First of all, i want to say thank you, for doing such an amazing job. I have a question fo you, we saw in London 2012, Nathan Adrian start doing high octaine in 100 free when there were at least 10 meters left. He was a foot and half behind james magnussen and he touches 1 hundredth of second before him, in terms of time or speed how does it effect the race?
Nathan has probably won more freestyle races by .01 seconds than any other swimmer I can recall. A lot of that has to do with the way he finishes with a no-breath, high-octane, high stroke rate freestyle technique on the last 8-10 meters of the race. Mike Bottom taught him to do that around 2008.
I have been having fun playing around with this... As near as I can tell, the higher the octane level, the more important it is to synchronize the arms, kind of like you do your feet with the flutter kick. One arm recovers, and the other pulls. I can feel how much it adds to my kicking too... More experimenting. I will be doing some more timed laps, maybe next week and will see how much difference this makes. I have been getting the feeling that with distance swimming, it isn't as essential for the arms to synchronize as it is in the sprints??? Kind of like distance can work better with more of a catch up style???
Great video about important detail, thanks. To be precise there is just one common misconception regarding the octanes. Octane number is rating of a fuel's ability to resist autoignition (engine knocking), it is not measure of energy content. It is true its used in high performance engines, but for the reason that it can withstand high compression without premature selfignition. Paradoxically, pure 87 (ethanol free) gasoline should get you further than 93 gasoline. It has higher specific gravity and density per unit of weight. But in reality, it differs from batch to batch according to how good job is done at a refinery.
You are right. The comparison with gasoline is not perfect. Most people, however, associate higher octane with more power and more cost...which is what applies here. Sometimes perception outweighs fact.
Well, timed myself in a few 50 yard sprints yesterday. On the last 2, I used the high octane straight arm recover, and on the other, I used the shorter bent arm recover and stroke. The times were almost identical, looking at the wall clock. The difference was with the high octane, I was at 9 full arm stroke cycles, per length, and on the short arm stroke, I was at 10 arm cycles.... I am guessing that as I practice this more, the stroke count may remain pretty much the same, but the time should go down. This has served to get me more focused on full extension on the front part of the stroke and with the full length finish part of the stroke where with the short/more bent arm, I wasn't quite getting there... More practice......
Your velocity is SR x DPS. With low octane you are getting less DPS but higher SR, compared to high octane. In time, your SR with high Octane will go up and so will your speed.
I am starting to think that part of the reason my straight arm stroke isn't as powerful or more powerful than my shorter arm strokes is that need to develop more brute strength. Just don't have the power to have it be as efficient. So, more laps and more strength training. I did notice from my first attempts at full on sprints that every thing between my shoulder blades let me know that I hadn't used those muscles like that in a long while.... More training....
Great video on a very misunderstood aspect of swimming. I think in the future as swimmers get stronger/fitter, the straighter arms will start appearing in more and more events as athletes learn to maintain it for longer distances. Still makes you wonder how someone like Alex Popov generated such tremendous power and torque with a completely relaxed bent elbow.
theraceclub It’s interesting to watch replays of that 96’ 50 free, your son takes such a drastically different approach than Popov, and it seems that his legacy has really prevailed in the sprint culture of swimming- even though he of course, lost that race. Outside of perhaps Michael Andrew (Ironic right, that the USRPT guy doesn’t even straight arm it), I struggle to think of any recent American sprinter in the 50 that hasn’t evolved to a straightened recovery. Hell, now it’s not just recovery- guys like Dressel are pulling significantly deeper as-well, and that all seems to be traced to your incredible family. Thanks for all this great content, and really raising awareness outside of the age-grouping community about the mechanics of swimming! I really can’t emphasize enough how incredible it is to have the lifetime experience of one of the greatest swimmers ever- at the touch of a button. 🙏
Straight arms are faster but need more control because the entry of the hand into the water shouldn’t be an aggressive downward force that straight arm freestyle generates
Virtually, it's about as deep as you can get it (older, stronger athletes typically have more success) with the straight arm pull - requires a lot of torque!
