If it makes you feel better, remember, mailboxes can't feel anything. It's just Harry projecting. As for the purpose? Damaging objects, like the mailbox allows you go gain a thought that raises the learning cap for all FYS skills by +1 (plus, +1 to pain threshhold, and you can heal damage by hitting other objects, sometimes). Every attribute has at least one thought that does this. It can be pretty useful. Your FYS is pretty high though, so it's not all that important.
@@tomaO2Yes, it is Harry projecting, doesn’t that make it just as bad thought? It means that he is harming himself by doing so. And wouldn’t that thought just make you sadistic?
You'll get the thought "Anti-object task force" for being a menace to man-made material things. :P It would have been a great thought in the beginning for this playthrough, or sometime around the crazy 3-8% check success on Klaasje's balcony door. Anyway see how kicking the mailbox was a Pain Threshold check? That's probably the darkest path Harry can take in this game, if followed all the way through. Play DE every other way if you like, but not that way. It's one hell of unnerving bummer.
I really like the more structured and purposeful direction these later videos have taken. Now that Brady has a handle on the mechanics and dynamics he can really focus each episode on a point that only he can elucidate to the world ❤
The car talk is one of my favorite little Kim highlights. If you go with Visual Calculus’ suggestion for improving it, and use Encyclopedia to impress Kim with Harry’s own car knowledge, you can get him to agree to spend their next day off working on it together.
I always thought that the youth center was just a random civic building that evrart bs'ed you with. But then i remembered cuno throwing rocks at a corpse. I thought of the girl being used as an employee by her mom. Cunoesse lying in a hallway. Thanks to this playthrough, I realized evrart was right in what he said, and Revachol definitely needs literally any childcare. But with Evrart as always it comes down to whether you believe that he actually means it.
Okay, this is a theory of mine (which I don't know how obvious or far fetched is), but I feel like Evrart's sliminess is fake. He pretends to be a corrupt wirm because Moralintern /Wild Pines can trust him when he is this way. The powerful people need the corrupt to lead unions because they can be negotiated with. They trust him to choose his own interests, to line his own pockets - and that is what he meant by "ugly people being good at politics". He wants to be the hero of the working class, but looking like one would get him in an early grave (or at least keep him from anything resembling the position of power). Moreover, think of civility politics. Who can afford to be civil? People like Joyce, the rich and the powerful who have everything under control. They can act as benevolent as they like - but they are aware they're a part of the system that keeps the overwhelming amount of people miserable. Which brings to mind what Mañana said about Evrart "Sure, he is reasonably corrupt, but he is corrupt for our sakes".
When you think of a slimy person, it's typically someone who tries to manipulate you, but can't disguise their true motivations. In that regard everard's sliminess is definitely fake. The fact that his manipulations are so easy to point out serves only to demonstrate the power he has to still get away with them.
From wild pines point of view, he's in their pocket. They had a good relationship, the negotiator was capable, had access, and was probably "generous" to Evrart. They didn't know about the drugs, the back channels, everything he was doing to bring power and money to Martinaise And then one day he kicks out the negotiator, slams the doors, and stops taking bribes. From the POV of wild pines, you just got used by somebody who had bigger goals than an easy paycheck.
I also suscribe to the "Evrart is double faking" theory. A good guy pretending to be a bad guy pretending to be a good guy. ("Good" not being the best term here, but it keeps my sentence from being five times as long.) It would work so well. Not to mention we interact with him through a cop, an antagonist, and not an ally or even a neutral party. I wish I could interact with the people of Martinaise as a layman! It would be so interesting.
@@europeanwildcat I'd say it's "well intentioned pretending to be corrupt pretending to be well intentioned". He did do a certain stunt that is a spoiler that, I think, is very immoral of him, but still, within his own framework - permissible.
Oh yeah, that's a good way to say it. I'm not very good with words lol. I'm not sure what stunt exactly you're referring to 🤔 but Brady could read this, so probably best to avoid spoilers
It's interesting that you mention Evrart in his "tower"! The game makes you feel that way at times, but also has Joyce working from a luxury yacht while Evrart works in a shipping container, just like many of the rank and file Union members (albeit with different tasks.) I think there's a tendency for people to perceive their relative power in reverse, perhaps because of literal size and the refined vs. crude dynamic - the latter being especially thematically relevant given that "proper" behavior tends to reflect the values of those with power.
