In ny experience, if you love what you buy, you forget about the money, but if you don’t like it; the only thing you remember, is the amount you spend.
Getting rid of used stuff is increasingly difficult. Dealers don't want the stuff even as a trade in because floor space is so expensive. Selling on the web is fraught. Shipping is becoming increasingly expensive. There's often not a market from stuff from boutique company. I am buying far, far less stuff now because I just can't get rid of it when I'm done with it
You're right with everything you've said Richard. The fix obviously is buy a system until you wear it out. I'm tossing brand new Bose 901's and a Stanton turntable and finally a Yamaha receiver for all the reasons you've stated. I have a system now that will follow me to the grave, no more issues of selling it.
👍30 years ago, I paid $800 for a Japanese made amplifier, Steve, and being a financially challenged younger guy, I thought, Jeez, I must be out of my freaking mind !! Well, it turns out that, to this day, I feel like it was worth every penny!😉
I've had excellent luck with using The Music Room to dispose of my used gear. You can sell it outright to them, or trade it in towards something they have for sale. Even if they won't give you cash for your gear you can still sell it through them on consignment. I've used all three of these methods. SkyFi Audio is another outfit that buys used gear, although they tend to concentrate on vintage high end equipment.
Thanks Steve. I love your videos and these topics provoke great thought. I am at a place where I’m enjoying what I have. Something old, something new, something borrowed... Yes to more shows with you and Herb!
I've learned to buy what looks and feels the best to me, because how it sounds in the store means nothing. Your room, speakers, and equipment will make whatever you are buying sound completely different than what it sounds like in the store.
My personal approach: Find reviewers that have the same taste as you and trust their reviews; try to listen to the piece at home if possible; have a few good reasons why you want to pull the trigger on the piece; and finally, when you listen to it, avoid listening to the fireworks. By "fireworks" I mean the obvious characteristics like extension, bass, etc that you perceive right away. It is a bit like meeting a new person: you might be impressed by the chit chat, the impressive stories, but whether you will like that person depends on a lot of more subtle things. I find similar traits in high-end audio. Take your time, and be patient.
Wow, find reviewers that have the same ... trainers (taste) as us and trust their reviews. Wow, go down to Manhattan; look at all the footwear walking around and uh ... yeah; if someone wearing our style of shoe goes into a certain coffee place, then we'll go in there too and if everybody else in there is wearing different shoes from ours, you know, avoid listening to the fireworks. By 'fireworks' I mean obvious things like people wearing other footwear. You know for a supposed physicist, you know Miguel is Steve's rival for Albert Einstein. What Miguel says has to be pearls of wisdom in Steve's opinion.
The worst way is to buy because a RUclipsr say its good. When you look at the biggest Hifi Channels the Product Choices are very repetitive. I wouldnt even take this Klipsch, Wharfedale, SMSL, Topping, Mission etc Gear for free that get tons of reviews. The realy good Stuff mostly dont get reviews because when you are in the scene beside this hifi youtuber, the people recommend and know the good stuff (ATC, Neumann, Strauss, CraneSong, SPL, Amphion, Genelec etc..) And this Brands dont need this promotion on youtube.
@@MMK___ ATC? Billy Woodman? You know ... in his early days Billy made a cloth dome tweeter and we had to have EL34 tubes to drive the Axtent, Radford 15 or 25, and ATC were just bigger versions of the crummy Axtent that needed you know equipment that was so expensive that nobody that Steve has ever shown of the System of the Day, even has now! But the main thing is being good at a low price.
@@MMK___ If we used a QUAD 405-2 with ATC you know ... Wow, would it sound good? No it would sound like the worst thing you ever heard! Because EL34 tubes in a Radford they're using a minimum of components and it's all artifice and stunning workmanship. So ATC ... you know, with what feeding it? Dropping names is an old trick. But if you can some system that is sweet for a low price, that's what a lot of people need.
A strategy that's worked for me is deciding that I'm interested in purchasing a product & then just keeping an eye on it. A few months later I may see that a replacement model caused the price to drop or a dealer or manufacturer is closing it out or selling a demonstrator unit. Checking websites regularly helps a lot with the process.
Thanks for the video Steve. You make some good points. However, I got a very inexpensive speaker amp and a separate cheap preamp from Schiit Audio and I could not be more pleased. I spent most of my budget on a pair of Heresy IV's and that's why I was able to get away with a low powered amp (just 10 watts) but it drives those speakers just fine.
Hello Steve, really enjoy your vids & commentaries:] I can relate, I was an audio rep before going back to college and had that same feeling with customer decisions. At the time I jumped the gun on a pair of JBL L220 Oracle speakers, negotiated with my significant other and have been enjoying them for close to 40 years. Never regretted buying that something... I lusted for....Cheers from Montreal.
25 years ago, a good friend bought an Aragon 18K Preamp. Shortly thereafter, he fell under the spell of another friend of mine who was an "audio broker/dealer" who bought and sold very exotic gear, often "tube based". Richard (dealer) took John's 18K in on trade toward a $15,000 tube integrated. Richard called me because I am a sucker for a "great deal". His words: "if you give me $600 today, the 18K is yours, I just don't feel like listing it." I still use it to this day and adore it (it has the Penny & Giles volume pot upgrade). It has never failed me. Interestingly, since it is line only, it necessitated finding a suitable "phono stage". A fellow 2 hours south of me had an Acurus (less expensive subsidiary of Aragon) P10 and it is an absolutely perfect match. Just so you know I am a fairly serious player, my turntable is a 40-year-old Linn Sondek LP12 that has gone through several clinics and upgrades (yes, Lingo and Cirkus). Oh yes, amp is Linn LK85. Money is tight these days. The gear sounds great and still works. The speakers might use some upgrading, modified Large Advents. But I am in no hurry. I really regret selling my JBL Lancer/Athena 99s from 1968. I had to replace that hideous material JBL used for surrounds (Lansaloy or some such) as it had stiffened and allowed the woofers no play. But because of the way the crossover was designed, you could not upgrade to better speaker terminals. Alas, I still miss them. Alas, also a mint pair of JBL L26 Decades in the original oak proprietary cabinets. Later, for cost considerations, JBL put the drivers in the cabinet they used for the L100. In fact they used that cabinet for the rest of the decade for such speakers as the L36 and the L50 (the last of the great JBL's).
I am not an audiophile, really, just love the music, and started to pay more attention to sound quality. Maybe because of that I really relate to the "feel and look" test you mention. I bought the LEAK Stereo and CDT mostly because I fell in love with the looks, it transported me to 60's and 70's, and just by that it made me enjoy the music even more. Great video, as always!! Congrats on you content.
Well ... the Leak Stereo 130 and Wharfedale Linton Revival you know. I had Wharfedale Glendale XP2 at the same time as the Realistic Optimus X-100 and the problem with Wharfedale was the 6 ohm load and Medium Sensitivity, 86dB SPL to 94dB and 8-ohm with the Realistic. But the Glendale was truly ... awesome but a real power guzzler and Leak 130 isn't the best match today for the new Linton, it needs far more than 45 watts, because the new Linton is still a 6 ohm speaker and has 88dB/w/m.
You are absolutely right. I am on the market right now for a pair of speakers and I would love to get the new Linton’s, with the stands. But I know they are not the best match for the Leak, so it’s not all about the “looks”, even for a non-audiophile like me.
I tried the Lintons with the LEAK Stereo but it sounded like the Lintons could do more. Paired with a refurbished Denon PMA-1060 amplifier the Lintons are really good.
I only buy based on sound, not price (within my budget of course). I found a really nice audio shop that gives me back 100% of the purchase value if I upgrade within a year after I've bought a piece of equipment. So it's hard to go wrong. Another thing I do is I always make sure I have all the money needed to buy something I want and never buy on credit.
I wouldn't use such a benefit, since a valid design should be good for about 25 years, plus I buy very carefully , intending to keep and use the products I carefully select.
@@richardelliott8352 I understand you because I too tend to keep my equipment for a long time. But this is a good way of getting into Hi-Fi and gradually upgrading to a flagship model. You can buy something cash and put money aside for a year and upgrade without losing a dime since they take back your product in exchange and give you what you paid for.
@@richardelliott8352 Everybody is the same but you know, SONY made many valid designs that were good for 2.5 years. So they had ten times more experience of buying stuff than you did with your 25 years old piece of kit.
Great content as always, thank you. After 25 years as an audio enthusiast and following the twists and turns of upgrading (Graaf, Accuphase, Unison Research, Kef, B&W, Martin Logan. … etc etc. I have finally found peace and satisfaction….. with a Lingdorf TDAI 1120 and Wharfdale Linton Heritage. (Room Perfect made a huge difference) and a vintage Pioneer CD transport. (2500 CD’s) Oh the time and money spent to arrive at something relatively inexpensive. Now it is just about the music….
After 25 years we'd expect you to know that Lyngdorf TDAI-1120 you know has a brand name similar to 'Lying', you know to tell lies. We've all heard the New York made Frontin' Audio stuff and you know as soon as we make a sound, you know a noise like Wharfedale Linton Heritage, well we know where you're coming from ... Wharfedale City. Hey ... 'Water seeks its own level' simply means quality people of integrity find other quality people of integrity and vice versa. It also means high quality finds high quality and low quality finds low quality. This is true in business and in life. It is a scientific fact: water does indeed reach its own level.
