I know, I was slightly annoyed at all these effete liberals, presumably, chuckling and laughing like it was all a big joke, but it did sort of read like he was having some fun with the whole thing, in addition to still trying to earnestly get the point across. All I was thinking the whole time was the people in that audience would be doomed in a lawless, Mad Max-esque America. Because there isn't going to be a 'civil war' if it ever comes to that, it will simply be a slaughter, if we're talking about one side of the socio-political aisle as it were versus the other. One side is well armed, physically strong and virile, and willing to be violent. And the other side isn't....
Watching in Jan of 2024 thinking this is right around the corner. I frequently wonder if I’ll regret staying in the US. Read the book “ The Fourth Turning is Here”, and Jim Richard’s, this will help prepare.
@@wmc9722 Thank you for the reminder, I got busy and forgot to get it from the library. Fortunately, I was able to get it put on hold, so I will indeed be reading it soon. Thanks again. I must not let busy stuff get in the way. 🙂
Literally listening to this while tending to my 'Collapse' garden, which I started because it seemed like it might be useful for what's coming, wearing - you guessed it - my gardening gloves.
@@денисбаженов-щ1б What good is money if there is no food available to buy? You do you, boo. I've done the money-grubbing thing - I much prefer grubbing in the dirt.
@@денисбаженов-щ1б no not being sarcastic. Gardens will only get people so far. People should listen to people who lived in post collapse Russia or the Balkans
It's from 2009 🤪 USA is still the world's superpower (China and Russia are regional powers). I don't see what's "brilliant" being wrong for at least 12 years
@@lvgl_beginner ....it's because he is KGB demoralization specialist sent to spread propoganda....america ain't going nowhere....russia did not have firearms in the hands of their citizens and therefore had no ability to fight to protect itself from within....
And classy. When many people in the audience laugh, he does not mock them saying, 'just wait and see who'll be laughing'. I believe that there's a 20% possibility that what he envisions will come to pass.
@@xrxs1020 After Tuesday September 11th, 2001, I spend 100s of hours researching the case and when I mentioned my findings to a certain confidant I got utter disinterest and a bit of an eye-roll. Now, nearly 20 years later I'm ecited to hear that same person explain some of what is REALLY going on these days. Re: Orlov: The setting here was such that they chuckled a bit perhaps because they felt uncomfortable with what they were hearing. In the crowd there may have been one person who was hearing every word, taking notes, hoping to listen to him more AFTER the stage presentation. Ignorance may 'be bliss' until it is not and one is wacked in the side of the head. Ignorance is a choice.
When many people in the audience laugh, he does not mock them saying, 'let's wait and see who'll be laughing'. I believe that there's a 40% possibility that what he envisions will come to pass by 2030.
this presentation is from 2011 and is far on coarse now 9 yrs later. I have the impression that we are far closer to what Dmitry is discribing, if you haven't moved yet, time is getting shorter is my guess. unemployment is definetely on the rise and the tech sector has been booming, but how will that story end?
C'mon man, when the audience laugh its because of his witty delivery, not that they find the subject matter comical. Besides, the best comedy is build upon tragedy.
@@wmc9722 You sir, are a fool, and a grumpy fool at that. "40% chance by 2030." Is a fact is it? Not just your speculation? Where did you get the 40% value from? Dont make sweeping generalisations, arbitrarily pluck numbers out of no-where and tell me its fact. I will not be sharing any of my chickens with you post collapse. They're for jolly survivors who can laugh at their own misfortune only.
The irony is if we could just let it happen(the collapse) without losing our minds, it would be quick. That fact that we'll cling to our way of living dooms us to a long recovery.
The human tendency to cling to the comfortable and familiar is also going to doom us to civilizational collapse in general. We have been in a state of ecological overshoot for decades now. Climate change is just one of the symptoms. The evidence is all around us and clearly getting worse. What's coming in the remainder of the 2020s will not be pretty. In a nutshell: "If the depletion of finite natural resources cannot go on forever, it won’t."
@@RussCR5187 We are perfectly fine. This crisis is being ginned up like they did with WW1 and 2. THEY ARE AT WAR AGAINST YOU!! Taking C02 out of the air won't stop climate change one bit!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
@@tuckerbugeater I agree that "they" (our billionaire overlords) are at war with us. They are imposing tighter and tighter control over our lives and are well on the way to authoritarian rule. I also agree that taking CO2 out of the air won't stop the unbalancing of our climate. We don't have a technology that can remove enough CO2 to make any meaningful difference. And for both of those reasons we are NOT perfectly fine.
1:12:00 Actually it wasn't the Chechens who made up the largest ethnic mafia. There was another race (or tribe) of people who constructed a way more prolific ethnic crime ring. Putin largely dismantled this ethnic mafia, but nonetheless they still have widespread influence. Please note that in the case of the US this ethnic mafia is already in place, and if nothing is done against them they will only become stronger.
As to your current profession, think about how your skills could be used in a post-collapse economy and how they could be marketed. Work to redesign yourself in that direction, strengthening any weaknesses that you uncover. As you gradually evolve into something more useful, use the money that you are earning to gain control over your critical life support system and make yourself and your family more sustainable and resilient. Next, focus on doing the same for your friends, neighbors and coworkers. Expand your circle of influence outward. Partner with others when it will be to your mutual benefit. Keep your guard up. Expect resistance. You will encounter it frequently. That’s when you really need your friends. Good luck on your journey and God bless!
Your joke reminds me of when I visited where I grew up in Darnica, Kiev, Ukraine where I went into a butcher shop and saw vitrines full of, well, nothing. Except for one, which was full of some kind of white sausage (maybe a kind of kalbsbratwurst). This would have been shortly before the breakup of the SU. Today there is some little wooden church where the statue of Lenin used to be and the butcher shop is gone. The land is levelled and during the day you can find the usual post-Soviet bazaar.
i listened to dmitry for over a decade now and read his blog for a decade now and bought a few of his books. the further i become informed and look at what is happening around me the more his ideas make sense. unfortunately the large populace still believes and hopes consumption after fossil fuel decline will stay as high as they where used to in the most consumptive cultures(USA, Western Europe
It stands up pretty well 11 years later. He's wrong about oil and house prices. But he's right about austerity, Brexit, Trump and the impact of COVID. It's a great watch.
