Gosh, I just realized that the Goddess of Flowers is the key player here. She knew that Deshret will fail inevitably but chose to help him because she had seen the future. She knew that the series of events will lead to victory even if sacrifices will be made. Even though she was banished from Celestia she retained her form and powers. She even created the Jinn from what's left of her powers. How much more if she was once a divine envoy of Celestia?
Ikr! Thanks for putting that words out of my head, I don't know how to describe it well like you did. The mystery slowly crumbles as we getting answers is just satisfy my Genshin lore thirst. Man I love Genshin lmpact for this reason.
I wonder if she was also the God of time, since they seem to be connected to a lot of nations so far and she seemed to know the future or be able to manipulate it like we saw them do in Raiden's story quest
10:18 Yes it would sound normal because after Scaramouche removed himself from Irminsul, the traveler wakes up and asks "Do you know Balladeer" to which Paimon responded "Balladeer? Is that some kind of food?"
As for changing forms, I do believe that it might be different for Nahida and others because those aren't their innate forms, like the animal/human forms for the Adepti or Yae Miko. It's a stretch, though...
I was about to mention this. I do think this is the case as well. Fungi isn't part of Nahida actual form, she learned about it basically by "fast forward" through time. This is the thing that drains her power.
i agree. Miko and the Adeptus are born in their specific animal form, and it's a part of their nature. And since they're considered mystical beings, they can shapeshift into a human-like appearance in order to adapt to human society and can transform back into their original form.
@@yumine_ i also think nahida was exhausted not because of tampering with time, but because she is already in her weakest form, the smallest version of the greater lord. if she transforms into any creature that is highly connected to the specific element she wields, she's mostlikely using a big portion of her energy because she stated that if she will make another fireseed, she might became as small as a blade of grass or a twig, her original form. and then she asked paimon that they plant her so she can comeback but it will be a long time process.
I'm thinking maybe Yae Miko and the Adepti are doing that for hundreds or thousands of years that they've already mastered changing forms. While Nahida is just a newbie in doing it.
Its a small detail but if you remember the first time that elemental fungi talks about her child she said that she named her after a traveler from far land but because it has happened so long in the past she cant remember her child's name. But in the fight scene with apep we hear that she named her child Nur(نور), which in persian means the same as Lumine. The question here is that shouldn't her child’s name change depending on which of the siblings is your main character?!
While the connection with Lumine is an interesting prospect, the elemental form only says "an adventurer" in the english dialogue. However I can't claim this for the Chinese or Japanese versions.
20:52 to 20:57 - Taking account that Forbidden Knowledge either drives you mad or Elezear. Deshret was aware that Apep's plan to defeat Celestia with the power of the Apocalypse would only end in shambles and create more troubles than it's worth. And what a better way to kill two birds with one stone, by allowing himself to be eaten - to escape Celestia's gaze, protect his people and getting rid of Apep through the process.
Taking into account Genshin's parent story Honkai, the Abyssal power is akin to Quantum, while the Light realm/elemental power is akin to Imaginary, it's kind of right to some aspects as both sides counters one another.
Apep does not believe in humans, that is why he believed that Deshret would fall quickly in his ambitions but it was totally the opposite. He exceeded his craziest expectations in every way but in the end Liloupar in his revenge brought down the kingdom of Deshret where he made the mistake of use the wedge that was there freed the abyss. All those abyssal energy had to be swallowed by Apep due to the deal he made, and Deshret was not absorbed because he became the seal since Deshret always had that his kingdom would be eternal and therefore he would never fulfill the deal with Apep, who would win. to the death. Coincidentally, he also wanted to do something similar but she could understand that it was useless and she didn't go any further like Deshret.
About "Changing forms" : I think it was more like it's hard to change into different species other than human? Venti is originally a Wind wisp so I assume he can change into his previous form and take form of any human( he took form of his friend and depend on how you interpret his story quest you can tell he took form of real Stanley too) Zhongli originally is a dragon and wasn't it said somewhere that he took form of different humans with different ages in the past? If you think about it many Youkais (not all) can take form of human, even if they real form is some kind of beast, but I never heard of a Youkai that can take form of different youkai. Yae Miko is Kitsune so of course it's not hard to take human form that represents her but I don't think she's capable to take form of any creature, maybe she can only take form of other humans but I'm not sure about this too. I don't know Chinese beasts and divine beings but I assume Adepti are a bit similar to Youkais, they can take form of human that would represent them and go back to their original form but they can't change into another species. Well what I want to say is it seems changing to look like human don't seem to be a problem to Archons/some yokais/adepti but I think Archons can change into another species(Nahida changing into fungus) but this would take too much power to do and characters like Yae Miko and Adepti wouldn't be able to change into anything else than their beast forms and human forms! I hope it's understandable... my English is not that good, sorry for that >.
as far as I recall Zhongli debunked that story about him of changing forms as fictive(many stories of him prove to be exaggerations). we only see him in one human form he still appears in today.
@@dragon_nova_luna Well, we also see Zhongli's "exuvia" - the form he used during Rite of Descension. Which looks like of like a Chinese dragon. So he clearly changed at least between those two forms. But overall, I am under the impression that many deeds of the Adepti and his other friends and allies, like Marchosias, ended up being attributed to Zhongli. So it's very much possible that the woman in that story was not Zhongli himself, but somebody else, perhaps Madame Ping or Guizhong.
Zhongli actually has an ability similar to Nahida's where he can watch his entire region. We find this out during his discussion with Venti at Hu Tao's dinner. (While Zhongli claims not to have known Venti had arrived when Venti gripes about the lack of welcome, Zhongli's awareness of the wind guiding a man is why he sent the Traveler to the area the man was at.) Likewise, Venti seems to be able to use winds to watch over areas. Ei, who claims to be fully aware of everything that goes on is the only one without such an ability it seems. :S
I want to believe zhongli could see anything that touches the earth like toph seismic sense from Avatar but as wide as liyue, and venti too with wind current but his sense are mobile, it in radius wherever he stand like echolocation, it goes smoothly with anemo gnosis being a freemoving queen I have three theories regarding raiden ei, 1. she can see everything under stormy clouds of inazuma, but since she hide inside raiden shogun, raiden shogun is the one who can see and rely information to her, she puts thunder barricade around inazuma so she can sense a trespassers enter or leave inazuma 2.only raiden makoto have those senses since shes the original seven 3.raiden makoto and ei were twin god, they both needs to connect their focus, makoto can see people when lightning flashes and ei can see people under dark clouds, ei means shadow, but makoto died so she lost this power
Well, earth, wind and plants are everywhere in the world but not lightning. In fact, Ei, or the shogun can still unconsciously create thunderstorms that covers all the sea areas of inazuma, which means they have similar degree of authority over their region and elements even without gnosis, just differ in the nature of their elements.
my guess its because inazumas thunder storm is left in stasis by the puppet shougun. if Ei was in control they'd probably be able to watch inazuma through via electrical signals by manipulating said storm
My jaw dropped when you mentioned that there is smthing sealed under inazuma. That is creepy and cool. I really wish the anime covers anything from the past events of teyvat but I feel like that might not happen
It's probably a reference to the Abyss though. The Sakura tree's purpose is combating the Abyss not some dead dragon. Besides we already know the Electro dragon was Kapatcir.
It could be a Dragon Sovereign- in the Enkanomiya book, there is a reference to Ourubos, another Snake (?) God. Near Sangonomiya Shrine, there is a Sumeru Scholar who is investigating the beliefs of Watatsumi Island and has concluded there were two gods.
@@danielm5535 Ouroboros isn't a creature but an aspect of the Primordial One. Recall that Enka used to be part of the unified Ancient Civilization that existed before 2nd Throne arrived. As such they all worshiped the Primordial One and nothing else, because there wasn't anything else. Specifically the Orouboros represents the cyclic eternity imposed by the Primordial One on Teyvat which the prophet-engineer Aberaku led a heresy against after Enka fell into the Dark Sea. Aberaku preached that the unending eternity of the past under the PO had now given way to a progressive era of time and "history" and worshiped Istaroth, the god of moments (or time). Thus "Before Sun and Moon" is religious tract that records the religious friction between the disillusioned ex-followers of PO and the aristocracy descended from the ancient priest-kings who still tried to milk the whole Primordial One for all they could get out of it even after Enka was abandoned by the PO, by creating the Sunchildren, arresting and later executing Aberaku and later still Spartacus. Anyway - point is - Orouboros not a god. It says so explicitly in the Enka text.
Even if he isn't the Second who came, the dragon king is a strong candidate for the true identity of the sinner on his own merits. He's not a god, has access to great abyssal power, is an enemy of Celestia, and based on his name, likely has ties to Khanri'ah.
It could be that those who can shapeshift between human/non-human forms learned how to do so through their process of “growth.” It’s obviously possible to do it instantly, even for Nahida (though it taxes her), so maybe it’s that learning how to change like that safely and naturally is what takes time and growth.
11:31 When Nahida deleted Rukkhadevata, everyones memories were altered to replace Rukkha with Nahida. Even she believes she purged the forbidden knowledge with Deshret long ago, way before she was even born. Everyone just thinks the lord of the forest was always Nahida.
When Nahida hears the complaints about Wanderer's mannerism in the Akademiya, she would have to tell this Inazuman man that he is 'Ina-lot-of-trouble.'
2 things would be missing that I noticed. The first would be that Apep seems to have been blinded by the forbidden knowledge, which caused him this hatred towards Celestia and confused the reason for obtaining the knowledge that was part of the nature of the dendro element. The second is that the entire dragons vs. Celestia event is not registered and no one on the surface remembers it, it is as if it did not exist, those words being that the winners write history but this does not put Celestia as the good and the dragons Like the bad guys, it rather seems as if Celestia blames herself for everything that happened and erases the guilt of the dragons so that it is not judged by others when this almost destroys Teyvat.
It is certainly not an accident that almost no one remembers the world before Second Who Came. In Enkanomiya chronicles, it was said that some kind of "prohibition" was put to prevent people who knew the previous world from coming back to the surface. And the Archon War that started shortly afterwards has killed a lot of witnesses among the more long-lived people.
Have the people who keep trying to use the abyss to destroy Celestia not learn from the failure of those who came before. All they got to show for it is going insane and corrupted. Seriously I hope someone make fun and humilated them if they lose AGAIN. Celestia god: Have I ever told you about the definition of insanity ?
So there's a chance that we might see a new area in Inazuma and that would be the Electro Dragon who might still be alive, just like what happened to Azdaha who was sealed away by Morax and the Adepti
Phew, what a journey this one. King Deshret & Goddess of Flowers' lore went hard, we don't even get to see their faces. At this point I'm very curious, I'll take even a slight sillhoutte
Aw, I love this video, breaking down one of the most lore-filled story quest! My brain can't take it all lmaooo. I agreed with most of the points, however I have some different opinions, regarding: 1) Nahida's shapeshifting abilities; it is indeed hard and exhausting for her bc it wasn't part of her original form at all, and to achieve that shroom state, she kinda skipped times that was supposed to be the evolution and growth. I believe this is different from Inazuma's Youkai and Liyue's Adepti, both are mystical beings, which already had those forms from the very beginning, and they also accumulated experiences and growth needed to do it easily by their own will. It's understandable that Nahida is way too exhausted bc she kind of crammed it all in few seconds/minutes, moreover, she is a newbie at shapeshifting. 2) More than Two Dendro Archon; I believe the Geoshroom referred to Normal/Big Rukka AND smaller Rukkha (after saving King Deshret's civilization). It was still Rukkha all along, she shrunk and lose big portion of her power but it's still her. She probably only lose 75% part of her (kind of), but it is STILL her. Eventhough it may happen several times already, one of them which Geoshroom witnessed. Meanwhile, in the ultimate moment of creating Nahida, 500 years ago, she made a whole brand new one, out of a different branch, then delete herself 100%. Which is why, I still believe that there are only Two Dendro Archon. As to why Rukkha warned Geoshroom that she might not remember it in the future, probably it is already her 'habit' to shrink and lose some powers. I believe this is also tampering with her memory, eventho it's not erasing 100% of it. But she already knew that at some point, she might pass her duties into a new one (she probably already thinking of creating Nahida). These are just my two cents, I'm trying hard to grasp these lore, lol. Cmiiw and feel free to have some discussions! Thank you, Cat, for the amazing video 🐱
Nibelung isn't affected by forbidden knowledge and can utilised it. If Nibulong is one of those long-bodied dragon, could we say that Nibulong is a 'bookworm'?
