Jose Martinez - Based on the purest definition;which is how I defined Christianity Islam is also a cult. So when you hear these evangelicals declare everyone except them a cult, remind yourself how absolutely wrong they are. If anyone behaves with a cult mentality, they do.
@@DM-bu6to And yet they could easily outsmart and out argue you. So what does that say about you you half-witted, obtuse, imbecilic, doltish moron! Oh, i am sorry, i bet you couldn't even understand most of what I wrote, as your comment shows you have the vernacular of a 5 year old.
I have been a Mormon my whole life. Most people locally are well meaning. My son left the church a few weeks ago after a horrific missionary experience with the Portland Oregon Mission president. He told me he wanted to leave but when I tried to bring my child home the mission president refused to allow me to pick him up, refused to give me an address to have him picked up and refused to provide me with a means to bring him home until I called the police. Mission President instructed the other missionaries in the home to not allow my child to leave which is technically a hostage situation and a crime. I complained through proper church channels but church leadership swept my concerns under the rug. I never thought of my religion as a cult until this incident with higher ranking church authorities.
Report it to lower levels and higher levels than what you are the Church is aware that these things are happening, and that’s why they made a big deal of it at the last conference, and form pf abuse or abusiveness won’t be tolerated. They straight up said anyone who is doing things, they’re going to get excommunicated.
@@anhingathing2382 I reported it to the local leadership and my area leadership. The problem here is the person who is responsible for the abuse is at a higher level so the local and area leadership refused to contact anyone higher to report my issue. I heard the official church stance on it during conference as you stated but that is not what I observed while trying to report the abuse. I think they are more than willing to discipline lower level leadership while letting the higher level leadership do what they please. I agree with you that is what should happen and is what the church stated would happen but I don’t see them actually practicing what they just preached.
@@JC-vj2wh How long ago did you report this as well? Another thing could be that they're trying to investigate the issue further. It could also be that the Area presidency doesn't have authority to move forward with anything until they're told they can from their higherups, even then I think there's room for some concern, as if it's been more than it's fair share of time, then the abuse cases aren't being prioritized by those members.
@@anhingathing2382 this one was pretty severe. I would think it would have been a pretty high priority. If I had someone hold another individual against their will and refuse to allow the person freedom, I would have that at the top of my investigation list. I would deal with the Mission President immediately. I reported it in October to area leadership and was just told “well I don’t know why he would do that but I’m sure he wishes he would have handled it differently.” Very indifferent and had a tone of not wanting to pursue it any further. I reported it in October the day after it happened. Maybe they are looking into it as you say? I have been very disappointed with my interactions with church leaders about this issue. If I had done this outside of the church, I would have been arrested and charged with a crime immediately.
I worked for years with many Mormons. I don’t know much about their theology, but they were some of the most humble, kind and giving people I’ve ever met. I didn’t meet a single brainwashed cultist who tried to convert me.
People are inherently good and nice. Meeting friendly mormons in your life gives no relevance to the truth of their religion or indeed their morality. In the case of the latter it’s especially true as no person should have to believe religious doctrine in order to do good
@@johnb5254 nope I only seen good things and like I said I can only speak positively about it. Then again I say every area of it is different. Alot of nice people in the church I went to so I use to feel great coming out of there on a sunday
I have been a member of the church for almost a year now. One of the reasons why I joined the church was because they were genuinely nice people and convinced me what I was taught were real. But here is my first problem: I didn’t even know if I was making the right decision to get baptized because I still had doubts. And according to them, they would, supposedly, know if someone is ready to be baptized or not. A missionary had a conversation with me before I got baptized to see if I was qualified, which I passed. But to me, it felt like any test you would have in school, as long as you get the answers right, then you pass. Furthermore, they keep telling people to pray to God if you have any questions, if your prayer and desire is sincere, you will receive the answer. Well, not a single question I had was being answered. Something I figured out lately that Christians are confirmation bias, meaning if you are looking for something to happen, and if anything then happens, that must be it, coming from god. For example, you have worked so hard to get something you desire. You finally got it, but because you believed it to be God’s gift, you disregard all the hard work you put into it, instead giving God all the credits. There was a time when I was bothered by the thought that if the church is not true, then how come everyone around me believed it to be true? Then I came to realization that most of them grew up with it, or indoctrinated since a young age. That’s how they view the world, telling them that their world view is not correct is an impossible task. When it comes to Science, most of them have this sort of selective amnesia where they agree with biology, physics stuff but completely in against with stuff like evolution, radiocarbon dating, etc.. The more I think about it the less convincing the LDS Church is to me, thought I found the real one(there are none, there is no heavenly entities), turned out to be just like other churches. Wish I had learned that earlier. Recently, I have been watching videos that debunk Christianity and Religion in general, and I couldn’t agree more with what them videos been saying. I still go to church every Sunday and participate in their activities, but I don’t feel it anymore, if I had ever felt anything in the first place when I joined the church.
My favorite cult would have to be the Amish. Here's a group of people who had some crazy beliefs, and so they went off and minded their own business. Perfect. (Okay, some people complain that their buggies damage public roads from time to time, but the way I see it, our cars are polluting the planet that they live on, so it's kind of an even trade.)
At least the hommish make food, rugs, and clothes for the outside community. These Mormons just try and ruin laws. They own half of Vegas for a reason.
I talked to a Mormon from Salt Lake City who was doing his MIssionary work in Northern Ontario Canada trying to convert the locals and natives.. They were really nice. We talked about the play book of Mormon. They liked it. I talked about South Park with them. They didnt seem to like SP very much lol. They gave me a bible and I couldnt throw it out. It just felt wrong. So it sits on top on my entertainment center with a Buddha lol
Burn the religions icons... Not because I'm some extremist.. But just because if there is a God, it's sending him the message to come talk to you himself if he wants you XD
@@josephsherman5288 What do you think the book is? It's God wanting to talk to you, but the real reason you burn it is because you don't actually want to listen.
I’m a non Mormon but played hockey in Salt Lake when I was younger and spent a year there. The people were extremely nice and helpful. Yes they had large families and many beautiful Mormon girls wouldn’t marry outside their religion, tho I’d offer to convert they’d all say they didn’t want me to convert just for them. Still, an awesome helpful people. My truck broke down on freeway and in 5 minutes literally 20 passerby’s stopped to help me. Also a cop pulled me over once for weaving and recognized me and let me go asking if I could get him tickets. I remember it because I never did get him those tickets…20 years later.
as a lot of religious fundamentalists are. Just because they are humble, kind and giving does not mean they are not in a cult. Its part of their MO, part of the cult behavior
They probably thought you were Mormon. Mormon's were friendly, until I told them I wasn't Mormon, then they avoided talking to me. Every time I visit SLC and Provo, I get a creepy feeling, like I'm an outsider. Its not a cult, just a weird closed social group, not a religion. Joe Smith had many scams going while starting the Mormon church. He was a crooked contractor, investor, etc and just wanted to get rich. State of Ohio had plenty of evidence of stealing $thousands from people, but he gained such a following with religion, they forced JS to leave the State and never come back. Visit SLC and see the teenagers living on the street. The church told their parents to kick them out until they repent. Many other weird things.
@@WhiteArtsMagic I’m not saying that these Mormons weren’t helping out of good intention but your exactly right it’s still a cult reminds me of what this one RUclipsr said “The absence of evil is not an indication for the presence of good” - Dry Creek Wrangler
That hurts a lot coming from someone who doesn't understand when to use the correct you're. I grew up in Utah and certainly know where Colorado City is located, look it up!
I live like an hour away from Colorado city and sometimes when I drive through the city I get curious and look at all the houses in the small town once I’ve looked at the majority of the houses and markets in the town I notice cars following behind me it’s not necessarily “scary” it’s just eery as fuck. I also work at a plant nursery and a lot of our customers are polygamists and the way they dress is funny as hell it’s like an Olden day “costume” it’s pretty weird that I have to type/ explain all of this weird shit because this is literally my everyday life.
I was going to ask a question about that be cause a) Colorado City in CO is nowhere near the CO-UT border and b) Colorado City is not a Mormon town (I used to live less than 20 miles away).
@Kenzie K Wonderful. Definitely not the Colorado City in CO. It was pretty quiet when I was living nearby. This Colorado City sounds like somewhere no one except a FLDS member would want to go.
Dude, I've got more beef than most with the LDS church, but many of your "facts" are incorrect. Firstly, Joseph Smith was killed in Illinois, not Missouri. The affidavit in the introduction to the Book of Mormon is not about polygamy. The FLDS sect was led by Warren Jeffs. Colorado City is near the boarder of Utah and Arizona, not Colorado. And you say you've been there?
As a former Mormon I’m surprised how much Rogan knows about Joseph Smith. To spit out his age at a certain year off the top of his head was pretty impressive
@@scottmolis4267 l was an active Mormon for 50 + years....born ln the "covenant", mission, BYU, bishopric, temple married, etc., etc. Would you consider ME to be an "authorlty"...as long as l didn't say anything negative about Mormonism? (l reslgned my LDS membershlp 20+ years ago.)
@Dub You said “As a former Mormon I’m surprised how much Rogan knows about Joseph Smith.” Rogan practically knows nothing about Joseph Smith and the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day. He’s just trying to be impressive to maintain his reputation of a commentator of sorts on the Internet, with the other guy just playing second fiddle. How about you, Dub? What’s your story? Obviously you know very little of the Church. How long have you been a member? We’re you even an active member who paid tithing? What made you leave, and which church, if any, do you go to now? What’s your story?
WARREN IS THE ONLY PROPHET WHO COMMUNICATES WITH GOD. LOL NOT!!!! DO FLDS ACTUALLY THINK THIS BIZARE! YOU STAY IN YOUR COMPOUNDS THE WORLDLY WORLD IS EVIL YOU STAY IN YOUR NICE COMPOUNDS LOL
2:45 the signed statement he's referring to was about them claiming to have seen the golden plates. Joe Rogan then says Joseph Smith 'started it all out when he was 14' but Joseph Smith only claimed he had a vision then maybe a decade later. Back then Joseph Smith was doing things like treasure digging. 8:17, the church actually still have some (or all) of the stones it was the golden plates that were claimed to have been brought up to heaven. Again, all super close and impressive that he knows so much about Mormonism.
Technically, all religions are "cults" in the original Greek definition of the word, as "cult" referred to a small body (what is called a congregation) of worshipers who gathered in private to perform religious rites of worship for their deities.
@@guidomonto3742 Not true.. even what happens in the temples is written in the scriptures that ALL are encouraged to read. The words the movements.. etc.. it's all over the internet as well. There are even classes that are taught to members regarding what takes place in the temples. Nothing is a SECRET but we hold these things SACRED. There are 'rituals, rights' etc. in almost every ancient religion and tribes throughout the world. In the Temple in Jerusalem, there were clothing that was worn, words spoken, offerings given and places in the temple that only the Holy of Holies good go... I'm Jewish and from the Church of Jesus Christ. I have been in the Temple many times. Wonderful things take place there that bring families together such as marriages for all time AND eternity. Jesus said that whatsoever man binds on earth in only for this life time but whatsoever is bound by God is for eternity. I would want to have my children for all time and eternity... Baptism for the dead.. Christ when talking the Pharisees gave them a lesson about the resurrection. They didn't believe in the resurrection but they baptized the dead. Christ said, why baptized the dead if the dead rise not at all. He was trying to get them to understand that YES.. the dead are going to rise and they still needed to be baptized. This church is not the first in history that baptized the dead by proxy. Same with sealing of deceased family members to living so that the family lineage through time are still together for all eternity. This has been done through history as discovered through ancient writings and archeological research. So why is what my church doing so wrong? Because people don't understand it? People fear it? Because we are a peculiar people? Christ made it clear that the saving ordinance that are performed for the living must also be performed for the dead. There is an organization to everything that God does.. he is not a God of chaos. As far as 'ranking' up in the church.. there is no such thing. A man may be 'called' or 'set apart' through prayer and inspiration by a Stake President to become a Bishop of his ward.. He is only a Bishop for 4-7 years and then is replaced and he goes back into the normal congregation. A stake President is 'set apart' in that position for up to 9 years and then he is released and goes back into the normal congregation. These people in the church do not get paid but volunteer their time and it can take quite a bir of time. There is no compensation given. Someone who is 'set apart' serves in that position for a set period of time and then is released. An Apostle, the Prophet and the Patriarchs are 'ordained' into those positions for the remainder of their life. They don't 'rank' up. When the Prophet dies, yes.. it's USUALLY the president of the 12 apostles who become the next prophet but that is not always the case. The 12 apostles go to a room in the temple and they fast and pray as to who the LORD wants to be the next prophet.. not man. See, in Jewish history, it was usually the eldest son who received the Birthright and blessing from their father. This was tradition... But you will find that it was not always the case when God wanted a particular son to become the next Prophet. Esau should have but it went to Jacob, Ephraim received Joseph's but Joseph received Jacob's. God will choose who He chooses, whether a son of Pharoah who was slow of speech, had killed, had sexual relations, etc. or a 14 year old farm boy with a 3rd grade education. There is a great deal the public doesn't know about this church because there are so many people spreading lies or misconseptions.. This is not a SECRET organization.. we don't worship satan, the prophets or any other 'thing' or person.. Just Jesus Christ. Thus the name of the church.. THE CHURCH OF JESUS CHRIST of latter day saints. By the way.. you can find that name and phrase in the dead sea scrolls found in 1947 in a cave on the coast of the Dead Sea.. How did a 14 year old boy know about that name in a scroll that was from the 3rd century BCE and found almost 100 years after his death... there is so much more that you all don't know or understand but I am more than happy to debunk your debunking. Ask me...
@Will iam Most are. I was a mormon missionary and have paid attention to mormon growth tactics since. "White people" don't become mormon anymore. More seem to be leaving than joining (like myself). The only people who join in USA are Mexicans and abroad outside of the USA are Africans.
@@shawnreed7876 Also that's not really true, I think by now there's a greater LDS population outside of the US than inside, but in American churches there's a very high white demographic. Not because we're white supremacists or anything, anyone should be able to join any church and it's the same with us, just because it started only 200 years ago in Utah.
@@WiloPolis03 It is most definitely true. Look at the numbers. White people don't become mormons. More whities leave than join. Soon Latinos will stop joining as well. Most of the mormon church's current and future growth will be in Africa but eventually that will slow as well. Joseph smith's church has done remarkably well but as will all things, the pedofile's church will eventually die.
Around 9th-10th grade I had a good friend who was Mormon. He was devout and i actually went to their church a couple time as well as some youth events. Nicest ppl ever !! Their beliefs are wacky af but they do treat others nicely
@@jeffs4483 yeah they have told me some weird ass shit man. I appreciate them not being assholes about me being an atheist but they were pretty weird with beliefs for sure
@Steve D ...not so much. Unless you're potentially baptizable OR a neighbor, local merchant, etc. - you'll get a pass, but no "recommend" (insider joke 4 LDS & NoMo's)!! But hey... we all gotta' serve SOMEbody.
I am born Mormon and still go sometimes. I have to go cause of my father. Mormons are nice and I don’t think it’s bad, but it’s not right for me. Im starting to question and being Mormon doesn’t let me express who I truly am and it doesn’t make me happy. I will probably still go to the Mormon church until I am old enough to say “I’m leaving.” I just believe in God and the basics. I don’t want anything complicated
I converted to the LDS Church a couple of years ago. It was one of the best choices I have ever made. Through the Church I met some of the most decent people ever. I dont drink any alcohol or smoke, have become very disciplined in everything. I have become more compassionate towards others. Thanks to God and the LDS Church. A perfect church!!!
Apostle J Reuben Clark said: "If we have the truth, no harm can come from investigation." Please read the CES Letter and discover what you need to know...
giving away 10 percent of your income sure does displine you huh, can do all of that outside of the church and save that money, or actually spread the gospel instead of the book of "golden plates". Heaven is forever free, it will never require your 10 percent to get in, to your surprise god actually donest care about money, also polygamy is adultery.......
Taylor Rogers Alright, here's my fact-checking of Joe and the other guy: I love joe Rogans podcast, but when this needs serious correction: 1.) they are not careful enough on differentiating mainstream Mormonism from fundamental Mormonism. The former condemns the latter for their polygamy practice and is not similar to the latter much at all. 2.) guy on the right is absolutely false, the so to speak polygamy revelation is not in the Book of Mormon and the revelation that other witnesses signed to testify of was not the marriage revelation but the gold plates of the Book of Mormon. Nowhere in the same ballpark Joseph didn't start the religion at 14, that was when he was very thoughtful about religion and claimed the beginning of his heavenly visions. The Book of Mormon came when he was 23, and many other parts of the religion gradually came for the 15 years after that. Guy on the right mischaracterizes Joseph's "trouble with the law". Look at every case and it was largely a matter of religious intolerance. The Mormons had an extermination order against them from the government of missouri, the federal government didn't defend them while acknowledging this injustice, and the governor of Illinois knowingly permitted Joseph to be put in a jail with too few guards that could be overrun by a mob and end in his death, which is what happened, he was not murdered for justified reasons. I'm sorry but painting the federal government as the innocent and purely fair party and Joseph as some rough lawless scoundrel is very ignorant of the historical context. Religious intolerance drove their persecution, and I don't think other religions would ever receive this same lazy mischaracterization I think this whole, Brigham young had to move west to evade federal authorities. We don't characterize the pilgrims as a cult that had to leave England to avoid just law enforcement, they left cause of religious intolerance and so did the Mormons. The Scientology comparisons to Mormonism being anywhere in the same ballpark shows a serious lack of anything more than a superficial understanding of Mormons. Look up the essays "Are Christians Mormon?" That's shows how Christian orthodoxy has actually followed mormon theology on several major points now in the 21st century, so the cult label isn't fitting when non Mormon scholars recognize the impressive substance of Mormon theology and when mainstream Christianity now aligns with it on several points. I like joe's concession at the end that most Mormons are really good people. The question must then be asked, can good fruit come from a bad tree? I get if people don't want to believe in the supernaturalism surrounding some of Joseph smiths claims, but there must be other admirable parts of the religion that is producing such good people and motivating people to be so Christlike. And for some reason ppl prefer to focus on the controversial rather than the mainstream
Most normal people are ignorant to LDS cult members. ONly Cult members are more ignorant than just about anyone else on LDS subject SAD www.wivesofjosephsmith.org Question everything the cult tells you
@@johnrobert2072 lol I never denied the original church practicized polygamy and I'm very aware of my religion. This is where accuracy about representation is important and that was Joe's error, even though he also goofed up on a lot of the facts as well. congrats you sent me one website that I've known about for a long time. Its not that we don't know about this history, there's an ugly side to it, the problem is that the embellishment and exaggeration by you and in this one time case, Joe, is that you're making up stuff on top of it and taking it way out of proportion. Get Educated please or don't be posting about it.