THESE REPLIES CONTAIN SPOILERS. PLEASE READ AT YOUR OWN RISK. Joyce is a trained company negotiator who thinks on her feet. A sloop is luxurious and flexible. She uses her flexibility to get around the conversation smoothly, effortlessly. She bribes you and you don't even notice. Hell, you likely think it's your idea. Her bosses are offscreen. They live in another world. If you saw them up close, it would make Evrart's syndicate look like a sandcastle. She's on the side with the money and the power. When you already run the show, you can afford the privilege of appearing clean and professional. Wild Pines are part of the established order of Revachol as a whole, so there's less of a wall between her and you. She's just more fun and friendly to talk to. Unlike Joyce' flexibility, Evrart is immobile: physically, psychologically, and socially. His empire is built out of shipping containers, and contains more moving parts than a kvalsund crane. He's blatantly, childishly slimy. He uses the same tricks as stage magicians, conversationalists, and charlatans, and gets away with it because he seems to have popular support among the union. Don't look at the people who didn't like him, they never existed 😉 He reminds me of someone who did basic media training and improvised the rest through experience, rather than the professional negotiation training Joyce had. His corruption is open for all to see, and plays dirty. But his power base is cobbled together out of ruins, like everything else in Martinaise. The union filled the gap that the official and unofficial power structures had left in their wake. I think it's easy to hate Evrart because his corruption is easier to spot. He's antagonistic towards you. He's manipulative, power hungry, uses any means available to him, and bluntly holds the fate of Martinaise in his hands for his own gain. You're also on his turf, whether it should be his or not. His power is antagonistic to the moralintern, unlike both Wild Pines and the RCM, so that makes it easier to point out his abuses of power. Joyce says 'her superiors' authorise disproportionate force, while the buck stops at Evrart. It's easier to blame someone with a face. But it's also easy to make apologia for him. You're a cop and he's a corrupt quasisocialist mob boss, of course he's going to stonewall and intimidate you. Before the union, Martinaise was nothing but some blown up ruins. Could you build something better given the context? Evrart thinks that the ends justify the means, and that emerges in direct contrast to the moralintern's ideology of incremental change. A hypocritical ideology. Nowhere illustrates its hollowness better than Martinaise.
@@AvonGingell Evrart has you completely fooled my guy if you actually think he's inept. It's all a ruse to make you think he's not as in touch as you think, it's his greatest trick. He makes you believe he's hiding something when in fact, he's been honest with you the whole time. Meanwhile Joyce's traditional approach falls like a house of cards once you progress through her dialogue tree enough. Spoilers: She completely fails her mission and it's all her fault. She eventually admits that she has MUCH more power than she lets on. She is the once who is tasked to stop to striking, and how does she go about it? By hiring violent and racist mercenaries. She vastly underestimates Evrart, shows her cards way too quickly and thus Evrart has control over the whole situation without even having to initiate it.
I don't think he's inept at all, just that his approach appears less slick than Joyce. He counts on it. The detective underestimates him just like she does, because he's primed by both Joyce and Kim to see him as a mob boss, with all the typical stereotypes associated with that title.
By contrast, Joyce puts up the appearance of being a smooth operator, but hiring war criminal mercenaries is the bluntest thing you could possibly do to suppress a strike. Her slickness is also an illusion. Fact is, Evrart does lie to you. What about the forewoman who "forgot she put her casserole in the oven?" He's not entirely honest, even though he does tell the truth about some things, like the youth center.
I got the passive check where you get to talk to Kim about his car on the first day and it was precious to me, since it was the first time where Kim showed enthusiasm about anything. Hawing to pawn off his hubcaps hurt so much more though.
(Spoilers in second paragraph). I think people vastly underestimate how clever Evrart Claire really is, as shown by some comments in here. While Joyce has a very 'traditional' approach to her manipulation and corruption, Evrart wears his on his sleeve. It catches people in an emotional reaction to his behaviour, you're distracted by trying to 'figure him out' when in reality there's literally nothing to figure out. He's told you everything. He's been 99% honest, more honest than most other characters truth be told. His overt 'sliminess' is a deliberate ruse to catch you off guard and make you think he's inept. Meanwhile Joyce has completely failed in her mission. She may be eloquent, intelligent, polite, etc. But it's a mask. She reveals that she has much more power than initially let on if you follow her dialogue, she is basically on the Wild Pines board (iirc). It's HER who commissioned the mercenaries, who she knew were violent, racist and irrational. All in order to intimidate and cause chaos among the striking workers, it's not beyond possibility that she knew they would murder innocent people - and she can completely avoid responsibility for this. However their violent nature completely backfires on her. She underestimates Evrart Claire (just like most players). She shows her hand, and all Evrart does is use that hand against her. He IS incredibly smart.
The way that I remember it, Joyce was against hiring the mercenaries to terrorize the union, but was just outvoted at the board meeting. But I would argue that makes the stance she takes at the negotiation worse. She doesn't really try to negotiate with Evart. While Evart doesn't make it easy, it is achievable, as Harry and the previous negotiator have proven. She knows that people will die because she won't want act more drastically that her position demands of her. But she is ok with people dying, because she has accepted the system that created her.
@@Oneiromantisgr That is what Joyce tells Harry, but actually she is a member if the board, potentially the CEO of Wild Pines, meaning that even if she really was outvoted in the board meeting about the mercenaries, she lied about who she is and how much power she really has over what she can offer the Union in the name of the company.
Fun fact: Public relations, which Bernays founded, is a more palatable synonym for propaganda. There was a short movie featuring Noam Chomsky and others that talked about Bernays' work - "Propaganda: The Manufacture of Consent"
Jinx on the "because that's life" line. That's why so many people love the politics in this game. Because it's real. It's a true illustration of politics as it relates to real people, not caricatures.
