@@jarod1701 better check the terms of service... Haha you don't own anything these days. You are just given a usage license. It's like your debit card. It doesn't belong to you. It must be surrendered on request.
Nintendo single-handedly is the reason I raised the black flag, and I've only raised the flag for them out of civil disobedience towards their legal team
Reading the actual lawsuit, the entire case is a COMPLETE nothing-burger. Without assuming gross incompetence, the only play I can see on Nintendo's part is that they want to bleed Tropic Haze LLC (Yuzu parent company) dry. Regardless, it's FOSS, so it will still continue to exist afterwards. To answer why they might've taken this swing in the first place, my guesses are A. Yuzu was making too much money B. They thought there was the *slightest* chance they could win, and given the existing precedent for emulation any chance might be a chance worth taking C. A combination of both D. Similar to A, but basically just "punitive action".
A lot of the established case law regarding emulation is pre-DMCA, which, combined with the further corporatist swing of the US courts over the past decades, and their win on the Gary Bowser case, make for an extremely good chance that Nintendo is going to win this. And Nintendo is clearly also trying to use this to kill emulation altogether, as they're not just citing the piracy of new games as an issue, but that they consider selling older gen games to play on their new consoles as a core part of their business that emulation is eating into.
@@meecobAny set of competent copyright lawyers should be able to defend against this pretty readily. The lawsuit itself is pretty shaky based on precedent. I guarantee its going to cost Nintendo many times more money to try to win this than it will to adequately defend against it.
@@ScotsmanGamer Why don't you believe the guy ? he get's a few likes because he donates to them and you try and bite him in the neck. What did you do to help ?
Paperclips defeat hardware security all the time. Door locks, for example. Picking a lock with a paperclip is illegal.... Unless you own the lock or have permission to pick it. If you bought a switch and a game, you should be legally allowed to "Pick the lock".
It's the prod.keys not emulation as a whole. Reverse engineering and emulation is legal. This has been settled in court decades ago. Nintendo can't change that.
@st - too much at stake for non-video game companies that rely on emulation for their products and services. Even if they win this one, they'll just lose on appeal. Emulation won't be going anywhere. Yuzu might get shut down, but that will be all.
@@DragunBreath Even if Yuzu got shutdown its not as if all that source code vanishes from the internet. There will be 10 forked projects spun up within a week... likely originating in countries with less insane laws that allowed nintendo to pull off a win. At best this would be a pyrrhic victory for nintendo as it would result in many more projects popping into existence in places they can't bully as easily.
@@NerdNestI feel like the idea of emulation has been muddied now. A ROM is just a digital copy of a game. you cant ban emulation because then people cant play a lot of the games they own. think about it. if emulation is completely based around hardware then any game that is larger than 25 gigs should not be playable on the switch unless you have those nintendo microsd cards. if you ban emulation then you also cant develop games for a system super easy because technically any dev kit is not a system (its emulating it). its hard to justify banning stand alone emulators based on piracy because anything you can think of the emulators doing when it comes to piracy, the base consoles can do as well. in the article I read talking about how nintendo was sueing yuzu because they had proof people were pirating the game and it was only being used to facilitate pirating. this is funny because their argument was that yuzu could run pirated switch games and so people must be pirating if it can. using this same argument... the switch can run pirated copies of games. those same breath of the wild roms they swore were pirated? well unfortunately they are switch games and so should work on a switch. I prefer to use emulators when playing switch games because I can play my games at 4k resolution without the game lagging. if nintendo offered a service that did that I might think about not emulating my own games. another thing to consider is that I can sync my saves between all my computers that can run the game. I was playing torchlight 2 on my computer and then my friend calls me and wants me to go hang out with him? cool. syncthing and a few seconds later and I am literally where I left off on my legion go. and both have better quality experiences than the switch. no I dont think they can reverse this particular legal precedent because you would have to definitively explain what emulation is and no matter what definition you come up with nintendo will be guilty of facilitating emulation as well.
Remember that Nintendo changed Japanese law to stop people RENTING and LENDING their games in the 80's under the pretence of stopping piracy. They're that spiteful. That law is still in action to this day too. Selling, renting, lending or giving your own bought copy of a game, cd, tape, dvd to someone else (without explicit and specific permission of rights holders) is a crime in Japan, thanks to Nintendo.
Reminds me of Disney prolonging copyright to infinity and beyond despite owing their entire success to the public domain. Some companies are straight up bullies
Nintendo already convinced Japan that the device you bought isn't something you own, and now they are trying to push the same attitude elsewhere. I'm not as positive on the Nintendo win here, but I definitely will keep my eyes on that. One thing they must understand is that you cannot win opensource - even if Yuzu lost, and will get closed there will be another project, forked from it, which will take all the details of the previous Nintendo case into consideration and will do it exactly the way to bypass those. Google already tried to shutdown RUclips-Vanced, and now we have a ReVanced patches with a tool to patch RUclips on your phone, so not exactly the win.
I would just like to point to the old PS1 emulator "Bleem!" Sony Sued the maker of Bleem!, and lost, solidifying emulation as something legal. Yuzu, as an emulator, requires you to have a switch to dump it's firmware to get the files needed to decrypt the games to be played. The only leg Nintendo has to stand on, is where they are pushing, they are pushing that Yuzu Facilitates piracy, and that's a biiiiig hurdle to leap. They have to provide evidence that Yuzu's team knowingly, intentionally, went out of there way to facilitate piracy specifically. In reality, If you go to Yuzu, and download their software, you can not play any games as is. You have to mod your switch. Dump firmware, etc etc. It's the same with many other emulators in one way or another. Most emulators, outside of classic consoles, require the user to provide the firmware from a real console to run. Yes, you can choose to sail the high seas, and find massive compendiums of console firmware to download if you go looking. But anyone can do that, Yuzu provides zero links, or directions to go find said firmware. Hell even the music industry knows that self made copies for personal use, are a fair and expected way to enjoy said content, and the music industry is pretty serious about protecting their stuff.
No such thing as solidification when it comes to legal precedent. We just saw a few landmark legal cases get overturned within the highest courts of our society. Regardless of how you feel about the decisions, the point is that with time and new judges, laws and legal precent can be reversed or overturned.
Winning is not the point. They can afford to file a frivolous lawsuit cuz it's pocket change for them, the devs of Yuzu might get screwed just paying legal fees. It's 100% a power move. Though I'd rather call it bully tactics.
@@CharmingGecko Got any suggestions? who would do that? you would need millions in reserves to fight for a decade or longer on this case to maybe get court fees covered at best
If the Yuzu devs successfully defend this legal action, they need to go after Nintendo for legal fees to deter them from pulling this garbage in future. There's no Nintendo code in Yuzu, they have no case. They're just bullies with money.
What about in 5 years when AI can crack and write an emulator for a modern console in 2 days? Nintendo may just move on from making video games to something else. No money to make? Why bother? EMULATION ALWAYS WINS!!
I don't think it is so much that they think they will win...it is that they think they can successfully bully Yuzu devs into taking it down by the threat alone well ahead of any trial.
@NerdNest im guessing it is a bully tactic. Unless they use Nintendo copyright code and or a Bios in their code, they have nothing to to worry about. Sony lost a similar lawsuit in the past against the emulator Bleem! (Psx emulation) the reason the emulator bleem failed was due to the cost of fighting the lawsuits was too great. Today emus have a healthy financial backing via patreon that will help them vs the old lawsuits.
I'm not really worried about it. Even if Nintendo manages to kill Tropic Haze, Yuzu will live on thanks to it's FOSS nature. There's also still Ryujinx.
