Ganondorf's Motive in Tears of the Kingdom Explained | Theory
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- Опубликовано: 16 май 2024
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What are the true intentions of Ganondorf in the Legend of Zelda: Tears of the Kingdom? Is there more of a back story to Ganon, and his Demon King and Demon Dragon forms? Is it tied to Demise or his presence in other Zelda games? Let's talk about it!
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Timestamps:
Giveaway - 00:00
The tragedy of Ganondorf - 1:31
Ganondorf's place in history - 4:12
His true motive - 10:16
#tearsofthekingdom #legendofzelda #nintendoswitch 
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This giveaway is... SUAVÉ
@@NovaMaster375 hahah
Cheer man, also, if its the same micro sd card as Nate, you may want to mention that they may ship it in a couple of weeks
I rushed to get one of the 300 free SD cards. When I was about to checkout, I realized I don't need it. I don't know how much I paid for it, but I already have a decent one in my switch since 2017, so I would gladly pass the offer to someone who needs it. Please everyone, be kind. And Andres, thank you. Love from Italy.
When you say shipping is not included, do you mean that we don't have to pay shipping or we do?
TotK DLC should be about Ganondorf's back story and have Koume and Kotake as it's final boss,
A modern day Twinrova would be EPIC
@@AndresRestart AGREED! It's not like we see what their fate is during the main story so maybe it can happen.
@@quan22777 I mean they did "curse" Link to forever haunt him before ascending to the "Heaven" after they died to i find it peculiar that in the several games which came after Ocarina of Time only the Oracle games would give the 2 witches the chance to keep their word to the Hero. Hopefully the DLC has them show up after finishing a dungeon similar to Monk Maz Koshia at the end of the Champions Ballad DLC.
@javiervasquez625 there should be two dungeons in the dlc as there is two hearts missing after completing the shrines
YES!!!! You're a genius!!😊
Ganondorf's lines near the end of the game implied his fight is more of a religious or spiritual one, in my opinion. He said he wants to return the world to chaos and darkness because he believes the proper state of the world is in chaos and darkness, and that the goddesses' light, order, and creations are all unnatural interference.
Ganondorf's beliefs seem to mirror theistic satanism to a certain degree, wanting to return the world to its natural state of primordial chaos.
it makes his sacrifice of his own life in devouring the stone nearly as poetic as Zelda's: at first it may seem to contradict his desire for power, but when you realize his goals are a sort of restoration to how he believes things should be, it becomes that much more interesting. Zelda & Ganondorf are both sacrificing their humanity to have one more chance at changing the world to their ideal state, even at the expense of their own lives.
And in the end Order wins due to the pressence of a messianic figure who stands by the Light abiding deity against the satanist "prophet". Had Ganondorf chose a "Hero of Chaos" to stand at his side like Hylia did (Dark Link?) maybe the final battle would have ended in Chaos's favor.
@@javiervasquez625 That was Demise.
@@not_anybody_in_particular Ganondorf stands for Chaos while Zelda stands for Order and Link represents _Balance_ between the 2. Think of it like the Force in Star Wars and the parallels between the Light Side, Dark Side and Anakin Skywalker. Link is a _mediator_ between Light (God Tribe from japanese Skyward Sword) and Darkness (Demon Tribe) which is why Ganondorf can't use an "Anti Link" to stand in his side.
@@javiervasquez625link is an agent of light there’s no ambiguity about that.
This makes a lot of sense when I think about the light roots that grown down to the depths and change their environment when activated.
That felt like overstepping to me. The depths are naturally lacking light, but they’re not necessarily evil. It’s unnatural that the Zonai interfered, and forced them to have light and for the vegetation to grow the same away as above ground (probably so they could mine all the zonaite down there)
I wonder if the original Demise fought against the people of the land and sky because they’d tried to interfere too much with the depths!
Too bad he always leaves the Gerudo behind
I think there might have been some good male Gerudo Kings, but it is sad that they had to deal with those incarnations of Ganondotf.
@@ZayaMillis Fair Enough, it would be cool to see a Gerudo king that isn't Ganondorf, he could be called Talufo
To this day i wonder why did Demise "chose" the Gerudo as the race fated to birth Ganondorfs for all of time...? ¿Did the Gerudo do _something_ to the Demon Tribe which cursed their male bloodline for eternity? I feel there's some hidden Lore out there regarding the male Gerudos which Nintendo doesn't want us to know.
@javiervasquez625 I think it's not just Gerudo since the Piccori also had Vaati but yeah there is a lot on Ganondorf. It'd be cool to see Demise choose another group to inhabit
The Curse chose Ganondorf, not the Gerudo people. Ganon tends not to die properly. Most iterations of Ganon are the same person: Ocarina of Time, Twilight Princess, Wind Waker, Legend of Zelda, and A Link to the Past... all the same guy - he just doesn't die.
In Tears of the Kingdom, it isn't even confirmed that this Ganon isn't the Ocarina of Time Ganon. I don't think he is; but the memories call back so strongly to the Time Era, I watched the windows in the throne room, looking for a pair of ten year olds spying on the proceedings.
The Curse of Demise seemed to have fallen on at least one other wizard, Vaati. One could also argue that Zant was at least highly motivated as a result of the curse even if he wasn't the one being controlled by it.
The tragedy of Ganondorf is that whatever nobility he may cloak himself in, however he justifies things to himself, when the triforce shows his true heart he's just a big pig.
Edit: Spelling
He stands for Chaos while Zelda stands for Order and Link represents _Balance_ between the 2. Think of it like the Force in Star Wars and the parallels between the Light Side, Dark Side and Anakin Skywalker.
I also think there may be more to Ganondorf. Though I do believe this really is one of the darker versions of Ganondorf. When Ganondorf saw the modern sages he was supprised that they didn't recognize him, which suggests he expected their secret stones to give them knowledge of the past, and by extension means that his secret stone gave him knowldege of his past lives like Demise. If this Ganon remembers all the times Link(s) and Zelda(s) killed him in the past that actually fits with how determined he is to kill Link at the end of the game he has generations of hatred for Link. I would also like to point out we see many Garudo supporting Ganondorf before he gets the secret stone but after he gets it not only is a Garudo one of the sages but it is implied that a Garudo army tried to resist Ganondorf. Something changed after he got the secret stone and it was not his lust for power that was clearly always there. This further supports my belief that Ganondorf got the memories of his past lives back and he became like a different person which is what caused the Garudo to turn on him.
I do like the idea that he wants to “drive out the light” as a metaphor for destroying the sun of the desert even if I don’t necessarily agree that’s what the “light” is. Really good video and Zelda theory!
I kinda feel bad for the male Gerudo's born between Ganondorf's. That must be a horrible stigma to be saddled with.
There were no Male Gerudo born after Ganondorf, because he never died.
Unless you mean after Totk ends, then yeah. Looks like the Gerudo are getting their first new male after 100,000 years!
I think it's was very cool that he was ready to sacrifice himself to defeat Link - his greatest enemy. Because this Ganondorf knows that he always loses to Link, but not this time. I think it's really shows how evil and passionate he is. He was really terrifying at this moment.
Didn't Creating a Champion say no gerudo male became king after the one who became the Calamity? Wouldn't that suggest the memories have to be after after OoT?
The memores are before Calamity Ganon. Calamity Ganon is born from Ganondorf imprisoned undee Hyrule castle from what we understand.
That's my point. If this takes place before Oot then a male Gerudo king was born after that. But Creating a Champion specifically says that didn't happen.
Rather, if no gerudo king was born after the one who became the Calamity, then OoT Ganondorf cannot exist after Totk Ganondorf is sealed, assuming they happen in that order.
Honestly, I don’t believe that BotW or TotK take place on either of the the traditional established Zelda timelines. It’s just a really good reimagining of the universe that takes inspiration from all of the games, including Easter eggs and callbacks, with a dash of Miyazaki. And that’s totally fine.
@@ravenebony2267 also, perhaps the information about there not being another gerudo king after the first imprisoning war may be accurate circa the time BETWEEN the first imprisoning war and the events of TotK. Which would mean that the reason no other males were born in that time is that the previous male was technically still alive under hyrule castle. It was only AFTER his demise(badum tsss) that the Ganandorf of OoT was able to be born.
I don’t get why people think he’s doing evil for no reason. He literally says to Rauru that he took his power for granted and that he tried to control him. And that about lines up with the Japanese translation where it states he wanted a world full of strong people and he didn’t see Rauru as such. Also he’s Demise reincarnated and that drives him as well. It’s really not that deep.
Ganondorf's wind speech in The wind waker is entirely selfish as it was mostly him that coveted Hyrule's winds while most of his people didn't as they were fine with living in the harsh desert climate, before the timeskip he and his servants were brainwashing Gerudo who opposed him, only few shared Ganondorf's opinions and desires. The wind waker portrays him as a humbled hypocrite and a delusional madman who has turned his hatred and demons upon the gods and the great sea in an attempt to forcefully revive a forgotten and dead world of the past just so he could rule over it as the demon king, there are moments where he is trying to kill Link and only one moment where he doesn't before he changes his mind. He often treats his followers and his people as expendable pawns.