So disappointed with Joe on this. So many errors in all their assumptions. The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints. This church does so much good in the world. Joe why not bring a real member of this church on your show, and get facts, read the Book of Mormon also. And remember ye shall know them by their fruits
@@johnrobert2072 You know nothing yet you think you know everything. Why don't you educate yourself versus just making stupid comments. The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints has been extremely wise with the money they receive. They have in vested, etc. They own the worlds largest ranch, have to largest food program in the world to feed the hungry. I have used this program instead of the gov program of food stamps. etc. Nothing was required to receive it, and only stipulation is that I was seeking work (church has one of the best employment programs in the world, which got me a job), and pay tithing if I could (not required). They build beautiful temples and houses of worship only for the use of spiritual matters. We have weddings there that cost zero. If I am ever in trouble on any level they are there to help. I could tell you benefit after benefit. And poor me for all this I pay 10% of my income to it if I want and once a month I give up the price of two meals to feed the hungry if I want. This churches programs is not like the government where it is wasted, it is used wisely.
@@cj8899 Actually its 200 billion. Much of the wealth is in property such as churches and temples, farms, ranches (to feed the poor), food storage facilities called Bishop Store Houses to feed and cloth the poor, preservation of historical sites, etc. It is not money just sitting in the bank. My father once needed a surgery and had little money so the church stepped in and helps. I could give you story after story. So maybe instead of just being critical, maybe become informed and learn all the amazing good they do with what the Lord has blessed them and me as a member of that wonderful church. This is what bothers me about what Joe and this guy are saying about The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints. They are both so ill informed, related to Joseph Smith. etc. Joseph was not banging a 14 year old girl, there is no proof of that. DNA test of ancestors have not shown truth of this. Yes we lived the law of polygamy for a short time, like many did during Bible times, and like today, which is about 54 percent of the worlds population. The problem today is with groups who practice it and abuse it. Please become informed and let us fight evil where it really exists, primarily on the Left and the real alt right.
The difference between a religion and a cult is that a cult always has strings attached, as in: they want your money and free labor. True religion is about philosophy and spirituality
You don't find "true religion" in an organized church, only in individuals. I think people fail to understand that the word cult isn't always similar to what you see in the movies. With that said, a religion cannot be a cult, BUT all cults are religious.
Just FYI, I have never, in 46 years of being immersed in LDS culture, heard anyone mention paying tithing on capital gains or profits of a home sale. I'm sure some LDS do this, but that's the minority; the hardcore. It's just never come up in thousands of LDS sermons or Sunday School lessons, and not doing this is certainly nothing Mormon leadership would ever call you out on.
bigbigbigdoug I feel you ,I have been to many congregations in many states ,such as all around Florida (Deltona ,Daytona,Miami,Tallahassee)and NYC,and NJ,l have never seen such things
They have 130 BILLION in assets PEAK INVESTMENTS look it up! HIDDEN! Tisk tisk would be have to ask for your money when you have more than most fortune 500's. Bishop it's time to pay your tithing and if it's not an honest tithting no temple for your or salvation. SHIT you out top heaven. Not a cult lol
Then you weren't listening very carefully, if I'm honest. The rule is 10% of _ALL_ income, which includes things like capital gains. More specifically, tithing is paid on your "increase", rather than just work-related and similar incomes, though as far as my mother was concerned they were the same thing. When I was a kid, my mother would very very sternly encourage me to pay tithing on my $5 of weekly pocket money, which had already been tithed as it came from her income, but as far as she was concerned it was income for me (an increase to the balance of my piggy bank) so the commandment was that I pay a 50c tithe. "If the money comes in, it's income" she'd say, which is why she insisted that relatives not give me cash for Christmas and birthday presents, because she didn't think it was very uplifting for me to be paying tithing on my Christmas gifts. More recently, in our ward we actually had someone ask the Elders Quorum President (a few years ago now) during a lesson on tithing whether he was supposed to pay tithing on the sale of his house, which was in settlement, and the president said he wasn't sure but he assumed so because it was a form of income. That prompted a discussion on whether the elder in question needed to pay tithing on the whole sale or only the increase from its original purchase value, and we resolved it was the latter as he'd originally bought the house rather than inherited it. He was actually surprised about it because he'd assumed he needed to pay tithing on the full sale, so he was glad the spirit had prompted him to bring it up. This is the only time I've ever heard of anyone discussing the minutiae of tithing payments, whether in lessons or even just in conversation, so I can understand that you would have never heard of anyone mention tithing on capital gains and the like. But I think this is more a case of Church leadership assuming that members will understand and honestly follow the rule that tithing it to be paid on "all income" or their "increase" rather than any wilful attempt by leaders or membership to subvert the rules on tithing in regards to extraordinary income.
@@michaelheliotis5279 @Michael Heliotis I stand by my assertion that this hasn't been something that's been emphasized specifically. To be real, I have avoided elders' quorum almost completely for years . . mostly to avoid ultra-conservative douchecanoes trying to insist on defining the finer aspects of various doctrines for everyone else. And I have no empirical evidence regarding the percentage of LDS that would stick to the letter of the law regarding tithing to the extent of applying it to capital gains on houses . . it's just my impression based on decades of being around people. If I had to reason it out, in most cases I sell a house, but then I'm buying another house, so it's not like I'm pocketing the difference. Yes, it would still be an "increase" . . but I don't see anyone being denied a temple recommend because they moved, made a profit on the sale of their home, and didn't pay tithing on the profit. That would be one hard-core bishop demanding that.
@@douglasderu980 I don't disagree with you that it's not emphasised very much, I'm just saying the the Church's leadership probably just takes it for granted that people pay their tithing the way they're supposed to. And I don't think it's unreasonable for them to make that assumption, as most people who've obtained a financial position that affords them regular capital gains are likely to understand that they should be paying tithing on them. So anyone who isn't is very obviously cheating the Lord. I agree that you won't find a bishop who'll grind you over your once in a decade house sale, but if you're a career landlord who buys and sells houses all over the place, he'd be a pretty negligent bishop if he wasn't taking an interest in your capital gains.
Joe Rogan, I always support the fact that if you need something about someone, you should go directly to the person and ask. Seriously, the man you invited learned about Mormonism through some kind of cartoons ... it has no sense at all on the things he said.
I'm an active Mormon and have been my whole life. Honestly as a member i'm not looking to convert people wherever I go, honestly i'd rather just not talk religion most of the time anyway. I'm literally just trying to live my life the best I can. If you want to hang out, awesome, lets do it. Want to go to a bar? Awesome lets do it, I'll be your driver. Need help with something? Cool I'll try my best to be there. Some of the comments too talk about shunning other people that aren't LDS (Mormon) I think some of it comes from us LDS people feeling uncomfortable when people are talking bad about the religion in front of them anytime someone comes up and I don't think its probably a consious thing, just that people who talk bad about your morals and religion isn't something that makes me want to hang out with that person. I'm all for jokes and stuff, but its exhausting always trying to defend beliefs all the time. My kids go and hang out with kids in our neighborhood who aren't religious and we're friendly with the parents too. We're normal people trying to live normal lives too. I'll let my kids believe what they want, and ask questions on what they want.
I’m a devout Christian and what I have to say is you need to repent,get away from Mormonism,it’s a Cultic false religion.And if you choose not to you’re on the broad path to destruction.
Alright, here's my fact-checking of Joe and the other guy: I love joe Rogans podcast, but when this needs serious correction: 1.) they are not careful enough on differentiating mainstream Mormonism from fundamental Mormonism. The former condemns the latter for their polygamy practice and is not similar to the latter much at all. 2.) guy on the right is absolutely false, the so to speak polygamy revelation is not in the Book of Mormon and the revelation that other witnesses signed to testify of was not the marriage revelation but the gold plates of the Book of Mormon. Nowhere in the same ballpark Joseph didn't start the religion at 14, that was when he was very thoughtful about religion and claimed the beginning of his heavenly visions. The Book of Mormon came when he was 23, and many other parts of the religion gradually came for the 15 years after that. Guy on the right mischaracterizes Joseph's "trouble with the law". Look at every case and it was largely a matter of religious intolerance. The Mormons had an extermination order against them from the government of missouri, the federal government didn't defend them while acknowledging this injustice, and the governor of Illinois knowingly permitted Joseph to be put in a jail with too few guards that could be overrun by a mob and end in his death, which is what happened, he was not murdered for justified reasons. I'm sorry but painting the federal government as the innocent and purely fair party and Joseph as some rough lawless scoundrel is very ignorant of the historical context. Religious intolerance drove their persecution, and I don't think other religions would ever receive this same lazy mischaracterization I think this whole, Brigham young had to move west to evade federal authorities. We don't characterize the pilgrims as a cult that had to leave England to avoid just law enforcement, they left cause of religious intolerance and so did the Mormons. The Scientology comparisons to Mormonism being anywhere in the same ballpark shows a serious lack of anything more than a superficial understanding of Mormons. Look up the essays "Are Christians Mormon?" That's shows how Christian orthodoxy has actually followed mormon theology on several major points now in the 21st century, so the cult label isn't fitting when non Mormon scholars recognize the impressive substance of Mormon theology and when mainstream Christianity now aligns with it on several points. I like joe's concession at the end that most Mormons are really good people. The question must then be asked, can good fruit come from a bad tree? I get if people don't want to believe in the supernaturalism surrounding some of Joseph smiths claims, but there must be other admirable parts of the religion that is producing such good people and motivating people to be so Christlike. And for some reason ppl prefer to focus on the controversial rather than the mainstream
@@toyconnoisseur4948 lol people who get that flustered by the CES letter are people who don't know how to think for themselves. I've read it many times and am not bothered by it at all, there are a ton of flaws in it, and I know enough about Lds history and theology to know what's a valid attack and what's lazy. and most of it is the latter. I'm not saying gospel doctrine is be all end all, but you're ignoring volumes of scholarship on these subjects in the name of you didn't learn it in Sunday school. Grow up and teach yourself. Most people bothered by CES letter were people who never took their own learning upon themselves. So if its trust issue with the church cause of that fine I get that, but don't act like the CES letter is an impressive document, once you get out of your angsty teen phase you'll realize how irrelevant it was all along.
@Kenzie K Yea you don't seem like someone who has an open mind to discuss this topic, you seem waaaay to arrogant and overconfident about your positions. Also, your disbelief of 21st century converging with mormon theology positions shows your vast ignorance of the actual literature, which tells me that your "big brains" on this subject, really came from a few RUclips videos and a few websites. Talk to me when you've actually read the professional scholarly literature, and get off the amateur blogs. You've already shown me you're not interested in having a serious discussion, but just want to vent off your anger so you feel a bit better about whatever insecurities are bothering you.
@@louccideavon7116 The big hitter in the CES letter is the book of Abraham. I’m not sure why you would attack a paper that is helping people escape a cult… lol
There is some amazing people in the lds community, but let me tell you there are a few horrific people in that church and the titing isn't used for good they don't help no members at all
the government dosnt care about welfare and certainly didn’t when churches got tax exempt status. they don’t pay taxes because of how much the us government is corrupted by religion
The average church only gives 7 to 8 percent to charity- the rest goes to church infrastructure- church outreach- church services- buildings, land, schools, most goes directly back to church hierarchy!! Churches are the worse way to use your money if you want to give for charity/ most charitable organizations have 80 to 90 percent going directly to charity!! And churches don’t get rated like non profits do!! Non profit organizations are transparent don’t they can get a rating- churches are secretive- and many like tv evangelists are corrupt
Being a Mormon, it’s like when folks accuse rogan of being in on a conspiracy or being controlled and he knows the truth about his own position but the opinions of others will remain. It’s all good, but I don’t talk jiujitsu technique because I’d sound foolish to anybody with more experience or practice than myself, vice versa....
Jason YoMama my sympathies for your negative experiences... I’m sure you’ve found zero deception or imperfections in your continued attempts at fulfillment and a happy life elsewhere...
Jason YoMama What makes magic underwear not OK? What makes symbolism wrong? You know for a fact that I can show you countless number of happy successful men and women and happy marriages and with happy kids who are in happy marriages and so on and you can point to some Bad examples as well. So who cares? I could point to good and bad examples of all in any and every type of people individual or group. , you have a mind that is triggered by Someone else’s underwear and preferred spiritual symbols and rituals... I can assure you that you think about other peoples underwear a lot more than more mormons buddy... I wish you very sexy underwear fantasies
... Except you don't have to be a mormon to know Joseph Smith was a felon, a known fraud and a conman, who had dozens of wives, some dangerously young.
He was also chased out of Ohio, and left in the middle of the night, but not before torching the building that had all the records of his wrongdoing. Ohio is where he had the FAKE bank that was illegal; he created it after the state turned down his request to create a bank.
@@Abby-pd3rx it's bad when it forces people to live in a sense of false reality that if you join us you'll be happy. While the leaders reap all the benefits. Not everybody is so easy to submit. Nor like LIVING A LIE.
I used to be Mormon. There's some good stuff, but their secrecy, patriarchy, finances, policies with LGBTQ+, and their psychological power over people are very disturbing.
@@johnlee1352 Except in this case , your the one protecting the money changers; given that the church has about $120 billion and uses only about 6% of the interest in that for charity while requiring the poor to tithe before buying food for their kids. Great work!
@@fatheratum5033 If you were LDS, thanks for leaving voluntarily. If you never were LDS, thanks for staying out. We don't need the weakness and confusion.
The LDS church has the largest humanitarian efforts and homeless and addict outreach programs in the world. That's where it goes. To say it goes to the top leaders is absolute bullshit. The very top leaders get an annual support (salary, if you will) of $120k, which is a drastic decrease in income from their lifelong professions.
@@garys.2291 yes, they funded that mask and now have no association with it. That's not really scandalous. Also, the funds the church holds has trustees just like any investment fund. None of the leadership personally owns land beyond their personal homes. You're making mountains out of molehills.
I'm an ex mormon. I just want to clarify that the FLDS practices pologamy but that is a small group compared to the LDS church which banned polagmy. The LDS church is the one knocking on peoples doors and handing out book of mormons and all of that. With all that theres a reason I left. Many reasons actually
When we moved to Utah in the 90s. We were welcomed by half the neighborhood, once they found out that we weren't Mormon and we didn't go to church. None of the kids were allowed to play with us and basically we were ignored from there on out. They like to keep to their own. Oh and trust me they'll act like you don't exist.
Not all of us are like that. But I believe you 100% because I grew up with these idiots. They focus on the wrong part of Christianity often because some of them are so frightened.
They only tolerate non members to the extent that they hope to convert them one day. When it's clear you are not interested, you are automatically shunned.
Interesting conversation, but as an active Latter-day Saint it pains me how little they know about my religion and it's founding and yet think they are authorities on the subject. His explanation of Joseph Smith's polygamy and his justifications for it is pure conjecture. He also fails to distinguish between The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints and other polygamist groups.
Christians and the LDS church speak the same language but mean totally different things. Father God was never a man, let alone a man who had his own planet. Jesus wasn't a spirit child originally. He has present since the beginning of time. He came to earth 2,000 years ago but has been around a lot longer. That is a small sample of why no Christian religion considers the LDS church as christian. But the members are really nice!
No, the reorganized LDS church always rejected polygamy and denied that J Smith practiced it. the FLDS church and its offshoots are the polygamists. So many LDS branches it can get confusing ...
I have been a Mormon for 35+ years now and it is absolutely wonderful. It's true that I've been offended by individual members plenty of times (just like anywhere), but I have certainly found peace and felt God's love in the church, especially when I'm doing service and helping others
Because they interfere in all aspects of life based on 0 scientific evidence proclaiming that their imaginary friend is the real deal, the other 3000 imaginary friends aren't and so what they say is important. Look at abortion or euthanasia or stem cell research, all the nutters with their imaginary friends sticking their nose in everyone's business. No one would care if the lunatics would keep their insane ranting to themselves.
I was raised Mormon in the Midwest which is about 85% less weird than In Utah. It's definitely a cult. After I left the church I attended other churches and went to university to major in Religious Studies. Was amazed to realize religions in general start out as a cult with a charismatic leader and a group of well meaning but gullible followers. Most of then fizzle out within the first generation. The ones that survive do so by gradually altering their doctrine until it becomes a set of manageable and socially acceptable beliefs. Mormonism and Scientology are both in the early stages of that process. They have evolved quite a lot already, and will continue to do so. The Mormons I've known in my life have been good, upstanding, kindhearted people, just as in other religions. Like Catholics and Protestants just how much of the church doctrine they believe varies from one person to another. In all the Jesus centered denominations some members don't believe much of it at all, but they like the social connection of belonging to their church and raising their families among good willed and supportive people. Personally I'm much happier studying religions and the people who practice religion than I am actually trying to conform to a religion. People apparently need something to believe in. Some. Choose religion, some choose political ideals, some choose 'science' or art or sex or drugs or doing battle with an enemy. We're curious creatures to say the least. PS- the secret to the long survival of Christianity is that Rome adopted the Jesus movement and restructured it into a state religion to keep all their rowdy illiterate peasants on the same page so to speak. In order to make their plan of world domination more achievable it was practical to not have people worshipping fifty or sixty different gods. If you have only one god, and your emperor is best buddies with that god, it makes perfect sense to do what the emperor wants. The more educated people become, the more likely they are to leave religion altogether. The connectivity of the internet and the ease of studying history has people leaving churches like rats leaviing a sinking ship. Its an internesting time to be alive.
Its always been easy to study history with things called books, but in today's world it's harder than every to discern fact from fiction, and AI gonna accelerate that problem.
@@kenziek6707So the alternative is to just give money to poor people? Don’t you think it would make more sense to build up an economy in a way that actually helps people for life? You know how many jobs that mall created? How many more people have sustainable income now because of this?
@@johnsonchase The church lied about where the money was going is the point. The lds church was made to pay millions of dollars in fines for lying to them. The SEC published a list of the real investment the LDS church currently has there are several things on it the LDS church preaches against. Like Alcohol, why is it alcohol is so bad and yet you can even buy at the LDS mall, to say nothing of the hotels the LDS church invested in that sell it and even a bar, "Dave and Busters Entertainment", is primarily a bar. I guess its only "bad" if the "lord" doesn't make money off it. The LDS church isn't at all interested in supporting people its interested in making money, that's all. How else do you explain things like the LDS church has over 100 Billion dollars (which it also tried lying about when it claimed "the majority funds go to funding temples and humanitarian projects" yet got rid of its paid custodial staff to clean up temples and instead have families volunteer to do it? The LDS church has been caught int he flat out blatant lie that it somehow gives a "billion in humanitarian projects". It first tried that claim a few years ago, but the fine print was it was its TOTAL amount since the since the 80s until then. The church still tries to claim that, even though it never once appeared on the top 400 charities of the us. Funny how little tiny willow creek church by itself gives more to charity than the LDS empire with its billions of dollars. And willow creek church doesn't have any Hawaiian resorts, over 2 billion dollars invested in big pharma, investments in hotels, Amazon (which also sells many things the lds church preaches against). I guess this shows either the leaders of the church know what they say is all a lie or its only "bad" if the "lord" isn't making off things h3es against. Either way the LDS church is horrible, lies all the time and I am so glad I left it.
@@johnsonchasereally? You are actually trying to defend the fact that tithing funds were used (despite EXPLICIT promises by GBH) to build a billion dollar for-profit mall? Let’s us not forget the only other time (literally!) funds from the EPA were used was to bail out a for-profit insurance company. Highly unethical and I imagine the IRS whistle blower case will deem the actions illegal too.
