Love these practical content which help with multiple perspectives and options not out of the box. I settled with the 10-51T for both my SLX and XT wheelsets in the absence of your experience to be honest. Happy with it thus far. 👍🏾 Great detailed video as always.
This is awesome, wish I would have known about the 11 speed GS sooner. But I have been using the long XT 12 speed wiht the 10-45T cassette for a few months now. Awesome video.
Interesting for a racing bike. I find the 10 tooth cog is perfect with a 32t or 34t ring for XC fast descents, but I never use the 50t cog as it's really just a bail-out gear. Now the spacing with the 10 / 45 makes a lot more sense and it could also mean cheaper derailleurs with shorter cages. Thanks a lot for the tips.
Better to have a bailout gear and never use it especially if you're buying only one cassette for all purposes. If you're in the 10t you would actually be better off super tucking or doing a supertuck based position if you're in a UCI competition
@@jason200912 Those cassettes are for mtb, there is no "super tucking" going on. UCI banned those positions... If you have a XC racing bike, you probably own other bikes that fit different purposes and that 51tooth gear might be helpful there. You get better spacing for racing application after the 28th tooth : - 10-45 : 10-12-14-16-18-21-24-28-32-36-40-45 - 10-51 : 10-12-14-16-18-21-24-28-33-39-45-51
@@jason200912 Then why you bringing "supertuck" to the convo mate? Is this something you like to do when competing against yourself on your local trail ?
Your videos are always very helpful and there is always something new to learn. I have to say this XT M8000 derailleur is amazing. After long time, I cnoverted my drivetrain 2x11 to 1x11 and it works really good. I kept my XT M8000 SGS and installed DEORE M5100 cassette 11-51T and it is really good setup, I am very satisfied with that. Works fine, shifts fine and looks nice. I tested it on flat soections and uphills between 20 - 25% of gradient and everything works really good. Climbing is amazing with this setup.
Now Im a bit confused. Did you manage to operate XT M8000 SGS with M5100 cassette without the goatlink? Everyone claims that you need to use RD-M5100 with M5100 cassette or 12 speed ones and that 11 speed XT M8000 is not compatible with 51 tooth large cog. Please can you make it clear? I guess if it works for you it does work.
@@digitalkovik Yes, I use xt m8000 sgs with m5100 11-51t without goatlink or any rd hanger extender. People say that a lot of things will not work but it work.
@@LoveMTB M5100 cassette pairs with Deore RD-M5100 as per Shimano. As you are mentioning in your video it works with all 12 speed RDs. It looks like it works with 11 speed RD-M8000 CG, but I was wondering if we set it for largest gear, vould it not be too far from lower gears? Therefore hard to setup to work reliably? One thing is if it works with no load in the garrage and the other if it works on trail.
I used the 45t based on the fact I was riding 32t to 11-36t on 26" wheels, and still being limited by grip or front wheel unweighting on climbs. To get the same smallest gear with the 45t cassette and 29" wheels, I think it came out at a 36t chainring. I've gone with smaller because I've been unable to ride for 2 years and my frame probably won't accommodate that, but the 45t gives more ground clearance which is what killed my previous setup, a 10 speed on 26" with a proper short cage mech. 10-51t is a bit of a mystery to me, but I've always liked to pump out high torque rather than spin.
Well, I used the 11-40 with 34t when I was riding 1x11 Now the new bike I bought I'm using 11-51 with 36t 1x12 But I think the jump between cogs its huge ¡¡ 8I most ride road bike so maybe its related) I can't adapt to this so I'm Switching 10-45 with 34t chainring
The reason that I'll go for the 10-45 instead of 51 next time, is the ability to use the m8000 derailleur, I really like how the new ones handle cross chaining with the crooked cage, however I really hate how much they stick out from the bike.
@@Lee-ic2yn yes, and an update to the m8000, it doesn't handle a 12 cassette well, doesn't have enough side to side range, and a 12s cassette has the biggest cog even slightly more inwards than 11s.