In the Japanese version of Tears of the kingdom Ganondorf's motives are shown a bit clearer, he wanted a world with some fighting spirit, courage and vigor and despised the peaceful world Rauru, Sonia and the ancient Zonai had created so he wanted to make the world merciless where people have to fight for survival, the weak fall and the strong rule while he can fight someone he can unleash his dark magic and physical strength upon. While this is also shown in the English version there is a bit more in the Japanese. When Ganondorf swears fealty to Rauru he says in English that it is unfortunate that the no let Zonai no longer grace the world with their presence, in Japanese it's made clear that the Zonai perished with only Rauru and Mineru being the remaining Zonai. Ganondorf thinks the Zonai were a weak godlike power wielding people as they perished despite their godlike powers.
The curse of the demon tribe is Saṃsāra 輪廻(the word appears in the speech). Saṃsāra is the cycle of death, birth and rebirth which is perpetuated by hate, greed, delusion as well as one's karma. It's something that has existed since the dawn of time. Demise described Saṃsāra(the inevitable cycle that permeates the world, everyone is subject to it and there is no point in running away from it because it will be the same for everyone no matter what happens), the state of the demon tribe and a concept intrinsic to the universe(as long as light exists evil is bound to return for where there is light there is also jealousy and where there is jealousy there is also lust and lust means negative feelings. No matter how much light there is to overcome the darkness the darkness will eventually return). Demise talks about how he will not be the last embodiment of the hatred of Saṃsāra, Demon king and source of monsters because his hate will eventually be part of someone else's hate. Demise's final words isn't him casting a curse, Demise would have doomed his tribe to never achieve eternal domination if he caused their enemies to reincarnate.
魔族の呪い (curse of the demon tribe)
魔族の呪い (Mazoku no noroi), demons' curse (Demise, SS)
魔人の呪い (Majin no noroi), demon's curse (Vaati, TMC)
光の力を持つ姫…ハイラルの王女が持っているといわれる
“The princess carries the power of light… It’s said that Hyrulean princesses possess this.
ふしぎな力というヤツですか…そんな力を持った者をほうっておいて
They call it a mysterious power… It wouldn’t do well to ignore someone with such power.
後々ジャマをされたら大変ですね…
It could become a serious hindrance in the future…
ワタの魔人の呪いで石になるがいい！
So I will turn you to stone with my demon’s curse!”
```
- Vaati, The Minish Cap
FI (SKYWARD SWORD)
"中でも貴重なお宝 邪の結晶は
魔族の呪いを放つ 魔物を倒したときに
得られる可能性があります
Among the most valuable treasures are the evil crystals,
which may be obtained by defeating demons that unleash
the curse of the Demon Tribe."
FI (SKYWARD SWORD)
"魔族の呪いにあうと 剣や盾が一定時間 使えなくなります
いったん その場から離れることを推奨
If you are under the curse of the Demon Tribe, you will be unable to use your sword or shield for a certain period of time.
It is recommended that you leave the area."
DEMISE (SKYWARD SWORD)
"我の憎悪は・・・
魔族の呪いは・・・
悠久の時の果てまで輪廻を描く
忘れな！
繰り返すのだ！
お前達は・・・
女神の血と勇者の魂を持つ者共は
永久にこの呪縛から逃れられぬ！
この憎悪と怨念が・・・その権化が
貴様らと共に 血塗られた闇の海を
永遠にもがき彷徨い続けるのだ！！
My hatred...
The curse of the Demon Tribe...
It shall go on continuously reincarnating across the flow of time…
Never forget this!
This will happen again!!
You... You who possess the blood of the goddess
and the soul of hero shall...forever be unable to escape from this curse!
This hatred and grudge...its **incarnations**
shall go on strugglingly wandering along with
you lowlifes within a bloodstained sea of darkness, forever!!"
ハイラルを 創りたまいし 古代の 神々よ！ 今こそ 封印の扉 開きて 邪悪なる 闇の化身を 冥府の彼方へ 葬りたまえ！！
Ancient gods who created Hyrule! Now is the time, open the sealed door and consign the evil **incarnation of Darkness** beyond the realm of the dead!!
~ Rauru (Ocarina of Time)
神の御名において治められし大地は安寧のなかにあリました
Because it came to be governed in God’s name, the Earth was filled with peace.
けれどもその穏やかな時は突如として失われたのです・・・
However, this calm time was suddenly lost…
闇の権化 魔王の襲来・・・多くの命が奪われ 大地が焼かれました
The **Incarnation of Darkness**: the Demon King’s invasion... Many lives were taken, and the Earth was burnt.
~ Niko (Spirit Tracks)
Evil will always exist/Evil is here to stay trope:
ruclips.net/video/Sk6YkEd-NQo/видео.htmlsi=h64OM7pqPeZX8PHF
ruclips.net/video/Cjqj4kbSvq0/видео.html
Demise's eradication and removal from the cycle of reincarnation:
ゼルダ様・・・ハイリア様の記憶をお持ちの あなたには おわかりの筈です
“Zelda…you possess Hylia’s memories, so you must understand that it must be so.
私は元より この時代の人間なのです
I am originally a human of this era.
お戻り下さい・・・あなた方の時代へ私はゼルダ様達が 去られた後この扉を処理します
Return for me, please…to your era. After you all pass through, I shall deal with this gate.
私は ハイリア様の命を受けてあなたを守り 世界を救う為に時の扉をくぐりました
I received Hylia’s command, to pass through the Gate of Time for the sake of saving the world and protecting you.
そして終焉の者の思念が 剣の中で朽ち行く今・・・誰かが あの剣を見守って行かねばなりません
And now that the thoughts of Demise are proceeding to decay within the blade… Someone must watch over that blade.
終焉の者が 目を覚ます事があってはならない・・・世界が 再び脅威にさらされては ならないのです・・・
Demise cannot awaken…this world must not be exposed to that threat again…
そして それは我ら一族に課せられたもの・・・
And that is the assignment of my clan…
女神様に選ばれた誇りを 胸に抱く我らシーカー族の果たすべき役目なのです
This is the duty that must be performed by us Sheikah, who bear the pride of being chosen by the Goddess in our hearts.”
- Impa (young), before sending us through the gate, Skyward Sword
Skyward sword ending:
ruclips.net/video/BDqqm6rhF-s/видео.htmlsi=gVaZJKW-69ftrfVl
Glitterberri's translation of Hyrule historia(it should be noted that the books are subjective not objective, the game information overrules them, the books have errors and inconsistencies):
"However, the extinction of Demise was not the end of the battle. This was the beginning of the endless cycle of the conflict of those bound to the curse of the demon that have the Blood of the Goddess and the Spirit of the Hero." This shows that Demise's defeat was the beginning of the conflict between the demon tribe, evil and the spirit of the hero and the blood of the goddess but not the beginning of the curse(the hatred towards the gods was a thing before the events of Skyward sword)
"Fi also fulfilled her role and her contract with Link was dissolved. The Master Sword was returned to its pedestal, and enters a long slumber along with Fi. Impa stays in the Past in order to watch over the sword, ensuring the complete eradication of Demise’s residual conciousness." this shows that Demise is completely gone but that doesn't stop manifestations from appearing.
Yeah it's crazy.. But I find odd that there seems to be a connection between Gerudo and Bringer demise Hatred.
Ganondorf is an incarnation of demise hatred.. is The Gerudo Tribe Bloodline Somehow tainted somehow?.. It doesn't help that A Male Gerudo Was not born since Ganondorf was Sealed.. So it's clear... Which is Beyond 10 thousand years.
Spoilers:.. Now that he has been killed.. It's very possible that another Male Gerudo Will Be Born Again.. The only question can the cycle be broken if the Male Gerudo Was Raised Properly?.. Of Course Ganondorf is not the only incarnation of the demise's hatred..
Meaning... this Demise crap will go _forever_ with no end until Nintendo is done with this franchise for good.
@@javiervasquez625 I'm down for that... Zelda never lets me down even though some of the games are not my style. I can appreciate the innovation the series has
@@byksEBM I just realized a "paradox" of sorts regarding the Demon's Tribe curse: at the end of Demise's monologue he slaggs off Link and Zelda as "lowlifes" despite both of them _kicking_ his tribe's @ss 2 times before and yet he honestly thinks a curse is gonna be a big deal for the 2 of them? What a hilarious juxtaposition casting a curse on 2 "lowlifes" who're clearly *stronger* than you Demise...
@@javiervasquez625well that’s the thing about his curse. He knows he’s going to die for good and doesn’t care about victory because he won’t experience this and he knows this. He doesn’t care if the incarnation of his hate wins, he just wants it to incarnate time and time again to plummet hyrule into war. That’s all he care about, dooming the world to war forever. The curse itself is a victory for demise.
I think we need to know more about how he orchestrated the events of the great calamities despite being sealed beneath the castle
He orchestatred nothing, Ganon was just his hatred and frustration taking a physical form
Even with Rauru's seal, Ganondorf hatred escaped little by little, forming a sentient being by itself.
There's precedence that Ganon influences things from behind the scenes in twilight Princess and LttP, it's a strong recurring theme. Downgrading into overly literalized, "it's magic anger" is pointless.
I would start with Rauru. Of course he could be a different character, but look at Rauru in OoT with the knowledge on King Rhoam's lingering spirit: Rauru is ALSO a spirit, he's part of the ORGINAL sages in OoT backstory. Must be. He secured his spirit in Sacred Realm. So does this mean he died? Not necessarily.
