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I can't wait to get a video on Harvey. The flip of making the acid side the good type was really good. I love how he went from an ass to at least trying to do the right thing, even if it was too little too late and resulted in his attack. Also might be cool getting a video on this version of Bullock and Flass.
It wasn’t that she killed her son, it was how quickly without hesitation she commanded his death and then how she did it, drowning her child in a box. Penguin was thee most ruthless villain in this new Batman series
Especially with that little look of regret she gives after she does it. Her doing it while not really wanting to doesn't make her softer, it just highlights how cruel and evil she is.
the method is what really got to me. just imagine getting locked in a dark, claustrophobic coffin, with barely any room to even wiggle your toes, and the only thing you can hear is the rush of water as you plunge down into the abyss of a lake and the inside of the box fills with water... god thats a terrible way to die. and all those boxes on the bottom of the lake...
The Iceberg Lounge is a boat, bravo to whoever came up with the idea. Because it basically means the penguin lives on a floating iceberg, which is such an obvious joke I'm kicking myself for noticing it sooner
I would also point out that penguins are famously some of the most caring parents in the animal kingdom, right down to being driven to raising (well, kidnapping) other penguins' babies if theirs is killed or lost. So, Oswalda being so willing to murder her sons is incredibly ironic given her nickname.
Well that and sometimes if a parental penguin loses their child, their "NEED BABY" hormones are still so juiced up that they will try and steal other chicks. Sometimes accidentally killing them in the chaos. But even the ones that don't get killed tend to be abandoned soon after once the baby hormones cool off.
@@SerumLake if I may be honest? I didn't give much thought to the whole outrage or uproar of making The Penguin a woman, I just know that if I was asked to come up with a new iteration of the character I would've gone with a Baby Herman situation from Who Framed Roger Rabbit, maybe explore the more negative aspects of childish behavior that are rarely addressed in comic book shows, maybe even contrast it with Bruce's/Batman's character traits, I will harp on the fact that Bruce Timm and co settled on a name like Oswalda though, I expected something a bit more creative than that.
Was NOT expecting her to kill her kid by stuffing him in a box and dropping the box in the sea. Really reminded me of the origin of the golden age Spectre
Speaking of DC's spirit of vengeance, did you happen to notice that one of the GCPD's recurring officers for the first half of the series is a redheaded man named Corrigan?
I like how they also flipped Penguin's personality. The traditional Penguin has a lot of resentment about how his family is looked down upon by other rich families and he really wants to be a legitimate member of high society but he's awkward around them. This Penguin is very comfortable in high society and mingles well with them, but she still keeps those illicit dealings like the traditional Penguin. A lot of previous versions of the Penguin also had overbearing mothers. This version is an awful mother who killed her own son.
I feel quite the opposite to be honest, penguin lives on the fringes of gotham's high society, putting on a show for the rich folk on her boat but ultimatly in public she's just a stylish singular club owner. A relatively successfull business woman doing Jessica Rabbit impression. Batman makes a point about how she's hiding in plain sight, having acess to all the rich and powerfull of Gotham while not actually being considered one of them. This is something show almost doesn't go into but it really makes for the most key factor in penguin for me. She wants to be one of the elites of high society but there's a barrier keeping her from truly belonging, and she wails and scratches at that barrier bringing out the worst of herself out of spite. Thorne plays on that insecurity of her and pits her against her sons, letting penguin completely ruin her upstart of an empire without having to lift a finger. Letting her completely humiliate herself. That is top penguin for me but might have just imagined it.
@@karolchruzik1919Nah Thorne was playing her, that's why he implied that it was the loyal son and not the rat, he knew that she wouldn't let that betrayal stand but even if she let him live it could be the start of her empire imploding. This is why he didnt help out the rat either, he doesn't want a traitor on his side, but knowing that she's willing to kill her sons by this point he knows that the kid will either blab to the cops for protection or he'll die and Thorne will have dealt Penguin 2 mortal blows to her empire in one fell swoop, either scenario being a massive boon. Mind you he could've forced the kid to blab to the cops under his protection but he doesnt trust the kid so he probably didn't consider that an option
Guys every single penguin is different actually mention which version of the penguin you are talking about they don't have the same backstory or personality or even looks
And also saying "traditional" doesn't count because none of them are officially called the traditional penguin because there isn't a traditional penguin, again that implies that they share qualities and none of the Penguins do some of them are raised Rich some of them are killers some of them aren't Killers some of them were homeless
They nailed the duality you need with the penguin. She goes from giving a musical number and rubbing shoulders at a party to locking her son in a trunk and tossing him into the ocean to drown. Like I feel the true essence of the Penguin, at least the best versions, are this person who puts on an air of sophistication, but can then instantly switch to a cold murderer in a second.
My problem with Oswalda is that it feels like they rushed her. I think it would have been fun if she was a recurring character as part of the mob subplots so we could really ramp up to how vicious she was. Right now it feels like they started at 11 and now have nowhere else to go. Also there was all that talk about a mob power vacuum that never really seemed to materialize. Makes me think this was a pilot and a lot of the big ideas the creators wanted to include had to be cut out due to not being given as many episodes as originally planned. Edit: Guys I know she's coming back. I'm just saying that the introduction of a character is important and I feel like her intro could have been handled better.
I think there was no need for her and Rupert Thorne to both stick around. Penguin is viscious and loud while Thorne is quiet and subtle. They chose quiet and subtle.
@@matthewhecht9257and perhaps that’s why we won’t see Thorne very much of the future. Like you said he’s subtle, behind the shadows like Batman with more experience hiding his activities and blood money.
4 месяца назад+30
since she isnt killed by the cops like Fire Bug or Two Face, she has a chance to appear again.
Regardless of how people feel about a gender-swapped Penguin, I did like how she still acted like the Penguin. She was just as cold and ruthless as the character usually is, as we literally see her kill her own son without a shred of remorse or not even a tear; that alone is COLD ASF! It's also refreshing to see a Penguin that actually belonged in high society for once and enjoys it.
I hate how everyone calling BCC "woke" just because Penguin is a woman and the Gordons are black. Because god forbid black people exist. 🙄 If anything, I think being a woman makes Penguin a lot more interesting. Not only is she a ruthless monster who didn't even hesitate to merk her own kid, but unlike every other female Batman villain, she is not conventionally attractive. So she can't disarm men by using se× appeal like Harley, Ivy, or Catwoman would. Instead she's clawed her way to the top by sheer determination, intelligence, and willingness to do whatever it takes to win, even if it means throwing her morals out the window....or into the ocean, so to speak.
@@WobblesandBean my main problem with the show is that its set in the 1940s but they don't really do much with it. there's none of the social issues that would have been prevalent at the time. they don't mention world issues to any capacity (that i know of) its just a 40s coat of paint. that and i think the animation is subpar at times
@@WobblesandBean Honestly every single woman in this show is hot as hell, including Oswalda, imo. But she was not designed to be conventionally attractive to straight dudes, which makes her incredibly unique.
@@twideslauriers7875 Agreed. I personally think she's a good-looking woman. And her waist is killer (pun intended). But ultimately, she's still a fantastic villain.
@@WobblesandBeanGordon was black in The Batman show and that’s my favorite version of Gordon, so I have no idea why people would complain about him being black. Seems weird.
Serum Lake: "This version of Penguin might be the most ruthless one yet." Me: "C'mon, how bad could she possibly be when compared to the Arkham and Gotham versions?" Serum Lake: "She murders he own son on the off chance he's a traitor, and there is a literal graveyard of corpses beneath her boat." Me: "Oh, that's... that's pretty bad."
Thank you for mentioning *Gotham* ^^ while our dear Serum was listing the various Penguins, I kept expecting to hear => "and of course, Robin Lord Taylor, one of the 2 break-out stars from the show *Gotham* " But nothing for us Gothamites 😢 [if anyone is wondering, I have Cameron Monaghan as Mr J for the breat out moment... there wasn't much publicity about the show, but when _"The Blind Fortune Teller"_ came out, and *that* one scene at the GCPD with Jérôme Valeska, his blind dad, Jim Gordon & Leslie Thomkins hit RUclips, it went "2015 viral" and Joker fans reaaaaally wanted to see more of this guy.] ... damn, almost a decade already? Which reminds me, the trailer and charas announced for Matt Reeves *"The Penguin"* makes me wonder how much that show (just one more month till first episode airs, gettin' closer \o/) will look like Robin Lord Taylor's Oswald's ascension to power, and his constant fight to _remain_ in power. I loved Oz in Reeves' "The Batman" so I'm not worried. I'm sure it will be good, just a tad strange that 2 whole live action shows would specifically depict Oswald Cobblepot's rise in Gotham City. Sure, in *Gotham* he's not the "evil protagonist", but during season 1, when they didn't know exactly which direction to take the show on, we spend as much time with Bruce Wayne that we do with Oswald, watching both of them struggle with their respective issues, fighting uphill battles one after the other... Bruce had Alfred and Selina Kyle Oswald has Gertrude (and Edward... and later Elijah Van Dahl Edward... then Edward... you decide if I'm talking about the dog that mauled Nyssa Al Ghul or not.) Ok, thesis over, nice video Serum, as usual! Keep up the good work, it's nice to see reviews of this show that aren't just bashing-fests RF
@@randallflagg3700 that's not entirely true, that Robin Lord Taylor's Penguin was left out. While he wasn't mentioned by name, a clip of him is shown at 1:38 when Serum points out that almost every Penguin has one thing in common: being ruthless, calculating killers.