The flags and kings thing is a "royalist" answer, i.e. fascist. You're telling him that his plan doesn't have enough nationalistic pride in it. Evrart's response of promising to add a skull and crossbones for you is a brilliant troll.
this locus of control thing has helped me understand a lot and put so much of my behaviour into context thank u brady 😭😭 therapy has never worked for me because i guess i have too much internal locus of control and everything is always my responsibility/my fault so i've found it hard to believe that anyone other than myself could or should have to deal w my problems
Dude! You had me going with withdrawal symptoms bc you skip the 2 day upload schedule lol! Now i can had my dosis of therapist plays with my morning coffee
been quietly enjoying the last batch of episodes ( the entire empty chair technique episode was -chefs kiss - ) since you're winding down on this playthrough some indie game recs that might scratch the character driven narrative itch without being odyssey length; The Beginners Guide (Pretty short) - Slay the Princess - Tiny Bunny - In stars and Time ( Full disclosure on not playing / watching the last three mentioned (( The buffer of trying not to consciously pull from potentially likeminded ideas that may dilute or influence ones own )) but we've heard nothing but good / interesting things about them when mentioned! )
It's also curious how Evrart is demonstrating some sort of "selfish care" for the Martinaise district. He wants the district to prosper but doesn't give a flying f--k about all the other districts around so he's completely fine with pouring a huge stream of drugs into the said other districts. And he's so tunnel visioned on his district's and his own gain that he doesn't think ahead of how ruining all the other districts of Revachole will eventually wreck his district as well.
For me Evrart and Joyce are two sides of the same coin. They both manipulate you to get what they want, but Joyce hides it behind intellectual debates and open-ness/Honesty, while Evrart uses a mixture of veiled threats/pressure and feigned friendliness.
Evrart (or Edgar) has nothing to worry about anymore. He took advantage of the situation and now has a Xanathos's gambit (a plan in which all foreseeable outcomes benefit the planner). If the cops can't stop the tribunal, there will be blood of innocents in the hands of Wild Pines, and the people will point out to them and demand justice, which is exactly what Evrart wants. If the cops prevent the tribunal, then the Union can say they helped avoid a dissaster, which will both empower the movement and question the reasoning on the company's actions, which is exactly what Evrart wants. And if the tribunal happens but the mercenaries lose, that would prove the people can withstand the power of Wild Pines, that they can beat them, justifying a harder stance against them in the future, which is exactly what Evrart wants. Whatever happens, he gets his revolution.
Brady I just cant believe you would hurt that poor mailbox 😢. No but once again fantastic episode I look forward to the next! I plan on subbing to your patreon soon in support . Much love Brady! ❤
Hey Brady, the option you chose at 1:06:21 was the "fascist" nationalist response. Revachol used to be a kingdom before the communists took over (and then the communists were defeated and Revachol taken over by the moralist coalition). I think Rene gives you the most lore about it, but Gary and maybe Racist Lorry Driver also talk of preferring the old kingdom days - I think they also have flags up in their apt or truck. I feel like the game rarely ever lets you express a reasonable opinion - it's always an extreme of some sort (even the boring option is an extreme centrist take of "not my business") 😂
The Locust of Control rules the city of rage from within, organizing, manipulating, gathering power. He will bend the city of rage to his whims and shape that rage into the mandible of truth that will cleave responsibility to accountability. The new world will rise from this cryptid.
Evrart is definitely a complex character and it definitely is all about him. But there is one crucial difference between Evrart and Joyce. Evrart has absolutely no moral compass whatsoever while Joyce does. There is more information that you can learn about the Claire brothers later in the game that may affect your opinion of them. However, the source of this information will not be Evrart Claire or Joyce Messier.
haha yeah who would deny help from friends offering help, that's kinda irrational amirite? haha!!! Really love to learn about new stuff like locus of control, great video!!!
i think the perspective of claire on the people in the fishing village is different than your reasoning. while he thinks highly of himself, and certainly higher than those people and others too, he has a sense of camaraderie due to his upbringing. we dont know much, but he is from here and its fair to assume he grew up in poverty, as thats all thats around. i find his demeaning remarks about children playing with feces and such are more of a way to express his disgust with the cards he's been given, as were the children. maybe in a sort of post traumatic distancing himself as he became successful. seeing himself now as a mighty provider that can do now what his parents and community wasnt able to and bring change. on another front i think that his stance, and the whole leftist aspect of his organisation being a labour union impacts his perception. the dramatisation of living condition of the people in the fishing village, while certainly being poverty, is too harsh. i disagree with your view of trying to find upsides about it. sure there are some. people will attempt to make the best of what they have, but change is needed and in this case quite desperately. village has a population of like 10 people, half of them alcoholics and as washerwomen said people dont come there, they just leave as did her family. about the measures claire is willing to take, while brutal, you can understand that its what he sees as necessary for improvement of their living condition. i genuinely believe him when he says hell put them in low-income housing afterwards. and imo itd worth it for the children and the future at the cost of the current residents. hes just cold and smug about it
I like Evrart's response when you ask him why he's so fat. The skills, and by extension Harry, often uses the weight of Evrart and Angus as comedic relief - embarrassing to watch, but very in character - but this specific interaction is a nice little bit of "Do you even realize what you're saying/thinking?"