Awesome hack! This should help many a Shimano drivetrain owner..... If I were to design my perfect drivetrain, it would be a 10 speed 9-48. On my Eagle 10-50 I double, triple and quadruple tap 80% of my shifts, and would love a wide ratio drivetrain. It would be lighter and I would be able to run my 30T chainring (like I already do) with an even better top end. SRAM and Shimano are in an arms race to give us the most gears, but not the best gears.... I understand racers need to keep a certain cadence up and they love the 12 speed stuff, but I'm just an average trail rider who couldn't care less about my cadence. < end rant >!
I don't think you can get things much lighter as the Garbaruk cassette's Apart from using titanium. E13 has 9-46 and other 9tooth cassette's tho. Speaking of making your own... Next month i will try to remake the one up mini cluster with shimano spare cogs for the 12spd. i hope that this will work.... Well first parts must be back in stock😬
"are not that big of a deal for weekend warriors like you and me" definitely loved that!> All the necessary videos that I was looking for here on RUclips, were founded in your channel!
Awesome video. And there's even another option, running a 10-51 XTR cassette with the 51T cog removed. So 11 speed 10-45T with 80g saving. I'll try this route on my xc 29er. Hope the gaps at the largest cogs don't bother me.
I think, I will start to stockpile the RD-M8000-GS's :DDD These got everything, the looks, the size, the compatability. Also I wonder: The RD-M8130-SGS, how versatile is it? Or it's just for linkglide systems?
I've been using an RD-M7100 on a CS-M7100 10-45T on a couple of bikes (hardtail & full suspension) and shifting is fine in the stand, but has a small amount of chatter when riding. If you tune this out with cable tension, the shifting speed slows. I'm going to try a RD-M7120 in the hope that the top pulley will be able to be adjusted closer to the cassette. I'm curious to see how well a 45T rated, 11 speed mech might work as 12 speed availability is an issue at the moment. I have tried an RD-M5100 which was similar to the other 12 speed mechs rated to a 51T.
Wow great video!!! Will come handy to me some day. So a more important question how does it shift/perform on the trail? That's the one it matters the most
I bought the 10-45T XT. You're also supposed to use a different derailleur with shadow RD plus. 4:26 Nope, the difference is bigger, since the derailleur for the 45 is lighter, because of its shorter cage.
Great video! unf, shimano's choice of gear ratios leaves a lot to be desired. gaps are huge at the top end due to two tooth jumps between cogs, while gear changes at the low end are small, often requiring multiple shifts. take a 10-45 cassette with 32T 1x setup as an example. shifting between 12 (2.67) and 10 (3.20) cogs is a massive (0.53) gap, while at the low end shifts between 45 (0.71) and 40 (0.80) cogs, or 40 (0.80) and 36 (0.89) cogs are small (0.09) steps. looking at it another way, the (0.53) gap between 12 and 10 cogs is equivalent to shifting thru four gears, between 40 (0.80) and 24 (1.33) cogs! it would be great if someone offered more evenly spaced cassette(s) with single tooth spacing at the high end and consistent gaps thru the rest of the range.
The 29" trail and enduro bikes that guys like me can afford are pretty heavy. Having that 51 tooth cog is unfortunately necessary for many weekend warriors.
What are your opinions on close ratio gearing? It's more prevalent with the HG 11s cassettes that I've looked at. For instance, the gear change from cog 3 to 4 on the M8130 11s (CS-LG600-11) has a 13% tooth increase. The CS-H113 & CS-G113 have a 20% increase in the same change. I think I could give up gross range for tighter ratios over the entire cassette. It might be okay for the largest cogs to make the biggest jumps. The real meat of my drive comes in the middle of the cassette, so I think closer ratios to match spin speed as I shift up and down may be a good idea.
Seams to be a great option! Thanks for the awesome hack with 11s xt rear mech ^^ . Do you think it would work on 26' bike, or the clearance would be too small ?
i have a 12s derailleur with long cage on my 26 inch bike. works fine, almost touches the ground though lol. Well not quite, havent had any issue so far.
@@Ropetable I still have 3x9 sram X.0 on one of my bikes ^^ Thinking about fun project for this summer. I was going to use shimano xt/ deore 1x11. I'll consider 1x12 with this hack.
