Thanks. The Savages seem to be good shooters. Pretty encouraging for a 1st stab at me loading for this. Especially considering the wind was gusty & swirling. It was this outing that really got me into looking at how much POI shift a gust can cause, even at just 100 yards. It only takes 7 mph for a 55 gr at 3000 fps to move .85". I have written down 8-10 mph & 13 mph gusts on the paper from this day. It's never constant. So now I'm recording the readings on the anemometer. Next time I'll have flags or ribbons hanging at the target and at the bench. You can really hear some differences in wind in a few of these groups from the 1st shot to the 4th or 5th shot...especially the last group! I think it may have been shooting even better than the numbers might show. I'll have to duplicate these loads and try some others. The blitzking I especially just threw together at the last second, and the one with x-term was pretty slow. I do like the accu-trigger. Have you shot yours yet, with any factory or your hand loads?
thanks. I blame my vision. The sunglasses were on early in the video, but I forget to put them back on after when I have to see something close-by. I have a new pair of prescription glasses that have the transition lenses, so I hopefully don't forget to put them on each time.
Nice! I bought a some of the 60 gr to test into gel through the AR pretty soon, and may slow them a bit depending on what I see. I have it in my mind it could be an ideal defensive load, but we'll see if anything penetrates or if it just flies apart. I also got a box of Ammo Inc factory to compare against and will be testing some groups from the Axis, too.
I totally agree. I just usually buy a box to see where they seat them and what velocity and just as a baseline for groups. But yeah, they are almost always seated way too deep for any real accuracy in a bolt-action.
I have not. I have my hands full with other calibers, so I don't know when I'll get back to testing more .223. I definitely want to. I do want to see what I can do with the AR, too. That was the powder you used?
@@ShastaBean The Blitzkings were in factory ADI ammo. I've used the AR-Comp with 77gr Berger OTM's but I want to pick up some 55gr Blitzking and try them with that powder.
@@rustynut1967 OH! I forgot I had bought some HSM Varmint Blue rounds that I never got around to shooting. Not many make completed rounds w/the blitzkings. Those are going with me to the range next time and should at least give me a decent basis for comparison. I don't have the twist rate to really spend any time with any of the heavy bullets. With all the stupid news of bills being run thru the house, I have been thinking about another AR before I no longer can, and thinking a 1:8. I have Ramshot TAC to try, in addition to the ones I used here with the ELD-M. I only have these 3 bullets, so far. And probably not going to tinker with much else any time soon. I've for sure created a combination-overload situation with the various powders, bullets and primers as it is. Fun, though. Those OTMs might be good at a long distance if you can stabilize them?
@@johnganshow5536 Is that a new model? I don't recall seeing it before. I do see it looks to have a shorter (20") barrel. I shot some more handloads last weekend, but still haven't gone through the targets, chrono, & footage yet. But they weren't spectacular, but also not horrible It was new loads, and seeing what I could do with light-for-caliber 40g VMAX bullets. No huge groups, but nothing under 1". Which I'm fine with, considering 1st stab at powder calculations for velocity baseline. I'm confident I can tighten them up with this rifle.
I've only had like two outings where it wasn't doing this swirling/gusting thing. I think I need to start going earlier in the morning. I only have these 3 projectiles for .223 at this point. I am going to just stick with them, and see if I can find a good result. The other calibers I bought a lot of various types to start testing with. It gets really overwhelming doing it that way along with many powders. I have quite a ways to go (~400fps), given the velocities are so low here...but of course wanted to start low & work-up. What velocity were you getting from that combination?
@@ShastaBean i have not checked it yet. Got it in October last year, threw together a load for coyote season a d off i went. Ill have to check it out. I have a ruger m77 that liked 50gr with w748 at 26.5 gr charge. That was a mild speed at 2,900ish.
@@ShastaBean i just looked at my notes. In my ruger i was wrong. At 26.5gr of w748 im pushing the 50gr at 3,160. In my savage i loaded them at 27.5gr but not tested yet.