@@kenziek6707 A return so low 'you wouldnt have made it yourself' - everyone knows malls are terrible investments in the last 20 years, so why do it? hmmmmmmmmm, too deep for internet users to figure out, but I can tell you it has to do with missionary work and donut effects.
Hate to burst his bubble. The money does not go to good causes to help poor people. It is the worlds richest church and only about .5 percent helps people. The rest of the money is in an account. Perhaps it. Is there to accrue interest and now there is research exposing hidden money.
"they're really nice people and are good to each other" until you hear the women talk about the drama and the other women and cliques and slights in primary and young women and relief society. You'd think the only true church would be some level of different from the rest of the world. But no.
This! Because I've never met pettier people then the ones who claim that they're oh so holy. And their teachings on obedience are nothing short of authoritarianism.
I was born and raised in the Mormon church and I still am in it. In my experience, I find everyone to be friendly, and I have not seen anything toxic about it. Even if it isn’t true, it still preaches the bible. Additionally, it has given me direction in my life in the sense that it keeps me away from harmful things, like drugs, alcohol, etc. I find the main reason people don’t accept it is because they don’t want to think of a world without alcohol especially. But being sober my whole life has really helped me be non reliant on things and helped me navigate good vs evil. So whatever other people want to say about it is their opinion, but it has brought good values to my family and myself. I find a lot of other churches will preach god on one day of the week but the other 6 they go drinking and doing things created by the devil so I just haven’t really felt like it’s right to praise god but walk your own path in life. People also mention corrupt leaders but the leader of the church is not a rich man and not one word that’s come out of its mouth has ever been questionable to me. I just don’t see what makes it more of a cult compared to other religions when it holds values such as these.
@@mcanders19 Oh...NOW you're concerned for the standards of the church? Judged 16 million people unrighteously and now you're playing the victim...a millennial no doubt.
I grew up Mormon. I think they're kind people, however generally not nice. Extraordinarily judgmental as well and generally unaccepting. This is having grown up on the east coast in the church and also living utah as an adult as an ex Mormon.
You may be surprised how much of the food pantries are actually filled by the Mormon or LDS church here in Utah or an Idaho or in California or Nevada. On top of teaching people to farm arranging for running water and small villages Distributing clothes to third world countries and two natural disaster areas and a number of actual relief efforts such as those that Community also teaches literacy to the poor trades to people who normally wouldn't have a future otherwise and creates educational opportunities, helps people in everything from addiction recovery to abuse recovery to people who want to go through their program for genital identity issues. They hit help women who are in trouble with pregnancies another issues worldwide and their youth is constantly involved in service activities with their leadership. They've helped build auditing programs and systems for organizations to make sure that they are not wasting money or having recourse stolen from them.
In reality the church hoards $$$$money$$$$ and does very little to actually help people. In ONE investment account alone the church has more than $ONE BILLION DOLLARS. Yes, that's Billion with a "B." And they continue to hoard the money while not helping when there is so much need. You really should investigate who is actually on the front lines doing good, because it most definitely is not the Mormon church.
This isn't the main Mormon church (The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints) being discussed at the beginning. Michael then brings up the founder of the main Church, Joseph Smith. Michael then claimed that Joseph Smith was having sexual relations outside of his original marriage with Emma Smith. So far there has been no DNA evidence linking Joseph Smith to any children outside of his marriage with Emma Smith. Ugo A Perego a geneticist has a website dedicated to finding evidence of "other" children. www.josephsmithdna.com/about-me.html Although many early members of the church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints practiced polygamy, It wasn't for the mere reason of lust. I often hear Joe Rogan bring up the church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints as a 'cult' example, But I often feel he misses the point of it's positive teachings and doctrine contained within the book of Mormon. For example, Mosiah 2: 17 And behold, I tell you these things that ye may learn wisdom; that ye may learn that when ye are in the service of your fellow beings ye are only in the service of your God. Even if the Book of Mormon is true or false, It has undeniable positive teachings. I'd suggest anyone to read the book, Then make up their own mind.
Tyler Coop The author of the CES letter was a very dedicated Mormon at one point in his life. It seemed to me that for a long time he was never aware of the various issues and criticisms of the historicity and divine authenticity of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints. And when he eventually went online I believe he was genuinely shocked at what he found. So he created this letter which is more a compilation of the most popular criticisms of Mormonism. As far as I'm aware the apologetic group Fair Mormon have been replying to the CES letter. www.fairmormon.org/blog/2016/05/23/ces-letter-closer-look Also this Blog has been responding, tarikdlacour.blogspot.co.uk/2017/02/answering-letter-to-ces-director-1.html?m=1 Speaking personally I read the CES letter and I found it tedious. I've been aware of many of the criticisms of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints ever since I was a young teenager. Even at one point I played the part of the 'Mormon apologist'. I've came to the conclusion at this point that people could debate for many years of these various issues. I'm trying to remain as neutral as I can sometimes I see things the Church does that I completely disagree with, Sometimes I hear a critical point of view and I can see it's a straight lie.
That warm and friendly vibe Mormons have is an act. They’re very nice to outsiders to their face but a lot are two faced. They are so kind and nice with a great sense of community until you are one of them and start questioning your beliefs. They’ll slowly turn away from you and once you decide that the religion isn’t accurate they will shun you all together. Or at least that’s what happened to me and everyone I knew that used to be a member. But I’m sure it’s not everyone that will do that and most will say it doesn’t happen at all.
Totally 💯 Same thing happened to me. They’re nice as long as they think they can convert you or that you are a true believer. If you are a critic, they will shun you.
Where do you live? I'm mormon (before I start I want to say I respect your opinion and hope you respect mine) and my whole life, they have been very kind to me and my family. The only time I've seen what your saying is teenage girls and boys. They break every rule but put on a face. The reason they do this is because they are afraid to leave. It is kind of scary now that I think about it... wait, is it a cult?!
While I’m not denying the existence of the problem you’ve mentioned, having known several “ex-mormons” I wonder if there might be another factor that makes it feel like they’ve suddenly turned their backs on you. Could it be that after you decided that the religion isn’t real you became very critical of huge swathes of church practices, beliefs, etc. which constitute a huge amount of those people’s lives? Put differently, it might have been that they felt you were attacking their lifestyle unjustly and were put off by that. I know that the first thing most ex-mormons I’ve known do is spout off about how miserable the church’s practices are and how stupid their beliefs are, etc. and I can see how that causes people to “shun you.” Again, I’m not saying that what happened in your case isn’t legitimate or that this kind of thing doesn’t happen, but I don’t think most ex-Mormons are very fair on this subject
@@elicindrich3282 I can see your point and I’m sure that is a case with a lot of ex Mormons. I can’t speak for everyone but with me personally, I didn’t openly criticize anyone I knew or the church until after I was cast out. I believe that anyone has the right to believe what they choose as long as it doesn’t cause harm to others. At the risk of sounding hypocritical, my issue is when those beliefs influence the holders to treat others as less than equals. To clarify, I’m not in any way saying that all Mormons shun those that leave and in fact I still have friends that are Mormon that know my story. We don’t judge each other and have had healthy discussions about our beliefs. I’m human and not perfect so I’m sure I have been guilty of similar actions that I experienced. When I do realize that I’m doing the same thing I try to correct myself. Yet my emotions do get the best of me when talking about my experience with this subject and I do sometimes generalize which I realize isn’t fair to everyone that is a member of that church.
I was at least somewhat christian until i moved to a town with a lot of mormons and now I just don't feel comfortable with that stuff anymore. the not cursing, Not being able to hangout Sundays, no sleepovers, etc. it started to piss me off
@@johnb5254 Yeah because they do drink soft drinks which have caffeine. There's no reason for that shit, it makes no sense. I also dislike that they can't watch Rated R movies. The list goes on and it's almost like they're not allowed to be human
Don’t know if this is correct but I heard at one point he started to smoke a joint before each interview too. Sometimes I think he just likes to talk about whatever and sometimes doesn’t really care about the topic. Like some things are just throwaway topics for him idk lol
@@warriorofgod1412 A cult is a system of religious veneration and devotion directed toward a particular figure or object. If Christ is your "particular figure" i hope you are in a cult too.
It’s not just the Evangelicals that consider them a cult; Catholics do, too. If an ex-Mormon converts to Catholicism, they have to be re-baptized because they reject the Trinitarian form of God. (The Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit are One God in three persons; the ones who follow Jesus but reject this formula are considered to be a cult by the Church.)
You mentioned that he was 14 when he started to translate the Book of Mormon, he was also extremely uneducated at the time, if he did make it up (because 14 year olds do lie) how would he have been able to write an entire book, in complex language even for his time without any grammatical errors? No 14 year old kid I know could make something like the Book of Mormon up especially not an uneducated one.
Lucas Russo doesn’t change the fact that Joseph smith was uneducated so he would’ve been unable to come up with and write himself. todays youth are generally more educated than the adults back then, illiteracy wasn’t an uncommon thing for adults, because it wasn’t a priority in their lives, like you said 14 year olds had to help raise a family, there wasn’t enough time to go to school and read and write when you’re trying to put food on the table for several people in your family. Joseph smith did become educated later and life but that wasn’t until long after the church was restored. If you look at the language used in the Book of Mormon, it’s *old* it was very old even in Joseph Smiths time. Which would make it a thousand times harder to come up with yourself, as an uneducated 14 year old at the time.
Boston _ it wouldn’t be too hard to come up with if you’re changing the words of already existing scripture to better suit your idea. Multiple evidences that the KJV bible was changed just slightly in several instances to become the BoM
Lucas Russo you couldn’t just slightly change the Bible to get the Book of Mormon. That claim is insane. Look at the stories in the Book of Mormon, consistent with the Bible, yet different.
I live in Boise and in my neighborhood we have a hardcore fundamentalist Mormon family, you know the kind where the women wear homemade dresses that go down to the ankles and the men wear plain buttoned down shirts and off brand blue jeans that never quite fit right, the teenage son comes over to my house from time to time looking for work, every once in a while I’ll have him clear brush and give him a few bucks, one day while he was working I asked him if he wanted some water and started asking him about himself, he’s about 16, never been to school, doesn’t own a tv, supposedly a master furniture maker, and his last name is Jeffs. Right then my ears perked up and I said “oh yeah, like part of the Warren Jeffs family”? And he looked at me like how could this heathen possibly know Warren? Then I said “I watch the news” and he immediately clammed up and I couldn’t get anymore out of him. I don’t know where he falls in the family lineage (there’s 100’s of em) but I suspect that family managed to “break off” from the rest of the cult and are now living in a quiet neighborhood in Boise, he hasn’t been back since, kinda a weird kid
@@RealHorhay actually flds actually follow the religion as it was originally written. They are all cut from the same religion with flds actually being more true to its origins. Read more about it if you are interested.
I don’t know if I’d say NO religious institutions should get tax exceptions; the Catholic Church is the largest private provider of education and runs the most soup kitchens (privately) in the US. Many Protestant, Muslim, Hindu, and Buddhist groups do valuable secular outreach in their communities as well. Call me crazy but I don’t want one, central, politicized entity controlling all food and social service for the needy through the Federal government with taxes; they are the most inefficient group I’ve seen in my life time that is allowed to continue existing.
I can understand that. Problem is the LDS Church has amassed in just ONE investment account alone $100 BILLION DOLLARS. Yes, that's BILLION with a "B." They do very little good, and use only a tiny percentage of their wealth for charity, and usually only when they can get good press attention in return. A church that wealthy can afford to contribute something to the country that made it so wealthy. As it stands they pay NOTHING toward the upkeep of all the infrastructure they benefit from -- roads, water systems, sewer systems, electricity infrastructure, etc. They should at the very least participate in covering costs and they should pay property tax on their vast holdings. The Catholic Church does contribute much more than the LDS Church does.
@@Decision_Justice Wait, so the govt steals people money, spends 45% of GDP (state, local, and federal); then a church with voluntary membership is fiscally responsible running a surplus, and you don't like it? not to mention you have no clue of their actual spending? Besides, seems few can do basic math. $50B (amount they have today) divided by 15M members = $3,500 per member Govt debt: $200k per person. This civilization we are living is is clearly going to fail at this rate, and not because of churches.
Instead of getting commentary on Mormonism from people who have no clue, why don't you interview someone who can actually speak from a position of authority? I've heard you interview a few people who have made comments on Mormonism that are completely wrong. Having these guys comment on Mormonism is like asking Bill Burr to comment on astrophysics because he heard Neil DeGrasse Tyson speak one time.
Yes, it is a cult, and Joseph Smith was brilliant. He created a religious text called the Book of Mormon and based an entire religion on that book. Where are the golden plates...? God "took them" away to test the people. Wow. How convenient. Mormons are not that friendly to people who leave the church. (At least in my experience). Read "Letter to My Wife", or "CES Letters" to find out for yourself the truth of the LDS faith.
So contrary opinions and poorly sourced articles rehashed from old anti books is truth? Well, read books on why America is the most corrupt nation on earth while you are at it, or why the first moon landings were actually faked. Besides, the gold plates are right next to the ark, Moses miraculous staff, the bronze snake, Aarons rod, Moses' Urim and Thummim, Jesus cross/garments/etc.., the Garden of Eden.... oh wait, they were all conveniently lost I forgot.
And whats interesting that is FLDS but LDS Mormons in the Arizona Legislature stood in the way to having the Colorado city Police Department disbanded. Probably because everything warren Jeffs did Joseph Smith did. I hear it is better there now, but I still wonder why any non Mormon would live there.
My older brother converted to Mormonism about 5 years ago and he’s turned into the most annoying person I’ve ever met. When he caught me smoking weed (when I was 20, living on my own), he called my mom and told on me. I was 20, and he was 25 when that happened. The fuck bruh.
Thinking the US was better off under trump than it is now hardly means he joined a cult. You dont even appear to know what a, "cult" is any more than you know what a complete sentience is.
Quattro Bajeena my Jesus is the Son of God who came to earth. He was born in Bethlehem. He walked amongst the jews and taught his father’s word. He suffered in the garden of gethsemane for the sins of the world. He was spit on, beaten, whipped, mocked, falsely accused, betrayed, and nailed to a cross to die on calvary. He was placed in a tomb and had the entrance sealed. Three days later he was gone. He had risen and was resurrected. If you and I believe in a different Jesus, then you clearly believe in the wrong one.
Interesting - they don't quote 2Peter but appear to understand what Peter said in his second epistle - false religion and cults frequently go hand in hand with sexual immorality and greed. And in the case of Joseph Smith - all those plus general iniquity.
@@DannyAGray Ever notice that people trapped in a cult never say, "Hey everyone - I'm in a cult over here!!" Only when they are set free do they realize it. There's a reason that if you Google, "Set free from Mormonism" you get 2.2 million hits.
@@deancamp4914 I am a social scientist. It is not a cult, but you are clearly ignorant on the topic of cults, which is not an insult, just a description that ignorance we all have in various areas.
@ I have a doctorate in apologetics. I am well acquainted with cults. Of course no one ever describes themselves as a cult. As far as Christianity is concerned, a religious cult may be defined as, “any group that deviates from the orthodox teachings of the historic Christian faith being derived from the Bible and confirmed through the ancient ecumenical creeds.” Mormonism, by that definition, is certainly a cult. Read the story below of the man whose son was kidnapped by the Mormon “church”. Standard cult tactics.
I drove thru Colorado City a few years ago on my way to the Grand Canyon. It was very surreal. All the homes were partly finished and I saw no one except for a pickup truck with a bunch of kids in pioneer clothes in the back.
That was most likely then re - enacting the story of how Brigham young marched to Utah , it’s called “ trek” where teens and the leaders wear pioneer clothing and walk for days
@@seppyq3672 This is a worldwide thing. Big in Greece. You leave an upper floor unfinished and therefore it's not technically 100% a "dwelling". Very clever thing. Not all countries tolerate this, here in the UK they don't.
They are still a cult. I used to be mormon and I found a lot of things that don’t match with the word of God. Good works does not give you salvation. Good works come later. It’s God’s way how to teach you to be a good person. That’s part of the process to clean you. Accepting Jesus Christ is the only way to the Father. Romans 3:20 20Therefore no one will be declared righteous in God's sight by the works of the law; rather, through the law we become conscious of our sin.
Cleanup Efforts Underway in Asia Following Typhoon Mangkhut The typhoon, known as Typhoon Ompong in the Philippines, packed destructive winds and torrential rain as it cut across northern Luzon. Dozens of people lost their lives after heavy rains triggered landslides. Ninety-six Latter-day Saint chapels in the affected areas of the Philippines sheltered more than 4,000 members and friends of the Church during the typhoon where they received food and water. LDS Charities, the humanitarian arm of the Church, is coordinating relief efforts alongside Church volunteers who are repacking suppplies and distributing 7,000 food kits in the affected Philippine provinces. In Hong Kong, members and more than 100 missionaries from The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints have been working to help clean debris in the community. High wind smashed windows in the city, tearing off parts of buildings and roofs, while the storm surge flooded hotels and restaurants. Eight meetinghouses received minor flooding along with landscape damage. The Hong Kong China Temple received minor landscape damage but has reopened. Miraculously no lives were lost though a few hundred were injured and some were displaced. . . www.mormonnewsroom.org/article/cleanup-efforts-underway-asia-following-typhoon-mangkhut
What does their humanitarian efforts have to do with their doctrine being true or not? Both people on this podcast stated they thought Mormons were nice people. So i'm not sure what point you think you're making.
@Will iam My only point towards the OP is that Mormons could be the nicest people or contribute the most in humanitarian efforts and that wouldn't in any way lend itself as evidence the religion itself is True. Which is why I'm confused on the point the OP is making.
I was raised Mormon and was actually reading the Book of Mormon and had somewhat of a belief in the church all the way up until 8 months ago when I had a near death experience. You would think that would push me closer to god but it did the opposite I woke up from a coma and had to repent for all my sins to my bishop which were things like having sex, drinking beer and smoking weed. The reason it pushed me away is because everyone was saying things like “ we’re asking everyone in the ward to pray for you”and “we’re fasting for you” they believed that through fasting and prayer my life was saved and I was like uhh no the doctors and surgeons saved my life my family is still super Mormon so no hate to Mormons they’re really nice people I just am not that gullible to believe in that comical religion
Go a step further. Doctors and surgeons didn’t save your life, it was the natural self healing operations of the body merely aided by doctors that saved it. Doctors don’t heal bodies, they only help bodies to heal themselves. Go another step further. Your life wasn’t saved, your death was postponed. Memento Mori
@@skootempaw694 I think you meant to say “pray” and not “prey.” At any rate, I don’t think the RUclips comment section is a good place to proselytize. As a platform for religious discourse, it’s worse than pamphlets.
@@skootempaw694 ok.. I pray too... I also live in Salt Lake City, and have lots of lovely Mormon coworkers where I work building furniture for the temples. I don’t have anything against Mormons, I just don’t think proselytizing in RUclips comments works.
@@elijahbachrach6579 Then don't hang about in utube comment sections. Problem solved. It's an "Occum's Razor" function of cognition whence making choices. Google it for clarity.
My best friend was a Mormon, idk, never really asked him about it. But down the line 8 years of being my bro, he stole from me, and lowkey gets at all my exes. Cut him off since.
