The doc didn't even pull back when the gun was pointed at his face. And yes, Kilmer did a great job. People who played the part in older movies seemed hokey to me.
Absolutely amazing breakdown! The complex yet simple Latin phrases that may be interpreted to convey multiple meanings is precisely what made ancient Latin so unique and fascinating.
Thanks for this. I've seen different translations of this and at first, like you said felt that it didn't flow well or make sense. I understand it better now
I checked with my sister, who teaches Latin and Greek, and she confirmed that this video is completely accurate and the breakdown of each line is perfect. Thanks for the upload!!!
It’s so brilliantly written. When I see Doc saying “Rest in Peace,” it’s almost like when he says “I’m your huckleberry,” in other situations. Sort of like “It’s your funeral” and “I’ll be your pallbearer,” haha!
I love how ringos face turns to a look of horror when he realizes Doc is pranking and ridiculing him. Doc showing absolutely no fear of ringo losing it and blowing him away.
The doc also showed he didn't feel the need to show off. He took it so lightly that he mocked Ringo's tricks with his shot cup. The doc acted like he really didn't give a ****. This way Ringo didn't know what to think, especially since the doc didn't even flinch when Ringo stuck the gun in his face. Ringo was expecting fear and didn't get it, and now didn't know what to think.
@@beornthebear.8220 There is even more to it. If Doc had pulled his gun to show off, Ringo could have blown him away and claimed that "he was going for his gun", whereas Doc could not drraw and blow away Ringo. Doc saw through the ploy and clowned around instead, de-escalating the situation and getting himself out of a dangerous bind.
Dunkin hinz is my forte and B.B.Hermon is my goolrae. In the Nick of crime I held down the law of the Northern One. And in return He gave me Neptune. With the ability to throw or hold gravity.
Latin really isn't something I'm an expert in, I studied more Koine Greek in college, but although most of your translations were fine, some of the interpretations you made were a bit off. I'll explain: First, "Age quod agis", translated simply as "Do what you are doing", is a famous quote from the Jesuit Order's founder St. Ignatius. It was used to encourage his students, and it is still a common phrase pounded into the heads of students training in the order. That's why, if you hear this phrase quoted, the person doing the quoting has probably had Jesuit training. One might take it as saying something closer along the line of "Continue doing that thing that you are doing," or to be more exact, *"Focus on the task at hand."* In the context of the film, Ringo is telling Doc to focus back on him, instead of talking to his friend Wyatt. Most importantly, "Juventus stultorum magister", translated here as "Youth is the teacher of fools", is erroneous, and not what Ringo says (Go check the original script, or just listen to the audio, if you do not believe me.) The common Latin aphorism is actually "Eventus stultorum magister", translated simply as *"Experience is the teacher of fools."* Youth/inexperience is a common flaw to fools, and life events/experience is the only way they know how to learn. In other words, you can't just tell an idiot not to do something (e.g. not touch the hot stove), he has to experience the consequences of his actions before he can learn. Simple Latin Translation: *In vino veritas* = In wine there is truth *Age quod agis* = Do what you are doing (Focus on the task at hand) *Credat Judaeus Apella, non ego* = The Jew Apella may believe it, but not I. (Go tell someone who cares) *Eventus stultorum magister* = Experience is the teacher of fools *In pace requiescat* = Rest in peace If we were to translate the conversation between them into the more common vernacular, the exchange would probably sound something more like what follows: *Doc:* Something about this cocky punk is pissing me off, and I'm pretty sure, from what little I've seen, that I hate his guts! *Wyatt:* Blow it off Ringo. He's just talking smack to you 'cause he's drunk. *Doc:* (Now speaking to Wyatt and ignoring Ringo... right after insulting him) Damn right I'm drunk, and that's how you know I ain't lying! *Ringo:* Hey, eyes over here you old drunk! We were having a conversation, so why don't you finish what you started! *Doc:* Pfft! Here's a quarter punk... go call someone who cares, because you ain't worth my time. *Ringo:* Why don't you try me and find out, Pops! *Doc:* It'd be your funeral, Kid. Just my 2 cents. You can spend it as you see fit :) Regards!
I took the phrase as an alteration of 'si agis, age bene,' meaning 'whatever it is you do, do it well,' here implying that Doc Holiday does 'being a drunkard' well.
One of my favorite scenes of the movie. Thanks for the break down. I saw and read other translations so I had an certain understanding but never realized Doc memorized Ringo’s gun routine which must have made Ringo realize how dangerous Doc Holiday really was! Also Ringo must have realized that Doc now knew his routine and how to approach him if ever in an gun fight! Never show your enemy your strengths as he did to Doc Holiday!
@@TheOTJ Absolutely spot on with your analysis! It was no accident that, after Wyatt killed Curly Bill, Ringo sent Ike Clanton and the remaining Cowboys after Wyatt, Creek Johnson, and Texas Jack ONLY, not even MENTIONING Doc, knowing damn well that Doc was just as much a participant in the vendetta ride as they were. It was also no accident that he challenged Wyatt, and not Doc, who was the bigger threat, to the big oak showdown; Why? Cause Ringo knew that Doc was his superior, and that he was as good as dead against him one on one.
This is a good life lesson in general. In martial arts sparing you learn never to "telegraph" your moves, that is, to let your opponent know what you are going to do next by obvious body language. Or a real pet peeve of mine, posting pictures of your firearms on social media. Never let anyone know what you have in your house! This is my favorite scene from one of my favorite movies.
In the spirit of movie directing, there is always room for improvement, and how I would end this scene would be to have Doc drop the cup and replace it with a gun before anyone noticed! That's just my opinion, as with 'The Fastest Gun Alive', When Glen Ford told Broderick Crawford, "I'm George Kitteridge!", Crawford should have narrowed his eyed and said " I already killed you?" I have always thought that this would have given the end of the movie a great plot twist and explained why George was as he was!
The "wtf" face Ringo had when he realized Doc memorized everything he did low key scared him. Even though dock was legit wasted, Doc knew exactly what he was doing. He showed Ringo in just sheer action that this was not the fight he wanted.
I didn't realize how rich this scene was. Doc, it's plain, has the upper hand and is basically telling Ringo, "Go peddle that bs somewhere else" and finally, "I am going to kill you". Johnny looks very subtly shook when the realization dawns on him that Doc is better than him, and doesn't want to take him on at this moment. What a great movie this is!
