I have and it terrifies me every time. I was like this too but you need to learn the hard lessons. When I made my thesis film in grad school, it was so bad my professors told me to re shoot the whole film. From top to bottom it was all over the place. I was so embrassed by my film, that I took a two year hiatus. I was too scared to direct another film because of my epic failure. I felt I wasn't good enough to be a filmmaker. Even though I was part of other people''s productions, I didn't have the courage to direct another film. Over the course of two years, I realized my mistakes. Bad writing, bad shooting, bad directions, NO Planning. Being a filmmaker takes hard work, practice and patience. And also humility. Don't go trying to be the next great director or cinematographer or anything. Just focus on the task at hand. One step at a time. You create films not for the glory, or just to say I am a filmmaker, but for the love of cinema and the need to tell stories.
You guys forgot to mention the most critical thing of all times in student films, that is Sound. Student films have most often then not, badly recorded sound as the general idea of ''fixing in post'' is still wide spread. The post sound also tend to be all over the place too, with a really badly mix. And even if they have a good sound designer, the sound designer struggles tremendously with the badly recorded sound, because there is not such a thing as fix it in post. The main problem, in my view, is that film universities and courses don't stress enough the importance of sound on films. They don't put everyone in the process of recording and editing the sound, so they can understand the impact it has in your film and how hard is to do it well. That is why student films and low budget productions tend to have beautiful picture and terrible sound. They still think the camera is what makes the film. I became a sound recordist after doing an editing specialism at university. Only then I felt the pain on having to deal with poor sound, and how it makes or breaks your film, no matter the story you have, or the acting, or the beautiful camera shots, or the amazingly edited piece. I would really love to watch an episode where you cover that, if you haven't done it yet. I just found your channel, and am keen to check out your other videos. great stuff! thanks!
So true. I haven't made any films but I have worked with visual novels, where the visuals tend to be restricted to static illustration with very limited animation. Quality sound, though, can make that VN feel almost like a movie, even if you don't have voice actors. Footsteps, paper rustling, whatever. Makes all the difference in the world.
So true! I'm in film school right now (Kent State) and we learn how to record and edit sound before we even pick up a camera. It's one of the biggest part of our curriculum. Our films are starting to stand out among other schools simply because our sound isn't unbearable.
I just watched a bunch of student films at my school and a lot of them had bad sound, despite the fact that they are required to take a sound course. There was one film that they even used the main character sound for the off-screen character dialogue so it sounded very distant and bad quality. I don't know why they didn't record that characters dialogue separately especially since you don't even see them saying it. The sound person and the editor dropped the ball on that.
When I was in film school the professors kept telling us to avoid the 6 D's of student films: Death Depression Drugs Dreams Dorms Dough That last one was mostly for the students that kept making lost wallet films.
I'd say that it's not entirely a bad thing for some of these things. After all, Requiem for a Dream is all about drugs. I think he may have said that because students tend to not understand what makes those types of films work. They just film it happening, not why it happened or how they started from the top then descended, or things like that.
@@LeoBladini As someone who is currently basing my (first ever, film and script) short film script around depression as a core emotion, I will say that it needs to either be supplementary or have supplements. I've been a writer since I could write, and one of the things I first learned is that some subjects just require... more. You can't do a film about drugs without either going all the fucking way or making the drugs a part of a whole. You can't do a film about depression without it being hoisted by other things. Depression is, fundamentally, a concept about the meander of our lives casting a shadow over us. So when a bunch of film students get together and make a film about depression, they make it meandering. Have the depression be a core point that accelerates the character into whatever action your film needs them to, and then have the tests they undergo help them overcome their depression. It's shouldn't be a "statement". It should be the character arc. Mine is about depression inspired by grief, where the MC carries his depression in complete guilt over his friend's death. It's even more motivated, though, as his friend announces that he is happy for the first time in years thanks to the MC, and the MC indirectly allows him to die. Thus, the depression explored isn't the meandering shit that I see too often to count; it's motivated by actions that the MC has to overcome. It still fucking sucks, though. I won't stop sucking until I die.
I think in very high concept films like his, it's almost a must. The real issue with many of these student films using dialogue as exposition is that what they are communicating with this dialogue could be easily and more powerfully communicated visually. Visual storytelling is just a must. When you're making a si fi setting in which complicated concepts need to be communicated to the audience, sometimes the most efficient way is to just have characters explain those concepts. In a film like "The Dark Knight", Nolan doesn't feel the need to explain the world to the audience through exposition in dialogue because the audience already knows what's going on. In a film like "Inception", the world and its rules do need to be explained so the audience knows the stakes and the rules of the world. However, Leo Dicaprios character never explains how he's feeling or why he's doing what he's doing because that is something that can be demonstrated visually.
As a retired film teacher I often found a problem with editing, in that the student wouldn't want to cut a scene that might have been his/her favorite, but which really slowed down the narrative pace.
My rhetoric professor said one of the hardest pieces of advice she ever had to follow is to “kill your darlings.” Just because you like something doesn’t mean it’s good for the project.
My top 10 are: 1.- Undramatized pieces 2.- Few believable dilemmas 3.- Stories too big for a short 4.- Stories too lugubrious or solemn 5.- No sense of place 6.- No P.O.V. of the filmmaker 7.- Bad casting 8.- Unshaped performances 9.- Not enough coverage or wrong coverage 10.- Weak production design
Your list is better than the one they used in the video. Stuff like "dialogue as exposition" and "repeated emotional beats" can be used to great effect in certain circumstances, and "mistaking your own experience for cinema" doesn't even make sense to me. Meanwhile, I can see at least 8 of your 10 examples being applied to my first attempt at making a student film. The only things I feel I got right were the sense of place and production design. Bad casting, no P.O.V., too-big stories, etc.... these are all practical, real-life problems that most students (including myself, obviously) will only learn the hard way.
This is the first "mistakes" video that seen that really engages in what the real mistakes are. Thought provoking and gets me more excited about telling great stories, well done! Bravo
I’m just a student but I will say this... you’re always going to make mistakes as a filmmaker. But you learn from your mistakes and you keep on progressing
Most short films I saw and worked in at uni started with a character waking up and then they go to the bathroom to look at themselves in the mirror. Also the students that decide to write the scripts, usually make themselves the main character as if their lives are interesting enough to make a movie about them.
I'll be honest, I lot of film s I see from my fellow film students are overly pretentious. I feel thats a big issue too. And I am in no way except from that
Simply it is the creation of the physical world and scenery that you are building around the scene. Also, it's known as set design. It includes props and costumes.
@@TheStoenk Not true. You can borrow props costumes and furniture from family and friends. You can also make props and costumes. Just visit your local charity shops or thrift stores if you haven't got the right stuff at home.
Most student films are very pretentious, they’re trying to make something bigger than they are capable of achieving with such a small budget and the effects ends up looking terrible in the end. Always write a movie with the mindset of what you’re capable of doing.
The casting and performance one, I think, is such a big issue because many of these people can only pull from people they know, or people from a film school they're going to Its incredibly difficult to put your foot down and actually DIRECT someone who you know personally or are peers with outside of a project, largely out of fear that they will dislike you for it The relationship between a director and the actors they're working with is very different to the relationship they may have with friends, so when those actors ARE their friends, changing that dynamic can feel like it could end that friendship
God, I'm having that EXACT SAME problem right now. Being isolated outside of the film as a director because of this made my entire school life worse. I'm planning to step down as a director and just let the entire class take the reins because the one who kept fighting with me wants "all of the class to be directors" which is, haha.... no. That's not how it works. They want everyone to be scriptwriters as well, and etcetera etcetera. It's a disheartening and dismaying ordeal.
but the biggest difference is dialogue performed by A Star proffesional actors has SOOO much nuances and bealivability in their delivery of dialogue - they add subtext, tone, breaks and rythm whereas a student film's entire dialogue comes out 2 dimensional like that guy in the video I AM LEAVING then does a sharp turn - loll
I’m neither a film student nor filmmaker, just a dude who likes to edit and vlog, but I thought it would be cool to make a short and this info is crazy helpful and insightful. Thank you!
Don't forget "6"; editors doing stuff for the sake of being clever rather than having a purpose for it. Flashbacks and other forms of skipping around the timeline, stutter cuts, digital zooms, match cuts, split-screen edits etc. They can be useful tools when they are NEEDED, but most budding editors use them because they can.