Lol i love the elon shade. You are right, he flipped to the other side the moment he got any pushback. He needs to he recognised for his achievements, venerated even.
I don’t think the comparisons with Phillip Morris and Elon Musk work very well, but I think it’s telling that the personalities you’re invoking for the comparison are capitalists. Without the union, *only* the Messiers and Musks of the world would have their hooks in Martinaise. Evrart isn’t a vulgar profiteer; he’d be better described (quoting Rust from the 1st season of True Detective) as one of the bad men who “keeps the other bad men at the door.” He’s Machiavellian for sure, but I don’t think it works to compare him to the capitalists he is attempting to protect his neighborhood from.
He only cares about his union though, you just need to watch the living conditions on the other side of the river to realize that he doesn’t like that they refused to unionize, he doesn’t care at all either about what happens as long as it doesn’t involve his boys, if other places have drug problems because of him doesn’t concern him. Although it cannot be denied that he indeed does care for the union at the very least.
@@Medivh9 that's a weird take. Where do you get that "the other side of the river refused to unionise"? How can a bunch of terminal alcoholics and old people unionize? They're basically paupers. And he does care for them, and include them as his own people, he's doing his development plan for them. As for drugs, it's a complex thing, but he's choosing a lesser evil of controlling drug trade in his area, because otherwise the drugs would be on the doorstep, and there would again be gangs and mafiosos running the show. But, if he's in position to control all the Wild Pines, or at least his own terminal, he's completely at leisure to cut drug trade completely, and he would be too powerful to mess with him at that point. It's as Manana says, he's corrupt, but he's corrupt for their benefit.
@@daod8286 I think you are giving him way too much credit, it is mentioned textually in the game that people that side of the river distrust the union and do not want anything to do with them. What right then, does he have to do this project? He is going to go through with the drugs plan as well, there is no question about that given that he needs it for funding and doesn’t care for the effects it will provoke elsewhere. He cares for the union, that is all.
@@Medivh9 no, textually it says that the washerwoman mistrusts him because he’s fat and in her mind that means bourgeois, and Lilienne is kinda apathetic, but wants good future for her children. All the other people the other side of the river are either literal children or in alcohol coma or nearing it. As for drugs, yeah, I agree it’s not very cool, but I’m not about to go and lambast what a revolutionary movement does to fund itself. Bolsheviks used robbery, for example. Some latam rev movements have been mixed in with drug trade. It’s distasteful, but such is the reality of being an underdog. And Evrart also mentions that illegal drug revenue is just a tiny slice of the revenue they would be getting through the terminals. Even with all that said, “What is the robbing of the bank compared to founding it?”. Sure, Evrart may be involved in contraband trade, violence, corruption, shady schemes… Doing it ten times over wouldn’t make him even a percent as bad as the people he’s fighting against. Evrart is acting in the interests of the oppressed, and it’s the action that counts for me.
Evrart is a political animal and political technologist. He has goals and his speech is 99% just a tool to get to his goals. You really have to get under his skin for the mask to crack a little.
I know you're trying to wrap up the game, but if you're interested in helping more youth, the two kids playing in front of Isobel actually have a questline!
I wouldn’t call Evrart good at all, he and Joyce are probably in the same level, both were willing to sacrifice lives by withholding information after all. But if there is one saving grace for Evrart is that he actually seems to care about the union.
I'M SORRY MAILBOX. More psychopathic manipulation coming soon. Episode 53 is up early for supporters on patreon, coming to YT soon. Enjoy!
Oddly enough kicking the mailbox was a mini reenactment of burning Tommy 😢
If it makes you feel better, remember, mailboxes can't feel anything. It's just Harry projecting.
As for the purpose? Damaging objects, like the mailbox allows you go gain a thought that raises the learning cap for all FYS skills by +1 (plus, +1 to pain threshhold, and you can heal damage by hitting other objects, sometimes). Every attribute has at least one thought that does this. It can be pretty useful. Your FYS is pretty high though, so it's not all that important.
@@tomaO2Yes, it is Harry projecting, doesn’t that make it just as bad thought? It means that he is harming himself by doing so. And wouldn’t that thought just make you sadistic?
Can't believe you're getting the super bad ending for hitting the mailbox..... Smh Brady!
You'll get the thought "Anti-object task force" for being a menace to man-made material things. :P It would have been a great thought in the beginning for this playthrough, or sometime around the crazy 3-8% check success on Klaasje's balcony door.
Anyway see how kicking the mailbox was a Pain Threshold check? That's probably the darkest path Harry can take in this game, if followed all the way through. Play DE every other way if you like, but not that way. It's one hell of unnerving bummer.
I really like the more structured and purposeful direction these later videos have taken. Now that Brady has a handle on the mechanics and dynamics he can really focus each episode on a point that only he can elucidate to the world ❤
The car talk is one of my favorite little Kim highlights. If you go with Visual Calculus’ suggestion for improving it, and use Encyclopedia to impress Kim with Harry’s own car knowledge, you can get him to agree to spend their next day off working on it together.
Mr. Evrart is helping me find my gun
Mr. Evrart is helping me find my gun
Mr. Evrart is helping me find my gun
He's beginning to see....