When I see Ringo staring him down after showboating with his gun, he has this gleam in his eyes like he wants to kill him, but when Doc begins to sarcastically showboat with this shot cup, that gleam dissipates almost immediately. I think, Doc, even though he was drunk, was still smart enough to know that he ought not escalate the situation any further. So, he diffused the bomb by playing it off in a humorous fashion. He still won this round, though. No doubt about that. He made Ringo look like a high school jock, revving his engine in a lifted diesel truck, haha!
@@smoothALOE was just about to write this. While everyone else is laughing casually at Doc acting silly and spinning around his cup, Ringo has terror in his eyes at 9:50 that Doc has managed to copy all his fancy gunfighters moves (that he most likely spent a long time practicing)verbatim while he is drunk on the spot. Up until this moment Ringo was very sure of himself and ready to get in a gunfight with Doc, always escalating the situation with more insults. It’s so good because for the onlookers in the saloon, Doc spinning his cup around is the first time they weren’t scared since the conversation with Doc and Ringo started, but for Ringo it’s the first time he was scared. ALSO, the casual viewer of this scene is like onlookers in the saloon while the more in-depth viewers (us) are like Doc and Ringo. What great acting at 9:50 and what a masterfully done scene and movie.
What a great analysis. When I had first saw this scene, I had thought that educated was in the sense that both men knew latin - just the language. But i see that they are educated in discourse and the classics, and are conveying many different levels of meaning. So there's real depth here.
Unfortunately there is a mistake here, it is not the Youth is the teacher of fools but the original expression is: "Eventus stultorum magister" which means : The outcome of things is the teacher of fools . It is EVENTUS instead of Juventus!
Thank you for this clarification. As a Latin scholar I notice a second mistake. I really appreciate the work of this video though, and give them a strong if not shining grade. What I noticed is that “Age” cannot be translated, “the people do.” Rather it is the imperative “Do.” So the entire phrase should read “Do what you do.” The spirit of the taunting phrase, or figurative translation then to Ringo could be, “Do what you like,” or more loosely “Bring it on.” The “people do” would be “gens aget.” Do you agree?
I applaud this video maker knew that it was not Judae Apella, not Judae Sotella as the actor pronounced. The video maker caught an error much as you did. I’ve also noticed that actors can get away with some incorrect phrases as Kilmer did with “Sotella.” This is fine with me because if I were acting in, say German, I would inevitably fake my way through much more than Kilmer.
This is soooo much more of an informative narrative than any others, I've heard it really conveys the actual meanings and force of the Latin spoken and the feelings in the imagery between these two men who are actually feeling the other out, who is the REAL victim in this very brief show of swords to one another, of course it's Holliday who is the REAL Aggressor and Ringo realizes it by the look in Ringo's eyes, even in Holliday's drunken state Ringo can tell that Holliday is a death sentence waiting and ready to be reckoned upon him or anyone that dares stepping over that very tenuous RAZOR thin line between life and death. Booyah 🤔
I've watched several translations of the Latin conversation, but your video is the most informative and inciteful one that I've yet seen on RUclips. Very impressive!
You have educated a lot of us. Superb! I was a trained linguist for the U.S. Military Intelligence, and you are great.!So many people hear things in movies, but don't know what they mean. Your explanation was fantastic!. Keep up your great work !
Thank you for the compliment! You were great too in protecting our Country! Thanks for your service! I was a 98G2LRU. Rusian linguist /code breaker like you! I was with a Special Project called "Tracer Round". We had teams in Augsburg, Frankfurt and Berlin! Mostly aimed at the Russ ians and East Germans. Short range (FROG) and the Scud (long range missiles). We did a "Hell of a Job" in tracking their misiles and rockets! There were good times and very "tense" times for all of us! I would like to keep a channel open for us to communicate. I'd like to know your experiences too. Take care my friend and please keep in touch! Steve Wiggins
Wow, I love smart people like you here and I learned a lot from reading these comments ❤. I love learning, I study Russian and German languages for fun and history, it’s interesting to learn about people like you guys,
this is my all time favourite movie too and all these years i haven't learned the translation till now. thank you. Now.....for those who do not understand the mystery of Ringo's death, that scene is the first indication that the film maker believe Doc killed Ringo. I say this because the real point of that scene is that Doc did not show his first first move to his gun: he spun the cup. the second indication that Doc probably killed Ringo comes when Ringo challenged Wyatt in the street: the "play for blood scene". in that scene Doc said "I'm your huckleberry" and stepped forward with one of his guns in his left hand behind his back; in short, Doc had the drop on Ringo and Ringo didn't know it, which puts Ringo's arning in Latin into a context of biting Ringo in ther ass. Doc outsmarted Ringo twice and Ringo didn't even know it. With Doc's education and "street smarts" and fearlessness and flamboyancy I for one believe it was Doc that killed Ringo under the Oak tree because if ringo killed himself, he could not have put his hat on his own head; i doubt sdtrongly that Wyatt would either. so, for meit could have only have been Doc. this was good video though..thanks
"You must not fight too often with one enemy, or you will teach him all your art of war." - Napoleon Bonaparte. This 'play fight', even though it was the only time the two would confront each other before their duel to the death, was one too many times to show Doc Holiday your skills. Actually, the death duel probably never happened as evidence indicates Ringo committed suicide by putting a bullet through his brain.
I enjoy the first quote. I know nothing about the man, myself. I was not really taught anything about him, the man. My dad says the same. He did read books on the battles and the lifetime, but no quotes that he can recall, either. LOL
The thing Is doc wasn't afraid to die, because he was already dying from the Illness back when doctors couldn't find a cure for consumption AKA tuberculosis, so this all makes sense for docs' behavior that day when him and Ringo met, because he had a death wish, and for a good reason, who would want to die in bed coughing blood until they can't wake up no more?
"Credat Judaeus Apella, non ego": "Tell it to someone who might give a f___." The scene itself with Michael Biehn's eyes should be Oscar worthy alone if they gave out 'Best Scene'.