There's no reason to think the Dragon King wasn't negatively effected by Forbidden Knowledge of course. Most likely it had nearly as hard a time as Apep and all the other dragons.
so it means that Rukkhadevata was already small during Archon War since the events during King Deshret's fall was before the Archon War. Rukkhadevata was small for about 1500+ years which means she reigned as an archon but not in her adult form. This explains the statue being in small form and why she's also small when Nahida met her at Irminsul
If we learned something from the event with the Wanderer, it is that when something is deleted from Irminsul, only the "information" is deleted but the things that have already happened cannot be changed, the world will change so that the "information" is deleted but the World events will be the same, they will simply have another "explanation" (Like instead of Wanderer having killed all those people, an avenging descendant appears who kills everyone and dies leaving no offspring) So it seems natural to me that "forbidden knowledge" still causes problems but in another way.
Irminsul changes the past. The game text is very clear about this. Rukkhadevata, Nahida, Traveler, Paimon, Wanderer and Nicole all state this is so. And they do so explicitly except for Rukkhadevata who is a bit vague and open to interpretation.
@@DavidJohnson-ib1dh Remember the vase that Paimon accidentally broke while worrying about Scaramouche? The vase continued to be broken despite the fact that Scaramouche no longer existed and had become a Wanderer, and Paimon no longer remembered him. This was to show us that while you can change "lore" you can't change "events".
Shapeshifting itself isnt the problem if its a shift that involves something innate. It seems to be changing shape into something that isnt innately part of ones self that requires a lot of power. And id actually say that the humanoid forms are likely the forms that required power to acquire and same for youkai given they both work on logic of chinese and japanese mythology about cultivation and stuff?
So they can change into humans once they have lived thro enough "human experiences" and human emotions, and the reason why changing into another species is so difficult is bc different races have different understandings, agendas and ideologies. Humans, however, are free from world-changing duties and have no "centered goal", meaning anyone can become a human if they "forget" their purpose and indulge in mortal pleasures and sufferings for long enough.
I have theory that "Thousand Winds" is the title of Anemo Dragon. Since Venti (the elemental wisp) was part of the Thousand Winds, like the elemental beings born from Apep
We must always remember this about Nahida, she's purpose holding back her energy. Remember what she told Traveler to do in her Voice lines. She told them not to put the jar of Candied Ajilenakh Nuts where she could easily reach them.
You're probably thinking on thos too hard. It's just that Nahida has a very sweet tooth (just as much as Ei), so you shouldn't let her grab onto candies, as she'll munch on it. Then again, she can fly, so no matter how high you put the jar she'll always reach it 😂
Hi @CatWithBlueHat, I love your video it help me catch up with the Lore time to time. U are doing a great job. I agree with most of the video but you are going all over the place to some part of it tho!!? Nahidas part of changing form but going throu time, so she basically use her power of futur her to change her current form. While for Hakushin Yae (Kitsune), Gorou (Inugami) and Kirara (Nekomata) it is just metamorphosis . They use their Youkai mystical power to modify their current form thats why we can see part of their true nature still showing. In Japanese mythology it is daid that a Youkai cannot totally change to human and something will always betray them and show their true nature (ears, tails, pow, horns, wings). This is ALSO differentes for mixed life forms such as Sucrose (canonically Mondstadt Kitsune), Tighnari (Tighnarian), Diona (Katzlein). That is again different to Morax way of changing form who is again also différentes to Adepti way of changing form. There is a multitude of way to change form, Nahida in her is just choosing the most difficult but efficient way of doing so idk where the insinuation of Yae strengh comes from. As for Rhukadevatta shrinking 3.0 to 3.2 we already knew that she shring 2 times in history. One time earlier and another one for saving the desert and the new 3.6 area confirmed us that this first time she shring was by creating the tree god to anchor the god of sweet dew to the mortal world to fight the corruption of the abyss. Again her shrinking 2 times before Nahida is a known fact. And for the relationship between Amun Al-Ahmar and Apep, we also know this from the start of Sumeru, they were friends along with Hermanubis the sages of all sages, Ibis the Grand scribe and the goat and crocodile kings. They were his vassals but she left them and secluded itself, build Court with her children deep in the desert cavern. Yes he also knew what would happen to Apep when she would ate him, it was his part of his plan. Anyway thats the only point i wanted to talk about, overall great video, again, thank you for all your work.
Possibly a coincidence, but I wanna point out how similar these quotes sound: "In war, the victor would inherit the right to shape the world, while the losers must turn to ash..." -Apep "The rules of war are woven in the womb: the victors shall burn bright, while the losers must turn to ash." -Dainsleif, Chapter Storyline Preview We know VERY little about Natlan, but I wonder if this phrase is something that goes way back, beyond the God of War's beliefs.
there wasn´t three dendro archons, "Rukkhadevata" could shrink to use too much of his power, but still being "rukkhadevata" in the case of "Nahida" the Dendro Archon didn´t just "shrink", she "clone herself" as a new being, but everyone has forgotten the existence of rukkhadevata and with it the fact that Nahida is actually "Rukhadevatha´s daughter by mitosis"
I agree! It's like the previous shrink of Rukkhadevata definitely changed her size and her power also shrunk to smaller portion, but we can say like she only shrunk 75% (kind of). She got smaller but it's still her, during those several times. The one Grounded Mushroom referred to were basically normal Rukkha and then smaller Rukkha. However, with the 'creation' of Nahida, 500 years ago, she really made her as a new one, from a different Irminsul branch, then delete herself, which means she is 100% gone (from existence). It's two different things, so I still believe there were only two Dendro Archon.
The goddess of flowers artifacts has a lore about the skyfrost nail incident from the desert tho, which hinted that Nabu Malikata and Al Ahmar planned a rebellion against the divine but it will take a sacrifice from a god in able to trigger what may happen in the future. In my understanding, what Deshret did with Goddess of flowers was entirely a part of their plan for humans to fight against the divine in the future. Meaning his incident with Apep is possibly part of their plan, what I don't know though if Rukkhadevata is also going along with it. It's possible, and even Nahida may have also no idea what it was. Note: the goddess of flowers artifacts are meant to be read backwards, meaning from right to left.
Are the scrolls dropped by Samachurls written about forbidden knowledge? (Those who have attempted to translate “went mad”) Could Morax be a subjugated Sovereign? When we try to ask about the Cataclysm, he says, “I signed a contract when it all began.”, meaning at the new order by the PO, not the Cataclysm. The way Apep refers to the Heavenly Principles- does that mean HP = PO?
19:06 If PO actually won the war against SWC and loves human, why did they tell Orobashi to kill itself or otherwise people of Enka would suffer after reading before sun and moon?
Now to quote @Fusaex3 i think you are getting confused by the changed that Nahida and the Elemental life forms are talking abiut. What the Elemental life forms did to gain the fungus for was to slowly "evolve" into that shape and form. The Adaptation they kesp speaking of is basically evolution in its more simplier form, since the Elemental life forms changed their shape over time to be able to better live in the evnironment of Sumeru like how Darwins examples of the finches similar but different changes of forms they took to live the island lives they did. They beings you brought up having the power to change their form are in fact a part of their beings. The Adepti of Liyue are basically the Teyvat versions of many Chinese gods and demons who all can have a human or vaguely human form to fite better with humans but their real forms are their animal forms. This is something they gain from their many years of life cultivating power, which is something that we do to our characters as well. Gaining years of experience through magical books to spead the process while using items to break through to the next level of cultivation or ascendtion. Much like in China, Japanese yokai are not in fact human at all but are basically nautral phenomenon given physical form. Since yokai are in fact that, to find a actual yokai whos original form is a human is excedenly rare since to be considered a yokai one must very much not human. Heck, tbe only reason a Yokai would assume a human form is if they had the power and experience to do so. So in reality, Nahida and the Elemental life forms convo is true still even in for these being. They all gained the power to change human form as a side effect of their long lives. Also it should be noted that Apep's "adaptation" of forbiden knowldge is actually a bit of a red harring. They stated explicitly that in any form, Forbidden knowldge is in fact harmful to all life no matter what since its very exsitance isnt of the world if Teyvat. At best, it would be like having a metal shard lodge in your body and not removing it cuase it would be far to dangerous to do so. Your body would grow to have it inside and maybe even be less sensitive but at the end of the day thats still a piece of metal in your body. It will slowly poison you over time even with proper tretment to help you survive. And the longer it stayes in your body the harder it will be to get it out since your body will always be actively fighting to keep it contained. Which brings me to why Apep didnt just shrink to close the void. That kind of change would require immense amount of time an energy to do. Remember that the Forbidden knowldge was not originally part of the body, therefore that body of Apep was in no way actually actively making it apart of itself but was in fact working hard to keep it contain in the body and keep it from harming the rest of the body. Which it failed to due considering that all the damage it did to Apep's mind and the Elementals that inhabitied the dragon's body. With it gone, no body can be able to simply quickly change back to what it would do nomally since for Ages the body has been working on keeping that area od the body "contained" to the point that even with it gone the body would have exsauted all its energy into keeping it contained that it cant simply changes gears fast enough to fill the whole back in. All the while the missing hole itself is now doing more damage to the body since a hole in the body is significatly more dangerous then a foreign object since all kinds of important things will fall through it the body will simply pull all the stops to patch it up, taking other valuable energy resources from their equaly important places in order ro seal up the hole quickly to lessen any more losses. They say that the Apep is tired, even the most adaptable life cant do anything if they are to tired to do anything about it. Growth takes time and energy. Therefore, they where both right. Just simply about different things. The Geoshroom about Apep being to tired from containing Forbidden Knowldge and Nahida with Apep's "adaptability". I wouldnt say King Deshret had planned to use himself to kill Apep but was originally gonna use it himself to finish off Apep. But when he eventually became overwhelmed by the power of Forbidden Knowldge, in the end he still use it in a attempt to kill Apep. All in all, this video is very informative and it really made me think about how this whole story quest really put forward that this game is very much a chinese game. Cultivation is the act of accumulating oower over time to become stronger, longer living, and eventually into a god/ascended beings.
I honestly think Deshret didn’t just dislike what Celestia beheld under the Sustainer, mourning for what the Sky People have become, but also was aware of a risk in Apep were she to fully realize what she requires to rise up. Sumeru will suffer far more if she went loose, and what better methods were there than to just… give her what she wants? His agreement ensured Sumeru was under the three god-kings (which would then belong to the Lord of Wisdom, now made Lord of Dendro) while she minded her business in exchange for his knowledge. He poisoned his own mind through the use of it, and created the Eternal Oasis but also the Gaol for Liloupar, who destroyed what he worked so hard for out of her bitter resentment for her lover. The technological advancements of the whole of Sumeru were no doubt collected and refined forms of the foreign knowledge, and modified to be acceptable under Irminsul’s reasoning. And with that, he used his life as a seal, his fragment unknown, and knowledge consumed by Apep, poisoning her grievously. But that would not have killed her, I think Nabu saw that as well. It was why she went through with her sacrifice: because the future will wipe away that version of forbidden knowledge, which would cause her to fall. Rukkhadevata’s deletion and the Forbidden Knowledge being wiped in this form had nearly killed Apep. It’s why in her weakened state, she made the Fire Seed, and allowed Nabu’s daughter and progeny uphold their fight against the corrosion and leak. Nahida saved Apep, but I feel like this is all the previous god-kings’ dance to put Apep down low to save Sumeru and keep her from hurting their people. In the end Apep conceded that she will not harm the denizens of Sumeru, they are not the one who hold her ire. Which is what they’d all want.