To a small extent Oil prices have being kept somewhat more affordable by more Oil Exports from Iraq(more than expected) and the developing of the Kashkar Oil field in Kazakhstan since 2017
Ha, $7 gasoline and 7% mortgage interest rates. I think he was and is spot on about both. This isn't a supply side problem with gasoline. It's the ponzi scheme of fracking which has only produced a less than promised oil bonanza. Fracking shale formations is in the end times. Resource depletion is real. Mexico will stop exporting oil in 2023 because their Super Giant field has been depleted.
Financialisation is definitely the main problem, over the reality of physical supply and stocks. I thought the whole peak oil thing was a psyop though, artificial scarcity is more dependable than the real kind imo.
It's funny. Have read his stuff before, but never saw him do a speech. Of course this video is 11 years old. Still think it has some relevance in our current year of 2020. For anyone interested he covers security at 49:48. Be interesting to see what he thinks of our current situation ? Personally think the violence is going to be far greater.
His assessment, based on tried and true processes, makes so much sense. Having mentally unstable, armed "friends", wink, wink, nearby, is sometimes a minus in normal society but quite valuable in unstable times of weakened central authority. The intimidation factor as sort of "growling, unhinged, instigating, attack dogs" often will smooth a pathway more efficiently than any other immediate method, and usually with zero actual harm being done, but ONLY in limited circumstances, with limited strategic uses, at other times 100% counterproductive. Those kind of "friends" are tools like fire- useful if managed and controlled, a disaster if not. His assessment of whom would make the transition most easily is also, right on the mark. Implied in all of this, is that some sort of partial or complete recovery will eventually come, but with changed rules of the game.
15 years later, storing spending little how did that work out? He hates America moved back to Russia to raise family because USA is so bad for families. Obviously was a young boy with an admiration of the toughness of Russian society and right now is part of nation that of course is taking over the societal collapse of the Ukraine.
@@angelicinspirations "You have a total lack of empathy. Horrible, horrible person that you are. YOU are despicable." Hello pot! Call the kettle black much?
I noticed that China could also lay claim (aspire to?) the same list of symmetries as SU US, although it's day in the sun as a true Super Power has not not yet quite been reached in modern times. If they hurry up perhaps they, too, can get this collapse thing done before the entire planetary human civilization thing becomes completely impossible.
He's right about cargo bikes. I've moved 1000s of lbs of stuff with mine. I make my post office deliveries with it, have brought back furniture, do all kinds of hauling with mine. In my world, Silicon Valley, no one can afford to own and operate a car unless they managed to hold onto one from the before times.
Americans survived the total collapse of the Great Depression without social collapse. Europe survived their even worse economic depression without social collapse. That's an obvious truth. It wasnt the communist system that saved russia from social collapse. Mutual cooperation within society endures social survival. In America the churches do as much charity as the government. And local governments have more flexibility in responding to needs and changes than in a totalitarian system or a centralized system.
The American century is Over / since 1989 and the end of history by American political scientist Francis Fukuyama shows the facts of today the entrepreneurs of the west believed on a fiction, and eat the illusion of FUKUYAMA. This fact has giving the possibility of a soft landing for America & the entrepreneurs & bankers the west created since 1776. They did not understood the wheel 🎡 of time today they don't either.😥 Reason why you got Crazy TRUMP USELESS OBAMA & CRIMINAL BUSH front page 📄 CLINTON as American presidents tailored to sink the nation & they have😉🤗 Joe Biden🦼 is the last pope if you like. Look to the bright 🔆 future & the third renaissance 🎨🖼🎭🎪🎞🎹🎵✍ for the mind & the spirit 🤗🧐👽😇
The USA came close to a much-needed revolution in the Great Depression until its ass was saved by FDR. It was indeed what you'd call "communism" that saved Russia and saved the US.
@@alexcarter8807 the economy was recovering by the end of 1930 I believe. ..... employment had improved steadily .....until the government stepped in . Another thing about the depression era was the long drought out west. The government was helpful there as they promoted large scale land husbandry/farming techniques. It's why we have trees planted around fields today.
His observation of America's overinflated budget and rise in debt is spot on. But his solutions like community farming and shutting down production would be catastrophic and would inevitably speed up such a collapse.
Free markets are a product of nature, they arise spontaneously and immediately anywhere human activity is found. It's interesting hearing someone speculate about solutions to problems they don't completely understand in economic terms. He's right that inflation is a problem, though he probably doesn't understand it's a consequence of central planning and market manipulation. And so he thinks there are central planning solutions. Which, as you point out, would exacerbate the shortages and broaden the destruction of lives, wealth, and property, which is generally a bad thing 😅 especially during times of population collapse.... And it seems that nearly 98% of everyone in modern society doesn't understand the coming consequences of population collapse. Because it's exponential, and exponential trends are not really intuitive to the human mind. For example, a negative GDP.
Humanity will survive collapse of Industrialism within alot of the Western World, What is at least a toss up will the part of humanity in the Large Western Metro areas survive in any significant numbers and with something of a functional culture and maybe not in North America considering the increase in Drugs, Alcoholism, Mass Shootings, lack of Community, maybe amount of 5G Internet,etc.
Have hope for other Society's even within Western World.(For example Iceland aims to have all electricty from renewable sources and much of it Geothermal Energy).
Liberals so completely misunderstood guns as survival tools, and as a means to democratize self-defense to the most weak and vulnerable, even against the strongest oppressors and criminals. The main difference between a slave and a citizen, is the citizen is allowed to defend themselves against violence and exploitation.. He sees gun ownership as a negative, but also advocates post-collapse militias, so long as the militias are restricted to corrupt police officers and psychologically unstable ex-military... It makes sense to someone who is completely unfamiliar with the actual reality of these things through life experience or analysis of data, and bases their understanding and ideas about them on the political dogma they've learned over the years. At least the ignorance of people like this, will provide an advantage to the rest of us in a post-collapse society. Especially those who understand the economics of free markets (black markets) that inevitably become the primary means of trade for free people.
No it shouldn't. It's not a mistake. This is the Long Now Foundation. They've done it on purpose to reflect the far future (ie. If we're lucky enough to make it to, say, the year 20020).
I prefer the word "transformation". Humanity is always transforming. Especially in the past 200 years from 1800 to 2,000. Humanity added 6 billion more humans, which is the root of all problems. We can do better. Hopefully we will. If not, we will transform, in good or bad ways. Utopians worry me always changing and always malcontent with things being pretty good. Too many parasites, not enough producers. Too many over educated parasites. Protect yourself.