I am extremely grateful for this RUclips Channel as it has uncovered a lot of the problems us swimmers have been facing. This whole octane training makes sense to me. I understand the Kinetic Energy and how we can use gravity to our advantage on the recovery. At the end of the video, you talked about how swimmers had straight arms on the pull when performing at the high octane level. I can't remember which video it was but you made a video that said pulling with you arm straight down creates a lot of drag and that can be fixed by bending the elbow and keeping your elbows higher towards the surface. I have been using that tip and it is very helpful, but when performing at a high octane level, would it be best to keep the arm straight or to continue using the bent elbow technique?? Thanks
We advocate using a deeper pulling motion in one event, only: the 50 meter freestyle. In that event, one can sustain the higher drag forces for a shorter period of time, gaining more propulsion. For all other freestyle events, use the high elbow pulling motion...even if you choose to use a higher octane recovery.
Wow YOU are such experienced people explaining things in a scientific way I m amaized with this Please can I have your advice if I want to swim more than 200 to 400 and not more than 5minutes in the 200 and not more than 8minutes in the 400. Thank you a lot
This is a GREAT video! I've recently been wondering not so much about how high to recover my hands above the surface but about how much energy to expend on my freestyle entry. Whether to gently let my hand pierce the water or to do it more forcefully. I've come to the conclusion that it depends on the distance and intensity of the set but for me there really is no reason to be too gentle on my entry unless I am warming up or cooling down.
Even the 53 Olympians that trained with us would warm up or cool down by coming up slowly on the recovery and always coming down HARD! Practice that whether going fast or slow and you will always capture that energy at the right time.
Yes. Sprinters will tend to pull deeper....particularly the stronger male elite sprinters. More drag...more propulsion...but they can manage for a 50 meter sprint. We have lots of videos on our subscription channels on correct pulling motion. www.theraceclub.com.
Not if they are using a proper pulling motion technique. We find that swimmers that pull deep tend to get problems... we've done a few vids in our subscription on this
Probably not that important until the hand is approaching the water, I don't see why having a loose wrist in the recovery until that point would cause a deficit!
Never enter with the hand first. The old concept of fingers, wrist, elbow is wrong. Fully hyperextend the arm at entry. The triceps should enter the water first.
Gary, could you please break down Ian Thorpe's hip driven stroke, his use of his legs, his extension of his arms and why his technique look too smooth.
Ian may have had the strongest kick in history. That kick enabled him to swim fast at a relatively slow stroke rate (hip driven freestyle). I feel that Ian's head position was too forward (elevated). Yet he proved that even a barge can go fast with enough power behind it. His elevated head position probably made him hate the 1500 meter races. His slower stroke rate didn't fare as well in the 100 meters...but he still swam fast there.
Interesting explanations. I think it was 2 Olympics ago where the swimmers were using a loping style with one arm high and straighter, which made no sense to me since it was only done on one side. This makes far more sense. Now I know what was being discussed a bit ago on your videos about the straight arm recovery. Faster over the top also means faster pull under the water. The whole action/reaction thing in freestyle fascinates me. Spiral energy as my Tai Chi instructor calls it...I think with my over arm side stroke, I may resemble the loping style more since the under arm doesn't come out of the water...
With loping freestyle (what I call Hybrid) one arm (on breath side) comes down harder than on the other side, generating more propulsion for the surge, when head goes underwater after the breath.
Kind of what I figured. I think the loping style will apply to my side stroke better than trying to do it with both sides. I was playing the high octane stroke yesterday in the pool. I noticed that it does tend to give much better results in full extension of the arm in front and the arm behind in the finish part of the stroke. I have to practice it to the point where I don't have to think about it... 10,000 more times as my martial arts instructor says... I was chatting with one of the coaches there, and he was familiar with the technique but didn't understand it. I will pass this on to him. He wasn't familiar with your channel.
I'm having a problem with tired biceps and triceps, not so much with lats. I'm thinking it is because of my recovery, meaning I'm not giving my arms enough relax in the phase. In another word, I'm always tense up my arms, probably because I think it would help for a faster recovery and stroke rate. What are your thoughts? Thanks you very much
@@theraceclub Thank you very much. I will try it right away. Also, for the 6 beat kick, is there a good drill to improve the endurance of the legs? My kicks are quite fast but sustaining it for over 75m is borderline impossible. Again, thanks for replying; I believe that your contents are top notch on RUclips so keep on doing that!