He's beginning to understand why people love the politics in this game
The mailbox can see right through your therapy ways😂
I always thought that the youth center was just a random civic building that evrart bs'ed you with. But then i remembered cuno throwing rocks at a corpse. I thought of the girl being used as an employee by her mom. Cunoesse lying in a hallway.
Thanks to this playthrough, I realized evrart was right in what he said, and Revachol definitely needs literally any childcare. But with Evrart as always it comes down to whether you believe that he actually means it.
Okay, this is a theory of mine (which I don't know how obvious or far fetched is), but I feel like Evrart's sliminess is fake. He pretends to be a corrupt wirm because Moralintern /Wild Pines can trust him when he is this way. The powerful people need the corrupt to lead unions because they can be negotiated with. They trust him to choose his own interests, to line his own pockets - and that is what he meant by "ugly people being good at politics". He wants to be the hero of the working class, but looking like one would get him in an early grave (or at least keep him from anything resembling the position of power).
Moreover, think of civility politics. Who can afford to be civil? People like Joyce, the rich and the powerful who have everything under control. They can act as benevolent as they like - but they are aware they're a part of the system that keeps the overwhelming amount of people miserable. Which brings to mind what Mañana said about Evrart "Sure, he is reasonably corrupt, but he is corrupt for our sakes".
When you think of a slimy person, it's typically someone who tries to manipulate you, but can't disguise their true motivations.
In that regard everard's sliminess is definitely fake.
The fact that his manipulations are so easy to point out serves only to demonstrate the power he has to still get away with them.
From wild pines point of view, he's in their pocket. They had a good relationship, the negotiator was capable, had access, and was probably "generous" to Evrart. They didn't know about the drugs, the back channels, everything he was doing to bring power and money to Martinaise
And then one day he kicks out the negotiator, slams the doors, and stops taking bribes. From the POV of wild pines, you just got used by somebody who had bigger goals than an easy paycheck.
I also suscribe to the "Evrart is double faking" theory. A good guy pretending to be a bad guy pretending to be a good guy. ("Good" not being the best term here, but it keeps my sentence from being five times as long.) It would work so well. Not to mention we interact with him through a cop, an antagonist, and not an ally or even a neutral party.
I wish I could interact with the people of Martinaise as a layman! It would be so interesting.
@@europeanwildcat I'd say it's "well intentioned pretending to be corrupt pretending to be well intentioned". He did do a certain stunt that is a spoiler that, I think, is very immoral of him, but still, within his own framework - permissible.
Oh yeah, that's a good way to say it. I'm not very good with words lol. I'm not sure what stunt exactly you're referring to 🤔 but Brady could read this, so probably best to avoid spoilers
I've been looking forward to your encounter with The Pigs. One of those big moments IMO. Definitely its own episode.
brady on his elon musk hater arc lets goooo
It's interesting that you mention Evrart in his "tower"! The game makes you feel that way at times, but also has Joyce working from a luxury yacht while Evrart works in a shipping container, just like many of the rank and file Union members (albeit with different tasks.) I think there's a tendency for people to perceive their relative power in reverse, perhaps because of literal size and the refined vs. crude dynamic - the latter being especially thematically relevant given that "proper" behavior tends to reflect the values of those with power.
THESE REPLIES CONTAIN SPOILERS. PLEASE READ AT YOUR OWN RISK.
Joyce is a trained company negotiator who thinks on her feet. A sloop is luxurious and flexible. She uses her flexibility to get around the conversation smoothly, effortlessly. She bribes you and you don't even notice. Hell, you likely think it's your idea. Her bosses are offscreen. They live in another world. If you saw them up close, it would make Evrart's syndicate look like a sandcastle. She's on the side with the money and the power. When you already run the show, you can afford the privilege of appearing clean and professional. Wild Pines are part of the established order of Revachol as a whole, so there's less of a wall between her and you. She's just more fun and friendly to talk to.
Unlike Joyce' flexibility, Evrart is immobile: physically, psychologically, and socially. His empire is built out of shipping containers, and contains more moving parts than a kvalsund crane. He's blatantly, childishly slimy. He uses the same tricks as stage magicians, conversationalists, and charlatans, and gets away with it because he seems to have popular support among the union. Don't look at the people who didn't like him, they never existed 😉 He reminds me of someone who did basic media training and improvised the rest through experience, rather than the professional negotiation training Joyce had. His corruption is open for all to see, and plays dirty. But his power base is cobbled together out of ruins, like everything else in Martinaise. The union filled the gap that the official and unofficial power structures had left in their wake.
I think it's easy to hate Evrart because his corruption is easier to spot. He's antagonistic towards you. He's manipulative, power hungry, uses any means available to him, and bluntly holds the fate of Martinaise in his hands for his own gain. You're also on his turf, whether it should be his or not. His power is antagonistic to the moralintern, unlike both Wild Pines and the RCM, so that makes it easier to point out his abuses of power. Joyce says 'her superiors' authorise disproportionate force, while the buck stops at Evrart. It's easier to blame someone with a face.
