I studied/trained in the Harner method for several years. Soul retrieval was part of that training. I see my self and the world at large, in such deep psychic pain and sheer exhaustion from the constant stress of coping with daily shocking events. It has created a deep abyss in our collective psyche, fragmented, numb, a splitting off of the most tender parts of our hearts, our soul. Daily life has become arduous, and shutting off the feeling parts of self makes it a little easier to cope. However, that shutting off is destroying our very humanity, tolerance, joy. My question is can we as a thinking feeling human beings, as a collective, a community, retrieve our souls from the brink of madness? What needs to happen to bring back that tender part of us, not forgotten but put in a sheltered space, by us, to protect that kernel of light we loved so much.
I ironically came across this video at 3am and chose it to help me go back to sleep but I actually learnt quite alot. I did fall asleep at one point and woke up when you were discussing the dog and the boy in hospital. My Dad spent a month in hospital at 20 months old. His parents were asked not to come see him as they didn't want him to upset him and the other kids when it was time to go. He remembers turning his back on the world in his crib (physically; intellectually and spiritually) Hes never been the same since and has lived his life in a bubble or with a wall around him that doesn't allow him to ever get closer to people that he moves towards. A self made prison of sorts. He now has Parkinsons which makes me wonder if his physical self is reflecting what goes on inside. I also thought of a time as a very young child (2-3) when I was walking up to the shop/Dairy with my Mum. I thought the world was a loving place and everyone my friend or family. I said a happy 'Hello' to a lady walking past and she completely ignored me and did not say hello back or even look at me. I remember my view of the world changed in that instant. Something so simple felt quite damaging.
At the risk of sounding insensitive, let me suggest to you something I have noticed in my work with mental health patients, especially those with Parkinson’s and Parkinsonism. They all do show signs of an early trauma. So you are right to correlate your father’s Parkinson’s with his early experience with trauma and a feeling of abandonment. And here’s the part where I may come across as insensitive, but I do mean it in the nicest possible way: the other correlation that these patients have is that they are exhibit traits of emotionally weak individuals. And when you mentioned how a lady did not say hello to you, and that completely changed your view of the world I think it would be useful for you to realize that it is quite a weakened emotional state on your end. Your father may be beyond that kind of help, but if you don’t want the repetition of this genetic imprint to realize also in your life, in old age, you need to work on becoming less sensitive to the world around you. You need to become emotionally stronger and not care as much. If you don’t do that, what happens is what happens to Parkinson’s patients and happened to your dad is that they retreat into a part of themselves where they cannot be hurt. That is Parkinson’s. It’s a retreat of the self to a “safe place”. So take some weeks to think how you can transform your family’s natural penchant to be too sensitive to the environment and it’s difficulties, so that you may become more emotionally resilient and therefore keep the genetic predisposition for Parkinson’s at bay. 🍀
I just felt that I needed to add my two cents. I get what Alpha-Andromeda is saying here as far as emotional resiliency. But when I first read the reply, I took it more as saying don't be so sensitive, which may not have been the intent. As someone who is quite sensitive, I relate to the story of taking it hard when the lady ignored your happy hello. I still have experiences like this that I struggle with, although it doesn't change my entire view of the world...I think some of us are naturally more sensitive. Being more perceptive often goes along with that. We pick up on things that other people miss. We take on energies from our environment. My thinking is this - telling a sensitive person to be less sensitive is like telling water to be less wet. But sensitive people can learn resiliency and how to process difficult emotions. I recently read a book called "When The Body Says No" by Gabor Mate, and he relates stories similar to that of your Dad. But the overarching theme of the book is that these people all repressed their emotions and never got the help they needed to process their trauma, which was what led to the illness. I think it is common to hear the message that we just need to toughen up, but what that really does is teach people to repress and hide their true feelings, which causes further harm. What people need is to be taught how to process trauma and emotions in a healthy way so that it doesn't cripple them mentally or harm them physically.
@@HFTLHthank you for this thoughtful and sensitive reply. As one who has grown up constantly being told to toughen up and grow thicker skin, the effect was just adding insult to injury. Your comment that telling a sensitive person to be less sensitive is like telling water to be less wet is dead accurate. Being sensitive can be a gift if one is taught how to use it correctly (as you described) otherwise it can be a curse. Young souls who come in so open and innocent are in for a rude awakening when encountering the harshness of the world. But they were born sensitive for a reason. I would not want to be like my mother or father or sister or brothers or any one of my aunts uncles cousins etc etc…. To me they are missing a part of the magic of life. So I do not wish to dull my senses to become like the rest of the world. What I wish is to be emotionally independent and have a strong connection to my core sense of self. To maintain my ability to sense the subtleties of the world while holding on to myself. To be able to feel others pain but not take it on. Chiron , the archetype of the wounded healer, was such a great healer because of his wound not in-spite of it. As Jung wrote the wound is where the medicine is. Being able to alchemize the wound into a healing balm is what is required. What we need are those who can show people how to do this, not shame them for being emotionally weak. Sheesh. 🙄
I was abused as a child and struggled with low grade depression for decades. Loss of life force is a good way to describe it. But one day l was reading a book about Job and l found myself saying out loud "l am sorry God l ever doubted your love." Suddenly l fel a young woman spirit by my side hug me with delight. I had no belief system to understand this experience, but somehow l knew she was a part of me that l had become separated from and that she was my soul self. After that l never again felt that emptiness inside my heart space. I went into therapy, after l learned l had dissociated as a child and still did under certain circumstances, and l was able to heal the split. After I did I went on to have many positive spiritual experiences. Another woman l knew told me she had the same experience of being hugged during a low period in her life.
Aaaaah I just stopped the video to read your comment in which you describe coming out of depression and being hugged by your soul. It links to the discussion about whether deep depression is purposeful. It seems so often that it is in that deepest darkness that we both experience a loss of, or separation from soul, but yet also the conditions that make us open to profound realisation. I feel that your story is elemental archetypal. Thank you.
Reflecting on my trauma by recognizing what capacity for expression have I lost? My children used to remark when I opened gifts at Christmas that I never seemed surprised (they did work wonderfully at the perfect gift) Always grateful but peacefully receptive. Never demonstrative. I now remember how my mother used to take our presents away as children- after my visiting father left the house- they were gifts of need; brand new snowsuits and boots. Whether it was because it was practical and not playful or whether it was that his girlfriend had picked the gifts, she would throw them away or Give them to Salvation Army for someone needier. (Where we ourselves shopped lol) This is a very heavy memory and connecting the dots while listening to this podcast is quite a powerful thing. Sincerely it was the steady and centered tender sharing story about losing the family dog and as a boy to be open armed as the dog was bounding forward which struck that memory for me. I cannot thank you enough for the simple yet striking connection. I felt that small girl’s excitement about a dad coming for Christmas and huge wrapped boxes. The anger of a mom. And later the very careful and measured approach I have had towards all gifts which are wrapped and have my name on it. There’s some anxiety about having it taken away I think with the unwrapping and it expresses itself with cautious gratitude. Next time I receive a gift from my adult children I promise to make quite the fun ordeal of it. 🥹❤️
Did you talk about your experiences as a child, with your children? This is allowed 😊! Even more so, when they are older! It helps them to understand your behaviour better and not take it so much personal anymore. And don't get unreal in front of them with your joy when they give you a gift next time. And you don't feel it. (That doesn't feel good, because it's not authentic!!!). Here is a better idea: Go and buy yourself something you really like. Then you go home and put nice paper around it. Be creative and put stickers on ir or ballons etc. Stuff you didn't get decorated as a child. Choose a postcard that responses to your inner child. Write a lovely card to this inner child of you: Hallo my sweathart .......(Your Name). I wish you a wonderful day with this present. Have fun. Love you so much your adult/your mummy nowerdays ......(Your name again). And then you create a place for it. With a nice blanket, flowers, a celebration candle and a delicious Glas of juice and sit in front of it for ten minitues or something, for a few days. And feel the forward looking. Then one day, you sit again in front of it, make nice Musik If you like and open it slowly. And ready your Card. And feel the freeing happyness inside that you can feel happy about gifts today! Nowing, nobody will take it away. When your children give you then presents, do a bit the same. Have this or another nice blanket on the table. A candle, flowers or the Christmas tree....and put them there. Sit and watch. Feel the joy and the thankfulness that they thought of you. And say it to them. Alone that they thought of you is a gift! It is so so kind of them.💓 Unpack it slowly and take time watching it. You will feel joy and smile. It will work. You are worth all presents you get! Even if we can not expect that WE get them, we all are worth them and that's the same with showing gratitude. We are worth it, but we can not expect IT from others. But to give it, is a universal law of attraction key. Gratitude 🎉✨🌸💜💓 If you like you can let me know after a while, how your selflove present enjoying journey works out 🎉🙂.