Hot take, but when it comes to franchises like Batman that have been adapted a billion times, sometimes changing things just for the sake of it is a nice way of keeping things fresh. This show seems to be inverting a lot about the Batman mythos and I respect that (especially with how badly some fans deal with change)
Exactly. Take, as an example, Mr. Freeze. Prior to Batman; the animated Series, Mr. Freeze had been a low tier 2 villain who wasn't all that notable. At the time the show premiered, I do belive Freeze was actually dead, having been 'iced' by the Joker. He was a generic mad scientist type. Not interesting. They made him sympathetic in the series and it instantly made Freeze a tier 1 fan favorite.
I appreciate you mentioning the impact of a mother killing their child as a significant reason why this version works. This may not be a definitive version of Penguin, but its a very good one with thought put into the story, and they do effectively in just 10 minutes of screen time.
@@SerumLake I really hope she comes back in Season Two. I wish her gang war with Rupert Thorne could have been fleshed out in two or three episodes, but understand why that wasn't possible with only 10 episodes. I wouldn't trade the Gentlemen Ghost or Natalia Night episodes for it. I think exploring Linton Midnight's deal later will have payoff and the traveling carnival was a good tie-in to the Dent/Thorne subplot, plus Robin referential fanservice.
Another observation (and I'm not sure if this means anything): it's ironic that the Penguin would refer to Aaron - the offspring she kills - as her favorite since judging by his appearance, he likely takes after his noticeably absent father; you would think for that reason that she would be disgusted at the sight of him and partial to the one who bears a stronger resemblance to her, yet we see the opposite to be the case.
Honestly i found that they actually did something that is done with a lot of Penguins; she’s underestimated. Not because of size or appearance but because of her gender. And she is actually fairly like IRL Penguins. Real ones DO kill their own off spring of needed
Hi, zoologist here. That's not true at all. Penguins are excellent parents, in fact they're so strongly bonded to their offspring that if they lose a chick, they will grieve terribly, and the distraught mother might even try to steal another penguin's chick because she is so desperate to have her baby back. You're getting penguins confused with storks, and possibly loons. Storks are notorious for this, they will typically lay 3-4 eggs but only raise 1-2 chicks. They just sort of let their babies play Battle Royale. Loons are even worse, they'll merk their baby themselves if they sense there aren't enough fish to feed their entire clutch of loonlets.
I have to admit that at first, I was without words, but when I saw how she was like, I was absolutely pleased with how she really is the Penguin. Not just a genderbend. She IS the Penguin in all the ways that matter. All I can say as that THIS is why I save my judgements for seeing the character in action.
@jamesmorales4735 My man, that is a woman Like in this universes context she's a woman, you're being transphbic for someone that isn't even trans lmao.
to be perfectly honest, people being mad about a genderswapped penguin need to go onto the dc wikia, type the name of any character, and see just how many wild and weird variations there are of any one character. did you guys know there was a female two-face in the past? yup. catwoman: guardian of gotham. not to say it was GOOD. no. but people need to realize: elseworlds and projects outside the main comic continuity are like.... simpsons treehouse of horror episodes. the writers can tell weird and out-there stories not bound by limitation. whether they are good or bad stories though is another matter entirely.
4:37 things like that always make extremely angry as someone who grew up with a mentally abusive mom, people would always defend her because "she's your mother". The double standard is so frustrating. Women can be abusive too! Dads should get more respect and love from society.
Oh geez… please tell me that you’re out of there and have cut her off, I’m so so sorry that you went through something like that… I just hope that you know whatever reason she abused you was never your fault, you deserve better, and I hope where ever you are you are somewhere safe, and you are happy😢
Here's my adaptation rule: the FIRST time a character is adapted from their original medium, you should try to stick as close to the source material as possible. AFTER that, do whatever you want. We've had original comic-accurate Penguin on TV for decades now, so Oswalda works just fine for me.
Same goes for Transformers characters, particularly Optimus and Megatron. Believe me, their Beast Wars and Animated iterations are loads better than their G1 cartoon iterations for many reasons.
I've adapted The Mad Hatter 8 times now. My favorite method for adapting is taking elements I enjoy/feel aren't fully expanded on and running with it while adding my own bits. In my newest adaptation, I'm exploring how growing up in Arkham Asylum would affect him (as that's a part of one of his origins), and I've made his father Professor Pyg (because somebody said his dad in that origin kinda looks like him). I've added his desire for company, and changed it to a platonic yearning for his missing siblings (one of whom is Clock King, as they were brothers in a comic for the 1966 show).
@MrMelonsz well changing sex or race isn't it for me. You cpukd make the joker a woman and still have him be the joker if his mentality, morality, and motivations remain the same. Jared let's joker wad a baseline white man yes but he didn't FEEL like the joker, he felt like a pretender.
The filicide aspect of this version of the Penguin is really interesting, considering the fact that she's adopted the mantle of an animal known for great parenting. I honestly think this may be my favorite incarnation of the character, since the series creators have really leaned into creative ways to flesh her out in a way that distinguishes her from just being another version of "mobster" that we see all too often.
I'm not totally sure this reimagining of Penguin sticks the landing but I can't help but love the influences they chose for her: Dietrich, Liza, Divine...
Genderbending does not matter if the character is written well. And this version of the Penguin is written well! VERY WELL! The character fits the Batman's setting "terribly" well.
@@darmok3420why is gender bending not needed when the whole point is to make a personal reimagining of an established character? Her existence does not erase any previous version of the character, people are complaining because they are petulant and call things lazy when they really even aren't due to personal bias.
She truly is heartless and I’ve gotta say she’s one of the best interpretations of the Penguin, I’ve seen. My heart broke when she decided to murder her own child and he was like banging on the door and calling her mama and she still had him killed. Just brutal.
I have to say that a big complaint about Bruce Timm's character design for a long time was that he only knew how to draw one woman with different hairstyles. He has certainly gotten away from that (although i didn't know how much of the art and character design is directly from him).
Yes! That was an aspect that stood out to me in this show, if you looked at the various women they all had different silhouettes. Where are in the BTAS several of the women had very similar silhouettes.
To be fair, almost all of the male superheroes, except maybe the stretchy types like Elongated man, designed by Timm basically share the same buff body shape too.
My one and only complaint with CC Penguin is her name: Oswalda. I get she’s supposed to be a gender swap of Oswald but could they not come up with any other female/feminine name beguiling with O that didn’t involve taping the lazy feminine A-suffex to the name Oswald?
I didn't care for it when I first heard it, but I am used to it now. Upon reflection I think this was done so that people wouldn't just say that this was the REAL Penguin's mother. However, people are still saying that...
@@SerumLake well if we believe in the theory that Ronald will take on the mantle sometime later down in the series, then technically speaking, and only in that specific case, she is the penguin’s mother. Though I don’t really believe it
Every version of the Penguin is unique, My personal favorite is the one from the Gotham Series not only for how ruthless and Crazy he is but also his relationship with The Riddler in that show and how the Duo Stole a lot of moments of the show for me.
I thought it was a weird idea making penguin as woman but I must say that this is one of the most interesting versions of the character and the only problem is that they had so little of her in the show with only the first episode
Honestly love this new take on Penguin. She gives me twisted Lady Dimitrescu vibes from Resident Evil, both are ruthless and enjoy the power they have. Along with being successful jazz singers. Though unlike Lady Dimitrescu, Oswalda has zero care when it comes to her children.
Tf did y’all want her to be called she’s the penguin💀💀💀ofc her name would be Oswalda. That would defeat the whole purpose and they’d just have to make a complete new character.
@@Darth_atrociousall they did was adding an "a" at the and here, now it is a girl name, what a creative decision. Where spider-verse gender swapped their antagonost she was famously nammed Ottoa Octaviusa. Can't wait for female batman being named Brucea, daughter of Thomasa. What a dumb argument
The Penguin has always had a great duality of goofy appearance and quirks vs genuine threat, and I'm glad that carried over here. Great points on how making Penguin a mother added more impact to her killing her son. It kind of reminds me of how real penguins are heavily motivated by family, but their instincts for family often end up smothering or killing their chicks. Also making her a lounge singer is a great aesthetic to add onto her classic coattails
This woman answers the question of what would happen if Lady Dimitrescu became a mob boss. Also, the darker take on the penguin motif is an interesting touch.