@@justbaggit70 Dang - you got me into reviewing some numbers, too...and I really only have two Factory loads through the chrono...and both are ~100fps under the velocity listed on box...I see the Hornady site says 24" barrel for those standard 3240fps that are typically seen for 55 gr loads. The 55 gr Frontier I shot was about 3025 & the Winchester match 69 gr shown as 3000 fps on the box shot at 2906fps. So you've convinced me that I need to shoot more Factory loads and get a better baseline before I start taking up the charges. I also could really use some group-sizes to have as some sort of standard. I just haven't shot this Axis very much. Definitely makes me want this heat to subside and get back out there. I'd like to buy a Ruger rifle. What length barrel does yours have - the 22"? The listed velocity Hornady has for Superformance 53 gr V-Max is shown as 3465 fps !! Granted that's 24" barrel...but yowz - that's moving! - the Superformance is loaded pretty hot from what I've seen in other calibers. That tells me I should be able to take the 52 gr ELD up to around 3300 fps or so...and the 55 gr Sierra & V-Max up to around 3100 fps and still be safe.
@@ShastaBean the barrel length on my axis is 22inch. The ruger that i chronograph was 26 inch. Ill have to borrow a chronograph and test my axis to see what its running. Weather should cool hopefully next month. I do all my summer shooting in payson due to the heat. Been awhile since i went to casa grande range due to the people there and sun shines in my face early in the morning.
Why are so many of your loads OAL above the SAAMI max of 2.260"? I noticed at least one of the cartridge types was giving you some issues locking the bolt..
Not sure which cartridge you are talking about issues locking the bolt...but if you mean at 1:08 - that has nothing to do with the OAL. You'll almost always find that to get accuracy, you have to load with less bullet-jump / closer to the lands than the SAAMI #s. And most say around .0010" - .0030" is typical, depending on cartridge. These are ~ .0543 off the lands. So they are actually much shorter than I'm sure they'll end up for smallest groups. And so since you bring it up, my next outing with these I'll probably load to something more like 2.3400" OAL and get to ~.015 off lands. These are really early in me testing .223 handloads, so I started where I did as just a way to compare numbers in the future. When it comes to handloading, you see discussions around how much jump people are seating to, and not really the OAL. Sometimes you'll see them discuss to ogive. Berger bullets for example are pretty long and most find they end up having to single-feed. The SAAMI specs that factory stuff gets loaded to has more to do with feeding from magazines, and especially when it comes to ARs. That isn't what I'm doing here, though. This is the main reason factory ammo seldom shoots small groups. Way too much bullet-jump.
@@ShastaBean Your rifle seemed to do well with the PMC Bronze 55gn FMJ-BT in the factory load comparison. I think it grouped 0.9". My Henry single shot also does well with that ammo typically shooting 1" 6 shot groups at 100yds. I have measured those rounds with less than 2.200" OAL. I understand your point about reduced distance to the lands, but it's hard to argue with what your rifle likes to shoot. Do you think upgrading the stock would be more fruitful than all the load testing for improved accuracy?
@@josephlawrence6299 All fair points & questions... It's done fine with a few factory loads...in fact, with most...depending on what a person considers "fine". Only 1 ammo has been over 3". Whereas some of my others like the Compass rifles will shot several factory loads in the 5"+ realm. Winchester Power Max 180 gr PHP was 9" in my .308. I think the general consensus is that Savages "just plain shoot"...and that's been my experience (albeit limited) with my rifles, which are all pretty much 'budget" rifles. My .338 & this one have been easily the two best with factory loads. So my thinking then becomes if I can shoot 1" with factory loads, then I maybe should be able to load to .3-.5" groups with it? We'll see. When just testing 40gr factory loads for velocity, a couple showed up a .5", although just 3-shot groups. I guess I didn't get around to posting a video for that...since it was really just for me to see what factory 40 gr velocity FPS would be. The DLX chronos were screwing me though, and I had to re-do it with the Magneto another day and they were more like .9 & 1". Maybe I'll go back and do one & post it. Of course if I am going to to beat that with handloads, I'll have my work cut out for me. For a reference - & someone doing 2.3000" ruclips.net/video/XXxq-3HUS_8/видео.html He's MILES beyond any progress I've gotten to with loading, and especially for .223. He states that 2.300 is "15 thou off the lands" - for that gun & the 40 gr VMAX. These numbers vary by gun and is why Hornady sells an ogive tool to measure each bullet in YOUR chamber to help with this. There are other ways to find the lands, but to each their own. I think that same rifle with a 50 or 55 gr VMAX he did something actually under the SAMMI max but said that was also .0015" off lands. As for rifle mods...I'm not really interested in that, yet. Erik Cortina has a series doing that with 6.5 CM Remingtons. They rapidly seem to toss variable control out the window, though, but still some interesting results. A person can change out the stock, the barrel, the trigger, add weights, add muzzle brakes or tuners, and perhaps get great results with some or maybe most factory ammo. I've just decided to instead tinker with loading. I find it way more fun. Someday I might decide to have an $8000 custom rifle built and see where things can go from there. Guys that go that route would probably throw the barrel in the garbage if they saw a .9" group. pff.