The "loss of Soul" is epidemic in today's world. We are basically shamed and treated like objects in society. In order to "adjust" and fit in with society, we must wear a persona and act as an adapted self. Our instincts, emotions, and feelings are not welcome in society. So we learn to repressed them and reject ourselves in the process. This sets up primal repression. People outwardly identify with objects and base their self esteem on society's sick system and false ranking of being and value. Outwardly looking for Being and Value is characteristic of narcissism, codependency, and the depression that accompanies these deep wounds. Being and Value can only come from the Self or Soul. Most people are wounded by shame and this wound and its psychic structures are deeply repressed in the unconscious and form a big part of the shadow. The wound diminishes and restricts the ego-Self axis and reduces consciousness. The wounds prevents the positive and fertile healing energies of the Self from coming to consciousness. Getting at this core wound takes years...even decades. As the wound is purged and integrated, the Soul gradually becomes healed and whole. Peace. Love this channel.
As an indigenous person very embedded in my culture and ways of healing and knowing, its important to obtain insight directly from therapists to learn more. Most of these newer therapies, and also Jungs perspectives came from awareness of consciousness and the embodiment of cultures that have not been disconnected. Calling your spirit back is what created a lot of modern therapy approaches. Recovering ones spirit. Too look at the chemistry only and take the chemicals from the plant medicines and synthesize them into something else takes the spirit out of the relationship with that plant or that food or that element
WOW! I find so much value in the podcasts the three of you provide. This particular one I find especially significant. The topic explored obviously considering the traumatized world we live in, but the quality, depth, and personal expressions of insight offered were noteworthy Joseph, you are always amazingly articulate and I was especially moved with the vulnerable sharing of your experience and process with the tragic loss of your dog and the recovery of what you had been previous to a similar painful experience at age three. So raw, so human, and so deeply healing. Also the shring of the man's process and retreaval of such an important aspect of his soul in the group. It reminded me of 'family constalation' work which I have had personal experience with. It's these types of shares and examples that nurture as well as inform our own process and journey of self discovery ... and yes healing. And let us remember that in our willingness to experience the agony comes the possibility and availability to experience the ecstasy. Two extremes in the spectrum of human experience. And when this quality of depth healing occurs it's as if we have a visitation of grace. A visitation that enlivens us yes, but also grounds us to be more present to the moment whatever it may bring.
When we lose a piece of our soul, it leaves a vacuum. Thus we have an empty space where we can pick up other energy that's looking for a warm, empty space to take up residence. Soul Retrieval is only one of the ancient healing methods called "Shamanism". Another is Extraction - a removal of these energies that do not belong. Once these energies are removed (exorcised), soul retrieval can more easily happen.
“the flatness” - working through this .. part of it was my career , in teaching . I fully sourced and served my purpose to the point my cup was empty. I gave and gave , and I do not regret . Though , I felt like a vessel and the universe pushed me to seek that something was wrong . The environment I was in didn’t align with me, I was continuity getting sick , just down.. I resigned last May. I transferred to a new district, my heart is slowly becoming lighter . Though , I learned my lessons to give also .. to myself .
And still finding my ground and path to get back to “fulfill my purpose” isn’t just defined by my career .. my soul has recognizes its purpose , but it has also recognized there is a need for self value in that there is more to life 💜
I’ve had the same. I was a hairstylist for 22 years, the same reasons I loved my career are the same reasons I burned out. Too much energy exchange. Protect your energy, the giving and receiving. But you’re right, you’re there for a purpose, keep planting seeds and shining your light💖
Thank you so much for this! I’ve had a psychotic break while experimenting with LSD and following my intuition, and ended up entering an abyss of never ending darkness. Since then I don’t feel like myself anymore, I can’t see beauty, feel the music or connect with people or life. I’ve lost the part of me that I loved most, my essence. So far I have been under psychiatric treatment but I know the problem I am facing is spiritual. I need to get in touch with a Shaman or Curioso to help me with this. I must find a way to retrieve my soul, because living life like this is the same as not living. Thank you again.
Maybe you’re having a dark night of the soul/ego death which may be part of a spiritual awakening; in which case congratulations because your life is about to become amazing!
Thank you so much! It feels like the opposite of awakening is happening right now. But I’ll keep moving forward and try my best to reconect with life, the most important thing we have.
In the early 1980’s I did a psychodrama program at the University leading by Dr. Ferdinand Knobloch. It transformed my life like no other therapy had, nor has since. That man was brilliant and so tender hearted.
LOVE that you said, ‘it’s not depression, it’s much more profound.’. Yes!! Exactly!! Thank you for that! I’ve had several people who’ve known me for years offer up their opinion that I’m depressed and you’ve given me a way to respond because it IS MUCH more profound💖
I've gone through all the spiritual practices, Buddhism, New Age, I'm tired. I used to be able to manifest effortlessly, from Holy Imagination, but after a cascade of incidents that caused me severe distress and trauma, my imagination began to backfire and quite literally attacked me. I've also suffered so much recently but have tried to fight the shadows in my mind back, only to find out, it wants me to be safe. To be safe, was to be hidden, and the most extreme, to die. I'm lucky to be alive but I honestly don't know what to do. Each spiritual teaching hasn't helped me, but a heartfelt validation I received the other day made me feel alive. A simple one, an honest "you've been through a lot". That was it. That gave me enough strength to power through the week. Turns out I was surrounded by "friends" who actually didn't quite care. It's one thing to be busy, it's another to actually neglect a person. This video came to my feed after I came to that realization.
Psychedelics. Also without them you can still make progress, it's just with them it allows you to reprogram your subconscious by rewiring of the brain. Essentially the way the humanind works is we see/relate to the world through stories/beliefs about yourself and the world. This is programmed into the subconscious mind during the first 7 years of life approximately. Children personalize everything so if you were neglected or abused instead of realizing it had nothing to do with you, you instead assume there's something wrong with you. Either your unlovable, stupid, flawed, and this gets stored. Then when things happen that contradict that you subconsciously fight it or dismiss things that don't support that belief. Also can come out in negative self talk or self destructive behaviors. If you can identify that core false belief and change it. Then you can avoid everything that comes with it. At first you'll just be aware of it and will have to catch yourself when it comes up and intentionally stop yourself, but over time you can secure a new belief. Beliefs are jus things you think over and over again until it solidifies as a belief. Psychedelics are quicker because it shakes loose those false beliefs. Therefore allowing you to start fresh the next day with no solidified beliefs false or otherwise. Then you jus have to make sure to avoid people and situations that could make you adopt those wrong beliefs all over again. Which is why things like Ibogaine or mushrooms that cure addiction are said to last 6 months. In that amount of time if put back in se toxic environments one can end up adopting those beliefs again. It takes complete honest to look inward and find out which character you are in your story. Then forgive yourself for being young and stupid enough to think it was true. I literally laughed out loud when I identified my false beliefs and fears. Requires forgiveness of those who caused you to have the thoughts as well, no room for grudges if you want peace of mind. Hope this helps
As I know, the dream sometimes come from collective consciousness (the connections between our reality and other realms) to predict the future or recall our past lives. And sometimes is made up by our subconscious ( memories,basic need, desires, compress of emotions and feelings and what you have perceived the information through out daily life including movies, news, music and games). I think there’s also a way to retrieve your soul loss through being alone, observe your inner self ( because we are constantly busy with making money, responsible with family and friends, love game or too much problems from the society which distract to understanding ourselves), or get in touch with nature which is made up by the Oneness, the creator, God or Collective Consciousness. From there, when you understand and get to know more about your self, you will somehow realize your true life purpose, you past lives, your higher self and eventually the Creator.
Im only about a half hour in, but I just want to say that you are hitting all the checkmarks for my experience so far. "Where did I go?" Is a question I ask myself daily. Also there is a numinous quality to my experience, as if some magic spell took my soul. Im gonna keep watching now, thanks.
"This, then, is to be our first distinction between the mythologies of hunters and those of planters. The accent of the planting rites is on the group; that of the hunters, rather, on the individual-among the hunters we have the people-the dear people-who bow to one another politely, like brothers-in-law, but have comparatively little personal power." [The Masks of God: Primitive Mythology, Joseph Campbell, 1991, Part 3: Ch. 5- "Shamanism"] "We don't use the motive of domination, because we are always thinking of the whole group." [Walden Two, B.F. Skinner, 1948, Ch. 14]
I caught Covid in 2022, and I spent 1 year between life and death, but I had a problem with my gums that I still struggle with to this day not to lose my teeth, and I got fibromyalgia in the same week I started to feel a burning sensation in my mouth and shocks in my face ..., I had many other symptoms that until now no one could help me with, now I take antidepressants for nerve pain, and I feel tired all day, I had depression when I was young, now I'm 38, and I'm having to deal with almost the same feeling again, it's so weird, thanks for the podcast ❤❤
Regarding dissociation; childhood trauma of an extreme kind can cause one to section off that trauma in order to survive. It's an amazing defense mechanism.