"Diversity" really means "DIVISITY"(!)... It is an outgrowth of the time tested DIVIDE AND CONQUER(!)...school of human husbandry manipulation, breeding, processing, and consumption...the branding is always so much fun?
Based on African experience there will be a flight to bigger towns where pockets of the former life will survive, while the rest of the country slowly degenerates, services break down, nothing gets fixed. It's not a spectacular event, just slow collapse.
@@joshuak5958 Say you borrowed a few bucks from a guy and you pride yourself on paying your debts: would it be in poor taste to pay him or not to pay him back while he just so happens to be cueing up for the gallows?
A problem with the United States is that everything has to be packaged and branded so as to appeal to the consumer. Even the most logical practices need to be "evangelised" in a cozy and appealing manner. A nation growing up on a propaganda diet of Rambo and terminator movies will never find it easy to practice many of things in this talk. The 400 year old legacy issues will further complicate the issues beyond amelioration. This country is in serious need of some serious culture. That will be a hard task.
The Sephardic Jewish community of Tashkent thrived during the 2.WW because of the huge influx from Moscow and St.Petersburg of Ashkenazi Jews... Orlov means has the word eagle in its stem, there's a saying in Russian that any bird is suitable for a Jewish Russian family name. Mr Orlov doesn't mention the basic necessity of energy (warmth, light), only as fuel for transport. And aren't the US a net exporter of oil meanwhile?
The guy makes some good points, but ultimately sees everything form an economic point of view. This is the weakness of his argument. In the case of the US it won't just be the state collapsing, but the whole culture collapsing. Orlov doesn't really account for this in his narrative. One should augment this by reading such works as the Fourth Turning or listening to 3rd positionist critiques that have recently been made.
He breaks down the collapse of all societies into 5 parts, with culture being one of them. He’s stated that cultural collapses are usually the last stage to happen, but in the case of the US it happened first. You really think you had some novelty point bringing up culture lol
This is why every able bodied conservative should be an active part of their local militia. Don’t believe the propaganda, most militias are not racist blood-thirsty whakkos. Be part of a community that can help your community when this happens
GREAT, I AM WATCHING IT FROM 1967, WHEN I CAME FROM COMMUNIST CZECHOSLOVAJIA TO SF. I WAS NO JEWISH. THE NON STOP VICTIM . SINCE THEN I AM FIGHTING AND TRYING TO PPEOLE UP. WELL IT WAS NOT SUCSESS. NOW I AM 80..... ....
Covid showed we don't need residential colleges or skyscraper office jobs. We have the internet and online learning and meetings. Increasingly high energy costs make it a losing proposition to transport millions of office workers to and from their cubicles. $5-7 gasoline is here to stay. This isn't a supply side issue. It's the world running low on easily accessible oil. Fracking shale formations shows we're at the bottom of the barrel in reserves. The USA only has an estimated 25 billion barrels in reserves and burns a billion barrels each 50 days. We are definitely in peak oil but more importantly we are in the end times of mass oil use. It will have to be rationed to produce and transport food, not fill commuters' SUVS or millionaire's yachts.
oh, how nice of him to cite "Soviet government" that gave the terrible non-bread to starving people of Leningrad. Yes, when German and Finnish nazis kept the city in a blokade. The anti-soviet people are always russophobes deeply inside, and they never learn. What he is saying about the prosperous Russian Empire and the criminal Soviet collectivization are another exemples of his utter incompetence in everything that has to do with the real Russian history. But yeah, he is much better than the American analysists, not that it is a difficult thing
Fun presentation that was based on the idea that mineral oil was the basis of wealth. We now have very cheap solar power, wind power, hydro power. + Electric cars, buses and trains for transportation solve many issues that he feared.
epSos.de - it isn’t cheap. In California, Germany, prices doubled with solar & wind. One reason it isn’t cheap is because, unfortunately, it isn’t reliable, so you always need an alternate, RELIABLE backup power source.
I'm sorry, but i just wanted to say i think you are so wrong, Oil are so important in the current system, solar and wind power are too small and not good enought to maintain the system by themself. you are fooling yourself if you think Electric car will fix the problem. Maybe i'm wrong but just wanted to make you think cause i felt your comment was so obviously wrong.
What I find interesting is, if this is a lecture from a year ago, where is the large beard Dmitry had grown a year ago? Where is the mention, even in passing, of the covid pandemic? And, a year ago, travel was quite restricted, and yet Dmitry was still jet-setting around? This reminds of of "new" documentaries supposedly shot in, say, 2019, but everyone's watching CRT TVs and no one's got a smart phone. I just watched a docu supposedly about 6 months old, about Hitler's fiancee, where I recognize the voice of the narrator from the 90s. I think this is part of the 'hypernormalisation' the US is undergoing. In the case of Dmitry's lectures, it really doesn't matter if they're a year old or a decade, they're all good. If there's any update to this probably 10-year-old lecture, it's that Dmitry's been surprised lately to find that the US has not been following the stages of collapse he originally outlined, but had chosen to collapse sociologically first.
he is brilliant now when speaking of USA but all his ideas about the demise of the USSR are wrong. He couldn´t know a lot of information and documents that came to public years later and in the years of "perestroyka" and the collapse of his country he was just one of many russophobic liberals, like a lot of other Soviet "dissidents". The smartest of them came eventually to realisation of how wrong they were, the rest - not so much. Orlov is one of the smart ones, but it is so unpleasant to admit your own wrongdoings...
What would you suggest to Russia to become the replacement superpower now that the Untied Status is faltering? Immigration, to correct that dwindling population trend? Bring back some of the emigrees and their families? A new Silicon Valley and tax-free entrepreneurial area in Krim?