I’ve only bought stuff I have demoed. Before buying these Vandersteen Model 2Ce Signature III I listened to them for several hours before buying. Same with the Model 1 CI+. I am now addicted to Vandersteen.
This is the only problem when building your own speakers, I've just finished the medium monitors, they cost me around £800 to build, they are equivalent to a set of £3,000 monitors, but if I tried to sell them, I'd find it hard, even though I run my RUclips channel, lucky I'm not bothered, but if you want to sell equipment, alway buy good quality, so you can trade it easy, great video steve
I would never build my own speakers because the odds are not very high of getting the sound just right. I'd rather be able to return speakers that don't work for me in my space.
I am fortunate in that I have a great relationship with a dealer who allows me to loan equipment. I think this is the best option as I can hear how the item on loan integrates with the rest of my system. I do realise, however, that there has been a significant reduction in physical stores which has resulted in more reliance on reviews. Selling equipment has become more challenging as I discovered a couple of years ago. Fortunately, the dealer has contact with someone who buys second hand equipment. I realise that this means not getting the best price but it was better than nothing and meant that I didn’t have a fairly large box lying around the house.
I bought Klipsch RP600M (Gen 1) because of the good reviews and low low price on the gloss finish. It’s a fine speaker. I’ve enjoyed it. But I didn’t get what I really wanted. And now I’m thinking about my next move. Food for thought next time my itchy trigger finger hovers over the add to cart button.
I use a sub. I used to be anti-sub but ever since I connected it using the speaker jacks it’s been a game changer. Meaning, integrated amp > into sub > out of sub > speakers. It’s integration is better in my experience than using a dedicated sub / preamp rca output jack.
@@tewwywuggles with my main system I use an RME ADI-2 Pro FS R BE as my dac and preamp. I run XLR to my amp and the 1/4 outs I use the left to my left dub and the right to my right sub. Musical bliss for me.
Hi Steve. Again You have made a very good - and IMPORTANT - video.. Which can protect hifi guys, for making the same mistakes that for instans I have done, through the years...Im now 65 years.. And know the importanse of watching this video clip...Even if its - at my age - and years in living with hifi - is like getting a comb, now I have lost most of my hair..he he😊 But for newer guys, interested in hifi.. Your advices in this video is GOLD 👍🤗
Since 1980 I've had 3 systems, all of which I still have, which work and which I use whenever I want a change of sound. In the early days no demo no buy now I'm in more rarefied area of £15k to £30k a box no dealer home loan unit not considered. However I know the sound I like which makes it easier. For last 25 years have used mostly Audio Research and Krell but during the pandemic changed to Constellation Mono blocs. Have used a Linn Sondek and Magnaplanars since the 1980's, have 4 pairs of the maggies and upgraded the Linn to a Klimax over the years. The only out of the blue buy was a Transparent cabling loom which has made a huge difference. As cartridges are > £2K no demo no purchase. Quality kit lasts the only thing that died were my original Tannoys from the 1960's, 2 pairs of Kefs still work and sound interesting.
I recently upgraded all my components. Bought my Arcam SA20 amp by listening in store. Liked the sound and looks. Bought turntable and speaks by watching reviews on RUclips. Went with Elac SB283 speakers because reviews mentioned that the speakers were so good with bass they didn't need a sub and I didn't want to use a sub due to space. Reviews were right. They are incredible sounding on their own. Dual CS 618Q turntable is exactly what I was looking for but came with a 30 day return if I changed my mind. I very happy with my system but it was expensive. My wife would cut me off if she knew. Only live once and the sticker shock goes away every time I spin some vinyl.
Value for money as you will get the use of it over many years. Arcam SA20 is definitely not at wreckless price point in the Intergrated amplifier market 🙂
I always find a dealer that will allow me to test a product in my system before I buy. I spent several weeks comparing audio research and Krell amps at home - absolutely vital and I avoided a very expensive mistake.
Hi Steve , thanks for another great video . Worst thing i ever did was buying a cheap surround front , two floorstanders and a Center , because they were a bargain but did not fit the rooms where i had these a bit. For lack of money it was years later that i replaced them with a smaller 5.0 set mostly used for films but occasionally for surround discs of all sorts. In the meantime i have found a dealer about an hour from our home who even insists (!) on testing all gear at home . I am positive this leads me to good decisions , even if he does not have all gear that would be interesting for me in the shop. With him i can also discuss ideas about things he does not sell. A life with hifi is a hell of a journey in its best sense and the right dealer can be a great companion and turn into a friend . I am not naive enough to exclude other dealers, but happy to know somebody having an idea about my luxury hifi problems and able to help me solve some..
I made the mistake of buying Pioneer speakers you recommended because they were half off and you liked them. I didn't like them, couldn't sell them and gave them away for free. Expensive lesson learned
Buying gear because it was a good deal really worked for me, but I am conscious that I lucked out big times. First was a German integrate amplifier, Aaron No.1a. I was looking for a second amplifier for the summer as my 845 tube amp generated to much heat and this, unknown in America, 6 month old amp came in as a super deal, I bought it hoping it would be good enough for summer listening, I sold my 845. Not long after, we moved and my then speakers could not fill my new bigger room. A dealer/distributor that I dealt with a few times in the pass was closing shop and offered to sell me a sealed box pair of spendor sp1/2R2 for less than a 1/3 price, plus he threw in a pair of beautiful sound anchor stands. This was 13 years ago and I am still using this combination. Getting this combination was pure luck, I brought my amp at a friends place to try with his Vivid audio loudspeakers, we where both amazed how good this intergrade could play and we also agreed that the combination lacked musically, just too neutral. But combined with the big almost tube like sounding spendors (polymer diaphragms), it's musical bliss, still no plans to upgrade. The only draw back is that the front of my speakers are just under 8 feet from the back wall or what some people call front wall for the music to open to its full potential and this is our living quarters, thank goodness for my super understanding girlfriend, I really lucked out with her, but that's a story for another day.
Great topic Steve!!! I buy something mostly based on Brand name and sound quality. I am a big Technics fan, and their new audio gear is just way to expensive for me. I still have the Technics gear I bought new in 1989 and it works perfectly to this day and I use it everyday for at least 3 hours. The sad part is the new Technics gear is so expensive so I am forced to buy other brands. I am impressed with Yamaha audio so if anything happens to my Technics gear I will probably be buying Yamaha, piece by piece, But I still have the incredible Technics Speakers I bought new in 1989 and they work perfect and sound incredible. Hopefully they will last me the rest of my life!!
My AS-10 (AcousticResearch licensed acoustic suspension 2-way large bookshelf spkrsys)were solidly built 'high- Value' affordable speaker kits in 1964. Really desired the highly acclaimed AS2ax by AR but each enclosure was more than a month's pay(USAF..E-4). The AS-10s served adequately & were still beautiful dark walnuton all surfaces expt back...so The pair was totally refurbed w/UPGRADED hi-db spkrs + superTweeters & 3way crossovers. wt=~42lb ea encl. Conseratively rated to handle ~ 150wrms. My fav among the 8 pr of spkr sys because they deliver such wonderous vocals. DJ-in-TX 15:51
John Rutan in New Jersey and Frank Huang in Westchester county New York owned two of my best 'go to' stores because they were so passionate about audio and pleasing their customers that I truly believe that they would never steer me wrong. Love those guys and bought plenty of equipment from both of them.
I always liked this quote: “Extravagance in the pursuit of excellence is no vice.” The headline advertising blurb from Elac-Miracord when they introduced the first turntable priced at the then-extravagant sum of $200. I think their biggest competition, the Dual 1219, was priced at $180.
Resale difficulty is particularly true with antiques and art. AND, the ridiculously high seller commissions (to cover their overhead for the facility, etc.) wipe out any profit almost guaranteeing a loss. My experience and suggestion with any type of stereo purchase is to save and spend 90% on the speakers. Do a LOT of listening and spend months listening to all types of speakers at different!!! stores with different front ends (tube, solid state, and a mix) until one pair of speakers keeps bringing a smile to your face over and over. Spend almost your entire budget on those speakers and plan to keep them forever. Buy anything used and inexpensive for a front end to play music. In time, you can save and start the next phase of the system assembly by exploring either an integrated amp or separates. I'd lean toward integrated. They have perfected the design. It's a lot less money, and audibly I doubt you would hear the difference. Spend all of your budget on this purchase after months of listening experiences. Lastly, choose a source unit upgrade: CD or TT. CD is far less money and simple. Then, treat your room with inexpensive methods to improve the listening space. It does make a difference.
I got an open box deal on a Music Hall MMF 9.3. I'm fairly happy with it.I plan on keeping it as I would like to own at least tables. But, ideally, I'd have 3 tonearms. Or 4. Lol.