I would not be surprised if Ma Barker was one of the sources of inspiration given how Batman was heavily inspired by true crime and classic horror. By the way, Batman himself was also inspired by Dr. Bat from Die Fledermaus. The only difference being that Dr. Bat was an irredeemable monster.
This series seems to really isolate Batman and emphasize that he is one man with no superpowers and as much as he can solve the immediate problem in front of him he cannot singlehandedly prevent collateral damage.
Might be why there is no Racism, Homophobia and Sexism in Caped Crusader This version of Batman would easily die to 50 KKK members let alone THOUSANDS of them
While I was a little confused about the decision to make this Penguin a woman, I overall didn’t mind it that much (though I really hate the name. Seriously? Oswalda? Why not Olivia Cobblepot or even Olga Cobblepot?) I really like how she’s characterized in this show because she seems to have a bit of a “Professor Ratigan complex” as I would put it. A villain who puts on the illusion of class, sophistication, and properness though are more greedy murderous monsters in actuality. (A good example of this type of character would be it’s namesake, Professor Ratigan from The Great Mouse Detective).
I really liked this version of Penguin, because they actually did some stuff with her to make her stand out among most versions of the character beyond just changing her gender, really hope you get to see more of her in future. I wouldn’t be opposed to gender swapped villains.
She feels more like an introduction to gotham and the wider crime scene than a stand alone character. This kinda leads to a interesting introduction but a lack luster ending
I foresaw that Penguin would be female this time, as the promo material only had her in a silhouette. Timm quite notoriously doesn't like to do the same thing twice - so simply making The Penguin female made the most sense. I am loving the heavy attention to mob dynamics they've decided to die into The Penguin this time. I suppose they call her "Penguin" because she is COLD!
My brother threw a hissy fit about it until I pointed out something that both DC AND MARVEL use damn near religiously: The Multiverse Theory. Shut him right up!
One thing that might also be a reference is the possibility of Penguin being a reference to Ma Barker of the Barker-Karpis Gang of the mid to late 30s. The lady inspired similar characters like the mother from the Goonies and Ma Beagle from DuckTales.
That was the first thing that came to mind my mind too, had to go deep to find your comment though. I only wish she had been in a few more episodes and established her relationship with her sons more before she killed one to deepen the shock and impact
Its kinda sad that the younger son was basically like the other Penguins in their youth, small and trying to be seen by the upper crust only to be cut down worst by their mother in some lore Penguin adored/feared
This version (along with Batman: Earth One and Batman: Arkham City) has the potential to be a Complete Monster. I do hope they keep The Penguin a completely irredeemable villain and make her a recurring threat.
Hopefully if they bring Penguin back, they can fully commit to what Gotham tip-toed around and pair her up with the Riddler. I need NygmaPot canon SOMEWHERE.
The Iceberg Lounge being a luxury cruise is a very good idea and I hope it’s one that sticks around in the future. A cruise ship is such a better setting for plot stuff (and is more thematic) than a night club.
6:53 okay i know we joke about it especially in the Arkham games but those men are dead this incarnation of Cobblepot seems like a really neat spin on the character.
So I made a criticism regarding the female Penguin saying "I don't care she's a woman, but why did they make her the tallest MF in the room?" My brother's response was clever: "emperor penguins." Then he started talking about now extinct penguins that were taller than people. Very interesting, didn't know about that. I retract my complaint 😊 (Edit: wrote this before the video but dude mentioned emperor penguins in the video, nice!)
I liked Lady Penguin, as in fact most of the villains, it was unexpected for me that they literally combined two versions of Clay-faced into one, I am very glad that when creating the image of Harley, they did not try to repeat the trope that had already bothered me with the fact that "poor Harley was thrown out by the Joker, but she could not stand it and now does what wants" they came up with something really unique BY THROWING THE JOKER OUT OF HER STORY IN GENERAL, I don't mind if the canon of characters is changed in different cartoons, the main thing for me is that it works within the universe of the cartoon where it happens, and Lady Penguin works, even works very well within this cartoon.
My theory for why they genderswapped Penguin would be because they didn't want their Penguin to be compared to Colin Farrell's. This is purely headcanon for me though since Matt Reeves was one of the producers for this show. Also it's common for characters to be off-limits or altered like the DCAU with the Bat Embargo. Also good choice to bring up the inconsistent design choices for Penguin in media xD
I'm mixed on this version of the penguin but the voice actress does a really good job but i would have loved to see tom kenady voice the penguin again i just wish the penguin was shorter
I like how they changed up the Oswald Cobblepot we're used to, not just changing the gender but also changing how the penguin is usually seen as I like how they made her extremely cruel and uncaring while still keeping something's from the original Penguin from Batman the animated series, this is what Suicide Squad kill a franchise should learn from although we all know they never will.
I quite liked her, because it was interestingly different to have a version of the Penguin who owned the ugliness - by doing the song - rather than being embittered. And having sons was an interesting idea. Although in that respect she was rather like Ma Barker from the Adam West series. Could have used her but I guess they had to go with one of the big guns for the opener. Other than the Joker for a change. And since Ma was only on the tv show I wonder what the rights situation to the character would be.
There was a character that was inspired from Ma Barker, called Ma Mayhem who appeared in Batman Beyond. So... yes, they could have just used her or did what Batman Beyond did.
Not gonna lie, I was thoroughly impressed with the writers on this interpretation. Truthfully I'm not the biggest batman fan, but I've been loving the new series
The Penguin has always been one of my favorites, and I absolutely love this version. My only complaint is that they didn't even TRY with her first name. "Oswalda"?
I agree with you. Having her as a cabaret-singer-crime-boss is great. However, I'd have called her Mavis Siegel. And I'd have had her take on Carmine Falcone.
My first critique of this version of the Penguin is that she lacks the crippling insecurity about appearance and station that made the more well known version interesting/relateable and a more cogent commentary on the plight of those obsessed with external validation. She's just a garden variety psycppath. Which brings me to my second critique. If she is the psycho/sociopath presented, so much so that she would kill a child on the mere suspicion of thwarting her ambition, then she shouldn't have adult children. Surely they would have had the life throttled out of them the first developmental marker they missed or B they brought home. I understand the writers wanted to communicate ruthlessness, but that is too much ruthlessness to make the character beleivable.
I just knew. The moment I found out this interpretation of the character was a woman that the toxic sludge dumping ground known as twitter/X would have something to say about it. Christ, those people need a hobby.
Honestly I like how they adapted everyone, with minor appearances like Waylon Jones in the freakshow and Floyd Lawton being the attempted assassin. They adapted a lot of stuff pretty well.
If Penguin is this evil, I can hardly wait till we get to see even more dastardly foes whom in the comics make Penguin look like a decent guy. Namely the likes of Scarecrow and The Joker.
I’m usually not a big fan of changing or modifying established characters, but as long as it works (and as said, every different version of the character was already dramatically different) I am more than willing to keep an open mind, and I must say… I like most of the changes they made, they work very well in their own unique way.
i support womens rights, and i also support womens wrongs. haven't watched this new batman series, but this new penguin really makes me want to watch it.
Whilst I've no issue with this iteration's concept for The Penguin, I think the execution is off in the following ways: - *The Design:* It's basically the comic book Penguin with eye makeup and lipstick. The story reimagines her role in a way similar to _Gotham_ and the 2022 Matt Reeves film. The character design, on the other hand, seems phoned-in, somewhat uncanny, and grotesque. (And not in a cool way, either.) The name _Oswalda_ is off. The writers actually bothered to create an original take on this character, but the design feels like it was left to 3:30pm on a Friday. - *The Performance:* I feel awful about this, because I really admire Minnie Driver. She gave a technically perfect west-coast US accent, but she missed the point of this character. As written, this Penguin is a spunky, sharp-tongued wise-ass. The detectives begging to be insulted during her act brings to mind stories about Groucho Marx. The voice for this character needed to be way more vaudeville. Maybe a Mae West imitation, as you suggested. Maybe sassy Brooklynese or Queens-speak. Or New England Brahmin. Or, for an added layer of backstory, maybe a Borscht-belt accent.
4:45 You'd think all those chests filled with corpses of her known associates including her son in the vicinity of her ship would be enough to shut down the Penguin's operation right there.
First of all I had no idea they made another batman series, so thanks for telling me, but secondly her design seems really perfect as a Penguin design. He was always a grandiose character, and it feels very fitting that that charisma would get translated to a flashy stage woman. I haven’t seen this show (obviously I just learned about it) but I already really like this version!