We now know of dragnification, and mummification, and also Sheikah monks... King Rauru is strangely absent-minded, asking clarification even on Zonai matters, adn those facials scales... don't they resemble the Imprisoned Demise? I tell you this: Rauru HAS BEEN dragonified, and the mind he's displaying, IS A DRAGON. This phenomenon, of dragonification, is forbidden NOT because the Zonai fear it as "death". It pushes your soul into death BEYOND death, not EVEN reincarnating anymore. And this is WHY there are timelines. The mind is pushed into another timeline, and whatever world is there for that mind to live off of, remains up to other factors.
'-'-'--'
Some time after SS, Gaepora's descendants (ergo Zelda's) begat Rauru, the sage, whose spirit and body were separated. This mindless body became the dragon, King Rauru, the second-least dragonified Zonai after Mineru. And the MIND, was able to persist in Sacred Realm, where he guarded the Triforce for OoT.
The entire WORLD of OoT, was mummified like Ganondorf, in an event that became a blink of an eye by the ending of the game. The characters you know, they all had their spirits face Termination through Majora's Mask, as their bodies were reborn along with Ganondorf IN THE SACRED REALM: that world, where the new world was built to be the Great Sea. AND THIS SAME WORLD, is the Golden Land that Ganon would turn into Dark world in ALttP, and would even later become Lorule.
What Ganondorf did, was that he operated out of WW and DURING WW to pass the events of Twilight Princess, appearing to Zant and influencing Zelda through dark, transcendental magic. Only when he was turned to stone, almost like mummified, he was able to detach his entire spirit and appear at the end of Twilight Princess, and that, BECAUSE of the effects of twilight. Dying in Twilight Princess just made him try again in the Downfall timeline. And he would try again, whenever a suitable body would host his spirit, but before that it's just access from another timeline by using dark magical devices like the Magic Mirror.
@@carlosamgalaxythe events are a manifestation of the culmination of malice over some time
@@sboinkthelegday3892 Lol no that's a crazy theory which dismisses the _agency_ of the characters if they're forced reincarnated across different timelines against their will. Other than Ganondorf no other character in Zelda (that we know of) is able to reincarnate into a new body.
Ganondorf TotK, Ganondorf OoT, and Ganondorf Imprisoned War predate LttP are the same Ganon at the same time… but from another timeline.
>>>Wild Timeline
>Skyward Sword
(Demise is killed by Link in the past. Divine prank allows the Master Sword to exist in two timelines.)
(Founding of Hyule by the Zonai)
(Ganondorf is born)
(Tears of the Kingdom memories)
(Imprisoning War)
(First Calamity)
(Breath of the Wild memories)
(Second Calamity)
>Breath of the Wild
>Tears of the Kingdom
>>>Child Timeline
>Skyward Sword
(The Imprison is crushed by Link’s Triforce wish. Divine prank allows the Master Sword to exist in two timelines.)
(Founding of Hyrule)
(The Hero of Men received the Minish Blade)
>Minish Cap (Vaati is destroyed)
(Ganondorf is born)
>Ocarina of Time (child timeline)
(Ganondorf is captured)
>Majora’s Mask
>Twilight Princess
>>>Adult Timeline
>Skyward Sword
(The Imprison is crushed by Link’s Triforce wish. Divine prank allows the Master Sword to exist in two timelines.)
(Founding of Hyrule)
(The Hero of Men received the Minish Blade)
>Minish Cap (Vaati is destroyed)
(Ganondorf is born)
>Ocarina of Time (adult timeline)
(Ganondorf is sealed)
(The Great Flood)
>Wind Waker
>Phantom Hourglass
(Founding of New Hyrule)
>Sprit Tracks
>>>Classic Timeline
>Skyward Sword
(The Imprison is crushed by Link’s Triforce wish. Divine prank allows the Master Sword to exist in two timelines.)
(Founding of Hyrule)
(The Hero of Men received the Minish Blade)
>Minish Cap (Vaati is sealed)
(Vaati escapes and kidnaps beautiful girls, a Hero use the Four Swords again.)
>Four Swords
(Ganondorf is born)
>Four Swords Adventures
(Imprisoning War)
>A Link to the Past
>Link’s Awakening
(Triforce splits)
>A Link Between Worlds
>Tri Force Heros
>Oracle of Ages/Seasons
>The Legend of Zelda
>The Adventure of Link
I think the theory that Breath of the Wild and Tears of the Kingdom takes place at the very end of the timeline makes more sense. An event caused all three timelines to merge (Hyrule Warriors even though its not Canon), after the catastrophe of 3 parallel worlds merging, Hyrule gets founded by the Zonai which leads up to the events of the Wild Era.
@@mrn1616 Me too. There's a theory that BOTW/TOTK takes place so astronomically long after any of the other entries that they have basically become myths and legends at this point and they could've happened sometime before BOTW or were made up stories.
@@mrn1616 so you think is Elder Scrolls Dragon Break? Rather than a (something that canonical) Divine Prank?
The book "Creating a Champion" makes it very clear that the _Era of the Wild_ takes places *thousands of years* after the _Era of Myth_ where the 3 timelines ended. The Ganondorf seen in Tears of the Kingdom is a _reincarnation_ of the one from Ocarina of Time just like the one from Four Swords Adventures.
@@methodius--9405 Yes I think its like an Elder Scrolls dragon break. The break began in OoT and it somehow ended which resulted in a new unified timeline. There are a lot of videos that theorize about this too so I think they're worth checking out.
On the TOTK website there was a disclaimer that said before it got deleted "**full version of game required to use DLC. Sold seperately." so MAYYYBE we will see more of his motives explored, context and lore? I can only hope.
What I hoping for a TOTK dlc story expansion so we can see more of Zelda’s own adventure in the distant past while being a playable character. To see how Queen Sonia trained her to mastered her time power, and to revealed if Sonai and Rauru have any children.
Personally I wanted to see the entirety of the imprisoning war so badly.
Thus, explore the origins of Ganondorf, how the life of the early Gerudo becomes more barbaric with so many atrocities these warrior women have committed, what drove the formal King of the Gerudo in conquering Hyrule, have Naboris (who may be the Ancient Sage of Lightning) has grown suspicious of his dark ambitions and decided to defect on him to join King Rauru’s Sages, and reintroducing his surrogate mothers (Kotake and Koume) as they’re seen briefly in two Dragon Tear memories in their golden masks.
Maybe see TOTK's take on Twinrova in a new way (as Zelda fans are familiar with this iconic foe from Ocarina of Time).
All I want is one cutscene where ganondorf is at a table eating with the royal family + zelda, giving off this tense silence until Rauru breaks the silence and asks ganondorf questions, kind of pressing him
Imagine Hyrule warriors 2 imprisoning war (like Hyrule warriors calamity)
Great video. Your zelda theories are always awesome
Great video bro, v informative
You got me jumping up and down over this! You're basically saying the thing I've been thinking for the last month and it's like ambrosia in my ear
Love this recap of history of the games and explanation of Ganondorf motives.
I wish I could watch this now. I’m really taking my time. I’m only three temples in. I’ll come back and catch up on your totk videos when I beat the game.
It's awesome the way you pieced together his history and thus tears of the kingdom's.
Can someone explain any insight that they may have as I am confused why Ganondorf attacks Hyrule with Molduga. I thought they only moved through sand and even though they can jump, if they breach themselves onto land they won’t be able to dig under the ground of Hyrule dirt and would be beached, vulnerable and incredibly ineffective.
One of the fan theories before TOTK came out was that this would end the cycle of demise. And i thought how cool would it be if it turned out Ganondorf himself was just cursed by Demise. A vessel chosen to continue his original plan, and had no free will of its own. And then we end the curse and Ganondorf turns out to be just a cool guy
Alas Nintendo chose to repeat the same plot over and over again to keep continuity with the original game's theme of the 3 essences holding the world...
I think Ganondorf, despite being so powerful, is all too sure of himself which then turns into something toxic. He's arrogant, prideful and he's also has a large part of him thats confused or in conflict with each other (insert there are two wolves inside of you meme).
Darkness is born of the earth itself, especially in Zelda games. When I battled Ganon in totk, all I could think about is just how confusing his mantra was. He'd been working, as a King for the Gerudo, for quite some time before totk's ancient history. He was first dedicated to his people, to grant them better lives.
But at the display of power somewhere in his life, whether it was when Rauru blasted all those molduga or another event that wasn't chronicled, and he identified the secret stones. I think he suddenly lost all his sense his original of way.
Demise is using him like a tool, you could argue to the same for Link and Hylia.. but Link remains in a pure state. Unclouded. Demise's insistence is almost feral, feeding Ganondorf the promise of power to save the Gerudo. When they may not even need saving as they thrive well enough. In fact, Ganondorf turns his back on his people and forces Gerudo settlements to submit to him.
Getting in his own way despite wanting to originally bring his people a less harsh environment... his new people end up being monsters who get to roam and do his bidding in the kingdom that is green and prosperous. Because Demise definitely doesn't care what happens to anyone else, only that he will someday prove his power stronger to that of Hylia's light.
You know…Koume and Kotake being Ganondorf’s surrogate mothers in OoT actually makes a lot more sense after this game. Do you think it’s possible that the Twins used magic to bring about the resurrection of their demon king they knew from TotK? I’m pretty sure they do something similar in I think the Oracles games. It’s possible that they were successful the first time in OoT.
