to be at CAF unfortunately
Paul, when you say "fill the room", what volume level are you tallking about, moderate listening or are we talking very loud levels?
I think the question your viewer asked needs further clarification. Knowing this info affects the decision. Thank you
Beautiful loudspeakers fully made by American workers
And china. Assembled in us maybe. As so many other products.
Are you sure about that?
@@gotham61 PS Audio made in USA?
@@artyfhartie2269 I’m pretty sure the cabinets and drivers are made in Asia. Whether enough of the assembly is done in the States to label them as “Made in the USA” isn’t clear.
9 by 12 by 8 FEET? That's tiny. Are you sure it wasn't meters?
An 8 meter ceiling height?
Those woofers look so low
Anterior pelvic tilt could account for the missing inch...
I don’t think this is too difficult to figure out.
Some want to “feel” the music.
Others just want to “listen” to the music.
Feel vs Listening.
The listening group has the best advantage They can use small bookshelf speakers in a 30 X 30 X 10 foot room and listen just fine. No problem.
It’s the Feel group that always has the most ongoing demanding issues.
That is where the manufacturing profits comes into the picture.
Feel means more 💰💰💰💰💰💰💰💰💰💰💰💰💰💰💰💰💰💰💰💰💰💰
The only side note to all this are.. .. the deaf groups and the mentally unstable groups.
A QUESTION: Should people with small rooms be audiophiles? If you don't have a decent size room, you're not going to get anything even close to approaching realism. So why bother? Those you listen nearfield with the speakers only 6 feet away; if they think they're hearing realism of imaging, they are great at pretending. Just isn't going to happen. With nearfield listening, it sounds like you are listening to 2D cardboard cutouts. You have to be sitting further away from the speakers than that, for the instruments themseves to sound truly 3D. It sounds like the instruments have a front but no back.
Tiny room.Aspens will be way to big.
You have several problems. Speakers should be 4 foot from walls, your speakers are too close to the walls. For best imaging speakers should be 4 foot & 6 inches apart, then farther apart they lose imaging, & at 8 feet apart they wont image at all. Your speakers dont have seperate enclosers & ports for each driver like PSB speakers do, Large cabinets make speakers sound dull. Two woofers the same size are no better than one woofer the same sizw. A big boom has less bass, & less volume.
Ah. Paul.
Mostly perfect advice.
🤌🏾