Yes..after 23yr marriage..happy all the time celebrating holidays..20yrs later i still no longer have that joy i use to have,part of me (soul) died that day..in/out hospital out of work a few months..but I had two kids to raise so I have been going thru the motions every day..not like I use to be but not where I was either
Big hug 💜. He is with you, when you think of him. Have you once watched Long Island Medium? Or visited another good Trust worthy Medium? That could Help to ease your pain. Thereza Caputo looks special, but she can do her job. She is a psychic medium.
Thank you Debra for your comment about "loss of soul" as essentially a loss of feeling. That's spot on -- bells started ringing inside my head when I heard you say that.
Thank you so much Joseph for sharing your story about your dog it touched my heart in so many ways. As I had lost my beloved little dog unexpectedly and tragically in late December as well. The tears that have rolled down my eyes as you spoke was actually cleansing for me. Thank you so much for the great work that the three of you are doing.❤
I love this. I've listened a couple times already in order to grok it all. Lately I've been simmering thoughts about Hillman's Acorn theory and my own feelings about my depression being rooted in having allowed my potential(purpose) to be suffocated. For me, it makes perfect sense. Perhaps 'potential' is a roommate of libido, so when it is unable to flourish, depression happens. There is too much energy for it to be simply forgotten about with no symptoms. I've been working through this since the mid 80's (marriage) and then depression, which now makes complete sense. It's taken almost all of the time since then to figure this out as I begin to step back into the world (not married!). Thanks for this podcast! You guys are dreamy! ...see what I did there? Grateful. Also, adding in Joseph's word, "diminished," which is so perfect.
I realized a few years ago I lost my soul, and it has been gotten worse. I just hope this is part of a greater process and at some point I can see beyond the veil. I'm practicing lot of inner work, shadow work, etc. with some progress and some change, but I guess that is part of my path.
I have an explanation their are 2 versions of Soul Sul and Sol sul is dead energy at the bottom of your fields and Sol is when you close that opening and bring in life everlasting its deep be we all have our own fields but the bottom is literally cut off by death and to lose your Sul is the only way to gain your Sol
The vessel must experience loss in order for other energies to embody the vessel. So possession and Soul loss or loss of Self must occur normally simultaneously and indirectly from what I’ve seen in mySelf and in my clients. Great video and topic btw thank you love peoples for this material. Very awesome topic !!!
Incredible incredible. Incredible. What were you thinking when you non-intuitively asked for him to accept the death ghost in to himself. Was that an externalization of a piece of soul that was part of the death ghost. The fear was externalized as a ghost, and the fear was restored to him with it, courage and completeness.
What a wonderful dream! Fantastic! It begins with caring for another and anxiety and ends with accomplishment and safety. The horses are vigorous (power and health). She did what she had to do, not only as a child but now..
I just found you and the insight is really amazing. There is something very special about you all. Rarely do I ever hear that soft undertone in people's voices that indicates a very peaceful nature. A smooth windy aspect. Wonderful 🌞🌱
Been studying Jung for close to 40 years. I share these studies with the sweetheart of then who has worn various roles in my life. He has a fam of his own now and I am super solo....so finding y'all fills a real human need for me. Many thanks.
What Joseph Lee describes about his dog, I can fully empathize with. It's like you lose a very sensitive part of yourself, and only time, preferably in combination with good friends and a religious outlook, can help to heal it. It also happened to my mother (whom I was very deeply connected to) in full sight of me, and it was like life and the universe had no meaning, leaving that black hole of unbearable depression. Yes, that emptiness goes hand in hand with the loss of soul. To my embarassment I have to admit that it has also happened to me to lesser degrees in occasions that I suffered from ego collapse after a humiliating experience. You get kind of sucked up in the complex, and forget about the person before entering that state of emptiness.
The Red String talk tore me up. No idea why, but it hit my heart like a hammer. I saw a fuzzy white sentient being with no featureless face standing in a crowed of like beings, some short, some tall. A small being in the crowd stood out, wearing a reg string on the wrist. It was my soul. So vivid. So real. Why didn't I grab it right then when it presented itself. I'm such an idiot.
Today I was in a live of a medium woman she asked us to think to whose spirits we would like to connect and I thought of my dear dog and in this video Joseph talks about his dog, then later I've had some memories of my younger sis, when we both felt really alive, immediately after there's this dream 1:21:10 about a girl saving someone like a sister and I also had this role of taking care of my mom and sister at a very young age and also had dreams of defending my family from bad people and failing for a long time.
Those were two very powerful stories that Joseph shared. I found myself tearing up during both. It's interesting how stories of the retrieval or restoration of soul can be so uplifting.
I loved this discussion but it also brought home how intimate the listening is in your conversation as it was really distracting when Lisa seemed to be answering emails and looking to her right and above - and of course the typing - not not looking out to the other two speakers. It really changed the energy and I had to not watch the screen and just listen! I now see that I must stop that whilst on camera myself!!
I love what Joseph said about there being a capacity on the other side of loss. His story really evoked the meaning of soul loss, and the meaning of soul retrieval. You know, one thing you really didn't discuss, one that I thought you probably would discuss in this context, is whether Jung's own experiences were shamanistic in some sense. I think quite a few people have suggested that they were.
Check out the latest book from Susan Cain-Bittersweet, how sorrow and longing make us whole. It’s really making sense of my life as an “over-sensitive “ person
Really enjoy listening to this channel and have learnt different points of views which is great. One thing I have learnt is not to follow one of anything, you develop narrow tunnel vision. The story of what happened a few years ago was a great filter for me. 12 individuals around me fell prey to various illnesses and death. To devalue another’s point of view of choice in life is wrong . Jung’s theory is not the only, Freud is not the only etc there are merits in many ways of thinking. Greek and ancient philosophy is amazing and more truthful I find, . We are an amazing creation and need to reach our highest potential and maybe this is a threat to others 🤷♀️
"... the shamanistic crisis, when properly fostered, yields an adult not only of superior intelligence and refinements, but also greater physical stamina and vitality of spirit than is normal to members of his group. The crisis, consequently, has the value of a superior threshold initiation: superior, in the first place, because the shift of reference of the psychologically potent symbols has been not from the family to the tribe but from the family to the universe. The energies of the psyche summoned into play by such an immediately recognized magnification of the field of life are of greater force than those released and directed by the group-oriented, group-contrived....." [The Masks of God: Primitive Mythology, Joseph Campbell, 1991, Part 3: Ch. 5- "Shamanism"]
on possession, my thoughts are this. when the shadow takes control of the ego it can manifest its horrors in 3D. when the ego inflicts restriction on the expression of the shadow, the shadow, as a living entity must survive. our shadow is extemely important to primordial survivial. if it is not integrated it will find a way to survive. Even if the ego tries to kill or hide the shadow. the more opposite your ego correspondence is to shadow the more it will manifest in 3d
That’s a struggle. Is this the human experience ? Or is that a dysfunctional wound.? Shadows are necessary. But when in 3D, it all hands on deck. What’s the cure again ?
I think this is such a great topic. I have had to do this work on myself many times and in many stages and it is so tiring and taxing but invaluable. I think everyone can relate to this whether they are aware of what they were doing to heal themselves or not. I believe this is where spirituality and psychology meet and overlap in the best of ways.
So many valuable moments that really hit home for me just wanted to say Thank you for your gifts of insights that you offer to so many of us who need it most @ this time!🙏💜😇
20:48 Thank your for pointing out this dangerous problem and share your concern with us about our young generation (our future). Because I was also a part of dark collective unconsciousness when I was young, I would like to share my experience with you that there are 2 types influenced them. First,what our kid have perceived from external influences which change their innocent soul like dropping black oil into water. Such as porn, violence videos games, movies, bad lyrics music, and surrounding by bad friends and environment ( school, neighbors or even family). Secondly, this is my personal issue, from Vietnam, many kids growing up was a sacrifice for wealth deities, entities worshipers. Many people trade their kids for wealth so kids growing up was already a part of dark force collective unconsciousness. They serves for these dark force to create fear, chaos and bad influence to those normal kids and people. They lack sense of morals, love and life purpose. Some kids and teenagers are also just a shadow or a reflection of you.