I sure appreciate the extra effort you put in here...while speaking Latin, they were also using phrses from literature to FURTHER prove their educations...quotes from Horace and then common Roman quotes of the day...not bad. Age Quod Agis. I would have liked to have heard more, and I noticed how everyone in the room was quiet, didn't speak Latin, yet didn't have to. They knew exactly what they were witnessing. I take that back...any Doctor/Priest or military man would have been exposed to Latin.
The fact is ... Doc's reputation precedes him. Ringo tries to warned him but Doc is unfazed. The fact that the girl next to Doc is so relaxed and was more worried about Ringo's life's causes Ringo to realise this man (Doc) can back his talk. The act of war by pointing the gun is only to convince himself that he is at par with Doc and not to loose face in public. A smart guy would know Doc is insulting a little boy by mocking his style which was actually very slow.
Yes - a fatal error by Ringo. Doc saw the speed of his draw and knew for sure that he could beat him. All doubts if there were any were erased. Going into a fight that knowledge is a huge advantage.
Something I don't see given enough praise is Bill Paxton's expressions, conveying the level of tension in the room. When Ringo draws and starts to spin, all the bystanders who are drunk and uninvolved are laughing and whooping at the spectacle, like its a trivial matter. But Paxton's expression brings you back to just how serious the situation is and how close it really is to breaking into gunfire. Then moments later, when Doc starts his performance, you see the tension release in his expression, conveying the temperature in the room dropping. Without those two quick shots of Paxton, the scene wouldn't have carried as much weight. Such a great supporting actor. Requiescat in Pace
Wrong move Johnny. That show-offs is a mark that everything's going downhill for him after this. Maybe should've shot Doc Holliday rightaway after exposing all the flashy moves you got to him lol
Omi effn God...I love you .....whoever's you are ...you are now my favorite person ... u nailed it ...... I threw up just now because you made me think
"I know! Let's have a spelling contest!" was the best putdown by any character in any movie ever. You could just feel his cheeky humor radiating off the screen. I gather the real Doc was reported to be a bit like that?
I love this movie and this scene is one of my favorites...however Johnny Ringo was not educated. In fact, according to another accountant of a few inaccuracies of the movie, Ringo never went to school at all. Literary license accepted...still a great scene and exchange between adversaries.
Did anyone else notice doc subtly change from drinking with his right hand to his left? So he could still drink but had his right hand free to draw his weapon if needed.
You could not have chosen better actor's for this version of tombstone it will go down as the best remember the movie was made as close as to what actually happened 100 or more years ago in the days when people could not read or write so for two people to speak latin a difficult language and to understand the different meanings and one word could mean many different things a credit to the director or who ever mustto put this dialogue mjust
What he does is show the "show off" that any fool can spin a gun around. But deliberately drawing and killing a foe who is willing to kill you, is something completely different than showing off.
Brilliant explanation. I’ve watched this scene many times, feeling the intensity of the exchange but without understanding exactly what was being said. Their body language conveyed the notion that a challenge had been issued but it was never clear to me who did the provoking. I also missed the fact that Ringo’s steely gaze melts away abruptly when Doc repeats Ringo’s revolver routine, move for move, after observing it one time - DRUNK! This is evidently something Ringo had spent days, if not weeks, perfecting.
7:30 I guess Ringo tried to say that young people could be smarter than the old and experieced. Old people often became ignorant to the young, and the young could teach them a lesson. Also this means that people learn from their mistakes when they're young, but some never learn.
Nah, most damgerous men of notoriety with a reputation died before they reached 30 back then, so Ringo would not have assumed he was much older than Holiday. I think Ringo was trying to convey a massage that he was more experienced than Holiday and that Holiday's inexperience would get him hurt, but seeing how cool headed Holiday remained while speaking threats to each other and his calm insult in plain English to Ringo for everyone to hear made Ringo realize that he himself was the youthful foo. Then he did what foolish young men do, which is to show off and try to "peacock" a bit with the gunplay, trying to show his experience to make the point. Holiday's reaction once again proved he was beyond Ringo experience wise with his cup retort. The 2 scenes between them after this interaction showed that Ringo feared him(the huckleberry scene) and then foolishly with prideful fear accepted a duel(finale death scene). Ringo was probably the craziest of that group, the kind that always turned it up to 11 and was able to bully his way with people, right up until he met someone like Holiday who cast a shadow over him...like someone dressed convincingly as superman and pretending to be him meeting the real superman in the flesh. His confidence melted the moment he realized Holiday was the man he(Ringo) was pretending to be.
I never wondered i knew one fact and one fact alone in this scene they were sizing each other up for a pine box. This is usually how it starts then it ends with one of em in a Pine box.
Fun fact, Powers Booth was also in Deadwood and makes a reference to Tombstone, in Deadwood he says something to the effect of don’t be an idiot baying in the street and trying to shoot down the moon, a hint at his character Tombstone getting high on Opium and going crazy in the street and trying to shoot down the moon, check it out both are great
There's another video on RUclips that gives a completely different breakdown: "When I drink, I speak my mind." "Do what you do best". "I don't believe drinking is what I do best." "Fools have to learn by experience" "It's your funeral." Which one is more accurate? I'd have to go with this one because, Pace Requiescat does mean Rest in peace, nothing about it being someone's funeral. Then again I suppose people can make up anything they want based on the action and stick subtitles onto the celluloid under the assumption the viewer doesn't know Latin from Lebanese.
Thank you SO MUCH for this video! I more or less got what was going on, but I didn't know the direct translations/interpretations thereof. I was a bit off, but close. This is ABSOLUTELY one of my TOP 5 Westerns, but I can't crown it Number 1 (as I don't have JUST one). Thanks again! :)
One of my favorite movies. Also got me interested in Latin... the only Latin I memorized is from this movie. I've come to notice Latin is full of proverbs. I was wondering the translation of "every action there is a reaction" I Googled it but I'd rather come here and ask a pro. Great video thanks
Well I studied latin for years and many of my friends were ha p what they say and so try to figure it out especially if your from Portugal Spain france Italian especially Romanian and some others advieniat regnum tum en panam nostrum debetoribus nostrum
GREAT FUN! Thanks for sharing. According to contemporary accounts, John Ringo was indeed a highly educated man who at some point broke bad and decided to become an outlaw. I wish we knew more about Ringo's backstory because he's an even more interesting character than his opponents (who we hardly saints themselves) on the so-called other side of the law. Ringo may have had a story similar to the Earps; perhaps somewhat analogous to Holliday himself. Kilmer was magnificently cast and truly owned the part, demonstrating that he wasn't just a pretty boy with a Pepsodent smile - he had serious acting chops and truly earned his spurs (heh) in this magnificent feature.