To qoute Martian Scorsese. "the best editing is not seen." while editing is fantasic tool and can drive stories forward. Most young editors and I have made the mistake of is flashy editing. While I love myself flashy editing. It's all about how you do it. Because this can easily ruin a film. You have to find what works best for the indivual scenes and the large scale of the plot.
Actor pet peeve: 1) When they aren't talking, they just stand there with their hands either dead at their sides or clasped in front of them at bellybutton height. No one stands like that and says/ does nothing in a conversation. To make it worse, they then overdo their movements and intonation when they start speaking.
1. Own experience =/= Cinema (Personal experience lacks empathetic impact) 2. Casting and Performances are overlooked (be open minded when holding auditions and recognize that what you’re looking for might change) 3. Dialogue should be character centric and not just exposition (Use the medium and performances more effectively versus over-reliance on dialogue) 4. Repeating emotional beats (diversity in emotional range and pacing) 5. “What is this film about?” An essential question that must be able to be answered simply
Being that filmmaking is a collaborative process, I'd prefer to avoid directors who have such an ego that I need to worry about how to talk to them--aside from common courtesy, of course. :)
@@keithmoore1329 I've been an editor for 33 years, and believe me, you have to work with all kind of directors - megalomaniac, egoists or good friends, philosophers, nerds, fast and practical, up to the ones who does'nt even show up during editing -comes just to see the final. But whatever you do, you have to think that is also YOUR project, not just someone elses job -otherwise you won't be able to stand the job for too long.
This video was extremely well done, on all counts. Excellent work. I do have one issue with it, though: Saying, "What can an editor do to fix these [problems with student films?]" frames the whole video from the much-maligned perspective of "fix it in post." Student films, specifically, are usually not good. The creators are still learning. If a brilliant editor were to weave that straw into gold, it can give the writer/director/camera operator a false sense of accomplishment. This isn't just my intuition... I've seen it happen. If a film sucks, let it suck. It's the only way that those responsible will learn. Fortunately, by the end of the video, it was a lot more clear that this is a list of things that should be avoided in the first place.
Totally not what i was expecting to watch.!! That was absolutely brilliant. i loved the conversation style editing. i was expecting things like,, camera,sound,story etc
I think that taking themselves too seriously is often a problem. Not that you shouldn't think highly of your product, but you should still be realistic about it and maybe put it into perspective if you just worked on the ideas for a few months or weeks.
Well said! #3 tends to bug me the most, even in vlogs. Please stop telling me what you're doing as you do it, or telling me what you're about to do next; narrating like that effectively duplicates what I can already see, sliding the supply curve of information to the right, devaluing both the information contained in the shot and the narration itself... or diminishes any potential anticipation for what's next. I like to think storytelling's a subtle art of taking things away. Slide the supply curve to the left, in just the right ways, and you can elicit a lot more value with less content.
As an editor who's worked on several student films and first features, I can say that the biggest amateur problem is lack of coverage. Not giving the editor enough choices to shape the story. With enough coverage, the editor can fix a lot of the problems mentioned in this video.
I'm very lucky to actually have Karen as my professor, and one piece of advice that's stuck with me is to be clear on WHO the story is about. If you are clear about perspective, you'll have a clearer idea of which shots should be selected and how they should be cut together. Filmmaking should also be a constant feedback and improvement process, so be as organised and collaborative as humanly possible. Try to involve everyone (including actors) with shaping the script and action.
I'm so glad that you mentioned Milos Forman. It's sad, but he passed out just few days earlier. He was one of best directors of Czech Republic. Thank you that you honored him !
I also think that life experience plays heavily on how good a student film is. Some 25-year-olds have not seen enough of life to give their stories proper context,. Teens are not that great at making teen films because without the perspective of being an adult an understanding of what happened in their youth.
This video spoke to me on all mistakes I've made when deciding what to write. I've struggled too much on dialogue and reverted to using dialogue when I was stuck writing the story. I now learned to move forward is to find the theme and not focus too much on the little details and part of the plot and the ending of the film.
Student horror films seem to get this one wrong a lot: they don't give the audience the catalyst for anticipation. They often save the scare for the very end of the film. But the trouble here is that throughout the film the audience doesn't have a reason to be scared or to empathize with the characters because we haven't been given a glimpse of the monster/creator/ghost/demon. Without knowing what MIGHT lurk in the shadows, we aren't afraid of the dark.
This is fantastic. I often act as a reader for local playwriting contests, and I notice so often that dialogue stands in for action in so many plays (and theater is far more dialogue-dependent than film). I've had directors and actors tell me that they pay no attention to stage directions when they prepare for a show, and it can be so obvious when we think that saying something can stand in for doing something. With film and video, it's far easier and less expensive to say something than to do something, so over-reliance on dialogue can be such an easy trap to fall into. I love great dialogue, but it's so true that it's to shine a light on character, not to propel the plot or the story.
_richie_13 well I don’t see problem with it but in my case I love to film as many locations as possible even if it’s a small scene I would go to the gas station and film something quick or in a abandoned place or maybe in front of my apartment and I would even a shot in where the actor drives and passed by the camera in one road it’s more fun the thing is to be careful with people thinking your recording then haha
Oh my God. I’m a student filmmaker. This video was extremely insightful. I’ve never even realized any of these mistakes as mistakes before. I thought I had a proficiency with what I do but it looks like I haven’t even scratched the surface. I have so much to learn. Thank you for this great video!
I never had the opptunity to take a film class. But intuitively I always felt the way this editor feels. I'm glad I am on the same page with her. Loved the video.
Loved this video - very informative and definitely very accurate. I remember when I first started making movie with friends when I was 12-13, the most common problem we had was that everything felt forced and we were trying too hard to mimic what bigger movies were doing. In doing so, we neglected one of the most important aspects of movies which is forming an emotional connection with the audience. If you think about it, there's something very primal about the movies. It offers us an experience that - if done successfully - can move us to the core. With that being said, I kinda started approaching filmmaking from that perspective and rather than focus too heavily on style and aesthetics, I try to find effective ways to illicit a response from the audience. I mean movies are made by humans, so instead of trying to produce this picture perfect movie, rather go for one that humans can relate to.
In my first student film assignment we weren’t allowed to have any sound. We got 100ft of 16mm reversal film, a camera, and that was it. It forced us to think hard about visual storytelling.
I have been a FIlm teacher for almost 5 years now at grade 9-10 in Denmark. For the most part planning is an issue for them. I also struggle with how much i should do for them and when i should let them make their own mistakes and learn. I have been using your material the past year. Its great. Thank you.
I believe the best humorous observation of #3 was done by I Hate Everything when he referred to an old lady character babbling off exposition as "Exposition Granny." Now I can never think anything else when I hear dialogue that smells remotely of exposition, and it even caused me to notice exposition dialogue ALL THE TIME where before I simply blindly accepted it. Student films have too many exposition grannies. Another observation that often goes unspoken: at 6:40 you can see why shooting "flat" without 10-bit color and the necessary experience in color grading is a really bad idea. Stop shooting flat. If you can't afford a GH5 ($2000 + lens) at a MINIMUM, you can only make it look worse by shooting flat. If you think CineStyle on your T3i or 80D or whatever will somehow make your stuff look better, you're wrong, full stop. Especially for students, you need to be getting as much correct in-camera as possible.
Amen to that. I would say however a student could get a BPMCC mark I and have great footage for grading, but shouldn't do it. Honestly. RAW and LOG are really advanced technical processes to work with and should not be a concern for film students - I did this mistake as well tho. A lot of great people also work with colors in-camera - Roger Deakins is one extraordinary DP who, according to him, worked 100% with in-camera colors for Blade Runner. Now granted that's shot on Arri and corrected by pros but still. I think at the end it just comes down to the basics. The problem we face as students and beginners (I'm starting my photography business) is the plethora of highly technical gear available at affordable prices. It's great to have it. It is freeing, only, for someone who got to work with basic gear and got a firm grasp on the *basics*. And that IMHO would be learning to shoot black and white first to understand shape, light and shadow play, and avoid the soap-opera 3 point lighting "inside a TV studio" look. Then colors then lighting with colors (gelled lights and RGBs etc). Too often because the technology is there available to us, and affordable to us, we want to use right away the Log profiles, the RGB LEDs, the drones, the radio triggers and HSS flashes (in the world of stills) etc but we skip on the basics. And everything ends-up a mashed up soup of trendy slow-mo footage with the latest, most popular LUT (next time I see an orange and teal cheap LUT look, I... I was gonna say Imma break my monitor but this is not gonna happens...).