But it's also easy to make apologia for him. You're a cop and he's a corrupt quasisocialist mob boss, of course he's going to stonewall and intimidate you. Before the union, Martinaise was nothing but some blown up ruins. Could you build something better given the context? Evrart thinks that the ends justify the means, and that emerges in direct contrast to the moralintern's ideology of incremental change. A hypocritical ideology. Nowhere illustrates its hollowness better than Martinaise.
@@AvonGingell Evrart has you completely fooled my guy if you actually think he's inept. It's all a ruse to make you think he's not as in touch as you think, it's his greatest trick. He makes you believe he's hiding something when in fact, he's been honest with you the whole time. Meanwhile Joyce's traditional approach falls like a house of cards once you progress through her dialogue tree enough. Spoilers:
She completely fails her mission and it's all her fault. She eventually admits that she has MUCH more power than she lets on. She is the once who is tasked to stop to striking, and how does she go about it? By hiring violent and racist mercenaries. She vastly underestimates Evrart, shows her cards way too quickly and thus Evrart has control over the whole situation without even having to initiate it.
I don't think he's inept at all, just that his approach appears less slick than Joyce. He counts on it. The detective underestimates him just like she does, because he's primed by both Joyce and Kim to see him as a mob boss, with all the typical stereotypes associated with that title.
By contrast, Joyce puts up the appearance of being a smooth operator, but hiring war criminal mercenaries is the bluntest thing you could possibly do to suppress a strike. Her slickness is also an illusion.
Fact is, Evrart does lie to you. What about the forewoman who "forgot she put her casserole in the oven?" He's not entirely honest, even though he does tell the truth about some things, like the youth center.
I got the passive check where you get to talk to Kim about his car on the first day and it was precious to me, since it was the first time where Kim showed enthusiasm about anything. Hawing to pawn off his hubcaps hurt so much more though.
Youth-Supermarket-Church Complex? Really? I find it quite simple.
Based? Based on what?
You're telling me this empire is in land?
(Spoilers in second paragraph). I think people vastly underestimate how clever Evrart Claire really is, as shown by some comments in here. While Joyce has a very 'traditional' approach to her manipulation and corruption, Evrart wears his on his sleeve. It catches people in an emotional reaction to his behaviour, you're distracted by trying to 'figure him out' when in reality there's literally nothing to figure out. He's told you everything. He's been 99% honest, more honest than most other characters truth be told. His overt 'sliminess' is a deliberate ruse to catch you off guard and make you think he's inept.
Meanwhile Joyce has completely failed in her mission. She may be eloquent, intelligent, polite, etc. But it's a mask. She reveals that she has much more power than initially let on if you follow her dialogue, she is basically on the Wild Pines board (iirc). It's HER who commissioned the mercenaries, who she knew were violent, racist and irrational. All in order to intimidate and cause chaos among the striking workers, it's not beyond possibility that she knew they would murder innocent people - and she can completely avoid responsibility for this. However their violent nature completely backfires on her. She underestimates Evrart Claire (just like most players). She shows her hand, and all Evrart does is use that hand against her. He IS incredibly smart.
The way that I remember it, Joyce was against hiring the mercenaries to terrorize the union, but was just outvoted at the board meeting. But I would argue that makes the stance she takes at the negotiation worse. She doesn't really try to negotiate with Evart. While Evart doesn't make it easy, it is achievable, as Harry and the previous negotiator have proven. She knows that people will die because she won't want act more drastically that her position demands of her. But she is ok with people dying, because she has accepted the system that created her.
@@Oneiromantisgr That is what Joyce tells Harry, but actually she is a member if the board, potentially the CEO of Wild Pines, meaning that even if she really was outvoted in the board meeting about the mercenaries, she lied about who she is and how much power she really has over what she can offer the Union in the name of the company.
Has brady noticed that he uses the flashlight to gesticulate in game while he talks
It’s part of his swag. Obviously.
You locked yourself out of the best ending by kicking that mailbox...
Evrart proves to be TOO STRONG and POWERFUL for the MEEK therapist
Fun fact: Public relations, which Bernays founded, is a more palatable synonym for propaganda. There was a short movie featuring Noam Chomsky and others that talked about Bernays' work - "Propaganda: The Manufacture of Consent"
I made it to the latest episode! I'm so happy you're still working on this! I appreciate your effort throughout this journey! ❤
Jinx on the "because that's life" line. That's why so many people love the politics in this game. Because it's real. It's a true illustration of politics as it relates to real people, not caricatures.
I’ve learned a lot while watching this series, but I really want to thank you for introducing me to Bernays. What a fascinating career!
iirc evening starts at 8pm - you'll be able to tell because the whirling gets cool lights
The flags and kings thing is a "royalist" answer, i.e. fascist. You're telling him that his plan doesn't have enough nationalistic pride in it. Evrart's response of promising to add a skull and crossbones for you is a brilliant troll.
this locus of control thing has helped me understand a lot and put so much of my behaviour into context thank u brady 😭😭 therapy has never worked for me because i guess i have too much internal locus of control and everything is always my responsibility/my fault so i've found it hard to believe that anyone other than myself could or should have to deal w my problems
Dude you still have months of content XD Loving it.
