My Japanese prof would get very angry if we used the straight English R sound, but if we used the English L (or for 2 of us who could properly roll an R like in Spanish) she could not hear a difference. She, of course, is a native speaker from Japan.
I hear what you say and agree with most of what you have written here...just to make it clear, this vid is intended to be a first step to keep learners moving forward instead of getting stuck and discouraged. Technically speaking there is a lot more to getting the "perfect" pronunciation. But after speaking to many native Japanese speakers, they all agree that the L is closer than the R. As for rya,rye,ryo; using the L or rolled R is more difficult, but it's the correct pronunciation.
is it similar to the Spanish rolling R but just like a millisecond quicker? like in the way they say in spanish "reloj" (れろ is the closet pronunciation of Reloj) or Rata (らた is the closest pronunciation). What I hear is a quick r flick, that creates a slick L and by the time your tongue falls to the bottom of your mouth it creates a soft D / soft T sound. or does it have to do by the region of japan the person comes from. Some japanese people sound like they are rolling the R for a split second, while others sound like they are using an L+ slight D, while other's sound like are trying to pronounce an R like they have their tongue cut off.
+Hipster Black Metal That hits pretty much every detail that needs to be done. The only claim that many Japanese teachers tend to make is that the Japanese らりるれろ is not as strong (and as you said) not as prolonged as the Spanish rolling R.
ShoyuJapanese Thank you. I always wondered that, I wasn't sure if I was mispronouncing らりるれろ because I hear that many people have a hard time pronouncing らりるれろ. I am assuming the R sounds are soft like the U (う) sound in ふ. While most people may say ふ like ふう. Thank you for your response.
@Warba98 Yes, just use your rolling R. You should be fine. (Just a note: Pronunciation comes with time, usage and effort in language learning. Again it takes time.) A couple of Spanish speaking people I know in Japan speak Japanese using the rolling R and it's all good.
To be honest, I can't quite catch the image of that mix, BUT if you can roll your "r", it works. And like I say in the vid, I hear a lot (A LOT) of Japanese people pronouncing this line with what is way closer to an "L" sound than an "R" sound. Hope this helps...
Everyone is saying it sounds like an 'L' but I only hear a 'D' sound when ra ri ru re ro is pronounced. Whenever I try to pronounce it, it sounds right, but then I feel like I'm doing it wrong because people are saying it should be close to an 'L' sound.
Thanks so much for doing this video,i have been struggling with how to say the r's for the longest time now.lol.So,i think this will definitely help alot.I just subscribed to your channel,so i'm gonna check out your other videos!
Are there different pronunciations for the "r"? Maybe it's just me, but I feel like when I listen to Japanese, I can hear a few different sounds. A Spanish R, an L, and even an N. Also, could you make a video about differentiating between the different pronunciations of "n" and syllabic n? I'm pretty confused in this area.
I think that since this is a video, saying to use L is fine but an English L is soooo far forward in your mouth (talking about your tongue) that it will sound no closer than using R. I think it's a great suggestion though because if people understand what you've done in the video, they will get closer since the R-sound in America does not include touching your tongue to the rough of your mouth. But the Japanese R is basically the L-sound but with your tongue farther back and with a quicker tap.
Could I really just use my rolling R like in Dutch and Spanish? And maybe let it sound a bit more like an L? I tried a lot of times but I can only say that rolling R ;)
It might be closer, but this is still not correct. The English L is a lateral consonant, which means the air is going out around the tongue and exiting the mouth. You can hold an L as long as you have air in your lungs. The Japanese R is a retroflex flap. The tongue taps the roof of the mouth. It cannot be held. It is a distinct consonant that needs to be learned. Using an L or a rolled R will make pronouncing the palatalized りゃ りゅ りょ (rya,ryu,ryo) more difficult.
So you still haven't taught how to pronounce R like a Japanese... Currently I can pronounce R in 3 ways: in clean English way like a native English speaker, and two like in Russian language, the hard R sound and the soft R sound(like when you about to say ri) none of those ways sound like Japanese R wtf?
10 years later and I am here
Same >_
I came for the actual tutorial, and stayed for the special effects. This video actually helped quite a bit, ty.
a tip: watch movies on flixzone. I've been using it for watching a lot of movies recently.
@Damari Damien yea, been using Flixzone for months myself :)
My Japanese prof would get very angry if we used the straight English R sound, but if we used the English L (or for 2 of us who could properly roll an R like in Spanish) she could not hear a difference. She, of course, is a native speaker from Japan.
I tried flicking my tongue from the roof of my mouth like I was rolling an R, but I only did a single flick. It seemed to get the correct sound.