Thanks! This was quite educational, even for non-filmmakers. As a fan of short films, I watch a lot of student and amateur ones in the process of trying to find a few which are 'good.' I come away from many of them wishing the editing was better. I can't tell you how much #3, in particular, irritates me!! I don't think there's anything worse than that, except maybe an overabundance of overlayed narration as exposition. Nice work.
This was excellent insight, and well thought out, genuine advice. Filmmakers probably make these mistakes over and over before stumbling on a gem like this video that expounds on common mistakes. Thank you!
Your videos never disappoint! The detailed tutorials, clear comparisons, and brilliant showcases of sound design and storytelling are incredibly helpful. Thanks for the insightful and well-explained content.
Great content, Sven. Since I like making RUclips videos so much, my friends challenged me to create some kind of "dramatic" short film. I haven't come up with a script yet, which to me seems like the right place to start, but definitely I think this video gave me some great insights. For me as an amateur, I can say what I like or dislike only intuitively, but it's very helpful when you and Karen break it down into clear concepts like nuanced emotions, empathy, rhythmic beats, etc. I'm saving this video in my playlist so I can review it after I have a script, or even a premise, to work with. Thanks again. I love your work.
I'm an actor . Last year I appeared in 19 student films. 18 of them went into the dumpster. Here's my top problems . 1, film schools are admitting students who have zero aptitude for film making. They want the tuition fees. Their graduation films are for the most part dumpster food. 2. Film schools want to play nice, so everybody gets a medal...I've been on sets where the camera is switched to autofocus, this was on a final course film 3. Scripts are absolutely appalling ...painful dialogue, no meaningful dialogue between actors.. 4. Static cameras poor or nonexistent blocking. 5. Directors who don't know how to block a scene, move the camera, create the right lighting. 6 .Directors who don't pay attention to an actors performance and think that the shot is most important. 7. Totally incompetent casting choices. 8.DOPs who have no ideahow their shot relates to the rest of the film. 9.Terrible sound recording....poor mic placement. 10. No feel for lighting or atmosphere. 11. Filming a half baked personal experience they think will make a great story using a script that should never be filmed. There's more but that should do.
I just graduated with a film degree and all I can say is I blame my professors, all lacked any energy or passion about new ideas or techniques, all we watched my 4 years were studio binder videos and felt like I wasted my time. All I’d say is major in something else and learn on your own yall 🗣️
This info was helpful to me as I am working on my second short. I am not a student in literal terms but a student in learning on writing and directing. This segment also actually gave me some insight as an actor. I am checking out the student film list. The snippets seemed interesting.
I would respectfully argue about no. 5 and No. 3, the problem is not that the writer is telling their personal story. A lot of the premises from personal experiences are very compelling from most (not all) writers when you hear the writer/director explain why its so meaningful, like sitting them down and having a conversation about their idea. The problem is all of the context they have spoken does not make it onto the screenplay, I see it so often. They get caught up in trying to force in subtext to look smart, or dont have the context on the page so the reader can experience what the writer experienced when they had it. Like @00:39 "I'm going crazy" as stakes for the protagonist, thats an internal stake, thats very hard for the audience to experience visually on the screen, its very internal, so we wont get the same experience the writer /director had. Remember filmmaking is an energy transference business, you have to get the emotional, compelling story that plays in your head and somehow write it down so that I have the exact same experience when I read the script/watch the film....sounds simple but it's NOT! trust me, not trying to brag but I've a writing mentor in the industry very recently, who's teaching me to write compelling writing to the industry standard, it's really tough but the no. 1 mistake is lack of clear context from the protagonist and their goal, stakes etc. Don't send your script to a friend/producer/director/mentor and ask what they thought generally. Give them a list of context questions about the main character their goal, stakes, why those stakes felt so meaningful to the character in pursuit if their goal. If their answers line up with what you had in mind you're off to a great start. A lot of other mistakes I see is that most writers don't write in compelling conflict or a sheer lack of clarity from the protagonist or an internal goal that we the viewer cannot experience, a lot of the times with conflict its just people arguing for the sake of it, and none of the essential context listed above. Conflict is the engine that drives your script all the way to the end. Sorkin, Mamet said it before and its the bedrock of great writing. Writers often complain about second act and how they struggle with it and blame it, its like driving across the country and blaming a mid west city that your car stopped driving, when your car ran out of gas, not the cits fault...and the "gasoline" is compelling conflict....to quote David Mamet when he spoke to his writers room "you'll learn to write in compelling conflict or you'll be on the f*%king dole line" ie its essential. also for a video directed at student filmmakers having a comment like "cinematic empathy is more nuanced than just sympathy with someone's situation.." "..into something that has an emotional flow" that sounds very vague/tad high brow/little pretentious and really hard for a new writer/filmmaker to grasp, needs simplicity and specificity for a new filmmaker to get a hold of, sorry. I was new to this game not so long ago and to be frank that sounds like gibberish, pretentious criticism if I'm being really honest in the context of speaking to a student filmmaker and trying to help them improve in a specific way.
Jesus, exactly. Everything you say comes from experience only. It's like they're saying: "Your experience ain't worth watching." I don't underestimate anything or anyone. I believe, with the right way of telling, even the most boring story can be pretty interesting and great.
This video popped up in my suggestions and found it to be pretty inspiring! Definitely going to use those tips, especially about building everything around a theme rather than just plot for plot's sake.
Thank you to all the TGE Facebook Group Members that allowed us to show clips from their films. Here you can watch their student work: ruclips.net/p/PLNEhn13QqMlZtgUJEVwBKwyLzhDT8N-Mf The intent of the ep. is not to shame anyone, but to look at some common problems with student work, to reflect on it, and help us grow as storytellers.
Thanks for the great video! Would you mind adding my short to the list, as a couple of clips were used in the video? ruclips.net/video/qOGAaFkEu-Y/видео.html Thanks again! Kyle
Fantastic Video Sven! You guys went all out on the production value and it really helps tie the video together as a whole! Congrats! and hope all's been well with you!
Mistaking your own experience for cinema. SO TRUE. Right now at my college there is not one but TWO student films in production where the writer/director is starring as himself. Same name and everything. While I find this incredibly cringe, at least they are making this dumb mistake in school.
I absolutely LOVE you two together!! I gain so much insight watching these videos, and the knowledge i gain from it gives me such a much broader perspective on the art of editing!! thank you for uploading, and i hope to see more videos like this in the future
oh my god this is so helpful!! I'm so happy it's from an editing perspective as well because I've seen too many of these where they don't even talk about editing and I'm stuck because i'm trying to save these films in such a short amount of time! I'm sending these to all the student directors i work with in the future so they know about what to do. Thank you so much for this!
Has anyone, ever in real life said "I'm leaving" before turning to walk out a door?! I swear, that is one of the funnest things I have ever seen in a move. Was it supposed to be a comedy?
so much information, interesting choice in not introducing the people doing the VO on film. it didn't detrack from the video and got straight to the point.
Oh my goodness. This video just changed my whole view on filmmaking, better late than never!! Thank you so much for making this, I'm blown away right now!
I think I might have said this on another one of your videos (or did I just think it?) but your channel is the best of it's kind. I was just watching this video and thinking, "how is he giving this stuff away for free?" Then it dawned on me: Patreon! And then the guilt set in. So I guess I'm going to have to hop on over there and donate (not my usual course of action bc I've got the whole starving artist thing going on right now) but your material has helped me so much I have no choice but to give back. Thanks Sven. Please keep up the amazing altruism.
What an awesome discussion. I had a few light bulbs light up for sure and I noticed in this video itself you were including some of the keys youve previously pointed out before. It all makes for an enjoyable and educational video. Thanks again I love what you do and am very greatful you share this to us. Cheers.
Personally I really liked the compilation you made around 6:02. By cutting it from 43 to 9 seconds, you do convey a feeling of someone trying to distract himself with photography, but it's clear that it's not working - something is really bothering him, and the feeling just won't go away.
i agree with directors not casting roles adequately. i feel like not everyone is made for every role. yes, it’s nice to show range of an actor but some people just aren’t cut out for a role or acting in general.
I did no education for any of this but I've been watching and learning from great written shows and movies. When I watch these kinds of videos I always notice how I make none of the beginners mistakes anymore, also with those "points of no return" in your story, I had never heard of it but I always use it. It's great to learn haha
I am studiyng by myself and hope onde day I can make some films, and tell my stories to the world. Your channel is an inspiration, please keep doing this great work! Cheers from Portugal!