When Mark Samut was selling PASS equipment that had already been checked out at Pass Labs and re-boxed, I purchased three components that appeared to be like brand new at really great prices. Two of the three components were owned by someone who claimed he was moving but I sensed that he may have had financial difficulties which is unfortunate. He traded an XP-22 and XP-15 to Mark at what must've been a very low price. I took quick advantage by purchasing these two Pass preamps. The third component was a Pass HPA-1 headphone amplifier/Pre-Amp which had one tiny blemish on the cover but the rest of it looked new and I grabbed that up for a great price as well. I know that Pass Labs has a limited warranty but speaking to someone at the company I was told that if the component wasn't abused that they usually would repair their products at little or no charge even years later. It was a no-brainer for me to make these purchases because I figured that the resale value would hold up. I'm delighted with the sound that all three of these components reproduce. Too bad that I sold a Threshold 4000 years ago for less than $1000 when I saw one listed in excellent condition like mine was for close to $4500 two years ago.
*Your advise and opinion is very valuable Steve. Listening to you is always very fascinating. Thank you so much for sharing years of experience and knowledge, greetings from the UK.*
I love a good story behind somthing. The first hifi stereo i fell in love with was the G.A.S. Son Of Ampzilla with dahlquist dq-10s, simply because it was my dads setup in the 70's. My first acquisition was an Aragon 4004 with the matching 24k preamp. Loved the Dan D'agostinoI, "poor mans Krell" connection, still think it it the beautiful. Brutal and monolithic... could look at it forever. The stereo that keeps me dreaming is the 47 Labratory, 4706 Gaincard and the lm3886 op-amp such as the Akitika GT-102. Love the simplicity, amazing sound and fun. I like to move around when listening so open baffle, electrostatic, and omni-directional speakers are fun and interesting. Dont care much about numbers if i donr feel anything about the product!
I built a pair of TI “Overture” LM3886 amp boards built from scratch from plans published in the magazine Audio Express. Made my own circuit boards and all. Just be sure to use big heatsinks. I understand Jeff Rowland used the LM3886 amplifier modules in one of his integrated amplifiers. The LM3886 boards combined with a basic 12AU7 tube input stage are still rockin’ 10 years now in a pair of powered speakers in my office.
When I choose what to buy using my heart instead of my head, I'm much more satisfied with what I buy. I find I have less or no buyers remorse afterward.
I love the last system. I just put together a little bedroom system with a Fosi BT20a pro, FX Audio DAC-X6 mkII, WiiM Mini, and Klipsch R-41m bookshelf speakers with a Klipsch R-100sw sub, all on the restored 1937 Singer sewing machine my Grandma got for Mother's Day in 1937. I'll have to rearrange the room and make it look cool for a pic. The knob on the Fosi matches the woofers on the Klipsches and it all looks fly on the nice woodwork.
Along with prior guidance you provided some years ago, I am definitely more methodical and judicious in my purchase choices and have finally shifted into a place where I am just enjoying what I have and is wonderful to my ears. The only difference is that I have moved into headphone collecting territory, and I am enjoying that activity. Looking forward to the SoCal can-jam.
I think id like a H190 too I've heard the H120 (£2250) & I think that would be more than sufficient to drive my 89.5 sensitively Focal floorstanding speakers. However they are currently being driven by Naim 70 wpc amplifier so physiologically I would need to "upgrade" to the H190 (£3000) 🙄 The H390 is £5250 here in UK 🇬🇧 so unless I win the lottery.... & as you say then I would feel as though I needed a more premium pair of speakers to "match"
Hey Steve, thanks for putting my system up. Would you believe there’s been a few changes since? 🤷♂️I still have the LP12 though and listened to you and Herb talk about them with great interest. 👍
Thanks so much Steve. I am still searching for synergy and have way too many pieces of equipment. I appreciate your advice and experience. Schitt products I keep , they work and are reliable and go with a lot of my equipment. Now to pair with that glorious sound I am looking for.
Yes. I don't want to make ANY big mistakes buying expensive audio. I'm not a rich American audiophile. I'm a Yorkshire man in retirement. I spend as long as it takes before choosing amp, speakers, source components etc. If I'm not sure I will try to audition at home if possible. In order to free my decision making being limited by looks I don't care about looks my hi-fi lives behind large cabinet doors. Although It actually looks great by accident not through choice
You’re so right about NOT letting “a deal” be your motivation. As I have learned more about phono audio, I regret more and more not having spent a couple $100 more to get something with a good versatile phono stage. Trapped with an onboard Yamaha phono stage, I feel my sound could be better. I’d also like to be able to insert a multi-channel equalizer. Can’t with my current rig.
I absolutely buy used as much as possible--75% of the time. Used products have a track record and a well established reputation both positive and negative. Add to that, Audio hardware can last 50 years plus with a cap job in midlife. The crazy thing about doing this for 53 years is I've gotten quite good at it... deals find me. $4,200. Castle Winchester speakers for $400. immaculate condition. $2,000. JBL studio monitors for $100. Linn LP12 $200. The only time I have bought new on the basis of 3 well known RUclips reviewers-- it didn't work out. The product was the Rotel RA1592 MKll. Not only did all 3 reviewers rave about this integrated amp but, one even called it his new reference and Macintosh killer. At 350/side 4 ohms, I thought this high current amp would be able to drive my Magnepan 3.7's Not even close. What all 3 reviewers missed was a major design flaw at the input stage. To save money many manufacturer's have resorted to digital gain control at the input stage-- it costs a lot to make a quality analog gain potentiometer. There is no input gain matching feature on the Rotel resulting in a poor low level signal. The Preamp section also will not output the minimum 2 volts. A wonderful product with a well balanced, full sounding presence and an exquisite DAC that sounds better than both my Bluesound Node ll or Cambridge CNX V2.
It is vital to audition any hifi purchase in your own home, the bottom line comes down to your budget you can get a great sound out of a budget system if well matched. The other important thing is to audition gear with a cd or vinyl you know has been well produced and you know very well, these days good hifi systems don't have to break the bank manafactures know how to produce good quality hifi gear at a budget price why? that is the biggest market.
I've had quite a few systems over the years, and the biggest impression left on me was the first time I heard something really good, that was obtainable. I heard, then bought an Adcom GFP 565 Preamplifier, GFA 565 Monoblocks and a GCD 575 single drawer cd player. Phase Technology PC10.5 s. I was 20.
Steve I have a Rogue CM2 and want to pair it with a sub $1500 dac. Suggestions? I don’t want to warm a sound. I like detail , resolution and wide soundstage. I like a forward sound.
A fairly reliable indicator of a piece of equipments general quality, build and or sound wise, is the used market availability and resale value. If the item is rarely seen for resale, usually means owners are holding on to them, implying they are keepers. If the resale value is significantly close to the original sales price, another indication of good build, sound quality, whether you in particular like it's sound is another issue. These points may be obvious to some, but patience and research win the day
Pride of ownership i think its a huge part of buying audio equipment. How equipment looks and feels, particularly when it comes to speakers. They are audio furniture.
Absolutely, there are lots of great American speaking companies, Vandersteen, ZU, TEKTON, etc. Amps, Decware, Van Alstine, First Watt, etc. DAC, Schiit
I’m close to pulling the trigger on used speakers that I absolutely love the sound of. However, the lack of warranty and unknown ability to have them repaired is a big risk. I’ve had very little trouble with speakers so I wouldn’t expect to have problems but if I did I would be out a lot of money. Wish I knew what is the right way to go. These speakers are what I really want and a good value if they last. If they don’t last I’m really in trouble. So hard to know if it’s worth the risk. I can’t afford these speakers new so it’s either used or going with something of far less quality. Help please!
@@SteveGuttenbergAudiophiliac Steve, you are a legend and I really appreciate you taking the time to respond. I am following your advice on this. Thanks again.
Steve, any chance you've listened to or reviewed the Western Electric 91E Integrated Amplifier? It's a tube amp and just from the looks of it, is right up your alley.
Steve gotta ask/comment I also have the Talking Heads box set. I remember buying it two things, it was expensive, - cost more than similar sets and that it offered a multi channel mix. At the time I demurred would it be an excuse to get into multi channel. I never really did, at one time I podged together a set of amps and a bought a multichannel processor/preamp. I even had a SACD player that could deliver multi channels. It all come together sounded great but didn’t last the weekend. Maybe if I’d a dedicated theater room it would have had some staying power I don’t know man I love the TH’s, I think their music deserves the effort required for great reproduction. But the encumbrance is what I remember most. Cables and boxes everywhere. None of this stuff ever really helped to enjoy the music it was a pain in the a__. These days I listen to the Heads on an upstairs system which is straight out of the seventies, in fact I bought the advents with in a few minutes walk from CBGB’s. David B. Has written so eloquently about the sound of their venues, and Jerry went to such a great effort to do the new mix, I still think there is a chance that it could all come together and sound so fantastic and distinct from stereo. I just don’t see how now.
Lots of nuggets of knowledge here very similar to luxury watches here. Buy the thing you want, not the next best thing….so true. How easy to resell it so that you dont get stuck with all the stuff. 🍻
Thats's why I have owned Mcintosh since 64. Never have lost money buying and owning Mcintosh electronics.. I also only buy some thing I have auditioned many times. Also I worked for a Mcintosh dealer for many many years 1970 till 2004 full time and part time from 63 to 70. while going to school and working for a Radio Station.