I hear what you say and agree with most of what you have written here...just to make it clear, this vid is intended to be a first step to keep learners moving forward instead of getting stuck and discouraged. Technically speaking there is a lot more to getting the "perfect" pronunciation. But after speaking to many native Japanese speakers, they all agree that the L is closer than the R. As for rya,rye,ryo; using the L or rolled R is more difficult, but it's the correct pronunciation.
is it similar to the Spanish rolling R but just like a millisecond quicker? like in the way they say in spanish "reloj" (れろ is the closet pronunciation of Reloj) or Rata (らた is the closest pronunciation). What I hear is a quick r flick, that creates a slick L and by the time your tongue falls to the bottom of your mouth it creates a soft D / soft T sound.
or does it have to do by the region of japan the person comes from. Some japanese people sound like they are rolling the R for a split second, while others sound like they are using an L+ slight D, while other's sound like are trying to pronounce an R like they have their tongue cut off.
+Hipster Black Metal That hits pretty much every detail that needs to be done. The only claim that many Japanese teachers tend to make is that the Japanese らりるれろ is not as strong (and as you said) not as prolonged as the Spanish rolling R.
ShoyuJapanese
Thank you. I always wondered that, I wasn't sure if I was mispronouncing らりるれろ because I hear that many people have a hard time pronouncing らりるれろ. I am assuming the R sounds are soft like the U (う) sound in ふ. While most people may say ふ like ふう.
Thank you for your response.
@@ShoyuJapanese Can I use L to pronounce Ryo Rya?
@Warba98 Yes, just use your rolling R. You should be fine. (Just a note: Pronunciation comes with time, usage and effort in language learning. Again it takes time.) A couple of Spanish speaking people I know in Japan speak Japanese using the rolling R and it's all good.
To be honest, I can't quite catch the image of that mix, BUT if you can roll your "r", it works. And like I say in the vid, I hear a lot (A LOT) of Japanese people pronouncing this line with what is way closer to an "L" sound than an "R" sound. Hope this helps...
That intro was awesome!
Everyone is saying it sounds like an 'L' but I only hear a 'D' sound when ra ri ru re ro is pronounced. Whenever I try to pronounce it, it sounds right, but then I feel like I'm doing it wrong because people are saying it should be close to an 'L' sound.
Thanx man, the best explanaition on youtube!
Thanks so much for doing this video,i have been struggling with how to say the r's for the longest time now.lol.So,i think this will definitely help alot.I just subscribed to your channel,so i'm gonna check out your other videos!
Thank you very much! I really appreciate it!
Didnt know a rolling R could be used for this, +100 relief
I have been trying to figure out how to say the R line forever. I always thought it kind of sounded like the L sound. Thanks
Thanks - this was great so I subscribe.
Someone said that you can pronounce R like R+L+D, does work too?
Anyway, thanks dude.
Yes the R+L+D works too (as long as you can capture the image of that)
@@ShoyuJapanese Can I pronounce ryo, ryu with the L sound too?
R has been driving me nuts, thanks.
Are there different pronunciations for the "r"? Maybe it's just me, but I feel like when I listen to Japanese, I can hear a few different sounds. A Spanish R, an L, and even an N.
Also, could you make a video about differentiating between the different pronunciations of "n" and syllabic n? I'm pretty confused in this area.
Excelentes vídeos publicados! Uma pena eu não dominar o idioma inglês para aproveitar 100%...
vero, anche per noi italiani.
I think that since this is a video, saying to use L is fine but an English L is soooo far forward in your mouth (talking about your tongue) that it will sound no closer than using R. I think it's a great suggestion though because if people understand what you've done in the video, they will get closer since the R-sound in America does not include touching your tongue to the rough of your mouth. But the Japanese R is basically the L-sound but with your tongue farther back and with a quicker tap.
Thank you!
ありがとう ございます。
This is pronounced the same as the Dutch R, yay :D
Could I really just use my rolling R like in Dutch and Spanish? And maybe let it sound a bit more like an L? I tried a lot of times but I can only say that rolling R ;)
I knew it!
Worked for me too :)
Mine sound to much like D's
Omfg me too
It might be closer, but this is still not correct.
The English L is a lateral consonant, which means the air is going out around the tongue and exiting the mouth. You can hold an L as long as you have air in your lungs.
The Japanese R is a retroflex flap. The tongue taps the roof of the mouth. It cannot be held. It is a distinct consonant that needs to be learned.
Using an L or a rolled R will make pronouncing the palatalized りゃ りゅ りょ (rya,ryu,ryo) more difficult.
Arigato, sensei. :-)
So you still haven't taught how to pronounce R like a Japanese... Currently I can pronounce R in 3 ways: in clean English way like a native English speaker, and two like in Russian language, the hard R sound and the soft R sound(like when you about to say ri) none of those ways sound like Japanese R wtf?
SHOYU! SHOMI!
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