ha! thanks! I guess I don't feel quite so incompetent...there was another attempt at it that failed just as badly, but I cut it from the video. I wish now I had left it in there. I watched this one again and it made me laugh. Is yours also .223, or do they have this challenge in other calibers, too?
It was 243, then I had it rebarrelled in 6mm creedmoor. Funny thing, I can get it to single feed just the brass with no bullet, but when I try with a complete round it doesn’t work. Frankly, I don’t really care. All I really care about is accuracy. Last week I averaged under 2/3 inch 4 shot groups at a hundred yards with Hornady Match 108s, so I’m a happy camper at the moment.
Did you read the title?? HAHA! 🤡 It's the 1st handloads I did, and your Brainstein idea is to start changing things BEFORE even testing anything?? HAHA!! Because, science?
Great video i just picked up one of these rifles im hoping a good load for the sierra blitzking 55 grain
Thanks. The Savages seem to be good shooters. Pretty encouraging for a 1st stab at me loading for this. Especially considering the wind was gusty & swirling. It was this outing that really got me into looking at how much POI shift a gust can cause, even at just 100 yards. It only takes 7 mph for a 55 gr at 3000 fps to move .85". I have written down 8-10 mph & 13 mph gusts on the paper from this day. It's never constant. So now I'm recording the readings on the anemometer. Next time I'll have flags or ribbons hanging at the target and at the bench. You can really hear some differences in wind in a few of these groups from the 1st shot to the 4th or 5th shot...especially the last group! I think it may have been shooting even better than the numbers might show. I'll have to duplicate these loads and try some others. The blitzking I especially just threw together at the last second, and the one with x-term was pretty slow. I do like the accu-trigger. Have you shot yours yet, with any factory or your hand loads?
Good load "NO EYE PROTECTION"
thanks.
I blame my vision. The sunglasses were on early in the video, but I forget to put them back on after when I have to see something close-by.
I have a new pair of prescription glasses that have the transition lenses, so I hopefully don't forget to put them on each time.
I have a 12 in 6 mm br.@@ShastaBean
My .223 axis with regular trigger shoots great. Best was .2” 60grn v max and 23.9 tac powder. 0.3” 55 v max and 22grn benchmark. Fed primer.
Nice!
I bought a some of the 60 gr to test into gel through the AR pretty soon, and may slow them a bit depending on what I see. I have it in my mind it could be an ideal defensive load, but we'll see if anything penetrates or if it just flies apart.
I also got a box of Ammo Inc factory to compare against and will be testing some groups from the Axis, too.
@@ShastaBean I tried a few factory ammo. Does not work well.
I totally agree. I just usually buy a box to see where they seat them and what velocity and just as a baseline for groups. But yeah, they are almost always seated way too deep for any real accuracy in a bolt-action.
The wind sounded pretty nasty. My AR loves the 55gr Blitzking. Have you tried AR-Comp?
I have not. I have my hands full with other calibers, so I don't know when I'll get back to testing more .223. I definitely want to. I do want to see what I can do with the AR, too. That was the powder you used?
@@ShastaBean The Blitzkings were in factory ADI ammo. I've used the AR-Comp with 77gr Berger OTM's but I want to pick up some 55gr Blitzking and try them with that powder.