Not trying to convert anyone, but either Joseph Smith as a young boy had a time machine or other means of knowing all the nuts and bolts of the peoples in the Americas and their traditions both in their culture and as a society or he was truly given the golden plates which he then translated to give us various testimonies of Prophets and their testimony of Jesus Christ which can be found in the Book of Mormon. Read it and you will see the plethora of information that can be found there, which not even scholars in the early 1820's knew about existed let alone a young boy.
An anachronism is defined as an event that appears out of time. An example would be a reference to an event that had not yet occurred, or mention of objects or materials which did not yet exist. A well-known instance is the reference to a clock in Shakespeare's "Julius Caesar". Of course there were no clocks in Caesar's time, either Shakespeare didn't care about the inaccuracy or possibly he just wasn't aware there were no clocks during that time period. Joseph Smith claimed that the Book of Mormon, published in 1830, had been translated from golden plates that contained the accounts of the ancient inhabitants of the American continent. When studying the Book of Mormon one must question why are there Greek names and words such as Jonas, Lachoneus, Timothy, and Alpha & Omega found in a book that should have absolutely no Greek influence? 776 BC to 323 BC. Anyone familiar with Old Testament history will know that Alexander the Great's conquests of biblical lands in 332 BC came many centuries AFTER Lehi's supposed departure for the Americas. According to I Nephi 1:4, Nephi and his family left Jerusalem in the first year of the reign of King Zedekiah which was 597 BC. The Book of Mormon mention "bellows" in 1 Nephi 17:11, "brass" 2 Nephi 5:15, "breast plates and copper" in Mosiah" 8:10, "gold and silver currency" Alma 11, "silver" Jarom 1:8, and "steel swords" Ether 7:9? None these items existed during Book of Mormon times which are from 600 BC to AD 421. In fact, metallurgy did not appear until the 800s AD. Why does the Book of Mormon many times mention "cattle," "cows," and "calves," "bulls," "asses," "horses," "oxen," "domestic sheep," "pigs" and even "elephants," when none of these animals existed in America during Book of Mormon times? The only domesticated animals in pre-Columbian America were llamas, alpacas, guinea pigs, and turkeys which interestingly these animals are never even mentioned not once in The Book of Mormon. Another anachronism occurs in Ether 2:23: "What will ye that I should do that ye may have light in your vessels?" "For behold, ye cannot have windows, for they will be dashed in pieces;" The mention of windows that could be "dashed in pieces" in Ether 2:23 is another anachronistic, since glass windows were not invented until the late Middle Ages. Ethan Smith's book (no relation to Joseph) "View of the Hebrews," was published seven years before the Book of Mormon and is thought to be source material for Joseph Smith's Book of Mormon. LDS Historian and apostle Brigham Henry Roberts (B. H. Roberts) conducted an exhaustive comparison and analysis of these two books and concluded there is merit to this criticism. Contrary to popular belief, the Book of Mormon was not the first to suggest that Jews are the ancestral origins of American Indians. Joseph Smith had access to these early works: "It is altogether probable that these two books-"Priest's Wonders of Nature and Providence," 1824; and Ethan Smith's "View of the Hebrews" 1st edition 1823, and the 2nd edition 1825-were either possessed by Joseph Smith or certainly known by him, for they were surely available to him." B.H. Roberts - Mormon Seventy and LDS church historian "Studies of the Book of Mormon," p.153 We know that Joseph Smith was familiar with "View of the Hebrews" as he quoted page 220 from it: "If such may have been the fact, that a part of the Ten Tribes came over to America, in the way we have supposed, leaving the cold regions of Assareth behind them in quest of a milder climate, it would be natural to look for tokens of the presence of Jews of some sort, along countries adjacent to the Atlantic. In order to this, we shall here make an extract from an able work: written exclusively on the subject of the Ten Tribes having come from Asia by the way of Bherings Strait." -Smith's view of the Hebrews. Pg. 220. Joseph Smith - founder of the Mormon religion
And there are many more anachronims in The Book of Mormon, in addition to those grace mentioned above. Such as "steel," chariots, and preparing the horses and chariots of the King. No domesticated horses. No domesticated sheep. No coins. The wheel wasn't even used. The Book of Mormon quotes parts of Isaiah that had not been written at the time the Mormon Church claims for the prophet reciting it in the book. And the printing errors of Joseph Smith's particular KJV version of the Bible that he had are copied into the Book of Mormon. And that we are told by the Church, is the most correct book. Please read the CES Letter before you spend your entire life being fooled. The weight of the evidence against the Mormon Church is very, very heavy. And the Mormon Church has to have entire sites dedicated to trying to convince its members not to look at the evidence, and trying to get them to avert their eyes and not examine it. No other church has to do that.
@@gracethatchanges Ummmm, there are dozens if not hundreds of books that talk bout hebrews being ancestors of some of native Americans, ranging from holland in 1400s to Spanish chronicalers, and every century after. Joseph Smith may have rendered certain names into their closest English equivalents, similar to how biblical names were rendered in English translations of the Bible. For example, names like Isaiah and Jeremiah in the Bible have been transliterated from Hebrew, but their English forms reflect Greek and Latin influence. "Timothy" might represent a Hebrew or Nephite name that Joseph Smith translated into a familiar biblical-sounding name. What is more interesting is that all names int the early BoM are old Hebrew. Dont forget the French in there too, like "adieu" I think you are better off to pick one argument, not machine gun your issues.
Hey Joe. Mormons that you know that are Olympic Wrestlers and MMA Fighters include Mark Shultz, Cael Sanderson, Rulon Gardner, and also Mark Hunt- who used to have an LDS symbol on his fighting trunks,- but I do believe that Mark Hunt isn't a practicing Mormon at this time in his life. Just some trivia.
HeroSquad1millionA.D. Thanks I will try and do better at re-checking my spelling. What other skills do you havr besides trolling for RUclips spelling errors, staring at your balls all day and wondering why nobody responds to your friend requests on Facebook.
Seriously?! Yes ..lots of nice people But you really don't know enough about the doctrine and a lot of other things.. Like the lack of transparency about where tithing and other money goes.
@@elevationeddie1981 I've been following a family on RUclips named...Knorp and South. They are Mormons. So I started reading about Mormonism a few weeks ago. I'm kinda shocked that this family believes all these man made rules and weird ideas, like the underwear. Their son is getting ready to do a missions trip and they said they won't see him for two years, but what they don't tell you is that it's forbidden. Lots of hiding stuff. Also, your user name, hope that means you go to Elevation church!
@@TheVintageBumbleBee if ur talking bout LDS Mormons. U are dead wrong, it's not forbidden that mormons see their missionaries on the mission. So that alone just shows how much u don't know about the church.
@J Antione I'm glad u r willing to listen, as a teen teacher, i feel compelled to oblige with ur underdstanding of the church, now do take into account that to develope an understanding of the church, it takes more than just reading one of our books, please take the time to come to one of our sunday schools, sacrements and congrigations as often as u can. But as i said that's not what true LDS MORMONS believe in. This theory of black Africans being descendents of the curse of ham has been refuted ever since 1978, when the church had reconsile with our spiritual brothers and sisters. Remember, our scriptures have symbolic meanings in its text, in fact "dark skinned" doesn't necessarily mean a person being of color, but instead of disobedience. It's even been theorized that the curse didn't apply towarrds africans but instead indians. Which to me, makes more sence, not saying thats better, but even in our church we have members who enforce the word of God, instead of inviting those to listen, with our rationality. Lastly, I'm not so convinced you've learnt much about the church's history (which can't be found in the Book of Mormon) but u say Joseph Smith was a racist, yet he was one of the few to actually apose black slavery. I hope this helps, God bless you and ur family brother.
You are confused with Frosty the Snowman. Go spend a few nights reading about the translation process. It's mentioned a couple times on the church website decades ago, and numerous times regarding the seer stone (similar to Moses Urim and Thummim)
@ I read enough about Joseph Smith to know a conman charlatan when I see one and don’t want anything to do with that Idiocracy. I feel sorry for the weak willed sheep raised under its yoke that blindly follow without questioning why. Gods gift is free will, use it. Nice people, but in a holy war or apocalyptic situation I’d lay them all to waste for being so weak willed and to stop that social disease. How’s Chad Daybell and Lori Vallow doing?
Yeah. It is. So was Christianity at one point. The definition is: "a relatively small group of people having religious beliefs or practices regarded by others as strange or sinister.", and "a system of religious veneration and devotion directed toward a particular figure or object." Any religion seen as fringe is considered a cult.
Lol "just drop joseph smith"... good one joe, some deep thought there. Why don't you just add dropping Mohammed for the Muslims and Moses for the Jews while your at it..
Wrong - I think you mean a disgruntled former employee apostate member filed forms with the IRS in an attempt to get rich by starting an audit and claim a portion of the taxes collected. Mormon leadership are above board with paying necessary taxes. They are audited annually by Price Waterhouse Cooper and KPMG. The IRS already has the documents regarding of the entity in question. This is going to go nowhere.
@@raddiemutto7934 Evidence provided by the whistle blower proves otherwise. Not once in the 22 years of this "charitable", tax exempt fund did the mormon church use so much as one penny to fund any charitable causes.
Especially when we were led to believe that it was all going to charity rather than a stockpile of money they deserve to be taxed. I was Mormon until a year ago and then on top of the issues I had which weren’t related to tithing, this whole thing comes out yaaaaa I was mislead I may be disgruntled but I’m not a moron
@@andyr49 😂 are you kidding me? Ok. Just the first to come to mind of a long list. 2004 Indian Ocean tsunami relief. Mormon church gave over $31 MILLION in cash and supplies to aid in recovery. More than almost all aid organizations. Read for yourself under non governmental organizations en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Humanitarian_response_to_the_2004_Indian_Ocean_earthquake
John Robert ... lol no, the “local honest community” that you’re referring to was a mob of angry bigots on a mission to kill Hyrum and Joseph Smith. While these mobsters were heading up the stairs and into Carthage jail, a few of them were killed in self defense.
While Smith didn't deserve to be murdered, he brought his death in Illinois on himself. He likely would have been legally executed as it is, for being a government official, and military officer guilty of sedition.
The mob of men who took out Joseph Smith did so in Illinois, not Missouri. The "Council of Fifty" meetings records show that Smith was guilty of Treason. He had a plot to overthrow the U.S. government and turn it into a Theocracy with himself as King. He even had himself crowned King. It was the documents published by the State of Missouri in 1842 regarding the crimes of Joseph Smith, the destruction of and banning of the Free Press, and the stealing of other men's legal wives that enraged the mob. They knew he planned to abolish the U.S. Constitution and to overthrow the U.S. Government.
The story of Joseph Smith finding the golden plates is something. Try actually reading the Book of Mormon in a serious way. It is a miraculous book that has amazing power to bring one closer to Jesus Christ. It has brought me such peace and joy in my life and taught me so much about how to be a true follower of Jesus Christ. Oh, and Colorado City is not on the border of Colorado. It's in Arizona.
“I’ve been involved in a number of cults, some as a leader, some as a follower. You have more fun as a follower but you make more money as a leader”
Creed Bratton
Christianity is a cult.
Papa smurf
ZeRo Beats Cool beans.
Jose Martinez - Based on the purest definition;which is how I defined Christianity Islam is also a cult.
So when you hear these evangelicals declare everyone except them a cult, remind yourself how absolutely wrong they are. If anyone behaves with a cult mentality, they do.
I was raised Mormon but broke off really young. Mormonism is really weird but for the most part really friendly people.
Friendly on the surface, but very toxic.
@@pt7604 ? How so?
@@catmani2 Not a good way to respond.
@@DM-bu6to And yet they could easily outsmart and out argue you. So what does that say about you you half-witted, obtuse, imbecilic, doltish moron! Oh, i am sorry, i bet you couldn't even understand most of what I wrote, as your comment shows you have the vernacular of a 5 year old.
@Jim Caponzi Lol, because crimes happen that means that all followers of a religion are not friendly. MAKES SENSE
I have been a Mormon my whole life. Most people locally are well meaning. My son left the church a few weeks ago after a horrific missionary experience with the Portland Oregon Mission president. He told me he wanted to leave but when I tried to bring my child home the mission president refused to allow me to pick him up, refused to give me an address to have him picked up and refused to provide me with a means to bring him home until I called the police. Mission President instructed the other missionaries in the home to not allow my child to leave which is technically a hostage situation and a crime. I complained through proper church channels but church leadership swept my concerns under the rug. I never thought of my religion as a cult until this incident with higher ranking church authorities.
Report it to lower levels and higher levels than what you are the Church is aware that these things are happening, and that’s why they made a big deal of it at the last conference, and form pf abuse or abusiveness won’t be tolerated. They straight up said anyone who is doing things, they’re going to get excommunicated.
@@anhingathing2382 I reported it to the local leadership and my area leadership. The problem here is the person who is responsible for the abuse is at a higher level so the local and area leadership refused to contact anyone higher to report my issue. I heard the official church stance on it during conference as you stated but that is not what I observed while trying to report the abuse. I think they are more than willing to discipline lower level leadership while letting the higher level leadership do what they please. I agree with you that is what should happen and is what the church stated would happen but I don’t see them actually practicing what they just preached.
@@JC-vj2wh How long ago did you report this as well? Another thing could be that they're trying to investigate the issue further. It could also be that the Area presidency doesn't have authority to move forward with anything until they're told they can from their higherups, even then I think there's room for some concern, as if it's been more than it's fair share of time, then the abuse cases aren't being prioritized by those members.
@@anhingathing2382 this one was pretty severe. I would think it would have been a pretty high priority. If I had someone hold another individual against their will and refuse to allow the person freedom, I would have that at the top of my investigation list. I would deal with the Mission President immediately. I reported it in October to area leadership and was just told “well I don’t know why he would do that but I’m sure he wishes he would have handled it differently.” Very indifferent and had a tone of not wanting to pursue it any further. I reported it in October the day after it happened. Maybe they are looking into it as you say? I have been very disappointed with my interactions with church leaders about this issue. If I had done this outside of the church, I would have been arrested and charged with a crime immediately.
@@JC-vj2wh Yeah, I agree entirely, have you tried reporting it again? That's a really long time, and sweeping it under the rug like that isn't okay.
I worked for years with many Mormons. I don’t know much about their theology, but they were some of the most humble, kind and giving people I’ve ever met. I didn’t meet a single brainwashed cultist who tried to convert me.
Such nice Racists indeed.
@@jeffs4483 huh?
@@jeffs4483 ???
@@elementzr6978
They believe dark skin is a curse.
People are inherently good and nice. Meeting friendly mormons in your life gives no relevance to the truth of their religion or indeed their morality. In the case of the latter it’s especially true as no person should have to believe religious doctrine in order to do good
I was a Mormon for two years and have left the church but I don't have a bad word to say about my experience in the church
I was in it for 3 decades and I say the complete opposite. You didn't see the destructive side, so lucky you.
@@johnb5254 nope I only seen good things and like I said I can only speak positively about it. Then again I say every area of it is different. Alot of nice people in the church I went to so I use to feel great coming out of there on a sunday
@@evancawley3236
You only saw what's on the surface. Lucky you.
@@johnb5254 please share your experience :)?
I have been a member of the church for almost a year now. One of the reasons why I joined the church was because they were genuinely nice people and convinced me what I was taught were real. But here is my first problem: I didn’t even know if I was making the right decision to get baptized because I still had doubts. And according to them, they would, supposedly, know if someone is ready to be baptized or not. A missionary had a conversation with me before I got baptized to see if I was qualified, which I passed. But to me, it felt like any test you would have in school, as long as you get the answers right, then you pass. Furthermore, they keep telling people to pray to God if you have any questions, if your prayer and desire is sincere, you will receive the answer. Well, not a single question I had was being answered. Something I figured out lately that Christians are confirmation bias, meaning if you are looking for something to happen, and if anything then happens, that must be it, coming from god. For example, you have worked so hard to get something you desire. You finally got it, but because you believed it to be God’s gift, you disregard all the hard work you put into it, instead giving God all the credits. There was a time when I was bothered by the thought that if the church is not true, then how come everyone around me believed it to be true? Then I came to realization that most of them grew up with it, or indoctrinated since a young age. That’s how they view the world, telling them that their world view is not correct is an impossible task. When it comes to Science, most of them have this sort of selective amnesia where they agree with biology, physics stuff but completely in against with stuff like evolution, radiocarbon dating, etc.. The more I think about it the less convincing the LDS Church is to me, thought I found the real one(there are none, there is no heavenly entities), turned out to be just like other churches. Wish I had learned that earlier. Recently, I have been watching videos that debunk Christianity and Religion in general, and I couldn’t agree more with what them videos been saying. I still go to church every Sunday and participate in their activities, but I don’t feel it anymore, if I had ever felt anything in the first place when I joined the church.
My favorite cult would have to be the Amish. Here's a group of people who had some crazy beliefs, and so they went off and minded their own business. Perfect.
(Okay, some people complain that their buggies damage public roads from time to time, but the way I see it, our cars are polluting the planet that they live on, so it's kind of an even trade.)
Amish are not a cult. They just live differently than you do. This is a perfect example of bigotry.
they do make incredible furniture! haha
At least the hommish make food, rugs, and clothes for the outside community. These Mormons just try and ruin laws. They own half of Vegas for a reason.
Shawn Ravenfire I think If I was gonna commit to any Crazy religion, I would choose the Amish. 😂😂
Half my neighbors are Amish, very strong people and so nice too.
I talked to a Mormon from Salt Lake City who was doing his MIssionary work in Northern Ontario Canada trying to convert the locals and natives.. They were really nice. We talked about the play book of Mormon. They liked it. I talked about South Park with them. They didnt seem to like SP very much lol. They gave me a bible and I couldnt throw it out. It just felt wrong. So it sits on top on my entertainment center with a Buddha lol
Burn the religions icons... Not because I'm some extremist.. But just because if there is a God, it's sending him the message to come talk to you himself if he wants you XD
@@josephsherman5288 What do you think the book is? It's God wanting to talk to you, but the real reason you burn it is because you don't actually want to listen.
@@markurry3149 Not at all, it's an organisation's propaganda.
You mean they gave you the book of Mormon?
@@josephsherman5288 how could the book of Mormon possibly be propoganda?
I’m a non Mormon but played hockey in Salt Lake when I was younger and spent a year there. The people were extremely nice and helpful. Yes they had large families and many beautiful Mormon girls wouldn’t marry outside their religion, tho I’d offer to convert they’d all say they didn’t want me to convert just for them. Still, an awesome helpful people. My truck broke down on freeway and in 5 minutes literally 20 passerby’s stopped to help me. Also a cop pulled me over once for weaving and recognized me and let me go asking if I could get him tickets. I remember it because I never did get him those tickets…20 years later.
yeah, they're nice until you tell them to F off ...then they gang stalk you just like scientologists do
as a lot of religious fundamentalists are. Just because they are humble, kind and giving does not mean they are not in a cult. Its part of their MO, part of the cult behavior
They probably thought you were Mormon. Mormon's were friendly, until I told them I wasn't Mormon, then they avoided talking to me. Every time I visit SLC and Provo, I get a creepy feeling, like I'm an outsider. Its not a cult, just a weird closed social group, not a religion. Joe Smith had many scams going while starting the Mormon church. He was a crooked contractor, investor, etc and just wanted to get rich. State of Ohio had plenty of evidence of stealing $thousands from people, but he gained such a following with religion, they forced JS to leave the State and never come back. Visit SLC and see the teenagers living on the street. The church told their parents to kick them out until they repent. Many other weird things.