Lol. Barf. I was that kid who smoked weed and shut the adults out and as an adult I can tell you this was the fault of the adults not me as a kid or the collective rebellion of the grung rock generation. If adults were connected to kids and not using them for vicarious success or ignoring them completely, there would be no need for disassociation and alienating rebellion in youth. If you can handle them rebelling and be there for them as they differentiate they do not need to disassociate. It is a way of nurturing creativity rather than reacting to it. Behind every troubled child is a troubled parent.
I feel this. There is a window of opportunity before a teen "resigns," when they look around for guidance and realize the purpose of life is not reflective in the adults around them surviving not thriving and so it's too painful to keep seeing the world through the souls eyes and the ego protects them through resignation to fit in, stay safe and be in the world as they don't know how to be not of it. Resignation happened to me at 13 and i wore grey for years
I think that's exactly what they're saying. The teen experiences some kind of trauma or maladaption by their environment, eventually being crippled or maladjusted by these shortcomings (ie resigning to drugs and hedonism).
Blaming and fault finding is irrelevant. We came into the "school" to learn and grow. Some say we signed up for every class. Chose our parents, life's significant events, everything. We must be guided by love found in our own heart. So if we cut off a part of ourselves, the why doesn't matter. The only thing that matters is healing and growing.
@Kintsugi979 I can see your point, however... a couple years ago I told my parents that I'd been diagnosed with PTSD and have a significant (3+ year) gap in my memory prior to when my mother lovingly terms "when the aliens stole her real daughter and dropped this thing off." Nobody in my family remembers anything about me during the missing time, but for a plethora and multitude of reasons I know the nature of the event(s). My father responded with "well, I had something like that happen to me and I didn't let it affect *MY* life." I'll tell you what, *THAT'S* my father, he chose *ME* as his child in this school as well. As far as I'm concerned, my authentic hurt and feeling of betrayal, both historical and current, that it's my role to illuminate for him the depth of suffering that can be endured... I've been detailing it for him as I discover the origins of the things I feel in my body as the trauma unfolds itself to me. If he feels no compassion toward the fact that my leg hurts and I lose proprioception of my feet under certain conditions because I was *HUNG BY THAT LEG* he deserves to stay the hell out of my life.
Coincidentally I'm currently reading "Respark: Igniting hope and joy after trauma and depression" by Graham Music - and it strikes me that he might be talking about the same thing using different language. What he calls a loss of spark sounds a lot like the loss of soul you're talking about. I'm going to have therapist-as-shaman in the back of my mind as I read - thank you :)
Shame curls us inward and inward is only introspection which is antithetical to development, communication and communion all of which make life worth living. ❤
my family was killed in a mass shooting and i am still trying to find a way to heal that. its more the trauma than the sorrow. my body acts weird. my brain just won’t sleep. i feel sick inside. we lost ten family members. i have done a lot of self healing work before but this one seems impossible. i’m so sad to have lost the part of me that can feel or be happy. i am still able to make some parts of me work. but not others. i really need help and don’t know where to turn. i have always been able to rise above other traumas. this time i feel so utterly hopeless. 😢
No one responded so i feel obligated to reply, hope this reaches you well. What a profound loss I am so so sorry. If you are able to find local/online resources for grief somatic therapy to help process. (Loved ones / friends are so important too!) Thats such a deep pain to go through. Dont feel pressued to "keep it together" you are allowed to hurt and feel however you want. Take care of yourself 🤍
Thank you for sharing, it’s hard to open up, and it’s even harder to find someone who is willing to listen, or care. People say ‘reach out to friends and talk to someone’, but when I have tried talking to friends about my sadness, I suddenly found no one would return my calls. I think going through this alone brought me to a deeper level of healing, but it could’ve been so much easier if I had just one person to help me through. I want you to know that I would be happy to talk with you anytime you need, even if it’s just to listen. The light in me sees the light in you. I’m here for you, and I am so sorry for the loss you have endured.
Thanks so much for this deep dive, discussion and framing! Very personally relevant wnd helpful! Thinking on a societal scale, is anomie a driver of or a symptom of collective loss of soul? Is that how collective soul loss manifests?
After listening to Joseph story about remembering the dog experience as à three year old, also the hospital experience of the young man he was working with as a physiotherapist. I'm so glad I listened to the small boy I was in charge of. He had absolute terror when I left the room, even if I told him I was leaving to go to the toilet, one day he looked at me very seriously and said "I've been alone for 14 years" I had the feeling ge had, anyway after listening to this pleased I didn't poo poo him as maybe something pre verbal had taken place to scare him so much.
It was my first experience with ceremonial ayahuasca that helped me understand that my chronic dysthymia (low grade depression) was better articulated as "soul loss".
People think feeling depressed is sickness. Its not. Its necessary to move between states and become ok with the movement. Dont fear them and u wont get stuck. Theyre transient.
I would add to the dream analysis the following. The bull represents the stresses that pushed her from child to parent child. Climbing away was the attempt to reach a higher level above the pressure's felt in her unstable world she's propelled into. Climbing represented rising above the chaos to find understanding and resolution and/or escape. Falling down and being caught by the dragon was the archetype she had to integrate and become to protect herself as the younger child and the chocolate represents the nourishment of the two selves together. (Her person and the archetype which she became to survive the dragon.) The large head represents her intellect. Becoming super sharpened and keen as a survival mechanism and the spikes were each of challenges or task to absorb and yes, she had to ward off as an adult understood by a child person, the needs of the integrsted dragon have come to completion and the head shrinks. And she is returning to with youthful child and the creativity that was lost.
If you’re going to look at this from a mythological perspective, we can compare to Osiris and the gathering of his parts, of course, the feminine played a vital role.
"The shaman represents this principle on the primitive level, as do the mystics, the poets, and the artists in the higher reaches of the culture scale." [The Masks of God: Primitive Mythology, Joseph Campbell, 1991, Part 4: "..."]
An hedonia, is that how you spell it? I’m going through this these days. Maybe slowly coming out of it. Lots of therapy but just starting to do dream work. Shadow work. A little exhausting, all the work in my cave. Lots of napping but on the mend. Thank you three.🙏
![Seungmin "그렇게, 천천히, 우리(As we are)" | [Stray Kids : SKZ-PLAYER]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/kAzmhLHePqU/mqdefault.jpg)
I studied/trained in the Harner method for several years. Soul retrieval was part of that training. I see my self and the world at large, in such deep psychic pain and sheer exhaustion from the constant stress of coping with daily shocking events. It has created a deep abyss in our collective psyche, fragmented, numb, a splitting off of the most tender parts of our hearts, our soul. Daily life has become arduous, and shutting off the feeling parts of self makes it a little easier to cope. However, that shutting off is destroying our very humanity, tolerance, joy. My question is can we as a thinking feeling human beings, as a collective, a community, retrieve our souls from the brink of madness? What needs to happen to bring back that tender part of us, not forgotten but put in a sheltered space, by us, to protect that kernel of light we loved so much.
This hit me very hard. I couldn't have articulated this thought process any better.
We loved so much...can we drop the 'd'? That we love so much. The light doesn't flicker.... I do. cheer up and keep achieving. Gregg
Wow.. beautifully elucidated
Do u do this though the inner child? And shadow work?
Spot on. 100%.
I ironically came across this video at 3am and chose it to help me go back to sleep but I actually learnt quite alot. I did fall asleep at one point and woke up when you were discussing the dog and the boy in hospital. My Dad spent a month in hospital at 20 months old. His parents were asked not to come see him as they didn't want him to upset him and the other kids when it was time to go. He remembers turning his back on the world in his crib (physically; intellectually and spiritually) Hes never been the same since and has lived his life in a bubble or with a wall around him that doesn't allow him to ever get closer to people that he moves towards. A self made prison of sorts. He now has Parkinsons which makes me wonder if his physical self is reflecting what goes on inside.
I also thought of a time as a very young child (2-3) when I was walking up to the shop/Dairy with my Mum. I thought the world was a loving place and everyone my friend or family. I said a happy 'Hello' to a lady walking past and she completely ignored me and did not say hello back or even look at me. I remember my view of the world changed in that instant. Something so simple felt quite damaging.
At the risk of sounding insensitive, let me suggest to you something I have noticed in my work with mental health patients, especially those with Parkinson’s and Parkinsonism.
They all do show signs of an early trauma. So you are right to correlate your father’s Parkinson’s with his early experience with trauma and a feeling of abandonment.
And here’s the part where I may come across as insensitive, but I do mean it in the nicest possible way: the other correlation that these patients have is that they are exhibit traits of emotionally weak individuals.
And when you mentioned how a lady did not say hello to you, and that completely changed your view of the world I think it would be useful for you to realize that it is quite a weakened emotional state on your end.