The "not enough flags or kings" line is expressing support for nationalism and/or fascism. It's chest thumping as politics.
I've never seen evrarts response before now it's so good lmao "I'll even throw in a skull and bones for you"
Mailbox won't trust other people sympathy now...
ALL BECASE YOU WERE CURIOUS!
Dude! You had me going with withdrawal symptoms bc you skip the 2 day upload schedule lol! Now i can had my dosis of therapist plays with my morning coffee
Brady's serving some serious macaroni
So happy for a new episode 😍
been quietly enjoying the last batch of episodes ( the entire empty chair technique episode was -chefs kiss - ) since you're winding down on this playthrough some indie game recs that might scratch the character driven narrative itch without being odyssey length; The Beginners Guide (Pretty short) - Slay the Princess - Tiny Bunny - In stars and Time ( Full disclosure on not playing / watching the last three mentioned (( The buffer of trying not to consciously pull from potentially likeminded ideas that may dilute or influence ones own )) but we've heard nothing but good / interesting things about them when mentioned! )
Seconding Slay the Princess. That game's literally all about psychology with a side dish of philosophy.
It's also curious how Evrart is demonstrating some sort of "selfish care" for the Martinaise district.
He wants the district to prosper but doesn't give a flying f--k about all the other districts around so he's completely fine with pouring a huge stream of drugs into the said other districts.
And he's so tunnel visioned on his district's and his own gain that he doesn't think ahead of how ruining all the other districts of Revachole will eventually wreck his district as well.
For me Evrart and Joyce are two sides of the same coin. They both manipulate you to get what they want, but Joyce hides it behind intellectual debates and open-ness/Honesty, while Evrart uses a mixture of veiled threats/pressure and feigned friendliness.
Evrart (or Edgar) has nothing to worry about anymore. He took advantage of the situation and now has a Xanathos's gambit (a plan in which all foreseeable outcomes benefit the planner). If the cops can't stop the tribunal, there will be blood of innocents in the hands of Wild Pines, and the people will point out to them and demand justice, which is exactly what Evrart wants. If the cops prevent the tribunal, then the Union can say they helped avoid a dissaster, which will both empower the movement and question the reasoning on the company's actions, which is exactly what Evrart wants. And if the tribunal happens but the mercenaries lose, that would prove the people can withstand the power of Wild Pines, that they can beat them, justifying a harder stance against them in the future, which is exactly what Evrart wants. Whatever happens, he gets his revolution.
Brady I just cant believe you would hurt that poor mailbox 😢. No but once again fantastic episode I look forward to the next! I plan on subbing to your patreon soon in support . Much love Brady! ❤
Digging the new cut, Brady!
god i love the trials and tribulations of you with evrart
Looking forward to seeing how you handle getting Harry's gun back from The Pigs.
Hey Brady, the option you chose at 1:06:21 was the "fascist" nationalist response. Revachol used to be a kingdom before the communists took over (and then the communists were defeated and Revachol taken over by the moralist coalition). I think Rene gives you the most lore about it, but Gary and maybe Racist Lorry Driver also talk of preferring the old kingdom days - I think they also have flags up in their apt or truck. I feel like the game rarely ever lets you express a reasonable opinion - it's always an extreme of some sort (even the boring option is an extreme centrist take of "not my business") 😂
I've only now just realized that since the start of this series I've finished both my second and third runs of Disco Elysium....
I wonder what Joyce has to say about this...
🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔
Harry relapsed but the mailbox had it coming
The Locust of Control rules the city of rage from within, organizing, manipulating, gathering power. He will bend the city of rage to his whims and shape that rage into the mandible of truth that will cleave responsibility to accountability. The new world will rise from this cryptid.
Evrart is definitely a complex character and it definitely is all about him.
But there is one crucial difference between Evrart and Joyce. Evrart has absolutely no moral compass whatsoever while Joyce does.
There is more information that you can learn about the Claire brothers later in the game that may affect your opinion of them. However, the source of this information will not be Evrart Claire or Joyce Messier.
haha yeah who would deny help from friends offering help, that's kinda irrational amirite? haha!!! Really love to learn about new stuff like locus of control, great video!!!
i think the perspective of claire on the people in the fishing village is different than your reasoning. while he thinks highly of himself, and certainly higher than those people and others too, he has a sense of camaraderie due to his upbringing. we dont know much, but he is from here and its fair to assume he grew up in poverty, as thats all thats around. i find his demeaning remarks about children playing with feces and such are more of a way to express his disgust with the cards he's been given, as were the children. maybe in a sort of post traumatic distancing himself as he became successful. seeing himself now as a mighty provider that can do now what his parents and community wasnt able to and bring change.
on another front i think that his stance, and the whole leftist aspect of his organisation being a labour union impacts his perception. the dramatisation of living condition of the people in the fishing village, while certainly being poverty, is too harsh.
i disagree with your view of trying to find upsides about it. sure there are some. people will attempt to make the best of what they have, but change is needed and in this case quite desperately. village has a population of like 10 people, half of them alcoholics and as washerwomen said people dont come there, they just leave as did her family. about the measures claire is willing to take, while brutal, you can understand that its what he sees as necessary for improvement of their living condition. i genuinely believe him when he says hell put them in low-income housing afterwards. and imo itd worth it for the children and the future at the cost of the current residents. hes just cold and smug about it
TIL "therapize" is an actual word
I like Evrart's response when you ask him why he's so fat. The skills, and by extension Harry, often uses the weight of Evrart and Angus as comedic relief - embarrassing to watch, but very in character - but this specific interaction is a nice little bit of "Do you even realize what you're saying/thinking?"
omg did we break him
Kicking the mailbox is NOT canon
oh, you don't like having a light shine right in your face?