Hi, could you please clarify what you mean by coupling motions. When I search Google for coupling motions I do not get results related to biomechanics. I would like to understand the physics that makes coupling motions work. Is there a different name for what you are talking about in general physics? Thanks, appreciate your work
Hi there coach! 2 months noob swimmer here but super geeky about the fluid dynamics in swimming. Massive thanks for constantly creating such high-quality content not to mention your avid engagement with the comments. I've just got a few questions here and would really appreciate it if you could share a few words. In racing or just average pool out here, I get to see a lot of swimmers with one straight arm recovery and one bent arm recovery, and if I recall correctly usually with a bent arm on the breathing side(for longer window maybe?). What is the reason behind this? Another one is a myth that's been bugging me for ages. There is a saying that you are faster in deeper pools due to the waves, which you created through swimming, bouncing back off the wall are weaker, causing less interference. It seems specious, but for me it doesn't stand. Because a swimmer's speed might be related to horizontal waves(wave drag), but in this case, the pool depth only affects vertical waves. I would have run a CFD analysis if only I were good at it while at uni. What's your view on this? And the last one is about lane position. I heard from some commentators that if you are next to the top lane, say lane 4, you can 'suck' on him like a magnet with a parasitic effect. Is this related to wave drag and how? I would love to have your paid subscription yet I'm having trouble accessing the website since I currently live in Asia. The website does load but usually takes 5 minutes or so to show the full page. Maybe there's a fix to the server or IP? Would you recommend any books covering swim physics? Kind regards
Hey Sean, Great questions. There is no rule that both arms need to be the same on the recovery, although there are physics reasons why straight arm is better for sprint and bent arm for distance. Lotte Friis (Denmark) and Cesar Cielo (Brazil) were notable examples of this. Much of the wave action of swimmers in pools is caused by the vortices of the legs, not as much from the arms. Much of the feet motion is up and down, so a wave bounces off the bottom of the pool. Waves that reach the surface will propagate outward. The nearer the bottom of the pool and the stronger (and more) swimmers, the bigger the waves. Shallow pools and flat walls on any side are notoriously bad for swimming waves. The lane markers are designed to cut down waves and do so to a degree. The lane position in a pool does matter. Being adjacent to any wall (outside lane) generally means more turbulence. If one positions oneself at about the waist to the feet of the swimmer in the next lane, it is also possible to catch a little bit of the vortex from the lead swimmer and get pulled along. Jason Lezak did this famously with Alain Bernard in the 2008 Olympic Games. We just released a new book on swimming technique, Fundamentals of Fast Swimming (Amazon) which contains a simplified explanation of the physics and physiology of swimming. Thanks for the tip on the website. I will discuss with our IT guys today. Hope to get it better soon.
Your body works best in the water if arms and legs work together. A good kick rhythm will have your right food engaging a kick while your left hand engages a pull at the same time. Putting a fin on one foot and a paddle on the opposite hand exaggerates this feeling so it trains you to have better timing. That is my best guess at least.
Kevin is correct. Typically the right foot will do a strong surge down kick when the left hand enters the water. The use of fin and paddle on the opposite sides will simply exaggerate the power of the coupling motion of body rotation and arm recovery.
You are welcome. Mike Bottom coined the term Body Driven Freestyle, when referring to straight arm recovery technique. Essentially, it is the same as High Octane Freestyle.
His version said that it only use when swimmer dying in the last 10m to 15m for 100m freestyle but I saw some the olympic swimmer do it from the beginning in 50m freestyle.My question : is it ok to use the high octane freestyle/straight arm technique from beginning until finish in 100m freestyle race? if yes, please give me your best tip & advice.Thank you very much Mr. Garry, i'm really appreciate it.. ❤😃🙏
I have a mental problem with pausing my catch stroke once my arm enters the water to extend my shoulder further infront of me while sprinting. This results in my stroke rate being slower than it should but when i try to not pause my stroke, my technique crumbles.