@@WhiteArtsMagicdefinitely not 💀💀 ur brainwashed to believe that mormons are awful people 😂
@@WhiteArtsMagic
I’m not saying that these Mormons weren’t helping out of good intention but your exactly right it’s still a cult
reminds me of what this one RUclipsr said
“The absence of evil is not an indication for the presence of good” - Dry Creek Wrangler
Colorado City is actually on the border of Utah and Arizona.
That hurts a lot coming from someone who doesn't understand when to use the correct you're. I grew up in Utah and certainly know where Colorado City is located, look it up!
@@MountainHobbler Would you take me over to the Short Creek? I hear it's good place to pickup chics
I live like an hour away from Colorado city and sometimes when I drive through the city I get curious and look at all the houses in the small town once I’ve looked at the majority of the houses and markets in the town I notice cars following behind me it’s not necessarily “scary” it’s just eery as fuck. I also work at a plant nursery and a lot of our customers are polygamists and the way they dress is funny as hell it’s like an Olden day “costume” it’s pretty weird that I have to type/ explain all of this weird shit because this is literally my everyday life.
I was going to ask a question about that be cause a) Colorado City in CO is nowhere near the CO-UT border and b) Colorado City is not a Mormon town (I used to live less than 20 miles away).
@Kenzie K Wonderful. Definitely not the Colorado City in CO. It was pretty quiet when I was living nearby. This Colorado City sounds like somewhere no one except a FLDS member would want to go.
Dude, I've got more beef than most with the LDS church, but many of your "facts" are incorrect. Firstly, Joseph Smith was killed in Illinois, not Missouri. The affidavit in the introduction to the Book of Mormon is not about polygamy. The FLDS sect was led by Warren Jeffs. Colorado City is near the boarder of Utah and Arizona, not Colorado. And you say you've been there?
Why you hate mormons?
@@KC.801 I don't hate Mormons.
@@couchsurfingsam you said you got beef wit em
@@KC.801Beef and hate are two very different things my friend.
@@couchsurfingsam if you have beef with someone you don’t like them 😂
As a former Mormon I’m surprised how much Rogan knows about Joseph Smith. To spit out his age at a certain year off the top of his head was pretty impressive
@balddicknosedasscanoe no hes never mentioned it before i don't think
Wow! that sure makes him an authority!
Pretty sure he has notes and reviews certain topics before the episode. Just a thought.
@@scottmolis4267
l was an active Mormon for 50 + years....born ln the "covenant", mission, BYU, bishopric, temple married, etc., etc.
Would you consider ME to be an "authorlty"...as long as l didn't say anything negative about Mormonism?
(l reslgned my LDS membershlp 20+ years ago.)
@Dub You said “As a former Mormon I’m surprised how much Rogan knows about Joseph Smith.”
Rogan practically knows nothing about Joseph Smith and the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day. He’s just trying to be impressive to maintain his reputation of a commentator of sorts on the Internet, with the other guy just playing second fiddle.
How about you, Dub? What’s your story? Obviously you know very little of the Church. How long have you been a member? We’re you even an active member who paid tithing? What made you leave, and which church, if any, do you go to now? What’s your story?
Not all Mormons that I've met are bad people, but of the 5 worst humans I've met, 4 were Mormons. The top 4.
I’m sorry that happened to you. Everyone should be treated kindly.
The followers are usually great people but they are controlled by guilt.
Warren Jeffs is the guy you're trying to think of Joe.
Dudes compound is whack I cleaned that shit out for a class in high school
WARREN IS THE ONLY PROPHET WHO COMMUNICATES WITH GOD. LOL NOT!!!! DO FLDS ACTUALLY THINK THIS BIZARE! YOU STAY IN YOUR COMPOUNDS THE WORLDLY WORLD IS EVIL YOU STAY IN YOUR NICE COMPOUNDS LOL
Warren Jeffs? LOL you mean LDS leader! wiki joseph smith jailed 42 times www.wivesofjosephsmith.org
Yeah, these guys really did their homework before doing this episode.
@Kenzie K you are sooo full of shit
lol, I used to be Mormon and they're pretty close, but Joe has a bit too much misinformation from this
What misinformation was there?
Lots... he's making generalizations and chronological misconceptions at the least.
@@LazarusSchell Can you give one example?
Logan Tatham how joseph smith made up the polygamist rule so he can bang the neighbor, but he made that rule before he was married
2:45 the signed statement he's referring to was about them claiming to have seen the golden plates. Joe Rogan then says Joseph Smith 'started it all out when he was 14' but Joseph Smith only claimed he had a vision then maybe a decade later. Back then Joseph Smith was doing things like treasure digging. 8:17, the church actually still have some (or all) of the stones it was the golden plates that were claimed to have been brought up to heaven. Again, all super close and impressive that he knows so much about Mormonism.
Technically, all religions are "cults" in the original Greek definition of the word, as "cult" referred to a small body (what is called a congregation) of worshipers who gathered in private to perform religious rites of worship for their deities.
mormon church gatherings are entirely open to the public
@@jameschristensen1658 but I’m pretty sure most of their rituals and other things are kept in secret.
@@guidomonto3742 even from members until they rank high enough
@@guidomonto3742 no
@@guidomonto3742 Not true.. even what happens in the temples is written in the scriptures that ALL are encouraged to read. The words the movements.. etc.. it's all over the internet as well. There are even classes that are taught to members regarding what takes place in the temples. Nothing is a SECRET but we hold these things SACRED. There are 'rituals, rights' etc. in almost every ancient religion and tribes throughout the world. In the Temple in Jerusalem, there were clothing that was worn, words spoken, offerings given and places in the temple that only the Holy of Holies good go... I'm Jewish and from the Church of Jesus Christ. I have been in the Temple many times. Wonderful things take place there that bring families together such as marriages for all time AND eternity. Jesus said that whatsoever man binds on earth in only for this life time but whatsoever is bound by God is for eternity. I would want to have my children for all time and eternity... Baptism for the dead.. Christ when talking the Pharisees gave them a lesson about the resurrection. They didn't believe in the resurrection but they baptized the dead. Christ said, why baptized the dead if the dead rise not at all. He was trying to get them to understand that YES.. the dead are going to rise and they still needed to be baptized. This church is not the first in history that baptized the dead by proxy. Same with sealing of deceased family members to living so that the family lineage through time are still together for all eternity. This has been done through history as discovered through ancient writings and archeological research. So why is what my church doing so wrong? Because people don't understand it? People fear it? Because we are a peculiar people? Christ made it clear that the saving ordinance that are performed for the living must also be performed for the dead. There is an organization to everything that God does.. he is not a God of chaos. As far as 'ranking' up in the church.. there is no such thing. A man may be 'called' or 'set apart' through prayer and inspiration by a Stake President to become a Bishop of his ward.. He is only a Bishop for 4-7 years and then is replaced and he goes back into the normal congregation. A stake President is 'set apart' in that position for up to 9 years and then he is released and goes back into the normal congregation. These people in the church do not get paid but volunteer their time and it can take quite a bir of time. There is no compensation given. Someone who is 'set apart' serves in that position for a set period of time and then is released. An Apostle, the Prophet and the Patriarchs are 'ordained' into those positions for the remainder of their life. They don't 'rank' up. When the Prophet dies, yes.. it's USUALLY the president of the 12 apostles who become the next prophet but that is not always the case. The 12 apostles go to a room in the temple and they fast and pray as to who the LORD wants to be the next prophet.. not man. See, in Jewish history, it was usually the eldest son who received the Birthright and blessing from their father. This was tradition... But you will find that it was not always the case when God wanted a particular son to become the next Prophet. Esau should have but it went to Jacob, Ephraim received Joseph's but Joseph received Jacob's. God will choose who He chooses, whether a son of Pharoah who was slow of speech, had killed, had sexual relations, etc. or a 14 year old farm boy with a 3rd grade education. There is a great deal the public doesn't know about this church because there are so many people spreading lies or misconseptions.. This is not a SECRET organization.. we don't worship satan, the prophets or any other 'thing' or person.. Just Jesus Christ. Thus the name of the church.. THE CHURCH OF JESUS CHRIST of latter day saints. By the way.. you can find that name and phrase in the dead sea scrolls found in 1947 in a cave on the coast of the Dead Sea.. How did a 14 year old boy know about that name in a scroll that was from the 3rd century BCE and found almost 100 years after his death... there is so much more that you all don't know or understand but I am more than happy to debunk your debunking. Ask me...
Mormons are friendly in the same way salesmen are friendly.
We do a friendly. I am Mormon and I have a lots no- mórmon member
yea FRAUDS
exactly, i grew up mormon and i hate when people say they’re friendly, it’s so disingenuous.
@@markyjrocks68 thank you
Mormons, They are nice but rarely are they kind.
All i got to say is mormons have really good work ethic only people I've ever seen that are able to keep up with hispanics
Cause mormons are hispanics.
@Will iam Most are. I was a mormon missionary and have paid attention to mormon growth tactics since. "White people" don't become mormon anymore. More seem to be leaving than joining (like myself). The only people who join in USA are Mexicans and abroad outside of the USA are Africans.
Appreciate it man
@@shawnreed7876 Also that's not really true, I think by now there's a greater LDS population outside of the US than inside, but in American churches there's a very high white demographic. Not because we're white supremacists or anything, anyone should be able to join any church and it's the same with us, just because it started only 200 years ago in Utah.
@@WiloPolis03 It is most definitely true. Look at the numbers. White people don't become mormons. More whities leave than join. Soon Latinos will stop joining as well. Most of the mormon church's current and future growth will be in Africa but eventually that will slow as well. Joseph smith's church has done remarkably well but as will all things, the pedofile's church will eventually die.
Around 9th-10th grade I had a good friend who was Mormon. He was devout and i actually went to their church a couple time as well as some youth events. Nicest ppl ever !! Their beliefs are wacky af but they do treat others nicely
@ Clovis...
Nice... UNTIL YOU PROBE THE SURFACE OF THEIR FACADE. THEN... you'll learn all about "shunning".
Yeah, unlike JW's, Mormons are allowed to have friends outside of their faith.
Nice until you start asking real questions.
@@jeffs4483 yeah they have told me some weird ass shit man. I appreciate them not being assholes about me being an atheist but they were pretty weird with beliefs for sure
@Steve D ...not so much. Unless you're potentially baptizable OR a neighbor, local merchant, etc. - you'll get a pass, but no "recommend" (insider joke 4 LDS & NoMo's)!! But hey... we all gotta' serve SOMEbody.
I am born Mormon and still go sometimes. I have to go cause of my father. Mormons are nice and I don’t think it’s bad, but it’s not right for me. Im starting to question and being Mormon doesn’t let me express who I truly am and it doesn’t make me happy. I will probably still go to the Mormon church until I am old enough to say “I’m leaving.”
I just believe in God and the basics. I don’t want anything complicated
same here bro
You can make it out.
Good for you! God would want you to be yourself.
I suggest you pray to GOD for guidance
Sooner or later you Will notice the doctrine is false and weird and you will leave it completely. That’s how it happened to me.
I converted to the LDS Church a couple of years ago. It was one of the best choices I have ever made. Through the Church I met some of the most decent people ever. I dont drink any alcohol or smoke, have become very disciplined in everything. I have become more compassionate towards others. Thanks to God and the LDS Church. A perfect church!!!
Whoops, he’s been brainwashed boys-
@@Milkish How do you have so little likes🤣
Damnnnnnnnnn cult be going crazy
Apostle J Reuben Clark said: "If we have the truth, no harm can come from investigation." Please read the CES Letter and discover what you need to know...
giving away 10 percent of your income sure does displine you huh, can do all of that outside of the church and save that money, or actually spread the gospel instead of the book of "golden plates". Heaven is forever free, it will never require your 10 percent to get in, to your surprise god actually donest care about money, also polygamy is adultery.......
Annoys me when people say how 'nice' they are. That has not been my experience.
If they are being rude or mean in any way, they do not understand the LDS doctrine.
@@noahsherman4129
Their doctrine is supremacist so it rubs off on it's members.
Yeah just because you had bed experience doesn’t mean everyone in the church is bad
@@MoseleySquad13
Yes, it's bad 100%. That whole organization is based on lies and fed by endless bigotry, racism, and sexism.
You're gonna find assholes anywhere even in the LDS faith you'll find them. I hope you have better experiences in the future
I usually like joe rogan but A LOT of misinformation in this video. I'm really surprised by some of his ignorance on the topic
What's wrong about it?
Same man
Taylor Rogers Alright, here's my fact-checking of Joe and the other guy:
I love joe Rogans podcast, but when this needs serious correction:
1.) they are not careful enough on differentiating mainstream Mormonism from fundamental Mormonism. The former condemns the latter for their polygamy practice and is not similar to the latter much at all. 2.) guy on the right is absolutely false, the so to speak polygamy revelation is not in the Book of Mormon and the revelation that other witnesses signed to testify of was not the marriage revelation but the gold plates of the Book of Mormon. Nowhere in the same ballpark
Joseph didn't start the religion at 14, that was when he was very thoughtful about religion and claimed the beginning of his heavenly visions. The Book of Mormon came when he was 23, and many other parts of the religion gradually came for the 15 years after that.
Guy on the right mischaracterizes Joseph's "trouble with the law". Look at every case and it was largely a matter of religious intolerance. The Mormons had an extermination order against them from the government of missouri, the federal government didn't defend them while acknowledging this injustice, and the governor of Illinois knowingly permitted Joseph to be put in a jail with too few guards that could be overrun by a mob and end in his death, which is what happened, he was not murdered for justified reasons. I'm sorry but painting the federal government as the innocent and purely fair party and Joseph as some rough lawless scoundrel is very ignorant of the historical context. Religious intolerance drove their persecution, and I don't think other religions would ever receive this same lazy mischaracterization
I think this whole, Brigham young had to move west to evade federal authorities. We don't characterize the pilgrims as a cult that had to leave England to avoid just law enforcement, they left cause of religious intolerance and so did the Mormons.
The Scientology comparisons to Mormonism being anywhere in the same ballpark shows a serious lack of anything more than a superficial understanding of Mormons.
Look up the essays "Are Christians Mormon?" That's shows how Christian orthodoxy has actually followed mormon theology on several major points now in the 21st century, so the cult label isn't fitting when non Mormon scholars recognize the impressive substance of Mormon theology and when mainstream Christianity now aligns with it on several points.
I like joe's concession at the end that most Mormons are really good people. The question must then be asked, can good fruit come from a bad tree? I get if people don't want to believe in the supernaturalism surrounding some of Joseph smiths claims, but there must be other admirable parts of the religion that is producing such good people and motivating people to be so Christlike. And for some reason ppl prefer to focus on the controversial rather than the mainstream
Most normal people are ignorant to LDS cult members. ONly Cult members are more ignorant than just about anyone else on LDS subject SAD www.wivesofjosephsmith.org Question everything the cult tells you
@@johnrobert2072 lol I never denied the original church practicized polygamy and I'm very aware of my religion. This is where accuracy about representation is important and that was Joe's error, even though he also goofed up on a lot of the facts as well. congrats you sent me one website that I've known about for a long time. Its not that we don't know about this history, there's an ugly side to it, the problem is that the embellishment and exaggeration by you and in this one time case, Joe, is that you're making up stuff on top of it and taking it way out of proportion. Get Educated please or don't be posting about it.
Wrong on the tithing too. Handbook 2 is available online for anyone to read. This conversation was the blind leading the blind.
So disappointed with Joe on this. So many errors in all their assumptions. The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints. This church does so much good in the world. Joe why not bring a real member of this church on your show, and get facts, read the Book of Mormon also. And remember ye shall know them by their fruits
You have handbooks on how to pay LOLOLOL. Is your criminal organization also full of CPA's?
John Robert of course! How else do you think they’ve stock piled over $100 billion dollars and not paid any taxes?
@@johnrobert2072 You know nothing yet you think you know everything. Why don't you educate yourself versus just making stupid comments. The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints has been extremely wise with the money they receive. They have in vested, etc. They own the worlds largest ranch, have to largest food program in the world to feed the hungry. I have used this program instead of the gov program of food stamps. etc. Nothing was required to receive it, and only stipulation is that I was seeking work (church has one of the best employment programs in the world, which got me a job), and pay tithing if I could (not required). They build beautiful temples and houses of worship only for the use of spiritual matters. We have weddings there that cost zero. If I am ever in trouble on any level they are there to help. I could tell you benefit after benefit. And poor me for all this I pay 10% of my income to it if I want and once a month I give up the price of two meals to feed the hungry if I want. This churches programs is not like the government where it is wasted, it is used wisely.
@@cj8899 Actually its 200 billion. Much of the wealth is in property such as churches and temples, farms, ranches (to feed the poor), food storage facilities called Bishop Store Houses to feed and cloth the poor, preservation of historical sites, etc. It is not money just sitting in the bank. My father once needed a surgery and had little money so the church stepped in and helps. I could give you story after story. So maybe instead of just being critical, maybe become informed and learn all the amazing good they do with what the Lord has blessed them and me as a member of that wonderful church. This is what bothers me about what Joe and this guy are saying about The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints. They are both so ill informed, related to Joseph Smith. etc. Joseph was not banging a 14 year old girl, there is no proof of that. DNA test of ancestors have not shown truth of this. Yes we lived the law of polygamy for a short time, like many did during Bible times, and like today, which is about 54 percent of the worlds population. The problem today is with groups who practice it and abuse it. Please become informed and let us fight evil where it really exists, primarily on the Left and the real alt right.
The difference between a religion and a cult is that a cult always has strings attached, as in: they want your money and free labor. True religion is about philosophy and spirituality
Tue religious is about a hoard mentality. No freedom for self thought. If you arent in you are out
So all churches are cults.
You don't find "true religion" in an organized church, only in individuals. I think people fail to understand that the word cult isn't always similar to what you see in the movies. With that said, a religion cannot be a cult, BUT all cults are religious.
Then it's not religion anymore. It's looking within yourself to find the real God. That God can't be found in the walls of the Church.