As a plausible alternative to either the US or China in terms of global leadership, Russia is outmatched and outclassed. Putin lacks a positive, constructive vision for his own country, let alone the world. Putin’s diplomatic, military and strategic successes, notably in the Middle East, cannot disguise fundamental domestic weaknesses: chronic underinvestment, overreliance on energy export revenues, poor infrastructure and social provision, endemic corruption, rising political discontent, and a pervasive, fearful sense of state lawlessness. Putin has largely defined his foreign policy in disruptive opposition to the US and the EU - by slavishly befriending China, courting Eurosceptic east Europeans, meddling in the Balkans, backing outlier regimes such as Iran, selling arms to anybody who asks, manipulating other people’s elections (and his own), and generally subverting democratic states'. My opinion: Simon Tisdall, October 19, 2019.
what a pile of bullocks. He not only doesn´t know USSR, he doesn´t know the modern Russia as well. Russians are not "ethnic minority". "Chechen mafia" did not hold the trade in their hands - Armenians, Azers and Jews did. And all kind of other small details that make you think this person has never ever visited Russia, USSR, Russian Empire, Ancient Rus´, whatever
In Cuba criminals are put in jail not release so a hitchhiker likely to be law abiding. Not so in Democrat ruled USA. Audience seems to be woke Karens and Kens. 🤮
How does he imagine the territorial division of the United States after the collapse? Will California and Texas be independent countries? Will the WASP create their own country in the north?
Interestingly alot of the North has more German Americans than English Americans specicly a belt from Indiana to the Dakota's and Also Pennsylvania. This may eventually influence new boundaries in the North East and Upper Midwest.
An other Interesting perspective on Collapse (Well specifically America's Collapse) is from the very knowledgeable Morris Berman. His analysis traces America's wrong turn actually all the way back to the late 1600,s and debates that even that far back that America made an entire way of life based around Hustling, Hustling was emphasis over all other values, even American democracy (according to Berman) was tied to Hustling, and finally in a Country or the world with is finite resources there is only so long in time a Society can have Hustling as the supreme value. Morris Berman also connects resource constraints kicking in harder and the recent political and civil unrest in America to basically the collapse of the American Dream. I,m not saying I fully agree with Morris Berman but this is his analysis. Lastly he has an interesting website www.morrisberman.blogspot.com
@cqxmrvcoy I don't agree with morris on everything however he is right to point out that hustling and oppertunism dominating the culture as in alot of the early 21st Century world is not normal and the norm by historical standards is steady state economy and also not blind belief in Advanced Technologies or Transhumanism.
Dimitry is a frequent guest on Dialogue works. Then you can find out what he thinks about our current situation. He much more serious now.
I know, I was slightly annoyed at all these effete liberals, presumably, chuckling and laughing like it was all a big joke, but it did sort of read like he was having some fun with the whole thing, in addition to still trying to earnestly get the point across. All I was thinking the whole time was the people in that audience would be doomed in a lawless, Mad Max-esque America. Because there isn't going to be a 'civil war' if it ever comes to that, it will simply be a slaughter, if we're talking about one side of the socio-political aisle as it were versus the other. One side is well armed, physically strong and virile, and willing to be violent. And the other side isn't....
Yeah he is very good
He’s still funny, but times are somber
Great talk by Orlov. Also enjoy reading his articles. Truly original thinker and offers a contrarian view.
Watching in Jan of 2024 thinking this is right around the corner. I frequently wonder if I’ll regret staying in the US. Read the book “ The Fourth Turning is Here”, and Jim Richard’s, this will help prepare.
What a wonderful talk! And so accurate even now in 2023, more so, in fact. I'll be checking out his book.
Did you?
@@wmc9722 Thank you for the reminder, I got busy and forgot to get it from the library. Fortunately, I was able to get it put on hold, so I will indeed be reading it soon. Thanks again. I must not let busy stuff get in the way. 🙂
I have read his book translated into French. Inoubliable! I strongly recommand it?
@@rolandetisseyre113 Merci!
amazing guest speaker. love listening to him on different podcasts
Literally listening to this while tending to my 'Collapse' garden, which I started because it seemed like it might be useful for what's coming, wearing - you guessed it - my gardening gloves.
@@денисбаженов-щ1б What good is money if there is no food available to buy?
You do you, boo. I've done the money-grubbing thing - I much prefer grubbing in the dirt.
@@денисбаженов-щ1б TL;DR, dude - I need to get back out to my garden.
@@денисбаженов-щ1б have a great day! 😁
@@денисбаженов-щ1б this. You know exactly what's the proper course of action.
@@денисбаженов-щ1б no not being sarcastic. Gardens will only get people so far. People should listen to people who lived in post collapse Russia or the Balkans
I love listening to Dmitry.
Brilliant. Deserves more views. There’s far too few people willing to consider any problems which are unpleasant
It's from 2009 🤪
USA is still the world's superpower (China and Russia are regional powers).
I don't see what's "brilliant" being wrong for at least 12 years
It is apparent.
What a great (outstanding) presentation in dimension and breadth, leaves many facets to think about... (Thank You!)
Since this interview, Orlov relocated to St. Petersburg, Russia.
My cue was when Dmitry orlov moves back to Russia
Things are really going to shit
So collapse by 1st Jan 2025
...because he is a kgb demoralization operator sent to america to spread propoganda...older than dirt trick....america won't collapse....relax....
@@lvgl_beginner ....it's because he is KGB demoralization specialist sent to spread propoganda....america ain't going nowhere....russia did not have firearms in the hands of their citizens and therefore had no ability to fight to protect itself from within....
@@AndrewHorezga I am excited because the USA _will_ collapse.
FYI, I don't live in the US and I do _not_ wish the US well.
@@conscious_being lol...you are a dime a dozen....reeeee.....suffer then.
Orlov is brilliant
And classy. When many people in the audience laugh, he does not mock them saying, 'just wait and see who'll be laughing'.
I believe that there's a 20% possibility that what he envisions will come to pass.
@@wmc9722 I don't think they're laughing at him, as in MOCKING him. Thus, there's no reason for him to say "just wait......"
@@xrxs1020 After Tuesday September 11th, 2001, I spend 100s of hours researching the case and when I mentioned my findings to a certain confidant I got utter disinterest and a bit of an eye-roll. Now, nearly 20 years later I'm ecited to hear that same person explain some of what is REALLY going on these days.
Re: Orlov:
The setting here was such that they chuckled a bit perhaps because they felt uncomfortable with what they were hearing.
In the crowd there may have been one person who was hearing every word, taking notes, hoping to listen to him more AFTER the stage presentation.
Ignorance may 'be bliss' until it is not and one is wacked in the side of the head.
Ignorance is a choice.
When many people in the audience laugh, he does not mock them saying, 'let's wait and see who'll be laughing'.
I believe that there's a 40% possibility that what he envisions will come to pass by 2030.
this presentation is from 2011 and is far on coarse now 9 yrs later. I have the impression that we are far closer to what Dmitry is discribing, if you haven't moved yet, time is getting shorter is my guess. unemployment is definetely on the rise and the tech sector has been booming, but how will that story end?