Try to hyperextend the shoulder during the recovery so that the hand hits the water with the arm fully extended. Then get into lift phase immediately. Try using a tempo trainer or a dolphin kick freestyle drill to help you out. You can find both drills on our subscription channels in Lane 3. www.theraceclub.com
The 50 meter sprinters will pull deeper because it offers more propulsion (and more frontal drag). Anything over 50 meters we recommend the high elbow pulling motion or early vertical forearm.
You are an astute observer. I have recommended to Brad that he should look down, not forward while sprinting. He has since made this adjustment. It is faster with the head down, looking straight down, not forward.
Breast / freestyle - has nice - fused memories. Armes - do much mores. Arm pull / thrustsz. In English- thrusters. Butt sz = gives sizes - shapes - dynamices. Mva -- masz velocity acelerates - or bodily density - mainly bones. Or heaviest organs. Cluster linear anatomy! Her majesty's Naval Acadamy - MD courses.
Great video with the analogies of arm recovery But then you need to discuss kick speed and arm bend under the water So with increasing speed there MAY be less bend under water With all this being said, everyone is different and coaches need to find a correct style for each swimmer- What do you think?
I agree completely. Most elite sprinters pull deeper in the water (causing more drag) but men tend to pull a little deeper than the women. One must find the sweet spot between propulsion and drag forces. Less drag is always a better idea in the 200 and up events.
Not really. Janet Evans used high octane recovery on the 800 free. Leah Smith...high octane distance swimmer. Lotte Friis...high octane distance swimmer (on one arm). For the most part it is a technique for sprinters...but not always.
I performed the 93 one just twice a certain day months ago and never managed to replicate it again, not sure why I have this mental blocking ever since. In any case, the amount of generated power was way too high based on I was used to, I still remember being so happy that I had done what Schoeman did on that Body Rotation video ... one day I will be able to do it once more.
![Felix "Unfair" | [Stray Kids : SKZ-PLAYER]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/Oswujxm2Ag0/mqdefault.jpg)
great explanation to know exactly the reason high or low relaxation hands. Thank you very much !
Absolutely - thanks for the feedback!
This video answered my questions on freestyle arm positions. Thanks.
Glad it helped you!
Thanks I will play with this today. 🙏
You are welcome.
Great great great. I always asked myself that question! Thanks
Happy you enjoyed it!
First of all, i want to say thank you, for doing such an amazing job. I have a question fo you, we saw in London 2012, Nathan Adrian start doing high octaine in 100 free when there were at least 10 meters left. He was a foot and half behind james magnussen and he touches 1 hundredth of second before him, in terms of time or speed how does it effect the race?
Nathan has probably won more freestyle races by .01 seconds than any other swimmer I can recall. A lot of that has to do with the way he finishes with a no-breath, high-octane, high stroke rate freestyle technique on the last 8-10 meters of the race. Mike Bottom taught him to do that around 2008.
Interesting talk/instruction thank you
You are welcome! Glad you liked it.
I have been having fun playing around with this... As near as I can tell, the higher the octane level, the more important it is to synchronize the arms, kind of like you do your feet with the flutter kick. One arm recovers, and the other pulls. I can feel how much it adds to my kicking too... More experimenting. I will be doing some more timed laps, maybe next week and will see how much difference this makes. I have been getting the feeling that with distance swimming, it isn't as essential for the arms to synchronize as it is in the sprints??? Kind of like distance can work better with more of a catch up style???
Yes...don't do a catch up freestyle technique...or you lose the coupling effect of the arm recovery and body rotation.
Thanks a lot! I have been trying to find this information for my son....
You are welcome!
So good
Thank you!!
Great Class Thank's!!
Thanks!
Subscribe to Lane 2 or 3 at www.theraceclub.com to see many more videos!
Great video about important detail, thanks. To be precise there is just one common misconception regarding the octanes. Octane number is rating of a fuel's ability to resist autoignition (engine knocking), it is not measure of energy content. It is true its used in high performance engines, but for the reason that it can withstand high compression without premature selfignition. Paradoxically, pure 87 (ethanol free) gasoline should get you further than 93 gasoline. It has higher specific gravity and density per unit of weight. But in reality, it differs from batch to batch according to how good job is done at a refinery.