This entire section of the quest has some interesting implications for everything we have seen before and may see in the future. If it's true that Celestia and the Heavenly Principals care for all life, then that means all of its actions can now be deduced. One of the biggest questions was what was the criteria for the Heavenly Principals to essentially end a civilization and the main ideas were that the Primordial was dethroned or that Celestia became tyranical or both. But now that we know the possibility of the SWC bringing large quantities of Forbiden Knowledge, which we know is connected to the Abyss or accessible from it and how that knowledge seems to harm life itself, it's possible that Celestia's hands may have been forced into doing that for the sake of Teyvat and protect life in its entirety. And I say that because now... we can explain Sal Vindagnyr (or howvever it's spell, the Dragon Spine civilization) as well as Orobashi. DragonSpine was loyal to the Celestial Gods yet it was destroyed after someone discovered something in tge Leylines. Now that we know that Forbiden Knowledge can permeate into it like with Irminsul, it's possible it was Forbiden Knowledge that was discovered and was contaminating that regions Ley line, explaining why it needed to be destroyed so it wouldn't contaminate the whole or infect several people. Aas for Orobashi having to die...we know Orobashi discovered something, but what it was heavily speculated to be "Before Sun and Moon". But remembering where Enkanomiya is, it's possible he found Forbiden Knowledge there too... and the evidence may rest within the Archon Residue. Before Orobashi, we visited two other locations where Gods died, not once we saw Archon Residue or even any form of contamination like we did in the Delusion factory. These places were Decarabian's ruins and the Salt Archon's Domain. If this is true... Celestia has been protecting Humanity for a very long time against the Abyss and Forbiden Knowledge, and seeing as one of the themes we are seeing is how Humans only see the power of the Gods and covet it and/or speculate about its grandeur... it's possible no one saw the connection and simply saw what they felt rather than what was. EDIT: It just hit me... The Fatui have a motto to free the world of Arrogant Gods and the like, acting like they are doing what they believe is necessary for "peace" or whatever, all while doing the most heinous things at times. The Abyss Order seems intent on similar ideals but more extreme. Celestia on the other hand looks downright evil but actually is forced into it rather than seemingly wanting to do it, the exact opposite of the Abyss Order and the Fatui.
I think nahida wasn't just "transforming" but replicating the evolution of the fungus. That's why she's tired, but idk maybe just writing inconsistency
You’re also wrong about the geoshroom. It doesn’t remember Rukkhadevatta. It remembers the lord of dendro. Which in the memories of the people was always Nahida. It wasn’t trying to say “Rukkhadevatta,” that was just the memories being reverted to elemental energy and being unable to speak anymore. Rukkhadevatta still remains a word people can say in the world. Only now people think it was an ancient tree. The word wasn’t erased, just the memory of the person who used to have it ad a name. Also Rukkhadevatta herself wasn’t erased either. I’m surprised people still don’t understand this. The removal from irminsul doesn’t change history. Scaramouche’s story quest proves this. He removed himself from irminsul, but the history of the world remained exactly the same. People just don’t remember his involvement. But he WAS still involved. Same with Rukkhadevatta. She was removed from irminsul but she still existed. People just can’t remember her. Irminsul only stores memory. It doesn’t have any effect on actual history.
12:46 I always believe Rukkha (mommy) used all her power in King Deshret Incident and become teen, after that in cataclysm incident she used all her power again and became child and then she creates Nahida from branch. So is that wrong?
No. Your thinking maybe right. For me, first she used up a lot of her power (to help Deshret) and became a child, then she grew up again and during the cataclysm she used all her power again to fight the forbidden knowledge, becoming a child in the process. He then creates Nahida and dies 😢
@@alexia22245 it also make sense especially if the time gap between king deshret incident and cataclysm is enough for rukkha to grew up. My brain can't take it when Cat said theres 3 rukkha
People tend to forget that Forbidden Knowledge is not from Teyvat hence does not obey its rule > How geoshroom was able to retain memories of Rukkhadevata because he knew she wouldn't remember everything since it would create a paradox (How can you remember things you did before you were born. Nahida is ONLY 500 years old unlike Rukkhadevata who was friends with the likes of Zhongli) also he did say to Nahida that he was here to fill the gap in her memories. As for Apep, did people forget what's the definition of the void ? Nothingness. If there's nothing to adapt to what's the point of adapting ? The void bends light hence time, it can bend physics as well hence space, rendering every concept living beings can come up with useless and on what does adaptability relies on ? Growth which depends on time and space (environment). I think the Forbidden Knowledge also takes on the philosophical view of an idea : an idea or a belief is more difficult to get rid of than a person or living being. It can be altered in some way but the core will always be the same. Forbidden knowledge => harming everything it touches
The people from Khaenri'ah knew a kind of energy that was obtained by knowledge from outside of Teyvat, and i don't remember well if it was Dahri civilization or the Skeptics who came after them, but some of those notes, diaries and pappers in the ruins says they was creating a kind of energy who is similar to the abyss power and this energy can fight against it. These two things, or at least one of them, could be somehow related to Nibelung/Second Who Came/Sinner and the power he obtained outside of Teyvat, mentioned by Apep, if we consider that the Sinner contacted the abyss order founder, many person from the abyss order is related to Khaenri'ah (it's founder itself) and that line from Dainsleaf saying "the rules of the time doesn't seem to be enough to stop him".
I love your videos, genshin is so multi layered that even if you read everything you can still miss a lot of things. Without your vids most fans won't realise the lore behind genshin runs deeper than the roots of iriminsul
13:08 I think what she said there has something to do with Natlan, remember the trailer? Dainsleif was like "The Victor shall burn bright, while the loser must turn to ash. When the God of War shares this secret with the traveler, it is because she has her own reasons"
6:34 I’ve been saying this ever since I played the quest, there is something below Inazuma that we haven’t seen yet. I am very curious about what it might be!
I think for adepti & yokai they only have 2 forms, it didn't state they can transform outside their beast & human form. Zhongli & Venti can transform freely only when they had their gnosis, which function like divine battery so they didn't have to think twice to use their power & energy. now they enjoy their human looks just fine without bothered to change form
It's not true in Zhongli's case. He took many forms in the past and will probably change his form in the future. He's more than 6k years old so it's not a big problem for him (not to mention that his origins unknown)
Transformation was difficult for Nahida, because she did it instantly if transform slowly enough it wouldn't take so much energy. It's like running. If you move fast, you get to your destination quickly but spent a lot of energy. If you move slowlier then you need more time to get to your destination, but wouldn't spend much energy.
15:29 I vaguely remember something about what the Sorush world quest taught me: both the power of the Abyss and the power of the gods are equally "imposing their own order" onto the natural law of Teyvat, twisting them into following their ways Basically, we got otherworldly powers clashing from both sides, and the people (read: vishaps and dragons) who were caught in the middle, suffering in various ways
I have just one thing on my mind, it’s a reference from the Khvarena world quest, there’s a mention of the sinner originating from Khaenri’ah why can’t the God we spoke to in Abyss in the Traveller’s Archon quest be the same sinner, I’m guessing Rhinedottir.
And I love hos selfless Nahida is in the Archon quest. She's willing to sacrifice herself no matter what. Glad she has the traveler and forest freinds to help her out. ❤
Just a theory but maybe Inazuma's dragon is actually Orobashi ? 🤔 Yk the snake thingy with a big skull at the Serpent's Head, he used to be a god and everything before he got killed by the Shogun
You’re wrong about Rukkha. She was the same person up till her death in the cataclysm. She was always the same dendro archon till she died. There have only been 2. Deshret refused the gnosis, so Rukkha later accepted it. That was during the archon war between 4 and 2 thousand years ago. Rukkha was friends with deshret long before that, as he wrote her name in the eternal oasis which he built after the goddess of flowers sacrificed herself by bringing forth abyssal knowledge and being crushed by a celestial nail. That was around the start of the archon war, since Deshret had already refused the gnosis. Rukkhadevatta was doing the same thing as Nahida, using her power to ridiculous levels in exchange for shrinking and reverting to younger ages. But the shrunken form was her teenage form from after she sealed deshret. She didn’t lose all her memories when shrinking, she just reverted to a younger body. She was still the same person.
Nahida Second Story Quest and the artifacts description suggest that the Primordial One defeated the Second Who Came, then landed the Skyfrost Nails to purge the Forbidden Knowledge. But somehow it exterminated the first civilization without getting rid of Forbidden Knowledge. If that's what happened I wonder what Phanes felt after launching those nukes since they are or were said to love human
Thats the part where it gets tricky bcause *Before Sun & Moon’ and the artifacts lore contradicts each other about Phanes’ drastic personality change after the Primordial war, for what we know history could have been tampered by Irminsul just like how someone or something might’ve tampered with the abyss twin’s records. Or? the Second Throne brought forth the forbidden knowledge/abyssal power unto teyvat, corrupted the Primordial one, eventually Phanes falls to insanity, seals the abyssal power below teyvat, and dropping down nail nukes to prevent the abyss from leaking furthermore. The abyssal corruption and insanity could be the reason why Phanes exiled the seelies from celestia and abandoned Enkonomiya and eventually destroying ancient civilizations built around the abyss-corrupted Irminsul branches, (i.e the frostbearing tree in Dragonspine).
@@kamveng453 altering the history doesn't make sense. If the purpose was to erase the existence of Primordial one and the first civilization, wouldn't erasing the entire history makes more sense?
It seems that goddess of flower is an alien just like primordial one. She is also known nabu malikata means mistress of Nabu. But Deshret never called as Nabu which means Nabu is a celestial god just like heavenly principle.
7:49 "the most adapdable being in the world" not "the all adaptable being" + the dendro dragon is a creature from teyvat aka a native of it while the forbidden knowledge is something from out of teyvat. It might have adapted to the forbidden knowledge but it still a native of this world and can't suppress all effects of it. Nahida is probably mentionning how she believed it was the dendro dragon who was the best at adaptation until now. The most adaptable being at the moment is the traveler. 9:01 If it took 40 years for a god and his 4 shades to win the war against 7 dragon, that means the Primordial wasn't so powerful as it may seems. The war must have been exhausting for both sides and looking for a favorable peace treaty without having to kill all the dragons would have been beneficial. 19:12 So that's how Deshret sacrified himself to save the desert people. Which means the Sinner is unlikely to be him.
13:08 Is that a Natlan hint? "The rules of war are woven in the womb. The victor shall burn bright, while the losers must turn into ash." So the secret that Pyro Archon would share with the traveler could very well be related to the battle between Dragons and the Primordial One
I mean without gnosis all archons have is their "raw" powers. With that, Nahida is just too young to have enough energy to bend time. But at the same time Yae is like 500 years old heraelf, for which I don't have an explanation 😔 But again, I never saw Yae transform in the game, so maybe she actually can't turn into a kitsune that easily
We already have shapeshifting youkai NPCs that can turn back and forth between their real form and human form quite easily so Yae should have no difficulties turning into a kitsune when she feels like it. More likely answer is since Nahida never shapeshift before, she hasn’t gotten the hang of it. That’s why she’s tired.
17:36 More like he wanted to use that forbidden knowledge to rebel against the Heavenly Principles, only for the knowledge to cause disaster in his kingdom and corrupt him That's probably when he thought of his promise to Apep and used it as a way to sacrifice himself to stop the forbidden knowledge
One Aranara are OP, two I am worried about Zhiqiong, is she still alive? Regarding Rukkadevata, she used up her powers and Became small trying to protect everyone from Forbidden knowledge and created Nahida from Irminsul in her own Image before erasing herself (That's why the Baby Radish is still a child)
4:39 I have played this game since 1.5 and this is the first time I hear about someone or something being sealed beneath inazuma. After Watatsumi island got released, and then Enkanomiya, I thought that all mentions of seals or whatever were always related Enkanomiya and the vishaps. Guess we have to reread the texts from back then with all the knowledge we currently have.