If the names really were subtly interspersed throughout this video, then I definitely missed that, but once you revealed it, I sure caught my name at the end! Yay! Great video, as always. But it's crazy how I just had to subscribe to your channel again! How can I not be subscribed? I'm a patron!! Lol. Guess RUclips is right back to its antics.
You spoke about topics other wouldn't of which I don't think is the Top 5 but they are very great topics that do explain alot of problems I see in aspiring filmmakers and I'm glad you made this video, great video as always!!
Good video. These are the ones I've done/seen others do the most: -Yelling "Cut!" immediately after the last line/action, not giving the editor enough room to edit. -Forgetting the "rule of rules." You see, when a theatrical feature film does something (script-wise or visually) that goes against what textbooks say, the viewer knows that it's on purpose. When a student short film does it, the viewer thinks that it's due to the budget or lack of talent. I know this might sound discouraging for those who want to be more original, but it's a sacrifice you have to make not until you become an A-lister but at least until you can prove that you have a career, no matter how many feature films you make. BOTTLE ROCKET didn't have the perfectly simetrical shots. RESERVOIR DOGS didn't have the over-the-top zoom-ins. -Using free music. Nowadays, you don't need a big budget to have a good score. Find a musician and have him compose new music. Even if they don't know how to play the instrument that you want, have him compose and then use the notation on a music software. It's not hard to find someone that knows how to arrange it if necessary. -Not paying attention to the sound editing/mixing. Little details like steps or placing something on a table can help the production seem more professional.
It took me about 2 years to break these habits! Still sneak up on me though lol a big one I see a lot is to heavy(visible) color grade. Your viewer should feel it, not get stuck fixating on it
Insightful video. Liked it very much. In such a short duration, it touched many crucial elements. Though it seems to be presented with relevance to edit, but it also emphasize on basics of Filmmaking & deeper thought process. Additionally while going through the comments by viewers, got to know helpful examples & explanations. Many Thanks Dr. Karen, Steven, Vincent & entire Team for creating & sharing this guiding video. Also thanking to all viewers who shared their queries, views, experiences & details in comments to help in learning & growing others. Wellwishes to all for happiness, health, harmony, contentness 👍 Love
Very interesting. One thing that struck me is that each of the five things had to do with story. There were no techniques, such as lighting, sound, framing, camera movement, etc. The one about casting is certainly correct, but I wonder how many student films are actually cast? I would think that most are begging for any cast they can get. I know I certainly was. In my first short neither of the leads wanted to be in the film. They filled in at the last minute because I didn't have anyone else. One hadn't even read the script prior to shooting. That said, I really liked the comment about auditions (asking them to do it differently). Should I ever get to the point I can have auditions I will certainly do that. I'll have to re-watch it, likely several times. I am, after all, a "student" filmmaker.
Thanks. It seems that "everyone", myself included, concentrate on technique. Most of the training you find is also mostly about technique. I have tried to concentrate on story, but not much on acting. But, I'm not sure there is much I can do there as I'm begging for cast. One thing I really need to learn is how to tell when I am getting a good performance and how to direct someone to try and get what I want. The performance always seems better on set when I'm shooting than when I edit the film. Then again, maybe I need to be better at editing...
I realize more than ever that I'm very lucky to have had access to the theatre department at my college when I was shooting films there. And being an actor myself helps a lot, as obviously I would know actors and know whether they would fit certain roles.
As for technique. Orson Welles didn't know shit about filmmaking when he made Citizen Kane. What he DID know from working in theatre is acting and story. He was already a master at that. So he leaned heavily on his crew to get the technique right and was fortunate to have one of the best cinematography of that era. He also watched a lot of other movies just to get a feel for that sort of thing. But he always focused most on what he was great at: Story and acting.
Well that's the difference between a real film maker and amateur ! A pro will put the extra time and effort to find good acting partners, not at the last minute. This is why you see top directors use the same actor again and again. It's pays real dividends to find and build relationships with actors who want to be actors seriously. Like the pros say, the jobs done when you cast! So if I was doing it, I'd seriously got out of my way big time to find those new serious upcoming actors, they are there. You just have to have that true desire to make something great, not rush it out last minute. Real pros often take years and years planning a movie and casting it. It's not complicated just takes some brain cells to realise the real work is done in the pre planning and script, and casting and pre shooting script for true art. Otherwise it's it's amateur theatre.
Fantastic video. Really well made and great information. Sending it to my students immediately! But like you said, these are great reminders for everyone, not only students.
amazing tips, watching student films and bad movies or indies in local festivals, sometimes teach us more about how to make a great film that watching good cinema and make us appreciate more good film-making.
Wow! Such a valuable video! I think you should change the title to Films by Aspiring Filmmakers because it's not just students who'd make these mistakes. Filmmakers who are early (and sometimes experienced) in their career make these mistakes quite often.
imagine being a film student and watching this and then seeing your own film in it
Then your blessed. You’re being taught directly.
I have and it terrifies me every time. I was like this too but you need to learn the hard lessons. When I made my thesis film in grad school, it was so bad my professors told me to re shoot the whole film. From top to bottom it was all over the place. I was so embrassed by my film, that I took a two year hiatus. I was too scared to direct another film because of my epic failure. I felt I wasn't good enough to be a filmmaker. Even though I was part of other people''s productions, I didn't have the courage to direct another film. Over the course of two years, I realized my mistakes. Bad writing, bad shooting, bad directions, NO Planning. Being a filmmaker takes hard work, practice and patience. And also humility. Don't go trying to be the next great director or cinematographer or anything. Just focus on the task at hand. One step at a time. You create films not for the glory, or just to say I am a filmmaker, but for the love of cinema and the need to tell stories.
@@LifeAndWrestling well said my friend.
yes I would feel honoured hearing them how shit it is.
The meta!
You guys forgot to mention the most critical thing of all times in student films, that is Sound. Student films have most often then not, badly recorded sound as the general idea of ''fixing in post'' is still wide spread. The post sound also tend to be all over the place too, with a really badly mix. And even if they have a good sound designer, the sound designer struggles tremendously with the badly recorded sound, because there is not such a thing as fix it in post. The main problem, in my view, is that film universities and courses don't stress enough the importance of sound on films. They don't put everyone in the process of recording and editing the sound, so they can understand the impact it has in your film and how hard is to do it well. That is why student films and low budget productions tend to have beautiful picture and terrible sound. They still think the camera is what makes the film. I became a sound recordist after doing an editing specialism at university. Only then I felt the pain on having to deal with poor sound, and how it makes or breaks your film, no matter the story you have, or the acting, or the beautiful camera shots, or the amazingly edited piece. I would really love to watch an episode where you cover that, if you haven't done it yet. I just found your channel, and am keen to check out your other videos. great stuff! thanks!
So true. I haven't made any films but I have worked with visual novels, where the visuals tend to be restricted to static illustration with very limited animation. Quality sound, though, can make that VN feel almost like a movie, even if you don't have voice actors. Footsteps, paper rustling, whatever. Makes all the difference in the world.
So true! I'm in film school right now (Kent State) and we learn how to record and edit sound before we even pick up a camera. It's one of the biggest part of our curriculum. Our films are starting to stand out among other schools simply because our sound isn't unbearable.
In my opinion, sound is MORE important than the visual!
Arianny Canepa True
I just watched a bunch of student films at my school and a lot of them had bad sound, despite the fact that they are required to take a sound course. There was one film that they even used the main character sound for the off-screen character dialogue so it sounded very distant and bad quality. I don't know why they didn't record that characters dialogue separately especially since you don't even see them saying it. The sound person and the editor dropped the ball on that.
When that one dude said “I’m leaving” and made a sharp 90 degree turn I started laughing so hard 😭😂
i m l e a v i n g
deadset same. I just lost it 😂
😂😂😂 that was hilarious
4:05
Feels like a well-aimed Wes Anderson scene instead of weird dialogue tbh
When I was in film school the professors kept telling us to avoid the 6 D's of student films:
Death
Depression
Drugs
Dreams
Dorms
Dough
That last one was mostly for the students that kept making lost wallet films.
I'd say that it's not entirely a bad thing for some of these things. After all, Requiem for a Dream is all about drugs. I think he may have said that because students tend to not understand what makes those types of films work. They just film it happening, not why it happened or how they started from the top then descended, or things like that.