You are right. The comparison with gasoline is not perfect. Most people, however, associate higher octane with more power and more cost...which is what applies here. Sometimes perception outweighs fact.
Soy de Argentina y estoy Fascinado con tus videos.....Te FELICITO !!! Saludos
Race club should hire you
Great video on recovery, very informative, just what I needed. Thank you. So helpful.
Glad it was helpful!
Well, timed myself in a few 50 yard sprints yesterday. On the last 2, I used the high octane straight arm recover, and on the other, I used the shorter bent arm recover and stroke. The times were almost identical, looking at the wall clock. The difference was with the high octane, I was at 9 full arm stroke cycles, per length, and on the short arm stroke, I was at 10 arm cycles.... I am guessing that as I practice this more, the stroke count may remain pretty much the same, but the time should go down. This has served to get me more focused on full extension on the front part of the stroke and with the full length finish part of the stroke where with the short/more bent arm, I wasn't quite getting there... More practice......
Your velocity is SR x DPS. With low octane you are getting less DPS but higher SR, compared to high octane. In time, your SR with high Octane will go up and so will your speed.
I am starting to think that part of the reason my straight arm stroke isn't as powerful or more powerful than my shorter arm strokes is that need to develop more brute strength. Just don't have the power to have it be as efficient. So, more laps and more strength training. I did notice from my first attempts at full on sprints that every thing between my shoulder blades let me know that I hadn't used those muscles like that in a long while.... More training....
Great video on a very misunderstood aspect of swimming. I think in the future as swimmers get stronger/fitter, the straighter arms will start appearing in more and more events as athletes learn to maintain it for longer distances. Still makes you wonder how someone like Alex Popov generated such tremendous power and torque with a completely relaxed bent elbow.
Popov had great body rotation and threw the hand down hard at the end of the recovery....which added more energy.
theraceclub It’s interesting to watch replays of that 96’ 50 free, your son takes such a drastically different approach than Popov, and it seems that his legacy has really prevailed in the sprint culture of swimming- even though he of course, lost that race.
Outside of perhaps Michael Andrew (Ironic right, that the USRPT guy doesn’t even straight arm it), I struggle to think of any recent American sprinter in the 50 that hasn’t evolved to a straightened recovery. Hell, now it’s not just recovery- guys like Dressel are pulling significantly deeper as-well, and that all seems to be traced to your incredible family.
Thanks for all this great content, and really raising awareness outside of the age-grouping community about the mechanics of swimming! I really can’t emphasize enough how incredible it is to have the lifetime experience of one of the greatest swimmers ever- at the touch of a button. 🙏
Thanks for the nice words. You are most welcome. Just trying to figure this interesting sport out...and share our thoughts with others.
Vlad Morozov goes straight
Straight arms are faster but need more control because the entry of the hand into the water shouldn’t be an aggressive downward force that straight arm freestyle generates
Absolutely loved watching this!
Thank you!
Don't forget you can subscribe to Lane 2 or 3 and see many more great videos. www.theraceclub.com.
In the underwater pull the arm is still fully straight in the high octane?
Virtually, it's about as deep as you can get it (older, stronger athletes typically have more success) with the straight arm pull - requires a lot of torque!
I am extremely grateful for this RUclips Channel as it has uncovered a lot of the problems us swimmers have been facing. This whole octane training makes sense to me. I understand the Kinetic Energy and how we can use gravity to our advantage on the recovery. At the end of the video, you talked about how swimmers had straight arms on the pull when performing at the high octane level. I can't remember which video it was but you made a video that said pulling with you arm straight down creates a lot of drag and that can be fixed by bending the elbow and keeping your elbows higher towards the surface. I have been using that tip and it is very helpful, but when performing at a high octane level, would it be best to keep the arm straight or to continue using the bent elbow technique?? Thanks
We advocate using a deeper pulling motion in one event, only: the 50 meter freestyle. In that event, one can sustain the higher drag forces for a shorter period of time, gaining more propulsion. For all other freestyle events, use the high elbow pulling motion...even if you choose to use a higher octane recovery.