I honestly love how the Penguins first appearance puts her in a glamorous light. Especially since most other depictions emphasis the monsterous side of the character from the get go. either in favour. But in the iceberg lounge, she's an fun entertainer and the audience loves her, which makes her actions later on even more horrific and vicious.
Something I like is that this version of Penguin is exactly what every other version wishes they were, a respected member of high society Meanwhile, her two sons are more like the two different versions of Penguin from before, either someone who wishes to be respected amongst Gotham’s elite or someone who is delusional and thinks they are respected when that isn’t the case My one complaint is that Oswalda is a terrible name
Tim Burtons Penguin will for me always be the ultimative movie Penguin. I just watched the first episode of Caped Crusader, and I got to say there is almos no fascination with that character, she I just plain evil killing one of her sons just out of a hint from Bruce Wayne himself. This makes her not only look cruel, but plain stupid, and this makes for the way more lackluster and non-interesting villain. I also feel she is more a Witch than a penguin somehow, so I think they missed the chance to make this really interesting.
The thing is, the writers understood what makes the Penguin the Penguin, and made this character's different gender matter in a germane way. I like it, people have been trying to do something with the Penguin in various adaptations for decades and this is a refreshing direction.
I think personally Penguin works better as male, because his outfit and demeanor has always given me the impression of a guy desperately trying to look like what he sees as high class version of his demographic, when in reality he fits nowhere. Even the ones where he is more of mob boss gives this impression with Arkham’s version earning respect through means that are brutal but not as bad as the other gang leaders, and The Batman (the animated version with the crazy joker design) exemplifying this. But I do think this version does carry some of the aspects of the penguin even if the design doesn’t work as well for the character as it did with the OG in my opinion, like how she has insane influence over Gotham with her resources which keep the other gangs in check, her high class based life style, and the fact she is not afraid to make an example out of anyone her dares defies her, I wouldn’t say it is necessarily the type of Penguin I like, but I like how they committed to gender change in the story with the motherly theme.
Jesus I felt so bad for Arron, he deserved better, and imagine how bad Batman feels after realizing the kid he humiliated was then immediately drowned to death
Honestly I’m mixed on this version of the penguin but I DO like the idea of her as the head of a mob family. Hopefully they’ll lean into that on s2. She was a good first ep villain, looking forward to your breakdown on onomatopoeia
Thing is i cant watch this show, its not on my TV, i cant find anywhere to watch it for free legally, and im too broke to afford paid streaming services, so ill probably just bindge watch your entire series now Tho im not here to complain about how my life sucks or whatever, im here to basically say how much i love your content already, alot of people just speak in a monotone voice without any side commentary and are just direct to the point and dont give you time to linger on anything, making it quite boring You however found a way to make it fun and interesting and worth listening to, its a huge contrast recently i keep finding new youtubers i wished i found alot ealier than i did, and you definetly are one of them, but im glad i atleast got to find you now
Colin Farrel's Penguin is actually Robert DeNiro's Scarface from "The Untouchables" movie. Facial movements, voice and everything. An amazing performance.
I really liked what little we saw of her, I just wish there was more. A scary but matronly mob boss who uses people's perceptions of her to her own advantage is a really fun concept. I honestly wish she had been an end-of-season baddie instead of the first one so she'd have more build up. Ah well.
As mentioned in the overall thoughts video of the show, Capped Crusader only wears the the face of the mid 1900s. So Penguin's "sleeping with fishes" tactic was a cool use of a trope, especially with the character's motherly persona. The underwater cemetery scene reminded me a bit of something H.P. Lovecraft would have written.
My only quibble is the choice of name. Oswalda instead of Astoria--something which would invoke the high-class vibe of the Waldorf-Astoria, a famous luxury hotel in New York--was a missed opportunity. Same opening phoneme without forcing the name parallel in an awkward manner. With that said, I can definitely see where this version of Penguin gives off vibes of someone like Ursula from The Little Mermaid. She's a scheming, lying, manipulative witch and corrupting influence, and honestly despite the incomplete handling of her character I feel like this take on Penguin could go places.
i really like how this penguin is more than just a genderbend, she has her own identity and new cruelty. I also enjoy the fact that unlike other genderbends, shes not overly sexualized, nor is she overly self insertive of those who dont fit in the category of beauty standards or average. Her design has meaning and clear purpose. Ive seen penguin explored in so many other ways, and its why i like the weird joker that has long hair, i forgot which cartoon. It was such a unique depiction outside the arkham joker and his similar variants.
You can listen to our Special Caped Crusader Spoiler Filed Podcasts in this handy playlist: ruclips.net/p/PL-OisFIjerSLRNOcJqP2d-kTRDJOyXhsX&si=4GH-Aa4t97x3qeLC
While you’re there, don’t forget to subscribe to that channel and join the conversations on each episode.
I can't wait to get a video on Harvey. The flip of making the acid side the good type was really good. I love how he went from an ass to at least trying to do the right thing, even if it was too little too late and resulted in his attack. Also might be cool getting a video on this version of Bullock and Flass.
Already watched them all!
I liked the Gotham show Penguin.
@@michaelandreipalon359I knew you would 🫡
@@umbraemilitos pay no attention to the mouth-breather.
It wasn’t that she killed her son, it was how quickly without hesitation she commanded his death and then how she did it, drowning her child in a box. Penguin was thee most ruthless villain in this new Batman series
Especially with that little look of regret she gives after she does it. Her doing it while not really wanting to doesn't make her softer, it just highlights how cruel and evil she is.
the method is what really got to me. just imagine getting locked in a dark, claustrophobic coffin, with barely any room to even wiggle your toes, and the only thing you can hear is the rush of water as you plunge down into the abyss of a lake and the inside of the box fills with water...
god thats a terrible way to die. and all those boxes on the bottom of the lake...
The Iceberg Lounge is a boat, bravo to whoever came up with the idea. Because it basically means the penguin lives on a floating iceberg, which is such an obvious joke I'm kicking myself for noticing it sooner
what else would an iceberg do but float
@@spotty530 Destroy a ship causing the deaths of hundreds and then promptly melt. I’m just an ice cube in a cup idk what icebergs actually do
The Iceberg Lounge. Considering her preferred method of elimination, it sounds almost telling.
Tbf he did already operate out of a boat in Arkham Origins
I would also point out that penguins are famously some of the most caring parents in the animal kingdom, right down to being driven to raising (well, kidnapping) other penguins' babies if theirs is killed or lost. So, Oswalda being so willing to murder her sons is incredibly ironic given her nickname.
that's a great fact, thanks for sharing!
Well that and sometimes if a parental penguin loses their child, their "NEED BABY" hormones are still so juiced up that they will try and steal other chicks. Sometimes accidentally killing them in the chaos. But even the ones that don't get killed tend to be abandoned soon after once the baby hormones cool off.
If anything penguin needed a redesign anyway
@@SerumLake if I may be honest? I didn't give much thought to the whole outrage or uproar of making The Penguin a woman, I just know that if I was asked to come up with a new iteration of the character I would've gone with a Baby Herman situation from Who Framed Roger Rabbit, maybe explore the more negative aspects of childish behavior that are rarely addressed in comic book shows, maybe even contrast it with Bruce's/Batman's character traits, I will harp on the fact that Bruce Timm and co settled on a name like Oswalda though, I expected something a bit more creative than that.
Didn't the penguin's parent also try to kill him as well?
Was NOT expecting her to kill her kid by stuffing him in a box and dropping the box in the sea. Really reminded me of the origin of the golden age Spectre
Speaking of DC's spirit of vengeance, did you happen to notice that one of the GCPD's recurring officers for the first half of the series is a redheaded man named Corrigan?
@@ThenewTchannelnah, he actually based on a minor character that is a corrupt police, not Spectre
@@ngrjordi2352 are you sure you aren't thinking of Flass?
@@ThenewTchannel Nono he's right, in Gotham Central's comics there's a corrupt detective named corrigan
That was so gangster, but I can't get over her taking an op at her word
I like how they also flipped Penguin's personality.
The traditional Penguin has a lot of resentment about how his family is looked down upon by other rich families and he really wants to be a legitimate member of high society but he's awkward around them. This Penguin is very comfortable in high society and mingles well with them, but she still keeps those illicit dealings like the traditional Penguin.
A lot of previous versions of the Penguin also had overbearing mothers. This version is an awful mother who killed her own son.