Seems to be going to plan...
C'mon man, when the audience laugh its because of his witty delivery, not that they find the subject matter comical. Besides, the best comedy is build upon tragedy.
@@castlebravo2023 He is not a comedian and this is not a comedy!
Read it all again: I state facts above. You give your opinion of what others think.
@@wmc9722 You sir, are a fool, and a grumpy fool at that.
"40% chance by 2030." Is a fact is it? Not just your speculation? Where did you get the 40% value from?
Dont make sweeping generalisations, arbitrarily pluck numbers out of no-where and tell me its fact.
I will not be sharing any of my chickens with you post collapse. They're for jolly survivors who can laugh at their own misfortune only.
The irony is if we could just let it happen(the collapse) without losing our minds, it would be quick. That fact that we'll cling to our way of living dooms us to a long recovery.
The human tendency to cling to the comfortable and familiar is also going to doom us to civilizational collapse in general. We have been in a state of ecological overshoot for decades now. Climate change is just one of the symptoms. The evidence is all around us and clearly getting worse. What's coming in the remainder of the 2020s will not be pretty.
In a nutshell: "If the depletion of finite natural resources cannot go on forever, it won’t."
@@RussCR5187 We are perfectly fine. This crisis is being ginned up like they did with WW1 and 2. THEY ARE AT WAR AGAINST YOU!! Taking C02 out of the air won't stop climate change one bit!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
@@tuckerbugeater I agree that "they" (our billionaire overlords) are at war with us. They are imposing tighter and tighter control over our lives and are well on the way to authoritarian rule. I also agree that taking CO2 out of the air won't stop the unbalancing of our climate. We don't have a technology that can remove enough CO2 to make any meaningful difference. And for both of those reasons we are NOT perfectly fine.
This is a good presentation. I am not sure, however, that the audience understands that he's serious.
1:12:00 Actually it wasn't the Chechens who made up the largest ethnic mafia. There was another race (or tribe) of people who constructed a way more prolific ethnic crime ring. Putin largely dismantled this ethnic mafia, but nonetheless they still have widespread influence. Please note that in the case of the US this ethnic mafia is already in place, and if nothing is done against them they will only become stronger.
Ah......the Oligarchs.
@@paraguaymike5159 Uhhh, no it's the reptiles obviously
*sarcasm* glad to see people who know what's up
@Boxcarcifer There was a strong Russian crime group, and next Georgian, their government kicked them out of their country, but I may be wrong.
@@nemo2203 The one you replied to is a claimed member of the 'tribe'.
the ones with those peculiar hats
As to your current profession, think about how your skills could be used in a post-collapse economy and how they could be marketed. Work to redesign yourself in that direction, strengthening any weaknesses that you uncover. As you gradually evolve into something more useful, use the money that you are earning to gain control over your critical life support system and make yourself and your family more sustainable and resilient. Next, focus on doing the same for your friends, neighbors and coworkers. Expand your circle of influence outward. Partner with others when it will be to your mutual benefit. Keep your guard up. Expect resistance. You will encounter it frequently. That’s when you really need your friends. Good luck on your journey and God bless!
Wise words thank you
“Ignorance is instantaneous at all points in the known universe.” Absolute Truth.
He’s recast Barbara Tuchman’s March of Folly with sardonic wit and merges Ben Franklin’s Poor Richard’s Almanac into a Survival Guide.
Brilliant.
He's telling you your going to be impoverished and starved to death purposely! He's not stopping it.
Your joke reminds me of when I visited where I grew up in Darnica, Kiev, Ukraine where I went into a butcher shop and saw vitrines full of, well, nothing. Except for one, which was full of some kind of white sausage (maybe a kind of kalbsbratwurst). This would have been shortly before the breakup of the SU. Today there is some little wooden church where the statue of Lenin used to be and the butcher shop is gone. The land is levelled and during the day you can find the usual post-Soviet bazaar.
i listened to dmitry for over a decade now and read his blog for a decade now and bought a few of his books. the further i become informed and look at what is happening around me the more his ideas make sense. unfortunately the large populace still believes and hopes consumption after fossil fuel decline will stay as high as they where used to in the most consumptive cultures(USA, Western Europe
Nima brought me here
It stands up pretty well 11 years later. He's wrong about oil and house prices. But he's right about austerity, Brexit, Trump and the impact of COVID. It's a great watch.
Peak oil was only divertied because of shale but thats going under.
To a small extent Oil prices have being kept somewhat more affordable by more Oil Exports from Iraq(more than expected) and the developing of the Kashkar Oil field in Kazakhstan since 2017
Oh he's not wrong about oil. Global production has peaked.
Ha, $7 gasoline and 7% mortgage interest rates. I think he was and is spot on about both. This isn't a supply side problem with gasoline. It's the ponzi scheme of fracking which has only produced a less than promised oil bonanza. Fracking shale formations is in the end times. Resource depletion is real. Mexico will stop exporting oil in 2023 because their Super Giant field has been depleted.
Financialisation is definitely the main problem, over the reality of physical supply and stocks. I thought the whole peak oil thing was a psyop though, artificial scarcity is more dependable than the real kind imo.
It's funny. Have read his stuff before, but never saw him do a speech. Of course this video is 11 years old. Still think it has some relevance in our current year of 2020. For anyone interested he covers security at 49:48. Be interesting to see what he thinks of our current situation ? Personally think the violence is going to be far greater.
read his article on the US collapse which will be out tomorrow.
This guys a unicorn.
An engineer that's funny
The absence of bread seems very significant from an Orthodox Eucharistic perspective as well.
His assessment, based on tried and true processes, makes so much sense.
Having mentally unstable, armed "friends", wink, wink, nearby, is sometimes a minus in normal society but quite valuable in unstable times of weakened central authority.
The intimidation factor as sort of "growling, unhinged, instigating, attack dogs" often will smooth a pathway more efficiently than any other immediate method, and usually with zero actual harm being done, but ONLY in limited circumstances, with limited strategic uses, at other times 100% counterproductive.
Those kind of "friends" are tools like fire- useful if managed and controlled, a disaster if not.
His assessment of whom would make the transition most easily is also, right on the mark. Implied in all of this, is that some sort of partial or complete recovery will eventually come, but with changed rules of the game.