Great question. I am happy that it was answered, I needed the same answered.
Wow YOU are such experienced people explaining things in a scientific way I m amaized with this
Please can I have your advice if I want to swim more than 200 to 400 and not more than 5minutes in the 200 and not more than 8minutes in the 400.
Thank you a lot
Thank you! Usually in 200 and up you will use a lower octane recovery...but you must train hard for those events.
@@theraceclub Yes, thank you
This is a GREAT video! I've recently been wondering not so much about how high to recover my hands above the surface but about how much energy to expend on my freestyle entry. Whether to gently let my hand pierce the water or to do it more forcefully. I've come to the conclusion that it depends on the distance and intensity of the set but for me there really is no reason to be too gentle on my entry unless I am warming up or cooling down.
Even the 53 Olympians that trained with us would warm up or cool down by coming up slowly on the recovery and always coming down HARD! Practice that whether going fast or slow and you will always capture that energy at the right time.
@@theraceclub I will work on that! Thanks for the response!
Are there corresponding changes (spontaneous or deliberate) in the underwater pull too ?
Please elaborate.
Yes. Sprinters will tend to pull deeper....particularly the stronger male elite sprinters. More drag...more propulsion...but they can manage for a 50 meter sprint. We have lots of videos on our subscription channels on correct pulling motion. www.theraceclub.com.
Does a high arm recovery increse the shoulders pain?
Not if they are using a proper pulling motion technique. We find that swimmers that pull deep tend to get problems... we've done a few vids in our subscription on this
What about the wrist in the recovery phase of the high octane ,do i keep it loose?
Probably not that important until the hand is approaching the water, I don't see why having a loose wrist in the recovery until that point would cause a deficit!
Is the hand still entering the water first with the highest level, or is the forearm slapping down with it?
Never enter with the hand first. The old concept of fingers, wrist, elbow is wrong. Fully hyperextend the arm at entry. The triceps should enter the water first.
Gary, could you please break down Ian Thorpe's hip driven stroke, his use of his legs, his extension of his arms and why his technique look too smooth.
he has flippers for feet
@@SwimmingFit that's true size 17
Ian may have had the strongest kick in history. That kick enabled him to swim fast at a relatively slow stroke rate (hip driven freestyle). I feel that Ian's head position was too forward (elevated). Yet he proved that even a barge can go fast with enough power behind it. His elevated head position probably made him hate the 1500 meter races. His slower stroke rate didn't fare as well in the 100 meters...but he still swam fast there.
@@theraceclub Thank you Gary, he did have 2 world record times in the 800m though. Wonder how he could have done at the 15
Interesting explanations. I think it was 2 Olympics ago where the swimmers were using a loping style with one arm high and straighter, which made no sense to me since it was only done on one side. This makes far more sense. Now I know what was being discussed a bit ago on your videos about the straight arm recovery. Faster over the top also means faster pull under the water. The whole action/reaction thing in freestyle fascinates me. Spiral energy as my Tai Chi instructor calls it...I think with my over arm side stroke, I may resemble the loping style more since the under arm doesn't come out of the water...
With loping freestyle (what I call Hybrid) one arm (on breath side) comes down harder than on the other side, generating more propulsion for the surge, when head goes underwater after the breath.
Kind of what I figured. I think the loping style will apply to my side stroke better than trying to do it with both sides. I was playing the high octane stroke yesterday in the pool. I noticed that it does tend to give much better results in full extension of the arm in front and the arm behind in the finish part of the stroke. I have to practice it to the point where I don't have to think about it... 10,000 more times as my martial arts instructor says... I was chatting with one of the coaches there, and he was familiar with the technique but didn't understand it. I will pass this on to him. He wasn't familiar with your channel.
R1 is for fighter jets , Propulsion aerodynamics in the Air or water
.
Thanks for the insight!