Hi Steve - I agree with all the comments you made regarding making a purchase decision. More than once I found myself in Sound by Singer on Lex and later the 16th street store, using the same thought process you describe. Once, Andy presented an Arcam CD player for my consideration. He said it was a “sleeper”. Perhaps, but I really didn’t like the display. I couldn’t imagine staring at that for the next few years. For that reason alone I didn’t buy it.
I prefer buying used, open box, or model close out to take some of the depreciation hit, should I want to change direction later. Create a short list of options and be patient usually searching out a deal on,. Same rules apply to other hobbies when possible. I typically over research on projects. Audiophile stuff is a bit difficult as I don't know many who are into it and a showroom isn't exactly like being in the house. I have more than one expensive hobbie. So, max bang for the buck is a constant calculation as well as being realistic about how much my untrained ear can detect. Ultimately it is about kicking back back and enjoying listening to some music.
How I do it; Learn the value of patience, and after a while it's fun to wait. Sometimes the product you want hasn't been made yet, like in my case,-> choosing the right studio monitors for your tastes. I refused to take the chance of being dissapointed. I chose the speakers after at least 2 years, they were released a week before that. Perfect, and it worked out beautifully. Luckily I knew the sound of the brand, as listening in a store wasn't an option. So yes it was a small risk, but not life threatening so to speak 😅. If you can, listen before you buy! It's that simple.
Some things I’ve bought because of deals: Fluance rt82 for $80. Very happy with it as a 2nd table. Nagaoka Mp200 for $100. Extremely happy. Needed a cartridge upgrade anyways
After going for a long period of time trying to upgrade my loudspeakers and failing and then having my ML 333 ampliffer die and then going for a long period without and amp, I made an impulsive purchase for a Mono pair of 400 W Parasound JC 1’s when I found them on sale for $2000 off. I thought I remembered a very positive review by John Atkinson where he after hearing bought a pair. They sound fine but I think they are overpriced for the sale price of $16000 a pair. I believe most of the upper end electronics is way overpriced. I also think many audio dealers don’t serve the customers well.
US Audio Mart seems to be a graveyard for expensive gear that I personally have never heard about. How do you decide to buy an expensive piece of used gear. Yikes!
Please consider building your own gear. I started a little over two years ago and I can't stop. There are so many great kits available to get you started. I was getting pretty frustrated with the high price of audio gear. There are simply too many levels of distribution with too many players that need a slice of the pie. You eliminate a huge amount of this by building an amplifier, for example, from a kit. If you think you can't do it, you are wrong. BUT, you have to want to do it. I'm on my 16th and 17th build. I'm currently building a diyaudio First Watt F4 clone and a pair of CSS Audio Criton 1TD-X speakers. You can do this! D
I had been researching speakers for around nine months. I was days away from going into my local audio shop to listen to some Focals, when I got a notification from Adorama was having a deal on the Definitive Technology Demand 17’s that were about 75% off. I hadn’t heard of them but did some quick research and Jaap from The Alpha Audio liked them a lot. Peachtree also had a deal on the Nova 300. I pulled the trigger on both. I set them up and they sucked. I burned them both in for a couple days. Still crap. I brought in my thrift store AVR and the Demand 17’s suddenly opened up and sang. They are a crazy great deal. I sent the Nova 300 back and am planning on getting a NuPrime IDA8, an amp Jaap also liked. The Demand 17’s appear to still be on sale and I can highly, highly recommend for the price for the pair. Also check out The Alpha Audio channel for the reviews.
Being a South African Audiophile we can barely afford any high-end equipment new with our currency trading at 18 ZAR to the USD. Can you as an American imagine paying 18 times what you currently do for anything you can buy in the US? Luckily we have a few local sites that sell used equipment in mint condition. If it wasn't for that I would probably never own anything audiophile-grade in my life.
I can't afford what i like - so i have a LOT of DIY in my system. There's really good bang for the buck when you can build your own equipment - plus it's fun! (Thank you Mr. Pass!)
Steve, there is a vendor here in Oz that is selling the Magico A9, their flagship speaker, for 1.5 million AUD. I normally avoid the class war stuff, but you can still buy a HOUSE for that number almost anywhere outside hotspots in Sydney and Melbourne. Aspirational ? Sure, for the lucky few who win Lotto - for the rest, that is an insane choice.
Service on a component is often a pain in the bum when you live in Australia. Overseas shipping is very expensive and most brands don’t have service possibilities over here.
When I was 25, I bought a car of 50/k. I'd better had bought a 50/k audio system, as it would still have been here. Better buy really good gear, with the help of a trusted audio shop, and enjoy it for decades. Of course, over time sometimes gear is changed, but I have never worried about resale value. In fact, I just traded in speakers and they have been nearly free to own, though I had them some 20 years.
I could have saved a fortune by getting what I really want instead of what I can afford. Now I really stretch to what I really want and don’t have to move stuff on as much.
Yes... have seen so many ultra bargain seekers. They keep looking for that $200 bookshelf that sounds like $2000 pair they heard in store. Or similar for amp. Then selling those speakers... lucky if they get 50 bucks. So after 10 cheap things... they could have bought that pair they really wanted.
May I be so bold as to suggest an idea for an upcoming Steve & Herb episode? If you could time travel and go back in your audio lifetime what pieces of gear you sold do you wish you still had? Not only from a sound and nostalgia perspective but also a value one. I could replace most of the items I personally regret selling but the cost is absolutely prohibitive, i.e., McIntosh C-22 preamp, MC-2505 power, MR-78 tuner, Altec Lansing A7-5 loudspeakers, double stacked Quad ELS-57s, as an example. I was young, foolish and had no idea at the time and it was the same with my two Mercedes Benz 190SL’s or my 1963 Porsche 356B Cabrio. It was the 1970s and they were cheap then. but damn near unattainable now except for the wealthy.
@@keithmoriyama5421 Who would have thought how these items would become so collectible. I do have a pair of Altec Lansing 846a Valencia’s I bought on FacePlant Marketplace that I got for a great price and fixed up though so I do have that reminder somewhat of my glory days.
Sorry, no i have not TheyI do not appear to have presence in the US or Europe, I guess that's why I've never heard of them. If you own them and enjoy them that's great!
Hi Steve, Enjoying your videos! I took was once a retail sales person! Wanted to ask you about the subject of either Isolation Transformers or Line Conditioners. Are you familiar with a company that was back a few years ago called Silver Circle Audio? Huge Isolation device sold for anywhere from around $5k to $11k for the biggest one called the Tchaki 6 named after Tchaikovsky etc. Dave Stanard, I think was the designer! Thank you, larry
Thanks for watching, no I haven't had that much experience with conditioners or transformers. Meaning they haven't made a difference for the better in the sound of my system over many many years when I've tried them.
@@SteveGuttenbergAudiophiliac I think I agree with you up till this point! This Tchaik6 is something very different from anything I have ever tried in my system! It definitely does something to improve the Digital part of my system! Though, I'm not sure about my Power Amps! Was told probably would be best to leave them plugged into the wall! Thank you anyway, larr
In ny experience, if you love what you buy, you forget about the money, but if you don’t like it; the only thing you remember, is the amount you spend.
Getting rid of used stuff is increasingly difficult. Dealers don't want the stuff even as a trade in because floor space is so expensive. Selling on the web is fraught. Shipping is becoming increasingly expensive. There's often not a market from stuff from boutique company. I am buying far, far less stuff now because I just can't get rid of it when I'm done with it
You're right with everything you've said Richard. The fix obviously is buy a system until you wear it out. I'm tossing brand new Bose 901's and a Stanton turntable and finally a Yamaha receiver for all the reasons you've stated. I have a system now that will follow me to the grave, no more issues of selling it.
👍30 years ago,
I paid $800 for a Japanese made amplifier, Steve, and being a financially challenged younger guy,
I thought, Jeez,
I must be out of my freaking mind !!
Well, it turns out that, to this day,
I feel like it was worth every penny!😉
I’ve sold lots of hifi on local Craigslist.
I've had excellent luck with using The Music Room to dispose of my used gear. You can sell it outright to them, or trade it in towards something they have for sale. Even if they won't give you cash for your gear you can still sell it through them on consignment. I've used all three of these methods. SkyFi Audio is another outfit that buys used gear, although they tend to concentrate on vintage high end equipment.
@@geraldschrader8511The Music Room in Colorado is fantastic!!
Do what feels good. Live and learn. You'll make mistakes but you'll also learn more by doing than by reading web pages.
Thanks Steve. I love your videos and these topics provoke great thought. I am at a place where I’m enjoying what I have. Something old, something new, something borrowed...
Yes to more shows with you and Herb!
I've learned to buy what looks and feels the best to me, because how it sounds in the store means nothing. Your room, speakers, and equipment will make whatever you are buying sound completely different than what it sounds like in the store.
My personal approach: Find reviewers that have the same taste as you and trust their reviews; try to listen to the piece at home if possible; have a few good reasons why you want to pull the trigger on the piece; and finally, when you listen to it, avoid listening to the fireworks. By "fireworks" I mean the obvious characteristics like extension, bass, etc that you perceive right away. It is a bit like meeting a new person: you might be impressed by the chit chat, the impressive stories, but whether you will like that person depends on a lot of more subtle things. I find similar traits in high-end audio. Take your time, and be patient.