Deltasquad382943 I think the professors were just sick and tired of seeing drug induced suicides filmed in the dorms.
it's lazy. but only if you don't know how to work with those themes
What are lost wallet films?
@@LeoBladini As someone who is currently basing my (first ever, film and script) short film script around depression as a core emotion, I will say that it needs to either be supplementary or have supplements. I've been a writer since I could write, and one of the things I first learned is that some subjects just require... more. You can't do a film about drugs without either going all the fucking way or making the drugs a part of a whole. You can't do a film about depression without it being hoisted by other things. Depression is, fundamentally, a concept about the meander of our lives casting a shadow over us. So when a bunch of film students get together and make a film about depression, they make it meandering. Have the depression be a core point that accelerates the character into whatever action your film needs them to, and then have the tests they undergo help them overcome their depression. It's shouldn't be a "statement". It should be the character arc. Mine is about depression inspired by grief, where the MC carries his depression in complete guilt over his friend's death. It's even more motivated, though, as his friend announces that he is happy for the first time in years thanks to the MC, and the MC indirectly allows him to die. Thus, the depression explored isn't the meandering shit that I see too often to count; it's motivated by actions that the MC has to overcome.
It still fucking sucks, though. I won't stop sucking until I die.
"Dialogue is not information. Dialogue is character."
*Christopher Nolan disliked this video*
Lolll
As good a director he is, this is sooo true.
Damn
Nolan hardly makes character driven movies. It's always plot driven, and his characters are usually very thin, especially past The Dark Knight.
I think in very high concept films like his, it's almost a must. The real issue with many of these student films using dialogue as exposition is that what they are communicating with this dialogue could be easily and more powerfully communicated visually. Visual storytelling is just a must. When you're making a si fi setting in which complicated concepts need to be communicated to the audience, sometimes the most efficient way is to just have characters explain those concepts. In a film like "The Dark Knight", Nolan doesn't feel the need to explain the world to the audience through exposition in dialogue because the audience already knows what's going on. In a film like "Inception", the world and its rules do need to be explained so the audience knows the stakes and the rules of the world. However, Leo Dicaprios character never explains how he's feeling or why he's doing what he's doing because that is something that can be demonstrated visually.
As a retired film teacher I often found a problem with editing, in that the student wouldn't want to cut a scene that might have been his/her favorite, but which really slowed down the narrative pace.
My rhetoric professor said one of the hardest pieces of advice she ever had to follow is to “kill your darlings.” Just because you like something doesn’t mean it’s good for the project.
My top 10 are:
1.- Undramatized pieces
2.- Few believable dilemmas
3.- Stories too big for a short
4.- Stories too lugubrious or solemn
5.- No sense of place
6.- No P.O.V. of the filmmaker
7.- Bad casting
8.- Unshaped performances
9.- Not enough coverage or wrong coverage
10.- Weak production design
podrías leer el guión de mi corto y darme tu opinion jeje
Your list is better than the one they used in the video. Stuff like "dialogue as exposition" and "repeated emotional beats" can be used to great effect in certain circumstances, and "mistaking your own experience for cinema" doesn't even make sense to me. Meanwhile, I can see at least 8 of your 10 examples being applied to my first attempt at making a student film. The only things I feel I got right were the sense of place and production design. Bad casting, no P.O.V., too-big stories, etc.... these are all practical, real-life problems that most students (including myself, obviously) will only learn the hard way.
“Weak production design” mate it’s a student film
11. The SOUND.
11. Poor experience of life, literature and human nature . A bad neighbor is enough as a tragic conflict for them.
This is the first "mistakes" video that seen that really engages in what the real mistakes are. Thought provoking and gets me more excited about telling great stories, well done! Bravo
thrilled to read that you liked the video. big fan of your channel.
*Fade in from black*
>close-up of an alarm clock
Ugh...almost every student film I had watched has some iteration of this
I’m just a student but I will say this... you’re always going to make mistakes as a filmmaker. But you learn from your mistakes and you keep on progressing
Most short films I saw and worked in at uni started with a character waking up and then they go to the bathroom to look at themselves in the mirror. Also the students that decide to write the scripts, usually make themselves the main character as if their lives are interesting enough to make a movie about them.
I'll be honest, I lot of film s I see from my fellow film students are overly pretentious. I feel thats a big issue too. And I am in no way except from that
I KNOW!!! Like my friend is trying to be a director, but she doesn’t really like criticism, and yeah... WAAAY too pretentious
@@chimedemon link to her short films ?
@@chimedemon Then they won't become one unfortunately.
The most common mistakes at times are lack of production design.
Simply it is the creation of the physical world and scenery that you are building around the scene. Also, it's known as set design. It includes props and costumes.
production design is expensive
Production design isn't as necessary as a good script or good sound.
@@TheStoenk Not true. You can borrow props costumes and furniture from family and friends. You can also make props and costumes. Just visit your local charity shops or thrift stores if you haven't got the right stuff at home.
@@waflletoast11 I agree. just write a screenplay that fits your budget
My favorite video of yours. Excellent.
He Austin!! I love your Chanel :')
Well Austin likes this video so take notes
Da man!
Wait... he might not be THE Austin McConnell ;)
Go make a fucking movie, you tool. Yes, you, Audstin Mcconnell, what are you doing here, you should be writing you worthless "filmmaker'.
@@MrGreen-ci2mm Where's your 1 and a half million subscribers?
Most student films are very pretentious, they’re trying to make something bigger than they are capable of achieving with such a small budget and the effects ends up looking terrible in the end. Always write a movie with the mindset of what you’re capable of doing.
I agree you need to learn how to do it with a small budget before carrying the real weapon.
The casting and performance one, I think, is such a big issue because many of these people can only pull from people they know, or people from a film school they're going to
Its incredibly difficult to put your foot down and actually DIRECT someone who you know personally or are peers with outside of a project, largely out of fear that they will dislike you for it
The relationship between a director and the actors they're working with is very different to the relationship they may have with friends, so when those actors ARE their friends, changing that dynamic can feel like it could end that friendship
God, I'm having that EXACT SAME problem right now. Being isolated outside of the film as a director because of this made my entire school life worse. I'm planning to step down as a director and just let the entire class take the reins because the one who kept fighting with me wants "all of the class to be directors" which is, haha.... no. That's not how it works. They want everyone to be scriptwriters as well, and etcetera etcetera. It's a disheartening and dismaying ordeal.
As someone that those alot of dialouge-polish i can sadly say that exposition in dialogue is fairly common even in alot of professional-films.
Soap operas/telenovelas are practically all exposition.
Nolan does it a lot.
The entire Marvel Universe is dialogue as exposition.
but the biggest difference is dialogue performed by A Star proffesional actors has SOOO much nuances and bealivability in their delivery of dialogue - they add subtext, tone, breaks and rythm whereas a student film's entire dialogue comes out 2 dimensional like that guy in the video I AM LEAVING then does a sharp turn - loll
I’m neither a film student nor filmmaker, just a dude who likes to edit and vlog, but I thought it would be cool to make a short and this info is crazy helpful and insightful. Thank you!
you are a vloger and that makes you a filmmaker aswell..
Fahad Kahut no
Ayeeee I just watch this too bro what’s good lol
Don't forget "6"; editors doing stuff for the sake of being clever rather than having a purpose for it. Flashbacks and other forms of skipping around the timeline, stutter cuts, digital zooms, match cuts, split-screen edits etc. They can be useful tools when they are NEEDED, but most budding editors use them because they can.
To qoute Martian Scorsese. "the best editing is not seen." while editing is fantasic tool and can drive stories forward. Most young editors and I have made the mistake of is flashy editing. While I love myself flashy editing. It's all about how you do it. Because this can easily ruin a film. You have to find what works best for the indivual scenes and the large scale of the plot.
Wow, my student film really made it in... The audio was in too.... Big honor, but also big cringe.....
no need to cringe. fail harder :)
nice
Don't feel too bad The Last Jedi made every one of these mistakes.
We all start the same way. Keep going!
Hahahahaha all student films are cringe
Actor pet peeve:
1) When they aren't talking, they just stand there with their hands either dead at their sides or clasped in front of them at bellybutton height. No one stands like that and says/ does nothing in a conversation. To make it worse, they then overdo their movements and intonation when they start speaking.