The rules of the game have been the same for 10,000 fucking years we need to stop letting elites run the world into the ground
15 years later, storing spending little how did that work out? He hates America moved back to Russia to raise family because USA is so bad for families. Obviously was a young boy with an admiration of the toughness of Russian society and right now is part of nation that of course is taking over the societal collapse of the Ukraine.
Oil peak (energy collapse), military budger (arcs drain), trade deficit (industrial/farm/resources fail) + corrupt leaders (reaction hability) + people desired lifestile (social stability)
BASIC: Food, shelter, transportation; security (& adjusted education, & hope)
this will become the post a/merikan century user s book. Brilliant!!
Too true
The most powerful weapon is Truth
He is brilliant! He is the one who would be able to help people to survive the collapse of American economy.
It might be a REAL GOOD IDEA to put a date on this
@@heyyall9378 thank you!!
@Phoenix waaaaaa waaaaa waaaa
@@angelicinspirations "You have a total lack of empathy. Horrible, horrible person that you are. YOU are despicable."
Hello pot! Call the kettle black much?
ruclips.net/video/OLejDYf_BXQ/видео.html
@Phoenix Time to up your doses.
. . . every time I consider falling in love, I'll return to watch this video - fantastic sanity rinse!
Leave it to a Russian to make such a serious subject funny. Humor is always welcome and disarming. Cultivate it!
Nailed it!
I noticed that China could also lay claim (aspire to?) the same list of symmetries as SU US, although it's day in the sun as a true Super Power has not not yet quite been reached in modern times. If they hurry up perhaps they, too, can get this collapse thing done before the entire planetary human civilization thing becomes completely impossible.
When the "worker's paradise" stops working it is then fully achieved.
Love all Dmitry Orlovs work can’t wait to see the Quidnon
Does Dimitry Orlov have a you tube channel or Substack? Where can I read his stuff?
Great talk! On suburbs 35:00 Watch Not just Bikes and Strongtowns
Good call!
He's right about cargo bikes. I've moved 1000s of lbs of stuff with mine. I make my post office deliveries with it, have brought back furniture, do all kinds of hauling with mine. In my world, Silicon Valley, no one can afford to own and operate a car unless they managed to hold onto one from the before times.
Why do you even need four cars?
This was recommended to me a day after the Fall of Kabul...
Being physically fit will be very important after the collapse.
As a sedentary 62 year old cigarette smoker, I'm screwed.
Americans survived the total collapse of the Great Depression without social collapse. Europe survived their even worse economic depression without social collapse. That's an obvious truth. It wasnt the communist system that saved russia from social collapse. Mutual cooperation within society endures social survival. In America the churches do as much charity as the government. And local governments have more flexibility in responding to needs and changes than in a totalitarian system or a centralized system.
The American century is Over / since 1989 and the end of history by American political scientist Francis Fukuyama shows the facts of today the entrepreneurs of the west believed on a fiction, and eat the illusion of FUKUYAMA. This fact has giving the possibility of a soft landing for America & the entrepreneurs & bankers the west created since 1776. They did not understood the wheel 🎡 of time today they don't either.😥 Reason why you got Crazy TRUMP USELESS OBAMA & CRIMINAL BUSH front page 📄 CLINTON as American presidents tailored to sink the nation & they have😉🤗 Joe Biden🦼 is the last pope if you like. Look to the bright 🔆 future & the third renaissance 🎨🖼🎭🎪🎞🎹🎵✍ for the mind & the spirit 🤗🧐👽😇
The Great Depression was by no means a total collapse. Total collapse is when there's no more cheap energy to run the economy.
The USA came close to a much-needed revolution in the Great Depression until its ass was saved by FDR. It was indeed what you'd call "communism" that saved Russia and saved the US.
@@alexcarter8807 the economy was recovering by the end of 1930 I believe. ..... employment had improved steadily .....until the government stepped in . Another thing about the depression era was the long drought out west. The government was helpful there as they promoted large scale land husbandry/farming techniques. It's why we have trees planted around fields today.
@@deborahdean8867wrong on all accounts.
His observation of America's overinflated budget and rise in debt is spot on. But his solutions like community farming and shutting down production would be catastrophic and would inevitably speed up such a collapse.
Free markets are a product of nature, they arise spontaneously and immediately anywhere human activity is found. It's interesting hearing someone speculate about solutions to problems they don't completely understand in economic terms. He's right that inflation is a problem, though he probably doesn't understand it's a consequence of central planning and market manipulation. And so he thinks there are central planning solutions. Which, as you point out, would exacerbate the shortages and broaden the destruction of lives, wealth, and property, which is generally a bad thing 😅 especially during times of population collapse.... And it seems that nearly 98% of everyone in modern society doesn't understand the coming consequences of population collapse. Because it's exponential, and exponential trends are not really intuitive to the human mind. For example, a negative GDP.
I don't know when this was recorded, definitely not in 2020. Real Estate prices have not "continued to go down." Quite the opposite in fact.
They never thought she would lose.
This was recorded in 2009. It is there in the info.
@@conscious_being it’s still wrong.
Real estate is in a bubble, once again, even larger than before.
Wallstreet took that QE money and money from tax breaks, and money from COVID-19 relief and bought real estate. Print more money, get more inflation.
George Carlin would approve of Mr. Orlov's humor.
hilarious 😂 man's a natural...... also rip society
Humanity will survive collapse of Industrialism within alot of the Western World, What is at least a toss up will the part of humanity in the Large Western Metro areas survive in any significant numbers and with something of a functional culture and maybe not in North America considering the increase in Drugs, Alcoholism, Mass Shootings, lack of Community, maybe amount of 5G Internet,etc.
Have hope for other Society's even within Western World.(For example Iceland aims to have all electricty from renewable sources and much of it Geothermal Energy).
Sick burns bruh.
Corona brought me here.
Drink up.
what should I do with my beeny baby collection?
Plant the beans. They are magic.
Burn for warmth?
I dont recommend more than 10% Beeny Baby in your portfolio.
@@thecookiechannel7083 Put all the rest in boxed star war items?
I would sew them into your clothing.
15 years ago. it didn't happen did it? but it hasn't gone away has it? in fact certainly seems to be getting closer...
Love it. Stay Tactical!!!!!!!!!!!
clever line that looking forward while having vertigo
Wow(!)...The "Aces and Eights" School of Personalized "JUSTICE"...right?