Now obviously I doubt that the Gerudo wanted another male king after what happened with the first Ganondorf, but I’m sure that the twins could convince them that this “new” Ganondorf really wanted what was best for them this time.
Anyways great video!
When we played OoT, it seemed obvious he was just a self- motivate baddie. But now I am convinced Ganondorfs are tragedies of outside motives of persistent evil entities.
HOWEVER, he is always a force of vengeance from injustices against his people. So I think it is a formula of evil at hand, making sure that history repeats itself to ensure the persistence.
It has been a while that I thought about a compeling story which Ganondorf actually resist the curse and there is this inner conflict between him and Demise or Demise's curse. A sympathetic villain makes a story even more powerful. In The Wind Waker I actually wondered a bit how "good" were the "good guys" that decided that FLOODING HYRULE was the best option, even if warning people to reach the top of the mountains, they doomed the land.
It was probably a last resort. Ganondorf did seem pretty vengeful when he was sealed at the end of OOT, so his rampage was probably especially brutal.
I believe the memories, BOTW & TOTK all take place 10000+ years after the last game of any time line so Nintendo could do a soft reboot without catching Flak from the fanbase
Bingo someone who figured it out.
I think you did a great job with the presentation, but I think you've made the same mistake a lot of people do with that Wind Waker speech: You've assumed Ganondorf, the man who spent his youth manipulating the king of Hyrule and using subterfuge to get his way and attempt to claim the spiritual stones, was telling the truth about his motivations.
Ganondorf abandoned the Gerudo in Ocarina of Time the moment he seized power, keeping them in the desert under his minion's and loyal supporters' control while he ruled the land with monsters. He did not help them at all, and simply made Hyrule a worse place for everyone currently living there while he searched for the triforce to get his wish. He was using the Gerudo for power and threw them away once they were no longer useful.
Same thing in TotK. He used his status with them to wage war, but once he got the stone, he conquered with monsters and left the Gerudo to rot. Even once he awakened, he sent monsters and a terrible sandstorm to wipe out his own people years later. Ganondorf's speech in the Wind Waker was him lying to children (and himself) about how his intentions were good at first. He then proceeded to try and murder those children the moment he didn't get his way. Taking him at his own word is, in my opinion, a mistake too many people make.
Ganondorf's TRUE intentions: Power. That's why he was willing to give up himself at the end of it all. If he couldn't have power HIS way, he'd have it regardless. Ganondorf wants to rule the world in an unending era of darkness, and will lie, manipulate, and murder to do it.
Ganondorf stands for _Chaos_ while Zelda stands for _Order_ and Link stands for _balance_ between the 2 as shown during the final battle with Zelda and Ganondorf in dragon forms while Link stands in *between* the 2 as a "mediator" of sorts.
Zelda = Light = Order
Ganondorf = Darkness = Chaos
Link = balance
What he want is
_Suavemente_
SUAVÉ
See, my problem with TotK's past being before OOT is the fact that Hyrule has been well established by Minish Cap, and if I'm not mistaken, OOT was intended to depict the original Imprisoning War
The ALttP Imprisoning War is only called "The Imprisoning War" in English, in Japanese it's called "The Sealing War."
Yeah just looked it up, that one was set in specifically the Defeat timeline, which is 1) even later in the timeline, and 2) only in one of them, which leads me to believe TotK's past is still set after all 3 timelines
It is worth noting that Wind Waker Ganondorf only acts like that after his defeat, if we look at the "other outcomes" of his fate he either didnt change a bit or he was more evil than ever.
My Idea would be that the Spirit of TotK Ganondorf could escape the seal and take over / Influence the Minds of other Gerudo Males while his original body was sealed, after TotK Ganondorf was defeated and turned into Wind Waker Ganondorf, I think the Spirit of his Predecessor was seperated from him through an Exorcism made by the Master Sword (One of the Japanese names used to describe the Master Sword was Taima no Ken (if i remember it right) which means Exorcism Sword/Sword of Exorcism - and Exorcism is actually very acurate to be seen as Evil's Bane)
And this allows OoT Ganondorf who has been Influenced since birth by his Predecessor's Spirit to fully think on his own - he didnt turn evil right away, but the fact that he now thinks straight till the end is remarkable.
This means that they are rather different Individuals deep down.
Evidence for my theory that TotK Ganondorf can leave his Body is revealed in the Scene where Link confronts Ganondorf's Fake Zelda.
In this Scene "she" restores Hyrule Castle with Illusional Magic.
Then "she" says something very interesting
"Hyrule Castle, in its former glory, doesnt this awake memories? Memories of our Time here?"
Interesting... Ganondorf shows Memories that he shouldnt be able to have, he remembers how this Hyrule Castle looks on the inside but at the same time he remembers Meeting Link in this room some time ago... this means his spirit could escape but he had to create himself a new body - Calamity Ganon
He didn't "remember" meeting Link rather he was simply playing around with him by pretending to be Zelda and convince him to lower his guard to take him down. It's clear that this new Ganondorf is a *reincarnation* of the one from Ocarina of Time and Four Swords Adventures which is why he doesn't recall any memories of his past incarnations from thousands of years into the past.
@@javiervasquez625 Then how do you explain him restoring Hyrule Castle's Throne room? How is he supposed to know how it looks like?
@@Chris-gx1ei ¿Magic? He used the secret stone's power to _read_ Link's mind in turn giving him _insight_ as to how things looked in the future Era before the Calamity destroyed the kingdom in the first place (convoluted storytelling here we go).
Or perhaps another explanation is that Ganondorf had at least some minimal consciousness during the cataclysms to be able to observe his surroundings (remember that the seal had been weakening since the first cataclysm). So, it's likely that during the second cataclysm, Ganondorf already had the necessary consciousness to do things like control the Guardians and Divine Beasts. This would explain why he didn't do so during the first cataclysm, as he didn't have enough consciousness then. It would also explain that this level of "awareness" allowed him to see through Calamity Ganon and witness the kingdom of Hyrule in its prime.
I think it’s kind of weird that this is Demise’s curse and it will always inhabit a person, but the person always turns out to be Ganondorf or a person trying to revive Ganon. It’s just weird that the hatred just always winds up as him or a reincarnation of him
Love the theory and cant help but draw the connection to reality. People who do their research know the deserts werent always deserts, many homes to past civilizations. Just like wind waker Ganon states, catastrophe struck. Then on top of that people not from his realm came down and started kingdoms while him and his people suffer. Ganon sees himself as true King fighting against invaders because there was darkness before the light.
Chaos (Darkness) existed before Order (Light). Then Order imposed itself into Chaos and so a new Era of stability and peace was established across the entire Earth that is the Zelda World as Chaos was buried underneath the Earth's crust where it dwindled for a time until there was enough Chaos in the Human world that would allow it to return once more. (Skyward Sword) The rest is history.
There is actually evidence that disproves the distant past of TotK that Zelda went to is before Ocarina of Time.
1. The Rito exist. The Rito as a race have only ever existed in the Adult Timeline, where they were the descendants of the Zora. There is little evidence of them existing in any other timeline.
2. In the Creating a Champion book which detailed some additional lore for Breath of the Wild, it was revealed that the Gerudo haven't had a male Gerudo born for thousands of years ever since the one became the Calamity (aka TotK Ganondorf). So if Demon King Ganondorf brought a halt to the male gerudo birth cycle, how would OoT Ganondorf have been born?
3. There have been several Hyrules throughout the Zelda Timeline. There have been a few times where the Kingdom of Hyrule fell and was reborn. It was washed away in the adult timeline then Tetra and her crew founded a new Hyrule in the time between Wind Waker and Spirit Tracks. And at the end of the Fallen Hero Timeline, the kingdom of Hyrule was brought to the brink of collapse and is for all intents and purposes, a broken kingdom. What I'm trying to say is, it is far more likely that Rauru's Hyrule is a completely new one, likely being refounded after some great disaster destroyed the old kingdom.
4. The Great Plateau is where the OoT Hyrule used to be. The Temple of Time ruins resembles the one from OoT, and if you look around, the surrounding area bears a striking resemblance to castle town and where OoT Hyrule Castle was. And in TotK's lore, after the Imprisoning War, Rauru and Sonia's descendants relocated the kingdom to on top of the sight of Ganondorf's imprisonment to insure the site and the imprisoning seal was never disturbed. Big Daddy G's malice leaking out lead to the creation of Calamity Ganon which is why the big cloudy boar always shows up from underneath Hyrule Castle in the BotW Memories. So if the distant past of TotK takes place before OoT and the lore states the kingdom was moved north of the plateau to central hyrule, then how would OoT Hyrule suddenly be on the great plateau after the relocation? Unless there were two hyrules at the same time.