Not only is the crackdown towards emulation going to hurt the community as a whole, but it'll like you say-reduce long term preservation, and it will hurt the lower wage and poverty based countries the most. People who can afford games tend to buy it, as it is way less hassle and comes without the risk of viruses, malware etc. Don't Nintendo earn enough? The greed is so palpable it can be cut with a cheese knife. Nintendo is a company which breaks laws themselves and don't even bat an eye. In EU, and especially Norway there are strict laws of being able to return products (unless it's organic and used internally in some way). Nintendo strictly don't refund games and that is completely illegal here. Having tried to refund un-played games I've been met with a resounding NO. Yet they crackdown on emulation like there's no tomorrow. Such double standard-quite hilarious. They'll suck us dry, and try to make sure no-one else get to enjoy their games unless they fork up. Not everyone can afford these systems and get left in the dust. I'm all for paying for the media I consume, but pricing and being able to return policies are important.
If emulation becomes illegal, people will still emulate. Many drugs are illegal and plenty of people still do them. So yes, emulation will continue on regardless of how this ends.
i fucking HATE Nintendo... enough is enough i will no longer buy Nintendo systems or their games moving forward. i won't emulate them. i will sell my SuperFamicom because Sega Genesis was better anyway.
Realistically nintendo doesn't have the greatest legal standing for this and are likely more interested in harassing the Yuzu team into oblivion than an actual court case. This isn't the first time something like this has happened in the emulation world and it won't be the last, Bleem! being a prime example. The more you look at the language and some of the things they point out (or rather don't point out in some instances) the more weird the lawsuit actually looks, for instance they seem to refuse to actually name anyone actually connected to the company they are suing and are very vague about it in general; good luck looking up the LLC and finding any useful information. And when you continue down that rabbit hole and consider how yuzu development works you end up with the question of who exactly *is* nintendo suing?
Nintendo can't possibly win this on a global scale. What they did to Yuzu is the very reason I used to buy every Nintendo portable up to 3DS but I go out of my way to screw them over using Switch emulation. The only reasonable way to win against piracy is to make your service more convenient and cheaper than the effort of jumping through the hoops it takes. Nintendo makes things more expensive and harder every turn of the way and every chance they get. That's why they might not lose the average Andy but will definitely lose the war on piracy.
Realistically their only legal grounds are violation of DMCA by allowing users to circumvent copy protection if they provide keys which lets yuzu decrypt encrypted roms. So yeah, anywhere that doesn't have DMCA (basically everywhere that isn't USA) would likely ignore this whole case.
Nintendo's anti-consumerism, shutting down stores and 90's monopoly attitude has only helped drive actual piracy. If they weren't like that, emulation (which is not piracy) may not have become as big as it is today.
The masses have no knowledge (or cares) what Nintendo does or doesn't do behind the scenes. That's for people like you and I to parse and dissect. But piracy would have been just as big regardless of what Nintendo did. 90s Sega didn't do any of the things Nintendo did, but that didn't stop loads of people from pirating Dreamcast games. If people can find a way to get something for free with little to no consequence, many will go for it.
@uj I agree with you. The informed need inform the un/mis-informed Nintendo makes actual pirates of many of its fans. Many early emulators were made by Nintendo fans who desperately wanted to play it on PC. Third party companies were choking on Nintendo's very restrictive licensing system and some companies developed work arounds to bypass the lockout codes on consoleonsolded so they could manufacture and sell their own cartridges. Piracy was around long before Nintendo, particularly on Atari and pcs of the time, but Nintendo helped grow the modern emulation scene as most emulation was around NES and SNES. If Nintendo was more friendly to third party devs, supported PCs and wasn't such a monopolistic ass, companies like Sega and Sony may not have jumped in. Look up Nintendo's history and we will find they are the ones directly and indirectly created competitors in the gaming space and disgruntled gaming communities that went on to lay the foundation of modern day emulators. Yes, a lot of younger gamers don't know this but they will eventually learn about it. Emulation will live on, despite Nintendo's hopes to try and kill in or out of courts. Emulation can simply continue to grow and develop in markets corporations like Nintendo can't do Jack squat like. Russia Brazil China And others. There is also the grey and black market. When that happens,.we can once again blame Nintendo.
After a long and confusing history of who owns the rights to Burger time, the last I checked Data East owns the rights to Burger Time. Data is very frequently re-releases their games, that being said for some reason Burger time is the exception to the rule
Meh, I'm not worried. Nintendo really has no leg to stand on and will ultimately lose in the long run. Case and point the time they tried to sue blockbluster because they rented out Nintendo games. History always repeats itself, they lost back then and they're going to lose now.
Despite popular misconceptions to the contrary, Horizon is not largely derived from FreeBSD code, nor from Android, although the software licence and reverse engineering efforts have revealed that Nintendo does use some code from both in some system services and drivers.
Don’t see how they would win. Yuzu doesn’t provide the keys or games, and decrypting/reverse engineering is legal with a ton of precedent all the way back to sega vs accolade . You cannot copyright algorithms, if Yuzu can decrypt something , tough kick Nintendo . Do it better next time.
Well that's a muddy area. With DMCA Nintendo does have some legal grounds to sue over yuzu having the ability to decrypt encrypted roms, since that is technically bypassing copy protection.
Reverse engineering of computing equipment goes back to IBM VS Compaq and the rest of the PC cloners who "clean room" reverse engineered the Model 5150 BIOS.
My guess is Yuzu runs and hides like Skyline did. But I also hope not. I bet if they asked for donations, people would respond. Would love to see someone tell nintendo "no" for once.
There's a decent chance that after all the harassment and pressure, that Nintendo will no doubt provide, Yuzu's organization will dissolve and development will die off. And make no mistake, it's unlikely a fork would bring anything meaningful since development of switch emulation is actually pretty complicated and takes decent knowledge and experience with complicated frameworks/tools like vulkan. If you were developing yuzu as a passion project (as in not selling it to make a living off it) and Nintendo started attacking you, what would you do?
No-One Lives Forever was one of the best PC games & because of license issues you can't buy it ANYWHERE. Steam dropped Windows 7 & 8 support at the start of the year which meant that hundreds of older games on Steam can no longer be played since they simply don't run on Windows 10 & 11. I actually had high hopes that the Steam Deck might be able to combat this since the Proton layer might solve compatibility issues we see in Windows 10 but my experience was that these older games receive next to no attention & are poorly supported under Proton. So it's not just emulation but also the PC cracking scene that is vital.
What is the difference between this lawsuit and the ones that Sony got their asses handed to them over in the late 90's - early 00's? Unless Nintendo is saying that Yuzu was outright aiding people in distributing ROM's, I would have thought that this would be the exact same case, with the same outcome
You cant blame yuzu for people pirating switch games, that would be like blaming car manufacturers for people getting run over and killed I mean could you imagine that the said manufacturers would have to put a giant warning label in there cars saying "Please do not use this vehicle to kill adults and children as we will be held responsible and sued out of existance", i'm sick of nintendo they're like a spoilt brat who stamps there feet and says if i cant have it then you cant. I really wish now they had gone bankrupt because of all the screw ups they made with the wii and wiiu.
If nentendo had to, legally, commit to keeping every game they have a licenso to available on a digital store forever AND make all their future consoles backwards compatible with everything (cant be that hard, the steamdeck is compatible with almost every nintendo game lol) thered be no moral or legal case for emulation. But they dont. They take games off the store even though they own the license and then fight anyone that wants to play those games tooth and nail. They make consoles that are not backwards compatible and even if they port a game over, which they dont always do, they expect you to pay full price again for a game you already bought. This just costs them a ton of goodwill.