Inventus stultorum magister (est) would have been more grammatically correct, but it worked here to omit EST=IS. The recitation in the movie sounds like, "Youth, the teacher of fools", Rather than, "Youth is the teacher of fools." The statement didn't have a verb, but it had an actor.
Theres the reason why doc didnt pull his gun up.. because there's a saying that when you pull your gun and point it to peoples face you have to pull the trigger.. thats why doc didnt pull his gun to show his skills because he will actually pull that trigger and kill ringo not like johnny beacaus hes just too high strung ... Hes no daisy at all..
One of my favorite scenes I knew what it was hitting for when he said ain't no law round hear law dog all of them knew of each others reputation its alway a crazy youngn will to challenge a seasoned killer Doc knew his potential but it didn't matter
Just found the this scene and gonna have to say it’s already one of my favorites. Gonna learn some Latin just because of it. AAAGGGHHHHH HOLLYWOOD MOVIES SUCK. I wish Texas would start a Hollywood 2.0 and just make gunslinger movies all the time. This single scene is way more thought provoking than the last 20 years of Hollywood movies combined.
Doc Holliday: In vino veritas. Meaning: In wine, there is truth. Johnny Ringo: Age quod agis. Meaning: Do what you do or watch what you do. Doc Holliday: Credit Judaeus Apella, non ego. Meaning: Let Apella the Jew believe, not I (Tell it to someone else, not I). Johnny Ringo: Juventus stultorum magister. Meaning: Youth is the teacher of fools. Doc Holliday: In pace requiescat. Meaning: Rest in peace.
Yeah, Technically book translation, but it's more like "there's truth in wine" "then be careful what you say" "Tell that to someone else, not me" "I let my gun do my talking" "It's your funeral"
Incredible cast of Actors and the Great movies from the talent of each individual, I 1st saw Powers Booth in the movie Souther Confort he was such Fine Actor, for me this movie was times a changing in the business.
I love my little cup. It's very nice. I'd like to have one. I'm sorry, it's one of a kind. Perhaps you'd trade it for this pistol. I can't. It was a gift from my girlfriend.
While everyone else is laughing casually at Doc acting silly and spinning around his cup, Ringo has terror in his eyes at 9:50 that Doc has managed to copy all his fancy gunfighters moves (that he most likely spent a long time practicing) verbatim while he is drunk on the spot. Up until this moment Ringo was very sure of himself and ready to get in a gunfight with Doc, always escalating the situation with more insults. It's so good because for the onlookers in the saloon, Doc spinning his cup around is the first time they WEREN’T scared since the conversation with Doc and Ringo started, but for Ringo it's the first time he WAS scared. ALSO, the casual viewer of this scene is like the onlookers in the saloon while the more in-depth viewers (us) are like Doc and Ringo. What great, subtle acting at 9:50 that really sold the scene and what a masterfully done scene and movie.
Simply unbelievable that Kilmer did not win an Oscar for Best Supporting Actor (wasn't even nominated) in this his best movie role ever.
The Academy has been producing travesties like this for a very long time.
I feel like the academy always had a thing against violent movies.
Ya, and back in day when it was more about acting...
One would have to look who was nominated that year and for what...
And yes, he did awesome job.
Kilmer was solid gold in this film
The doc didn't even pull back when the gun was pointed at his face. And yes, Kilmer did a great job. People who played the part in older movies seemed hokey to me.
Excellent! Thank you, always loved the sound of Latin.
Absolutely amazing breakdown! The complex yet simple Latin phrases that may be interpreted to convey multiple meanings is precisely what made ancient Latin so unique and fascinating.
I took Latin for four years of highschool. I took to it pretty quickly. Never thought it was cool till I saw this movie.
Thanks for this. I've seen different translations of this and at first, like you said felt that it didn't flow well or make sense. I understand it better now
When they are walking to the OK corral why is the building on fire?
theatrical effect is my best guess...
I checked with my sister, who teaches Latin and Greek, and she confirmed that this video is completely accurate and the breakdown of each line is perfect. Thanks for the upload!!!
Thanks for sharing!
Stop😢😢😢❤❤❤
@@christopherarriaga1264 Huh?
Real men in this western. The cast is superb.
I am a big fan of Kurt Russell, but Val Kilmer made this movie a true western classic.
It’s so brilliantly written. When I see Doc saying “Rest in Peace,” it’s almost like when he says “I’m your huckleberry,” in other situations. Sort of like “It’s your funeral” and “I’ll be your pallbearer,” haha!
I love how ringos face turns to a look of horror when he realizes Doc is pranking and ridiculing him. Doc showing absolutely no fear of ringo losing it and blowing him away.
it wasn't a prank, doc was studying Ringo and Ringo let Doc see his first move to his gun
The doc also showed he didn't feel the need to show off. He took it so lightly that he mocked Ringo's tricks with his shot cup. The doc acted like he really didn't give a ****. This way Ringo didn't know what to think, especially since the doc didn't even flinch when Ringo stuck the gun in his face. Ringo was expecting fear and didn't get it, and now didn't know what to think.
Doc woulda shot him before he could squeeze the trigger.
@@beornthebear.8220 There is even more to it. If Doc had pulled his gun to show off, Ringo could have blown him away and claimed that "he was going for his gun", whereas Doc could not drraw and blow away Ringo. Doc saw through the ploy and clowned around instead, de-escalating the situation and getting himself out of a dangerous bind.
Dunkin hinz is my forte and B.B.Hermon is my goolrae. In the Nick of crime I held down the law of the Northern One. And in return He gave me Neptune. With the ability to throw or hold gravity.
Latin really isn't something I'm an expert in, I studied more Koine Greek in college, but although most of your translations were fine, some of the interpretations you made were a bit off. I'll explain:
First, "Age quod agis", translated simply as "Do what you are doing", is a famous quote from the Jesuit Order's founder St. Ignatius. It was used to encourage his students, and it is still a common phrase pounded into the heads of students training in the order. That's why, if you hear this phrase quoted, the person doing the quoting has probably had Jesuit training. One might take it as saying something closer along the line of "Continue doing that thing that you are doing," or to be more exact, *"Focus on the task at hand."* In the context of the film, Ringo is telling Doc to focus back on him, instead of talking to his friend Wyatt.