A lot of what I was thinking was similar to this theory but I think there could be even more if you look deep into Ganondorf's lines in Wind Waker. Years ago I just assumed that Ganondorf wanted to "fix" Hyrule becuase he still wanted to rule it. But after seeing so many videos about how Wind Waker Ganondorf is lighter than the others it occurs to me that Ganondorf's wish "Give Hyrule to me" could just be him saying "give me back my home". After Ganondorf's plan failed in Wind Waker it always seemed weird to me that Ganondorf said "I'll show you what your precious Triforces are worth". If he didn't think they were worth anything then why did he spend the whole game working to get them? This never made sense to me. But what if Ganondorf was trying to resist the curse of Demise and redeem himself? He did use shady methods to get the Triforce but if he thought it was for the greater good and if he was only planning to restore Hyrule in that game then it makes sense that he would be upset and calling the Triforce useless because he was trying to use it to fix things for everyone's sake and then he ends up accomplishing nothing. Then Ganondorf seems to snap I thought he just went crazy but it might be that he just gives up and doesn't see the point in resisting Demise's curse anymore.
i really hope they explore ganondorfs character and demises curse more in future games, like what if a future incarnation of him is born as a hero of the gerudo and actually fights for a noble cause, but demises curse slowly infests his mind in a way he doesnt want. It would also be interesting to explore link and zelda's "divine purpose given to them by the gods", but what if they reject that purpose? we know the gods are kindof morally grey, given how they drowned the entire world in wind waker, or grant ganondorf a piece of the triforce multiple times. maybe a game that lets link and zelda team up with ganondorf could show those themes of going against their fate and to maybe break the cycle and demises curse
I mean, even in skyward sword, that zelda experiences guilt for "using" link in a way. She has an internal struggle about not even knowing who she is, the goddess Hylia or just the human Zelda? The gods and Demise basically use Zelda, Link and Ganondorf as their puppets, even if it is sometimes for the greater good.
The Gerudo Desert is obviously a challenge. And yet the Gerudo women made it work. They created both a bustling center of trade at the Kara Kara Bazaar and a temperate women's only paradise in Gerudo Town. So no. Ganon was wrong, the desert is quite livable. He just was arrogant and lazy, and refused to use his considerable natural power and command in a way that would actually help his people. It's no wonder the Gerudo ended the male-birthright-king tradition.
Bro! I totally missed that!
It would seem as if his mentors have been planning something
It almost reminds me of a certain quote the seeds of the future lie buried in the past
Why cant they just share bro. All settlements are like 30 people big at most
I think people have talked about the Japanese translation of Ganondorf’s motives having to do with people becoming soft when the monsters are driven out and that returning the land to what it was will make the people strong again.
I think that is a cool tidbit that would have fit the story a lot better and ties into possibly hinting the Barbarian Armors origin.
**********************
I personally don’t buy his act in Wind Waker as being completely altruistic. While I do think his motivation for wanting to escape the desert is true, him wanting to bring his people out of it like everyone says does not sound right at all.
He did rule Hyrule in the Adult Timeline and did not take his people with him. They still were left in that desert and Castle Town was abandoned due. Considering Ganondorf can control the monsters, it would stand to reason that he could have either forced them to protect his people or kept his people in the castle with him.
I think his ambition altogether was completely selfish. He wanted the prosperous land for himself and that ultimate power.
"It was a wicked and wild wind
Blew down the doors to let me in
Shattered windows and the sound of drums
People couldn't believe what I'd become
Revolutionaries wait
For my head on a silver plate
Just a puppet on a lonely string
Oh, who would ever want to be king?
I hear Jerusalem bells a-ringin'
Roman Cavalry choirs are singing
Be my mirror, my sword and shield
My missionaries in a foreign field
For some reason, I can't explain
I know Saint Peter won't call my name
Never an honest word
But that was when I ruled the world." Viva la vida from Coldplay
Some have argued that the reason why Ganondorf didn't inmediatly allow his people to settle in Hyrule and enjoy it's lush, greenish world was due to the fact that he had yet claimed the _full_ Triforce yet and needed to obtain all 3 pieces so that neither Zelda or Link could stop the Gerudo's control over the Realm. Seeing as we've never seen Ganondorf having full mastery over the Triforce while _outside_ the Sacred Realm it is always possible he might have used it to completley safeguard the Gerudo's future.
what about all the items you can get in this game like TP Ganon's sword or TP Link's outfit, is it really possible to place this before OoT? Zelda on BotW also mentions in a speech about the twilight
Love the theory and glad you mentioned Twinrova! Btw Kotake was right but Koume is more like Co-oo-may (oo like ooze).
If you care lol
So in all, the hylians became greedy as hell 😂
Nintendo, Aonuma San, and Fujibayashi San needs to take notes from this video for adding TOTK dlc of Ganondorf’s origins. :)
Doubt it's gonna happen considering they didn't do it back in The Wind Waker and Twilight Princess despite having every reason to delve deeper in that Ganondorf's backstory not to show at least one flashback of his past. Doubt there's any reason for them to both doing it now. :/
Developers of Breath of the Wild and TotK.
so, this game takes places thousands of years after all the other games, so far in fact that all of the previous games have faded into myth and Legend.
-the fan base.
-Clearly it takes place, before this and that game, and then after this game, but before this branch.
x-D
Andres, what would be your timeline canonically for the Zelda games ?-?
Hell no. In tears of the kingdom, he is cookie-cutter evil. He wants the world to be dark, full of monsters. Strongest deserves to live, and the weak deserve to die. No peace nonsense, no sob story about his desert. You can't use his motivation from a previous incarnation to create a narrative about what this Ganondorf wants.
Who would have thought that the story of TOTK have taken some inspirations from Ocarina of Time if you look back at this nostalgic moments? 0_O
It took inspiration from across all the major games in the series ranging from the "Sky World" from Skyward Sword, a "Dark World" via the Depths from A Link to the Past, an ancient lost kingdom from The Wind Waker and a conflict of duality between to opposing concepts from Twilight Princess. This game was a fresh blend of several plotpoints from across the entire franchise.
There could be another Hyrule warriors with the age of calamity cast. Zelda can still find Ganondorf under the castle. This time they can be accompanied by the time traveling to it this time and take link with Zelda. Just dumb logic for the whole cast to be in at the same time.
He seems to have the same goal as Ocarina of Time and Wind Waker where he wanted a place to live that wasn’t the harsh lands of the Gerudo Desert. I don’t entirely blame him for wanting out of his homeland of scorching hot days and bone chilling cold nights. The problem is he immediately resorts to violence to get what he wants. It seems like the influence of Demise tends to make his various incarnations to be hateful, jealous, and violent, mainly towards the Hylians who are protected by the 3 Golden Goddesses of creation and their guardian goddess Hylia.
Anyone wonder why he never leaves the depths… (the seal is still in place from the wish made on the Triforce from Windwaker)
Is the first bit of the video a scam, I can't tell? The number with the "orders with discount left" appears to be a static non changing value in the link's HTML file. For me its a static 137, which is kinda odd considering this is a deal a lot of people would want, but correct me if im wrong.
I do not think that Ganondorf has the same motives as the Ocarina of Time Ganondorf, nor even that the placement of the memories is before Ocarina. "History is doomed to repeat itself, at first a grand tale, the next a farce." As for placement of the memories, it is very reasonable that the establishment under King Rauru happens far after the other timelines end. We do not know how long it is between that and the Great Calamity ten thousand years ago. And ten thousand years is a huge amount of time: many many many life times and kingdoms rising and falling, cultures clashing and fading, turbulence and peace.
Thus, I propose that after the end of the timeline split, Hyrule decays because of conflicts over the Triforce. In realizing the danger of such a power, the people, much like there counterparts in Lorule, decide to use the Triforce to destroy itself. However, with the chaos that induces, the decay of hyrule was hastened. This break up of an Empire cause the Hylians to revert to a sort of dark age. Then the Zonai, who have the superior technology, "conquer" the ruins of Hyrule and bring with them their Secret stones. For however many years after that the Zonai and the Hylians mutually benefit one another. Then the Zonai, due to their technology, begin to decay themselves, living longer and has less and less of a desire to multiply. Then realizing that the new Zonai empire was not going to last, Rauru marries Sonia, the priestess of time, to create the kingdom of hyrule.
Throught the dark age period, history was lost and fell into the era of myth. This means that the stories of Link and Zelda, and Ganondorf have faded so much that they are not seen even as real. And so history was not taught and people were doomed to repeat it. Thus, an "endless cycle of reincarnation".
But why would the king in OoT trust another Ganondorf when they had a massive Imprisoning War just a couple centuries earlier (records of this have survived tens of thousands of years, the royal family knows of it and of the importance of the castle which has been built ontop of the seal, which was destroyed absolutely in OoT)? And why would the Gerudo crown another Ganondorf when they swore not to do it again (he's been in memory tens of thousands of years later; Urbosa remarks about him/it).
IMO TotK's story and its past only makes sense and fit if it plays millenia after the last game of any/all timeline(s).
The vast majority of the Gerudo Tribe were sympathizers of this Ganondorf from TOTK, as seen in the memories. They were a warrior people, which aligned with this Ganondorf's mentality. When he becomes the Demon King and Rauru seals him, the people of the Royal Family do not remember him as "Ganondorf, Leader of the Gerudo," as indicated in one of the castle's writings describing the seal he holds. Instead, they refer to Ganondorf as the "Demon King." In the royal family's eyes, this first Ganondorf was more known as the Demon King than as the leader of the Gerudo. Additionally, only a few people were aware of the events of the war that took place in TOTK. The Ganondorf remembered by Urbosa as a despicable being who tarnished the tribe's name is the Ganondorf from Ocarina of Time, who indeed was known as the Leader of the Gerudo and not as the Demon King.