A point that you kinda hinted at but didn’t fully explain: We also have to remember here that Switch emulation at this point is more about piracy rather than preservation. Both ToTK and Pokémon SV were downloaded before they were even released. That is legit piracy and illegal distribution. This is one of the core points that Nintendo brought up in their lawsuit. When we’re talking about preservation, we’re more like talking about games and hardware that isn’t easily accessible anymore. It’s hard to justify current-gen emulation in the eyes of the law since most people at this point are legit doing it to pirate software they don’t own, instead of actually preserving things that they really do own.
@@NScherdin people pirating Switch games is exactly why this lawsuit even exists. Yes, Yuzu might not be using any Nintendo code but in Nintendo’s case, users are circumventing DMCA with instructions provided by Yuzu, with Yuzu themselves acknowledging that their software is widely used for pirating and guiding people on how to do just that. This is the biggest grey area that would be argued in court over the next few months. Instructions themselves are not circumvention, but that might change depending on how this lawsuit goes.
This is a baseless claim, neither you or Nintendo know whether emulation is mostly used for piracy or not. 'Person emulates to play their old games on modern hardware' certainly isn't a rare use case at all
@@Thornskade TotK was clearly being pirated when the leaked rom was downloaded and used with their emulator ahead of the game release day. Yuzu were pretty much aware of this with their Discord screenshots.
@@NeroVingian40 But the thing is that Yuzu does not equals piracy. TotK was even unplayable before launch. Those pirated game copies were played on Switch consoles, not on Yuzu. Even if, that's individual people doing that, not the Yuzu team.
The claim about the decryption keys was a bit odd, as if they were guessing. One thing I am speculating, considering the near future release of the switch 2, could they be trying to prevent the switch 2 from being emulated, potentially from information they obtain as part of this endeavour?
I played TotK a week early, and I didn't even know Yuzu existed. Nintendo just shipped the cartridges early, so I put the game in my Switch and played it. Yuzu has nothing to do with that. Nintendo is suing an unrelated party over a mistake Nintendo themselves made.
I think Yuzu can win because they do not promote piracy, they actually promote dumping your own games and getting your own firmware and keys from your switch. they are basically promoting you to buy Nintendo products
Nintendo won't win IMO. Sony has tried this in the past and failed. There's precedent in these cases and Nintendo gonna struggle. Yuzu doesn't supply copyrighted or protected technologies and cannot be blamed for piracy. They can't argue hurt sales as it's among the highest selling handhelds of all time. Nintendo sues ppl all the time and loses. They do win a lot, but can't see it in this case.
That was years ago the fact that Nintendo is using multiple arguments such as their patroen and piracy and others they may win they are even using everything said in the discord against them
Sony killed Bleem in a way Nintendo cant kill yuzu. Bleem was a physical product that released on literal market shelves. yuzu is a open source, 100% free to download and share piece of software. Bleem died because Sony made contracts with stores so Bleem could not be sold. If they sold Bleem, the contract is broken and Sony wont sell PlayStation's at that retailer. The lawsuit itself, which is separate from what I mentioned, Bleem won. If Yuzu Wins, what can Nintendo do? They cant just have it taken down anyways, If they get patron to shut there money flow down, Yuzu can still find other websites for donations like Ko-Fi, or even just have the money sent with paypal. Nintendo could bury Yuzu in google search results, but yuzu can just rename itself if its even bad enough in the first place. Its way harder to kill software, compared to a company. @@ceninant
How quickly people have forgotten about 3dfx GLIDE and UltraHLE which is likely the tipping point for NIntendo to start litigating emulators when they saw mario64 running flawlessly on a computer.
Another thing in Nintendo's favor would be the fact that Yuzu is emulating their latest console. You are not emulating a switch for preservation purposes right now, and they can twist the narrative to say that people emulating the switch are mostly pirates damaging their sales.
No one is saying don't back up your old games for when they get taken down. But FFS the Switch is still being sold.... You goofballs are going to push and push and end up getting everything taken down across the board. Dumb...
Burger Time was a bad example but only because it does have a legitimate physical release on an evercade pack (Evercade is great for some of this stuff) but fully agree with your sentiment. I think Nintendo have gone big because this is emulating their current output.
I think they will win and it’s due to Yuzu having a patreon and the fact that Nintendo camped out in their discord Nintendo is gonna use everything in that discord against them also it’s illegal to go around encryption
@@theclassicgamer20 you basically have zero knowledge of copyright law, this is basic fear tactic and people who fear handling lawyers usually end up folding. Yuzu isn't supplying pirated games,there is no case.
It will force clever emulation tech communities & drive more fans to go underground, and as a result; the community will become far more aggressive against Nintendo. Remember Sony getting slammed and hacked? Think 10X that...
Pretty much any racing game of the past which used real cars models (like NFS 1, 2, 3, Hot Pursuit etc.) is impossible to buy legally from the developer simply because EA didn't extend cars and music licenses, hence cannot legally sell those games anymore.
Yuzu may have to ask more donation just for the case, and get people to word to mouth about this and help them fight this. Things can take years to fight, and it's abit to much for Yuzu.
Someone needs to sue Nintendo, for us not having access to our digital purchases on older systems and store fronts. I would counter sue if I was Yuzu. Side note. I had a virtual boy with tennis(I think it came with it) and a fighter jet kind of game. Forget what it was called. Wish I would have never gotten rid of it. Could at it to my retired VR headset collection.
Yeah, but the orgs that made those emulations shortly after died anyways. Even if Nintendo doesn't win a lawsuit this can very well still mean the end of Yuzu in the near future.
I doubt that would happen this time. Besides a lawsuit, what can nintendo do? With bleem, it shut down because it was forced off the market by sony, with yuzu, its not on a market, its 100% free to download and easy + legal share. Even if nintendo wins, I could see someone a month later using the source code of yuzu, and changing whatever has to be changed to make it legal, Then rereleasing it. Personally, I think nintendo lost before they even tried to fight yuzu. Also theres Ryujinx, which is another switch emulator. So everyone would flock to that one. The only thing I can think of is Nintendo trying to bury Yuzu in google search results. Even then though, yuzu has a strong fanbase already so if nintendo tried, it would be to late. It does not help nintendo that yuzu is getting tons of free press right now.@@s01itarygaming
I will say the same thing I put on Russ's latest video. Its yalls fault this happened. You can't jinx these things we exist in a very liquid space. Its the same as a nurse or Dr. in the ED saying "wow its a slow night". Ive seen people sent home for that. One ED charge nurse made the person go outside in the snow and turn around and spit. You don't mess around with these things.
I love my Switch, I have been by it's side since 2019 ...but...it's really failing to keep up in most games. I have seen it hit under 30fps so many times, it's just expected.
Keep calm and keep emulating! Yuzu is open-source. It can be forked. The internet is a big place with lots of nooks and crannies. Goonies will never die! ...Emulation neither!
This is my guess as well, they're planning on simply bankrupting Yuzu or have them capitulate as well as scare of future emulators development, for example for the Switch 2 Naturally they're doing it in the US, this plan wouldn't stand a chance in Europe
Hey, would anyone know what the little gameboy like handheld shown at 4:46 is called? I really like the look and I've been looking for some smaller emulation handheld with a nice screen.
Depends. There's enough legal precedence that states if they *sell* you a game, even digitally, then you own the game. This is why a handful of years back every game store started offering refunds on digital *purchases*.
Nintendo has the worst track record of keeping their support online for past consoles. they do some of the most anti consumer things, but everyone kisses their butt. i find it frustrating
Nintendo are just being sore losers. Honestly I think it could go either way. If yuzu has the resources I think they would absolutely win but I don’t know if they are up to the task. Honestly the best thing they could do at this point is close shop and leak the source code so it can continue to be developed open source.