Just FYI, I have never, in 46 years of being immersed in LDS culture, heard anyone mention paying tithing on capital gains or profits of a home sale. I'm sure some LDS do this, but that's the minority; the hardcore. It's just never come up in thousands of LDS sermons or Sunday School lessons, and not doing this is certainly nothing Mormon leadership would ever call you out on.
bigbigbigdoug I feel you ,I have been to many congregations in many states ,such as all around Florida (Deltona ,Daytona,Miami,Tallahassee)and NYC,and NJ,l have never seen such things
They have 130 BILLION in assets PEAK INVESTMENTS look it up! HIDDEN! Tisk tisk would be have to ask for your money when you have more than most fortune 500's. Bishop it's time to pay your tithing and if it's not an honest tithting no temple for your or salvation. SHIT you out top heaven. Not a cult lol
Then you weren't listening very carefully, if I'm honest. The rule is 10% of _ALL_ income, which includes things like capital gains. More specifically, tithing is paid on your "increase", rather than just work-related and similar incomes, though as far as my mother was concerned they were the same thing. When I was a kid, my mother would very very sternly encourage me to pay tithing on my $5 of weekly pocket money, which had already been tithed as it came from her income, but as far as she was concerned it was income for me (an increase to the balance of my piggy bank) so the commandment was that I pay a 50c tithe. "If the money comes in, it's income" she'd say, which is why she insisted that relatives not give me cash for Christmas and birthday presents, because she didn't think it was very uplifting for me to be paying tithing on my Christmas gifts.
More recently, in our ward we actually had someone ask the Elders Quorum President (a few years ago now) during a lesson on tithing whether he was supposed to pay tithing on the sale of his house, which was in settlement, and the president said he wasn't sure but he assumed so because it was a form of income. That prompted a discussion on whether the elder in question needed to pay tithing on the whole sale or only the increase from its original purchase value, and we resolved it was the latter as he'd originally bought the house rather than inherited it. He was actually surprised about it because he'd assumed he needed to pay tithing on the full sale, so he was glad the spirit had prompted him to bring it up. This is the only time I've ever heard of anyone discussing the minutiae of tithing payments, whether in lessons or even just in conversation, so I can understand that you would have never heard of anyone mention tithing on capital gains and the like. But I think this is more a case of Church leadership assuming that members will understand and honestly follow the rule that tithing it to be paid on "all income" or their "increase" rather than any wilful attempt by leaders or membership to subvert the rules on tithing in regards to extraordinary income.
@@michaelheliotis5279 @Michael Heliotis I stand by my assertion that this hasn't been something that's been emphasized specifically. To be real, I have avoided elders' quorum almost completely for years . . mostly to avoid ultra-conservative douchecanoes trying to insist on defining the finer aspects of various doctrines for everyone else. And I have no empirical evidence regarding the percentage of LDS that would stick to the letter of the law regarding tithing to the extent of applying it to capital gains on houses . . it's just my impression based on decades of being around people. If I had to reason it out, in most cases I sell a house, but then I'm buying another house, so it's not like I'm pocketing the difference. Yes, it would still be an "increase" . . but I don't see anyone being denied a temple recommend because they moved, made a profit on the sale of their home, and didn't pay tithing on the profit. That would be one hard-core bishop demanding that.
@@douglasderu980 I don't disagree with you that it's not emphasised very much, I'm just saying the the Church's leadership probably just takes it for granted that people pay their tithing the way they're supposed to. And I don't think it's unreasonable for them to make that assumption, as most people who've obtained a financial position that affords them regular capital gains are likely to understand that they should be paying tithing on them. So anyone who isn't is very obviously cheating the Lord. I agree that you won't find a bishop who'll grind you over your once in a decade house sale, but if you're a career landlord who buys and sells houses all over the place, he'd be a pretty negligent bishop if he wasn't taking an interest in your capital gains.
Joe Rogan, I always support the fact that if you need something about someone, you should go directly to the person and ask.
Seriously, the man you invited learned about Mormonism through some kind of cartoons ... it has no sense at all on the things he said.
Thank you for saying this
thanks for some sense
Jon Smith was a crook, and not a prophet at all. Humans can not become gods. God himself was never a man.
A very good comment
Mormon and polygamy are not the same thing
arent the men promised multiple wives if they heed all commandments faithfully before death?
@Mr. Richardson Fake News
ElevationEddie I’d be screwed as a gay man. A whole planet of women. I guess we could go shopping together.
Mr. Richardson so funny even the LDS can't face that weird shit said by former prophets lol
Mr. Richardson can you give me a source
I'm an active Mormon and have been my whole life. Honestly as a member i'm not looking to convert people wherever I go, honestly i'd rather just not talk religion most of the time anyway. I'm literally just trying to live my life the best I can. If you want to hang out, awesome, lets do it. Want to go to a bar? Awesome lets do it, I'll be your driver. Need help with something? Cool I'll try my best to be there.
Some of the comments too talk about shunning other people that aren't LDS (Mormon) I think some of it comes from us LDS people feeling uncomfortable when people are talking bad about the religion in front of them anytime someone comes up and I don't think its probably a consious thing, just that people who talk bad about your morals and religion isn't something that makes me want to hang out with that person. I'm all for jokes and stuff, but its exhausting always trying to defend beliefs all the time.
My kids go and hang out with kids in our neighborhood who aren't religious and we're friendly with the parents too. We're normal people trying to live normal lives too. I'll let my kids believe what they want, and ask questions on what they want.
I’m a devout Christian and what I have to say is you need to repent,get away from Mormonism,it’s a Cultic false religion.And if you choose not to you’re on the broad path to destruction.
Alright, here's my fact-checking of Joe and the other guy:
I love joe Rogans podcast, but when this needs serious correction:
1.) they are not careful enough on differentiating mainstream Mormonism from fundamental Mormonism. The former condemns the latter for their polygamy practice and is not similar to the latter much at all. 2.) guy on the right is absolutely false, the so to speak polygamy revelation is not in the Book of Mormon and the revelation that other witnesses signed to testify of was not the marriage revelation but the gold plates of the Book of Mormon. Nowhere in the same ballpark
Joseph didn't start the religion at 14, that was when he was very thoughtful about religion and claimed the beginning of his heavenly visions. The Book of Mormon came when he was 23, and many other parts of the religion gradually came for the 15 years after that.
Guy on the right mischaracterizes Joseph's "trouble with the law". Look at every case and it was largely a matter of religious intolerance. The Mormons had an extermination order against them from the government of missouri, the federal government didn't defend them while acknowledging this injustice, and the governor of Illinois knowingly permitted Joseph to be put in a jail with too few guards that could be overrun by a mob and end in his death, which is what happened, he was not murdered for justified reasons. I'm sorry but painting the federal government as the innocent and purely fair party and Joseph as some rough lawless scoundrel is very ignorant of the historical context. Religious intolerance drove their persecution, and I don't think other religions would ever receive this same lazy mischaracterization
I think this whole, Brigham young had to move west to evade federal authorities. We don't characterize the pilgrims as a cult that had to leave England to avoid just law enforcement, they left cause of religious intolerance and so did the Mormons.
The Scientology comparisons to Mormonism being anywhere in the same ballpark shows a serious lack of anything more than a superficial understanding of Mormons.
Look up the essays "Are Christians Mormon?" That's shows how Christian orthodoxy has actually followed mormon theology on several major points now in the 21st century, so the cult label isn't fitting when non Mormon scholars recognize the impressive substance of Mormon theology and when mainstream Christianity now aligns with it on several points.
I like joe's concession at the end that most Mormons are really good people. The question must then be asked, can good fruit come from a bad tree? I get if people don't want to believe in the supernaturalism surrounding some of Joseph smiths claims, but there must be other admirable parts of the religion that is producing such good people and motivating people to be so Christlike. And for some reason ppl prefer to focus on the controversial rather than the mainstream
Michael's depiction of the LDS church was more accurate than the one taught in gospel doctrine classes.
cesletter.org/
Start there.
@@toyconnoisseur4948 lol people who get that flustered by the CES letter are people who don't know how to think for themselves. I've read it many times and am not bothered by it at all, there are a ton of flaws in it, and I know enough about Lds history and theology to know what's a valid attack and what's lazy. and most of it is the latter. I'm not saying gospel doctrine is be all end all, but you're ignoring volumes of scholarship on these subjects in the name of you didn't learn it in Sunday school. Grow up and teach yourself. Most people bothered by CES letter were people who never took their own learning upon themselves. So if its trust issue with the church cause of that fine I get that, but don't act like the CES letter is an impressive document, once you get out of your angsty teen phase you'll realize how irrelevant it was all along.
@Kenzie K Yea you don't seem like someone who has an open mind to discuss this topic, you seem waaaay to arrogant and overconfident about your positions. Also, your disbelief of 21st century converging with mormon theology positions shows your vast ignorance of the actual literature, which tells me that your "big brains" on this subject, really came from a few RUclips videos and a few websites. Talk to me when you've actually read the professional scholarly literature, and get off the amateur blogs. You've already shown me you're not interested in having a serious discussion, but just want to vent off your anger so you feel a bit better about whatever insecurities are bothering you.
@@louccideavon7116 The big hitter in the CES letter is the book of Abraham. I’m not sure why you would attack a paper that is helping people escape a cult… lol
Super well written comment. Sounds like the guy in the interview didn’t do his research. Annoying.
I was once Mormon can confirm it’s far fetched but also can confirm many of my best friends served missions and are amazing people!
Amazingly wicked and greedy.
Could be. Doesn't mean they didn't take people to hell.
It's so sad. These people can't enjoy their lives and instead go on these ridicolious missions.
There is some amazing people in the lds community, but let me tell you there are a few horrific people in that church and the titing isn't used for good they don't help no members at all
Tax exemption was instituted because the strong majority of churches were helping communities immensely.
No so they do not have to pay taxes on property or income LOL
the government dosnt care about welfare and certainly didn’t when churches got tax exempt status. they don’t pay taxes because of how much the us government is corrupted by religion
LDS hoards it's $.
The average church only gives 7 to 8 percent to charity- the rest goes to church infrastructure- church outreach- church services- buildings, land, schools, most goes directly back to church hierarchy!! Churches are the worse way to use your money if you want to give for charity/ most charitable organizations have 80 to 90 percent going directly to charity!! And churches don’t get rated like non profits do!! Non profit organizations are transparent don’t they can get a rating- churches are secretive- and many like tv evangelists are corrupt
My wife was bullied by Mormons growing up in utah, they are horrible people.
Generalizing
Their cult makes them nuts.
Being a Mormon, it’s like when folks accuse rogan of being in on a conspiracy or being controlled and he knows the truth about his own position but the opinions of others will remain. It’s all good, but I don’t talk jiujitsu technique because I’d sound foolish to anybody with more experience or practice than myself, vice versa....
You said it so it must be true 🙄
Jason YoMama my sympathies for your negative experiences... I’m sure you’ve found zero deception or imperfections in your continued attempts at fulfillment and a happy life elsewhere...
Jason YoMama What makes magic underwear not OK? What makes symbolism wrong? You know for a fact that I can show you countless number of happy successful men and women and happy marriages and with happy kids who are in happy marriages and so on and you can point to some Bad examples as well. So who cares? I could point to good and bad examples of all in any and every type of people individual or group. , you have a mind that is triggered by Someone else’s underwear and preferred spiritual symbols and rituals... I can assure you that you think about other peoples underwear a lot more than more mormons buddy... I wish you very sexy underwear fantasies
... Except you don't have to be a mormon to know Joseph Smith was a felon, a known fraud and a conman, who had dozens of wives, some dangerously young.
LMFAOO MORMONS ARE CULTISTS
I mean to be accurate, he was chased out of Palmyra, then chased out of Missouri, then killed in Illinois.
Because he was a fucking criminal. Among other "ungodly" things.
He was also chased out of Ohio, and left in the middle of the night, but not before torching the building that had all the records of his wrongdoing. Ohio is where he had the FAKE bank that was illegal; he created it after the state turned down his request to create a bank.
Palmyra?
as someone who grew up mormon i can attest to the fact that they are not “the nicest cult”....
All organized religion is a cult
@@starpaladin9532 No they aren’t. I suggest you check the BITE model to know what a cult is.
@@benjamingurevitch4097 The definition of a cult is literally a religion
not all cults are bad, just saying.
@@Abby-pd3rx it's bad when it forces people to live in a sense of false reality that if you join us you'll be happy. While the leaders reap all the benefits. Not everybody is so easy to submit. Nor like LIVING A LIE.
I used to be Mormon. There's some good stuff, but their secrecy, patriarchy, finances, policies with LGBTQ+, and their psychological power over people are very disturbing.
Thanks for leaving so we didn't have to throw you out.
@@johnlee1352 Obviously you have no belief in Jesus’ lost sheep parable. I thought Mormons were Christians.
@@fatheratum5033 I leave it to others to coddle the dross. I'm more of the guy with the rope doubled up driving the moneychangers from the temple...
@@johnlee1352 Except in this case , your the one protecting the money changers; given that the church has about $120 billion and uses only about 6% of the interest in that for charity while requiring the poor to tithe before buying food for their kids. Great work!
@@fatheratum5033 If you were LDS, thanks for leaving voluntarily. If you never were LDS, thanks for staying out. We don't need the weakness and confusion.
All religions have one thing in common. All of them started out as a cult.
Wait…where does the tithing go? How does it help poor people?
It doesn't even go to the members, it goes straight to the top which then gets funneled into real estate and other investment portfolios.
@@garys.2291 ok, this was my understanding as well
The LDS church has the largest humanitarian efforts and homeless and addict outreach programs in the world. That's where it goes. To say it goes to the top leaders is absolute bullshit. The very top leaders get an annual support (salary, if you will) of $120k, which is a drastic decrease in income from their lifelong professions.
@@garys.2291 yes, they funded that mask and now have no association with it. That's not really scandalous. Also, the funds the church holds has trustees just like any investment fund. None of the leadership personally owns land beyond their personal homes. You're making mountains out of molehills.
@@vermontmike9800
They spent $1 Billion on a shopping mall in Salt Lake City.
All churches should pay taxes ! Period !
Unless they give millions and millions to help those in need
@@sgaks9381 exactly. They actually put that money to good use rather than the waste that is the Federal Government.
Govts spend 45% of gdp now. Right. This world is full of morons who think bigger govt is the answer.
I'm an ex mormon. I just want to clarify that the FLDS practices pologamy but that is a small group compared to the LDS church which banned polagmy. The LDS church is the one knocking on peoples doors and handing out book of mormons and all of that. With all that theres a reason I left. Many reasons actually
When we moved to Utah in the 90s. We were welcomed by half the neighborhood, once they found out that we weren't Mormon and we didn't go to church. None of the kids were allowed to play with us and basically we were ignored from there on out. They like to keep to their own. Oh and trust me they'll act like you don't exist.
Not all of us are like that. But I believe you 100% because I grew up with these idiots. They focus on the wrong part of Christianity often because some of them are so frightened.
They only tolerate non members to the extent that they hope to convert them one day. When it's clear you are not interested, you are automatically shunned.
@@garys.2291 You hit the nail on the head
Sounds like a dream honestly. I wish all of my neighbors acted like I didn't exist
@@LilView
You want to live around neighbors that secretly hate you?
Interesting conversation, but as an active Latter-day Saint it pains me how little they know about my religion and it's founding and yet think they are authorities on the subject. His explanation of Joseph Smith's polygamy and his justifications for it is pure conjecture. He also fails to distinguish between The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints and other polygamist groups.
Agree or disagree, you guys buy into the word of a charlatan and I’m ashamed to live in Utah because of y’all.
Christians and the LDS church speak the same language but mean totally different things. Father God was never a man, let alone a man who had his own planet. Jesus wasn't a spirit child originally. He has present since the beginning of time. He came to earth 2,000 years ago but has been around a lot longer. That is a small sample of why no Christian religion considers the LDS church as christian. But the members are really nice!
For sure. Be sure to let that fuel your delusions.
The reorganized church practices polygamy, not lds
@Snow Angel nothing I said was wrong though lol, we used to practice polygamy, and we no longer do
the lds church still practices polygamy. Although you cannot be married to more that 1 wife at a time, you can be sealed to multiple women.
No, the reorganized LDS church always rejected polygamy and denied that J Smith practiced it. the FLDS church and its offshoots are the polygamists. So many LDS branches it can get confusing ...
@@harrisonwintergreen1147 that's who I meant flds
Will iam Lmaoo what
I have been a Mormon for 35+ years now and it is absolutely wonderful. It's true that I've been offended by individual members plenty of times (just like anywhere), but I have certainly found peace and felt God's love in the church, especially when I'm doing service and helping others
If you ever wonder why Mormons are so nice it's because we're taught (through Jesus' teachings) that we will find Joy through service
Mormons are actually "The Church of Jesus Christ"
Absolutely everything is Central to Jesus Christ
Why are people offended by existence of religion? It exists, so what? Noone's forcing you to preach.
Because they interfere in all aspects of life based on 0 scientific evidence proclaiming that their imaginary friend is the real deal, the other 3000 imaginary friends aren't and so what they say is important. Look at abortion or euthanasia or stem cell research, all the nutters with their imaginary friends sticking their nose in everyone's business. No one would care if the lunatics would keep their insane ranting to themselves.
@@AusExplorer Adhominim attack that is intellectually disingenuous.
Because it's a fallacy. But it's good exists so that people can know someday that it's false.
Netflix, why Mormons should smoke pot: “You guys, what if Joseph Smith made it all up?!” 😂
Crux161 Jesus is made up
I think you're thinking of mushrooms
Jesus is real
@@binguscat2514 and Quadalupe is your mother! lol
He was probably on dmt😁
Joe should get Jon Krakauer on the podcast!!!
Krakauer too respected
I was raised Mormon in the Midwest which is about 85% less weird than In Utah. It's definitely a cult. After I left the church I attended other churches and went to university to major in Religious Studies. Was amazed to realize religions in general start out as a cult with a charismatic leader and a group of well meaning but gullible followers. Most of then fizzle out within the first generation. The ones that survive do so by gradually altering their doctrine until it becomes a set of manageable and socially acceptable beliefs. Mormonism and Scientology are both in the early stages of that process. They have evolved quite a lot already, and will continue to do so.
The Mormons I've known in my life have been good, upstanding, kindhearted people, just as in other religions.
Like Catholics and Protestants just how much of the church doctrine they believe varies from one person to another.
In all the Jesus centered denominations some members don't believe much of it at all, but they like the social connection of belonging to their church and raising their families among good willed and supportive people.
Personally I'm much happier studying religions and the people who practice religion than I am actually trying to conform to a religion.
People apparently need something to believe in. Some. Choose religion, some choose political ideals, some choose 'science' or art or sex or drugs or doing battle with an enemy.
We're curious creatures to say the least.
PS- the secret to the long survival of Christianity is that Rome adopted the Jesus movement and restructured it into a state religion to keep all their rowdy illiterate peasants on the same page so to speak. In order to make their plan of world domination more achievable it was practical to not have people worshipping fifty or sixty different gods. If you have only one god, and your emperor is best buddies with that god, it makes perfect sense to do what the emperor wants.
The more educated people become, the more likely they are to leave religion altogether.
The connectivity of the internet and the ease of studying history has people leaving churches like rats leaviing a sinking ship.
Its an internesting time to be alive.
Its always been easy to study history with things called books, but in today's world it's harder than every to discern fact from fiction, and AI gonna accelerate that problem.
You are wrong. The money from tithing does not go to helping poor people. It goes to building the church.
and went to paying for that mall, even though the Church promised it wouldnt multiple times.
@@kenziek6707So the alternative is to just give money to poor people? Don’t you think it would make more sense to build up an economy in a way that actually helps people for life? You know how many jobs that mall created? How many more people have sustainable income now because of this?