I have a similar theory:
- TotK Ganondorf is the FIRST Ganondorf
->Theory: His will and hate were passed on like the curse of Demise and at the same time part of his curse
- When he went away, the witches(Twinrova) wanted to recreate it him
- A new boy was born with the will and hatred of the TotK Ganondorf
- This boy now named Ganondorf(OoT) became Calamity Ganon
- Calamity Ganon is part of the original Ganondorf but not the same person
He's a *reincarnation* of the last known Ganondorf from Ocarina of Time and Four Swords Adventures born after the _Era of Myth_ as confirmed in Creating a Champion. This Ganondorf was born in a *new* kingdom of Hyrule founded AFTER the old Hyrules dissapeared in the Era of Myth.
The only thing I disagree with is Koume and Kotake being the same ones in OoT. In OoT they say they are about 400 years old, which seems like a short amount of time between the beginning of TotK and OoT
I hate that they try this bs where he acts like he is out there to earn the world or fight real fights.
Because what he does goes starkly against any goal he could have.
He creates loser monsters fighting for him instead of taking out enemies himself. He wants the world empty of life while not even trying to create a monster that could equal him to have fights with.
He's dumb and stupid.
And I can't wait for a future Ganondorf to finally use the triforce to rid himself of whatever connection or curse of demise already. So he can have more interesting motives already.
Ganondorf Was cursed by a loser demon to rise forever as a loser. Ganondorf can't possibly have that forever
Also wind waker Ganondorf was full of shit.
He lied to children hoping not to have to fight them, knowing that he can't win that battle.
Just think for a second. Ganondorf let his people rot in the desert when he controlled hyrule. And hyrule would've just let his people in anyways.
All he speaks at the end of ww is lies
Also also, the gerudo were around before Rauru and Sonia founded their kingdom, they chose the desert. They always could have lived in any of the huge open spaces of the world.
Don't read too much into it, Ganondorf will always be irrational evil for antagonist sake
Nintendo has already stated this game is the farthest in the future and makes the timelines irrelevant through their statement on BotW. Given that everything taking place in the present is so far in the future that the timelines don't matter, that means that this isn't the same Hyrule but instead the second or maybe even third Hyrule. There's also the fact that the Rito are present at the founding of the kingdom. Them being there at the start and absent until Wind Waker isn't something that can really be handwaved away that easily. It's far too inconsistent and jarring and is therefore more sensible that it's the distant future from founding to present. Ganondorf also didn't know about the Master Sword except from what he heard from Rauru. As for the name, I would say the population forgot it but the Zonai knew it and were perhaps told to name it that by the gods.
Honestly, I don't understand why people are debating the placement of everything when Nintendo has pretty much put that issue to bed. If an official placement isn't enough for you, then what the hell is enough? It doesn't get any clearer than an official placement from the developers and even without an exact one on it's founding, it's easy to determine it's a later kingdom through official placements. It doesn't even take doing any math to figure that out but just some basic problem solving and simple logic. If this is just for the sake of content, then it sounds like it's getting to the point where there is no such thing as enough. I would think you could make theories without bringing up the timelines over and over until people are sick of it. I know I'm sick of it and would either use it doesn't matter or a cataclysmic event either caused a merge or the gods had to merge them, kind of like a dragon break but worse. If there are people who need timeline placements for everything, then I fail to understand them. I guess myself and those people will just have to agree to disagree and leave it there.
I have a hard time accepting Ganondorf's path as inevitable, but he certainly didn't have even a shred of a chance to value morals/ethics outside of his King bubble, which as you stated would have been carefully formed by Koume and Kotake. Lots of people in that situation in the real world, too.
Rule #1 of geopolitics: Geography is destiny
Rauru came down from the sky and being taken as gods, took over rule of the land. He had no right to it and took away ganons rightful ability to rule as a
king. That angered Ganon and he fought back bringing about the imprisoning war. Rauru shouldn’t have come down the the land to begin with.
That wasn't Rauru, that was the ancient Zonai. During the events leading to the Imprisoning war only Rauru and Mineru remain of the Zonai. Ganondorf despised the peace that the Zonai had brought and was being a dick about it.
@@carljohansson3512 Sounds like Demise with Hylia and the "God Tribe" mentioned in the japanese translation of Skyward Sword. One could argue that Ganondorf and the Zonai are basically "extensions" of both factions waging the same wars that were waged once long ago. A cycle through all of time for eternity.
It’s a good analysis, but you say how the darkness is just as harsh to the gerudo as the light. So him wanting to destroy the light on behalf of his people doesn’t really follow… at least for me.
To me he still seems like “I do bad things because I’m bad and I’m bad because I do bad things”
Maybe more so at one point he had some reason because of his people but it devolved into him becoming straight demonic due to the reasons I mentioned
it feels right for TOTK to take place after SS. During the establishment of Hyrule Kingdom years before the minish cap. Placement for TOTK on the timeline is still very questionable tho
Both recent games are a _soft reboot_ of the franchise taking place thousands of years after the "Era of Myth" with a new kingdom of Hyrule similar to the one founded by Tetra in Spirit Tracks. This new Ganondorf is simply a *reincarnation* just like the one from Four Swords Adventures.
@@javiervasquez625Breath of the Wild and Tears of the Kingdom, yes, they happen at the end of any of the three timelines, or all three simultaneously, as we remember that the last time they separated was when Zelda was the Wisdom of Time. In this game, she becomes the Wisdom of Time again, so a unification of the timelines wouldn't be surprising. Both options are valid, but not for the past of Tears of the Kingdom. If it is the true origin of the kingdom of Hyrule and not a "re-foundation," the events of the past must necessarily occur after Skyward Sword and before Minish Cap. It is likely that the Zonnan descended to Hyrule during the Era of Chaos.
@@j.p6815 Lol "Wisdom of Time"? I assume you mean _Hylia_ and the _disproven_ notion that ALL the Zeldas in the entire timeline ARE HYLIA in a reincarnated form basically suggesting she's her own ancestor/descendant (lol).
As for the Hyrule seen in the _Era of the Wild_ been the SAME Hyrule from BEFORE The Minish Cap... that's a laughable "theory" since the Hyrule Zelda sees in the past looks _exactly_ like Breath of the Wild and Tears of the Kingdom's Hyrule which (as you very well know) looks NOTHING like the Hyrule from The Minish Cap.
Rauru's Hyrule is a *NEW* kingdom completley independent from the ones in the _Era of Myth._
@javiervasquez625 Wisdom of Time is how Zelda's role in TOTK and OOT is known in the Spanish translation i just translated2it literal, just like Rauru from OOT is the Sage of Light i supose its called like that, sage of time?. That's the role I'm referring to; I don't know how it's called in the English translation since I haven't played it. As for your point about how Hyrule is depicted, it's something to laugh about as it doesn't make any sense. The Hyrule in Twilight Princess is the same as Ocarina of Time, the same submerged Hyrule as Wind Waker, and the same as Minish Cap, but they don't look similar at all. However, they are considered the same, the difference is caused by artistic choices in the game to avoid repetitive maps and styles. Your argument seems quite ridiculous, they are not going to use the SAME EXACT MAP FOR 5 GAMES LOL, it's obv that it will be different in each game with their owns style and map, but is the same Hyrule, so no, TOTK being before minish cap is still a solid thoery
@@j.p6815 Okay then i understand the use of such words as per the more peculiar spanish translation of the original game to emphasize the characters's roles in the story and what their main purpose is. Personally i'm not a fan of that decision on the part of spanish and latinoamerican dubbing studios for they come up with some the most random names imaginable which barely make any sense with what the original names for the characters are (looking at you "Heraldo de la Muerte"/Death Bringer). Needless to say i'm baffled that you thought it wise to use the spanish name for the character while still writing an _english_ comment seeing as anyone with an iota of common sense could realize that names sound _different_ in other languages and so it would be best to *learn* the _accurate_ name for the character in the english language to use it during a conversation.
_"As for your point about how Hyrule is depicted, it's something to laugh about as it doesn't make any sense"_
Lol what? Dude you do know that MANY LANDMARKS across the many Hyrules in the timeline DO NOT *EXIST* beyond the one game in which they appear right? The Lanayru Sand Sea in Skyward Sword, the Minish Woods and Mount Crenel in The Minish Cap, the Desert of Mystery in A Link to the Past (which is NOT the Gerudo Desert as confirmed in the Hyrule Historia), Snowpeak Mountain in Twilight Princess, the Desert of Doubt in Four Swords Adventures, the Forest, Fire, Snow, Ocean and Sand Realms in Spirit Tracks (which we KNOW all lie in the _Land of the Lokomos_ FAR AWAY from Old Hyrule) and Lurellin Village in Breath of the Wild and Tears of the Kingdom they all are *unique* landamarks which do NOT EXIST in any other game aside from the one they appear in making it impossible for the kingdom founded by Rauru and Sonia to be THE same Hyrule across the entire timeline without contradict the _geography_ of every map in the entire series.
¿Do you seriously, honestly believe the kingdom has remained static in the exact same location in EVERY GAME IN THE SERIES? There's already *evidence* _prooving_ otherwise making your little "thoery" a ridiculous and totally misinformed assumption at best:
ruclips.net/video/P9shOnebEaQ/видео.html
Conclusion: Don't go around spreading false information online for i ASSURE you you're blatantly LYING to people and prooving how little you understand the Lore to be crafting such backwards "thoeries".