Liberals so completely misunderstood guns as survival tools, and as a means to democratize self-defense to the most weak and vulnerable, even against the strongest oppressors and criminals. The main difference between a slave and a citizen, is the citizen is allowed to defend themselves against violence and exploitation.. He sees gun ownership as a negative, but also advocates post-collapse militias, so long as the militias are restricted to corrupt police officers and psychologically unstable ex-military... It makes sense to someone who is completely unfamiliar with the actual reality of these things through life experience or analysis of data, and bases their understanding and ideas about them on the political dogma they've learned over the years. At least the ignorance of people like this, will provide an advantage to the rest of us in a post-collapse society. Especially those who understand the economics of free markets (black markets) that inevitably become the primary means of trade for free people.
**This is 2009.
Description should be corrected.
No it shouldn't.
It's not a mistake. This is the Long Now Foundation. They've done it on purpose to reflect the far future (ie. If we're lucky enough to make it to, say, the year 20020).
Intrograted
Ok, well, it was already corrected. Description now states 2009.
Sorry. I guess I misunderstood what you were referring to. My bad.
I prefer the word "transformation". Humanity is always transforming. Especially in the past 200 years from 1800 to 2,000. Humanity added 6 billion more humans, which is the root of all problems. We can do better. Hopefully we will. If not, we will transform, in good or bad ways. Utopians worry me always changing and always malcontent with things being pretty good. Too many parasites, not enough producers. Too many over educated parasites. Protect yourself.
"Diversity" really means "DIVISITY"(!)... It is an outgrowth of the time tested DIVIDE AND CONQUER(!)...school of human husbandry manipulation, breeding, processing, and consumption...the branding is always so much fun?
Based on African experience there will be a flight to bigger towns where pockets of the former life will survive, while the rest of the country slowly degenerates, services break down, nothing gets fixed. It's not a spectacular event, just slow collapse.
History of climate, in the ice cores, shows a 5 degree celsius rise in temperature. As soon as the Artic ice is gone. There is no future.
Is there a transcript?
😱It’s coming in soon ❗️
This guy's a barrel of fuckin' laughs.
Morbid laughs, but yeah...
@@joshuak5958 Say you borrowed a few bucks from a guy and you pride yourself on paying your debts: would it be in poor taste to pay him or not to pay him back while he just so happens to be cueing up for the gallows?
@@Len124 It would be pretty dickish to give him money then- I'd probably pay his kids. I don't think I get your point, however.
@@joshuak5958 Gallows humour; literally.
A problem with the United States is that everything has to be packaged and branded so as to appeal to the consumer. Even the most logical practices need to be "evangelised" in a cozy and appealing manner. A nation growing up on a propaganda diet of Rambo and terminator movies will never find it easy to practice many of things in this talk. The 400 year old legacy issues will further complicate the issues beyond amelioration. This country is in serious need of some serious culture. That will be a hard task.
The Sephardic Jewish community of Tashkent thrived during the 2.WW because of the huge influx from Moscow and St.Petersburg of Ashkenazi Jews... Orlov means has the word eagle in its stem, there's a saying in Russian that any bird is suitable for a Jewish Russian family name. Mr Orlov doesn't mention the basic necessity of energy (warmth, light), only as fuel for transport. And aren't the US a net exporter of oil meanwhile?
Кто после Дмитрия Юрича?
We now have a potato in the Whitehouse.
C'mon, man. That's rather insulting to potatoes.
And its contentious whether the current potato is a downgrade or improvement on the previous president, a clown :/
Anyone, anyone, anyone is an improvement on criminal trump.
@@davidtrindle6473 🤪🤪🤡🤡
When did we not? 😢
The guy makes some good points, but ultimately sees everything form an economic point of view. This is the weakness of his argument. In the case of the US it won't just be the state collapsing, but the whole culture collapsing. Orlov doesn't really account for this in his narrative. One should augment this by reading such works as the Fourth Turning or listening to 3rd positionist critiques that have recently been made.
He breaks down the collapse of all societies into 5 parts, with culture being one of them. He’s stated that cultural collapses are usually the last stage to happen, but in the case of the US it happened first. You really think you had some novelty point bringing up culture lol
Alpine Clan this is correct.
Better have a look on experiences of disasters in America. The one most recent in Texas?
This is why every able bodied conservative should be an active part of their local militia. Don’t believe the propaganda, most militias are not racist blood-thirsty whakkos. Be part of a community that can help your community when this happens
GREAT, I AM WATCHING IT FROM 1967, WHEN I CAME FROM COMMUNIST CZECHOSLOVAJIA TO SF. I WAS NO JEWISH. THE NON STOP VICTIM . SINCE THEN I AM FIGHTING AND TRYING TO PPEOLE UP. WELL IT WAS NOT SUCSESS. NOW I AM 80..... ....
Dmitry Orlov: Author, Futurist, Linguist, Propagandist, Chief Troll at Internet Research Agency, St. Petersburg, Russia
Covid showed we don't need residential colleges or skyscraper office jobs. We have the internet and online learning and meetings. Increasingly high energy costs make it a losing proposition to transport millions of office workers to and from their cubicles. $5-7 gasoline is here to stay. This isn't a supply side issue. It's the world running low on easily accessible oil. Fracking shale formations shows we're at the bottom of the barrel in reserves. The USA only has an estimated 25 billion barrels in reserves and burns a billion barrels each 50 days. We are definitely in peak oil but more importantly we are in the end times of mass oil use. It will have to be rationed to produce and transport food, not fill commuters' SUVS or millionaire's yachts.
This must be a reupload, this is over ten years old
2009
@@richardscathouse thank you. Were you there perchance
I think going to live in another country is way better. Russia, Malaysia, Indonesia are good examples.
Stop pretending the US isn't a 3rd world shithole 😢
oh, how nice of him to cite "Soviet government" that gave the terrible non-bread to starving people of Leningrad. Yes, when German and Finnish nazis kept the city in a blokade. The anti-soviet people are always russophobes deeply inside, and they never learn.
What he is saying about the prosperous Russian Empire and the criminal Soviet collectivization are another exemples of his utter incompetence in everything that has to do with the real Russian history.
But yeah, he is much better than the American analysists, not that it is a difficult thing
Fun presentation that was based on the idea that mineral oil was the basis of wealth.
We now have very cheap solar power, wind power, hydro power.