Wow, find reviewers that have the same ... trainers (taste) as us and trust their reviews. Wow, go down to Manhattan; look at all the footwear walking around and uh ... yeah; if someone wearing our style of shoe goes into a certain coffee place, then we'll go in there too and if everybody else in there is wearing different shoes from ours, you know, avoid listening to the fireworks. By 'fireworks' I mean obvious things like people wearing other footwear. You know for a supposed physicist, you know Miguel is Steve's rival for Albert Einstein. What Miguel says has to be pearls of wisdom in Steve's opinion.
@@keplermission I find your foot fetish rather fascinating.
The worst way is to buy because a RUclipsr say its good. When you look at the biggest Hifi Channels the Product Choices are very repetitive. I wouldnt even take this Klipsch, Wharfedale, SMSL, Topping, Mission etc Gear for free that get tons of reviews. The realy good Stuff mostly dont get reviews because when you are in the scene beside this hifi youtuber, the people recommend and know the good stuff (ATC, Neumann, Strauss, CraneSong, SPL, Amphion, Genelec etc..) And this Brands dont need this promotion on youtube.
@@MMK___ ATC? Billy Woodman? You know ... in his early days Billy made a cloth dome tweeter and we had to have EL34 tubes to drive the Axtent, Radford 15 or 25, and ATC were just bigger versions of the crummy Axtent that needed you know equipment that was so expensive that nobody that Steve has ever shown of the System of the Day, even has now! But the main thing is being good at a low price.
@@MMK___ If we used a QUAD 405-2 with ATC you know ... Wow, would it sound good? No it would sound like the worst thing you ever heard! Because EL34 tubes in a Radford they're using a minimum of components and it's all artifice and stunning workmanship. So ATC ... you know, with what feeding it? Dropping names is an old trick. But if you can some system that is sweet for a low price, that's what a lot of people need.
A strategy that's worked for me is deciding that I'm interested in purchasing a product & then just keeping an eye on it. A few months later I may see that a replacement model caused the price to drop or a dealer or manufacturer is closing it out or selling a demonstrator unit. Checking websites regularly helps a lot with the process.
Good way to end the week Steve ! As usual, very insightful discussion. Awesome multiple viewer systems segment too.
Oh that’s awesome, I always enjoy seeing Herb on your show!
Thanks for the video Steve. You make some good points. However, I got a very inexpensive speaker amp and a separate cheap preamp from Schiit Audio and I could not be more pleased. I spent most of my budget on a pair of Heresy IV's and that's why I was able to get away with a low powered amp (just 10 watts) but it drives those speakers just fine.
Hello Steve, really enjoy your vids & commentaries:] I can relate, I was an audio rep before going back to college and had that same feeling with customer decisions. At the time I jumped the gun on a pair of JBL L220 Oracle speakers, negotiated with my significant other and have been enjoying them for close to 40 years. Never regretted buying that something... I lusted for....Cheers from Montreal.
25 years ago, a good friend bought an Aragon 18K Preamp. Shortly thereafter, he fell under the spell of another friend of mine who was an "audio broker/dealer" who bought and sold very exotic gear, often "tube based". Richard (dealer) took John's 18K in on trade toward a $15,000 tube integrated. Richard called me because I am a sucker for a "great deal". His words: "if you give me $600 today, the 18K is yours, I just don't feel like listing it." I still use it to this day and adore it (it has the Penny & Giles volume pot upgrade). It has never failed me. Interestingly, since it is line only, it necessitated finding a suitable "phono stage". A fellow 2 hours south of me had an Acurus (less expensive subsidiary of Aragon) P10 and it is an absolutely perfect match. Just so you know I am a fairly serious player, my turntable is a 40-year-old Linn Sondek LP12 that has gone through several clinics and upgrades (yes, Lingo and Cirkus). Oh yes, amp is Linn LK85. Money is tight these days. The gear sounds great and still works. The speakers might use some upgrading, modified Large Advents. But I am in no hurry. I really regret selling my JBL Lancer/Athena 99s from 1968. I had to replace that hideous material JBL used for surrounds (Lansaloy or some such) as it had stiffened and allowed the woofers no play. But because of the way the crossover was designed, you could not upgrade to better speaker terminals. Alas, I still miss them. Alas, also a mint pair of JBL L26 Decades in the original oak proprietary cabinets. Later, for cost considerations, JBL put the drivers in the cabinet they used for the L100. In fact they used that cabinet for the rest of the decade for such speakers as the L36 and the L50 (the last of the great JBL's).
I am not an audiophile, really, just love the music, and started to pay more attention to sound quality. Maybe because of that I really relate to the "feel and look" test you mention. I bought the LEAK Stereo and CDT mostly because I fell in love with the looks, it transported me to 60's and 70's, and just by that it made me enjoy the music even more. Great video, as always!! Congrats on you content.
Well ... the Leak Stereo 130 and Wharfedale Linton Revival you know. I had Wharfedale Glendale XP2 at the same time as the Realistic Optimus X-100 and the problem with Wharfedale was the 6 ohm load and Medium Sensitivity, 86dB SPL to 94dB and 8-ohm with the Realistic. But the Glendale was truly ... awesome but a real power guzzler and Leak 130 isn't the best match today for the new Linton, it needs far more than 45 watts, because the new Linton is still a 6 ohm speaker and has 88dB/w/m.
You are absolutely right. I am on the market right now for a pair of speakers and I would love to get the new Linton’s, with the stands. But I know they are not the best match for the Leak, so it’s not all about the “looks”, even for a non-audiophile like me.
What you have described here is a lover of music who is paying attention to sound quality. 'Audio' recorded sound, Phile- lover of (Latin)
I tried the Lintons with the LEAK Stereo but it sounded like the Lintons could do more. Paired with a refurbished Denon PMA-1060 amplifier the Lintons are really good.
Always get what you want because in the end you make a full circle and end up getting what you want after you get what you settled for.
I only buy based on sound, not price (within my budget of course). I found a really nice audio shop that gives me back 100% of the purchase value if I upgrade within a year after I've bought a piece of equipment. So it's hard to go wrong. Another thing I do is I always make sure I have all the money needed to buy something I want and never buy on credit.
My crummy comment keeps getting deleted! My crummy comment.
I wouldn't use such a benefit, since a valid design should be good for about 25 years, plus I buy very carefully , intending to keep and use the products I carefully select.
@@richardelliott8352 I understand you because I too tend to keep my equipment for a long time. But this is a good way of getting into Hi-Fi and gradually upgrading to a flagship model. You can buy something cash and put money aside for a year and upgrade without losing a dime since they take back your product in exchange and give you what you paid for.
@@richardelliott8352 Everybody is the same but you know, SONY made many valid designs that were good for 2.5 years. So they had ten times more experience of buying stuff than you did with your 25 years old piece of kit.
Which audio shop is it that gives you back 100% with in a year?
Great content as always, thank you. After 25 years as an audio enthusiast and following the twists and turns of upgrading (Graaf, Accuphase, Unison Research, Kef, B&W, Martin Logan. … etc etc. I have finally found peace and satisfaction….. with a Lingdorf TDAI 1120 and Wharfdale Linton Heritage. (Room Perfect made a huge difference) and a vintage Pioneer CD transport. (2500 CD’s)
Oh the time and money spent to arrive at something relatively inexpensive. Now it is just about the music….
After 25 years we'd expect you to know that Lyngdorf TDAI-1120 you know has a brand name similar to 'Lying', you know to tell lies. We've all heard the New York made Frontin' Audio stuff and you know as soon as we make a sound, you know a noise like Wharfedale Linton Heritage, well we know where you're coming from ... Wharfedale City. Hey ... 'Water seeks its own level' simply means quality people of integrity find other quality people of integrity and vice versa. It also means high quality finds high quality and low quality finds low quality. This is true in business and in life. It is a scientific fact: water does indeed reach its own level.
I’ve only bought stuff I have demoed. Before buying these Vandersteen Model 2Ce Signature III I listened to them for several hours before buying. Same with the Model 1 CI+. I am now addicted to Vandersteen.
This is the only problem when building your own speakers, I've just finished the medium monitors, they cost me around £800 to build, they are equivalent to a set of £3,000 monitors, but if I tried to sell them, I'd find it hard, even though I run my RUclips channel, lucky I'm not bothered, but if you want to sell equipment, alway buy good quality, so you can trade it easy, great video steve
I would never build my own speakers because the odds are not very high of getting the sound just right. I'd rather be able to return speakers that don't work for me in my space.
I am fortunate in that I have a great relationship with a dealer who allows me to loan equipment. I think this is the best option as I can hear how the item on loan integrates with the rest of my system. I do realise, however, that there has been a significant reduction in physical stores which has resulted in more reliance on reviews.
Selling equipment has become more challenging as I discovered a couple of years ago. Fortunately, the dealer has contact with someone who buys second hand equipment. I realise that this means not getting the best price but it was better than nothing and meant that I didn’t have a fairly large box lying around the house.
I bought Klipsch RP600M (Gen 1) because of the good reviews and low low price on the gloss finish. It’s a fine speaker. I’ve enjoyed it. But I didn’t get what I really wanted. And now I’m thinking about my next move. Food for thought next time my itchy trigger finger hovers over the add to cart button.