@@rustynut1967 OH! I forgot I had bought some HSM Varmint Blue rounds that I never got around to shooting. Not many make completed rounds w/the blitzkings. Those are going with me to the range next time and should at least give me a decent basis for comparison. I don't have the twist rate to really spend any time with any of the heavy bullets. With all the stupid news of bills being run thru the house, I have been thinking about another AR before I no longer can, and thinking a 1:8. I have Ramshot TAC to try, in addition to the ones I used here with the ELD-M. I only have these 3 bullets, so far. And probably not going to tinker with much else any time soon. I've for sure created a combination-overload situation with the various powders, bullets and primers as it is. Fun, though. Those OTMs might be good at a long distance if you can stabilize them?
Very accurate rifle !
The Savages just shoot. Looking forward to trying some more loads for it and test a bit more of the factory-loads
@@ShastaBean I have the Axis II Overwatch, 20 inch coated barrel, camo stock, very accurate...
@@johnganshow5536 Is that a new model? I don't recall seeing it before. I do see it looks to have a shorter (20") barrel. I shot some more handloads last weekend, but still haven't gone through the targets, chrono, & footage yet. But they weren't spectacular, but also not horrible It was new loads, and seeing what I could do with light-for-caliber 40g VMAX bullets. No huge groups, but nothing under 1". Which I'm fine with, considering 1st stab at powder calculations for velocity baseline. I'm confident I can tighten them up with this rifle.
The wind at that casa grande range can suck sometimes. My axis likes 50gr vmax with 27.5gr w748
I've only had like two outings where it wasn't doing this swirling/gusting thing. I think I need to start going earlier in the morning.
I only have these 3 projectiles for .223 at this point. I am going to just stick with them, and see if I can find a good result. The other calibers I bought a lot of various types to start testing with. It gets really overwhelming doing it that way along with many powders.
I have quite a ways to go (~400fps), given the velocities are so low here...but of course wanted to start low & work-up.
What velocity were you getting from that combination?
@@ShastaBean i have not checked it yet. Got it in October last year, threw together a load for coyote season a d off i went. Ill have to check it out. I have a ruger m77 that liked 50gr with w748 at 26.5 gr charge. That was a mild speed at 2,900ish.
@@ShastaBean i just looked at my notes. In my ruger i was wrong. At 26.5gr of w748 im pushing the 50gr at 3,160. In my savage i loaded them at 27.5gr but not tested yet.
@@justbaggit70 Dang - you got me into reviewing some numbers, too...and I really only have two Factory loads through the chrono...and both are ~100fps under the velocity listed on box...I see the Hornady site says 24" barrel for those standard 3240fps that are typically seen for 55 gr loads. The 55 gr Frontier I shot was about 3025 & the Winchester match 69 gr shown as 3000 fps on the box shot at 2906fps. So you've convinced me that I need to shoot more Factory loads and get a better baseline before I start taking up the charges. I also could really use some group-sizes to have as some sort of standard. I just haven't shot this Axis very much. Definitely makes me want this heat to subside and get back out there.
I'd like to buy a Ruger rifle. What length barrel does yours have - the 22"?
The listed velocity Hornady has for Superformance 53 gr V-Max is shown as 3465 fps !! Granted that's 24" barrel...but yowz - that's moving! - the Superformance is loaded pretty hot from what I've seen in other calibers. That tells me I should be able to take the 52 gr ELD up to around 3300 fps or so...and the 55 gr Sierra & V-Max up to around 3100 fps and still be safe.
@@ShastaBean the barrel length on my axis is 22inch. The ruger that i chronograph was 26 inch. Ill have to borrow a chronograph and test my axis to see what its running. Weather should cool hopefully next month. I do all my summer shooting in payson due to the heat. Been awhile since i went to casa grande range due to the people there and sun shines in my face early in the morning.
Why are so many of your loads OAL above the SAAMI max of 2.260"? I noticed at least one of the cartridge types was giving you some issues locking the bolt..
Not sure which cartridge you are talking about issues locking the bolt...but if you mean at 1:08 - that has nothing to do with the OAL.
You'll almost always find that to get accuracy, you have to load with less bullet-jump / closer to the lands than the SAAMI #s. And most say around .0010" - .0030" is typical, depending on cartridge.
These are ~ .0543 off the lands. So they are actually much shorter than I'm sure they'll end up for smallest groups. And so since you bring it up, my next outing with these I'll probably load to something more like 2.3400" OAL and get to ~.015 off lands. These are really early in me testing .223 handloads, so I started where I did as just a way to compare numbers in the future.