Your father may be beyond that kind of help, but if you don’t want the repetition of this genetic imprint to realize also in your life, in old age, you need to work on becoming less sensitive to the world around you. You need to become emotionally stronger and not care as much.
If you don’t do that, what happens is what happens to Parkinson’s patients and happened to your dad is that they retreat into a part of themselves where they cannot be hurt. That is Parkinson’s. It’s a retreat of the self to a “safe place”.
So take some weeks to think how you can transform your family’s natural penchant to be too sensitive to the environment and it’s difficulties, so that you may become more emotionally resilient and therefore keep the genetic predisposition for Parkinson’s at bay.
🍀
I just felt that I needed to add my two cents. I get what Alpha-Andromeda is saying here as far as emotional resiliency. But when I first read the reply, I took it more as saying don't be so sensitive, which may not have been the intent. As someone who is quite sensitive, I relate to the story of taking it hard when the lady ignored your happy hello. I still have experiences like this that I struggle with, although it doesn't change my entire view of the world...I think some of us are naturally more sensitive. Being more perceptive often goes along with that. We pick up on things that other people miss. We take on energies from our environment. My thinking is this - telling a sensitive person to be less sensitive is like telling water to be less wet. But sensitive people can learn resiliency and how to process difficult emotions. I recently read a book called "When The Body Says No" by Gabor Mate, and he relates stories similar to that of your Dad. But the overarching theme of the book is that these people all repressed their emotions and never got the help they needed to process their trauma, which was what led to the illness. I think it is common to hear the message that we just need to toughen up, but what that really does is teach people to repress and hide their true feelings, which causes further harm. What people need is to be taught how to process trauma and emotions in a healthy way so that it doesn't cripple them mentally or harm them physically.
@@HFTLHthank you for this thoughtful and sensitive reply. As one who has grown up constantly being told to toughen up and grow thicker skin, the effect was just adding insult to injury. Your comment that telling a sensitive person to be less sensitive is like telling water to be less wet is dead accurate. Being sensitive can be a gift if one is taught how to use it correctly (as you described) otherwise it can be a curse. Young souls who come in so open and innocent are in for a rude awakening when encountering the harshness of the world. But they were born sensitive for a reason. I would not want to be like my mother or father or sister or brothers or any one of my aunts uncles cousins etc etc…. To me they are missing a part of the magic of life. So I do not wish to dull my senses to become like the rest of the world. What I wish is to be emotionally independent and have a strong connection to my core sense of self. To maintain my ability to sense the subtleties of the world while holding on to myself. To be able to feel others pain but not take it on. Chiron , the archetype of the wounded healer, was such a great healer because of his wound not in-spite of it. As Jung wrote the wound is where the medicine is. Being able to alchemize the wound into a healing balm is what is required. What we need are those who can show people how to do this, not shame them for being emotionally weak. Sheesh. 🙄
I was abused as a child and struggled with low grade depression for decades. Loss of life force is a good way to describe it. But one day l was reading a book about Job and l found myself saying out loud "l am sorry God l ever doubted your love." Suddenly l fel a young woman spirit by my side hug me with delight. I had no belief system to understand this experience, but somehow l knew she was a part of me that l had become separated from and that she was my soul self. After that l never again felt that emptiness inside my heart space. I went into therapy, after l learned l had dissociated as a child and still did under certain circumstances, and l was able to heal the split. After I did I went on to have many positive spiritual experiences. Another woman l knew told me she had the same experience of being hugged during a low period in her life.
Aaaaah I just stopped the video to read your comment in which you describe coming out of depression and being hugged by your soul.
It links to the discussion about whether deep depression is purposeful. It seems so often that it is in that deepest darkness that we both experience a loss of, or separation from soul, but yet also the conditions that make us open to profound realisation.
I feel that your story is elemental archetypal. Thank you.
Reflecting on my trauma by recognizing what capacity for expression have I lost? My children used to remark when I opened gifts at Christmas that I never seemed surprised (they did work wonderfully at the perfect gift) Always grateful but peacefully receptive. Never demonstrative. I now remember how my mother used to take our presents away as children- after my visiting father left the house- they were gifts of need; brand new snowsuits and boots. Whether it was because it was practical and not playful or whether it was that his girlfriend had picked the gifts, she would throw them away or Give them to Salvation Army for someone needier. (Where we ourselves shopped lol) This is a very heavy memory and connecting the dots while listening to this podcast is quite a powerful thing. Sincerely it was the steady and centered tender sharing story about losing the family dog and as a boy to be open armed as the dog was bounding forward which struck that memory for me. I cannot thank you enough for the simple yet striking connection. I felt that small girl’s excitement about a dad coming for Christmas and huge wrapped boxes. The anger of a mom. And later the very careful and measured approach I have had towards all gifts which are wrapped and have my name on it. There’s some anxiety about having it taken away I think with the unwrapping and it expresses itself with cautious gratitude. Next time I receive a gift from my adult children I promise to make quite the fun ordeal of it. 🥹❤️
Great insights there Amanda
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Did you talk about your experiences as a child, with your children?
This is allowed 😊! Even more so, when they are older!
It helps them to understand your behaviour better and not take it so much personal anymore.
And don't get unreal in front of them with your joy when they give you a gift next time. And you don't feel it. (That doesn't feel good, because it's not authentic!!!).
Here is a better idea:
Go and buy yourself something you really like. Then you go home and put nice paper around it. Be creative and put stickers on ir or ballons etc. Stuff you didn't get decorated as a child.
Choose a postcard that responses to your inner child.
Write a lovely card to this inner child of you:
Hallo my sweathart .......(Your Name). I wish you a wonderful day with this present. Have fun.
Love you so much your adult/your mummy nowerdays ......(Your name again).
And then you create a place for it. With a nice blanket, flowers, a celebration candle and a delicious Glas of juice and sit in front of it for ten minitues or something, for a few days. And feel the forward looking.
Then one day, you sit again in front of it, make nice Musik If you like and open it slowly.
And ready your Card.
And feel the freeing happyness inside that you can feel happy about gifts today!
Nowing, nobody will take it away.
When your children give you then presents, do a bit the same. Have this or another nice blanket on the table. A candle, flowers or the Christmas tree....and put them there. Sit and watch. Feel the joy and the thankfulness that they thought of you. And say it to them. Alone that they thought of you is a gift! It is so so kind of them.💓
Unpack it slowly and take time watching it. You will feel joy and smile.
It will work.
You are worth all presents you get! Even if we can not expect that WE get them, we all are worth them and that's the same with showing gratitude. We are worth it, but we can not expect IT from others. But to give it, is a universal law of attraction key. Gratitude 🎉✨🌸💜💓
If you like you can let me know after a while, how your selflove present enjoying journey works out 🎉🙂.
The "loss of Soul" is epidemic in today's world. We are basically shamed and treated like objects in society. In order to "adjust" and fit in with society, we must wear a persona and act as an adapted self. Our instincts, emotions, and feelings are not welcome in society. So we learn to repressed them and reject ourselves in the process. This sets up primal repression. People outwardly identify with objects and base their self esteem on society's sick system and false ranking of being and value. Outwardly looking for Being and Value is characteristic of narcissism, codependency, and the depression that accompanies these deep wounds. Being and Value can only come from the Self or Soul. Most people are wounded by shame and this wound and its psychic structures are deeply repressed in the unconscious and form a big part of the shadow. The wound diminishes and restricts the ego-Self axis and reduces consciousness. The wounds prevents the positive and fertile healing energies of the Self from coming to consciousness. Getting at this core wound takes years...even decades. As the wound is purged and integrated, the Soul gradually becomes healed and whole. Peace. Love this channel.
It doesn’t have to take so long..
See Dr. Hawkins work..
As an indigenous person very embedded in my culture and ways of healing and knowing, its important to obtain insight directly from therapists to learn more. Most of these newer therapies, and also Jungs perspectives came from awareness of consciousness and the embodiment of cultures that have not been disconnected. Calling your spirit back is what created a lot of modern therapy approaches. Recovering ones spirit. Too look at the chemistry only and take the chemicals from the plant medicines and synthesize them into something else takes the spirit out of the relationship with that plant or that food or that element
Thumbs up for Lisa's endless collection of glasses frames.
All of this is resonating so much with me. I just don’t have the strength anymore. I’m trying I’m trying.
How is your journey at this time? Six months from your post.