This is a little different; dolphin had the decryption keys packaged with it's software, yuzu does not. So realistically Nintendo's only real legal standing here is that yuzu bypasses copy protection by decrypting encrypted roms (if supplied keys) and thereby breaking DMCA.
Nintendo has made me purchase the SAME EXACT virtual console games on multiple systems.. games I already own the physical copy of. They did this to themselves.
To Nintendo: Take down the internet, your problem is now solved. The next big thing is a Moon servers on the moon. thats right cloud servers are on planet earth with Earth internation Laws but not on the moon. Back in the days like 90's Nintendo did it with Bung Enterprises to stop all sales of their MGD Multi Game Doctor, in the end they took the concept of roms and made it their own, and hired rom pirates to work for them, I think this is the way the're going to go with this
Hello I understand your side for preservation and using an emulator to play old games. I am all for emulation. My country is pretty harsh and we are not that well off, I emulate games I already have or try games before buying them(or I borrow a friend’s copy), heck I even even put them on other devices. Which I see is an upside since money is not that easy to earn right now. But at the same time I do see people emulate games without really owning it and buying it when they get the funds for it. I think that is the issue they have with the more recent title. Well as much as I love Nintendo I do agree they are pretty stupid when it comes to attacking people regarding emulation of their older games. Edit: sorry I forgot I wish Nintendo doesn’t win the case. I also wish game devs also get their money so they can still produce more games.
They will win! back in the day when ps1 was the mainstream console. a person started a business where he was selling a program that will let mac computer users play ps1 games. Basically he was selling ps1 emulator for mac computers. He got sued and sony won.
This just makes me want to pirate Switch games lol, if Nintendo is all about enjoyment of game as they state, they would be all for emulators, not against them, but if Nintendo made it easy and simple to legally buy a preserve their console game libraries, there would not be a need for pirating in the first place.
Emulation isn't going anywhere. Starting this off by saying it's going to get wrecked across the board is just spreading FUD, and is only speculation at best.
facts plus the best thing about it is I've saved so much storage space. In the house by just playing all my classics on one system that I can actually look after and know it won't break
love your videos, i also hope emulation continues and i hear you, I wish all companies should continue to put out classic games on the cheap , no more then $5 a game , if it's an OLD console system , it should be on the cheap , they should just release ROMS for sale online, so emulators can use ,
game preservation because all systems will fail and break at some point and its better to have everything on one device that you can easily upgrade and look after plus emulating games gas saved me so much storage space
I am pro emulation. I believe video game preservation is important. But let’s all be honest for a second. Go to any emulation group or forum and it’s 99% piracy. People take what should be a good thing and they ruin it as always.
Nice try Nintendo. It's too late. Those games are out, and most of them work with current versions of Yuzu. You're still not getting my money now, or in the future.
Emulation itself has nothing to worry about. However Yuzu making damn near 30k a month probably is pissing Nintendo off lol. I can see Nintendo winning the case and shutting down Yuzu. But Yuzu is open source so it will still continue on in someway and it looks like Nintendo is only going after Yuzu not Ryujinx so there's that as well. But yea Yuzu profiting off this is not a good look at all. But again Emulation/General Computing itself Nintendo can't do anything about.
As long as yuzu went online their always going to be switch online weather they like it or not so copies of yuzu will come back also why not go after Microsoft for allowing us to play copies we can back up or android but yet they aren't picking that fight
I have been a gamer since the early 1980's and have no clue what the hell burger time is lol. An American thing I am guessing. probably from way back when I was flexing my British Sinclair Spectrum 48 and later 128 k personal computers. Britain back then was the GOAT.
1:58 makes a stronger case for Nintendo, basically you’re saying as long as I own the game I can make a “legal” back up and play it on non Nintendo Hardware. Thus bypassing the need to purchase said Hardware. YUZU is a Nintendo Switch Emulator, which allows you to emulate Switch Hardware. It’s not just about the Games.
If buying isn't owning, piracy isn't stealing.
huh?
he said the thing!!!111!!
copypasta
In case of Switch games, buying is owning.
@@jarod1701 better check the terms of service... Haha you don't own anything these days. You are just given a usage license. It's like your debit card. It doesn't belong to you. It must be surrendered on request.
Nintendo single-handedly is the reason I raised the black flag, and I've only raised the flag for them out of civil disobedience towards their legal team
That is such an insane LARP. Please go outside buddy, your mental needs it.
I'm so happy the ninjas🥷will be winning this.
@@houragents5490The irony is palpable
@@houragents5490Ironic much? 🤓
Rebel
He might be a nerd, but he's not a bootlicker
Reading the actual lawsuit, the entire case is a COMPLETE nothing-burger. Without assuming gross incompetence, the only play I can see on Nintendo's part is that they want to bleed Tropic Haze LLC (Yuzu parent company) dry.
Regardless, it's FOSS, so it will still continue to exist afterwards.
To answer why they might've taken this swing in the first place, my guesses are
A. Yuzu was making too much money
B. They thought there was the *slightest* chance they could win, and given the existing precedent for emulation any chance might be a chance worth taking
C. A combination of both
D. Similar to A, but basically just "punitive action".
What's FOSS
Free Open Source Software
The best chance Nintendo has is the case being filed in Rhode Island. 😂😂😂
Yuzu is definitely making a lot of money, there patreon makes about $29k a month... That's about $348K a year.
A lot of the established case law regarding emulation is pre-DMCA, which, combined with the further corporatist swing of the US courts over the past decades, and their win on the Gary Bowser case, make for an extremely good chance that Nintendo is going to win this. And Nintendo is clearly also trying to use this to kill emulation altogether, as they're not just citing the piracy of new games as an issue, but that they consider selling older gen games to play on their new consoles as a core part of their business that emulation is eating into.
These kind of lawsuits tell me that while emulation is legally risky, it is morally necessary.
I donated to Yuzu to help them fight the Nintendo Yakuza. I hope others do as well. There's no way Nintendo is winning this.
They should put up a GoFundMe in case they're taking them on
Nintendo has too much money dude!
@@meecobAny set of competent copyright lawyers should be able to defend against this pretty readily. The lawsuit itself is pretty shaky based on precedent. I guarantee its going to cost Nintendo many times more money to try to win this than it will to adequately defend against it.
@@TheXipherZero I don't disagree, they still have too much money regardless.
@@ScotsmanGamer Why don't you believe the guy ? he get's a few likes because he donates to them and you try and bite him in the neck. What did you do to help ?
A paperclip defeated their hardware security
and tinfoil lol
EXACTLY..... And that's somehow everyone else's problem... Circumvented by paperclip. Not sure the DMCA covers that 😆
Paperclips defeat hardware security all the time. Door locks, for example. Picking a lock with a paperclip is illegal.... Unless you own the lock or have permission to pick it. If you bought a switch and a game, you should be legally allowed to "Pick the lock".
It's the prod.keys not emulation as a whole. Reverse engineering and emulation is legal. This has been settled in court decades ago. Nintendo can't change that.
Legal precedent has been reversed in the past. It can happen again.
@st - too much at stake for non-video game companies that rely on emulation for their products and services. Even if they win this one, they'll just lose on appeal. Emulation won't be going anywhere. Yuzu might get shut down, but that will be all.
@@DragunBreath Even if Yuzu got shutdown its not as if all that source code vanishes from the internet. There will be 10 forked projects spun up within a week... likely originating in countries with less insane laws that allowed nintendo to pull off a win. At best this would be a pyrrhic victory for nintendo as it would result in many more projects popping into existence in places they can't bully as easily.
@@TheXipherZero - precisely. Spreading FUD over this is nothing but clickbait.