I'm having a problem with tired biceps and triceps, not so much with lats. I'm thinking it is because of my recovery, meaning I'm not giving my arms enough relax in the phase. In another word, I'm always tense up my arms, probably because I think it would help for a faster recovery and stroke rate. What are your thoughts? Thanks you very much
Relax your wrist on the recovery. Using fast stroke rate takes much strength and conditioning.
@@theraceclub Thank you very much. I will try it right away.
Also, for the 6 beat kick, is there a good drill to improve the endurance of the legs? My kicks are quite fast but sustaining it for over 75m is borderline impossible. Again, thanks for replying; I believe that your contents are top notch on RUclips so keep on doing that!
Hi, could you please clarify what you mean by coupling motions. When I search Google for coupling motions I do not get results related to biomechanics. I would like to understand the physics that makes coupling motions work. Is there a different name for what you are talking about in general physics? Thanks, appreciate your work
Coupling motions is a term that we defined. In physics, I could not find a name used for these important motions. Yet they are very true.
Hi there coach! 2 months noob swimmer here but super geeky about the fluid dynamics in swimming. Massive thanks for constantly creating such high-quality content not to mention your avid engagement with the comments. I've just got a few questions here and would really appreciate it if you could share a few words.
In racing or just average pool out here, I get to see a lot of swimmers with one straight arm recovery and one bent arm recovery, and if I recall correctly usually with a bent arm on the breathing side(for longer window maybe?). What is the reason behind this?
Another one is a myth that's been bugging me for ages. There is a saying that you are faster in deeper pools due to the waves, which you created through swimming, bouncing back off the wall are weaker, causing less interference. It seems specious, but for me it doesn't stand. Because a swimmer's speed might be related to horizontal waves(wave drag), but in this case, the pool depth only affects vertical waves. I would have run a CFD analysis if only I were good at it while at uni. What's your view on this?
And the last one is about lane position. I heard from some commentators that if you are next to the top lane, say lane 4, you can 'suck' on him like a magnet with a parasitic effect. Is this related to wave drag and how?
I would love to have your paid subscription yet I'm having trouble accessing the website since I currently live in Asia. The website does load but usually takes 5 minutes or so to show the full page. Maybe there's a fix to the server or IP? Would you recommend any books covering swim physics?
Kind regards
Hey Sean, Great questions. There is no rule that both arms need to be the same on the recovery, although there are physics reasons why straight arm is better for sprint and bent arm for distance. Lotte Friis (Denmark) and Cesar Cielo (Brazil) were notable examples of this.
Much of the wave action of swimmers in pools is caused by the vortices of the legs, not as much from the arms. Much of the feet motion is up and down, so a wave bounces off the bottom of the pool. Waves that reach the surface will propagate outward. The nearer the bottom of the pool and the stronger (and more) swimmers, the bigger the waves. Shallow pools and flat walls on any side are notoriously bad for swimming waves. The lane markers are designed to cut down waves and do so to a degree.
The lane position in a pool does matter. Being adjacent to any wall (outside lane) generally means more turbulence. If one positions oneself at about the waist to the feet of the swimmer in the next lane, it is also possible to catch a little bit of the vortex from the lead swimmer and get pulled along. Jason Lezak did this famously with Alain Bernard in the 2008 Olympic Games.
We just released a new book on swimming technique, Fundamentals of Fast Swimming (Amazon) which contains a simplified explanation of the physics and physiology of swimming.
Thanks for the tip on the website. I will discuss with our IT guys today. Hope to get it better soon.
Will you tell me please the meaning of this drill - a paddle on the left hand and a fin on the right foot?
Your body works best in the water if arms and legs work together. A good kick rhythm will have your right food engaging a kick while your left hand engages a pull at the same time. Putting a fin on one foot and a paddle on the opposite hand exaggerates this feeling so it trains you to have better timing. That is my best guess at least.
Kevin is correct. Typically the right foot will do a strong surge down kick when the left hand enters the water. The use of fin and paddle on the opposite sides will simply exaggerate the power of the coupling motion of body rotation and arm recovery.
@@kevincarson522 Thank you, Kevin.
@@theraceclub Thank you, Gary Hall,Sr.
Does lane 2 subscription offers drills to learn those techniques?