Every Genshin Lore nerd dies to watch the lore summaries on you channel. You do make us wait a lot for your vids, but in the end you never disappoint. Thank you❤
1:47 If I'm not mistaken, the floating hydro fungus and Nahida referring to the elimination of all "forbidden knowledge" is explained? Like in the archon quest it mentioned the withering, which is a byproduct of forbidden knowledge, the existing withering zones will still stay afterwards, but once it's cleansed it should be gone. We can infer that the dark mud in the chasm will still stay (and maybe even increase) if we don't cleanse it from the source (my guess is that the Lumenstone Adjuvant gadget doesn't actually cleanse it completely but only removes it for a moment, and we alone cannot cleanse it) I think by "forbidden knowledge is no more" they mean that the main source of it is gone, maybe? of course, I may be wrong, but that's what I thought of
Intresting how collecting "memories"/"growth" and then reversing its process can create such power (shown by nahida, shrooms, and aranara) If the twins used this technique, i wonder what devastating power they can unleash
7:18 At the time I thought that it was less of a "prophecy" and more of a "promise" I.e if Rukkhadevata promised the elemental lifeforms that she would bring them home after everything's over, then said lifeforms would take it as a prophecy (this is common in many religions)
Quite a stretch on the whole Rukkhadevata thing. Of course such a god has never existed and it was Nahida who created the Fire Seed, exactly as she states, Nahida who had talked to the Geoshroom, exactly as he said, and the Geoshroom wasn't trying to say the name of a god he'd never met and who had never existed naturally enough. How would that make any sense? The noise is just the sound of a great many Elemental beings together. Nahida herself shrunk and grew then shrunk again. In fact she has used her power to try and delete Forbidden Knowledge three times now. During Deshret's time (whom she remembers because she knew him - she's the oldest Archon), again 500 years ago and a third time a few months ago, where she feels it was most successful (also the third time didn't shrink her because - according to her at least - she had the power of two gnoses). I don't think Buer speaks for Celestia when she apologizes for "mistakes". What good would such an insincere statement be? Apep knows well enough that Buer is not Celestia but a sort of child of Celestia. Apep knows well that the child is not responsible for the sins of the parent, though the relationship ticks Apep off a lot. No, Nahida says she won't repeat the mistakes of her own kind, the gods. She doesn't speak for Celestia. That would just anger Apep more. The Nail drop was incidental to Apep's plans. I'm afraid from Celestia's point of view she just wasn't worth worrying about compared to the Abyss. It's a coincidence that suppressing the Mud also made it hard for Apep to gather Forbidden Knowledge. Deshret may have planned on Apep getting messed up by Forbidden Knowledge as Apep suggests, but it was not for the purpose of hurting Apep or saving humans from Apep. In any case it's really more the GoF's scheme so you'd have to ask her about exactly what she meant about illusions that break shackles to the land.
"Never seen this power before from any of the Archons" We kinda do see it, or at least hints of it. Zhongli can see the history of gems and rocks, Raiden can control the thunderstorms and Venti.... I wanna say that he knows the knowledge of the wind, but its a weird thing. Its like he's a time traveler but can't say anything too much of fear of changing the future.
Isn't it possible tho that being able to transform just depends on how much power someone has? And power is accumulated by growth right? Therefore, with Nahida being the youngest archon, it makes sense that she can't transform so easily. If we attribute size to growth, and we can totally do this since the story itself tells us that Rukkhadevata spent so much energy she shrank down to Nahida size - then Nahida, having only 500 years of growth, would def have less raw power than someone like Yae Miko or the adepti. And I say "raw power" because I'm not including their specialties like the way Venti can hear stuff on the wind or adepti arts, etc
For the transformations every else is still swapping into another version of themselves where as Nahida is becoming a whole new entity. It’s different,
18:23 When I played this story quest, this line immediately reminded me of what dainsleif said in the teyvat chapter storyline, in which he said something along the lines of "the victors shall burn bright, while the losers must turn to ash".
I think that zhongli is actually a dragon since he didnt forget anything from the original dialogs/personal stories when Nahida Deleted Rukkhadevata. He is more likely to be the OG geo dragon
@@lowliethxd1471 i know its kinda weird, but after all in the archon war, everyone fought to be the ruler of their respective land. Maybe Zhong Li, with those huge lithic spears that you can see in game, won the war after all. Something that we dont know yet is: How people used to control elements before archons? I know that genshin have a vast universe to explore yet. But the only elemental beings what we know so far, that can have humanoid form and control the elements are Dragons, as seen in the Enkanomiya event. And also the original rulers of the land, those who where in teyvat before Celestia, are also the ones that dont lose memory of the events if we modify the memories of the tree, the ones that have this ability, are the so called "descendents".
i want to see king deshrett so much. he is so freaking interesting. hopefully hoyo will release his and nibu design in future..and thanks for this video, i understand so much what was happening, lol. and some plothole meant to happen when a writer include 'time can be travelled forward and backward'... i really dont like when writer tempered with time. sometimes they usually out of ideas, the only way to make new plot is for MC to change future or history.
Go rewatch the cutscene again but don't listen to the narrator, everything he says is the myth that grew over the century about Azhdaha, only what Zhongli says is the truth
There is an actually chance that the actual Hydro Archon is the Hydro Crown Dragon reincarnated? I read that on the wiki about the Sovreignity so i was curious. And I , maybe, think that Fontaine is : or creating life form o the Oceanids mimicry ability evolved a lot. I read the documents in the Varukasha quest line soooo...dunno I am totally wrong and I spund like a madman like always
Yeah I don't think teenager rukkha was a different person like nahida is, though it's definitely why the statue is small, because for what I know, deshret's death was during the archon war and rukkha shrunk during his death. So the statues were depicting the dendro archon of the time, teen rukkha. also the dragon king "resurrected" right? Apep said something along the lines of "when the dragon king returned, the world had changed", so him returning was the second who came and shook the heavens, but failed again and turned into the sinner. My theory at least
If Deshret was alive so late in the timeline his kingdom would have been using Mora instead of minting their own coins. He died a loooooong time ago. Rukkhadevata was probably aware that there had been a samsara prior to her own, though perhaps the memory of that samsara in detail was not available to her. Her memory ghost talked about Nahida being herself in the new samsara, which suggests Rukkhadevata knew about the samsaras and the only way that could be true is by her own prior experience. Nahida is not yet aware of this since Traveler insists on hiding it for fear that such knowledge could provoke Forbidden Knowledge. As for if that is true it's hard to say.
If Nahida ever does become a twig, we should plant her in a pot and watch over her. Maybe she'll dance in the pot when no one's looking. Hopefully her vocabulary improves or else we'll be hearing 'I am Nahida' over and over again.
I've been waiting for [this video] for ages! Hehe. Maybe not for ages, but definitely since the quest had been released! I was so happy when I saw this update, thank you!
I just want to say thank you. These lore videos, with this specific format keep me from leaving Genshin. I love the game but often feel like the story is not moving forwards but at least, I get to understand better how the world functions through these videos. Again, it's super helpful to me and I'm sure you help a ton of players through your dedication. May you win all your 50/50s my friend.
So wait. The purple dirt saved the shroom's memory from wiping? He mentioned Rukkhadevata in a distorted voice but she doesn't exist. Hmm...question, questions. So many questions...
11:16 "All of this happened AFTER she became small when she helped Deshret's civilization" 1000+ years before the cataclysm, you mean? That's definitely enough time for Rukkhadevata to grow big again, only to shrink herself again in the cataclysm to do all those feats she did
1:14 She mentions specifically "the golden city" which we now know it is Gurabad from Sumeru. But "the black watchtower" is unknown, so possibly a future place from fontaine😮?😮
Zhongli - Morax venti - Barbatos Ei - Beelzebul Makoto - Baal Nahida/Kusanali/Rukhadevata - Buer Maybe the original dendro Archon is named Buer Also, i guess this explained Venti saying "he is the weakest" In the grand scheme of abilities, i guess he was the weakest out of the seven Buer had been weakened so many times yet her power remains as in one of the strongest Ei and Morax has shown immense power either Barbatos however, he did terraform a whole damn island but Buer foresaw the future Makes me terrified on how powerful the other archons we'll get to meet Tho i have deleted Genshin at this point ._.'
Nabu Malikata is just this plot device and hole at the same time. She's an all-knowing, all-seeing prophet. Whenever something weird happens in Sumeru history, you can probably trace it back to Nabu, directly or indirectly.
didn't the dragon king return? she mentioned that by the time he returned, the world had changed. and seems the Dragon King led them into battle against the Heavenly principles(I assume this is the 1st throne?), using darkness from beyond this world(so the Void ?). Always assumed 2nd throne is from the Void, opposing 1st throne. Apep seems to hold the King in high regards still.
Gosh, I just realized that the Goddess of Flowers is the key player here. She knew that Deshret will fail inevitably but chose to help him because she had seen the future. She knew that the series of events will lead to victory even if sacrifices will be made. Even though she was banished from Celestia she retained her form and powers. She even created the Jinn from what's left of her powers. How much more if she was once a divine envoy of Celestia?
Ikr! Thanks for putting that words out of my head, I don't know how to describe it well like you did.
The mystery slowly crumbles as we getting answers is just satisfy my Genshin lore thirst.
Man I love Genshin lmpact for this reason.
I wonder if she was also the God of time, since they seem to be connected to a lot of nations so far and she seemed to know the future or be able to manipulate it like we saw them do in Raiden's story quest
I see you took your time to give us the wisdom
But if the geoshroom remembered Rukkhadevata does that mean being covered in dark mud saved him from the memory wipe that Nahida did in Irminsul?
Yes.
@@CatWithBlueHat wow!
So there will be some others who still remembers rukhadevata🙄
@@iArcey or “those who share the memory” of osmanthus wine
@@iArcey yep, every single person who effected by dark mud
10:18 Yes it would sound normal because after Scaramouche removed himself from Irminsul, the traveler wakes up and asks "Do you know Balladeer" to which Paimon responded "Balladeer? Is that some kind of food?"
As for changing forms, I do believe that it might be different for Nahida and others because those aren't their innate forms, like the animal/human forms for the Adepti or Yae Miko. It's a stretch, though...
I was about to mention this. I do think this is the case as well. Fungi isn't part of Nahida actual form, she learned about it basically by "fast forward" through time. This is the thing that drains her power.
i agree. Miko and the Adeptus are born in their specific animal form, and it's a part of their nature. And since they're considered mystical beings, they can shapeshift into a human-like appearance in order to adapt to human society and can transform back into their original form.
@@yumine_ i also think nahida was exhausted not because of tampering with time, but because she is already in her weakest form, the smallest version of the greater lord. if she transforms into any creature that is highly connected to the specific element she wields, she's mostlikely using a big portion of her energy because she stated that if she will make another fireseed, she might became as small as a blade of grass or a twig, her original form. and then she asked paimon that they plant her so she can comeback but it will be a long time process.
I'm thinking maybe Yae Miko and the Adepti are doing that for hundreds or thousands of years that they've already mastered changing forms. While Nahida is just a newbie in doing it.
I agree with this, what Nahida was doing is more like 'shapeshifting' and not 'transforming' between own alternate forms.
Celestia doesn't seem to get woodworking, a nail is suppose to fix a problem not breaking things.
😂😂😭😭
Yea someone rlly need to hammer that into their head
💀
I mean it fixed abyss rifts. But...
woodworking is done with dead trees lol
Its a small detail but if you remember the first time that elemental fungi talks about her child she said that she named her after a traveler from far land but because it has happened so long in the past she cant remember her child's name.
But in the fight scene with apep we hear that she named her child Nur(نور), which in persian means the same as Lumine.
The question here is that shouldn't her child’s name change depending on which of the siblings is your main character?!