I get a dopamine rush everytime I see that a new episode of This Jungian Life has appeared, feels like smelling cookies baking in the oven 🙏💚
WOW! I find so much value in the podcasts the three of you provide. This particular one I find especially significant. The topic explored obviously considering the traumatized world we live in, but the quality, depth, and personal expressions of insight offered were noteworthy Joseph, you are always amazingly articulate and I was especially moved with the vulnerable sharing of your experience and process with the tragic loss of your dog and the recovery of what you had been previous to a similar painful experience at age three. So raw, so human, and so deeply healing. Also the shring of the man's process and retreaval of such an important aspect of his soul in the group. It reminded me of 'family constalation' work which I have had personal experience with. It's these types of shares and examples that nurture as well as inform our own process and journey of self discovery ... and yes healing. And let us remember that in our willingness to experience the agony comes the possibility and availability to experience the ecstasy. Two extremes in the spectrum of human experience. And when this quality of depth healing occurs it's as if we have a visitation of grace. A visitation that enlivens us yes, but also grounds us to be more present to the moment whatever it may bring.
When we lose a piece of our soul, it leaves a vacuum. Thus we have an empty space where we can pick up other energy that's looking for a warm, empty space to take up residence. Soul Retrieval is only one of the ancient healing methods called "Shamanism". Another is Extraction - a removal of these energies that do not belong. Once these energies are removed (exorcised), soul retrieval can more easily happen.
“the flatness” - working through this .. part of it was my career , in teaching . I fully sourced and served my purpose to the point my cup was empty. I gave and gave , and I do not regret . Though , I felt like a vessel and the universe pushed me to seek that something was wrong . The environment I was in didn’t align with me, I was continuity getting sick , just down.. I resigned last May. I transferred to a new district, my heart is slowly becoming lighter . Though , I learned my lessons to give also .. to myself .
And still finding my ground and path to get back to “fulfill my purpose” isn’t just defined by my career .. my soul has recognizes its purpose , but it has also recognized there is a need for self value in that there is more to life 💜
I’ve had the same. I was a hairstylist for 22 years, the same reasons I loved my career are the same reasons I burned out. Too much energy exchange. Protect your energy, the giving and receiving. But you’re right, you’re there for a purpose, keep planting seeds and shining your light💖
Love love love this conversation, thank you🙏🏾
Thank you so much for this! I’ve had a psychotic break while experimenting with LSD and following my intuition, and ended up entering an abyss of never ending darkness. Since then I don’t feel like myself anymore, I can’t see beauty, feel the music or connect with people or life. I’ve lost the part of me that I loved most, my essence. So far I have been under psychiatric treatment but I know the problem I am facing is spiritual. I need to get in touch with a Shaman or Curioso to help me with this. I must find a way to retrieve my soul, because living life like this is the same as not living. Thank you again.
Sounds like you lost your EGO which happens when you reach higher frequencies in meditation.
Maybe you’re having a dark night of the soul/ego death which may be part of a spiritual awakening; in which case congratulations because your life is about to become amazing!
Read the other within is by Robert Falconer ❤
Thank you so much! It feels like the opposite of awakening is happening right now. But I’ll keep moving forward and try my best to reconect with life, the most important thing we have.
ask a babalawo
In the early 1980’s I did a psychodrama program at the University leading by Dr. Ferdinand Knobloch. It transformed my life like no other therapy had, nor has since. That man was brilliant and so tender hearted.
LOVE that you said, ‘it’s not depression, it’s much more profound.’. Yes!! Exactly!! Thank you for that! I’ve had several people who’ve known me for years offer up their opinion that I’m depressed and you’ve given me a way to respond because it IS MUCH more profound💖
I've gone through all the spiritual practices, Buddhism, New Age, I'm tired. I used to be able to manifest effortlessly, from Holy Imagination, but after a cascade of incidents that caused me severe distress and trauma, my imagination began to backfire and quite literally attacked me. I've also suffered so much recently but have tried to fight the shadows in my mind back, only to find out, it wants me to be safe.
To be safe, was to be hidden, and the most extreme, to die. I'm lucky to be alive but I honestly don't know what to do. Each spiritual teaching hasn't helped me, but a heartfelt validation I received the other day made me feel alive.
A simple one, an honest "you've been through a lot". That was it. That gave me enough strength to power through the week. Turns out I was surrounded by "friends" who actually didn't quite care. It's one thing to be busy, it's another to actually neglect a person. This video came to my feed after I came to that realization.
Psychedelics. Also without them you can still make progress, it's just with them it allows you to reprogram your subconscious by rewiring of the brain. Essentially the way the humanind works is we see/relate to the world through stories/beliefs about yourself and the world. This is programmed into the subconscious mind during the first 7 years of life approximately. Children personalize everything so if you were neglected or abused instead of realizing it had nothing to do with you, you instead assume there's something wrong with you. Either your unlovable, stupid, flawed, and this gets stored. Then when things happen that contradict that you subconsciously fight it or dismiss things that don't support that belief. Also can come out in negative self talk or self destructive behaviors. If you can identify that core false belief and change it. Then you can avoid everything that comes with it. At first you'll just be aware of it and will have to catch yourself when it comes up and intentionally stop yourself, but over time you can secure a new belief. Beliefs are jus things you think over and over again until it solidifies as a belief. Psychedelics are quicker because it shakes loose those false beliefs. Therefore allowing you to start fresh the next day with no solidified beliefs false or otherwise. Then you jus have to make sure to avoid people and situations that could make you adopt those wrong beliefs all over again. Which is why things like Ibogaine or mushrooms that cure addiction are said to last 6 months. In that amount of time if put back in se toxic environments one can end up adopting those beliefs again. It takes complete honest to look inward and find out which character you are in your story. Then forgive yourself for being young and stupid enough to think it was true. I literally laughed out loud when I identified my false beliefs and fears. Requires forgiveness of those who caused you to have the thoughts as well, no room for grudges if you want peace of mind. Hope this helps
Thank you so much for the dog story has brought tears to my eyes thank you
As I know, the dream sometimes come from collective consciousness (the connections between our reality and other realms) to predict the future or recall our past lives. And sometimes is made up by our subconscious ( memories,basic need, desires, compress of emotions and feelings and what you have perceived the information through out daily life including movies, news, music and games).
I think there’s also a way to retrieve your soul loss through being alone, observe your inner self ( because we are constantly busy with making money, responsible with family and friends, love game or too much problems from the society which distract to understanding ourselves), or get in touch with nature which is made up by the Oneness, the creator, God or Collective Consciousness. From there, when you understand and get to know more about your self, you will somehow realize your true life purpose, you past lives, your higher self and eventually the Creator.
I keep coming back to this one
Im only about a half hour in, but I just want to say that you are hitting all the checkmarks for my experience so far. "Where did I go?" Is a question I ask myself daily. Also there is a numinous quality to my experience, as if some magic spell took my soul. Im gonna keep watching now, thanks.
"This, then, is to be our first distinction between the mythologies of hunters and those of planters. The accent of the planting rites is on the group; that of the hunters, rather, on the individual-among the hunters we have the people-the dear people-who bow to one another politely, like brothers-in-law, but have comparatively little personal power."
[The Masks of God: Primitive Mythology, Joseph Campbell, 1991, Part 3: Ch. 5- "Shamanism"]
"We don't use the motive of domination, because we are always thinking of the whole group."
[Walden Two, B.F. Skinner, 1948, Ch. 14]
Oh my…this conversation is exactly what my soul has been longing for, for years of illness. Thank you 🙏🏼 ❤
I caught Covid in 2022, and I spent 1 year between life and death, but I had a problem with my gums that I still struggle with to this day not to lose my teeth, and I got fibromyalgia in the same week I started to feel a burning sensation in my mouth and shocks in my face ..., I had many other symptoms that until now no one could help me with, now I take antidepressants for nerve pain, and I feel tired all day, I had depression when I was young, now I'm 38, and I'm having to deal with almost the same feeling again, it's so weird, thanks for the podcast ❤❤
Regarding dissociation; childhood trauma of an extreme kind can cause one to section off that trauma in order to survive. It's an amazing defense mechanism.
Unfortunately, I have to concur
I appreciate that you spend little time getting on topic. Thank you immensely.
Yes..after 23yr marriage..happy all the time celebrating holidays..20yrs later i still no longer have that joy i use to have,part of me (soul) died that day..in/out hospital out of work a few months..but I had two kids to raise so I have been going thru the motions every day..not like I use to be but not where I was either
Big hug 💜.
He is with you, when you think of him.
Have you once watched Long Island Medium? Or visited another good Trust worthy Medium? That could Help to ease your pain.
Thereza Caputo looks special, but she can do her job. She is a psychic medium.
I worked with Dr Braun on the Dissociative Disorders unit at Rush. The BASK model remains useful and I appreciate you applying it to this discussion.