Most importantly, "Juventus stultorum magister", translated here as "Youth is the teacher of fools", is erroneous, and not what Ringo says (Go check the original script, or just listen to the audio, if you do not believe me.) The common Latin aphorism is actually "Eventus stultorum magister", translated simply as *"Experience is the teacher of fools."* Youth/inexperience is a common flaw to fools, and life events/experience is the only way they know how to learn. In other words, you can't just tell an idiot not to do something (e.g. not touch the hot stove), he has to experience the consequences of his actions before he can learn.
Simple Latin Translation:
*In vino veritas* = In wine there is truth
*Age quod agis* = Do what you are doing (Focus on the task at hand)
*Credat Judaeus Apella, non ego* = The Jew Apella may believe it, but not I. (Go tell someone who cares)
*Eventus stultorum magister* = Experience is the teacher of fools
*In pace requiescat* = Rest in peace
If we were to translate the conversation between them into the more common vernacular, the exchange would probably sound something more like what follows:
*Doc:* Something about this cocky punk is pissing me off, and I'm pretty sure, from what little I've seen, that I hate his guts!
*Wyatt:* Blow it off Ringo. He's just talking smack to you 'cause he's drunk.
*Doc:* (Now speaking to Wyatt and ignoring Ringo... right after insulting him) Damn right I'm drunk, and that's how you know I ain't lying!
*Ringo:* Hey, eyes over here you old drunk! We were having a conversation, so why don't you finish what you started!
*Doc:* Pfft! Here's a quarter punk... go call someone who cares, because you ain't worth my time.
*Ringo:* Why don't you try me and find out, Pops!
*Doc:* It'd be your funeral, Kid.
Just my 2 cents. You can spend it as you see fit :) Regards!
well done!..
Thank you for your 2 cents, I enjoyed reading it.
Bravo!! Great breakdown lol.....!!
I took the phrase as an alteration of 'si agis, age bene,' meaning 'whatever it is you do, do it well,' here implying that Doc Holiday does 'being a drunkard' well.
You are an amazing linguist
This single scene is more profound than the entirety of the modern movie catalog.
10/10 breakdown.
One of my favorite scenes of the movie. Thanks for the break down. I saw and read other translations so I had an certain understanding but never realized Doc memorized Ringo’s gun routine which must have made Ringo realize how dangerous Doc Holiday really was! Also Ringo must have realized that Doc now knew his routine and how to approach him if ever in an gun fight! Never show your enemy your strengths as he did to Doc Holiday!
Exactly. My grandfather always told me to never let them see you coming.
@@TheOTJ Absolutely spot on with your analysis! It was no accident that, after Wyatt killed Curly Bill, Ringo sent Ike Clanton and the remaining Cowboys after Wyatt, Creek Johnson, and Texas Jack ONLY, not even MENTIONING Doc, knowing damn well that Doc was just as much a participant in the vendetta ride as they were. It was also no accident that he challenged Wyatt, and not Doc, who was the bigger threat, to the big oak showdown; Why? Cause Ringo knew that Doc was his superior, and that he was as good as dead against him one on one.
This is a good life lesson in general. In martial arts sparing you learn never to "telegraph" your moves, that is, to let your opponent know what you are going to do next by obvious body language. Or a real pet peeve of mine, posting pictures of your firearms on social media. Never let anyone know what you have in your house! This is my favorite scene from one of my favorite movies.
In the spirit of movie directing, there is always room for improvement, and how I would end this scene would be to have Doc drop the cup and replace it with a gun before anyone noticed!
That's just my opinion, as with 'The Fastest Gun Alive', When Glen Ford told Broderick Crawford, "I'm George Kitteridge!", Crawford should have narrowed his eyed and said " I already killed you?"
I have always thought that this would have given the end of the movie a great plot twist and explained why George was as he was!
@@garyhiggins4315 Ringo is dead, he just doesn't know it yet.
The "wtf" face Ringo had when he realized Doc memorized everything he did low key scared him. Even though dock was legit wasted, Doc knew exactly what he was doing. He showed Ringo in just sheer action that this was not the fight he wanted.
I didn't realize how rich this scene was. Doc, it's plain, has the upper hand and is basically telling Ringo, "Go peddle that bs somewhere else" and finally, "I am going to kill you". Johnny looks very subtly shook when the realization dawns on him that Doc is better than him, and doesn't want to take him on at this moment. What a great movie this is!
When I see Ringo staring him down after showboating with his gun, he has this gleam in his eyes like he wants to kill him, but when Doc begins to sarcastically showboat with this shot cup, that gleam dissipates almost immediately. I think, Doc, even though he was drunk, was still smart enough to know that he ought not escalate the situation any further. So, he diffused the bomb by playing it off in a humorous fashion. He still won this round, though. No doubt about that. He made Ringo look like a high school jock, revving his engine in a lifted diesel truck, haha!
@@smoothALOE was just about to write this. While everyone else is laughing casually at Doc acting silly and spinning around his cup, Ringo has terror in his eyes at 9:50 that Doc has managed to copy all his fancy gunfighters moves (that he most likely spent a long time practicing)verbatim while he is drunk on the spot. Up until this moment Ringo was very sure of himself and ready to get in a gunfight with Doc, always escalating the situation with more insults.
It’s so good because for the onlookers in the saloon, Doc spinning his cup around is the first time they weren’t scared since the conversation with Doc and Ringo started, but for Ringo it’s the first time he was scared. ALSO, the casual viewer of this scene is like onlookers in the saloon while the more in-depth viewers (us) are like Doc and Ringo.
What great acting at 9:50 and what a masterfully done scene and movie.
You can see fear in ringo's eyes when he realizes doc is the better man w a gun
What a great analysis. When I had first saw this scene, I had thought that educated was in the sense that both men knew latin - just the language. But i see that they are educated in discourse and the classics, and are conveying many different levels of meaning. So there's real depth here.