@@johnsonchase The church lied about where the money was going is the point. The lds church was made to pay millions of dollars in fines for lying to them. The SEC published a list of the real investment the LDS church currently has there are several things on it the LDS church preaches against. Like Alcohol, why is it alcohol is so bad and yet you can even buy at the LDS mall, to say nothing of the hotels the LDS church invested in that sell it and even a bar, "Dave and Busters Entertainment", is primarily a bar. I guess its only "bad" if the "lord" doesn't make money off it.
The LDS church isn't at all interested in supporting people its interested in making money, that's all. How else do you explain things like the LDS church has over 100 Billion dollars (which it also tried lying about when it claimed "the majority funds go to funding temples and humanitarian projects" yet got rid of its paid custodial staff to clean up temples and instead have families volunteer to do it?
The LDS church has been caught int he flat out blatant lie that it somehow gives a "billion in humanitarian projects". It first tried that claim a few years ago, but the fine print was it was its TOTAL amount since the since the 80s until then. The church still tries to claim that, even though it never once appeared on the top 400 charities of the us. Funny how little tiny willow creek church by itself gives more to charity than the LDS empire with its billions of dollars. And willow creek church doesn't have any Hawaiian resorts, over 2 billion dollars invested in big pharma, investments in hotels, Amazon (which also sells many things the lds church preaches against). I guess this shows either the leaders of the church know what they say is all a lie or its only "bad" if the "lord" isn't making off things h3es against. Either way the LDS church is horrible, lies all the time and I am so glad I left it.
@@johnsonchasereally? You are actually trying to defend the fact that tithing funds were used (despite EXPLICIT promises by GBH) to build a billion dollar for-profit mall? Let’s us not forget the only other time (literally!) funds from the EPA were used was to bail out a for-profit insurance company. Highly unethical and I imagine the IRS whistle blower case will deem the actions illegal too.
@@kenziek6707 A return so low 'you wouldnt have made it yourself' - everyone knows malls are terrible investments in the last 20 years, so why do it? hmmmmmmmmm, too deep for internet users to figure out, but I can tell you it has to do with missionary work and donut effects.
Hate to burst his bubble. The money does not go to good causes to help poor people. It is the worlds richest church and only about .5 percent helps people. The rest of the money is in an account. Perhaps it. Is there to accrue interest and now there is research exposing hidden money.
Financial stewardship is such an evil idea today.
@ Only give .5 percent to the poor is theft from God not financial stewardship. Gotta love passive aggressive Mormons.
"they're really nice people and are good to each other"
until you hear the women talk about the drama and the other women and cliques and slights in primary and young women and relief society. You'd think the only true church would be some level of different from the rest of the world. But no.
This! Because I've never met pettier people then the ones who claim that they're oh so holy. And their teachings on obedience are nothing short of authoritarianism.
In the LDS church we are taught charity. Some members are really slow students. Fortunately, God has charity, and patience.
And the priesthood’s general lack of energy and enthusiasm outside of camping😂
@@austinellsworth9641 ha!
@@austinellsworth9641 definitely.
I was born and raised in the Mormon church and I still am in it. In my experience, I find everyone to be friendly, and I have not seen anything toxic about it. Even if it isn’t true, it still preaches the bible. Additionally, it has given me direction in my life in the sense that it keeps me away from harmful things, like drugs, alcohol, etc. I find the main reason people don’t accept it is because they don’t want to think of a world without alcohol especially. But being sober my whole life has really helped me be non reliant on things and helped me navigate good vs evil. So whatever other people want to say about it is their opinion, but it has brought good values to my family and myself. I find a lot of other churches will preach god on one day of the week but the other 6 they go drinking and doing things created by the devil so I just haven’t really felt like it’s right to praise god but walk your own path in life. People also mention corrupt leaders but the leader of the church is not a rich man and not one word that’s come out of its mouth has ever been questionable to me. I just don’t see what makes it more of a cult compared to other religions when it holds values such as these.
Grew up in utah and was raised in the church. I left the church when I was 18. Nicest people, but OH BOY are they judgemental.
Thanks for leaving on your own so we didn't have to throw you out.
Judging a group as judgmental.....irony bomb
Wow...you know 16 million people well enough to judge them all? What a guy!...idiot
Wow, way to be an example. How christ like of you.
@@mcanders19 Oh...NOW you're concerned for the standards of the church? Judged 16 million people unrighteously and now you're playing the victim...a millennial no doubt.
I grew up Mormon. I think they're kind people, however generally not nice. Extraordinarily judgmental as well and generally unaccepting. This is having grown up on the east coast in the church and also living utah as an adult as an ex Mormon.
You may be surprised how much of the food pantries are actually filled by the Mormon or LDS church here in Utah or an Idaho or in California or Nevada. On top of teaching people to farm arranging for running water and small villages Distributing clothes to third world countries and two natural disaster areas and a number of actual relief efforts such as those that Community also teaches literacy to the poor trades to people who normally wouldn't have a future otherwise and creates educational opportunities, helps people in everything from addiction recovery to abuse recovery to people who want to go through their program for genital identity issues. They hit help women who are in trouble with pregnancies another issues worldwide and their youth is constantly involved in service activities with their leadership. They've helped build auditing programs and systems for organizations to make sure that they are not wasting money or having recourse stolen from them.
Yeah definitely a cult 😂
@MoseleySquad13
By definition, all Christianity is a cult. It isn't an insult if you believe Mary was mortal.
@@MoseleySquad13just cuz you don’t want the money that’s used for helping communities stolen isn’t a cult lmao
In reality the church hoards $$$$money$$$$ and does very little to actually help people. In ONE investment account alone the church has more than $ONE BILLION DOLLARS. Yes, that's Billion with a "B." And they continue to hoard the money while not helping when there is so much need. You really should investigate who is actually on the front lines doing good, because it most definitely is not the Mormon church.
I am a member of the LDS church . .aka Mormon. . And I love the Joe Rogan Podcast and all the guests! It is a great way to learn 👍
This isn't the main Mormon church (The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints) being discussed at the beginning. Michael then brings up the founder of the main Church, Joseph Smith. Michael then claimed that Joseph Smith was having sexual relations outside of his original marriage with Emma Smith. So far there has been no DNA evidence linking Joseph Smith to any children outside of his marriage with Emma Smith. Ugo A Perego a geneticist has a website dedicated to finding evidence of "other" children.
www.josephsmithdna.com/about-me.html
Although many early members of the church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints practiced polygamy, It wasn't for the mere reason of lust. I often hear Joe Rogan bring up the church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints as a 'cult' example, But I often feel he misses the point of it's positive teachings and doctrine contained within the book of Mormon. For example,
Mosiah 2: 17 And behold, I tell you these things that ye may learn wisdom; that ye may learn that when ye are in the service of your fellow beings ye are only in the service of your God.
Even if the Book of Mormon is true or false, It has undeniable positive teachings. I'd suggest anyone to read the book, Then make up their own mind.
Chris, What are your thoughts on the CES Letter cesletter.org/
Tyler Coop
The author of the CES letter was a very dedicated Mormon at one point in his life. It seemed to me that for a long time he was never aware of the various issues and criticisms of the historicity and divine authenticity of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints. And when he eventually went online I believe he was genuinely shocked at what he found. So he created this letter which is more a compilation of the most popular criticisms of Mormonism. As far as I'm aware the apologetic group Fair Mormon have been replying to the CES letter.
www.fairmormon.org/blog/2016/05/23/ces-letter-closer-look
Also this Blog has been responding,
tarikdlacour.blogspot.co.uk/2017/02/answering-letter-to-ces-director-1.html?m=1
Speaking personally I read the CES letter and I found it tedious. I've been aware of many of the criticisms of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints ever since I was a young teenager. Even at one point I played the part of the 'Mormon apologist'. I've came to the conclusion at this point that people could debate for many years of these various issues. I'm trying to remain as neutral as I can sometimes I see things the Church does that I completely disagree with, Sometimes I hear a critical point of view and I can see it's a straight lie.
Chris Shearer , why did Joseph Smith marry other women?
That warm and friendly vibe Mormons have is an act. They’re very nice to outsiders to their face but a lot are two faced. They are so kind and nice with a great sense of community until you are one of them and start questioning your beliefs. They’ll slowly turn away from you and once you decide that the religion isn’t accurate they will shun you all together. Or at least that’s what happened to me and everyone I knew that used to be a member. But I’m sure it’s not everyone that will do that and most will say it doesn’t happen at all.
Totally 💯 Same thing happened to me. They’re nice as long as they think they can convert you or that you are a true believer. If you are a critic, they will shun you.
Im sure even a girlfriend will be nice if you’re devoted to her but be mean if you leave her.
Where do you live? I'm mormon (before I start I want to say I respect your opinion and hope you respect mine) and my whole life, they have been very kind to me and my family. The only time I've seen what your saying is teenage girls and boys. They break every rule but put on a face. The reason they do this is because they are afraid to leave. It is kind of scary now that I think about it... wait, is it a cult?!
While I’m not denying the existence of the problem you’ve mentioned, having known several “ex-mormons” I wonder if there might be another factor that makes it feel like they’ve suddenly turned their backs on you. Could it be that after you decided that the religion isn’t real you became very critical of huge swathes of church practices, beliefs, etc. which constitute a huge amount of those people’s lives? Put differently, it might have been that they felt you were attacking their lifestyle unjustly and were put off by that. I know that the first thing most ex-mormons I’ve known do is spout off about how miserable the church’s practices are and how stupid their beliefs are, etc. and I can see how that causes people to “shun you.” Again, I’m not saying that what happened in your case isn’t legitimate or that this kind of thing doesn’t happen, but I don’t think most ex-Mormons are very fair on this subject
@@elicindrich3282 I can see your point and I’m sure that is a case with a lot of ex Mormons. I can’t speak for everyone but with me personally, I didn’t openly criticize anyone I knew or the church until after I was cast out. I believe that anyone has the right to believe what they choose as long as it doesn’t cause harm to others. At the risk of sounding hypocritical, my issue is when those beliefs influence the holders to treat others as less than equals. To clarify, I’m not in any way saying that all Mormons shun those that leave and in fact I still have friends that are Mormon that know my story. We don’t judge each other and have had healthy discussions about our beliefs. I’m human and not perfect so I’m sure I have been guilty of similar actions that I experienced. When I do realize that I’m doing the same thing I try to correct myself. Yet my emotions do get the best of me when talking about my experience with this subject and I do sometimes generalize which I realize isn’t fair to everyone that is a member of that church.
Ex member here. Yes, it is.
I was at least somewhat christian until i moved to a town with a lot of mormons and now I just don't feel comfortable with that stuff anymore. the not cursing, Not being able to hangout Sundays, no sleepovers, etc. it started to piss me off
Not to mention their irrational hatred of tea and coffee.
@@johnb5254 Yeah because they do drink soft drinks which have caffeine. There's no reason for that shit, it makes no sense.
I also dislike that they can't watch Rated R movies. The list goes on and it's almost like they're not allowed to be human
@@musliboy2430
I tell them Coffee is much healthier than a Coke but they can't understand. Haha.
@@musliboy2430 Cant have sex with mules either (legal and acceptable in some countries today)
@@johnb5254 Caffeine is a drug to which many are addicted. You are dumb if you drink it, member or otherwise.
It absolutely is a cult.
Joe loooveeesss talking about those frontal lobes of the brain
He thinks it makes him sound smart.
Don’t know if this is correct but I heard at one point he started to smoke a joint before each interview too. Sometimes I think he just likes to talk about whatever and sometimes doesn’t really care about the topic. Like some things are just throwaway topics for him idk lol
Can you imagine if Joe Rogan was licking your earlobe?
Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them
Facts, mormonism is a cult, true Christianity is by the Bible, the 66 nooks we have now is all we need
@@warriorofgod1412
A cult is a system of religious veneration and devotion directed toward a particular figure or object.
If Christ is your "particular figure" i hope you are in a cult too.
Mormons are bad fruits, correct.
@@jasonbowers130 ah yes but Joseph Smith was a false prophet
Whatever happens you guys, don't take the covid19 vaccine
It’s not just the Evangelicals that consider them a cult; Catholics do, too. If an ex-Mormon converts to Catholicism, they have to be re-baptized because they reject the Trinitarian form of God. (The Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit are One God in three persons; the ones who follow Jesus but reject this formula are considered to be a cult by the Church.)
You mentioned that he was 14 when he started to translate the Book of Mormon, he was also extremely uneducated at the time, if he did make it up (because 14 year olds do lie) how would he have been able to write an entire book, in complex language even for his time without any grammatical errors? No 14 year old kid I know could make something like the Book of Mormon up especially not an uneducated one.
Education was much more important to a lot of people back then. 14 year olds today eat tide pods, back then they helped raise their families
Lucas Russo doesn’t change the fact that Joseph smith was uneducated so he would’ve been unable to come up with and write himself. todays youth are generally more educated than the adults back then, illiteracy wasn’t an uncommon thing for adults, because it wasn’t a priority in their lives, like you said 14 year olds had to help raise a family, there wasn’t enough time to go to school and read and write when you’re trying to put food on the table for several people in your family. Joseph smith did become educated later and life but that wasn’t until long after the church was restored. If you look at the language used in the Book of Mormon, it’s *old* it was very old even in Joseph Smiths time. Which would make it a thousand times harder to come up with yourself, as an uneducated 14 year old at the time.
Boston _ it wouldn’t be too hard to come up with if you’re changing the words of already existing scripture to better suit your idea. Multiple evidences that the KJV bible was changed just slightly in several instances to become the BoM
Lucas Russo you couldn’t just slightly change the Bible to get the Book of Mormon. That claim is insane. Look at the stories in the Book of Mormon, consistent with the Bible, yet different.
Boston _ take a look at the CES letters direct comparisons, it’ll make more sense what I’m saying.
I live in Boise and in my neighborhood we have a hardcore fundamentalist Mormon family, you know the kind where the women wear homemade dresses that go down to the ankles and the men wear plain buttoned down shirts and off brand blue jeans that never quite fit right, the teenage son comes over to my house from time to time looking for work, every once in a while I’ll have him clear brush and give him a few bucks, one day while he was working I asked him if he wanted some water and started asking him about himself, he’s about 16, never been to school, doesn’t own a tv, supposedly a master furniture maker, and his last name is Jeffs. Right then my ears perked up and I said “oh yeah, like part of the Warren Jeffs family”? And he looked at me like how could this heathen possibly know Warren? Then I said “I watch the news” and he immediately clammed up and I couldn’t get anymore out of him. I don’t know where he falls in the family lineage (there’s 100’s of em) but I suspect that family managed to “break off” from the rest of the cult and are now living in a quiet neighborhood in Boise, he hasn’t been back since, kinda a weird kid
Those...are not Mormons bro.
Radical Vlogs don’t defend them man, “those” are Mormons just more on the fundamentalist side than you might like
@@isitwindy21 I dont think so but I could be wrong.
Yeah, those are FLDS, not LDS
@@RealHorhay actually flds actually follow the religion as it was originally written. They are all cut from the same religion with flds actually being more true to its origins. Read more about it if you are interested.
I don’t know if I’d say NO religious institutions should get tax exceptions; the Catholic Church is the largest private provider of education and runs the most soup kitchens (privately) in the US. Many Protestant, Muslim, Hindu, and Buddhist groups do valuable secular outreach in their communities as well. Call me crazy but I don’t want one, central, politicized entity controlling all food and social service for the needy through the Federal government with taxes; they are the most inefficient group I’ve seen in my life time that is allowed to continue existing.
I can understand that. Problem is the LDS Church has amassed in just ONE investment account alone $100 BILLION DOLLARS. Yes, that's BILLION with a "B." They do very little good, and use only a tiny percentage of their wealth for charity, and usually only when they can get good press attention in return. A church that wealthy can afford to contribute something to the country that made it so wealthy. As it stands they pay NOTHING toward the upkeep of all the infrastructure they benefit from -- roads, water systems, sewer systems, electricity infrastructure, etc. They should at the very least participate in covering costs and they should pay property tax on their vast holdings. The Catholic Church does contribute much more than the LDS Church does.
@@Decision_Justice Wait, so the govt steals people money, spends 45% of GDP (state, local, and federal); then a church with voluntary membership is fiscally responsible running a surplus, and you don't like it? not to mention you have no clue of their actual spending?
Besides, seems few can do basic math.
$50B (amount they have today) divided by 15M members = $3,500 per member
Govt debt: $200k per person.
This civilization we are living is is clearly going to fail at this rate, and not because of churches.
Fundamentalists will never be Mormon.
Instead of getting commentary on Mormonism from people who have no clue, why don't you interview someone who can actually speak from a position of authority? I've heard you interview a few people who have made comments on Mormonism that are completely wrong. Having these guys comment on Mormonism is like asking Bill Burr to comment on astrophysics because he heard Neil DeGrasse Tyson speak one time.
michael shermer at least seems to know what he’s talking about but there are obviously better podcasts made by historians
Yes, it is a cult, and Joseph Smith was brilliant. He created a religious text called the Book of Mormon and based an entire religion on that book. Where are the golden plates...? God "took them" away to test the people. Wow. How convenient.
Mormons are not that friendly to people who leave the church. (At least in my experience).
Read "Letter to My Wife", or "CES Letters" to find out for yourself the truth of the LDS faith.
So contrary opinions and poorly sourced articles rehashed from old anti books is truth? Well, read books on why America is the most corrupt nation on earth while you are at it, or why the first moon landings were actually faked.
Besides, the gold plates are right next to the ark, Moses miraculous staff, the bronze snake, Aarons rod, Moses' Urim and Thummim, Jesus cross/garments/etc.., the Garden of Eden.... oh wait, they were all conveniently lost I forgot.
It's weird Scientology and Mormonism is always mentioned together It's scary.
It’s because there both cults and make no fucking sense lol
Rogan mentions Scientology always with religion to establish his belief
Colorado city is on the border of Arizona and Utah.
And whats interesting that is FLDS but LDS Mormons in the Arizona Legislature stood in the way to having the Colorado city Police Department disbanded. Probably because everything warren Jeffs did Joseph Smith did. I hear it is better there now, but I still wonder why any non Mormon would live there.
My older brother converted to Mormonism about 5 years ago and he’s turned into the most annoying person I’ve ever met. When he caught me smoking weed (when I was 20, living on my own), he called my mom and told on me. I was 20, and he was 25 when that happened. The fuck bruh.
I am not religious but Mormons look happy 😁
They're not trust me. Fakest people on the planet
On the surface they look nice but once you get deeper, things get dark.
Like a David Lynch movie, like Blue Velvet, Twin Peaks...
lol Rogan studying cults before he join maga cult 😂❤ this made my day, good luck Joe , hopefully you will be honest with yourself one of these days .
Thinking the US was better off under trump than it is now hardly means he joined a cult. You dont even appear to know what a, "cult" is any more than you know what a complete sentience is.
8:35 no any real Christian will consider them a cult. They Believe in Jesus but they don’t believe in the same Jesus.
Just not true at all. Just have more text about Jesus. Not a different Jesus, we read the King James Bible
Quattro Bajeena my Jesus is the Son of God who came to earth. He was born in Bethlehem. He walked amongst the jews and taught his father’s word. He suffered in the garden of gethsemane for the sins of the world. He was spit on, beaten, whipped, mocked, falsely accused, betrayed, and nailed to a cross to die on calvary. He was placed in a tomb and had the entrance sealed. Three days later he was gone. He had risen and was resurrected.