While the connection with Lumine is an interesting prospect, the elemental form only says "an adventurer" in the english dialogue. However I can't claim this for the Chinese or Japanese versions.
Lumine means light, but so does Aether. The names have that connection, so perhaps the name doesn’t have to change
20:52 to 20:57 - Taking account that Forbidden Knowledge either drives you mad or Elezear. Deshret was aware that Apep's plan to defeat Celestia with the power of the Apocalypse would only end in shambles and create more troubles than it's worth. And what a better way to kill two birds with one stone, by allowing himself to be eaten - to escape Celestia's gaze, protect his people and getting rid of Apep through the process.
Taking into account Genshin's parent story Honkai, the Abyssal power is akin to Quantum, while the Light realm/elemental power is akin to Imaginary, it's kind of right to some aspects as both sides counters one another.
Apep does not believe in humans, that is why he believed that Deshret would fall quickly in his ambitions but it was totally the opposite. He exceeded his craziest expectations in every way but in the end Liloupar in his revenge brought down the kingdom of Deshret where he made the mistake of use the wedge that was there freed the abyss.
All those abyssal energy had to be swallowed by Apep due to the deal he made, and Deshret was not absorbed because he became the seal since Deshret always had that his kingdom would be eternal and therefore he would never fulfill the deal with Apep, who would win. to the death.
Coincidentally, he also wanted to do something similar but she could understand that it was useless and she didn't go any further like Deshret.
@@Rozherhn Who is lupital? that is the first time I ever heard of this name.
@@kanishkjaiswal5088 I think they meant Liloupar, the genie
@@kanishkjaiswal5088 the racist bottle
About "Changing forms" : I think it was more like it's hard to change into different species other than human? Venti is originally a Wind wisp so I assume he can change into his previous form and take form of any human( he took form of his friend and depend on how you interpret his story quest you can tell he took form of real Stanley too)
Zhongli originally is a dragon and wasn't it said somewhere that he took form of different humans with different ages in the past?
If you think about it many Youkais (not all) can take form of human, even if they real form is some kind of beast, but I never heard of a Youkai that can take form of different youkai. Yae Miko is Kitsune so of course it's not hard to take human form that represents her but I don't think she's capable to take form of any creature, maybe she can only take form of other humans but I'm not sure about this too.
I don't know Chinese beasts and divine beings but I assume Adepti are a bit similar to Youkais, they can take form of human that would represent them and go back to their original form but they can't change into another species.
Well what I want to say is it seems changing to look like human don't seem to be a problem to Archons/some yokais/adepti but I think Archons can change into another species(Nahida changing into fungus) but this would take too much power to do and characters like Yae Miko and Adepti wouldn't be able to change into anything else than their beast forms and human forms!
I hope it's understandable... my English is not that good, sorry for that >.
as far as I recall Zhongli debunked that story about him of changing forms as fictive(many stories of him prove to be exaggerations). we only see him in one human form he still appears in today.
@@dragon_nova_luna Well, we also see Zhongli's "exuvia" - the form he used during Rite of Descension. Which looks like of like a Chinese dragon. So he clearly changed at least between those two forms.
But overall, I am under the impression that many deeds of the Adepti and his other friends and allies, like Marchosias, ended up being attributed to Zhongli. So it's very much possible that the woman in that story was not Zhongli himself, but somebody else, perhaps Madame Ping or Guizhong.
Zhongli actually has an ability similar to Nahida's where he can watch his entire region. We find this out during his discussion with Venti at Hu Tao's dinner. (While Zhongli claims not to have known Venti had arrived when Venti gripes about the lack of welcome, Zhongli's awareness of the wind guiding a man is why he sent the Traveler to the area the man was at.)
Likewise, Venti seems to be able to use winds to watch over areas.
Ei, who claims to be fully aware of everything that goes on is the only one without such an ability it seems. :S
Would make sense, since Makoto was the original archon
I want to believe zhongli could see anything that touches the earth like toph seismic sense from Avatar but as wide as liyue, and venti too with wind current but his sense are mobile, it in radius wherever he stand like echolocation, it goes smoothly with anemo gnosis being a freemoving queen
I have three theories regarding raiden ei,
1. she can see everything under stormy clouds of inazuma, but since she hide inside raiden shogun, raiden shogun is the one who can see and rely information to her, she puts thunder barricade around inazuma so she can sense a trespassers enter or leave inazuma
2.only raiden makoto have those senses since shes the original seven
3.raiden makoto and ei were twin god, they both needs to connect their focus, makoto can see people when lightning flashes and ei can see people under dark clouds, ei means shadow, but makoto died so she lost this power
yae miko can watch inazuma through thunder sakuras
Well, earth, wind and plants are everywhere in the world but not lightning. In fact, Ei, or the shogun can still unconsciously create thunderstorms that covers all the sea areas of inazuma, which means they have similar degree of authority over their region and elements even without gnosis, just differ in the nature of their elements.
my guess its because inazumas thunder storm is left in stasis by the puppet shougun.
if Ei was in control they'd probably be able to watch inazuma through via electrical signals by manipulating said storm
My jaw dropped when you mentioned that there is smthing sealed under inazuma. That is creepy and cool. I really wish the anime covers anything from the past events of teyvat but I feel like that might not happen
I hope a antagonist unseal that so I can see the electro dragon
But the cause will be that inazuma island will sink
It's probably a reference to the Abyss though. The Sakura tree's purpose is combating the Abyss not some dead dragon. Besides we already know the Electro dragon was Kapatcir.
@@DavidJohnson-ib1dh Kapatcir is a bird dawg
It could be a Dragon Sovereign- in the Enkanomiya book, there is a reference to Ourubos, another Snake (?) God. Near Sangonomiya Shrine, there is a Sumeru Scholar who is investigating the beliefs of Watatsumi Island and has concluded there were two gods.
@@danielm5535 Ouroboros isn't a creature but an aspect of the Primordial One. Recall that Enka used to be part of the unified Ancient Civilization that existed before 2nd Throne arrived. As such they all worshiped the Primordial One and nothing else, because there wasn't anything else. Specifically the Orouboros represents the cyclic eternity imposed by the Primordial One on Teyvat which the prophet-engineer Aberaku led a heresy against after Enka fell into the Dark Sea. Aberaku preached that the unending eternity of the past under the PO had now given way to a progressive era of time and "history" and worshiped Istaroth, the god of moments (or time). Thus "Before Sun and Moon" is religious tract that records the religious friction between the disillusioned ex-followers of PO and the aristocracy descended from the ancient priest-kings who still tried to milk the whole Primordial One for all they could get out of it even after Enka was abandoned by the PO, by creating the Sunchildren, arresting and later executing Aberaku and later still Spartacus.
Anyway - point is - Orouboros not a god. It says so explicitly in the Enka text.
Even if he isn't the Second who came, the dragon king is a strong candidate for the true identity of the sinner on his own merits. He's not a god, has access to great abyssal power, is an enemy of Celestia, and based on his name, likely has ties to Khanri'ah.
It could be that those who can shapeshift between human/non-human forms learned how to do so through their process of “growth.” It’s obviously possible to do it instantly, even for Nahida (though it taxes her), so maybe it’s that learning how to change like that safely and naturally is what takes time and growth.
sussy vishap people
11:31 When Nahida deleted Rukkhadevata, everyones memories were altered to replace Rukkha with Nahida. Even she believes she purged the forbidden knowledge with Deshret long ago, way before she was even born. Everyone just thinks the lord of the forest was always Nahida.
Nahida leading her army of Aranara, not carrying weapons, but the tune from her video.
'La, La La La, La La Laaaaaa~🎵🎵'
Nahida just has a phone to receive Aranara calls and her ringtone just goes like LA LA LA LA LAAAAAAAAAA
When Nahida hears the complaints about Wanderer's mannerism in the Akademiya, she would have to tell this Inazuman man that he is 'Ina-lot-of-trouble.'
Ok this isn't supposed to be funny sksjss
Cyno approves!
Nahida loves cyno's unfunny jokes
I'mma give you 2 answers:
1- INAFF.
2- *Cyno happy noises*
Brother this is a lore video
2 things would be missing that I noticed.
The first would be that Apep seems to have been blinded by the forbidden knowledge, which caused him this hatred towards Celestia and confused the reason for obtaining the knowledge that was part of the nature of the dendro element.
The second is that the entire dragons vs. Celestia event is not registered and no one on the surface remembers it, it is as if it did not exist, those words being that the winners write history but this does not put Celestia as the good and the dragons Like the bad guys, it rather seems as if Celestia blames herself for everything that happened and erases the guilt of the dragons so that it is not judged by others when this almost destroys Teyvat.
It is certainly not an accident that almost no one remembers the world before Second Who Came. In Enkanomiya chronicles, it was said that some kind of "prohibition" was put to prevent people who knew the previous world from coming back to the surface. And the Archon War that started shortly afterwards has killed a lot of witnesses among the more long-lived people.
Have the people who keep trying to use the abyss to destroy Celestia not learn from the failure of those who came before. All they got to show for it is going insane and corrupted. Seriously I hope someone make fun and humilated them if they lose AGAIN.
Celestia god: Have I ever told you about the definition of insanity ?
So there's a chance that we might see a new area in Inazuma and that would be the Electro Dragon who might still be alive, just like what happened to Azdaha who was sealed away by Morax and the Adepti
Phew, what a journey this one. King Deshret & Goddess of Flowers' lore went hard, we don't even get to see their faces. At this point I'm very curious, I'll take even a slight sillhoutte
Aw, I love this video, breaking down one of the most lore-filled story quest! My brain can't take it all lmaooo.
I agreed with most of the points, however I have some different opinions, regarding:
1) Nahida's shapeshifting abilities; it is indeed hard and exhausting for her bc it wasn't part of her original form at all, and to achieve that shroom state, she kinda skipped times that was supposed to be the evolution and growth. I believe this is different from Inazuma's Youkai and Liyue's Adepti, both are mystical beings, which already had those forms from the very beginning, and they also accumulated experiences and growth needed to do it easily by their own will. It's understandable that Nahida is way too exhausted bc she kind of crammed it all in few seconds/minutes, moreover, she is a newbie at shapeshifting.
2) More than Two Dendro Archon; I believe the Geoshroom referred to Normal/Big Rukka AND smaller Rukkha (after saving King Deshret's civilization). It was still Rukkha all along, she shrunk and lose big portion of her power but it's still her. She probably only lose 75% part of her (kind of), but it is STILL her. Eventhough it may happen several times already, one of them which Geoshroom witnessed. Meanwhile, in the ultimate moment of creating Nahida, 500 years ago, she made a whole brand new one, out of a different branch, then delete herself 100%. Which is why, I still believe that there are only Two Dendro Archon. As to why Rukkha warned Geoshroom that she might not remember it in the future, probably it is already her 'habit' to shrink and lose some powers. I believe this is also tampering with her memory, eventho it's not erasing 100% of it. But she already knew that at some point, she might pass her duties into a new one (she probably already thinking of creating Nahida).
These are just my two cents, I'm trying hard to grasp these lore, lol. Cmiiw and feel free to have some discussions!
Thank you, Cat, for the amazing video 🐱
Nibelung isn't affected by forbidden knowledge and can utilised it. If Nibulong is one of those long-bodied dragon, could we say that Nibulong is a 'bookworm'?
There's no reason to think the Dragon King wasn't negatively effected by Forbidden Knowledge of course. Most likely it had nearly as hard a time as Apep and all the other dragons.
so it means that Rukkhadevata was already small during Archon War since the events during King Deshret's fall was before the Archon War. Rukkhadevata was small for about 1500+ years which means she reigned as an archon but not in her adult form. This explains the statue being in small form and why she's also small when Nahida met her at Irminsul
9:55 this is insane detail i never noticed this until i watch this video man
If we learned something from the event with the Wanderer, it is that when something is deleted from Irminsul, only the "information" is deleted but the things that have already happened cannot be changed, the world will change so that the "information" is deleted but the World events will be the same, they will simply have another "explanation" (Like instead of Wanderer having killed all those people, an avenging descendant appears who kills everyone and dies leaving no offspring)
So it seems natural to me that "forbidden knowledge" still causes problems but in another way.