Unfortunately there is a mistake here, it is not the Youth is the teacher of fools but the original expression is: "Eventus stultorum magister" which means : The outcome of things is the teacher of fools . It is EVENTUS instead of Juventus!
Thank you for this clarification. As a Latin scholar I notice a second mistake. I really appreciate the work of this video though, and give them a strong if not shining grade. What I noticed is that “Age” cannot be translated, “the people do.” Rather it is the imperative “Do.” So the entire phrase should read “Do what you do.” The spirit of the taunting phrase, or figurative translation then to Ringo could be, “Do what you like,” or more loosely “Bring it on.” The “people do” would be “gens aget.” Do you agree?
I applaud this video maker knew that it was not Judae Apella, not Judae Sotella as the actor pronounced. The video maker caught an error much as you did. I’ve also noticed that actors can get away with some incorrect phrases as Kilmer did with “Sotella.” This is fine with me because if I were acting in, say German, I would inevitably fake my way through much more than Kilmer.
Father of John Conner Snake Pliskin and Bruce wayne...wow
This is soooo much more of an informative narrative than any others, I've heard it really conveys the actual meanings and force of the Latin spoken and the feelings in the imagery between these two men who are actually feeling the other out, who is the REAL victim in this very brief show of swords to one another, of course it's Holliday who is the REAL Aggressor and Ringo realizes it by the look in Ringo's eyes, even in Holliday's drunken state Ringo can tell that Holliday is a death sentence waiting and ready to be reckoned upon him or anyone that dares stepping over that very tenuous RAZOR thin line between life and death. Booyah 🤔
" I'm in my prime..." What a line!
This is hands down the best translation I've seen, bravo.
thank you
I've watched several translations of the Latin conversation, but your video is the most informative and inciteful one that I've yet seen on RUclips. Very impressive!
thank you
An EXCELLENT video. Not only did it translate the Latin but also literally and with context.
thank you
This has always intrigued me.
Thank you for not just a basic translation
But the slurs in-between.
Bravo
Glad you enjoyed it!
Gosh, thanks for the grammar lesson mister. I would have never understood their meanings had it not been for you.
You have educated a lot of us. Superb! I was a trained linguist for the U.S. Military Intelligence, and you are great.!So many people hear things in movies, but don't know what they mean. Your explanation was fantastic!. Keep up your great work !
Thank you for the compliment! You were great too in protecting our Country! Thanks for your service! I was a 98G2LRU. Rusian linguist /code breaker like you! I was with a Special Project called "Tracer Round". We had teams in Augsburg, Frankfurt and Berlin! Mostly aimed at the Russ
ians and East Germans. Short range (FROG) and the Scud (long range missiles). We did a "Hell of a Job" in tracking their misiles and rockets! There were good times and very "tense" times for all of us! I would like to keep a channel open for us to communicate. I'd like to know your experiences too. Take care my friend and please keep in touch! Steve Wiggins
I'm on Facebook!
Wow, I love smart people like you here and I learned a lot from reading these comments ❤. I love learning, I study Russian and German languages for fun and history, it’s interesting to learn about people like you guys,
I love that pat on the back that Wild Bill gives Johnny. Johnny was embarrassed but it’s more of a “let it go son,” moment.
Curly Bill AKA William Brocius
this is my all time favourite movie too and all these years i haven't learned the translation till now. thank you. Now.....for those who do not understand the mystery of Ringo's death, that scene is the first indication that the film maker believe Doc killed Ringo. I say this because the real point of that scene is that Doc did not show his first first move to his gun: he spun the cup. the second indication that Doc probably killed Ringo comes when Ringo challenged Wyatt in the street: the "play for blood scene". in that scene Doc said "I'm your huckleberry" and stepped forward with one of his guns in his left hand behind his back; in short, Doc had the drop on Ringo and Ringo didn't know it, which puts Ringo's arning in Latin into a context of biting Ringo in ther ass. Doc outsmarted Ringo twice and Ringo didn't even know it. With Doc's education and "street smarts" and fearlessness and flamboyancy I for one believe it was Doc that killed Ringo under the Oak tree because if ringo killed himself, he could not have put his hat on his own head; i doubt sdtrongly that Wyatt would either. so, for meit could have only have been Doc. this was good video though..thanks
Imho one of the best scenes ever in a movie
Well done, if only this information could have been known the first 50 times of watching the movie. But it's a good reason to watch it again. Cheers
"You must not fight too often with one enemy, or you will teach him all your art of war." - Napoleon Bonaparte.
This 'play fight', even though it was the only time the two would confront each other before their duel to the death, was one too many times to show Doc Holiday your skills.
Actually, the death duel probably never happened as evidence indicates Ringo committed suicide by putting a bullet through his brain.
I enjoy the first quote. I know nothing about the man, myself. I was not really taught anything about him, the man. My dad says the same. He did read books on the battles and the lifetime, but no quotes that he can recall, either. LOL
You have to remember one thing. Doc didn’t respond to Ringo in Latin. His response was to Wyatt. Ringo answered him back.
The thing Is doc wasn't afraid to die, because he was already dying from the Illness back when doctors couldn't find a cure for consumption AKA tuberculosis, so this all makes sense for docs' behavior that day when him and Ringo met, because he had a death wish, and for a good reason, who would want to die in bed coughing blood until they can't wake up no more?
One of my Favorite Movies! Yes!
Also one of my favorite movies ever and respect to the creator. Very well done and thorough with tips when to pause to read. I respect that. 👍
"Credat Judaeus Apella, non ego": "Tell it to someone who might give a f___." The scene itself with Michael Biehn's eyes should be Oscar worthy alone if they gave out 'Best Scene'.
Thank you so much for taking the time to put this video together! Carpe Diem!
Thanks for watching
Video. Esepsional. 💖💖💖💖💖✅🕶️👍🇺🇸☘️😍.
Thanks for this video. The translations and commentary are much appreciated. Bravo!👏🏿👏🏿👏🏿👏🏿
I sure appreciate the extra effort you put in here...while speaking Latin, they were also using phrses from literature to FURTHER prove their educations...quotes from Horace and then common Roman quotes of the day...not bad. Age Quod Agis. I would have liked to have heard more, and I noticed how everyone in the room was quiet, didn't speak Latin, yet didn't have to. They knew exactly what they were witnessing. I take that back...any Doctor/Priest or military man would have been exposed to Latin.