Yes...Lanes 2 and 3 will have all of the drills we recommend for those techniques. Some are already completed and others are yet to come soon.
Is the 'high octane arm recovery' same with 'body driven freestyle' ? Thanks a lot for the awesome video.❤😃👍🙏
You are welcome. Mike Bottom coined the term Body Driven Freestyle, when referring to straight arm recovery technique. Essentially, it is the same as High Octane Freestyle.
His version said that it only use when swimmer dying in the last 10m to 15m for 100m freestyle but I saw some the olympic swimmer do it from the beginning in 50m freestyle.My question : is it ok to use the high octane freestyle/straight arm technique from beginning until finish in 100m freestyle race? if yes, please give me your best tip & advice.Thank you very much Mr. Garry, i'm really appreciate it.. ❤😃🙏
I have a mental problem with pausing my catch stroke once my arm enters the water to extend my shoulder further infront of me while sprinting. This results in my stroke rate being slower than it should but when i try to not pause my stroke, my technique crumbles.
Try to hyperextend the shoulder during the recovery so that the hand hits the water with the arm fully extended. Then get into lift phase immediately. Try using a tempo trainer or a dolphin kick freestyle drill to help you out. You can find both drills on our subscription channels in Lane 3. www.theraceclub.com
@@theraceclub never thought of it like that thanks
Should you have the same catch under water with each of these levels?
The 50 meter sprinters will pull deeper because it offers more propulsion (and more frontal drag). Anything over 50 meters we recommend the high elbow pulling motion or early vertical forearm.
Alright thanks 👍
5:40 - why the chin is up?
You are an astute observer. I have recommended to Brad that he should look down, not forward while sprinting. He has since made this adjustment. It is faster with the head down, looking straight down, not forward.
Breast / freestyle - has nice - fused memories. Armes - do much mores. Arm pull / thrustsz. In English- thrusters.
Butt sz = gives sizes - shapes - dynamices. Mva -- masz velocity acelerates - or bodily density - mainly bones. Or heaviest organs. Cluster linear anatomy! Her majesty's Naval Acadamy - MD courses.
Drag vs Propulsion....that is what it is all about.
Great video with the analogies of arm recovery
But then you need to discuss kick speed and arm bend under the water
So with increasing speed there MAY be less bend under water
With all this being said, everyone is different and coaches need to find a correct style for each swimmer-
What do you think?
I agree completely. Most elite sprinters pull deeper in the water (causing more drag) but men tend to pull a little deeper than the women. One must find the sweet spot between propulsion and drag forces. Less drag is always a better idea in the 200 and up events.
thanks for the video, but high octane is only suitable to 50m sprints..
Not really. Janet Evans used high octane recovery on the 800 free. Leah Smith...high octane distance swimmer. Lotte Friis...high octane distance swimmer (on one arm). For the most part it is a technique for sprinters...but not always.
How to keep fast kick when arms are turning faster?
Practice. With higher stroke rate, the kicking stroke rate not only goes up, but the intensity of the kick does also.
so sprinters with a straight arm are usually faster.. and with a bent elbows it's more relaxed for longer distances!
Yes...that is the idea.
I performed the 93 one just twice a certain day months ago and never managed to replicate it again, not sure why I have this mental blocking ever since. In any case, the amount of generated power was way too high based on I was used to, I still remember being so happy that I had done what Schoeman did on that Body Rotation video ... one day I will be able to do it once more.
No one said High Octane freestyle is easy! You need to be fit and strong to sustain...even for 50 meters.
It’s who has the better explanation
Thanks. Glad it helped.
Bovel is the only one that has a nice recovery
Not if you like more kinetic energy in the arm recovery. George used a bent arm, but most sprinters go straight arm or nearly straight arm today.
But why do triathletes do medium to high octane even though they swim long distances?
Because it keeps them moving much better in open water.
Most triathletes that don't train enough swimming will use lower octane, because they just cannot sustain the higher octane levels for too long.
Phelps with low octane score and fastest.
Yes....but not in the 50 free!
Listen to your body. This technique may bring you more injury to your shoulders
Not sure there is any good data to support that notion. If you have it, please share it.