Irminsul changes the past. The game text is very clear about this. Rukkhadevata, Nahida, Traveler, Paimon, Wanderer and Nicole all state this is so. And they do so explicitly except for Rukkhadevata who is a bit vague and open to interpretation.
@@DavidJohnson-ib1dh No, members of Raiden Gokaden are still dead
@@thwartificer It was 4-500 years ago, so I should hope so.
@@DavidJohnson-ib1dh Remember the vase that Paimon accidentally broke while worrying about Scaramouche?
The vase continued to be broken despite the fact that Scaramouche no longer existed and had become a Wanderer, and Paimon no longer remembered him.
This was to show us that while you can change "lore" you can't change "events".
@@Aural4444 Nicole told us a cat or a bird broke it in this samsara. The past changed as she stated (three times in a short speech in fact).
Shapeshifting itself isnt the problem if its a shift that involves something innate. It seems to be changing shape into something that isnt innately part of ones self that requires a lot of power. And id actually say that the humanoid forms are likely the forms that required power to acquire and same for youkai given they both work on logic of chinese and japanese mythology about cultivation and stuff?
So they can change into humans once they have lived thro enough "human experiences" and human emotions, and the reason why changing into another species is so difficult is bc different races have different understandings, agendas and ideologies. Humans, however, are free from world-changing duties and have no "centered goal", meaning anyone can become a human if they "forget" their purpose and indulge in mortal pleasures and sufferings for long enough.
I have theory that "Thousand Winds" is the title of Anemo Dragon. Since Venti (the elemental wisp) was part of the Thousand Winds, like the elemental beings born from Apep
Do you think the connections to Istaroth don't hold much anymore?
The thousand wind are just istaroth
We must always remember this about Nahida, she's purpose holding back her energy. Remember what she told Traveler to do in her Voice lines.
She told them not to put the jar of Candied Ajilenakh Nuts where she could easily reach them.
You're probably thinking on thos too hard.
It's just that Nahida has a very sweet tooth (just as much as Ei), so you shouldn't let her grab onto candies, as she'll munch on it.
Then again, she can fly, so no matter how high you put the jar she'll always reach it 😂
Hi @CatWithBlueHat, I love your video it help me catch up with the Lore time to time. U are doing a great job.
I agree with most of the video but you are going all over the place to some part of it tho!!?
Nahidas part of changing form but going throu time, so she basically use her power of futur her to change her current form.
While for Hakushin Yae (Kitsune), Gorou (Inugami) and Kirara (Nekomata) it is just metamorphosis . They use their Youkai mystical power to modify their current form thats why we can see part of their true nature still showing.
In Japanese mythology it is daid that a Youkai cannot totally change to human and something will always betray them and show their true nature (ears, tails, pow, horns, wings).
This is ALSO differentes for mixed life forms such as Sucrose (canonically Mondstadt Kitsune), Tighnari (Tighnarian), Diona (Katzlein).
That is again different to Morax way of changing form who is again also différentes to Adepti way of changing form. There is a multitude of way to change form, Nahida in her is just choosing the most difficult but efficient way of doing so idk where the insinuation of Yae strengh comes from.
As for Rhukadevatta shrinking 3.0 to 3.2 we already knew that she shring 2 times in history. One time earlier and another one for saving the desert and the new 3.6 area confirmed us that this first time she shring was by creating the tree god to anchor the god of sweet dew to the mortal world to fight the corruption of the abyss.
Again her shrinking 2 times before Nahida is a known fact.
And for the relationship between Amun Al-Ahmar and Apep, we also know this from the start of Sumeru, they were friends along with Hermanubis the sages of all sages, Ibis the Grand scribe and the goat and crocodile kings.
They were his vassals but she left them and secluded itself, build Court with her children deep in the desert cavern.
Yes he also knew what would happen to Apep when she would ate him, it was his part of his plan.
Anyway thats the only point i wanted to talk about, overall great video, again, thank you for all your work.
Possibly a coincidence, but I wanna point out how similar these quotes sound:
"In war, the victor would inherit the right to shape the world, while the losers must turn to ash..."
-Apep
"The rules of war are woven in the womb: the victors shall burn bright, while the losers must turn to ash."
-Dainsleif, Chapter Storyline Preview
We know VERY little about Natlan, but I wonder if this phrase is something that goes way back, beyond the God of War's beliefs.
Murata - the god of war seems to be an interesting person.
(One more spoiler - Dehya is from Natlan)
@@satishg5538 another character Honkai fans be worried for
@@shanedoesyoutube8001 Himeko right
@@satishg5538 Murata Himeko, yes
Since her death, they have become wary of Lisa (same JP voice as Himeko), the pyro archon, then Star Rail Himeko
there wasn´t three dendro archons, "Rukkhadevata" could shrink to use too much of his power, but still being "rukkhadevata" in the case of "Nahida" the Dendro Archon didn´t just "shrink", she "clone herself" as a new being, but everyone has forgotten the existence of rukkhadevata and with it the fact that Nahida is actually "Rukhadevatha´s daughter by mitosis"
I agree! It's like the previous shrink of Rukkhadevata definitely changed her size and her power also shrunk to smaller portion, but we can say like she only shrunk 75% (kind of). She got smaller but it's still her, during those several times. The one Grounded Mushroom referred to were basically normal Rukkha and then smaller Rukkha. However, with the 'creation' of Nahida, 500 years ago, she really made her as a new one, from a different Irminsul branch, then delete herself, which means she is 100% gone (from existence). It's two different things, so I still believe there were only two Dendro Archon.
The goddess of flowers artifacts has a lore about the skyfrost nail incident from the desert tho, which hinted that Nabu Malikata and Al Ahmar planned a rebellion against the divine but it will take a sacrifice from a god in able to trigger what may happen in the future. In my understanding, what Deshret did with Goddess of flowers was entirely a part of their plan for humans to fight against the divine in the future. Meaning his incident with Apep is possibly part of their plan, what I don't know though if Rukkhadevata is also going along with it. It's possible, and even Nahida may have also no idea what it was.
Note: the goddess of flowers artifacts are meant to be read backwards, meaning from right to left.
#21
Me bawling my eyes out when the Geoshroom we knew for 5 minutes sacrificed himself. Idk why that got me lmao
Guys can you imagine if all the desert world quest related to Al-Akmar and Goddess of Flowers were voiced😢
Are the scrolls dropped by Samachurls written about forbidden knowledge? (Those who have attempted to translate “went mad”)
Could Morax be a subjugated Sovereign? When we try to ask about the Cataclysm, he says, “I signed a contract when it all began.”, meaning at the new order by the PO, not the Cataclysm.
The way Apep refers to the Heavenly Principles- does that mean HP = PO?
19:06 If PO actually won the war against SWC and loves human, why did they tell Orobashi to kill itself or otherwise people of Enka would suffer after reading before sun and moon?
Now to quote @Fusaex3 i think you are getting confused by the changed that Nahida and the Elemental life forms are talking abiut. What the Elemental life forms did to gain the fungus for was to slowly "evolve" into that shape and form. The Adaptation they kesp speaking of is basically evolution in its more simplier form, since the Elemental life forms changed their shape over time to be able to better live in the evnironment of Sumeru like how Darwins examples of the finches similar but different changes of forms they took to live the island lives they did.
They beings you brought up having the power to change their form are in fact a part of their beings. The Adepti of Liyue are basically the Teyvat versions of many Chinese gods and demons who all can have a human or vaguely human form to fite better with humans but their real forms are their animal forms. This is something they gain from their many years of life cultivating power, which is something that we do to our characters as well. Gaining years of experience through magical books to spead the process while using items to break through to the next level of cultivation or ascendtion.
Much like in China, Japanese yokai are not in fact human at all but are basically nautral phenomenon given physical form. Since yokai are in fact that, to find a actual yokai whos original form is a human is excedenly rare since to be considered a yokai one must very much not human. Heck, tbe only reason a Yokai would assume a human form is if they had the power and experience to do so.
So in reality, Nahida and the Elemental life forms convo is true still even in for these being. They all gained the power to change human form as a side effect of their long lives.
Also it should be noted that Apep's "adaptation" of forbiden knowldge is actually a bit of a red harring. They stated explicitly that in any form, Forbidden knowldge is in fact harmful to all life no matter what since its very exsitance isnt of the world if Teyvat. At best, it would be like having a metal shard lodge in your body and not removing it cuase it would be far to dangerous to do so. Your body would grow to have it inside and maybe even be less sensitive but at the end of the day thats still a piece of metal in your body. It will slowly poison you over time even with proper tretment to help you survive. And the longer it stayes in your body the harder it will be to get it out since your body will always be actively fighting to keep it contained. Which brings me to why Apep didnt just shrink to close the void.
That kind of change would require immense amount of time an energy to do. Remember that the Forbidden knowldge was not originally part of the body, therefore that body of Apep was in no way actually actively making it apart of itself but was in fact working hard to keep it contain in the body and keep it from harming the rest of the body. Which it failed to due considering that all the damage it did to Apep's mind and the Elementals that inhabitied the dragon's body. With it gone, no body can be able to simply quickly change back to what it would do nomally since for Ages the body has been working on keeping that area od the body "contained" to the point that even with it gone the body would have exsauted all its energy into keeping it contained that it cant simply changes gears fast enough to fill the whole back in. All the while the missing hole itself is now doing more damage to the body since a hole in the body is significatly more dangerous then a foreign object since all kinds of important things will fall through it the body will simply pull all the stops to patch it up, taking other valuable energy resources from their equaly important places in order ro seal up the hole quickly to lessen any more losses. They say that the Apep is tired, even the most adaptable life cant do anything if they are to tired to do anything about it. Growth takes time and energy.
Therefore, they where both right. Just simply about different things. The Geoshroom about Apep being to tired from containing Forbidden Knowldge and Nahida with Apep's "adaptability".
I wouldnt say King Deshret had planned to use himself to kill Apep but was originally gonna use it himself to finish off Apep. But when he eventually became overwhelmed by the power of Forbidden Knowldge, in the end he still use it in a attempt to kill Apep.
All in all, this video is very informative and it really made me think about how this whole story quest really put forward that this game is very much a chinese game. Cultivation is the act of accumulating oower over time to become stronger, longer living, and eventually into a god/ascended beings.
I honestly think Deshret didn’t just dislike what Celestia beheld under the Sustainer, mourning for what the Sky People have become, but also was aware of a risk in Apep were she to fully realize what she requires to rise up. Sumeru will suffer far more if she went loose, and what better methods were there than to just… give her what she wants?
His agreement ensured Sumeru was under the three god-kings (which would then belong to the Lord of Wisdom, now made Lord of Dendro) while she minded her business in exchange for his knowledge. He poisoned his own mind through the use of it, and created the Eternal Oasis but also the Gaol for Liloupar, who destroyed what he worked so hard for out of her bitter resentment for her lover. The technological advancements of the whole of Sumeru were no doubt collected and refined forms of the foreign knowledge, and modified to be acceptable under Irminsul’s reasoning.
And with that, he used his life as a seal, his fragment unknown, and knowledge consumed by Apep, poisoning her grievously. But that would not have killed her, I think Nabu saw that as well. It was why she went through with her sacrifice: because the future will wipe away that version of forbidden knowledge, which would cause her to fall.
Rukkhadevata’s deletion and the Forbidden Knowledge being wiped in this form had nearly killed Apep. It’s why in her weakened state, she made the Fire Seed, and allowed Nabu’s daughter and progeny uphold their fight against the corrosion and leak.
Nahida saved Apep, but I feel like this is all the previous god-kings’ dance to put Apep down low to save Sumeru and keep her from hurting their people. In the end Apep conceded that she will not harm the denizens of Sumeru, they are not the one who hold her ire.