1. Own experience =/= Cinema (Personal experience lacks empathetic impact)
2. Casting and Performances are overlooked (be open minded when holding auditions and recognize that what you’re looking for might change)
3. Dialogue should be character centric and not just exposition (Use the medium and performances more effectively versus over-reliance on dialogue)
4. Repeating emotional beats (diversity in emotional range and pacing)
5. “What is this film about?” An essential question that must be able to be answered simply
Thanks
#6 how to talk to your director in a way that gets #1-5 across without insulting their ego and losing the job.
Being that filmmaking is a collaborative process, I'd prefer to avoid directors who have such an ego that I need to worry about how to talk to them--aside from common courtesy, of course. :)
@@keithmoore1329 I've been an editor for 33 years, and believe me, you have to work with all kind of directors - megalomaniac, egoists or good friends, philosophers, nerds, fast and practical, up to the ones who does'nt even show up during editing -comes just to see the final. But whatever you do, you have to think that is also YOUR project, not just someone elses job -otherwise you won't be able to stand the job for too long.
This video was extremely well done, on all counts. Excellent work.
I do have one issue with it, though:
Saying, "What can an editor do to fix these [problems with student films?]" frames the whole video from the much-maligned perspective of "fix it in post."
Student films, specifically, are usually not good. The creators are still learning. If a brilliant editor were to weave that straw into gold, it can give the writer/director/camera operator a false sense of accomplishment. This isn't just my intuition... I've seen it happen.
If a film sucks, let it suck. It's the only way that those responsible will learn.
Fortunately, by the end of the video, it was a lot more clear that this is a list of things that should be avoided in the first place.
Hello
Totally not what i was expecting to watch.!! That was absolutely brilliant. i loved the conversation style editing.
i was expecting things like,, camera,sound,story etc
I think that taking themselves too seriously is often a problem. Not that you shouldn't think highly of your product, but you should still be realistic about it and maybe put it into perspective if you just worked on the ideas for a few months or weeks.
Well said! #3 tends to bug me the most, even in vlogs. Please stop telling me what you're doing as you do it, or telling me what you're about to do next; narrating like that effectively duplicates what I can already see, sliding the supply curve of information to the right, devaluing both the information contained in the shot and the narration itself... or diminishes any potential anticipation for what's next. I like to think storytelling's a subtle art of taking things away. Slide the supply curve to the left, in just the right ways, and you can elicit a lot more value with less content.
nicely put!
Karen Pearlman Thanks, Karen! Looking forward to reading your book! :)
Oh wow 100% agree. I was so guilty lol
love this thanks for commenting
Great point Chris! I do this quite frequently and I’m hoping to find a better way to narrate a story while I’m in the moment.
This makes me appreciate real actors a lot more.
As an editor who's worked on several student films and first features, I can say that the biggest amateur problem is lack of coverage. Not giving the editor enough choices to shape the story. With enough coverage, the editor can fix a lot of the problems mentioned in this video.
I'm very lucky to actually have Karen as my professor, and one piece of advice that's stuck with me is to be clear on WHO the story is about. If you are clear about perspective, you'll have a clearer idea of which shots should be selected and how they should be cut together. Filmmaking should also be a constant feedback and improvement process, so be as organised and collaborative as humanly possible. Try to involve everyone (including actors) with shaping the script and action.
I watched this at 1.5 speed so as to feel less pain
I did the same but the pain came later.
The pain came to me afterwards as well when i've watched my movie after seeing this video
*"im leaving"*
ight imma head out
Leo Bladini u
I’m gonna take a shit 💩
I'll let myself out.
I've spoken.
biee
I'm so glad that you mentioned Milos Forman. It's sad, but he passed out just few days earlier. He was one of best directors of Czech Republic. Thank you that you honored him !
I also think that life experience plays heavily on how good a student film is. Some 25-year-olds have not seen enough of life to give their stories proper context,. Teens are not that great at making teen films because without the perspective of being an adult an understanding of what happened in their youth.
This video spoke to me on all mistakes I've made when deciding what to write. I've struggled too much on dialogue and reverted to using dialogue when I was stuck writing the story. I now learned to move forward is to find the theme and not focus too much on the little details and part of the plot and the ending of the film.
Student horror films seem to get this one wrong a lot: they don't give the audience the catalyst for anticipation. They often save the scare for the very end of the film. But the trouble here is that throughout the film the audience doesn't have a reason to be scared or to empathize with the characters because we haven't been given a glimpse of the monster/creator/ghost/demon. Without knowing what MIGHT lurk in the shadows, we aren't afraid of the dark.
This is fantastic. I often act as a reader for local playwriting contests, and I notice so often that dialogue stands in for action in so many plays (and theater is far more dialogue-dependent than film). I've had directors and actors tell me that they pay no attention to stage directions when they prepare for a show, and it can be so obvious when we think that saying something can stand in for doing something.
With film and video, it's far easier and less expensive to say something than to do something, so over-reliance on dialogue can be such an easy trap to fall into. I love great dialogue, but it's so true that it's to shine a light on character, not to propel the plot or the story.
stop putting your student films in forests. every one does it because its an accessible location and not because its important to the story. its bland
But when it's important for the film? Then it's good, right?
_richie_13 well I don’t see problem with it but in my case I love to film as many locations as possible even if it’s a small scene I would go to the gas station and film something quick or in a abandoned place or maybe in front of my apartment and I would even a shot in where the actor drives and passed by the camera in one road it’s more fun the thing is to be careful with people thinking your recording then haha
There are no woods anywhere near me so I guess I’ll be forced to not make that mistake
Forests and empty municipal parking garages.
@@andresnavarro5978 that's good, that sounds inspired and driven by creativity rather than "uh idk we'll film in the forest?"
2:20 well when you're 12 and only have 2 friends, it can be kinda difficult...
Meowsenberg just schedule an audition with Tom Hanks or something
Are you 12 and doing a film?
@@a.t.v3519 14 now
toasty And you are doing a film?
@@a.t.v3519 not currently. I haven't actually done much since this comment
Oh my God.
I’m a student filmmaker.
This video was extremely insightful. I’ve never even realized any of these mistakes as mistakes before. I thought I had a proficiency with what I do but it looks like I haven’t even scratched the surface. I have so much to learn.
Thank you for this great video!
I never had the opptunity to take a film class. But intuitively I always felt the way this editor feels. I'm glad I am on the same page with her. Loved the video.
This is such a great resource. 10 minutes that should not be ignored by students, indie, or big-budget filmmakers and writers. Bravo.🎥👍
Loved this video - very informative and definitely very accurate. I remember when I first started making movie with friends when I was 12-13, the most common problem we had was that everything felt forced and we were trying too hard to mimic what bigger movies were doing. In doing so, we neglected one of the most important aspects of movies which is forming an emotional connection with the audience. If you think about it, there's something very primal about the movies. It offers us an experience that - if done successfully - can move us to the core.
With that being said, I kinda started approaching filmmaking from that perspective and rather than focus too heavily on style and aesthetics, I try to find effective ways to illicit a response from the audience. I mean movies are made by humans, so instead of trying to produce this picture perfect movie, rather go for one that humans can relate to.
In my first student film assignment we weren’t allowed to have any sound. We got 100ft of 16mm reversal film, a camera, and that was it. It forced us to think hard about visual storytelling.
This is PURE GOLD
I have been a FIlm teacher for almost 5 years now at grade 9-10 in Denmark. For the most part planning is an issue for them. I also struggle with how much i should do for them and when i should let them make their own mistakes and learn. I have been using your material the past year. Its great. Thank you.
I believe the best humorous observation of #3 was done by I Hate Everything when he referred to an old lady character babbling off exposition as "Exposition Granny." Now I can never think anything else when I hear dialogue that smells remotely of exposition, and it even caused me to notice exposition dialogue ALL THE TIME where before I simply blindly accepted it. Student films have too many exposition grannies.
Another observation that often goes unspoken: at 6:40 you can see why shooting "flat" without 10-bit color and the necessary experience in color grading is a really bad idea. Stop shooting flat. If you can't afford a GH5 ($2000 + lens) at a MINIMUM, you can only make it look worse by shooting flat. If you think CineStyle on your T3i or 80D or whatever will somehow make your stuff look better, you're wrong, full stop. Especially for students, you need to be getting as much correct in-camera as possible.
Amen to that. I would say however a student could get a BPMCC mark I and have great footage for grading, but shouldn't do it. Honestly. RAW and LOG are really advanced technical processes to work with and should not be a concern for film students - I did this mistake as well tho. A lot of great people also work with colors in-camera - Roger Deakins is one extraordinary DP who, according to him, worked 100% with in-camera colors for Blade Runner. Now granted that's shot on Arri and corrected by pros but still.