I feel quite the opposite to be honest, penguin lives on the fringes of gotham's high society, putting on a show for the rich folk on her boat but ultimatly in public she's just a stylish singular club owner. A relatively successfull business woman doing Jessica Rabbit impression. Batman makes a point about how she's hiding in plain sight, having acess to all the rich and powerfull of Gotham while not actually being considered one of them. This is something show almost doesn't go into but it really makes for the most key factor in penguin for me. She wants to be one of the elites of high society but there's a barrier keeping her from truly belonging, and she wails and scratches at that barrier bringing out the worst of herself out of spite. Thorne plays on that insecurity of her and pits her against her sons, letting penguin completely ruin her upstart of an empire without having to lift a finger. Letting her completely humiliate herself. That is top penguin for me but might have just imagined it.
@@karolchruzik1919Nah Thorne was playing her, that's why he implied that it was the loyal son and not the rat, he knew that she wouldn't let that betrayal stand but even if she let him live it could be the start of her empire imploding. This is why he didnt help out the rat either, he doesn't want a traitor on his side, but knowing that she's willing to kill her sons by this point he knows that the kid will either blab to the cops for protection or he'll die and Thorne will have dealt Penguin 2 mortal blows to her empire in one fell swoop, either scenario being a massive boon.
Mind you he could've forced the kid to blab to the cops under his protection but he doesnt trust the kid so he probably didn't consider that an option
Guys every single penguin is different actually mention which version of the penguin you are talking about they don't have the same backstory or personality or even looks
Some have loving parents some don't
And also saying "traditional" doesn't count because none of them are officially called the traditional penguin because there isn't a traditional penguin, again that implies that they share qualities and none of the Penguins do some of them are raised Rich some of them are killers some of them aren't Killers some of them were homeless
They nailed the duality you need with the penguin. She goes from giving a musical number and rubbing shoulders at a party to locking her son in a trunk and tossing him into the ocean to drown. Like I feel the true essence of the Penguin, at least the best versions, are this person who puts on an air of sophistication, but can then instantly switch to a cold murderer in a second.
My problem with Oswalda is that it feels like they rushed her. I think it would have been fun if she was a recurring character as part of the mob subplots so we could really ramp up to how vicious she was. Right now it feels like they started at 11 and now have nowhere else to go.
Also there was all that talk about a mob power vacuum that never really seemed to materialize. Makes me think this was a pilot and a lot of the big ideas the creators wanted to include had to be cut out due to not being given as many episodes as originally planned.
Edit: Guys I know she's coming back. I'm just saying that the introduction of a character is important and I feel like her intro could have been handled better.
I think there was no need for her and Rupert Thorne to both stick around. Penguin is viscious and loud while Thorne is quiet and subtle. They chose quiet and subtle.
Hopefully she’ll get more time in a second season
@@matthewhecht9257and perhaps that’s why we won’t see Thorne very much of the future. Like you said he’s subtle, behind the shadows like Batman with more experience hiding his activities and blood money.
since she isnt killed by the cops like Fire Bug or Two Face, she has a chance to appear again.
2 face might make a comeback, it’d be weird for him to be gone so soon.
Regardless of how people feel about a gender-swapped Penguin, I did like how she still acted like the Penguin. She was just as cold and ruthless as the character usually is, as we literally see her kill her own son without a shred of remorse or not even a tear; that alone is COLD ASF! It's also refreshing to see a Penguin that actually belonged in high society for once and enjoys it.
I hate how everyone calling BCC "woke" just because Penguin is a woman and the Gordons are black. Because god forbid black people exist. 🙄
If anything, I think being a woman makes Penguin a lot more interesting. Not only is she a ruthless monster who didn't even hesitate to merk her own kid, but unlike every other female Batman villain, she is not conventionally attractive. So she can't disarm men by using se× appeal like Harley, Ivy, or Catwoman would. Instead she's clawed her way to the top by sheer determination, intelligence, and willingness to do whatever it takes to win, even if it means throwing her morals out the window....or into the ocean, so to speak.
@@WobblesandBean my main problem with the show is that its set in the 1940s but they don't really do much with it. there's none of the social issues that would have been prevalent at the time. they don't mention world issues to any capacity (that i know of) its just a 40s coat of paint. that and i think the animation is subpar at times
@@WobblesandBean Honestly every single woman in this show is hot as hell, including Oswalda, imo. But she was not designed to be conventionally attractive to straight dudes, which makes her incredibly unique.
@@twideslauriers7875 Agreed. I personally think she's a good-looking woman. And her waist is killer (pun intended). But ultimately, she's still a fantastic villain.
@@WobblesandBeanGordon was black in The Batman show and that’s my favorite version of Gordon, so I have no idea why people would complain about him being black. Seems weird.
Serum Lake: "This version of Penguin might be the most ruthless one yet."
Me: "C'mon, how bad could she possibly be when compared to the Arkham and Gotham versions?"
Serum Lake: "She murders he own son on the off chance he's a traitor, and there is a literal graveyard of corpses beneath her boat."
Me: "Oh, that's... that's pretty bad."
Thank you for mentioning *Gotham* ^^ while our dear Serum was listing the various Penguins, I kept expecting to hear =>
"and of course, Robin Lord Taylor, one of the 2 break-out stars from the show *Gotham* "
But nothing for us Gothamites 😢
[if anyone is wondering, I have Cameron Monaghan as Mr J for the breat out moment... there wasn't much publicity about the show, but when _"The Blind Fortune Teller"_ came out, and *that* one scene at the GCPD with Jérôme Valeska, his blind dad, Jim Gordon & Leslie Thomkins hit RUclips, it went "2015 viral" and Joker fans reaaaaally wanted to see more of this guy.]
... damn, almost a decade already?
Which reminds me, the trailer and charas announced for Matt Reeves *"The Penguin"* makes me wonder how much that show (just one more month till first episode airs, gettin' closer \o/) will look like Robin Lord Taylor's Oswald's ascension to power, and his constant fight to _remain_ in power.
I loved Oz in Reeves' "The Batman" so I'm not worried.
I'm sure it will be good, just a tad strange that 2 whole live action shows would specifically depict Oswald Cobblepot's rise in Gotham City.
Sure, in *Gotham* he's not the "evil protagonist", but during season 1, when they didn't know exactly which direction to take the show on, we spend as much time with Bruce Wayne that we do with Oswald, watching both of them struggle with their respective issues, fighting uphill battles one after the other...
Bruce had Alfred and Selina Kyle
Oswald has Gertrude (and Edward... and later Elijah Van Dahl Edward... then Edward... you decide if I'm talking about the dog that mauled Nyssa Al Ghul or not.)
Ok, thesis over, nice video Serum, as usual!
Keep up the good work, it's nice to see reviews of this show that aren't just bashing-fests
RF
@@randallflagg3700 that's not entirely true, that Robin Lord Taylor's Penguin was left out. While he wasn't mentioned by name, a clip of him is shown at 1:38 when Serum points out that almost every Penguin has one thing in common: being ruthless, calculating killers.
Hot take, but when it comes to franchises like Batman that have been adapted a billion times, sometimes changing things just for the sake of it is a nice way of keeping things fresh. This show seems to be inverting a lot about the Batman mythos and I respect that (especially with how badly some fans deal with change)
Change isn't bad, and the people who hate this change probably think Penguin will be a woman forever after this lmao.
Exactly. Take, as an example, Mr. Freeze. Prior to Batman; the animated Series, Mr. Freeze had been a low tier 2 villain who wasn't all that notable. At the time the show premiered, I do belive Freeze was actually dead, having been 'iced' by the Joker. He was a generic mad scientist type. Not interesting. They made him sympathetic in the series and it instantly made Freeze a tier 1 fan favorite.
I appreciate you mentioning the impact of a mother killing their child as a significant reason why this version works. This may not be a definitive version of Penguin, but its a very good one with thought put into the story, and they do effectively in just 10 minutes of screen time.
I’ll be interested to see how she’s used in the future. There are lots of possibilities here.
@@SerumLake I really hope she comes back in Season Two. I wish her gang war with Rupert Thorne could have been fleshed out in two or three episodes, but understand why that wasn't possible with only 10 episodes.
I wouldn't trade the Gentlemen Ghost or Natalia Night episodes for it. I think exploring Linton Midnight's deal later will have payoff and the traveling carnival was a good tie-in to the Dent/Thorne subplot, plus Robin referential fanservice.
@@wallerasScathing criticism
@@wallerasWhat's your deal?
@@walleras ...I think you're mistaking Caped Crusader for Homeworld 3 and The Acolyte.
“Twilight Penguin,” C’mon Serum Lake, Don’t be afraid to call the telltale penguin by what he’s actually known as, “CobbleHOT”
Another observation (and I'm not sure if this means anything): it's ironic that the Penguin would refer to Aaron - the offspring she kills - as her favorite since judging by his appearance, he likely takes after his noticeably absent father; you would think for that reason that she would be disgusted at the sight of him and partial to the one who bears a stronger resemblance to her, yet we see the opposite to be the case.