Which is what they’d all want.
This entire section of the quest has some interesting implications for everything we have seen before and may see in the future.
If it's true that Celestia and the Heavenly Principals care for all life, then that means all of its actions can now be deduced. One of the biggest questions was what was the criteria for the Heavenly Principals to essentially end a civilization and the main ideas were that the Primordial was dethroned or that Celestia became tyranical or both. But now that we know the possibility of the SWC bringing large quantities of Forbiden Knowledge, which we know is connected to the Abyss or accessible from it and how that knowledge seems to harm life itself, it's possible that Celestia's hands may have been forced into doing that for the sake of Teyvat and protect life in its entirety.
And I say that because now... we can explain Sal Vindagnyr (or howvever it's spell, the Dragon Spine civilization) as well as Orobashi. DragonSpine was loyal to the Celestial Gods yet it was destroyed after someone discovered something in tge Leylines. Now that we know that Forbiden Knowledge can permeate into it like with Irminsul, it's possible it was Forbiden Knowledge that was discovered and was contaminating that regions Ley line, explaining why it needed to be destroyed so it wouldn't contaminate the whole or infect several people.
Aas for Orobashi having to die...we know Orobashi discovered something, but what it was heavily speculated to be "Before Sun and Moon". But remembering where Enkanomiya is, it's possible he found Forbiden Knowledge there too... and the evidence may rest within the Archon Residue. Before Orobashi, we visited two other locations where Gods died, not once we saw Archon Residue or even any form of contamination like we did in the Delusion factory. These places were Decarabian's ruins and the Salt Archon's Domain.
If this is true... Celestia has been protecting Humanity for a very long time against the Abyss and Forbiden Knowledge, and seeing as one of the themes we are seeing is how Humans only see the power of the Gods and covet it and/or speculate about its grandeur... it's possible no one saw the connection and simply saw what they felt rather than what was.
EDIT: It just hit me... The Fatui have a motto to free the world of Arrogant Gods and the like, acting like they are doing what they believe is necessary for "peace" or whatever, all while doing the most heinous things at times. The Abyss Order seems intent on similar ideals but more extreme. Celestia on the other hand looks downright evil but actually is forced into it rather than seemingly wanting to do it, the exact opposite of the Abyss Order and the Fatui.
I think nahida wasn't just "transforming" but replicating the evolution of the fungus. That's why she's tired, but idk maybe just writing inconsistency
You’re also wrong about the geoshroom. It doesn’t remember Rukkhadevatta. It remembers the lord of dendro. Which in the memories of the people was always Nahida. It wasn’t trying to say “Rukkhadevatta,” that was just the memories being reverted to elemental energy and being unable to speak anymore.
Rukkhadevatta still remains a word people can say in the world. Only now people think it was an ancient tree. The word wasn’t erased, just the memory of the person who used to have it ad a name.
Also Rukkhadevatta herself wasn’t erased either. I’m surprised people still don’t understand this. The removal from irminsul doesn’t change history. Scaramouche’s story quest proves this. He removed himself from irminsul, but the history of the world remained exactly the same. People just don’t remember his involvement. But he WAS still involved. Same with Rukkhadevatta. She was removed from irminsul but she still existed. People just can’t remember her.
Irminsul only stores memory. It doesn’t have any effect on actual history.
16:27 Paimon was rude? If anyone told me that they would make fun of me after I died, I would have said something much worse
12:46 I always believe Rukkha (mommy) used all her power in King Deshret Incident and become teen, after that in cataclysm incident she used all her power again and became child and then she creates Nahida from branch. So is that wrong?
No. Your thinking maybe right.
For me, first she used up a lot of her power (to help Deshret) and became a child, then she grew up again and during the cataclysm she used all her power again to fight the forbidden knowledge, becoming a child in the process. He then creates Nahida and dies 😢
@@alexia22245 it also make sense especially if the time gap between king deshret incident and cataclysm is enough for rukkha to grew up. My brain can't take it when Cat said theres 3 rukkha
@@ahmaddanisaputra3580 My brain also can't take this. For me is only one Rukkha 😭 (possibly two counting Nahida)
People tend to forget that Forbidden Knowledge is not from Teyvat hence does not obey its rule > How geoshroom was able to retain memories of Rukkhadevata because he knew she wouldn't remember everything since it would create a paradox (How can you remember things you did before you were born. Nahida is ONLY 500 years old unlike Rukkhadevata who was friends with the likes of Zhongli) also he did say to Nahida that he was here to fill the gap in her memories. As for Apep, did people forget what's the definition of the void ? Nothingness. If there's nothing to adapt to what's the point of adapting ? The void bends light hence time, it can bend physics as well hence space, rendering every concept living beings can come up with useless and on what does adaptability relies on ? Growth which depends on time and space (environment). I think the Forbidden Knowledge also takes on the philosophical view of an idea : an idea or a belief is more difficult to get rid of than a person or living being. It can be altered in some way but the core will always be the same. Forbidden knowledge => harming everything it touches
And till the abyss exist will always exist also the forbidden knowledge
The people from Khaenri'ah knew a kind of energy that was obtained by knowledge from outside of Teyvat, and i don't remember well if it was Dahri civilization or the Skeptics who came after them, but some of those notes, diaries and pappers in the ruins says they was creating a kind of energy who is similar to the abyss power and this energy can fight against it. These two things, or at least one of them, could be somehow related to Nibelung/Second Who Came/Sinner and the power he obtained outside of Teyvat, mentioned by Apep, if we consider that the Sinner contacted the abyss order founder, many person from the abyss order is related to Khaenri'ah (it's founder itself) and that line from Dainsleaf saying "the rules of the time doesn't seem to be enough to stop him".
The dendro dragon says 'the victor... while the loser must turn to ash.' that's from natlan. in the tevyat chapter story preview.
I love your videos, genshin is so multi layered that even if you read everything you can still miss a lot of things. Without your vids most fans won't realise the lore behind genshin runs deeper than the roots of iriminsul
13:08 I think what she said there has something to do with Natlan, remember the trailer? Dainsleif was like "The Victor shall burn bright, while the loser must turn to ash. When the God of War shares this secret with the traveler, it is because she has her own reasons"
6:34 I’ve been saying this ever since I played the quest, there is something below Inazuma that we haven’t seen yet. I am very curious about what it might be!
I think for adepti & yokai they only have 2 forms, it didn't state they can transform outside their beast & human form. Zhongli & Venti can transform freely only when they had their gnosis, which function like divine battery so they didn't have to think twice to use their power & energy. now they enjoy their human looks just fine without bothered to change form
It's not true in Zhongli's case. He took many forms in the past and will probably change his form in the future. He's more than 6k years old so it's not a big problem for him (not to mention that his origins unknown)
Transformation was difficult for Nahida, because she did it instantly if transform slowly enough it wouldn't take so much energy. It's like running. If you move fast, you get to your destination quickly but spent a lot of energy. If you move slowlier then you need more time to get to your destination, but wouldn't spend much energy.
15:29
I vaguely remember something about what the Sorush world quest taught me: both the power of the Abyss and the power of the gods are equally "imposing their own order" onto the natural law of Teyvat, twisting them into following their ways
Basically, we got otherworldly powers clashing from both sides, and the people (read: vishaps and dragons) who were caught in the middle, suffering in various ways
I have just one thing on my mind, it’s a reference from the Khvarena world quest, there’s a mention of the sinner originating from Khaenri’ah why can’t the God we spoke to in Abyss in the Traveller’s Archon quest be the same sinner, I’m guessing Rhinedottir.
And I love hos selfless Nahida is in the Archon quest. She's willing to sacrifice herself no matter what.
Glad she has the traveler and forest freinds to help her out. ❤
Im calling it now, her selflessness will be the death of her 😭😭😭
@@lowliethxd1471 I mean, that happened a lot with her previous incarnations alreadY HAHAHAA
She seems to share this outlook with all the Aranara.
Just a theory but maybe Inazuma's dragon is actually Orobashi ? 🤔 Yk the snake thingy with a big skull at the Serpent's Head, he used to be a god and everything before he got killed by the Shogun
You’re wrong about Rukkha. She was the same person up till her death in the cataclysm. She was always the same dendro archon till she died. There have only been 2.
Deshret refused the gnosis, so Rukkha later accepted it. That was during the archon war between 4 and 2 thousand years ago. Rukkha was friends with deshret long before that, as he wrote her name in the eternal oasis which he built after the goddess of flowers sacrificed herself by bringing forth abyssal knowledge and being crushed by a celestial nail. That was around the start of the archon war, since Deshret had already refused the gnosis.
Rukkhadevatta was doing the same thing as Nahida, using her power to ridiculous levels in exchange for shrinking and reverting to younger ages. But the shrunken form was her teenage form from after she sealed deshret. She didn’t lose all her memories when shrinking, she just reverted to a younger body. She was still the same person.
I believe the scenario writer just forgot the adeptis can change form easily. This quest has so many issues.They should remake it.
Nahida Second Story Quest and the artifacts description suggest that the Primordial One defeated the Second Who Came, then landed the Skyfrost Nails to purge the Forbidden Knowledge. But somehow it exterminated the first civilization without getting rid of Forbidden Knowledge. If that's what happened I wonder what Phanes felt after launching those nukes since they are or were said to love human
Thats the part where it gets tricky bcause *Before Sun & Moon’ and the artifacts lore contradicts each other about Phanes’ drastic personality change after the Primordial war, for what we know history could have been tampered by Irminsul just like how someone or something might’ve tampered with the abyss twin’s records.
Or? the Second Throne brought forth the forbidden knowledge/abyssal power unto teyvat, corrupted the Primordial one, eventually Phanes falls to insanity, seals the abyssal power below teyvat, and dropping down nail nukes to prevent the abyss from leaking furthermore.
The abyssal corruption and insanity could be the reason why Phanes exiled the seelies from celestia and abandoned Enkonomiya and eventually destroying ancient civilizations built around the abyss-corrupted Irminsul branches, (i.e the frostbearing tree in Dragonspine).
@@kamveng453 altering the history doesn't make sense. If the purpose was to erase the existence of Primordial one and the first civilization, wouldn't erasing the entire history makes more sense?
The book already talk about that in game before nahida story quest
u always come in clutch whenever i dont have anything to watch during dinner
It seems that goddess of flower is an alien just like primordial one. She is also known nabu malikata means mistress of Nabu. But Deshret never called as Nabu which means Nabu is a celestial god just like heavenly principle.
She is a seele
7:49 "the most adapdable being in the world" not "the all adaptable being" + the dendro dragon is a creature from teyvat aka a native of it while the forbidden knowledge is something from out of teyvat.
It might have adapted to the forbidden knowledge but it still a native of this world and can't suppress all effects of it.
Nahida is probably mentionning how she believed it was the dendro dragon who was the best at adaptation until now. The most adaptable being at the moment is the traveler.
9:01 If it took 40 years for a god and his 4 shades to win the war against 7 dragon, that means the Primordial wasn't so powerful as it may seems. The war must have been exhausting for both sides and looking for a favorable peace treaty without having to kill all the dragons would have been beneficial.
19:12 So that's how Deshret sacrified himself to save the desert people. Which means the Sinner is unlikely to be him.
13:08 Is that a Natlan hint?
"The rules of war are woven in the womb. The victor shall burn bright, while the losers must turn into ash."
So the secret that Pyro Archon would share with the traveler could very well be related to the battle between Dragons and the Primordial One
I mean without gnosis all archons have is their "raw" powers. With that, Nahida is just too young to have enough energy to bend time. But at the same time Yae is like 500 years old heraelf, for which I don't have an explanation 😔
But again, I never saw Yae transform in the game, so maybe she actually can't turn into a kitsune that easily
We already have shapeshifting youkai NPCs that can turn back and forth between their real form and human form quite easily so Yae should have no difficulties turning into a kitsune when she feels like it. More likely answer is since Nahida never shapeshift before, she hasn’t gotten the hang of it. That’s why she’s tired.