I added a sunwoofer to my rp600m's and made a huge difference. Just a suggestion.
What would you say was missing?
@Soltballs7608 for me it was size and depth since it was in a large area.
I use a sub. I used to be anti-sub but ever since I connected it using the speaker jacks it’s been a game changer. Meaning, integrated amp > into sub > out of sub > speakers. It’s integration is better in my experience than using a dedicated sub / preamp rca output jack.
@@tewwywuggles with my main system I use an RME ADI-2 Pro FS R BE as my dac and preamp. I run XLR to my amp and the 1/4 outs I use the left to my left dub and the right to my right sub. Musical bliss for me.
Hi Steve. Again You have made a very good - and IMPORTANT - video.. Which can protect hifi guys, for making the same mistakes that for instans I have done, through the years...Im now 65 years.. And know the importanse of watching this video clip...Even if its - at my age - and years in living with hifi - is like getting a comb, now I have lost most of my hair..he he😊 But for newer guys, interested in hifi.. Your advices in this video is GOLD 👍🤗
Having a relationship with a good dealer is the key - who will lend you gear and help you develop a taste in fine quality hi-fi.
And also help you build a system with synergy.
in your viewers system from Santa Rosa: Fyne Audio F703's are very nice sounding/looking speakers.
Since 1980 I've had 3 systems, all of which I still have, which work and which I use whenever I want a change of sound. In the early days no demo no buy now I'm in more rarefied area of £15k to £30k a box no dealer home loan unit not considered. However I know the sound I like which makes it easier. For last 25 years have used mostly Audio Research and Krell but during the pandemic changed to Constellation Mono blocs. Have used a Linn Sondek and Magnaplanars since the 1980's, have 4 pairs of the maggies and upgraded the Linn to a Klimax over the years. The only out of the blue buy was a Transparent cabling loom which has made a huge difference. As cartridges are > £2K no demo no purchase. Quality kit lasts the only thing that died were my original Tannoys from the 1960's, 2 pairs of Kefs still work and sound interesting.
I recently upgraded all my components. Bought my Arcam SA20 amp by listening in store. Liked the sound and looks. Bought turntable and speaks by watching reviews on RUclips. Went with Elac SB283 speakers because reviews mentioned that the speakers were so good with bass they didn't need a sub and I didn't want to use a sub due to space. Reviews were right. They are incredible sounding on their own. Dual CS 618Q turntable is exactly what I was looking for but came with a 30 day return if I changed my mind. I very happy with my system but it was expensive. My wife would cut me off if she knew. Only live once and the sticker shock goes away every time I spin some vinyl.
Value for money as you will get the use of it over many years.
Arcam SA20 is definitely not at wreckless price point in the Intergrated amplifier market 🙂
Sage advice as always! Thanks for all you do. 🥰
I always find a dealer that will allow me to test a product in my system before I buy. I spent several weeks comparing audio research and Krell amps at home - absolutely vital and I avoided a very expensive mistake.
Hi Steve , thanks for another great video .
Worst thing i ever did was buying a cheap surround front , two floorstanders and a Center , because they were a bargain but did not fit the rooms where i had these a bit.
For lack of money it was years later that i replaced them with a smaller 5.0 set mostly used for films but occasionally for surround discs of all sorts.
In the meantime i have found a dealer about an hour from our home who even insists (!) on testing all gear at home . I am positive this leads me to good decisions , even if he does not have all gear that would be interesting for me in the shop. With him i can also discuss ideas about things he does not sell. A life with hifi is a hell of a journey in its best sense and the right dealer can be a great companion and turn into a friend . I am not naive enough to exclude other dealers, but happy to know somebody having an idea about my luxury hifi problems and able to help me solve some..
I made the mistake of buying Pioneer speakers you recommended because they were half off and you liked them. I didn't like them, couldn't sell them and gave them away for free. Expensive lesson learned
I find when upgrading equipment. I need to spend a minimum of 3 times what I already have. Or it's more of a sideways move not better just different
yes i agree
Buying gear because it was a good deal really worked for me, but I am conscious that I lucked out big times. First was a German integrate amplifier, Aaron No.1a. I was looking for a second amplifier for the summer as my 845 tube amp generated to much heat and this, unknown in America, 6 month old amp came in as a super deal, I bought it hoping it would be good enough for summer listening, I sold my 845. Not long after, we moved and my then speakers could not fill my new bigger room. A dealer/distributor that I dealt with a few times in the pass was closing shop and offered to sell me a sealed box pair of spendor sp1/2R2 for less than a 1/3 price, plus he threw in a pair of beautiful sound anchor stands. This was 13 years ago and I am still using this combination. Getting this combination was pure luck, I brought my amp at a friends place to try with his Vivid audio loudspeakers, we where both amazed how good this intergrade could play and we also agreed that the combination lacked musically, just too neutral. But combined with the big almost tube like sounding spendors (polymer diaphragms), it's musical bliss, still no plans to upgrade. The only draw back is that the front of my speakers are just under 8 feet from the back wall or what some people call front wall for the music to open to its full potential and this is our living quarters, thank goodness for my super understanding girlfriend, I really lucked out with her, but that's a story for another day.
Great topic Steve!!! I buy something mostly based on Brand name and sound quality. I am a big Technics fan, and their new audio gear is just way to expensive for me. I still have the Technics gear I bought new in 1989 and it works perfectly to this day and I use it everyday for at least 3 hours. The sad part is the new Technics gear is so expensive so I am forced to buy other brands. I am impressed with Yamaha audio so if anything happens to my Technics gear I will probably be buying Yamaha, piece by piece, But I still have the incredible Technics Speakers I bought new in 1989 and they work perfect and sound incredible. Hopefully they will last me the rest of my life!!
My AS-10 (AcousticResearch licensed acoustic suspension 2-way large bookshelf spkrsys)were solidly built 'high-
Value' affordable speaker kits in 1964. Really desired the highly acclaimed AS2ax by AR but each enclosure was more than a month's pay(USAF..E-4).
The AS-10s served adequately & were still beautiful dark walnuton all surfaces expt back...so The pair was totally refurbed w/UPGRADED hi-db spkrs + superTweeters & 3way crossovers. wt=~42lb ea encl. Conseratively rated to handle ~ 150wrms. My fav among the 8 pr of spkr sys because they deliver such wonderous vocals.
DJ-in-TX 15:51
What are those acoustic panels behind your equipment? Who makes them? Cost? How well do they work?
GIK Acoustics, around $60 each. They work, but not as I use them for visual interest. You need a lot of these or any room treatment to "work."
John Rutan in New Jersey and Frank Huang in Westchester county New York owned two of my best 'go to' stores because they were so passionate about audio and pleasing their customers that I truly believe that they would never steer me wrong. Love those guys and bought plenty of equipment from both of them.
I always liked this quote: “Extravagance in the pursuit of excellence is no vice.” The headline advertising blurb from Elac-Miracord when they introduced the first turntable priced at the then-extravagant sum of $200. I think their biggest competition, the Dual 1219, was priced at $180.
What a great quote! For people like us it's the truth.
Resale difficulty is particularly true with antiques and art. AND, the ridiculously high seller commissions (to cover their overhead for the facility, etc.) wipe out any profit almost guaranteeing a loss. My experience and suggestion with any type of stereo purchase is to save and spend 90% on the speakers. Do a LOT of listening and spend months listening to all types of speakers at different!!! stores with different front ends (tube, solid state, and a mix) until one pair of speakers keeps bringing a smile to your face over and over. Spend almost your entire budget on those speakers and plan to keep them forever. Buy anything used and inexpensive for a front end to play music. In time, you can save and start the next phase of the system assembly by exploring either an integrated amp or separates. I'd lean toward integrated. They have perfected the design. It's a lot less money, and audibly I doubt you would hear the difference. Spend all of your budget on this purchase after months of listening experiences. Lastly, choose a source unit upgrade: CD or TT. CD is far less money and simple. Then, treat your room with inexpensive methods to improve the listening space. It does make a difference.
Good points Steve! I'm on the hunt for an upgrade for to my old '86 Technics SLDL1 linear tracking turntable.
I got an open box deal on a Music Hall MMF 9.3. I'm fairly happy with it.I plan on keeping it as I would like to own at least tables. But, ideally, I'd have 3 tonearms. Or 4. Lol.
When Mark Samut was selling PASS equipment that had already been checked out at Pass Labs and re-boxed, I purchased three components that appeared to be like brand new at really great prices. Two of the three components were owned by someone who claimed he was moving but I sensed that he may have had financial difficulties which is unfortunate. He traded an XP-22 and XP-15 to Mark at what must've been a very low price. I took quick advantage by purchasing these two Pass preamps. The third component was a Pass HPA-1 headphone amplifier/Pre-Amp which had one tiny blemish on the cover but the rest of it looked new and I grabbed that up for a great price as well. I know that Pass Labs has a limited warranty but speaking to someone at the company I was told that if the component wasn't abused that they usually would repair their products at little or no charge even years later. It was a no-brainer for me to make these purchases because I figured that the resale value would hold up. I'm delighted with the sound that all three of these components reproduce. Too bad that I sold a Threshold 4000 years ago for less than $1000 when I saw one listed in excellent condition like mine was for close to $4500 two years ago.