@@NerdNestI feel like the idea of emulation has been muddied now. A ROM is just a digital copy of a game. you cant ban emulation because then people cant play a lot of the games they own. think about it. if emulation is completely based around hardware then any game that is larger than 25 gigs should not be playable on the switch unless you have those nintendo microsd cards. if you ban emulation then you also cant develop games for a system super easy because technically any dev kit is not a system (its emulating it). its hard to justify banning stand alone emulators based on piracy because anything you can think of the emulators doing when it comes to piracy, the base consoles can do as well. in the article I read talking about how nintendo was sueing yuzu because they had proof people were pirating the game and it was only being used to facilitate pirating. this is funny because their argument was that yuzu could run pirated switch games and so people must be pirating if it can. using this same argument... the switch can run pirated copies of games. those same breath of the wild roms they swore were pirated? well unfortunately they are switch games and so should work on a switch. I prefer to use emulators when playing switch games because I can play my games at 4k resolution without the game lagging. if nintendo offered a service that did that I might think about not emulating my own games. another thing to consider is that I can sync my saves between all my computers that can run the game. I was playing torchlight 2 on my computer and then my friend calls me and wants me to go hang out with him? cool. syncthing and a few seconds later and I am literally where I left off on my legion go. and both have better quality experiences than the switch. no I dont think they can reverse this particular legal precedent because you would have to definitively explain what emulation is and no matter what definition you come up with nintendo will be guilty of facilitating emulation as well.
If they take down yuzu team I will never buy Nintendo game ever again. Instead I will go out of my way to pirate their game wherever is possible.
same im selling my switch because the screen us so tiny and nearly went blind
Remember that Nintendo changed Japanese law to stop people RENTING and LENDING their games in the 80's under the pretence of stopping piracy. They're that spiteful. That law is still in action to this day too. Selling, renting, lending or giving your own bought copy of a game, cd, tape, dvd to someone else (without explicit and specific permission of rights holders) is a crime in Japan, thanks to Nintendo.
That's wild.
Reminds me of Disney prolonging copyright to infinity and beyond despite owing their entire success to the public domain. Some companies are straight up bullies
But its NOT a crime to hand money over to let them buy there own copy. Unless lending Yen is also too a crime.
Corporations have always lobbied laws and restricted the rights of consumers. It's twisted and sick.
Nintendo already convinced Japan that the device you bought isn't something you own, and now they are trying to push the same attitude elsewhere. I'm not as positive on the Nintendo win here, but I definitely will keep my eyes on that. One thing they must understand is that you cannot win opensource - even if Yuzu lost, and will get closed there will be another project, forked from it, which will take all the details of the previous Nintendo case into consideration and will do it exactly the way to bypass those. Google already tried to shutdown RUclips-Vanced, and now we have a ReVanced patches with a tool to patch RUclips on your phone, so not exactly the win.
Let the Big N get ready for that L coming for them
Thanks man I'm glad I found your comment as I didn't know youtube vanced still exists ❤
I would just like to point to the old PS1 emulator "Bleem!" Sony Sued the maker of Bleem!, and lost, solidifying emulation as something legal. Yuzu, as an emulator, requires you to have a switch to dump it's firmware to get the files needed to decrypt the games to be played. The only leg Nintendo has to stand on, is where they are pushing, they are pushing that Yuzu Facilitates piracy, and that's a biiiiig hurdle to leap. They have to provide evidence that Yuzu's team knowingly, intentionally, went out of there way to facilitate piracy specifically. In reality, If you go to Yuzu, and download their software, you can not play any games as is. You have to mod your switch. Dump firmware, etc etc.
It's the same with many other emulators in one way or another. Most emulators, outside of classic consoles, require the user to provide the firmware from a real console to run. Yes, you can choose to sail the high seas, and find massive compendiums of console firmware to download if you go looking. But anyone can do that, Yuzu provides zero links, or directions to go find said firmware. Hell even the music industry knows that self made copies for personal use, are a fair and expected way to enjoy said content, and the music industry is pretty serious about protecting their stuff.
No such thing as solidification when it comes to legal precedent. We just saw a few landmark legal cases get overturned within the highest courts of our society. Regardless of how you feel about the decisions, the point is that with time and new judges, laws and legal precent can be reversed or overturned.
Amazon sells waaaay more sketchy things than Emulation station. Like harddrives full of pirated modern software.
I never cared about emulating the Switch, now I'm gonna gather a fat library for preservation with yuzu.
Yuzu doesn’t use Nintendo code. Nintendo can’t win.
Winning is not the point. They can afford to file a frivolous lawsuit cuz it's pocket change for them, the devs of Yuzu might get screwed just paying legal fees. It's 100% a power move. Though I'd rather call it bully tactics.
@@clawofthefallen this always seems to be the go to response. If someone agrees to represent them and get paid after the case, it’s not a problem.
@@CharmingGecko Got any suggestions? who would do that? you would need millions in reserves to fight for a decade or longer on this case to maybe get court fees covered at best
If the Yuzu devs successfully defend this legal action, they need to go after Nintendo for legal fees to deter them from pulling this garbage in future. There's no Nintendo code in Yuzu, they have no case. They're just bullies with money.
@@Invid72Counter sue with an anti-SLAPP lawsuit. It would be hilarious if Nintendo ended up bank rolling Switch emulation for a decade or two.
Yuzu development can continue in Russia.
Nintendo can't do jack squat over there. *EMULATION ALWAYS WINS*
What about in 5 years when AI can crack and write an emulator for a modern console in 2 days? Nintendo may just move on from making video games to something else. No money to make? Why bother?
EMULATION ALWAYS WINS!!
I don't think it is so much that they think they will win...it is that they think they can successfully bully Yuzu devs into taking it down by the threat alone well ahead of any trial.
Emulation is legal. Yuzu does not supply decryption keys. Officially this is for you to dump from your switch.
Yuzu will win
I hope you're right, but I doubt Nintendo would bring this case if they didn't think they could win.
@NerdNest im guessing it is a bully tactic. Unless they use Nintendo copyright code and or a Bios in their code, they have nothing to to worry about. Sony lost a similar lawsuit in the past against the emulator Bleem! (Psx emulation) the reason the emulator bleem failed was due to the cost of fighting the lawsuits was too great. Today emus have a healthy financial backing via patreon that will help them vs the old lawsuits.
I'm not really worried about it. Even if Nintendo manages to kill Tropic Haze, Yuzu will live on thanks to it's FOSS nature. There's also still Ryujinx.
Not only is the crackdown towards emulation going to hurt the community as a whole, but it'll like you say-reduce long term preservation, and it will hurt the lower wage and poverty based countries the most. People who can afford games tend to buy it, as it is way less hassle and comes without the risk of viruses, malware etc. Don't Nintendo earn enough? The greed is so palpable it can be cut with a cheese knife.
Nintendo is a company which breaks laws themselves and don't even bat an eye. In EU, and especially Norway there are strict laws of being able to return products (unless it's organic and used internally in some way). Nintendo strictly don't refund games and that is completely illegal here. Having tried to refund un-played games I've been met with a resounding NO. Yet they crackdown on emulation like there's no tomorrow. Such double standard-quite hilarious. They'll suck us dry, and try to make sure no-one else get to enjoy their games unless they fork up. Not everyone can afford these systems and get left in the dust. I'm all for paying for the media I consume, but pricing and being able to return policies are important.
If yuzu opens a go fund me for lawyer funds I'm buying i gotta see this shit in court.
This is worrying news, but I hope emulation will still win in the end.
If emulation becomes illegal, people will still emulate. Many drugs are illegal and plenty of people still do them. So yes, emulation will continue on regardless of how this ends.