If you and I believe in a different Jesus, then you clearly believe in the wrong one.
@@RusskiShpion4199 Said the Jews of Jesus too when discussing the Messiah.
@ no because they don’t believe the messiah has come yet so that’s a completely different line of thought
@@RusskiShpion4199 semantics. They were expecting someone that did not match what they believed their literature said about who was going to come.
Yes also there is a lot of immorality in cults
Great video. He was really mistaken when he assumed the majority of the Mormon church's money goes to help people, though.
Yeah I looked it up and it might only be like 3% (1 billion out of 32 billion?... But a google search isn't always reliable).
Did you audit it?
Interesting - they don't quote 2Peter but appear to understand what Peter said in his second epistle - false religion and cults frequently go hand in hand with sexual immorality and greed. And in the case of Joseph Smith - all those plus general iniquity.
You're so wrong, it's not even funny
@@DannyAGray Ever notice that people trapped in a cult never say, "Hey everyone - I'm in a cult over here!!" Only when they are set free do they realize it. There's a reason that if you Google, "Set free from Mormonism" you get 2.2 million hits.
@@deancamp4914 I am a social scientist. It is not a cult, but you are clearly ignorant on the topic of cults, which is not an insult, just a description that ignorance we all have in various areas.
@ I have a doctorate in apologetics. I am well acquainted with cults. Of course no one ever describes themselves as a cult. As far as Christianity is concerned, a religious cult may be defined as, “any group that deviates from the orthodox teachings of the historic Christian faith being derived from the Bible and confirmed through the ancient ecumenical creeds.” Mormonism, by that definition, is certainly a cult.
Read the story below of the man whose son was kidnapped by the Mormon “church”. Standard cult tactics.
I drove thru Colorado City a few years ago on my way to the Grand Canyon. It was very surreal. All the homes were partly finished and I saw no one except for a pickup truck with a bunch of kids in pioneer clothes in the back.
That was most likely then re - enacting the story of how Brigham young marched to Utah , it’s called “ trek” where teens and the leaders wear pioneer clothing and walk for days
@@emilywilson696 If only that's what they were doing.
I was listening to a podcast today about why their homes are unfinished. It has something to do with tax statuses.
@@seppyq3672 This is a worldwide thing. Big in Greece. You leave an upper floor unfinished and therefore it's not technically 100% a "dwelling". Very clever thing. Not all countries tolerate this, here in the UK they don't.
They are still a cult. I used to be mormon and I found a lot of things that don’t match with the word of God. Good works does not give you salvation. Good works come later. It’s God’s way how to teach you to be a good person. That’s part of the process to clean you. Accepting Jesus Christ is the only way to the Father. Romans 3:20 20Therefore no one will be declared righteous in God's sight by the works of the law; rather, through the law we become conscious of our sin.
Cleanup Efforts Underway in Asia Following Typhoon Mangkhut
The typhoon, known as Typhoon Ompong in the Philippines, packed destructive winds and torrential rain as it cut across northern Luzon. Dozens of people lost their lives after heavy rains triggered landslides. Ninety-six Latter-day Saint chapels in the affected areas of the Philippines sheltered more than 4,000 members and friends of the Church during the typhoon where they received food and water.
LDS Charities, the humanitarian arm of the Church, is coordinating relief efforts alongside Church volunteers who are repacking suppplies and distributing 7,000 food kits in the affected Philippine provinces.
In Hong Kong, members and more than 100 missionaries from The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints have been working to help clean debris in the community. High wind smashed windows in the city, tearing off parts of buildings and roofs, while the storm surge flooded hotels and restaurants. Eight meetinghouses received minor flooding along with landscape damage. The Hong Kong China Temple received minor landscape damage but has reopened. Miraculously no lives were lost though a few hundred were injured and some were displaced. . .
www.mormonnewsroom.org/article/cleanup-efforts-underway-asia-following-typhoon-mangkhut
cdowis ITS A CULT DO YOUR HOMEWORK YOU FUCKING WEIRDO!!
He is selling LDS Cult and paid by them!
cesletter.org/
What does their humanitarian efforts have to do with their doctrine being true or not? Both people on this podcast stated they thought Mormons were nice people. So i'm not sure what point you think you're making.
@Will iam My only point towards the OP is that Mormons could be the nicest people or contribute the most in humanitarian efforts and that wouldn't in any way lend itself as evidence the religion itself is True. Which is why I'm confused on the point the OP is making.
mormon and i can tell you most of the money does not go to helping anyone but the organizational church itself.
True. They launder their $ into real estate.
David koresh was no different than joseph smith and brigham young. the branch dividian and mormonism are no different.
thank you for your expert opinion. im sure you fully researched these individuals before you came to this conclusion.
@@Frogman1943 any time! 👌
I never trusted aliens to tell me the truth. Duh
I was raised Mormon and was actually reading the Book of Mormon and had somewhat of a belief in the church all the way up until 8 months ago when I had a near death experience. You would think that would push me closer to god but it did the opposite I woke up from a coma and had to repent for all my sins to my bishop which were things like having sex, drinking beer and smoking weed. The reason it pushed me away is because everyone was saying things like “ we’re asking everyone in the ward to pray for you”and “we’re fasting for you” they believed that through fasting and prayer my life was saved and I was like uhh no the doctors and surgeons saved my life my family is still super Mormon so no hate to Mormons they’re really nice people I just am not that gullible to believe in that comical religion
Go a step further. Doctors and surgeons didn’t save your life, it was the natural self healing operations of the body merely aided by doctors that saved it. Doctors don’t heal bodies, they only help bodies to heal themselves. Go another step further. Your life wasn’t saved, your death was postponed. Memento Mori
@@skootempaw694 I think you meant to say “pray” and not “prey.” At any rate, I don’t think the RUclips comment section is a good place to proselytize. As a platform for religious discourse, it’s worse than pamphlets.
@@skootempaw694 ok.. I pray too... I also live in Salt Lake City, and have lots of lovely Mormon coworkers where I work building furniture for the temples. I don’t have anything against Mormons, I just don’t think proselytizing in RUclips comments works.
@@skootempaw694 sure. No hate. I was just advocating for the “right time and place.”
@@elijahbachrach6579 Then don't hang about in utube comment sections. Problem solved. It's an "Occum's Razor" function of cognition whence making choices. Google it for clarity.
My best friend was a Mormon, idk, never really asked him about it. But down the line 8 years of being my bro, he stole from me, and lowkey gets at all my exes. Cut him off since.
Untrustworthy and MANIPULATE! MANIPULATE like the DEVIL!
I mean that doesn't have anything to do with his religion he's just a bad guy.
Mormonism literally encourages bad behavior.
@@jeffs4483 what? How?
@@Redrexdex
Cult behavior.
Not trying to convert anyone, but either Joseph Smith as a young boy had a time machine or other means of knowing all the nuts and bolts of the peoples in the Americas and their traditions both in their culture and as a society or he was truly given the golden plates which he then translated to give us various testimonies of Prophets and their testimony of Jesus Christ which can be found in the Book of Mormon. Read it and you will see the plethora of information that can be found there, which not even scholars in the early 1820's knew about existed let alone a young boy.
Too bad the Rosetta Stone proved Joseph Smith a liar.
An anachronism is defined as an event that appears out of time. An example would be a reference to an event that had not yet occurred, or mention of objects or materials which did not yet exist. A well-known instance is the reference to a clock in Shakespeare's "Julius Caesar". Of course there were no clocks in Caesar's time, either Shakespeare didn't care about the inaccuracy or possibly he just wasn't aware there were no clocks during that time period. Joseph Smith claimed that the Book of Mormon, published in 1830, had been translated from golden plates that contained the accounts of the ancient inhabitants of the American continent. When studying the Book of Mormon one must question why are there Greek names and words such as Jonas, Lachoneus, Timothy, and Alpha & Omega found in a book that should have absolutely no Greek influence? 776 BC to 323 BC. Anyone familiar with Old Testament history will know that Alexander the Great's conquests of biblical lands in 332 BC came many centuries AFTER Lehi's supposed departure for the Americas. According to I Nephi 1:4, Nephi and his family left Jerusalem in the first year of the reign of King Zedekiah which was 597 BC. The Book of Mormon mention "bellows" in 1 Nephi 17:11, "brass" 2 Nephi 5:15, "breast plates and copper" in Mosiah" 8:10, "gold and silver currency" Alma 11, "silver" Jarom 1:8, and "steel swords" Ether 7:9? None these items existed during Book of Mormon times which are from 600 BC to AD 421. In fact, metallurgy did not appear until the 800s AD. Why does the Book of Mormon many times mention "cattle," "cows," and "calves," "bulls," "asses," "horses," "oxen," "domestic sheep," "pigs" and even "elephants," when none of these animals existed in America during Book of Mormon times?
The only domesticated animals in pre-Columbian America were llamas, alpacas, guinea pigs, and turkeys which interestingly these animals are never even mentioned not once in The Book of Mormon. Another anachronism occurs in Ether 2:23: "What will ye that I should do that ye may have light in your vessels?" "For behold, ye cannot have windows, for they will be dashed in pieces;" The mention of windows that could be "dashed in pieces" in Ether 2:23 is another anachronistic, since glass windows were not invented until the late Middle Ages.
Ethan Smith's book (no relation to Joseph) "View of the Hebrews," was published seven years before the Book of Mormon and is thought to be source material for Joseph Smith's Book of Mormon. LDS Historian and apostle Brigham Henry Roberts (B. H. Roberts) conducted an exhaustive comparison and analysis of these two books and concluded there is merit to this criticism. Contrary to popular belief, the Book of Mormon was not the first to suggest that Jews are the ancestral origins of American Indians. Joseph Smith had access to these early works:
"It is altogether probable that these two books-"Priest's Wonders of Nature and Providence," 1824; and Ethan Smith's "View of the Hebrews" 1st edition 1823, and the 2nd edition 1825-were either possessed by Joseph Smith or certainly known by him, for they were surely available to him." B.H. Roberts - Mormon Seventy and LDS church historian "Studies of the Book of Mormon," p.153
We know that Joseph Smith was familiar with "View of the Hebrews" as he quoted page 220 from it:
"If such may have been the fact, that a part of the Ten Tribes came over to America, in the way we have supposed, leaving the cold regions of Assareth behind them in quest of a milder climate, it would be natural to look for tokens of the presence of Jews of some sort, along countries adjacent to the Atlantic. In order to this, we shall here make an extract from an able work: written exclusively on the subject of the Ten Tribes having come from Asia by the way of Bherings Strait." -Smith's view of the Hebrews. Pg. 220.
Joseph Smith - founder of the Mormon religion
And there are many more anachronims in The Book of Mormon, in addition to those grace mentioned above. Such as "steel," chariots, and preparing the horses and chariots of the King. No domesticated horses. No domesticated sheep. No coins. The wheel wasn't even used. The Book of Mormon quotes parts of Isaiah that had not been written at the time the Mormon Church claims for the prophet reciting it in the book. And the printing errors of Joseph Smith's particular KJV version of the Bible that he had are copied into the Book of Mormon. And that we are told by the Church, is the most correct book.
Please read the CES Letter before you spend your entire life being fooled. The weight of the evidence against the Mormon Church is very, very heavy. And the Mormon Church has to have entire sites dedicated to trying to convince its members not to look at the evidence, and trying to get them to avert their eyes and not examine it. No other church has to do that.
@@gracethatchanges Ummmm, there are dozens if not hundreds of books that talk bout hebrews being ancestors of some of native Americans, ranging from holland in 1400s to Spanish chronicalers, and every century after.
Joseph Smith may have rendered certain names into their closest English equivalents, similar to how biblical names were rendered in English translations of the Bible.
For example, names like Isaiah and Jeremiah in the Bible have been transliterated from Hebrew, but their English forms reflect Greek and Latin influence.
"Timothy" might represent a Hebrew or Nephite name that Joseph Smith translated into a familiar biblical-sounding name.
What is more interesting is that all names int the early BoM are old Hebrew. Dont forget the French in there too, like "adieu"
I think you are better off to pick one argument, not machine gun your issues.
I'm a born, lived and will die a member of the LDS church.
It always worked for me.
Still does!
Your good with the fact that JS banged kids and was a known fraud then? Odd
It works for you because you don't need the truth.
Enjoy becoming your own God on your own planet:) Gotta work your way up in the Cult, right?
@@domplumridge488 js you mean Joseph smith or am I wrong?
Hey Joe. Mormons that you know that are Olympic Wrestlers and MMA Fighters include Mark Shultz, Cael Sanderson, Rulon Gardner, and also Mark Hunt- who used to have an LDS symbol on his fighting trunks,- but I do believe that Mark Hunt isn't a practicing Mormon at this time in his life. Just some trivia.
That’s not how you spell Mark Schultz’s name you boner.
HeroSquad1millionA.D. Thanks I will try and do better at re-checking my spelling. What other skills do you havr besides trolling for RUclips spelling errors, staring at your balls all day and wondering why nobody responds to your friend requests on Facebook.
Joseph Smith was a wrestling state champ if I recall correctly
Some trivia, nobody gives a F
And Mark Shultz is out and glad of it!!!
Seriously?!
Yes ..lots of nice people
But you really don't know enough about the doctrine and a lot of other things.. Like the lack of transparency about where tithing and other money goes.
they were nice. until i said im not going on a mission. then i was the fucking devil.
@@elevationeddie1981 I've been following a family on RUclips named...Knorp and South. They are Mormons. So I started reading about Mormonism a few weeks ago. I'm kinda shocked that this family believes all these man made rules and weird ideas, like the underwear. Their son is getting ready to do a missions trip and they said they won't see him for two years, but what they don't tell you is that it's forbidden. Lots of hiding stuff. Also, your user name, hope that means you go to Elevation church!
@J Antione who the heck are u talking about. Thats not mormonism of LDS
@@TheVintageBumbleBee if ur talking bout LDS Mormons. U are dead wrong, it's not forbidden that mormons see their missionaries on the mission. So that alone just shows how much u don't know about the church.
@J Antione I'm glad u r willing to listen, as a teen teacher, i feel compelled to oblige with ur underdstanding of the church, now do take into account that to develope an understanding of the church, it takes more than just reading one of our books, please take the time to come to one of our sunday schools, sacrements and congrigations as often as u can. But as i said that's not what true LDS MORMONS believe in. This theory of black Africans being descendents of the curse of ham has been refuted ever since 1978, when the church had reconsile with our spiritual brothers and sisters. Remember, our scriptures have symbolic meanings in its text, in fact "dark skinned" doesn't necessarily mean a person being of color, but instead of disobedience. It's even been theorized that the curse didn't apply towarrds africans but instead indians. Which to me, makes more sence, not saying thats better, but even in our church we have members who enforce the word of God, instead of inviting those to listen, with our rationality. Lastly, I'm not so convinced you've learnt much about the church's history (which can't be found in the Book of Mormon) but u say Joseph Smith was a racist, yet he was one of the few to actually apose black slavery. I hope this helps, God bless you and ur family brother.
Wanna know why they didn’t sue Southpark? Because it’s all true. The magic hat…..😂🤣🤷🏼♂️
You are confused with Frosty the Snowman. Go spend a few nights reading about the translation process. It's mentioned a couple times on the church website decades ago, and numerous times regarding the seer stone (similar to Moses Urim and Thummim)
@ I read enough about Joseph Smith to know a conman charlatan when I see one and don’t want anything to do with that Idiocracy. I feel sorry for the weak willed sheep raised under its yoke that blindly follow without questioning why. Gods gift is free will, use it. Nice people, but in a holy war or apocalyptic situation I’d lay them all to waste for being so weak willed and to stop that social disease. How’s Chad Daybell and Lori Vallow doing?
Yeah. It is. So was Christianity at one point. The definition is: "a relatively small group of people having religious beliefs or practices regarded by others as strange or sinister.", and "a system of religious veneration and devotion directed toward a particular figure or object."
Any religion seen as fringe is considered a cult.
Lol "just drop joseph smith"... good one joe, some deep thought there. Why don't you just add dropping Mohammed for the Muslims and Moses for the Jews while your at it..
I feel like the word cult is too widely used that it has lost its meaning. Also much of the talk I this is a lot of misinformation of history
Yes
Joe, I love your channel but I have to say, that your conversation today was all over the map! Wow!
I was raised Mormon and they speak more truth than any bother church i have visited.
They speak Lies nonstop.
“Most of their money goes to good causes”
Lol they got slammed by the IRS yesterday for evading $100billion dollars worth of taxable income
Wrong - I think you mean a disgruntled former employee apostate member filed forms with the IRS in an attempt to get rich by starting an audit and claim a portion of the taxes collected. Mormon leadership are above board with paying necessary taxes. They are audited annually by Price Waterhouse Cooper and KPMG. The IRS already has the documents regarding of the entity in question. This is going to go nowhere.
Raddie Mutto We will see
@@raddiemutto7934 Evidence provided by the whistle blower proves otherwise. Not once in the 22 years of this "charitable", tax exempt fund did the mormon church use so much as one penny to fund any charitable causes.
Especially when we were led to believe that it was all going to charity rather than a stockpile of money they deserve to be taxed. I was Mormon until a year ago and then on top of the issues I had which weren’t related to tithing, this whole thing comes out yaaaaa I was mislead I may be disgruntled but I’m not a moron
@@andyr49 😂 are you kidding me? Ok. Just the first to come to mind of a long list. 2004 Indian Ocean tsunami relief. Mormon church gave over $31 MILLION in cash and supplies to aid in recovery. More than almost all aid organizations. Read for yourself under non governmental organizations en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Humanitarian_response_to_the_2004_Indian_Ocean_earthquake
Joseph Smith didn't die in Missouri
No Joseph Smith killed couple guys in Carthage jail and the local honest community came to snuff out this murderous Joseph Smith
John Robert ... lol no, the “local honest community” that you’re referring to was a mob of angry bigots on a mission to kill Hyrum and Joseph Smith. While these mobsters were heading up the stairs and into Carthage jail, a few of them were killed in self defense.
While Smith didn't deserve to be murdered, he brought his death in Illinois on himself. He likely would have been legally executed as it is, for being a government official, and military officer guilty of sedition.
The mob of men who took out Joseph Smith did so in Illinois, not Missouri. The "Council of Fifty" meetings records show that Smith was guilty of Treason. He had a plot to overthrow the U.S. government and turn it into a Theocracy with himself as King. He even had himself crowned King. It was the documents published by the State of Missouri in 1842 regarding the crimes of Joseph Smith, the destruction of and banning of the Free Press, and the stealing of other men's legal wives that enraged the mob. They knew he planned to abolish the U.S. Constitution and to overthrow the U.S. Government.
The story of Joseph Smith finding the golden plates is something. Try actually reading the Book of Mormon in a serious way. It is a miraculous book that has amazing power to bring one closer to Jesus Christ. It has brought me such peace and joy in my life and taught me so much about how to be a true follower of Jesus Christ.
Oh, and Colorado City is not on the border of Colorado. It's in Arizona.