She must've liked his father
I would assume she probably had sons with different men and killed them when they were done
I figured Aaron was the favorite because he simply always did as he was told. He is straight-up a mama's boy and people pleaser.
@@SerumLake what if she just kidnaps orphans?
Honestly i found that they actually did something that is done with a lot of Penguins; she’s underestimated. Not because of size or appearance but because of her gender.
And she is actually fairly like IRL Penguins. Real ones DO kill their own off spring of needed
Are IRL penguins not known to be caring parents?
Whoa, it's as if, much like there is shitty humans, there are shitty penguins
@@TFoxhound The comment's phrasing had me infer it as saying that is the norm, rather than an exception.
They are. But some aren’t
Hi, zoologist here. That's not true at all. Penguins are excellent parents, in fact they're so strongly bonded to their offspring that if they lose a chick, they will grieve terribly, and the distraught mother might even try to steal another penguin's chick because she is so desperate to have her baby back.
You're getting penguins confused with storks, and possibly loons. Storks are notorious for this, they will typically lay 3-4 eggs but only raise 1-2 chicks. They just sort of let their babies play Battle Royale. Loons are even worse, they'll merk their baby themselves if they sense there aren't enough fish to feed their entire clutch of loonlets.
I have to admit that at first, I was without words, but when I saw how she was like, I was absolutely pleased with how she really is the Penguin. Not just a genderbend. She IS the Penguin in all the ways that matter. All I can say as that THIS is why I save my judgements for seeing the character in action.
No that's a Ciswoman Penguin.
@jamesmorales4735 My man, that is a woman
Like in this universes context she's a woman, you're being transphbic for someone that isn't even trans lmao.
@@jamesmorales4735 ...I thought this Penguin was just a much older woman?
U being _serious?_
@@jamesmorales4735 Dawg chill it’s just one episode.
to be perfectly honest, people being mad about a genderswapped penguin need to go onto the dc wikia, type the name of any character, and see just how many wild and weird variations there are of any one character.
did you guys know there was a female two-face in the past? yup. catwoman: guardian of gotham. not to say it was GOOD. no. but people need to realize: elseworlds and projects outside the main comic continuity are like.... simpsons treehouse of horror episodes. the writers can tell weird and out-there stories not bound by limitation.
whether they are good or bad stories though is another matter entirely.
4:37 things like that always make extremely angry as someone who grew up with a mentally abusive mom, people would always defend her because "she's your mother". The double standard is so frustrating. Women can be abusive too! Dads should get more respect and love from society.
I had a mentally and physically abusive mom, myself! The New Penguin reminded me of her.
@@darlalathan6143 that sucks ass man :(
Oh geez… please tell me that you’re out of there and have cut her off, I’m so so sorry that you went through something like that… I just hope that you know whatever reason she abused you was never your fault, you deserve better, and I hope where ever you are you are somewhere safe, and you are happy😢
@@mistyshadow9649 thanks a lot, that really means so much to me. you're a sweetie
Here's my adaptation rule: the FIRST time a character is adapted from their original medium, you should try to stick as close to the source material as possible. AFTER that, do whatever you want. We've had original comic-accurate Penguin on TV for decades now, so Oswalda works just fine for me.
Same goes for Transformers characters, particularly Optimus and Megatron. Believe me, their Beast Wars and Animated iterations are loads better than their G1 cartoon iterations for many reasons.
I've adapted The Mad Hatter 8 times now.
My favorite method for adapting is taking elements I enjoy/feel aren't fully expanded on and running with it while adding my own bits.
In my newest adaptation, I'm exploring how growing up in Arkham Asylum would affect him (as that's a part of one of his origins), and I've made his father Professor Pyg (because somebody said his dad in that origin kinda looks like him). I've added his desire for company, and changed it to a platonic yearning for his missing siblings (one of whom is Clock King, as they were brothers in a comic for the 1966 show).
@@michaelandreipalon359I did enjoy Optimus primal in beast wars. Not so much in the follow up beast machines.
To what extent can you change a character before it’s no longer the same character is an interesting question to me.
@MrMelonsz well changing sex or race isn't it for me. You cpukd make the joker a woman and still have him be the joker if his mentality, morality, and motivations remain the same. Jared let's joker wad a baseline white man yes but he didn't FEEL like the joker, he felt like a pretender.
1:06 yo but how could we forget about GOTHAM‘S penguin??? that was probably one of the most “out there” variations we’ve seen (and one of the best)
The filicide aspect of this version of the Penguin is really interesting, considering the fact that she's adopted the mantle of an animal known for great parenting. I honestly think this may be my favorite incarnation of the character, since the series creators have really leaned into creative ways to flesh her out in a way that distinguishes her from just being another version of "mobster" that we see all too often.
I'm not totally sure this reimagining of Penguin sticks the landing but I can't help but love the influences they chose for her: Dietrich, Liza, Divine...
Genderbending does not matter if the character is written well. And this version of the Penguin is written well! VERY WELL! The character fits the Batman's setting "terribly" well.
Nor is it needed, it's just lazy.
A mother killing her child is more fucked up than a father doing it
@@darmok3420why is gender bending not needed when the whole point is to make a personal reimagining of an established character?
Her existence does not erase any previous version of the character, people are complaining because they are petulant and call things lazy when they really even aren't due to personal bias.
She truly is heartless and I’ve gotta say she’s one of the best interpretations of the Penguin, I’ve seen. My heart broke when she decided to murder her own child and he was like banging on the door and calling her mama and she still had him killed. Just brutal.
And the fact that she looked sort of sad about it. She looked sort of regretful. And yet it didn't matter, she still did it
I have to say that a big complaint about Bruce Timm's character design for a long time was that he only knew how to draw one woman with different hairstyles. He has certainly gotten away from that (although i didn't know how much of the art and character design is directly from him).
Yes! That was an aspect that stood out to me in this show, if you looked at the various women they all had different silhouettes. Where are in the BTAS several of the women had very similar silhouettes.
To be fair, almost all of the male superheroes, except maybe the stretchy types like Elongated man, designed by Timm basically share the same buff body shape too.
My one and only complaint with CC Penguin is her name: Oswalda.
I get she’s supposed to be a gender swap of Oswald but could they not come up with any other female/feminine name beguiling with O that didn’t involve taping the lazy feminine A-suffex to the name Oswald?
I didn't care for it when I first heard it, but I am used to it now. Upon reflection I think this was done so that people wouldn't just say that this was the REAL Penguin's mother. However, people are still saying that...
@@SerumLake well if we believe in the theory that Ronald will take on the mantle sometime later down in the series, then technically speaking, and only in that specific case, she is the penguin’s mother. Though I don’t really believe it
Honestly, just keep her name as Oswald. It would slay
Ophelia Cobblepot? I can't think of any female names that start with O haha
@@RacingSnails64 that also works
“I don’t use Twitter anymore, and no I will never call it X”
That statement alone gives it an instant like.
Every version of the Penguin is unique, My personal favorite is the one from the Gotham Series not only for how ruthless and Crazy he is but also his relationship with The Riddler in that show and how the Duo Stole a lot of moments of the show for me.
I thought it was a weird idea making penguin as woman but I must say that this is one of the most interesting versions of the character and the only problem is that they had so little of her in the show with only the first episode
Honestly love this new take on Penguin. She gives me twisted Lady Dimitrescu vibes from Resident Evil, both are ruthless and enjoy the power they have. Along with being successful jazz singers. Though unlike Lady Dimitrescu, Oswalda has zero care when it comes to her children.
I had the same thought.
Funny, considering Lady Dimitrescu is a LITERAL monster XD
She's such a rad Penguin in her episode but oh boy that name is not winning me over lol
Fr. Idk how that was the best they could come up with. Ophelia? Olivia?
This franchise gave us Edward Nygma and Harleen Quinze, Penelope Guinevere was right there...
Tf did y’all want her to be called she’s the penguin💀💀💀ofc her name would be Oswalda. That would defeat the whole purpose and they’d just have to make a complete new character.
Yeah the outcry I saw most of was people not vining with her name and I get it
@@Darth_atrociousall they did was adding an "a" at the and here, now it is a girl name, what a creative decision.
Where spider-verse gender swapped their antagonost she was famously nammed Ottoa Octaviusa.
Can't wait for female batman being named Brucea, daughter of Thomasa.
What a dumb argument
The Penguin has always had a great duality of goofy appearance and quirks vs genuine threat, and I'm glad that carried over here. Great points on how making Penguin a mother added more impact to her killing her son. It kind of reminds me of how real penguins are heavily motivated by family, but their instincts for family often end up smothering or killing their chicks.