@@pchlars5666 sounds great. The 1x12 Shimano cassettes are the best thing i ever shifted. The hyperglide plus on the 12s lets you shift under load, and results in always smooth shifts. just because of that i would go 12s. That hack is a great solution for you :D
Do weekend warrior even need 10t instead of 11t ? I dont think so But very good practical experiment for 10-45 old shimano rear drailer . Keep up good job
Hi, I am watching your videos for a long time now, great and very informative, many thanks. Is there any chance you could test Shimano 10-45 cassette with AXS derailleur, please? I am thinking about this setup but I am not sure it that would work. There is not many (well, not at all, just assumptions) on internet forums, and I think it would be a great video too! All the best, Jarek
Been reading comments here but still a bit confused. So here's my question. I want to install 11 speed deore casette 11-51 since that will work with my current freehub not needing to change. Will it work if I use any(SLX, XT, XTR) 12 speed derailleurs and shifters? Looking at options online, SLX,XT and XTR 11 speeds isn't compatible with the 50/51T cog. Makes me Confused. Thanks
Did you tried this? I'm planning on using this route, I'll need to get a micro spline rear hub, the cassette and shifter but at least I'll be saving on the derailleur as I'll be reusing my still very crisp m9000.
Ive been running a 11 speed XT drivechain on my Tallboy 4 becuase I built it frame up when the parts shortage began. I have a 36 tooth wolftooth oval chainring with a 11-42 cassette. I ride in N Ga. Mostly XC type trails but a lot of climbing. I have a hard time understanding why people would pay several 100 dollars more for a 12 speed and I also think the range on my 11-42 is plenty.
A lot of climbs and long climbs are not the same thing, for my local trails I could happily live with a 11-36 cassette even and 32t ring, however that would mean always springting to the top or very low cadence for riding more slowly, that doesn't work for real mountains, I want my bike to work both on flat ground (top speed I don't care about, I don't pedal downhill or race with cars) and to be able to climb for an hour @15% grade, and I'm no world class athlete obviously. Imo 11s is enough gears for good spacing, unfortunately the companies have to find a way to sell you new stuff, so instead of a nicely spaced 11s with 10t smallest cog we got a complete new groupset with a higher pricetag and "not backwards compatible"
Maybe I missed it, but how is the shifting with 10-45 cassette using SGS derailleur? Or do I ‘need’ the GS derailleur for optimal shifting. The 10-45 w/34T will be a nice addition to my XC Race bike!
@@LoveMTB I found this video, it looks ok, but someone in the comments contradicted the performance running 12speed GS Derailleur with 10-51T cassette. So, not 100% certain it would work. ruclips.net/video/q9EE4gvedpQ/видео.html
I just bought an 2023 Ibis DV9 as it has been touted as a versatile bike, so I'll be putting it to the test with some 27.5 wheels driven with the 12 speed 10-45 cassette, and the XT mid cage 11 speed rear derailleur. I'll give the funny guy @6:25 an update on how it turns out.😉
Why would the indexing on the 11-speed derailleur work on the 12-speed? My brain can't process that. Something has to be different...either the indexing distance per click or the width of the cassette (with a spacer?).
Great video. Question: I'm buying a 29er wheelset for my fat bike which has a Shimano 10-51t and I'm wondering if I could run a 10-46t on the new wheel without having to adjust the derailer between wheel swaps? Thoughts?
@@LoveMTB thank you for this. Also, I found out that the distance between the middle of the guide to the 51T mark is 46mm which is the required distance of rd for 2x (m7120sgs) as stated in the manual
I have a question. Currently I have a Deore m5100 1x11 groupset with a cassette (11-42) with a M5120 SGS rear derailleur, but I want to change it for an XT M8000, which derailleur should I choose? SG OR SGS? I hope you can help me🤔
@@LoveMTB thanks for the reply. Ive been hesitant myself and have been waiting for some solid reviews and youtube content about it but its hard to find. which may point to what youre saying...