Are you putting a voice isolation filter over the game audio? The music keeps cutting in and out
Lol i love the elon shade. You are right, he flipped to the other side the moment he got any pushback. He needs to he recognised for his achievements, venerated even.
I don’t think the comparisons with Phillip Morris and Elon Musk work very well, but I think it’s telling that the personalities you’re invoking for the comparison are capitalists.
Without the union, *only* the Messiers and Musks of the world would have their hooks in Martinaise. Evrart isn’t a vulgar profiteer; he’d be better described (quoting Rust from the 1st season of True Detective) as one of the bad men who “keeps the other bad men at the door.”
He’s Machiavellian for sure, but I don’t think it works to compare him to the capitalists he is attempting to protect his neighborhood from.
He only cares about his union though, you just need to watch the living conditions on the other side of the river to realize that he doesn’t like that they refused to unionize, he doesn’t care at all either about what happens as long as it doesn’t involve his boys, if other places have drug problems because of him doesn’t concern him. Although it cannot be denied that he indeed does care for the union at the very least.
@@fox_e_crow3276 I think they are similar in that they all demand sacrifice in the name of progress while risking very little of their own stuff
@@Medivh9 that's a weird take. Where do you get that "the other side of the river refused to unionise"? How can a bunch of terminal alcoholics and old people unionize? They're basically paupers. And he does care for them, and include them as his own people, he's doing his development plan for them.
As for drugs, it's a complex thing, but he's choosing a lesser evil of controlling drug trade in his area, because otherwise the drugs would be on the doorstep, and there would again be gangs and mafiosos running the show. But, if he's in position to control all the Wild Pines, or at least his own terminal, he's completely at leisure to cut drug trade completely, and he would be too powerful to mess with him at that point. It's as Manana says, he's corrupt, but he's corrupt for their benefit.
@@daod8286 I think you are giving him way too much credit, it is mentioned textually in the game that people that side of the river distrust the union and do not want anything to do with them. What right then, does he have to do this project? He is going to go through with the drugs plan as well, there is no question about that given that he needs it for funding and doesn’t care for the effects it will provoke elsewhere. He cares for the union, that is all.
@@Medivh9 no, textually it says that the washerwoman mistrusts him because he’s fat and in her mind that means bourgeois, and Lilienne is kinda apathetic, but wants good future for her children. All the other people the other side of the river are either literal children or in alcohol coma or nearing it.
As for drugs, yeah, I agree it’s not very cool, but I’m not about to go and lambast what a revolutionary movement does to fund itself. Bolsheviks used robbery, for example. Some latam rev movements have been mixed in with drug trade. It’s distasteful, but such is the reality of being an underdog.
And Evrart also mentions that illegal drug revenue is just a tiny slice of the revenue they would be getting through the terminals.
Even with all that said, “What is the robbing of the bank compared to founding it?”. Sure, Evrart may be involved in contraband trade, violence, corruption, shady schemes… Doing it ten times over wouldn’t make him even a percent as bad as the people he’s fighting against. Evrart is acting in the interests of the oppressed, and it’s the action that counts for me.
Evrart is a political animal and political technologist. He has goals and his speech is 99% just a tool to get to his goals. You really have to get under his skin for the mask to crack a little.
I know you're trying to wrap up the game, but if you're interested in helping more youth, the two kids playing in front of Isobel actually have a questline!
they do, but dont they after the beggining of the *endgame*?
@@emmanuelbustos2693 I'm not sure if it's accessible then! Just felt like mentioning it either way. 😅
Love from a MendedLight and Vaush fan!
I wouldn’t call Evrart good at all, he and Joyce are probably in the same level, both were willing to sacrifice lives by withholding information after all. But if there is one saving grace for Evrart is that he actually seems to care about the union.
It's important to keep narcissists out of therapy. The process of therapy just gives them language they use as tools to harm others.
What, do you think narcissists are some unhuman creatures that cant be redeemed? Can't be helped?
mailbox is aware of your narcissistic manipulations 🤣
Mailbox didn't deserve that. Unsubscribed 😊
Enable the strreamer mode. Enable the strreamer mode.
He plays in Streamer mode for a long time tho. It doesn't help.
"incorporated socialism" when the communist in the game made by communists is more aligned with fascism than the fascists lol.
Sometimes you gotta choose the fascist option just cuz
23:55 "Making a killing on cigarettes" Hah... very true
8:59 holy shit miles davis reference
29:51 pretty people... Like Klaasje ;)
8:25 Dios mio, a liberal!