Thank you Debra for your comment about "loss of soul" as essentially a loss of feeling. That's spot on -- bells started ringing inside my head when I heard you say that.
Thank you so much Joseph for sharing your story about your dog it touched my heart in so many ways. As I had lost my beloved little dog unexpectedly and tragically in late December as well. The tears that have rolled down my eyes as you spoke was actually cleansing for me. Thank you so much for the great work that the three of you are doing.❤
I love this. I've listened a couple times already in order to grok it all. Lately I've been simmering thoughts about Hillman's Acorn theory and my own feelings about my depression being rooted in having allowed my potential(purpose) to be suffocated. For me, it makes perfect sense. Perhaps 'potential' is a roommate of libido, so when it is unable to flourish, depression happens. There is too much energy for it to be simply forgotten about with no symptoms. I've been working through this since the mid 80's (marriage) and then depression, which now makes complete sense. It's taken almost all of the time since then to figure this out as I begin to step back into the world (not married!). Thanks for this podcast! You guys are dreamy! ...see what I did there? Grateful. Also, adding in Joseph's word, "diminished," which is so perfect.
Beautiful talks! Thank you from all of my heart ❤️
I realized a few years ago I lost my soul, and it has been gotten worse. I just hope this is part of a greater process and at some point I can see beyond the veil. I'm practicing lot of inner work, shadow work, etc. with some progress and some change, but I guess that is part of my path.
I have an explanation their are 2 versions of Soul Sul and Sol sul is dead energy at the bottom of your fields and Sol is when you close that opening and bring in life everlasting its deep be we all have our own fields but the bottom is literally cut off by death and to lose your Sul is the only way to gain your Sol
I’m sorry. I say to myself. It was not soul murder. But an assault.
You will overcome, the pain. I believe in you.
SUCH A BEAUTIFUL BEAUTIFUL DISCUSSION!!!!! 🧡💛🤎💛🧡❤💛❤❤💙💜💛💜💚💚🧡♥💖💖💖💖💖
The vessel must experience loss in order for other energies to embody the vessel. So possession and Soul loss or loss of Self must occur normally simultaneously and indirectly from what I’ve seen in mySelf and in my clients.
Great video and topic btw thank you love peoples for this material. Very awesome topic !!!
Looking forward to listening to this podcast in this afternoon after I finish work. Thank you guys for posting all the time.❤❤
Incredible incredible. Incredible. What were you thinking when you non-intuitively asked for him to accept the death ghost in to himself. Was that an externalization of a piece of soul that was part of the death ghost. The fear was externalized as a ghost, and the fear was restored to him with it, courage and completeness.
Beautiful ❤
The synchronicity of this video. I just watched a video about shamanism and now this channel just uploaded 13h a shamanism video.
What a wonderful dream! Fantastic! It begins with caring for another and anxiety and ends with accomplishment and safety. The horses are vigorous (power and health). She did what she had to do, not only as a child but now..
I just found you and the insight is really amazing. There is something very special about you all. Rarely do I ever hear that soft undertone in people's voices that indicates a very peaceful nature. A smooth windy aspect. Wonderful 🌞🌱
I have to admit, I usually don't listen to the dream analysis, but LIsa's interpretation felt so profound! I get it!
Just found this channel and I am so glad.
Been studying Jung for close to 40 years. I share these studies with the sweetheart of then who has worn various roles in my life. He has a fam of his own now and I am super solo....so finding y'all fills a real human need for me.
Many thanks.
Love to hear about the retreat!!! hearing you from Portugal
Heeyyy... portuguesa aqui também 😁
Ola Ola Portugal 🇵🇹 here also
What Joseph Lee describes about his dog, I can fully empathize with. It's like you lose a very sensitive part of yourself, and only time, preferably in combination with good friends and a religious outlook, can help to heal it. It also happened to my mother (whom I was very deeply connected to) in full sight of me, and it was like life and the universe had no meaning, leaving that black hole of unbearable depression. Yes, that emptiness goes hand in hand with the loss of soul.
To my embarassment I have to admit that it has also happened to me to lesser degrees in occasions that I suffered from ego collapse after a humiliating experience. You get kind of sucked up in the complex, and forget about the person before entering that state of emptiness.
Beautiful. My first time in your chat. Heartfelt relevant discussions and insights, thank you so much.
The Red String talk tore me up. No idea why, but it hit my heart like a hammer. I saw a fuzzy white sentient being with no featureless face standing in a crowed of like beings, some short, some tall. A small being in the crowd stood out, wearing a reg string on the wrist. It was my soul. So vivid. So real. Why didn't I grab it right then when it presented itself. I'm such an idiot.
Today I was in a live of a medium woman she asked us to think to whose spirits we would like to connect and I thought of my dear dog and in this video Joseph talks about his dog, then later I've had some memories of my younger sis, when we both felt really alive, immediately after there's this dream 1:21:10 about a girl saving someone like a sister and I also had this role of taking care of my mom and sister at a very young age and also had dreams of defending my family from bad people and failing for a long time.
This was truly PROFOUND, thank you
Glad it was helpful!
Those were two very powerful stories that Joseph shared. I found myself tearing up during both. It's interesting how stories of the retrieval or restoration of soul can be so uplifting.
I loved this discussion but it also brought home how intimate the listening is in your conversation as it was really distracting when Lisa seemed to be answering emails and looking to her right and above - and of course the typing - not not looking out to the other two speakers. It really changed the energy and I had to not watch the screen and just listen! I now see that I must stop that whilst on camera myself!!
Woooow, right now I am searching how I can return my true soul, searching Who I really am
I love what Joseph said about there being a capacity on the other side of loss. His story really evoked the meaning of soul loss, and the meaning of soul retrieval. You know, one thing you really didn't discuss, one that I thought you probably would discuss in this context, is whether Jung's own experiences were shamanistic in some sense. I think quite a few people have suggested that they were.
Check out the latest book from Susan Cain-Bittersweet, how sorrow and longing make us whole. It’s really making sense of my life as an “over-sensitive “ person
I really enjoyed this discussion. Very calm and collected.
Really enjoy listening to this channel and have learnt different points of views which is great. One thing I have learnt is not to follow one of anything, you develop narrow tunnel vision. The story of what happened a few years ago was a great filter for me. 12 individuals around me fell prey to various illnesses and death. To devalue another’s point of view of choice in life is wrong . Jung’s theory is not the only, Freud is not the only etc there are merits in many ways of thinking. Greek and ancient philosophy is amazing and more truthful I find, . We are an amazing creation and need to reach our highest potential and maybe this is a threat to others 🤷♀️
"... the shamanistic crisis, when properly fostered, yields an adult not only of superior intelligence and refinements, but also greater physical stamina and vitality of spirit than is normal to members of his group. The crisis, consequently, has the value of a superior threshold initiation: superior, in the first place, because the shift of reference of the psychologically potent symbols has been not from the family to the tribe but from the family to the universe. The energies of the psyche summoned into play by such an immediately recognized magnification of the field of life are of greater force than those released and directed by the group-oriented, group-contrived....."
[The Masks of God: Primitive Mythology, Joseph Campbell, 1991, Part 3: Ch. 5- "Shamanism"]
What a beautiful podcast... So insightful. Thank you very much 🙏🏻
So good! Thank you ❤❤❤
THank you for the video for,at, I love seeing y’all’s faces and it helps me focus!,
on possession, my thoughts are this. when the shadow takes control of the ego it can manifest its horrors in 3D. when the ego inflicts restriction on the expression of the shadow, the shadow, as a living entity must survive. our shadow is extemely important to primordial survivial. if it is not integrated it will find a way to survive. Even if the ego tries to kill or hide the shadow. the more opposite your ego correspondence is to shadow the more it will manifest in 3d
That’s a struggle. Is this the human experience ? Or is that a dysfunctional wound.? Shadows are necessary. But when in 3D, it all hands on deck. What’s the cure again ?
I think this is such a great topic. I have had to do this work on myself many times and in many stages and it is so tiring and taxing but invaluable. I think everyone can relate to this whether they are aware of what they were doing to heal themselves or not. I believe this is where spirituality and psychology meet and overlap in the best of ways.
So many valuable moments that really hit home for me just wanted to say Thank you for your gifts of insights that you offer to so many of us who need it most @ this time!🙏💜😇
You are so welcome
20:48 Thank your for pointing out this dangerous problem and share your concern with us about our young generation (our future). Because I was also a part of dark collective unconsciousness when I was young, I would like to share my experience with you that there are 2 types influenced them.
First,what our kid have perceived from external influences which change their innocent soul like dropping black oil into water. Such as porn, violence videos games, movies, bad lyrics music, and surrounding by bad friends and environment ( school, neighbors or even family).