*Your advise and opinion is very valuable Steve. Listening to you is always very fascinating. Thank you so much for sharing years of experience and knowledge, greetings from the UK.*
Thanks for watching!
This is a "must pay attention to" video for newcomers and even seasoned buyers. Thank you Steve!
I love a good story behind somthing. The first hifi stereo i fell in love with was the G.A.S. Son Of Ampzilla with dahlquist dq-10s, simply because it was my dads setup in the 70's.
My first acquisition was an Aragon 4004 with the matching 24k preamp. Loved the Dan D'agostinoI, "poor mans Krell" connection, still think it it the beautiful. Brutal and monolithic... could look at it forever.
The stereo that keeps me dreaming is the 47 Labratory, 4706 Gaincard and the lm3886 op-amp such as the Akitika GT-102. Love the simplicity, amazing sound and fun.
I like to move around when listening so open baffle, electrostatic, and omni-directional speakers are fun and interesting.
Dont care much about numbers if i donr feel anything about the product!
I built a pair of TI “Overture” LM3886 amp boards built from scratch from plans published in the magazine Audio Express. Made my own circuit boards and all. Just be sure to use big heatsinks. I understand Jeff Rowland used the LM3886 amplifier modules in one of his integrated amplifiers. The LM3886 boards combined with a basic 12AU7 tube input stage are still rockin’ 10 years now in a pair of powered speakers in my office.
You are the best out there by far.
Thanks!!!!
When I choose what to buy using my heart instead of my head, I'm much more satisfied with what I buy. I find I have less or no buyers remorse afterward.
The Music Room in Colorado is fantastic for used or new!!
I love the last system. I just put together a little bedroom system with a Fosi BT20a pro, FX Audio DAC-X6 mkII, WiiM Mini, and Klipsch R-41m bookshelf speakers with a Klipsch R-100sw sub, all on the restored 1937 Singer sewing machine my Grandma got for Mother's Day in 1937. I'll have to rearrange the room and make it look cool for a pic. The knob on the Fosi matches the woofers on the Klipsches and it all looks fly on the nice woodwork.
Along with prior guidance you provided some years ago, I am definitely more methodical and judicious in my purchase choices and have finally shifted into a place where I am just enjoying what I have and is wonderful to my ears. The only difference is that I have moved into headphone collecting territory, and I am enjoying that activity. Looking forward to the SoCal can-jam.
I wanted a Hegel H190 but I got such a good deal on a Hegel H390 I bought that instead. The only problem with it is now I need better speakers.😊😊
I think id like a H190 too
I've heard the H120 (£2250) & I think that would be more than sufficient to drive my 89.5 sensitively Focal floorstanding speakers.
However they are currently being driven by Naim 70 wpc amplifier so physiologically I would need to "upgrade" to the H190 (£3000) 🙄
The H390 is £5250 here in UK 🇬🇧 so unless I win the lottery.... & as you say then I would feel as though I needed a more premium pair of speakers to "match"
That is so very true Steve ! Caveat Emptor; please give careful thought to each purchase to facilitate the most satisfying result !!
Great video! One day I’ll pull the trigger and your advice is so helpful.
Hey Steve, thanks for putting my system up. Would you believe there’s been a few changes since? 🤷♂️I still have the LP12 though and listened to you and Herb talk about them with great interest. 👍
Hello Steve, long time follower ❤️ ✌️ and 🎶
Great show Steve!🙂 I like the multiple VSOTD's supplements and to Bring Herb on the show is a very sound idea!
Seems to hardly be a used market for speakers unless it’s super old surrounds rotting type stuff
Thanks so much Steve. I am still searching for synergy and have way too many pieces of equipment. I appreciate your advice and experience. Schitt products I keep , they work and are reliable and go with a lot of my equipment. Now to pair with that glorious sound I am looking for.
Yes. I don't want to make ANY big mistakes buying expensive audio. I'm not a rich American audiophile. I'm a Yorkshire man in retirement. I spend as long as it takes before choosing amp, speakers, source components etc.
If I'm not sure I will try to audition at home if possible.
In order to free my decision making being limited by looks I don't care about looks my hi-fi lives behind large cabinet doors. Although It actually looks great by accident not through choice
You’re so right about NOT letting “a deal” be your motivation. As I have learned more about phono audio, I regret more and more not having spent a couple $100 more to get something with a good versatile phono stage. Trapped with an onboard Yamaha phono stage, I feel my sound could be better. I’d also like to be able to insert a multi-channel equalizer. Can’t with my current rig.
Spot on and necessary video Steve! Thanks for providing this valuable content
wow the guy with the nola speakers can adopt me anytime lol
😂 Thanks. I’m very happy with them. I bought them from a friend who moved on to Linkwitz.
Great viewer systems of the Day! Seems that you're getting really great music systems to talk about lately.
I absolutely buy used as much as possible--75% of the time.
Used products have a track record and a well established reputation both positive and negative. Add to that, Audio hardware can last 50 years plus with a cap job in midlife. The crazy thing about doing this for 53 years is I've gotten quite good at it... deals find me. $4,200. Castle Winchester speakers for $400. immaculate condition. $2,000. JBL studio monitors for $100. Linn LP12 $200.
The only time I have bought new on the basis of 3 well known RUclips reviewers-- it didn't work out. The product was the Rotel RA1592 MKll. Not only did all 3 reviewers rave about this integrated amp but, one even called it his new reference and Macintosh killer. At 350/side 4 ohms, I thought this high current amp would be able to drive my Magnepan 3.7's Not even close. What all 3 reviewers missed was a major design flaw at the input stage. To save money many manufacturer's have resorted to digital gain control at the input stage-- it costs a lot to make a quality analog gain potentiometer. There is no input gain matching feature on the Rotel resulting in a poor low level signal. The Preamp section also will not output the minimum 2 volts. A wonderful product with a well balanced, full sounding presence and an exquisite DAC that sounds better than both my Bluesound Node ll or Cambridge CNX V2.
It is vital to audition any hifi purchase in your own home, the bottom line comes down to your budget you can get a great sound out of a budget system if well matched. The other important thing is to audition gear with a cd or vinyl you know has been well produced and you know very well, these days good hifi systems don't have to break the bank manafactures know how to produce good quality hifi gear at a budget price why? that is the biggest market.
I've had quite a few systems over the years, and the biggest impression left on me was the first time I heard something really good, that was obtainable. I heard, then bought an Adcom GFP 565 Preamplifier, GFA 565 Monoblocks and a GCD 575 single drawer cd player. Phase Technology PC10.5 s.
I was 20.
Helps to have a trial period, so you can demo it in your system before you decide.
Steve I have a Rogue CM2 and want to pair it with a sub $1500 dac. Suggestions? I don’t want to warm a sound. I like detail , resolution and wide soundstage. I like a forward sound.
Chord DACs
I loved my Apogees Scintillas 🙂
RME ADI-2 PRO FS R BE, ZU Omen Def Supreme mk 1 speakers, 2 RSL 12S subwoofers one for right channel one for left. Absolutely love this set up.
A fairly reliable indicator of a piece of equipments general quality, build and or sound wise, is the used market availability and resale value.
If the item is rarely seen for resale, usually means owners are holding on to them, implying they are keepers.
If the resale value is significantly close to the original sales price, another indication of good build, sound quality, whether you in particular like it's sound is another issue.
These points may be obvious to some, but patience and research win the day
Pride of ownership i think its a huge part of buying audio equipment. How equipment looks and feels, particularly when it comes to speakers. They are audio furniture.
Is "Made in USA" audiophile level equipment a thing? I was wondering if it's possible to get a speaker, amp and dac system all made in USA.
Absolutely, there are lots of great American speaking companies, Vandersteen, ZU, TEKTON, etc. Amps, Decware, Van Alstine, First Watt, etc. DAC, Schiit
I’m close to pulling the trigger on used speakers that I absolutely love the sound of. However, the lack of warranty and unknown ability to have them repaired is a big risk. I’ve had very little trouble with speakers so I wouldn’t expect to have problems but if I did I would be out a lot of money. Wish I knew what is the right way to go. These speakers are what I really want and a good value if they last. If they don’t last I’m really in trouble. So hard to know if it’s worth the risk. I can’t afford these speakers new so it’s either used or going with something of far less quality. Help please!
I don't blame you, and you sound like a risk averse person so don't do it! There's other fish in the sea.
@@SteveGuttenbergAudiophiliac Steve, you are a legend and I really appreciate you taking the time to respond. I am following your advice on this. Thanks again.
Love your work brother.
Steve, any chance you've listened to or reviewed the Western Electric 91E Integrated Amplifier? It's a tube amp and just from the looks of it, is right up your alley.
Sorry I have not, I have no plans to. But for a lot less money the Decware Sarah 300 B is awfully good.
@@SteveGuttenbergAudiophiliac Thanks Steve, this piece just seemed to be something you'd be curious about.