@@s01itarygaming it will never become illegal nintendo has no leg to stand on they can only bleed yuzu dry with this case
@@s01itarygamingBut developing emulators is no small feat, and that is likely going to slow way down if it's illegal to distribute
@@s01itarygaming bad exampel.
@@Thornskade 100% agreed and I'm actually quite worried about what's going to happen to yuzu and it's developers.
The Emulation community as a WHOLE needs to get behind Yuzu, lest Nintendo irrevocably change emulation forever.
Wrong. No one uses emulatiors more than me, i play old stuff almost exclusively. But Nintendo has to protect their product if its currently for sale.
i fucking HATE Nintendo... enough is enough i will no longer buy Nintendo systems or their games moving forward. i won't emulate them. i will sell my SuperFamicom because Sega Genesis was better anyway.
No it wasn't, the SNES was the best. Has the best games on it.
@@randysalsman6992The best games Nintendo doesn't want you to play LOL
@@randysalsman6992 A. in your opinion... and B. best games that Nintendo doesn't want you to play lmaoooo
Yuzu will be fine (welp this aged horribly)
yeah I reckon
Realistically nintendo doesn't have the greatest legal standing for this and are likely more interested in harassing the Yuzu team into oblivion than an actual court case. This isn't the first time something like this has happened in the emulation world and it won't be the last, Bleem! being a prime example.
The more you look at the language and some of the things they point out (or rather don't point out in some instances) the more weird the lawsuit actually looks, for instance they seem to refuse to actually name anyone actually connected to the company they are suing and are very vague about it in general; good luck looking up the LLC and finding any useful information. And when you continue down that rabbit hole and consider how yuzu development works you end up with the question of who exactly *is* nintendo suing?
emulation will always survive
I hope you’re right!
Nintendo can't possibly win this on a global scale. What they did to Yuzu is the very reason I used to buy every Nintendo portable up to 3DS but I go out of my way to screw them over using Switch emulation.
The only reasonable way to win against piracy is to make your service more convenient and cheaper than the effort of jumping through the hoops it takes.
Nintendo makes things more expensive and harder every turn of the way and every chance they get. That's why they might not lose the average Andy but will definitely lose the war on piracy.
Realistically their only legal grounds are violation of DMCA by allowing users to circumvent copy protection if they provide keys which lets yuzu decrypt encrypted roms. So yeah, anywhere that doesn't have DMCA (basically everywhere that isn't USA) would likely ignore this whole case.
Nintendo's anti-consumerism, shutting down stores and 90's monopoly attitude has only helped drive actual piracy.
If they weren't like that, emulation (which is not piracy) may not have become as big as it is today.
The masses have no knowledge (or cares) what Nintendo does or doesn't do behind the scenes. That's for people like you and I to parse and dissect. But piracy would have been just as big regardless of what Nintendo did. 90s Sega didn't do any of the things Nintendo did, but that didn't stop loads of people from pirating Dreamcast games. If people can find a way to get something for free with little to no consequence, many will go for it.
@uj I agree with you.
The informed need inform the un/mis-informed
Nintendo makes actual pirates of many of its fans.
Many early emulators were made by Nintendo fans who desperately wanted to play it on PC.
Third party companies were choking on Nintendo's very restrictive licensing system and some companies developed work arounds to bypass the lockout codes on consoleonsolded so they could manufacture and sell their own cartridges.
Piracy was around long before Nintendo, particularly on Atari and pcs of the time, but Nintendo helped grow the modern emulation scene as most emulation was around NES and SNES.
If Nintendo was more friendly to third party devs, supported PCs and wasn't such a monopolistic ass, companies like Sega and Sony may not have jumped in.
Look up Nintendo's history and we will find they are the ones directly and indirectly created competitors in the gaming space and disgruntled gaming communities that went on to lay the foundation of modern day emulators.
Yes, a lot of younger gamers don't know this but they will eventually learn about it.
Emulation will live on, despite Nintendo's hopes to try and kill in or out of courts.
Emulation can simply continue to grow and develop in markets corporations like Nintendo can't do Jack squat like.
Russia
Brazil
China
And others.
There is also the grey and black market.
When that happens,.we can once again blame Nintendo.
So your saying piracy is a bad thing?
After a long and confusing history of who owns the rights to Burger time, the last I checked Data East owns the rights to Burger Time. Data is very frequently re-releases their games, that being said for some reason Burger time is the exception to the rule
You’re right. Data East has released Burger Time through those little desktop arcades from My Arcade, and Arcade1Up’s home arcade machine.
Meh, I'm not worried. Nintendo really has no leg to stand on and will ultimately lose in the long run. Case and point the time they tried to sue blockbluster because they rented out Nintendo games. History always repeats itself, they lost back then and they're going to lose now.
Yuzu will just rebrand. Nintendo have no chance of stopping emulation and eventually current gen will follow.
There was a lawsuit in the 90’s with Sony and an emulation company and Sony lost. That lawsuit is similar to what Nintendo is doing.
And that company died and with it the emulator's development died off.
Despite popular misconceptions to the contrary, Horizon is not largely derived from FreeBSD code, nor from Android, although the software licence and reverse engineering efforts have revealed that Nintendo does use some code from both in some system services and drivers.
I still have my old Virtual Boy too and it still works, somehow. I even have Super Mario Tennis, which I loved as a kid
Don’t see how they would win. Yuzu doesn’t provide the keys or games, and decrypting/reverse engineering is legal with a ton of precedent all the way back to sega vs accolade .
You cannot copyright algorithms, if Yuzu can decrypt something , tough kick Nintendo . Do it better next time.
Well that's a muddy area. With DMCA Nintendo does have some legal grounds to sue over yuzu having the ability to decrypt encrypted roms, since that is technically bypassing copy protection.
@@s01itarygamingBut it doesn't have that ability until you insert the actual decryption key yourself
Reverse engineering of computing equipment goes back to IBM VS Compaq and the rest of the PC cloners who "clean room" reverse engineered the Model 5150 BIOS.
@@Thornskade which is why it's muddy.
@@greggv8 okay but part of DMCA makes it illegal to circumvent copy protection of media and the encryption of roms is clearly copy protection.
My guess is Yuzu runs and hides like Skyline did.
But I also hope not.
I bet if they asked for donations, people would respond. Would love to see someone tell nintendo "no" for once.
There's a decent chance that after all the harassment and pressure, that Nintendo will no doubt provide, Yuzu's organization will dissolve and development will die off. And make no mistake, it's unlikely a fork would bring anything meaningful since development of switch emulation is actually pretty complicated and takes decent knowledge and experience with complicated frameworks/tools like vulkan.
If you were developing yuzu as a passion project (as in not selling it to make a living off it) and Nintendo started attacking you, what would you do?
Im waiting for the day that nintendo flew to close to the sun with CND's and lawsuits, Today might be that day.
Im just now deciding to get into emulation on pc. So i wouldnt be suprised if all emulators were shut down. Just my luck lol.
No-One Lives Forever was one of the best PC games & because of license issues you can't buy it ANYWHERE.
Steam dropped Windows 7 & 8 support at the start of the year which meant that hundreds of older games on Steam can no longer be played since they simply don't run on Windows 10 & 11.
I actually had high hopes that the Steam Deck might be able to combat this since the Proton layer might solve compatibility issues we see in Windows 10 but my experience was that these older games receive next to no attention & are poorly supported under Proton.
So it's not just emulation but also the PC cracking scene that is vital.
They don't need a legal team, they need The Eagle Team!
Don't worry, I'll call in the A team. I pity the fool who tries to take down emulation.