+ Electric cars, buses and trains for transportation solve many issues that he feared.
epSos.de - it isn’t cheap. In California, Germany, prices doubled with solar & wind. One reason it isn’t cheap is because, unfortunately, it isn’t reliable, so you always need an alternate, RELIABLE backup power source.
I'm sorry, but i just wanted to say i think you are so wrong, Oil are so important in the current system, solar and wind power are too small and not good enought to maintain the system by themself. you are fooling yourself if you think Electric car will fix the problem. Maybe i'm wrong but just wanted to make you think cause i felt your comment was so obviously wrong.
what have you been smoking?
"We now have very cheap solar power, wind power.....," which constitutes a drop in the bucket.
Energy is a very small percentage of what oil covers in industrialized society.
What I find interesting is, if this is a lecture from a year ago, where is the large beard Dmitry had grown a year ago? Where is the mention, even in passing, of the covid pandemic? And, a year ago, travel was quite restricted, and yet Dmitry was still jet-setting around?
This reminds of of "new" documentaries supposedly shot in, say, 2019, but everyone's watching CRT TVs and no one's got a smart phone. I just watched a docu supposedly about 6 months old, about Hitler's fiancee, where I recognize the voice of the narrator from the 90s.
I think this is part of the 'hypernormalisation' the US is undergoing. In the case of Dmitry's lectures, it really doesn't matter if they're a year old or a decade, they're all good. If there's any update to this probably 10-year-old lecture, it's that Dmitry's been surprised lately to find that the US has not been following the stages of collapse he originally outlined, but had chosen to collapse sociologically first.
This was recorded in 2009
he is brilliant now when speaking of USA but all his ideas about the demise of the USSR are wrong. He couldn´t know a lot of information and documents that came to public years later and in the years of "perestroyka" and the collapse of his country he was just one of many russophobic liberals, like a lot of other Soviet "dissidents". The smartest of them came eventually to realisation of how wrong they were, the rest - not so much. Orlov is one of the smart ones, but it is so unpleasant to admit your own wrongdoings...
I'm here searching for Hockey comments(as a Caps fan)
What would you suggest to Russia to become the replacement superpower now that the Untied Status is faltering? Immigration, to correct that dwindling population trend? Bring back some of the emigrees and their families? A new Silicon Valley and tax-free entrepreneurial area in Krim?
As a plausible alternative to either the US or China in terms of global leadership, Russia is outmatched and outclassed. Putin lacks a positive, constructive vision for his own country, let alone the world. Putin’s diplomatic, military and strategic successes, notably in the Middle East, cannot disguise fundamental domestic weaknesses: chronic underinvestment, overreliance on energy export revenues, poor infrastructure and social provision, endemic corruption, rising political discontent, and a pervasive, fearful sense of state lawlessness. Putin has largely defined his foreign policy in disruptive opposition to the US and the EU - by slavishly befriending China, courting Eurosceptic east Europeans, meddling in the Balkans, backing outlier regimes such as Iran, selling arms to anybody who asks, manipulating other people’s elections (and his own), and generally subverting democratic states'. My opinion: Simon Tisdall, October 19, 2019.
Dave Cockayne Do you reaIIy beIieve Putin wiII move against those oIigarchs when he works cIoseIy with said tr;be?
Rude!!! Lol. I love sailing! I live on my boat!
When was this?
2009
When you fed the donkey the WSJ you lowered yourself to the same level as your enemies. Rise above the biaS my friend
lol
...and now for some good news...
Sounds like another rich guy getting richer giving lectures that really don't say anything.
Yes, never listen to advice or learn preparedness. Just always do the same thing. That’s the American Way.
all the years of waste is catching up...
what a pile of bullocks. He not only doesn´t know USSR, he doesn´t know the modern Russia as well. Russians are not "ethnic minority". "Chechen mafia" did not hold the trade in their hands - Armenians, Azers and Jews did. And all kind of other small details that make you think this person has never ever visited Russia, USSR, Russian Empire, Ancient Rus´, whatever
This guy is pretty funny.
In Cuba criminals are put in jail not release so a hitchhiker likely to be law abiding. Not so in Democrat ruled USA. Audience seems to be woke Karens and Kens. 🤮
22222 views? yeah, right!
Elon stole ur X logo 😂
Elon never invented anything 😢
How does he imagine the territorial division of the United States after the collapse? Will California and Texas be independent countries? Will the WASP create their own country in the north?
The wasps will gi were ever they need too its irrelivent we will do what ever we must to survive.
Interestingly alot of the North has more German Americans than English Americans specicly a belt from Indiana to the Dakota's and Also Pennsylvania. This may eventually influence new boundaries in the North East and Upper Midwest.
@@davidorourke4311 Call you writ Irish?
@@wmc9722 en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/German_Americans
Me too. Emil (b.1880) left Germany for America.
The Pravda-eating donkey is worth the whole talk.
Shit! We are screwed. Mad max for USA
Housing prices will continue to head lower….he said.
This speech did not age well, ten years later.
7 Minutes in lonely and drunk sounds like Nancy Pulaski
Linwood Rapid
“Real estate will continue to lose value”
2021 - WRONG
Actually the dollar is losing value. That explains the inflation in ... everything ... including real estate.
Actually, the rise in home prices have outpaced inflation. So, home price are not high because of inflation
@@darktagmaster1861 True. Just another post-1999, post-regulatory bubble.
Try an inflation calculator, it's all downhill 😢
Bro was wrong on 😊Housing prices
An other Interesting perspective on Collapse (Well specifically America's Collapse) is from the very knowledgeable Morris Berman. His analysis traces America's wrong turn actually all the way back to the late 1600,s and debates that even that far back that America made an entire way of life based around Hustling, Hustling was emphasis over all other values, even American democracy (according to Berman) was tied to Hustling, and finally in a Country or the world with is finite resources there is only so long in time a Society can have Hustling as the supreme value. Morris Berman also connects resource constraints kicking in harder and the recent political and civil unrest in America to basically the collapse of the American Dream. I,m not saying I fully agree with Morris Berman but this is his analysis. Lastly he has an interesting website www.morrisberman.blogspot.com
@cqxmrvcoy I don't agree with morris on everything however he is right to point out that hustling and oppertunism dominating the culture as in alot of the early 21st Century world is not normal and the norm by historical standards is steady state economy and also not blind belief in Advanced Technologies or Transhumanism.