Also making her a lounge singer is a great aesthetic to add onto her classic coattails
This woman answers the question of what would happen if Lady Dimitrescu became a mob boss.
Also, the darker take on the penguin motif is an interesting touch.
She also reminds me of Disney's Queen of Hearts and Miss Trunchbull, as well as Ma Barker the ruthless crime matriarch.
I would not be surprised if Ma Barker was one of the sources of inspiration given how Batman was heavily inspired by true crime and classic horror.
By the way, Batman himself was also inspired by Dr. Bat from Die Fledermaus. The only difference being that Dr. Bat was an irredeemable monster.
When I saw that graveyard under the water, I got chills.
This series seems to really isolate Batman and emphasize that he is one man with no superpowers and as much as he can solve the immediate problem in front of him he cannot singlehandedly prevent collateral damage.
Might be why there is no Racism, Homophobia and Sexism in Caped Crusader
This version of Batman would easily die to 50 KKK members let alone THOUSANDS of them
4:14 Jesus and the name penguin for the animal they are very caring but Oswald decides to chuck one of her sons in a casket and into the ocean
While I was a little confused about the decision to make this Penguin a woman, I overall didn’t mind it that much (though I really hate the name. Seriously? Oswalda? Why not Olivia Cobblepot or even Olga Cobblepot?) I really like how she’s characterized in this show because she seems to have a bit of a “Professor Ratigan complex” as I would put it. A villain who puts on the illusion of class, sophistication, and properness though are more greedy murderous monsters in actuality. (A good example of this type of character would be it’s namesake, Professor Ratigan from The Great Mouse Detective).
I assumed in this version that Oswalda is more of a stage name
What kind of a name is Oswalda
Olga would've been a much better name
@@venomfan2020 THAT’S WHAT I’M SAYING!
The Professor Ratigan comparison works really well, they're both very similar characters when you explain it like that!
@@venomfan2020what the fuck is olga
I really liked this version of Penguin, because they actually did some stuff with her to make her stand out among most versions of the character beyond just changing her gender, really hope you get to see more of her in future. I wouldn’t be opposed to gender swapped villains.
She feels more like an introduction to gotham and the wider crime scene than a stand alone character.
This kinda leads to a interesting introduction but a lack luster ending
I foresaw that Penguin would be female this time, as the promo material only had her in a silhouette. Timm quite notoriously doesn't like to do the same thing twice - so simply making The Penguin female made the most sense. I am loving the heavy attention to mob dynamics they've decided to die into The Penguin this time. I suppose they call her "Penguin" because she is COLD!
Very good observation
My brother threw a hissy fit about it until I pointed out something that both DC AND MARVEL use damn near religiously: The Multiverse Theory. Shut him right up!
Oswalda in my opinion is still an ugly ass name
One thing that might also be a reference is the possibility of Penguin being a reference to Ma Barker of the Barker-Karpis Gang of the mid to late 30s. The lady inspired similar characters like the mother from the Goonies and Ma Beagle from DuckTales.
Great observation. Now that you mention it I have a vague memory of a similar character in the 66 Batman show…
@@SerumLakeI believe that was Shelly Winters playing Ma Parker in Batman 66
That was the first thing that came to mind my mind too, had to go deep to find your comment though. I only wish she had been in a few more episodes and established her relationship with her sons more before she killed one to deepen the shock and impact
Ironically, even Ma Barker never killed her own kids as ruthless as she was.
Its kinda sad that the younger son was basically like the other Penguins in their youth, small and trying to be seen by the upper crust only to be cut down worst by their mother in some lore Penguin adored/feared
This version (along with Batman: Earth One and Batman: Arkham City) has the potential to be a Complete Monster. I do hope they keep The Penguin a completely irredeemable villain and make her a recurring threat.
Yeah. Honestly, she's more interesting than most versions of the male Penquin.
Scary too
The male versions would SHIT THEIR PANTS
Hopefully if they bring Penguin back, they can fully commit to what Gotham tip-toed around and pair her up with the Riddler. I need NygmaPot canon SOMEWHERE.
As Batman once said: "the Hammer of Justice is unisex"
The Iceberg Lounge being a luxury cruise is a very good idea and I hope it’s one that sticks around in the future. A cruise ship is such a better setting for plot stuff (and is more thematic) than a night club.
6:53 okay i know we joke about it especially in the Arkham games but those men are dead
this incarnation of Cobblepot seems like a really neat spin on the character.
For the people who love to claim they never get offended over everything they sure do get offended over everything.
They're hypocrites.
Stick to the source material is all I ask, and instead they screw it up!
@@theoneandonlyufomini-bot
And then you equate it to fucking Velma all for one tiny screw up.
Oh yeah, Batman totally hit those guys with a car.
They are jaywalking.
LOL yeah saw that
I guess Batman's 'no killing' policy doesn't extend to vehicular manslaughter
Cripple ain't dead so...
So I made a criticism regarding the female Penguin saying "I don't care she's a woman, but why did they make her the tallest MF in the room?"
My brother's response was clever: "emperor penguins." Then he started talking about now extinct penguins that were taller than people. Very interesting, didn't know about that.
I retract my complaint 😊
(Edit: wrote this before the video but dude mentioned emperor penguins in the video, nice!)
Still wild people got obsessed over Oswalda being a woman and not being named fucking Oswalda
I liked Lady Penguin, as in fact most of the villains, it was unexpected for me that they literally combined two versions of Clay-faced into one, I am very glad that when creating the image of Harley, they did not try to repeat the trope that had already bothered me with the fact that "poor Harley was thrown out by the Joker, but she could not stand it and now does what wants" they came up with something really unique BY THROWING THE JOKER OUT OF HER STORY IN GENERAL, I don't mind if the canon of characters is changed in different cartoons, the main thing for me is that it works within the universe of the cartoon where it happens, and Lady Penguin works, even works very well within this cartoon.
My theory for why they genderswapped Penguin would be because they didn't want their Penguin to be compared to Colin Farrell's. This is purely headcanon for me though since Matt Reeves was one of the producers for this show. Also it's common for characters to be off-limits or altered like the DCAU with the Bat Embargo.
Also good choice to bring up the inconsistent design choices for Penguin in media xD
I cannot get over her name being fucking OSWALDA. YOU COULDN'T GIVE HER A BETTER NAME
Otherwise fans would say that she is just the sister or mother of the 'true' Penguin that it hasn't been revealed yet
although people are still doing that... sigh.
Fr. The name Oswin was RIGHT THERE.
Oswalda is a real name though.
Ophelia Cobblepot woulda been nice 2
They were really cooking with thus redesign imo
I'm mixed on this version of the penguin but the voice actress does a really good job but i would have loved to see tom kenady voice the penguin again i just wish the penguin was shorter
Right? Why is she like, seven feet tall?!
@@GPS_DS emperor penguins are very tall birds. Plus there are some prehistoric penguins which would tower over even Oslwalda herself.
Ah, nice to see someone who appreciates Tom Kenny's take on The Batman 2004.
@@michaelandreipalon359Tom Kenny as the penguin is such good casting
I like how they changed up the Oswald Cobblepot we're used to, not just changing the gender but also changing how the penguin is usually seen as I like how they made her extremely cruel and uncaring while still keeping something's from the original Penguin from Batman the animated series, this is what Suicide Squad kill a franchise should learn from although we all know they never will.
I quite liked her, because it was interestingly different to have a version of the Penguin who owned the ugliness - by doing the song - rather than being embittered. And having sons was an interesting idea. Although in that respect she was rather like Ma Barker from the Adam West series. Could have used her but I guess they had to go with one of the big guns for the opener. Other than the Joker for a change. And since Ma was only on the tv show I wonder what the rights situation to the character would be.
There was a character that was inspired from Ma Barker, called Ma Mayhem who appeared in Batman Beyond. So... yes, they could have just used her or did what Batman Beyond did.
Not gonna lie, I was thoroughly impressed with the writers on this interpretation. Truthfully I'm not the biggest batman fan, but I've been loving the new series
She looks like the principal from matilda. 😂
The Penguin has always been one of my favorites, and I absolutely love this version.
My only complaint is that they didn't even TRY with her first name. "Oswalda"?
I agree with you. Having her as a cabaret-singer-crime-boss is great. However, I'd have called her Mavis Siegel. And I'd have had her take on Carmine Falcone.
Lady Dimitre--I mean, the new Penguin is pretty cool imo...
I feel like this version of The Penguin is a redemption for BTAS Penguin
This version is a lil weird but I'm cool with it, Minnie Driver did an amazing job by voicing the penguin
My first critique of this version of the Penguin is that she lacks the crippling insecurity about appearance and station that made the more well known version interesting/relateable and a more cogent commentary on the plight of those obsessed with external validation. She's just a garden variety psycppath. Which brings me to my second critique. If she is the psycho/sociopath presented, so much so that she would kill a child on the mere suspicion of thwarting her ambition, then she shouldn't have adult children. Surely they would have had the life throttled out of them the first developmental marker they missed or B they brought home. I understand the writers wanted to communicate ruthlessness, but that is too much ruthlessness to make the character beleivable.