Secondly, this is my personal issue, from Vietnam, many kids growing up was a sacrifice for wealth deities, entities worshipers. Many people trade their kids for wealth so kids growing up was already a part of dark force collective unconsciousness. They serves for these dark force to create fear, chaos and bad influence to those normal kids and people. They lack sense of morals, love and life purpose.
Some kids and teenagers are also just a shadow or a reflection of you.
Well said.
I call it a trance. A mass psychosis.
Aka; no mother no father, no GOD, no home. No self. So let’s distract with tech, etc. it’s a deep wound.
LOVE your new format!
You did Shamanism!! Yay! 😊😊😊
I'm admitting to binging this. Dr. Lee is straight out of Central casting exactly who you would expect to pick your brain and dreams😂❤
Lol. Barf. I was that kid who smoked weed and shut the adults out and as an adult I can tell you this was the fault of the adults not me as a kid or the collective rebellion of the grung rock generation. If adults were connected to kids and not using them for vicarious success or ignoring them completely, there would be no need for disassociation and alienating rebellion in youth. If you can handle them rebelling and be there for them as they differentiate they do not need to disassociate. It is a way of nurturing creativity rather than reacting to it. Behind every troubled child is a troubled parent.
I feel this. There is a window of opportunity before a teen "resigns," when they look around for guidance and realize the purpose of life is not reflective in the adults around them surviving not thriving and so it's too painful to keep seeing the world through the souls eyes and the ego protects them through resignation to fit in, stay safe and be in the world as they don't know how to be not of it. Resignation happened to me at 13 and i wore grey for years
I think that's exactly what they're saying. The teen experiences some kind of trauma or maladaption by their environment, eventually being crippled or maladjusted by these shortcomings (ie resigning to drugs and hedonism).
Blaming and fault finding is irrelevant. We came into the "school" to learn and grow. Some say we signed up for every class. Chose our parents, life's significant events, everything. We must be guided by love found in our own heart.
So if we cut off a part of ourselves, the why doesn't matter. The only thing that matters is healing and growing.
@Kintsugi979 I can see your point, however... a couple years ago I told my parents that I'd been diagnosed with PTSD and have a significant (3+ year) gap in my memory prior to when my mother lovingly terms "when the aliens stole her real daughter and dropped this thing off."
Nobody in my family remembers anything about me during the missing time, but for a plethora and multitude of reasons I know the nature of the event(s). My father responded with "well, I had something like that happen to me and I didn't let it affect *MY* life."
I'll tell you what, *THAT'S* my father, he chose *ME* as his child in this school as well. As far as I'm concerned, my authentic hurt and feeling of betrayal, both historical and current, that it's my role to illuminate for him the depth of suffering that can be endured... I've been detailing it for him as I discover the origins of the things I feel in my body as the trauma unfolds itself to me. If he feels no compassion toward the fact that my leg hurts and I lose proprioception of my feet under certain conditions because I was *HUNG BY THAT LEG* he deserves to stay the hell out of my life.
I love this comment.
Maybe we incarnate into an injured world, so we can discover, develop & master ourselves-- every part of us. Bless us all!! 🤩🙏💕
This is wonderful thank you.
Thank you for this, so much.
Coincidentally I'm currently reading "Respark: Igniting hope and joy after trauma and depression" by Graham Music - and it strikes me that he might be talking about the same thing using different language. What he calls a loss of spark sounds a lot like the loss of soul you're talking about. I'm going to have therapist-as-shaman in the back of my mind as I read - thank you :)
Is it something like the “dark night of the soul”?
Amazing Insights!!
22:01 the kids are reacting to the parents loss of soul.
Shame curls us inward and inward is only introspection which is antithetical to development, communication and communion all of which make life worth living. ❤
Wonderful!
my family was killed in a mass shooting and i am still trying to find a way to heal that. its more the trauma than the sorrow. my body acts weird. my brain just won’t sleep. i feel sick inside. we lost ten family members. i have done a lot of self healing work before but this one seems impossible. i’m so sad to have lost the part of me that can feel or be happy. i am still able to make some parts of me work. but not others. i really need help and don’t know where to turn. i have always been able to rise above other traumas. this time i feel so utterly hopeless. 😢
No one responded so i feel obligated to reply, hope this reaches you well. What a profound loss I am so so sorry. If you are able to find local/online resources for grief somatic therapy to help process. (Loved ones / friends are so important too!) Thats such a deep pain to go through. Dont feel pressued to "keep it together" you are allowed to hurt and feel however you want. Take care of yourself 🤍
Thank you for sharing, it’s hard to open up, and it’s even harder to find someone who is willing to listen, or care. People say ‘reach out to friends and talk to someone’, but when I have tried talking to friends about my sadness, I suddenly found no one would return my calls. I think going through this alone brought me to a deeper level of healing, but it could’ve been so much easier if I had just one person to help me through. I want you to know that I would be happy to talk with you anytime you need, even if it’s just to listen. The light in me sees the light in you. I’m here for you, and I am so sorry for the loss you have endured.
💔 i’m so sorry for your loss. it’s some time later now, i hope things have improved slightly. don’t forget there’s a way to change your frame
Thanks so much for this deep dive, discussion and framing! Very personally relevant wnd helpful! Thinking on a societal scale, is anomie a driver of or a symptom of collective loss of soul? Is that how collective soul loss manifests?
After listening to Joseph story about remembering the dog experience as à three year old, also the hospital experience of the young man he was working with as a physiotherapist. I'm so glad I listened to the small boy I was in charge of. He had absolute terror when I left the room, even if I told him I was leaving to go to the toilet, one day he looked at me very seriously and said "I've been alone for 14 years" I had the feeling ge had, anyway after listening to this pleased I didn't poo poo him as maybe something pre verbal had taken place to scare him so much.
Thanks for listening to him and believing him.
Does the soul overlap with our individual unconscious mind in some way ? Is it the emotional component of the unconscious?
What about with disassociation? If we are living in a narcissistic state... Wouldn't that be loss of soul as well?
It was my first experience with ceremonial ayahuasca that helped me understand that my chronic dysthymia (low grade depression) was better articulated as "soul loss".
People think feeling depressed is sickness. Its not. Its necessary to move between states and become ok with the movement. Dont fear them and u wont get stuck. Theyre transient.
As always, great!
This describes my loss of self and the continuous uncontrollable descent into the abyss after I married. Marriage traumatized me more than anything.
Loss of love, loss of social connection with others, aging, futility, etc.
I would add to the dream analysis the following. The bull represents the stresses that pushed her from child to parent child. Climbing away was the attempt to reach a higher level above the pressure's felt in her unstable world she's propelled into. Climbing represented rising above the chaos to find understanding and resolution and/or escape.
Falling down and being caught by the dragon was the archetype she had to integrate and become to protect herself as the younger child and the chocolate represents the nourishment of the two selves together. (Her person and the archetype which she became to survive the dragon.)
The large head represents her intellect. Becoming super sharpened and keen as a survival mechanism and the spikes were each of challenges or task to absorb and yes, she had to ward off as an adult understood by a child person, the needs of the integrsted dragon have come to completion and the head shrinks. And she is returning to with youthful child and the creativity that was lost.
I’m so glad we can see you guys now as well as hearing you. Such a wonderful episode and so enlightening. Thank you! 🩵💛🩵
If you’re going to look at this from a mythological perspective, we can compare to Osiris and the gathering of his parts, of course, the feminine played a vital role.
Kind of list me with the part about does the soul go somewhere else…? Consider a chat with Bernardo Kastrup, a Dutch Jungian expert.
"The shaman represents this principle on the primitive level, as do the mystics, the poets, and the artists in the higher reaches of the culture scale."
[The Masks of God: Primitive Mythology, Joseph Campbell, 1991, Part 4: "..."]
Love seeing your faces!!!
I really think this is some thing I should do to retrieve my soul. I need guidance for sure on doing this properly. I really need help.
thank you !
What a wonderful episode. Thank you. Is rapture a word that might come close to describing Joseph’s experience ?
It can be captured thru deep samadi / mysticism
An hedonia, is that how you spell it? I’m going through this these days. Maybe slowly coming out of it. Lots of therapy but just starting to do dream work. Shadow work. A little exhausting, all the work in my cave. Lots of napping but on the mend. Thank you three.🙏
Very nice
This sounds like the last three years of our country. Loss of soul.
James Hillman voiced a concern regarding the soul of the US 12 years ago.
ruclips.net/video/VFng0WCJ8X8/видео.html at 4 min. 52 sec .
100%!! Everyone was a casualty . So grateful for this discussion ! And YOU for speaking the truth. Bless our Souls 🙏💜🐬
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