The fact is ... Doc's reputation precedes him. Ringo tries to warned him but Doc is unfazed. The fact that the girl next to Doc is so relaxed and was more worried about Ringo's life's causes Ringo to realise this man (Doc) can back his talk. The act of war by pointing the gun is only to convince himself that he is at par with Doc and not to loose face in public. A smart guy would know Doc is insulting a little boy by mocking his style which was actually very slow.
Yes - a fatal error by Ringo. Doc saw the speed of his draw and knew for sure that he could beat him. All doubts if there were any were erased. Going into a fight that knowledge is a huge advantage.
Being hammered helps.
Never been a better cast in a western movie.
One of the greatest movies of all time and thanks for the insightful breakdown, it's much appreciated!!!
Something I don't see given enough praise is Bill Paxton's expressions, conveying the level of tension in the room.
When Ringo draws and starts to spin, all the bystanders who are drunk and uninvolved are laughing and whooping at the spectacle, like its a trivial matter. But Paxton's expression brings you back to just how serious the situation is and how close it really is to breaking into gunfire.
Then moments later, when Doc starts his performance, you see the tension release in his expression, conveying the temperature in the room dropping.
Without those two quick shots of Paxton, the scene wouldn't have carried as much weight. Such a great supporting actor. Requiescat in Pace
I think Ringo says Eventis not Juventus. Therefore "Experience is the teacher of fools"
Wrong move Johnny. That show-offs is a mark that everything's going downhill for him after this. Maybe should've shot Doc Holliday rightaway after exposing all the flashy moves you got to him lol
Omi effn God...I love you .....whoever's you are ...you are now my favorite person ... u nailed it ...... I threw up just now because you made me think
😂Yeah!!! Now I have an excuse to watch this movie again. My kids will love it 😀 once they stop whining
"I know! Let's have a spelling contest!" was the best putdown by any character in any movie ever. You could just feel his cheeky humor radiating off the screen. I gather the real Doc was reported to be a bit like that?
🤣
SAY WHEN!!!!!
I love this movie and this scene is one of my favorites...however Johnny Ringo was not educated. In fact, according to another accountant of a few inaccuracies of the movie, Ringo never went to school at all. Literary license accepted...still a great scene and exchange between adversaries.
I wanted to believe that ONJ stood for On The Job lol..... Great Video
Wyatt's gun under the faro table.I love it
Did anyone else notice doc subtly change from drinking with his right hand to his left? So he could still drink but had his right hand free to draw his weapon if needed.
Good eye
You could not have chosen better actor's for this version of tombstone it will go down as the best remember the movie was made as close as to what actually happened 100 or more years ago in the days when people could not read or write so for two people to speak latin a difficult language and to understand the different meanings and one word could mean many different things a credit to the director or who ever mustto put this dialogue mjust
This is greatest western movie ever made. This scene is one of the deepest.
Val is cold as ice in this. A gentleman that will kill you and finish his tea. Badass.
What he does is show the "show off" that any fool can spin a gun around. But deliberately drawing and killing a foe who is willing to kill you, is something completely different than showing off.
doc was studying ringo; it was not meant to prank him or be joking....notice how doc never went to his gun
Doc was just trying to see how fast his draw was...
Frui spectaculum - 3:21
Latin: *"Enjoy the show"*
Brilliant, thanks for posting.
The detailed explanations are the best I’ve seen, you’ve done a fantastic job with this upload 👍
Glad it was helpful!
Brilliant explanation. I’ve watched this scene many times, feeling the intensity of the exchange but without understanding exactly what was being said.
Their body language conveyed the notion that a challenge had been issued but it was never clear to me who did the provoking. I also missed the fact that Ringo’s steely gaze melts away abruptly when Doc repeats Ringo’s revolver routine, move for move, after observing it one time - DRUNK! This is evidently something Ringo had spent days, if not weeks, perfecting.
thank you. Glad it was helpful.
Well done. My eyes have been opened. Great movie. Thanks for translating.
I've waited years to know that, thank you💯💯💯💯💯💯 and I never realized he did everything Ringo did with that cup.
Glad you liked it.
Ringo pulled the gun out on him
And Doc didn't even budge
What a fucking legend man
7:30 I guess Ringo tried to say that young people could be smarter than the old and experieced. Old people often became ignorant to the young, and the young could teach them a lesson.
Also this means that people learn from their mistakes when they're young, but some never learn.
Nah, most damgerous men of notoriety with a reputation died before they reached 30 back then, so Ringo would not have assumed he was much older than Holiday. I think Ringo was trying to convey a massage that he was more experienced than Holiday and that Holiday's inexperience would get him hurt, but seeing how cool headed Holiday remained while speaking threats to each other and his calm insult in plain English to Ringo for everyone to hear made Ringo realize that he himself was the youthful foo. Then he did what foolish young men do, which is to show off and try to "peacock" a bit with the gunplay, trying to show his experience to make the point. Holiday's reaction once again proved he was beyond Ringo experience wise with his cup retort. The 2 scenes between them after this interaction showed that Ringo feared him(the huckleberry scene) and then foolishly with prideful fear accepted a duel(finale death scene).
Ringo was probably the craziest of that group, the kind that always turned it up to 11 and was able to bully his way with people, right up until he met someone like Holiday who cast a shadow over him...like someone dressed convincingly as superman and pretending to be him meeting the real superman in the flesh. His confidence melted the moment he realized Holiday was the man he(Ringo) was pretending to be.
Latinam amo. Lingua pulchra cum multis significationibus.
I never wondered i knew one fact and one fact alone in this scene they were sizing each other up for a pine box. This is usually how it starts then it ends with one of em in a Pine box.
It was at that moment he knew,he fucked up.
There are some films that transcend their genre and become true classics of the movie heritage! This is one of the best of them! 👍👍👍👍👍👍❤❤❤❤❤❤🇬🇧🇬🇧🇬🇧
I wish they'd done this in the movie. Translate it in subtitles.
Law don't go round here 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
Val Kilmer still should get a Oscar
Thanks for the translation. Great job. This is also one of my favorite westerns.
i have seen this movie so many times, and i always wondered what they said in this scene
winner to the king 500 dollars .... shut up ike XD
DId you notice that Wyatt changed Curly Bills bet and then bottom dealt the King to ensure he would win? Another little easter egg in the scene.