This design fits the penguin so much better, matches well with the personality
I just knew. The moment I found out this interpretation of the character was a woman that the toxic sludge dumping ground known as twitter/X would have something to say about it.
Christ, those people need a hobby.
That seafloor graveyard is pretty haunting and effective.
Honestly I like how they adapted everyone, with minor appearances like Waylon Jones in the freakshow and Floyd Lawton being the attempted assassin. They adapted a lot of stuff pretty well.
If Penguin is this evil, I can hardly wait till we get to see even more dastardly foes whom in the comics make Penguin look like a decent guy. Namely the likes of Scarecrow and The Joker.
Ironically Scarecrow might be greyer since he used to study with Harley
This version of the Joker is just a plain mass terrorist
@@christiandauz3742 although Scarecrow is known for being manipulative, he could have been hiding his intentions for his own gain.
I’m usually not a big fan of changing or modifying established characters, but as long as it works (and as said, every different version of the character was already dramatically different) I am more than willing to keep an open mind, and I must say… I like most of the changes they made, they work very well in their own unique way.
i support womens rights, and i also support womens wrongs. haven't watched this new batman series, but this new penguin really makes me want to watch it.
Whilst I've no issue with this iteration's concept for The Penguin, I think the execution is off in the following ways:
- *The Design:* It's basically the comic book Penguin with eye makeup and lipstick. The story reimagines her role in a way similar to _Gotham_ and the 2022 Matt Reeves film. The character design, on the other hand, seems phoned-in, somewhat uncanny, and grotesque. (And not in a cool way, either.) The name _Oswalda_ is off. The writers actually bothered to create an original take on this character, but the design feels like it was left to 3:30pm on a Friday.
- *The Performance:* I feel awful about this, because I really admire Minnie Driver. She gave a technically perfect west-coast US accent, but she missed the point of this character. As written, this Penguin is a spunky, sharp-tongued wise-ass. The detectives begging to be insulted during her act brings to mind stories about Groucho Marx. The voice for this character needed to be way more vaudeville. Maybe a Mae West imitation, as you suggested. Maybe sassy Brooklynese or Queens-speak. Or New England Brahmin. Or, for an added layer of backstory, maybe a Borscht-belt accent.
Now that I've had the time to see Oswalda's portrayal; I am 100% satisfied with her portrayal.
4:45 You'd think all those chests filled with corpses of her known associates including her son in the vicinity of her ship would be enough to shut down the Penguin's operation right there.
First of all I had no idea they made another batman series, so thanks for telling me, but secondly her design seems really perfect as a Penguin design. He was always a grandiose character, and it feels very fitting that that charisma would get translated to a flashy stage woman. I haven’t seen this show (obviously I just learned about it) but I already really like this version!
I honestly love how the Penguins first appearance puts her in a glamorous light. Especially since most other depictions emphasis the monsterous side of the character from the get go. either in favour. But in the iceberg lounge, she's an fun entertainer and the audience loves her, which makes her actions later on even more horrific and vicious.
Something I like is that this version of Penguin is exactly what every other version wishes they were, a respected member of high society
Meanwhile, her two sons are more like the two different versions of Penguin from before, either someone who wishes to be respected amongst Gotham’s elite or someone who is delusional and thinks they are respected when that isn’t the case
My one complaint is that Oswalda is a terrible name
Tim Burtons Penguin will for me always be the ultimative movie Penguin. I just watched the first episode of Caped Crusader, and I got to say there is almos no fascination with that character, she I just plain evil killing one of her sons just out of a hint from Bruce Wayne himself. This makes her not only look cruel, but plain stupid, and this makes for the way more lackluster and non-interesting villain. I also feel she is more a Witch than a penguin somehow, so I think they missed the chance to make this really interesting.
The sons are clearly designed on Don Jr and Eric right down to that gummy smile.
The fact that she is willing to kill her own children is giving me strong Big Mom vibes! Mmmmaybe the nose, and her size, as well.
First Doctor Octopus now The Penguin.
And it worked every time. No complaints from me.
@@DoctorMysterio15they're both equally serving
Funfact:The 2004 penguin was based on a rock hopper penguin
The thing is, the writers understood what makes the Penguin the Penguin, and made this character's different gender matter in a germane way. I like it, people have been trying to do something with the Penguin in various adaptations for decades and this is a refreshing direction.
For some reason, this female version of The Penguin reminds me of Lady Dimitrescu from Resident Evil Village.
I think personally Penguin works better as male, because his outfit and demeanor has always given me the impression of a guy desperately trying to look like what he sees as high class version of his demographic, when in reality he fits nowhere.
Even the ones where he is more of mob boss gives this impression with Arkham’s version earning respect through means that are brutal but not as bad as the other gang leaders, and The Batman (the animated version with the crazy joker design) exemplifying this.
But I do think this version does carry some of the aspects of the penguin even if the design doesn’t work as well for the character as it did with the OG in my opinion, like how she has insane influence over Gotham with her resources which keep the other gangs in check, her high class based life style, and the fact she is not afraid to make an example out of anyone her dares defies her, I wouldn’t say it is necessarily the type of Penguin I like, but I like how they committed to gender change in the story with the motherly theme.
Jesus I felt so bad for Arron, he deserved better, and imagine how bad Batman feels after realizing the kid he humiliated was then immediately drowned to death
Honestly I’m mixed on this version of the penguin but I DO like the idea of her as the head of a mob family. Hopefully they’ll lean into that on s2. She was a good first ep villain, looking forward to your breakdown on onomatopoeia
Thing is i cant watch this show, its not on my TV, i cant find anywhere to watch it for free legally, and im too broke to afford paid streaming services, so ill probably just bindge watch your entire series now
Tho im not here to complain about how my life sucks or whatever, im here to basically say how much i love your content already, alot of people just speak in a monotone voice without any side commentary and are just direct to the point and dont give you time to linger on anything, making it quite boring
You however found a way to make it fun and interesting and worth listening to, its a huge contrast
recently i keep finding new youtubers i wished i found alot ealier than i did, and you definetly are one of them, but im glad i atleast got to find you now
Colin Farrel's Penguin is actually Robert DeNiro's Scarface from "The Untouchables" movie. Facial movements, voice and everything. An amazing performance.
Gotta love that movie. Sure, DeNiro doesn't look like Al Capone, but he seems to have nailed the audacity of the man.
I actually kinda hate how pretty they made Penguin… like, why are animators so afraid to make ugly/disfigured
Lady characters?
Someone on the show has evidentially played a lot of Resident Evil 8.
CoD Zombies was inspired by the Last Stand Flash Game
Is it just me or does the penguins sons look like Don Junior and Eric Trump?
100%
Not using twitter is saving you years of your life. Congratulations
Not using a ridiculous website means nothing. Your types always wanna feel special for the most meager of acts and it shows.
I really liked what little we saw of her, I just wish there was more. A scary but matronly mob boss who uses people's perceptions of her to her own advantage is a really fun concept. I honestly wish she had been an end-of-season baddie instead of the first one so she'd have more build up. Ah well.
Thorne is an excellent villain
As mentioned in the overall thoughts video of the show, Capped Crusader only wears the the face of the mid 1900s. So Penguin's "sleeping with fishes" tactic was a cool use of a trope, especially with the character's motherly persona. The underwater cemetery scene reminded me a bit of something H.P. Lovecraft would have written.
i was skeptical about the change until I saw her character design, its perfect.
My only quibble is the choice of name. Oswalda instead of Astoria--something which would invoke the high-class vibe of the Waldorf-Astoria, a famous luxury hotel in New York--was a missed opportunity. Same opening phoneme without forcing the name parallel in an awkward manner.
With that said, I can definitely see where this version of Penguin gives off vibes of someone like Ursula from The Little Mermaid. She's a scheming, lying, manipulative witch and corrupting influence, and honestly despite the incomplete handling of her character I feel like this take on Penguin could go places.
i really like how this penguin is more than just a genderbend, she has her own identity and new cruelty. I also enjoy the fact that unlike other genderbends, shes not overly sexualized, nor is she overly self insertive of those who dont fit in the category of beauty standards or average. Her design has meaning and clear purpose.
Ive seen penguin explored in so many other ways, and its why i like the weird joker that has long hair, i forgot which cartoon. It was such a unique depiction outside the arkham joker and his similar variants.
It's already bad enough that they Genderbend Mr Freeze in Suicide Squad Kill the Justice league, But Penguin?