I think at the end it just comes down to the basics.
The problem we face as students and beginners (I'm starting my photography business) is the plethora of highly technical gear available at affordable prices. It's great to have it. It is freeing, only, for someone who got to work with basic gear and got a firm grasp on the *basics*.
And that IMHO would be learning to shoot black and white first to understand shape, light and shadow play, and avoid the soap-opera 3 point lighting "inside a TV studio" look. Then colors then lighting with colors (gelled lights and RGBs etc).
Too often because the technology is there available to us, and affordable to us, we want to use right away the Log profiles, the RGB LEDs, the drones, the radio triggers and HSS flashes (in the world of stills) etc but we skip on the basics.
And everything ends-up a mashed up soup of trendy slow-mo footage with the latest, most popular LUT (next time I see an orange and teal cheap LUT look, I... I was gonna say Imma break my monitor but this is not gonna happens...).
When I first watched Moonrise Kingdom, all I could think whenever I saw the little narrator guy onscreen was "EXPOSITION ELF"!
Thanks! This was quite educational, even for non-filmmakers.
As a fan of short films, I watch a lot of student and amateur ones in the process of trying to find a few which are 'good.' I come away from many of them wishing the editing was better. I can't tell you how much #3, in particular, irritates me!! I don't think there's anything worse than that, except maybe an overabundance of overlayed narration as exposition.
Nice work.
This was excellent insight, and well thought out, genuine advice. Filmmakers probably make these mistakes over and over before stumbling on a gem like this video that expounds on common mistakes. Thank you!
thank you. but just to be clear, it's OK to make mistakes. Best way to succeed is to fail harder :)
Your videos never disappoint! The detailed tutorials, clear comparisons, and brilliant showcases of sound design and storytelling are incredibly helpful. Thanks for the insightful and well-explained content.
Great content, Sven. Since I like making RUclips videos so much, my friends challenged me to create some kind of "dramatic" short film. I haven't come up with a script yet, which to me seems like the right place to start, but definitely I think this video gave me some great insights. For me as an amateur, I can say what I like or dislike only intuitively, but it's very helpful when you and Karen break it down into clear concepts like nuanced emotions, empathy, rhythmic beats, etc. I'm saving this video in my playlist so I can review it after I have a script, or even a premise, to work with. Thanks again. I love your work.
I'm an actor .
Last year I appeared in 19 student films.
18 of them went into the dumpster.
Here's my top problems .
1, film schools are admitting students who have zero aptitude for film making. They want the tuition fees. Their graduation films are for the most part dumpster food.
2. Film schools want to play nice, so everybody gets a medal...I've been on sets where the camera is switched to autofocus, this was on a final course film
3. Scripts are absolutely appalling ...painful dialogue, no meaningful dialogue between actors..
4. Static cameras poor or nonexistent blocking.
5. Directors who don't know how to block a scene, move the camera, create the right lighting.
6 .Directors who don't pay attention to an actors performance and think that the shot is most important.
7. Totally incompetent casting choices.
8.DOPs who have no ideahow their shot relates to the rest of the film.
9.Terrible sound recording....poor mic placement.
10. No feel for lighting or atmosphere.
11. Filming a half baked personal experience they think will make a great story using a script that should never be filmed.
There's more but that should do.
I just graduated with a film degree and all I can say is I blame my professors, all lacked any energy or passion about new ideas or techniques, all we watched my 4 years were studio binder videos and felt like I wasted my time. All I’d say is major in something else and learn on your own yall 🗣️
How about the morning scene at the begining when lead character wakes up?
This info was helpful to me as I am working on my second short. I am not a student in literal terms but a student in learning on writing and directing. This segment also actually gave me some insight as an actor. I am checking out the student film list. The snippets seemed interesting.
I had a great time working on this video! Lots of useful info for aspiring and even professional filmmakers here. Keep up the great conversations!
thanks for your great work Vincent!
Karen Pearlman Any time!
thank you Vinnie. The set looks amazing and the editing is stellar.
Thanks, Sven!
I would respectfully argue about no. 5 and No. 3, the problem is not that the writer is telling their personal story. A lot of the premises from personal experiences are very compelling from most (not all) writers when you hear the writer/director explain why its so meaningful, like sitting them down and having a conversation about their idea.
The problem is all of the context they have spoken does not make it onto the screenplay, I see it so often. They get caught up in trying to force in subtext to look smart, or dont have the context on the page so the reader can experience what the writer experienced when they had it. Like @00:39 "I'm going crazy" as stakes for the protagonist, thats an internal stake, thats very hard for the audience to experience visually on the screen, its very internal, so we wont get the same experience the writer /director had.
Remember filmmaking is an energy transference business, you have to get the emotional, compelling story that plays in your head and somehow write it down so that I have the exact same experience when I read the script/watch the film....sounds simple but it's NOT! trust me, not trying to brag but I've a writing mentor in the industry very recently, who's teaching me to write compelling writing to the industry standard, it's really tough but the no. 1 mistake is lack of clear context from the protagonist and their goal, stakes etc.
Don't send your script to a friend/producer/director/mentor and ask what they thought generally. Give them a list of context questions about the main character their goal, stakes, why those stakes felt so meaningful to the character in pursuit if their goal. If their answers line up with what you had in mind you're off to a great start.
A lot of other mistakes I see is that most writers don't write in compelling conflict or a sheer lack of clarity from the protagonist or an internal goal that we the viewer cannot experience, a lot of the times with conflict its just people arguing for the sake of it, and none of the essential context listed above. Conflict is the engine that drives your script all the way to the end.
Sorkin, Mamet said it before and its the bedrock of great writing. Writers often complain about second act and how they struggle with it and blame it, its like driving across the country and blaming a mid west city that your car stopped driving, when your car ran out of gas, not the cits fault...and the "gasoline" is compelling conflict....to quote David Mamet when he spoke to his writers room "you'll learn to write in compelling conflict or you'll be on the f*%king dole line" ie its essential.
also for a video directed at student filmmakers having a comment like "cinematic empathy is more nuanced than just sympathy with someone's situation.." "..into something that has an emotional flow" that sounds very vague/tad high brow/little pretentious and really hard for a new writer/filmmaker to grasp, needs simplicity and specificity for a new filmmaker to get a hold of, sorry. I was new to this game not so long ago and to be frank that sounds like gibberish, pretentious criticism if I'm being really honest in the context of speaking to a student filmmaker and trying to help them improve in a specific way.
Jesus, exactly. Everything you say comes from experience only. It's like they're saying: "Your experience ain't worth watching." I don't underestimate anything or anyone. I believe, with the right way of telling, even the most boring story can be pretty interesting and great.
I was expecting an april fools video. Very happily surprised Sven! Great work!
This video popped up in my suggestions and found it to be pretty inspiring! Definitely going to use those tips, especially about building everything around a theme rather than just plot for plot's sake.
Thank you to all the TGE Facebook Group Members that allowed us to show clips from their films. Here you can watch their student work:
ruclips.net/p/PLNEhn13QqMlZtgUJEVwBKwyLzhDT8N-Mf
The intent of the ep. is not to shame anyone, but to look at some common problems with student work, to reflect on it, and help us grow as storytellers.
Thanks for the great video! Would you mind adding my short to the list, as a couple of clips were used in the video?
ruclips.net/video/qOGAaFkEu-Y/видео.html
Thanks again!
Kyle
It has been added. Thank YOU :)
i study film on my own and iv skipped these mistakes already by watching my own short films, amazing video btw
Fantastic Video Sven! You guys went all out on the production value and it really helps tie the video together as a whole! Congrats! and hope all's been well with you!
Love these! I've definetely heard all of these during my time as a film student, but never so concise and well demonstrated. Thank you for this vid!
Mistaking your own experience for cinema. SO TRUE. Right now at my college there is not one but TWO student films in production where the writer/director is starring as himself. Same name and everything. While I find this incredibly cringe, at least they are making this dumb mistake in school.
Nicolas Stop Motion ur studying it as a career in University?
Warren Beatty made a career of it! He had the looks, though.
I liked how at the end she gets up from the chair when you thank each other for the video. Very subtle but pleasing.