When it comes to handloading, you see discussions around how much jump people are seating to, and not really the OAL. Sometimes you'll see them discuss to ogive. Berger bullets for example are pretty long and most find they end up having to single-feed.
The SAAMI specs that factory stuff gets loaded to has more to do with feeding from magazines, and especially when it comes to ARs. That isn't what I'm doing here, though. This is the main reason factory ammo seldom shoots small groups. Way too much bullet-jump.
@@ShastaBean Your rifle seemed to do well with the PMC Bronze 55gn FMJ-BT in the factory load comparison. I think it grouped 0.9". My Henry single shot also does well with that ammo typically shooting 1" 6 shot groups at 100yds. I have measured those rounds with less than 2.200" OAL. I understand your point about reduced distance to the lands, but it's hard to argue with what your rifle likes to shoot. Do you think upgrading the stock would be more fruitful than all the load testing for improved accuracy?
@@josephlawrence6299 All fair points & questions...
It's done fine with a few factory loads...in fact, with most...depending on what a person considers "fine". Only 1 ammo has been over 3". Whereas some of my others like the Compass rifles will shot several factory loads in the 5"+ realm. Winchester Power Max 180 gr PHP was 9" in my .308.
I think the general consensus is that Savages "just plain shoot"...and that's been my experience (albeit limited) with my rifles, which are all pretty much 'budget" rifles. My .338 & this one have been easily the two best with factory loads. So my thinking then becomes if I can shoot 1" with factory loads, then I maybe should be able to load to .3-.5" groups with it? We'll see. When just testing 40gr factory loads for velocity, a couple showed up a .5", although just 3-shot groups. I guess I didn't get around to posting a video for that...since it was really just for me to see what factory 40 gr velocity FPS would be. The DLX chronos were screwing me though, and I had to re-do it with the Magneto another day and they were more like .9 & 1". Maybe I'll go back and do one & post it. Of course if I am going to to beat that with handloads, I'll have my work cut out for me.
For a reference - & someone doing 2.3000"
ruclips.net/video/XXxq-3HUS_8/видео.html
He's MILES beyond any progress I've gotten to with loading, and especially for .223. He states that 2.300 is "15 thou off the lands" - for that gun & the 40 gr VMAX. These numbers vary by gun and is why Hornady sells an ogive tool to measure each bullet in YOUR chamber to help with this. There are other ways to find the lands, but to each their own. I think that same rifle with a 50 or 55 gr VMAX he did something actually under the SAMMI max but said that was also .0015" off lands.
As for rifle mods...I'm not really interested in that, yet. Erik Cortina has a series doing that with 6.5 CM Remingtons. They rapidly seem to toss variable control out the window, though, but still some interesting results. A person can change out the stock, the barrel, the trigger, add weights, add muzzle brakes or tuners, and perhaps get great results with some or maybe most factory ammo. I've just decided to instead tinker with loading. I find it way more fun. Someday I might decide to have an $8000 custom rifle built and see where things can go from there. Guys that go that route would probably throw the barrel in the garbage if they saw a .9" group. pff.
I can’t get my axis do single feed either.
ha! thanks! I guess I don't feel quite so incompetent...there was another attempt at it that failed just as badly, but I cut it from the video. I wish now I had left it in there. I watched this one again and it made me laugh.
Is yours also .223, or do they have this challenge in other calibers, too?
It was 243, then I had it rebarrelled in 6mm creedmoor. Funny thing, I can get it to single feed just the brass with no bullet, but when I try with a complete round it doesn’t work. Frankly, I don’t really care. All I really care about is accuracy. Last week I averaged under 2/3 inch 4 shot groups at a hundred yards with Hornady Match 108s, so I’m a happy camper at the moment.
@@smsfte4699 Agreed. If everything I own shot as good as the two Savages do, I'd be more than happy.
Have you glass bedded the bottom action. At least bed the recoil lug. Rookie mistakes.
Did you read the title??
HAHA! 🤡
It's the 1st handloads I did, and your Brainstein idea is to start changing things BEFORE even testing anything?? HAHA!!
Because, science?