For one sec I thought you had the bad news about Yuzu, that they packed their bags and disappeared. But I am glad that isn´t the case...
What is the difference between this lawsuit and the ones that Sony got their asses handed to them over in the late 90's - early 00's? Unless Nintendo is saying that Yuzu was outright aiding people in distributing ROM's, I would have thought that this would be the exact same case, with the same outcome
Nintendo is not winning this I’m sorry
You cant blame yuzu for people pirating switch games, that would be like blaming car manufacturers for people getting run over and killed I mean could you imagine that the said manufacturers would have to put a giant warning label in there cars saying "Please do not use this vehicle to kill adults and children as we will be held responsible and sued out of existance", i'm sick of nintendo they're like a spoilt brat who stamps there feet and says if i cant have it then you cant. I really wish now they had gone bankrupt because of all the screw ups they made with the wii and wiiu.
Nintendo sucks a perfect example of corporate stupidity, if they had multi-platform for their older games they maybe can solve the piracy 😂
If nentendo had to, legally, commit to keeping every game they have a licenso to available on a digital store forever AND make all their future consoles backwards compatible with everything (cant be that hard, the steamdeck is compatible with almost every nintendo game lol) thered be no moral or legal case for emulation.
But they dont.
They take games off the store even though they own the license and then fight anyone that wants to play those games tooth and nail.
They make consoles that are not backwards compatible and even if they port a game over, which they dont always do, they expect you to pay full price again for a game you already bought.
This just costs them a ton of goodwill.
A point that you kinda hinted at but didn’t fully explain:
We also have to remember here that Switch emulation at this point is more about piracy rather than preservation. Both ToTK and Pokémon SV were downloaded before they were even released. That is legit piracy and illegal distribution. This is one of the core points that Nintendo brought up in their lawsuit.
When we’re talking about preservation, we’re more like talking about games and hardware that isn’t easily accessible anymore. It’s hard to justify current-gen emulation in the eyes of the law since most people at this point are legit doing it to pirate software they don’t own, instead of actually preserving things that they really do own.
It doesnt matter if people use Yuzu to pirate. What matters is that the devs are not pirating any Nintendo code.
@@NScherdin people pirating Switch games is exactly why this lawsuit even exists. Yes, Yuzu might not be using any Nintendo code but in Nintendo’s case, users are circumventing DMCA with instructions provided by Yuzu, with Yuzu themselves acknowledging that their software is widely used for pirating and guiding people on how to do just that. This is the biggest grey area that would be argued in court over the next few months. Instructions themselves are not circumvention, but that might change depending on how this lawsuit goes.
This is a baseless claim, neither you or Nintendo know whether emulation is mostly used for piracy or not. 'Person emulates to play their old games on modern hardware' certainly isn't a rare use case at all
@@Thornskade TotK was clearly being pirated when the leaked rom was downloaded and used with their emulator ahead of the game release day. Yuzu were pretty much aware of this with their Discord screenshots.
@@NeroVingian40 But the thing is that Yuzu does not equals piracy. TotK was even unplayable before launch. Those pirated game copies were played on Switch consoles, not on Yuzu. Even if, that's individual people doing that, not the Yuzu team.
The claim about the decryption keys was a bit odd, as if they were guessing.
One thing I am speculating, considering the near future release of the switch 2, could they be trying to prevent the switch 2 from being emulated, potentially from information they obtain as part of this endeavour?
I played TotK a week early, and I didn't even know Yuzu existed. Nintendo just shipped the cartridges early, so I put the game in my Switch and played it. Yuzu has nothing to do with that. Nintendo is suing an unrelated party over a mistake Nintendo themselves made.
I think Yuzu can win because they do not promote piracy, they actually promote dumping your own games and getting your own firmware and keys from your switch.
they are basically promoting you to buy Nintendo products
Nintendo won't win IMO. Sony has tried this in the past and failed. There's precedent in these cases and Nintendo gonna struggle. Yuzu doesn't supply copyrighted or protected technologies and cannot be blamed for piracy. They can't argue hurt sales as it's among the highest selling handhelds of all time. Nintendo sues ppl all the time and loses. They do win a lot, but can't see it in this case.
They killed Bleem!
And Rand Linden made their current internal emulators. 😔
That was years ago the fact that Nintendo is using multiple arguments such as their patroen and piracy and others they may win they are even using everything said in the discord against them
Sony killed Bleem in a way Nintendo cant kill yuzu. Bleem was a physical product that released on literal market shelves. yuzu is a open source, 100% free to download and share piece of software.
Bleem died because Sony made contracts with stores so Bleem could not be sold. If they sold Bleem, the contract is broken and Sony wont sell PlayStation's at that retailer. The lawsuit itself, which is separate from what I mentioned, Bleem won.
If Yuzu Wins, what can Nintendo do? They cant just have it taken down anyways, If they get patron to shut there money flow down, Yuzu can still find other websites for donations like Ko-Fi, or even just have the money sent with paypal. Nintendo could bury Yuzu in google search results, but yuzu can just rename itself if its even bad enough in the first place. Its way harder to kill software, compared to a company. @@ceninant
How quickly everyone has forgotten about bleem.
How quickly people have forgotten about 3dfx GLIDE and UltraHLE which is likely the tipping point for NIntendo to start litigating emulators when they saw mario64 running flawlessly on a computer.
Another thing in Nintendo's favor would be the fact that Yuzu is emulating their latest console. You are not emulating a switch for preservation purposes right now, and they can twist the narrative to say that people emulating the switch are mostly pirates damaging their sales.
Everyone should sue Nintendo because they interpret lending as purchase.
its in their UELA though...
@@rundown132Which is not legally binding
@@rundown132 Depending on your country the EULA might even be entirely meaningless.
No one is saying don't back up your old games for when they get taken down. But FFS the Switch is still being sold.... You goofballs are going to push and push and end up getting everything taken down across the board.
Dumb...
Burger Time was a bad example but only because it does have a legitimate physical release on an evercade pack (Evercade is great for some of this stuff) but fully agree with your sentiment.
I think Nintendo have gone big because this is emulating their current output.
Legally Nintendo can't do anything. It's basically a war of nerves, if yuzu is able to hold their own and not be scared they are golden
I think they will win and it’s due to Yuzu having a patreon and the fact that Nintendo camped out in their discord Nintendo is gonna use everything in that discord against them also it’s illegal to go around encryption
@@theclassicgamer20 you basically have zero knowledge of copyright law, this is basic fear tactic and people who fear handling lawyers usually end up folding.
Yuzu isn't supplying pirated games,there is no case.
It will force clever emulation tech communities & drive more fans to go underground, and as a result; the community will become far more aggressive against Nintendo. Remember Sony getting slammed and hacked? Think 10X that...
Pretty much any racing game of the past which used real cars models (like NFS 1, 2, 3, Hot Pursuit etc.) is impossible to buy legally from the developer simply because EA didn't extend cars and music licenses, hence cannot legally sell those games anymore.
Yuzu may have to ask more donation just for the case, and get people to word to mouth about this and help them fight this. Things can take years to fight, and it's abit to much for Yuzu.
Someone needs to sue Nintendo, for us not having access to our digital purchases on older systems and store fronts. I would counter sue if I was Yuzu.
Side note. I had a virtual boy with tennis(I think it came with it) and a fighter jet kind of game. Forget what it was called. Wish I would have never gotten rid of it. Could at it to my retired VR headset collection.
Bigger companies then Nintendo tried and failed trying to sue and get rid of emulation.
I hope the Big N takes the biggest L after this Case. Then open the floodgates for Emulation.
Yeah, but the orgs that made those emulations shortly after died anyways. Even if Nintendo doesn't win a lawsuit this can very well still mean the end of Yuzu in the near future.