That would make sense if there wasn't any Rito or Zonai. The Rito is one of the most confusing races in all of Zelda's history. Why are they in the backstory for TotK and absent everywhere else except for Wind Waker? And even in Wind Waker, Zoras supposedly "evolve" into Ritos. Like, how does a fish evolve into a bird? By all accounts, the Zoras should have been alive in WW. You can make the argument that the Great Sea is salt water and the Zoras live in fresh water, but the Zoras evolving into a salt water species makes more sense than a bird. So, that's one plot hole. Another plot hole, especially with this theory, is that this all happens after Skyward Sword. It was stated in the game that the Zonai came from the sky, but there were no Zonai in Skyward Sword. Even after TotK, we don't know anything about the Zonai. Nintendo needs to explain more about the Zonai and Rito and their origins for any of this to make sense.
I agree, there are still so many questions to be answered, and weird stuff that doesn't make sense that we kind of just have to accept, like the Zora Turning into Rito thing, and especially there being no Zonai in Skyward Sword. I guess the Skyloftians are more ancient than the Zonai as a species? Potentially some might have stayed behind in the sky and evolved into the Zonai? Ridiculous, but I gotta speculate.
Perhaps during SS the Zonai were underground, in the depths!
to be fear, mammals were fishes at first, and evolved from it
"Evolve" is a word much older than Darwin, so let's not pretend there were no finches and seaslugs before Darwin was there to invent them. "Evolve" just means development, and tha's explicitly said: gods TRANSFORMED Zora into Rito, and that's IN Wind Waker, not an iron clad rule. Evolution doesn't even work, they have long lifespans and would evolve SLOWER than everyone else.
I say Zora are a reflection of Hyrulean retainers, and they were ORIGINALLY Rito, and hence evolved perhaps through Loftwing or Parella into Zora. Maybe even BECAUSE this greatly extended their lifespans. OR, it's cultural heritage and they're not DIRECTLY descended. This would justify the gods changing their form once more.
I also believe Zora and Rito comparison mirrors dragonification, especially now when THAT is established to exist, in the sense that if Zora stray too far and become one with nature, they shed their scales for wings and take a step towards the cautionary tale of Icarus. Rito are, always in some sense doomed creatures. Also the ATTAINED scale and feather are recurring motifs in Zeda series, even MANDATROY for Zora to keep their (magical?) form and swimming ablity, even breeding ability. In any case, coming of age is tied to this ritualistic exchange.
The talking fish were forced to keep sunk Hyrule a secret, pretty sure Valoo turning the zora into birds was just to force them out of the ocean
If the flashback scenes take place after skyward sword than why are the Rito there?
In TP HD Rito are depicted on the walls in castle town. Suggesting they have been around for a long time actually. This probably wasn’t something they considered until the development of Breath of the Wild though.
I really wish that Ganondorf was a good guy . Nobody should have to go through any curse not even him😢
How did the Rito even exist at that point of time, weren’t they only created in wind waker and if this takes place in between skyward sword and ocarina of time then how do the Rito even exist since wind waker happened after???
Ganondorf: I don't like sand. It's coarse and rough and irritating and it gets everywhere. Not like here. Here everything is soft and smooth.
4:15
I was also a bit confused by that turn of events
Y did a character created with such courage in his convictions sacrifice the id for the ego🤔
Demise’s curse just isnt enuf explanation
For thousands of years Gannondorf held this conviction just to make it a hypocricy by becoming a dragon🤔
I dont buy it
7:11
So does that mean in BOTW there is a Baby Gannondorf🤔
Wasnt link asleep for 100 years😂😂😂
I never looked at him through that perspective but it makes sense
I think both BOTW and TOTK is on it’s own timeline than the originals.
@@a.jthomas6132 Highly unlikely due to the many references to past games which make it clear they all happened a long time ago in the long forgotten past (the _Era of Myth_ as stated in the book Creating a Champion). This new Ganondorf is a *reincarnation* just like the one born in Four Swords Adventures.
My theory on the Curse of Demise is that the curse only falls on one that has truly earned it. One must already be hateful, arrogant, and powerful. Then the subject must either steal a sacred object and/or attempt to murder a holy person or deity of the light.
Up until the curse falls, I think Ganondorf has full agency. But after the curse, he's no longer in charge of his destiny. He's just along for the ride.
If that's the case then why is it the Gerudo are ALWAYS the ones who birth this Anti-Christ entities when any such "worthy" being from another race could just as well earn the "gift" of becoming the Demon King? ¿What makes the Gerudo so _special_ that the Curse is always choosing Gerudo males to continue the cycle? ¿Did the Gerudo have blood ties to the Demon Tribe or something? ¿Did Twinrova make a satanic "pact" with the Demon Tribe to forever burden Gerudo women with birthing worthy "candidates" to bear the power of the Demon King?
Aonuma has a lot of explaining to do with Ganondorf i tell you.
That's not how the curse works unfortunately, at least if we take the original Japanese into account. The original Japanese stated that the Demon Tribe would reincarnate, essentially meaning monsters and evil will never truly go away. But either way, the curse is not an actual entity, that's just not really how curses work in general.
@@pokemonmaster1505 Based on what's stated in Breath of the Wild and Tears of the Kingdom it appears there's no real "Demon Tribe" which exists as a _race_ of it's own but rather normal people (Human, Sheikah, Gerudo, etc.) who, when consumed by Evil thoughts and _Malice_ towards those around them, *transform* into demonic beings able to harm people and seek Power for their own personal gain. This explains why Ganondorf is called the "Demon King" being a mortal man filled with hatred and desire (Malice) to the point of ressembling Demise after he stole Sonia's secret stone for his own use.
@@javiervasquez625 thanks for the clarification. This doesn't prove that the curse is a malevolent entity or anything. At most, it's an incomprehensible force on the level of how gravity works, which I would honestly say describes curses pretty well. Is it mentioned anywhere that the people lose agency control over their actions?
@@pokemonmaster1505 Yeah it appears that in Japan at least "Evil" is a half abstract-half magical concept which perpetually affects ALL LIFE in the Zelda universe whenever a person develops selfish desires and thoughts eventually turning into the "Malice" seen in the Wild duology capable of harming and corrupting everything it touches. While i can't recall reading anything that would suggest the loss of agency in Tears of the Kingdom i do remember reading something regarding the new Ganondorf shown in the Era of the Wild implying he has always been an "ambitious" man since his youth who harbored hatred and greed for decades _before_ using Sonia's secret stone to become more powerful leading credence to the impression that Ganondorf only became the Demon King after _increasing_ his Malice for many years to the point of allowing him to transform into a powerful demon on par with Demise himself.
If this scenario is true it's possible that the character known as "Demise" may himself have been just a *man* who became a Demon King after growing in Malice just like Ganondorf himself would many millenia in the future.
The "curse" is not demonic but rather _human..._ as long as there's Evil in the human world there will always be a man willing to harness that Evil and transform into the Demon King.
I rushed to get one of the 300 free SD cards. When I was about to checkout, I realized I don't need it. I don't know how much I paid for it, but I already have a decent one in my switch since 2017, so I would gladly pass the offer to someone who needs it. Please everyone, be kind. And Andres, thank you. Love from Italy.
Sonia has big ears that stick out much like the hylains from OoT o:
Definitely check all languages
3:06 watch him rip out his forehead jewelry and eat it. Is it just me, he has had that thing stuck to his forehead in every single game. I’ve always thought it was a weird, but consistent detail. And here he is eating it, so has he had a secret stone the entire series and just figured out what to do with it??
They're probably just decorative gemstones the Gerudo like to wear as per their theif-like culture. That Ganondorf decided to wear a Secret Stone as his own personal "forehead jewel" is incidental to his Gerudo background.
I think Gannondorf was just evil because he’s the embodiment of hate. That was what worked so well about him, he’s just evil, a force of hate.
So i think twinrova might have used magic to create the ocarina of time gannondorf, thats why there could be 2 incarnations of demise at once, also the gerudo said their last king was the calamity so either this is completely new timeline or they are both the same ganondorf
This new Ganondorf is a _reincarnation_ born after the "Era of Myth" as stated in the book Creating a Champion. You can't have 2 Ganondorfs alive and dandy at the same time as that doesn't make any sense with how Demise casted his curse in Skyward Sword.
when did gerudo siad that? ( I didnt see that in any game, thats why asking )
No! Let’s not pretend that Ganon was some sympathetic villain who only did what he did because he wanted to help his people. That’s crap.
WW Ganon is the same man from OoT. After Ganon took over Hyrule in OoT, what did he do for the Gerudo? Not a single thing!! Not in seven years! Did he move them to Hyrule? You know the land he coveted so much…No. Did he make their life in the desert easier? No. He only cared about himself and his own power. He didn’t give a damn about his people; and I want to puke every time someone tries to push that narrative.
Ganandorf in totk felt like a big guy who is bad to be bad.
Eg: A one dimensional badguy?
Ko-tah-kae
Ko-oo-mae
You took the worst timeline theory, Hyrule was refounded after all the other games. Ocarina Ganondorf was stated to be the first in Zelda Encyclopedia. Hyrule Castle also wasn't damaged from Raru's founding until Breath of the Wild causing Tears of the Kingdom Ganondorf to reawaken, contradicts Ocarina of Time's destruction of the castle and Twilight Princess' damage of the castle.