What I took from that scene was that Curly won 500 dollars and then bought everyone drinks, 500 dollars in the 1880s is equal to 11k today.....
I really liked Curly Bill in this flick for some reason.
Probably because he was portrayed by the immensely talented Powers Boothe.
Fun fact, Powers Booth was also in Deadwood and makes a reference to Tombstone, in Deadwood he says something to the effect of don’t be an idiot baying in the street and trying to shoot down the moon, a hint at his character Tombstone getting high on Opium and going crazy in the street and trying to shoot down the moon, check it out both are great
Thanks for the post. Super translations, interpretations and the oft-forgotten subtext... Latin is very interesting.
Glad you enjoyed it
@@TheOTJ The screenwriting was as good as it gets, but the latin scene is fabulous...
There's another video on RUclips that gives a completely different breakdown: "When I drink, I speak my mind." "Do what you do best". "I don't believe drinking is what I do best." "Fools have to learn by experience" "It's your funeral." Which one is more accurate? I'd have to go with this one because, Pace Requiescat does mean Rest in peace, nothing about it being someone's funeral. Then again I suppose people can make up anything they want based on the action and stick subtitles onto the celluloid under the assumption the viewer doesn't know Latin from Lebanese.
One of the best scenes in the movie..best wishes always from paradise Fiji
Thank you SO MUCH for this video! I more or less got what was going on, but I didn't know the direct translations/interpretations thereof. I was a bit off, but close. This is ABSOLUTELY one of my TOP 5 Westerns, but I can't crown it Number 1 (as I don't have JUST one). Thanks again! :)
In my opinion the best Wyatt Earp movie
Agreed
One of my favorite movies. Also got me interested in Latin... the only Latin I memorized is from this movie.
I've come to notice Latin is full of proverbs. I was wondering the translation of "every action there is a reaction"
I Googled it but I'd rather come here and ask a pro. Great video thanks
Well I studied latin for years and many of my friends were ha p what they say and so try to figure it out especially if your from Portugal Spain france Italian especially Romanian and some others advieniat regnum tum en panam nostrum debetoribus nostrum
GREAT FUN! Thanks for sharing. According to contemporary accounts, John Ringo was indeed a highly educated man who at some point broke bad and decided to become an outlaw. I wish we knew more about Ringo's backstory because he's an even more interesting character than his opponents (who we hardly saints themselves) on the so-called other side of the law. Ringo may have had a story similar to the Earps; perhaps somewhat analogous to Holliday himself. Kilmer was magnificently cast and truly owned the part, demonstrating that he wasn't just a pretty boy with a Pepsodent smile - he had serious acting chops and truly earned his spurs (heh) in this magnificent feature.
A man's prime is when he has nothing to lose.
Very true
Inventus stultorum magister (est) would have been more grammatically correct, but it worked here to omit EST=IS. The recitation in the movie sounds like, "Youth, the teacher of fools", Rather than, "Youth is the teacher of fools." The statement didn't have a verb, but it had an actor.
Theres the reason why doc didnt pull his gun up.. because there's a saying that when you pull your gun and point it to peoples face you have to pull the trigger.. thats why doc didnt pull his gun to show his skills because he will actually pull that trigger and kill ringo not like johnny beacaus hes just too high strung ... Hes no daisy at all..
I watched this video once and have been looking for it ever since, very well done.
Thank you!
One of my favorite scenes I knew what it was hitting for when he said ain't no law round hear law dog all of them knew of each others reputation its alway a crazy youngn will to challenge a seasoned killer Doc knew his potential but it didn't matter
Just found the this scene and gonna have to say it’s already one of my favorites. Gonna learn some Latin just because of it. AAAGGGHHHHH HOLLYWOOD MOVIES SUCK. I wish Texas would start a Hollywood 2.0 and just make gunslinger movies all the time. This single scene is way more thought provoking than the last 20 years of Hollywood movies combined.
Doc Holliday: In vino veritas.
Meaning: In wine, there is truth.
Johnny Ringo: Age quod agis.
Meaning: Do what you do or watch what you do.
Doc Holliday: Credit Judaeus Apella, non ego.
Meaning: Let Apella the Jew believe, not I (Tell it to someone else, not I).
Johnny Ringo: Juventus stultorum magister.
Meaning: Youth is the teacher of fools.
Doc Holliday: In pace requiescat.
Meaning: Rest in peace.
The translation isn’t exactly correct...
Yeah, Technically book translation, but it's more like "there's truth in wine" "then be careful what you say" "Tell that to someone else, not me" "I let my gun do my talking" "It's your funeral"
Incredible cast of Actors and the Great movies from the talent of each individual, I 1st saw Powers Booth in the movie Souther Confort he was such Fine Actor, for me this movie was times a changing in the business.
I love my little cup.
It's very nice. I'd like to have one.
I'm sorry, it's one of a kind.
Perhaps you'd trade it for this pistol.
I can't. It was a gift from my girlfriend.
Arguably the best cast ever assembled for a film and without a doubt the career best for Val Kilmer
I'm pretty sure the "Iuventus stultorum" line is wrong. Doesn't make any sense in the scene really. Shouldn't it be "Eventus stultorum magister"
Val Kilmer made this great movie a fantastic movie. He played a hell of a fantastic role!!!
While everyone else is laughing
casually at Doc acting silly and spinning around his cup, Ringo has terror in his eyes at 9:50 that Doc has managed to copy all his fancy gunfighters moves (that he most likely spent a long time practicing) verbatim while he is drunk on the spot. Up until this moment Ringo was very sure of himself and ready to get in a gunfight with Doc, always escalating the situation with more insults.
It's so good because for the onlookers in the saloon, Doc spinning his cup around is the first time they WEREN’T scared since the conversation with Doc and Ringo started, but for Ringo it's the first time he WAS scared. ALSO, the casual viewer of this scene is like the onlookers in the saloon while the more in-depth viewers (us) are like Doc and Ringo.
What great, subtle acting at 9:50 that really sold the scene and what a masterfully done scene and movie.
The right phrase is "eventus stultorem magister" -> "action/experience is the teacher of fools"