I am curious about wear on smaller cogs on 12 speed shimano and sram with 10 or 9 Tooth compared to 11T. I know it makes sense if they have smaller cassettes with smaller last cog making it possible to use smaller chainring without losing topspeed and climbing gear. But I am not sold on the Microspline yet. Nor Xd drive, I would have to try it myself i guess.
I'm planning to buy the Deore XT Groupset. I want the 10-51T cogs but im more of an xc rider so i want the bigger chainring. Can I use 36T chainring to 10-51T cogs?
Why not a 11-50t 12s for regular hubs with a larger chairing in the front? That's what I'm using, just do the math online to see what matches the 10-45 gearset
@@ricardog4459 because I have that setup now bro -_- yes the range is the same, but if I could have same range with smaller front chainring, smaller cassette and in turn shorter chain with shorter cage, I'd take it. Old Shimano 11-46 had atrocious gear spacing and Sunrace also had it's issues. What I have now works better than previous Sunrace, but I'm worried about the longass cage not surviving a season, as seen in this video with 27.5 wheel it reaches almost to the ground.
@@sebastiengiovannelli8556 there is also a 50$ Shimano m5100 11-51 11s, I'm running it now, but if it were not for the expensive microspline, I'd be running the 10-45 with an m8000 mid cage derailleur.
I don't think I could use this with Box X-wide as it really is max 50t, with bB bolt bottomed out at 50T. I've not tried other rear derailleurs yet. Nor tried Xd drive and Microspline. But have Garbaruk cassette on order. Ordered second Archer d1xtrail. Not sure when I will build my second bike. Nor what i will end up drivetrain wise. Currently I use Sunrace 11-50t HG. But I get sharp edges at the teeth, ramps, bend cogs slitgly, bend teeth on the smaller cogs,worst on the smallest cog. But I bend them back with pliers, use flat surface to tell if its straight, and sand the sharp edges off. I am not sure if I did a mistake with ordering 11-50t Garbaruk, I've not tried 12 speed.
Thanks for the video, I just bought a RD-M9120 by accident I thought I was getting the m9100. I have a 1x system with a 10-51 cassette. Can I make this Detailer work or do I need to return it?
Hi , I’ve got the short cage XTR 12s mech and t seems to work well on the eagle 50t cassette. ( I’ve also tried my 51t XT cassette ). It shift smoothly and quickly and definitely gives more ground clearance
@@LoveMTB Yeah its expensive but cheaper if you already have a 12 speed derailleur. I believe the only reason that it is so expensive is because one of the plates is carbon. The outer plate (carbon) cost 90 USD while the inner plate (aluminum) is 10USD. I am running the XT 10-45 with the RD-M8120
@@LoveMTB That's what I want to do, but I don't want to change the wheel freehub. : / Just hoping there is 3rd party brand will produce some cassettes by 10-40 or lower teeth.
I run sram chains and shimano chainrings on my bike and it works perfectly. Shimano cassettes are better though, when my xx1 is worn out i will switch back
I have the 2018 Giant Trance 2 with the direct mount set up. So to clarify, I have the M8000 RD on it so with a microspline wheel upgrade and M8100 12 speed XT shifter, is my only option the XT 10x45 cassette? I really would like to do 10x51 but am annoyed having a direct mount derailleur will prevent enabling me to do this. Could my Trance be converted to standard mount?
You've got me thinking about an M9000 derailleur now. I've got an M7120 at the moment and the length of the derailleur cage is a risk for sure... I've already caught it on a rock but luckily it only scuffed the finish off. I was also running an 11-52 cassette but went down to 11-46 recently as I just didn't need the extra range with a 32t chainring up front. Maybe the climbs around here aren't as harsh as what others have to deal with!
Hi Bro I just ordered: m6100 rd 12 speed csmz901 12 speed cassette Im planning to partner it with M8100 shifter and M6100 chain Do you think it will work fine?
Maybe that's a point becasue Im not on racing or even in trail but Im planning to go soon (maybe after this pandemic) I've already watch all your videos about shifters including xt itself specially the 4 clicks and the multi release, + the faster release of cables unlike deore and slx well anyway Thanks! Nice and detailed review I've learned so many things through this! Earned a sub!