Agreed it's clear that this new Ganondorf is a reincarnation just like the one from Four Swords Adventures before him. Whoever insists in believing Rauru's Hyrule is THE _first_ kingdom from before The Minish Cap seriously needs to read the supplementary material like Hyrule Historia and Creating a Champion.
TOTK do not take place in the official timeline, it retcons it. Meaning except for skyward sword, only BOTW and totk happens as games in it. Not OOT. It’s impossible since Ganondorf is sealed away for +10 000 years.
And two Ganondorf can not coexist at the same time, and some events. « The imprisoned war » existed before in the timeline. It clearly shows that TOTK is a reboot of the timeline just after the events of SS.
The 2 games in the Era of the Wild are a _soft reboot_ of the timeline taking place thousands of years *after* the "Era of Myth" mentioned in the book _Creating a Champion_ which is why both games have references to all the games in all 3 timelines. When TotK Zelda goes to the times of the "first king and queen of Hyrule" she's not going to the literal _first_ king but rather the first king of a *new* kingdom of Hyrule founded AFTER the ones from Era of Myth vanished from History. The Ganondorf in this game is a _reincarnation_ of the one from Ocarina of Time just like the one from Four Swords Adventures which is why he has no memories of the events of past games given his lack of ability to remember his past lives.
New Era = New Hyrule = New Ganondorf
@@javiervasquez625 I didn’t know about that, good thing you told me about it. But I think it clearly is impossible for 3 timelines to be unified again even in Zelda, but at least it might explain also the ancient hero. You’re the first one giving me an interesting answer lmao
@@Tjrmalveillant The unification of the timelines can be explained via the "Dragon Break" scenario which simply states that after MANY years passed by at the end of all 3 timelines the passage of time lead to each timeline's Hyrule to slowly loose it's past history to the point of it becoming "lost to time" and kickstarting a new kingdom with the _same_ origin and backstory in all the timelines. Thus the simple passage of time allowed a "unification" by having the Era of the Wild happen simultaneously at the end of the 3 timelines.
If you wonder what "logic" could allow the Dragon Break to be possible the answer is simple: _divine intervention._ Basically put the Golden Goddesses (Din, Nayru and Farore) *willed* the timelines together into one as part of a divine "plan" which would set off the events of Breath of the Wild and Tears of the Kingdom.
They need to make a zelda game where Ganondorf finally wins
it's called A Link to the Past
@@nadavhb I'm talking about a game where you actually see Ganondorf defeat Link .
So you either want to play as the bad guy, or play an unbeatable game.
@@MelissaBrownell-pz3fe Pretty much. I'd love to see a game where you play as Ganondorf or play as Link only to be defeated by Ganondorf in the end.
It would be cool concept for the third Botw game, sience they invated time travel in TotK. Like you could travel between maps like in ocarina, where in the future you can see world ruled by Gannondorf and had to beat him in time where he somehow defeated link from his timeline.
Why does he even like darkness tho? Does he just like the colour?
*laughs in tidus
Real question though, why can this man *seriously* just not... overthrow the current ruling party? Like... He always has to be so extra about it, just shank the king, kill the guards to weaken the kingdoms strength, marry the princess, or kill her, and... take over. G's biggest flaw is he wants to show off every time, he has to flaunt his goods like a peacock, like just kill the reigning family and overthrow their rule, it really could be that easy 😅
I mean he sort of tried that here... except he didn't. Instead of just killing Rauru, he decided to kill Sonia, which... I mean I understand why, logically that would make sense, because Sonia makes Rauru stronger, but G didn't kill Sonia for that reason, he killed her to steal her stone, but he also killed her just to rub it in Rauru's face that hey, you're an idiot. She died because of you. So... I mean also, he could have come back at any time while Rauru was struggling with his grieving, like he didn't even *want* help, he was going to face Ganondorf alone until his sister pointed out that he was, once again, being stupid. He had support, he didn't need to do that alone, but G could have taken advantage of that time frame... he didn't, and he didn't simply because... he wanted a challenge.
G wanted to show off his shiny new power, he wanted to once again rub it in Rauru's face that he was stronger than them, that even if Rauru had like seven people helping him, he would not be strong enough, and, while that absolutely was true... he just made it so unnecessarily hard for himself. Like the way royal families usually work is you have yhe king and queen, if you kill them, you're good, unless there are siblings who could become a contender, which, he had, but Mineru didn't seem interested like, at all... He could have killed her jist to assure she wouldn't though. Then there are children, who could become contenders, which Sonia amd Rauru obviously had, but, that child would need to show up in order to try to claim the throne, he could have just murked the child to, then there would be nobody left of the original royal bloodline to claim his throne, there would also be nobody else who'd be strong enough to take it away from him, either.
Why's he always gotta be so extra? 😅
I ask the same question with soooo many movie. It's just not in the script. Lol
I think you're great man!
It’s not this deep. He’s simply evil. Absolute power absolutely corrupts.
Ganondorf is not the demon king of darkness but of light IN darkness. His red aura is LIGHT. To be a true king, he wants his light to illuminate, and that's why the world must be plunged into darkness. People are wrong pinpointing Ganondof's evil to selfishness, that's just a knejerk post-hoc reasoning to pretty much equate evil in general with selfishness. That's the most basic catering to your own biases, in our society. Selfish or selfless, that doesn't really come into this. What Ganondorf wants, is lack of comfortable stagnation, at any cost. A fire that ALWAYS burns the world like fuel.
I believe the Sheikah, a shadow clan, are ancient traitors of the Gerudo as they need a world of LIGHT to cast shadows onto. My whole theory is that first there were Gerudo, of whom the Zonai split off of by inventing the Secret Stone as a weapon, and banished the Gerudo. But this caused them to turn slowly into dragons, last of whom are Mineru and Rauru for being the LEAST warlike among their kind, and most regretful. Third split is Sonia's tribe, the origin of fairies, and she helped them heal with flowers. For Rauru, the Sundelion, and for Mineru the Silent Princess, which she adapted into myth to create the origins which Sheikah would later discover. This would be the origin story of blue color as the symbol of Hyrulean royalty. Without them, they would have become like Lynels, and this indeed happened to Ancient Hero's Aspect.
I like to think Ganondorf is a simple personification of the concept of "Chaos" parallel to Zelda's role as the personification of "Order" and Link's role as the personification of _balance_ between Chaos and Order which makes a lot of sense with how all 3 behave across their respective appereance across the series with Ganondorf always unleashing (and craving) some form of entropy within the world as shown with his constant changings of the weather, destruction of major settlements and constant threathening with death and suffering to those who stand against him compared to Zelda's serene desire to promote peace and prosperity to the people of Hyrule through wisdom and egalitarian compassion towards every denizen in the realm. Meanwhile Link is the only of the 3 who's never show any interested in either _ruling_ or affecting the world in any direct way like his 2 counterparts do opting instead to live a carefree life that *adapts* to the ever shifting Chaos and Order which surrounds him by constantly standing against wathever force is disrupting the balance he upholds within Nature as shown throughout every game in the series. In simple terms:
Ganondorf = Chaos = "Darkness"
Zelda = Order = "Light"
Link = Balance between the 2
It makes ever morse sense for Link to stand for balance when you realize his Triforce piece (Courage) stands for the goddess Farore and the *Life* she poured into the world so that it would thrive and survive in the world created by Din and Nayru. Hopefully you can find some interesting information worth considering here for i feel this interpretation of the Lore is overwhelmingly accurate after the subtle hints that the series has been revealing over the course of it's history from the release of Ocarina of Time to the release of Tears of the Kingdom for this to just be random ramble from a fan.
(ko- u- m- eh)
I don’t think Ganondorf is misunderstood at all. It’s completely normal for an autocrat to plead heroism and/or victim hood when cornered. They turn to deceit in desperate moments, because deceit is all they know.
It’s pretty rich to hear people sympathetic with someone as categorically evil as Ganondorf when he talks about “my people”. Give me a break lol.
This is part of the mechanism for how autocrats succeed in real life. The autocrat can show you directly how cruel they are and how much they lack empathy of any kind, but people who don’t want to believe the truth will keep making excuses for them, even when the excuse is obviously a blatant lie.
Nintendo made a mess of the story, and the only explanation that makes sense is the Ganondorf in TotK is AFTER all the other Zelda games (except BotW), not born before Ocarina Of Time. It would make more sense that this is a new Kotake and Koume, rather than the same ones in Ocarina of Time.
talk about timing... I beat the game last night on the first run through
The English dub removes his motives simple. Hes actually just a boomer who thinks people now are weak and he will give people back his theyre fighting spirit
I imagine Rauru and Sonia existed long after Ocarina. Like New Hyrule, the country could've risen and fallen so many times that the new part has become redundant.
As for Ganondorf, it might've been my own trauma talking, but I saw he as an ableist monster. "Peace loving cowards" could refer people that enjoy peace and safety. He must think that the world should be one where no one is safe, where the weak can't be happy. So yeah, ableist monster.
Also, let's not forget that if what Wind Waker Ganondorf said was true and not just an attempt at rationalizing his actions, that means Ocarina Ganondorf was a hypocrite. He said he wanted the winds of prosperity, but instead of bringing about positive change he killed those winds, dragged everyone into the cyclone of suffering, and left his own people as little more than mind-controlled slaves!
Idk bout ya'll Twinrova can get it.