Steve gotta ask/comment I also have the Talking Heads box set. I remember buying it two things, it was expensive, - cost more than similar sets and that it offered a multi channel mix. At the time I demurred would it be an excuse to get into multi channel. I never really did, at one time I podged together a set of amps and a bought a multichannel processor/preamp. I even had a SACD player that could deliver multi channels. It all come together sounded great but didn’t last the weekend. Maybe if I’d a dedicated theater room it would have had some staying power I don’t know man I love the TH’s, I think their music deserves the effort required for great reproduction. But the encumbrance is what I remember most. Cables and boxes everywhere. None of this stuff ever really helped to enjoy the music it was a pain in the a__. These days I listen to the Heads on an upstairs system which is straight out of the seventies, in fact I bought the advents with in a few minutes walk from CBGB’s. David B. Has written so eloquently about the sound of their venues, and Jerry went to such a great effort to do the new mix, I still think there is a chance that it could all come together and sound so fantastic and distinct from stereo. I just don’t see how now.
Lots of nuggets of knowledge here very similar to luxury watches here.
Buy the thing you want, not the next best thing….so true.
How easy to resell it so that you dont get stuck with all the stuff.
🍻
You are the best Steve. Love from Malaysia.
Thats's why I have owned Mcintosh since 64. Never have lost money buying and owning Mcintosh electronics.. I also only buy some thing I have auditioned many times. Also I worked for a Mcintosh dealer for many many years 1970 till 2004 full time and part time from 63 to 70. while going to school and working for a Radio Station.
Hi Steve - I agree with all the comments you made regarding making a purchase decision. More than once I found myself in Sound by Singer on Lex and later the 16th street store, using the same thought process you describe. Once, Andy presented an Arcam CD player for my consideration. He said it was a “sleeper”. Perhaps, but I really didn’t like the display. I couldn’t imagine staring at that for the next few years. For that reason alone I didn’t buy it.
Hi Steve ThanksMuch!
I prefer buying used, open box, or model close out to take some of the depreciation hit, should I want to change direction later. Create a short list of options and be patient usually searching out a deal on,. Same rules apply to other hobbies when possible. I typically over research on projects.
Audiophile stuff is a bit difficult as I don't know many who are into it and a showroom isn't exactly like being in the house. I have more than one expensive hobbie. So, max bang for the buck is a constant calculation as well as being realistic about how much my untrained ear can detect. Ultimately it is about kicking back back and enjoying listening to some music.
I love the looks of my gear. Big volume knob, bass and treble controls, sounds good. Speakers look good and sound good. Took awhile to buy them tho
How I do it; Learn the value of patience, and after a while it's fun to wait. Sometimes the product you want hasn't been made yet, like in my case,-> choosing the right studio monitors for your tastes. I refused to take the chance of being dissapointed. I chose the speakers after at least 2 years, they were released a week before that. Perfect, and it worked out beautifully. Luckily I knew the sound of the brand, as listening in a store wasn't an option. So yes it was a small risk, but not life threatening so to speak 😅. If you can, listen before you buy! It's that simple.
Some things I’ve bought because of deals: Fluance rt82 for $80. Very happy with it as a 2nd table.
Nagaoka Mp200 for $100. Extremely happy. Needed a cartridge upgrade anyways
After going for a long period of time trying to upgrade my loudspeakers and failing and then having my ML 333 ampliffer die and then going for a long period without and amp, I made an impulsive purchase for a Mono pair of 400 W Parasound JC 1’s when I found them on sale for $2000 off. I thought I remembered a very positive review by John Atkinson where he after hearing bought a pair. They sound fine but I think they are overpriced for the sale price of $16000 a pair. I believe most of the upper end electronics is way overpriced. I also think many audio dealers don’t serve the customers well.
US Audio Mart seems to be a graveyard for expensive gear that I personally have never heard about. How do you decide to buy an expensive piece of used gear. Yikes!
Please consider building your own gear. I started a little over two years ago and I can't stop. There are so many great kits available to get you started. I was getting pretty frustrated with the high price of audio gear.
There are simply too many levels of distribution with too many players that need a slice of the pie. You eliminate a huge amount of this by building an amplifier, for example, from a kit. If you think you can't do it, you are wrong. BUT, you have to want to do it. I'm on my 16th and 17th build. I'm currently building a diyaudio First Watt F4 clone and a pair of CSS Audio Criton 1TD-X speakers. You can do this!
D
I had been researching speakers for around nine months. I was days away from going into my local audio shop to listen to some Focals, when I got a notification from Adorama was having a deal on the Definitive Technology Demand 17’s that were about 75% off. I hadn’t heard of them but did some quick research and Jaap from The Alpha Audio liked them a lot. Peachtree also had a deal on the Nova 300. I pulled the trigger on both. I set them up and they sucked. I burned them both in for a couple days. Still crap. I brought in my thrift store AVR and the Demand 17’s suddenly opened up and sang. They are a crazy great deal. I sent the Nova 300 back and am planning on getting a NuPrime IDA8, an amp Jaap also liked. The Demand 17’s appear to still be on sale and I can highly, highly recommend for the price for the pair. Also check out The Alpha Audio channel for the reviews.
Being a South African Audiophile we can barely afford any high-end equipment new with our currency trading at 18 ZAR to the USD. Can you as an American imagine paying 18 times what you currently do for anything you can buy in the US? Luckily we have a few local sites that sell used equipment in mint condition. If it wasn't for that I would probably never own anything audiophile-grade in my life.
I can't afford what i like - so i have a LOT of DIY in my system. There's really good bang for the buck when you
can build your own equipment - plus it's fun! (Thank you Mr. Pass!)
Steve, there is a vendor here in Oz that is selling the Magico A9, their flagship speaker, for 1.5 million AUD. I normally avoid the class war stuff, but you can still buy a HOUSE for that number almost anywhere outside hotspots in Sydney and Melbourne. Aspirational ? Sure, for the lucky few who win Lotto - for the rest, that is an insane choice.
Service on a component is often a pain in the bum when you live in Australia. Overseas shipping is very expensive and most brands don’t have service possibilities over here.
When I was 25, I bought a car of 50/k. I'd better had bought a 50/k audio system, as it would still have been here. Better buy really good gear, with the help of a trusted audio shop, and enjoy it for decades. Of course, over time sometimes gear is changed, but I have never worried about resale value. In fact, I just traded in speakers and they have been nearly free to own, though I had them some 20 years.
I could have saved a fortune by getting what I really want instead of what I can afford. Now I really stretch to what I really want and don’t have to move stuff on as much.
It's amazing how quick one gets used to the new component. Sometimes it's only a matter of weeks. 😢
Time to slow down and enjoy
Yes... have seen so many ultra bargain seekers. They keep looking for that $200 bookshelf that sounds like $2000 pair they heard in store. Or similar for amp. Then selling those speakers... lucky if they get 50 bucks. So after 10 cheap things... they could have bought that pair they really wanted.
May I be so bold as to suggest an idea for an upcoming Steve & Herb episode?
If you could time travel and go back in your audio lifetime what pieces of gear you sold do you wish you still had? Not only from a sound and nostalgia perspective but also a value one. I could replace most of the items I personally regret selling but the cost is absolutely prohibitive, i.e., McIntosh C-22 preamp, MC-2505 power, MR-78 tuner, Altec Lansing A7-5 loudspeakers, double stacked Quad ELS-57s, as an example. I was young, foolish and had no idea at the time and it was the same with my two Mercedes Benz 190SL’s or my 1963 Porsche 356B Cabrio. It was the 1970s and they were cheap then. but damn near unattainable now except for the wealthy.
For me: Technics RS1500 reel to reel. Completely rebuilt they go for $10K. Way too much $$ for the joy of watching 10" reels turn round and round.
@@keithmoriyama5421 Who would have thought how these items would become so collectible. I do have a pair of Altec Lansing 846a Valencia’s I bought on FacePlant Marketplace that I got for a great price and fixed up though so I do have that reminder somewhat of my glory days.
Yes! More herb please! We need a daily fix! Hopefully a more regular appearanve!
Hey Steve, were they Buchardt speakers behind you?
Yes, S400 MK II
have you listened to bentley acoustic speakers?
Sorry, no i have not TheyI do not appear to have presence in the US or Europe, I guess that's why I've never heard of them. If you own them and enjoy them that's great!
@@SteveGuttenbergAudiophiliac any chance you listened to the new JBL 3 way 698s? or the HDI line?
Hi Steve, Enjoying your videos! I took was once a retail sales person! Wanted to ask you about the subject of either Isolation Transformers or Line Conditioners. Are you familiar with a company that was back a few years ago called Silver Circle Audio? Huge Isolation device sold for anywhere from around $5k to $11k for the biggest one called the Tchaki 6 named after Tchaikovsky etc. Dave Stanard, I think was the designer! Thank you, larry
Thanks for watching, no I haven't had that much experience with conditioners or transformers. Meaning they haven't made a difference for the better in the sound of my system over many many years when I've tried them.
@@SteveGuttenbergAudiophiliac I think I agree with you up till this point! This Tchaik6 is something very different from anything I have ever tried in my system! It definitely does something to improve the Digital part of my system! Though, I'm not sure about my Power Amps! Was told probably would be best to leave them plugged into the wall! Thank you anyway, larr