I doubt that would happen this time. Besides a lawsuit, what can nintendo do? With bleem, it shut down because it was forced off the market by sony, with yuzu, its not on a market, its 100% free to download and easy + legal share. Even if nintendo wins, I could see someone a month later using the source code of yuzu, and changing whatever has to be changed to make it legal, Then rereleasing it. Personally, I think nintendo lost before they even tried to fight yuzu. Also theres Ryujinx, which is another switch emulator. So everyone would flock to that one.
The only thing I can think of is Nintendo trying to bury Yuzu in google search results. Even then though, yuzu has a strong fanbase already so if nintendo tried, it would be to late. It does not help nintendo that yuzu is getting tons of free press right now.@@s01itarygaming
I will say the same thing I put on Russ's latest video. Its yalls fault this happened. You can't jinx these things we exist in a very liquid space. Its the same as a nurse or Dr. in the ED saying "wow its a slow night". Ive seen people sent home for that. One ED charge nurse made the person go outside in the snow and turn around and spit. You don't mess around with these things.
I love my Switch, I have been by it's side since 2019 ...but...it's really failing to keep up in most games. I have seen it hit under 30fps so many times, it's just expected.
Keep calm and keep emulating!
Yuzu is open-source. It can be forked. The internet is a big place with lots of nooks and crannies. Goonies will never die! ...Emulation neither!
This is my guess as well, they're planning on simply bankrupting Yuzu or have them capitulate as well as scare of future emulators development, for example for the Switch 2
Naturally they're doing it in the US, this plan wouldn't stand a chance in Europe
Hey, would anyone know what the little gameboy like handheld shown at 4:46 is called? I really like the look and I've been looking for some smaller emulation handheld with a nice screen.
I think its the Miyoo Mini Plus
I really hope the courts rule in favor of game preservation!
Ryujinx has entered the chat
You can buy the games legally but if the licensing runs out or something those games can be yanked from you and you don't get your money back.
Depends. There's enough legal precedence that states if they *sell* you a game, even digitally, then you own the game. This is why a handful of years back every game store started offering refunds on digital *purchases*.
I've been boycotting Nintendo for multiple years now. They are anti-consumer.
Nintendo has the worst track record of keeping their support online for past consoles. they do some of the most anti consumer things, but everyone kisses their butt. i find it frustrating
Glad I chose Ryujinx.
Nintendo are just being sore losers. Honestly I think it could go either way. If yuzu has the resources I think they would absolutely win but I don’t know if they are up to the task. Honestly the best thing they could do at this point is close shop and leak the source code so it can continue to be developed open source.
Has anybody ever told you you look like Michael Ironside?
Didn't we go through this with dolphin??
Dolphin 🐬 is still here. They just went back into the Shadows
This is a little different; dolphin had the decryption keys packaged with it's software, yuzu does not. So realistically Nintendo's only real legal standing here is that yuzu bypasses copy protection by decrypting encrypted roms (if supplied keys) and thereby breaking DMCA.
I hope more people make Nintendo emulators to stick it to Nintendo.
Nintendo has made me purchase the SAME EXACT virtual console games on multiple systems.. games I already own the physical copy of. They did this to themselves.
To Nintendo: Take down the internet, your problem is now solved. The next big thing is a Moon servers on the moon. thats right cloud servers are on planet earth with Earth internation Laws but not on the moon. Back in the days like 90's Nintendo did it with Bung Enterprises to stop all sales of their MGD Multi Game Doctor, in the end they took the concept of roms and made it their own, and hired rom pirates to work for them, I think this is the way the're going to go with this
yuzu is open source...gl
I don't like the way Nintendo handle the 3ds with it's eshop . And it being the last true handheld Nintendo should of handled that better.
Emulation is the way to go.
Hello I understand your side for preservation and using an emulator to play old games. I am all for emulation. My country is pretty harsh and we are not that well off, I emulate games I already have or try games before buying them(or I borrow a friend’s copy), heck I even even put them on other devices. Which I see is an upside since money is not that easy to earn right now. But at the same time I do see people emulate games without really owning it and buying it when they get the funds for it. I think that is the issue they have with the more recent title. Well as much as I love Nintendo I do agree they are pretty stupid when it comes to attacking people regarding emulation of their older games.
Edit: sorry I forgot I wish Nintendo doesn’t win the case. I also wish game devs also get their money so they can still produce more games.
Some call Saul Goodman 😅
So now is a good time to get into yuzu?!
still a good time I recently downloaded it on my Lenovo Legion go and breath if the wild hits different on an 8 inch 144hz screen
They will win! back in the day when ps1 was the mainstream console. a person started a business where he was selling a program that will let mac computer users play ps1 games. Basically he was selling ps1 emulator for mac computers. He got sued and sony won.
This just makes me want to pirate Switch games lol, if Nintendo is all about enjoyment of game as they state, they would be all for emulators, not against them, but if Nintendo made it easy and simple to legally buy a preserve their console game libraries, there would not be a need for pirating in the first place.
Emulation isn't going anywhere. Starting this off by saying it's going to get wrecked across the board is just spreading FUD, and is only speculation at best.
facts plus the best thing about it is I've saved so much storage space. In the house by just playing all my classics on one system that I can actually look after and know it won't break
love your videos, i also hope emulation continues and i hear you, I wish all companies should continue to put out classic games on the cheap , no more then $5 a game , if it's an OLD console system , it should be on the cheap , they should just release ROMS for sale online, so emulators can use ,
i dont understand why this matters
game preservation because all systems will fail and break at some point and its better to have everything on one device that you can easily upgrade and look after plus emulating games gas saved me so much storage space
I am pro emulation. I believe video game preservation is important. But let’s all be honest for a second. Go to any emulation group or forum and it’s 99% piracy. People take what should be a good thing and they ruin it as always.
I agree with you
I believe Hamster Corporation owns the rights to Burgertime, and all of Data East's other IPs.
What game is running on your screen in the background at 1:04
First I thought it was rocket league, then I looked closer and it's an older looking title of some kind. Sorry though man I don't know either.
Nothing will happen.
Nice try Nintendo. It's too late. Those games are out, and most of them work with current versions of Yuzu. You're still not getting my money now, or in the future.
The only way Nintendo wins is yuzu's patreon and then making money off of it imo
Emulation itself has nothing to worry about. However Yuzu making damn near 30k a month probably is pissing Nintendo off lol. I can see Nintendo winning the case and shutting down Yuzu. But Yuzu is open source so it will still continue on in someway and it looks like Nintendo is only going after Yuzu not Ryujinx so there's that as well.
But yea Yuzu profiting off this is not a good look at all. But again Emulation/General Computing itself Nintendo can't do anything about.
As long as yuzu went online their always going to be switch online weather they like it or not so copies of yuzu will come back also why not go after Microsoft for allowing us to play copies we can back up or android but yet they aren't picking that fight
Videogame consoles are the worst. Unshackle yourselves and go FOSS (Free as in liberated, not price).
I have been a gamer since the early 1980's and have no clue what the hell burger time is lol. An American thing I am guessing. probably from way back when I was flexing my British Sinclair Spectrum 48 and later 128 k personal computers. Britain back then was the GOAT.
1. it's only about Nintendo 2. Its not yet decided. 3. Emulation is notPiracy and it's all Bullshittery
1:58 makes a stronger case for Nintendo, basically you’re saying as long as I own the game I can make a “legal” back up and play it on non Nintendo Hardware. Thus bypassing the need to purchase said Hardware. YUZU is a Nintendo Switch Emulator, which allows you to emulate Switch Hardware. It’s not just about the Games.