17:36
More like he wanted to use that forbidden knowledge to rebel against the Heavenly Principles, only for the knowledge to cause disaster in his kingdom and corrupt him
That's probably when he thought of his promise to Apep and used it as a way to sacrifice himself to stop the forbidden knowledge
One Aranara are OP, two I am worried about Zhiqiong, is she still alive?
Regarding Rukkadevata, she used up her powers and Became small trying to protect everyone from Forbidden knowledge and created Nahida from Irminsul in her own Image before erasing herself (That's why the Baby Radish is still a child)
4:39
I have played this game since 1.5 and this is the first time I hear about someone or something being sealed beneath inazuma. After Watatsumi island got released, and then Enkanomiya, I thought that all mentions of seals or whatever were always related Enkanomiya and the vishaps. Guess we have to reread the texts from back then with all the knowledge we currently have.
Every Genshin Lore nerd dies to watch the lore summaries on you channel. You do make us wait a lot for your vids, but in the end you never disappoint. Thank you❤
1:47 If I'm not mistaken, the floating hydro fungus and Nahida referring to the elimination of all "forbidden knowledge" is explained? Like in the archon quest it mentioned the withering, which is a byproduct of forbidden knowledge, the existing withering zones will still stay afterwards, but once it's cleansed it should be gone. We can infer that the dark mud in the chasm will still stay (and maybe even increase) if we don't cleanse it from the source (my guess is that the Lumenstone Adjuvant gadget doesn't actually cleanse it completely but only removes it for a moment, and we alone cannot cleanse it) I think by "forbidden knowledge is no more" they mean that the main source of it is gone, maybe? of course, I may be wrong, but that's what I thought of
Intresting how collecting "memories"/"growth" and then reversing its process can create such power (shown by nahida, shrooms, and aranara)
If the twins used this technique, i wonder what devastating power they can unleash
I just want to ask
Did The Abyss exist in teyvat from the beginning
Or did it just somehow appeared on teyvat suddenly like the primordial one
There's a loading screen statement that says the two powers that fight each other in the Chasm are both from beyond the heavens.
this is interesting, a bigger baddie
7:18
At the time I thought that it was less of a "prophecy" and more of a "promise"
I.e if Rukkhadevata promised the elemental lifeforms that she would bring them home after everything's over, then said lifeforms would take it as a prophecy (this is common in many religions)
Quite a stretch on the whole Rukkhadevata thing. Of course such a god has never existed and it was Nahida who created the Fire Seed, exactly as she states, Nahida who had talked to the Geoshroom, exactly as he said, and the Geoshroom wasn't trying to say the name of a god he'd never met and who had never existed naturally enough. How would that make any sense? The noise is just the sound of a great many Elemental beings together. Nahida herself shrunk and grew then shrunk again. In fact she has used her power to try and delete Forbidden Knowledge three times now. During Deshret's time (whom she remembers because she knew him - she's the oldest Archon), again 500 years ago and a third time a few months ago, where she feels it was most successful (also the third time didn't shrink her because - according to her at least - she had the power of two gnoses).
I don't think Buer speaks for Celestia when she apologizes for "mistakes". What good would such an insincere statement be? Apep knows well enough that Buer is not Celestia but a sort of child of Celestia. Apep knows well that the child is not responsible for the sins of the parent, though the relationship ticks Apep off a lot. No, Nahida says she won't repeat the mistakes of her own kind, the gods. She doesn't speak for Celestia. That would just anger Apep more.
The Nail drop was incidental to Apep's plans. I'm afraid from Celestia's point of view she just wasn't worth worrying about compared to the Abyss. It's a coincidence that suppressing the Mud also made it hard for Apep to gather Forbidden Knowledge.
Deshret may have planned on Apep getting messed up by Forbidden Knowledge as Apep suggests, but it was not for the purpose of hurting Apep or saving humans from Apep. In any case it's really more the GoF's scheme so you'd have to ask her about exactly what she meant about illusions that break shackles to the land.
It would be interesting to have a new raiden archon quest where we have to deal with the Inazuma dragon sovereign
"Never seen this power before from any of the Archons"
We kinda do see it, or at least hints of it. Zhongli can see the history of gems and rocks, Raiden can control the thunderstorms and Venti.... I wanna say that he knows the knowledge of the wind, but its a weird thing. Its like he's a time traveler but can't say anything too much of fear of changing the future.
Isn't it possible tho that being able to transform just depends on how much power someone has? And power is accumulated by growth right? Therefore, with Nahida being the youngest archon, it makes sense that she can't transform so easily.
If we attribute size to growth, and we can totally do this since the story itself tells us that Rukkhadevata spent so much energy she shrank down to Nahida size - then Nahida, having only 500 years of growth, would def have less raw power than someone like Yae Miko or the adepti. And I say "raw power" because I'm not including their specialties like the way Venti can hear stuff on the wind or adepti arts, etc
For the transformations every else is still swapping into another version of themselves where as Nahida is becoming a whole new entity.
It’s different,
18:23 When I played this story quest, this line immediately reminded me of what dainsleif said in the teyvat chapter storyline, in which he said something along the lines of "the victors shall burn bright, while the losers must turn to ash".
I think that zhongli is actually a dragon since he didnt forget anything from the original dialogs/personal stories when Nahida Deleted Rukkhadevata. He is more likely to be the OG geo dragon
Interesting.
Zhongli like Azhdaha was described as "powers beyond this world", so if Azhdaha is a sovereign...
Wouldn't it be weird/ ironic that a sovereign dragon would became an archon?
@@lowliethxd1471 i know its kinda weird, but after all in the archon war, everyone fought to be the ruler of their respective land. Maybe Zhong Li, with those huge lithic spears that you can see in game, won the war after all.
Something that we dont know yet is: How people used to control elements before archons? I know that genshin have a vast universe to explore yet. But the only elemental beings what we know so far, that can have humanoid form and control the elements are Dragons, as seen in the Enkanomiya event.
And also the original rulers of the land, those who where in teyvat before Celestia, are also the ones that dont lose memory of the events if we modify the memories of the tree, the ones that have this ability, are the so called "descendents".
He isn't a dragon, it's just one of his many forms. He could be probably not from Teyvat at all
i want to see king deshrett so much. he is so freaking interesting. hopefully hoyo will release his and nibu design in future..and thanks for this video, i understand so much what was happening, lol. and some plothole meant to happen when a writer include 'time can be travelled forward and backward'... i really dont like when writer tempered with time. sometimes they usually out of ideas, the only way to make new plot is for MC to change future or history.
I might not remember well but, wasn't Azhdaha given its present form by zhongli/morax ? How is he one of the sovereigns then ?
Go rewatch the cutscene again but don't listen to the narrator, everything he says is the myth that grew over the century about Azhdaha, only what Zhongli says is the truth
You should watch this ruclips.net/video/tp5-Bzcagbs/видео.html
Go watch the link cat gave u
Also did even play the 2nd lantern Rite event
@@CatWithBlueHat ohhhh i see now, thanks i was confused
There is an actually chance that the actual Hydro Archon is the Hydro Crown Dragon reincarnated? I read that on the wiki about the Sovreignity so i was curious. And I , maybe, think that Fontaine is : or creating life form o the Oceanids mimicry ability evolved a lot. I read the documents in the Varukasha quest line soooo...dunno I am totally wrong and I spund like a madman like always
Great video as always bro. I was wondering if you could do one for the 3.6 world quest (Khvarena of Good and Evil)❤
i just finished the quest so now im here of course
2:05 There is something similar with Barbatos, he hears wherever the wind blows
Yeah I don't think teenager rukkha was a different person like nahida is, though it's definitely why the statue is small, because for what I know, deshret's death was during the archon war and rukkha shrunk during his death. So the statues were depicting the dendro archon of the time, teen rukkha.
also the dragon king "resurrected" right? Apep said something along the lines of "when the dragon king returned, the world had changed", so him returning was the second who came and shook the heavens, but failed again and turned into the sinner. My theory at least
If Deshret was alive so late in the timeline his kingdom would have been using Mora instead of minting their own coins. He died a loooooong time ago.
Rukkhadevata was probably aware that there had been a samsara prior to her own, though perhaps the memory of that samsara in detail was not available to her. Her memory ghost talked about Nahida being herself in the new samsara, which suggests Rukkhadevata knew about the samsaras and the only way that could be true is by her own prior experience. Nahida is not yet aware of this since Traveler insists on hiding it for fear that such knowledge could provoke Forbidden Knowledge. As for if that is true it's hard to say.
If Nahida ever does become a twig, we should plant her in a pot and watch over her. Maybe she'll dance in the pot when no one's looking. Hopefully her vocabulary improves or else we'll be hearing 'I am Nahida' over and over again.
Nice! We got more information from the recent Story Quest with the Dendro Archon, Nahida!
I've been waiting for [this video] for ages!
Hehe. Maybe not for ages, but definitely since the quest had been released! I was so happy when I saw this update, thank you!
Thank you for spending your precious time to sum up the lore. Your videos make me understand it more than reading it myself.
well nahida is a branch of imrinsul , a branch of rukkhadeveta memories and powers so she couldnot handel the power
I just want to say thank you.
These lore videos, with this specific format keep me from leaving Genshin. I love the game but often feel like the story is not moving forwards but at least, I get to understand better how the world functions through these videos. Again, it's super helpful to me and I'm sure you help a ton of players through your dedication.
May you win all your 50/50s my friend.
Hey can you make a video about who is Al ahmar?
That’s Deshret
@@addisynsanders3805 wait what deshret is Al ahmar?
@@THE_FOOL2000 Yeah i mean acquired forbidden knowledge with the help of the goddess of flowers, can you think of anyone else who fits that bill?
@@addisynsanders3805 ah and here i just mistook both of them a separate character 🥲 sorry and thanks for explaining
@@THE_FOOL2000 it’s an easy mistake I’m just glad I could clear things up
So wait. The purple dirt saved the shroom's memory from wiping? He mentioned Rukkhadevata in a distorted voice but she doesn't exist. Hmm...question, questions. So many questions...
imagine the divine tree, where akademiya is on, is the first dendro archon
Wow that would be really cool but somehow unlikely
11:16 "All of this happened AFTER she became small when she helped Deshret's civilization"
1000+ years before the cataclysm, you mean?
That's definitely enough time for Rukkhadevata to grow big again, only to shrink herself again in the cataclysm to do all those feats she did
1:14 She mentions specifically "the golden city" which we now know it is Gurabad from Sumeru. But "the black watchtower" is unknown, so possibly a future place from fontaine😮?😮
Zhongli - Morax
venti - Barbatos
Ei - Beelzebul
Makoto - Baal
Nahida/Kusanali/Rukhadevata - Buer
Maybe the original dendro Archon is named Buer
Also, i guess this explained Venti saying "he is the weakest"
In the grand scheme of abilities, i guess he was the weakest out of the seven
Buer had been weakened so many times yet her power remains as in one of the strongest
Ei and Morax has shown immense power either
Barbatos however, he did terraform a whole damn island but Buer foresaw the future
Makes me terrified on how powerful the other archons we'll get to meet
Tho i have deleted Genshin at this point ._.'
Nabu Malikata is just this plot device and hole at the same time. She's an all-knowing, all-seeing prophet. Whenever something weird happens in Sumeru history, you can probably trace it back to Nabu, directly or indirectly.
what if Nibelung is the World Serpent like the one in Norse Mythology, but it lives around the roots of Irminsul, somewhere near Khanriah
I mean it's possible, isn't Apep also inspired from Apophis ?
didn't the dragon king return? she mentioned that by the time he returned, the world had changed. and seems the Dragon King led them into battle against the Heavenly principles(I assume this is the 1st throne?), using darkness from beyond this world(so the Void ?). Always assumed 2nd throne is from the Void, opposing 1st throne. Apep seems to hold the King in high regards still.