I absolutely LOVE you two together!! I gain so much insight watching these videos, and the knowledge i gain from it gives me such a much broader perspective on the art of editing!! thank you for uploading, and i hope to see more videos like this in the future
oh my god this is so helpful!! I'm so happy it's from an editing perspective as well because I've seen too many of these where they don't even talk about editing and I'm stuck because i'm trying to save these films in such a short amount of time! I'm sending these to all the student directors i work with in the future so they know about what to do. Thank you so much for this!
this is gold. probably the best thing i've watched on youtube this year. thank you for sharing
wow! I just started as a film student and can say i’ve been doing every single one of these!! such a helpful video
Dude! You just made my first feature film so much better! Thank you. Love your channel!
Has anyone, ever in real life said "I'm leaving" before turning to walk out a door?!
I swear, that is one of the funnest things I have ever seen in a move.
Was it supposed to be a comedy?
If I just leave like that without saying anything, it's rude.
so much information, interesting choice in not introducing the people doing the VO on film. it didn't detrack from the video and got straight to the point.
Thanks to a bunch of all these RUclips channels, I am learning different things than I did in my course.
This is a great video. Very well done. I loved the patron shout out method!
Oh my goodness. This video just changed my whole view on filmmaking, better late than never!! Thank you so much for making this, I'm blown away right now!
I think I might have said this on another one of your videos (or did I just think it?) but your channel is the best of it's kind. I was just watching this video and thinking, "how is he giving this stuff away for free?" Then it dawned on me: Patreon! And then the guilt set in. So I guess I'm going to have to hop on over there and donate (not my usual course of action bc I've got the whole starving artist thing going on right now) but your material has helped me so much I have no choice but to give back. Thanks Sven. Please keep up the amazing altruism.
that is awesome. welcome to the clubhouse.
Saw a clip from a short film that was entered into a local competition where I live. Cool to see that it got some more recognition!
What an awesome discussion. I had a few light bulbs light up for sure and I noticed in this video itself you were including some of the keys youve previously pointed out before. It all makes for an enjoyable and educational video. Thanks again I love what you do and am very greatful you share this to us. Cheers.
This lady has a hypnotic voice. I can listen to her any day.
I was so happy, when you mentioned Miloš Forman (I'm alson from Czech republic)....but than..... RIP 2018
The student film playlist is linked to only one film.
try now... ruclips.net/p/PLNEhn13QqMlZtgUJEVwBKwyLzhDT8N-Mf
It works! Thanks for the amazing video and featuring other student films!
Personally I really liked the compilation you made around 6:02. By cutting it from 43 to 9 seconds, you do convey a feeling of someone trying to distract himself with photography, but it's clear that it's not working - something is really bothering him, and the feeling just won't go away.
i agree with directors not casting roles adequately. i feel like not everyone is made for every role. yes, it’s nice to show range of an actor but some people just aren’t cut out for a role or acting in general.
I did no education for any of this but I've been watching and learning from great written shows and movies. When I watch these kinds of videos I always notice how I make none of the beginners mistakes anymore, also with those "points of no return" in your story, I had never heard of it but I always use it. It's great to learn haha
I am studiyng by myself and hope onde day I can make some films, and tell my stories to the world. Your channel is an inspiration, please keep doing this great work! Cheers from Portugal!
If the names really were subtly interspersed throughout this video, then I definitely missed that, but once you revealed it, I sure caught my name at the end! Yay! Great video, as always. But it's crazy how I just had to subscribe to your channel again! How can I not be subscribed? I'm a patron!! Lol. Guess RUclips is right back to its antics.
You spoke about topics other wouldn't of which I don't think is the Top 5 but they are very great topics that do explain alot of problems I see in aspiring filmmakers and I'm glad you made this video, great video as always!!
Good video. These are the ones I've done/seen others do the most:
-Yelling "Cut!" immediately after the last line/action, not giving the editor enough room to edit.
-Forgetting the "rule of rules." You see, when a theatrical feature film does something (script-wise or visually) that goes against what textbooks say, the viewer knows that it's on purpose. When a student short film does it, the viewer thinks that it's due to the budget or lack of talent. I know this might sound discouraging for those who want to be more original, but it's a sacrifice you have to make not until you become an A-lister but at least until you can prove that you have a career, no matter how many feature films you make. BOTTLE ROCKET didn't have the perfectly simetrical shots. RESERVOIR DOGS didn't have the over-the-top zoom-ins.
-Using free music. Nowadays, you don't need a big budget to have a good score. Find a musician and have him compose new music. Even if they don't know how to play the instrument that you want, have him compose and then use the notation on a music software. It's not hard to find someone that knows how to arrange it if necessary.
-Not paying attention to the sound editing/mixing. Little details like steps or placing something on a table can help the production seem more professional.
You should do a video on this
7:13 Great illustration
7:41 Theme - Perspective - What is the film about - Connecting the audience
Not just student films. I see these in movies all the time.
It took me about 2 years to break these habits! Still sneak up on me though lol a big one I see a lot is to heavy(visible) color grade. Your viewer should feel it, not get stuck fixating on it
Went to film school @ USC - can confirm this video is LEGIT.
Its nice seeing someone work on hitfilm, glad to know I'm not the only one.
Insightful video. Liked it very much. In such a short duration, it touched many crucial elements.
Though it seems to be presented with relevance to edit, but it also emphasize on basics of Filmmaking & deeper thought process.
Additionally while going through the comments by viewers, got to know helpful examples & explanations.
Many Thanks Dr. Karen, Steven, Vincent & entire Team for creating & sharing this guiding video.
Also thanking to all viewers who shared their queries, views, experiences & details in comments to help in learning & growing others.
Wellwishes to all for happiness, health, harmony, contentness 👍
Love
Very interesting. One thing that struck me is that each of the five things had to do with story. There were no techniques, such as lighting, sound, framing, camera movement, etc.
The one about casting is certainly correct, but I wonder how many student films are actually cast? I would think that most are begging for any cast they can get. I know I certainly was. In my first short neither of the leads wanted to be in the film. They filled in at the last minute because I didn't have anyone else. One hadn't even read the script prior to shooting. That said, I really liked the comment about auditions (asking them to do it differently). Should I ever get to the point I can have auditions I will certainly do that.
I'll have to re-watch it, likely several times. I am, after all, a "student" filmmaker.
astute observation :) Sound and visuals do matter, but it's usually story and acting that need to work first.
Thanks. It seems that "everyone", myself included, concentrate on technique. Most of the training you find is also mostly about technique. I have tried to concentrate on story, but not much on acting. But, I'm not sure there is much I can do there as I'm begging for cast. One thing I really need to learn is how to tell when I am getting a good performance and how to direct someone to try and get what I want. The performance always seems better on set when I'm shooting than when I edit the film. Then again, maybe I need to be better at editing...
I realize more than ever that I'm very lucky to have had access to the theatre department at my college when I was shooting films there. And being an actor myself helps a lot, as obviously I would know actors and know whether they would fit certain roles.
As for technique. Orson Welles didn't know shit about filmmaking when he made Citizen Kane. What he DID know from working in theatre is acting and story. He was already a master at that. So he leaned heavily on his crew to get the technique right and was fortunate to have one of the best cinematography of that era. He also watched a lot of other movies just to get a feel for that sort of thing. But he always focused most on what he was great at: Story and acting.
Well that's the difference between a real film maker and amateur ! A pro will put the extra time and effort to find good acting partners, not at the last minute. This is why you see top directors use the same actor again and again.
It's pays real dividends to find and build relationships with actors who want to be actors seriously. Like the pros say, the jobs done when you cast!
So if I was doing it, I'd seriously got out of my way big time to find those new serious upcoming actors, they are there. You just have to have that true desire to make something great, not rush it out last minute. Real pros often take years and years planning a movie and casting it.
It's not complicated just takes some brain cells to realise the real work is done in the pre planning and script, and casting and pre shooting script for true art. Otherwise it's it's amateur theatre.
This is extremely helpful. Glad that the plot and theme got emphasised on the video. Beautiful.
Fantastic video. Really well made and great information. Sending it to my students immediately! But like you said, these are great reminders for everyone, not only students.
Thank you so much for this valuable information!
So glad I subscribed to your channel.
Very best to you!
Cheers, Pete
amazing tips, watching student films and bad movies or indies in local festivals, sometimes teach us more about how to make a great film that watching good cinema and make us appreciate more good film-making.
Wow! Such a valuable video! I think you should change the title to Films by Aspiring Filmmakers because it's not just students who'd make these mistakes. Filmmakers who are early (and sometimes experienced) in their career make these mistakes quite often.
As I studied film in high school and college I noticed the importance of a editor that knows how to create emotion.