Here is what I'm experiencing, I used Shimano 12 speed 10 51T with Shimano xt 12 speed derailleur and shifter with xtr hyperglide+ chain. I found that the shifting is not as smooth. The weird thing is a 12 speed GX eagle and XO chain shift very smoothly with Shimano XT derailleur and shifter. Very weird but true. I'm into the last combo now. Save lots of money by buying Shimano XT shifter and derailleur only but using it with Sram GX eagle cassette and chain.
@@LoveMTB Would it be good idea to mix 12 speed shimano XT shifter, 12 s cassete 10-45t and 12 s chain XO with M6000 Deore cranks with aftermarket Deckas chainring (specified as 7-12 speed)?
@@LoveMTB thank you for replay. Yes, have seen video in link provided couple months ago. Have found some good option for Garbaruk chainrings. It says "Compatible with all 9,10,11-speed chains, 12-speed SRAM Eagle, KMC, Shimano HG+ chains". So I guess Shimano chain is also an option. Just not sure SLX, XT or XTR level to choose. Or to stick with Sram XO option..
Actually doesn't have much tighter ratios. 10 speed 11-36: 11-12-14-16-18-21-24-28-32-36 12 speed 10-45: 10-12-14-16-18-21-24-28-36-40-45 Almost identical spacing other than the 10 tooth small cog
@@tomdeller6795 im not comparing 10 to 12 speed. I went from a 10 speed 1x with 32 front and 11-42 rear to what I have listed and there is a difference. Otherwise Id go back to 1x.
@@tomdeller6795 You have to consider the chainring as well, not just the cassette teeth in the back. A two tooth change at the cassette has almost a 50% bigger jump when matched with a 32 1x chainring rather than a 22 lower 2x chainring. It's easier to see when you look at it in gear inches on a gear calculator. It's one of the advantages that 2x can still have.
Man, I wouldn't be so eager to jump on this 10-45 m8000 idea if I knew the derailleur just barely has enough reach for the largest cog, the 12s cassette is wider enough as compared to 11s to cause problems.
@@LoveMTB it's not the range itself, that's supported well, it's about the width of the cassette itself, the largest cog is pushed a little more inside than it was with 11s, it's right at the edge of possible derailleur travelit may be that my frame exaggerates the issue just a little (chick derailleur hanger) compared to some others.
@@LoveMTB the issue is with the angle at which the cable is pulled, the derailleur can be moved more inward by hand, but it cannot be pulled any further by the shifter, anyway, I see the same thing in your case, so you can check it for yourself. As I said, it does work, but just barely.
Btw. I always start with the end adjuster screw (to aid with setting cable tension), index the cassette and then set the limiter screws to barely touch when in either end of the range, starting with the limiter screws could present some issues sometimes.
I prefer the XT over the SLX. I've seen them both in person and the XT seems like a tougher built design (explains the weight). The SLX seems more matte on the surface, perhaps it's because there may be a manufacturing difference that the density and structural integrity of the SLX isn't going to be as good as the XT.
![ARGENTINA vs. BOLIVIA [6-0] | RESUMEN | ELIMINATORIAS SUDAMERICANAS | FECHA 10](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/C3wPtKNbAOA/mqdefault.jpg)
So you can use an 11 speed derailleur provided you pair it with a 12 speed shifter? That never occurred to me.
Love these practical content which help with multiple perspectives and options not out of the box. I settled with the 10-51T for both my SLX and XT wheelsets in the absence of your experience to be honest. Happy with it thus far. 👍🏾
Great detailed video as always.
Same. No clue what sorta dummies downvote this stuff.
@@ChrisKilzer 👍
This is awesome, wish I would have known about the 11 speed GS sooner. But I have been using the long XT 12 speed wiht the 10-45T cassette for a few months now. Awesome video.
Interesting for a racing bike. I find the 10 tooth cog is perfect with a 32t or 34t ring for XC fast descents, but I never use the 50t cog as it's really just a bail-out gear. Now the spacing with the 10 / 45 makes a lot more sense and it could also mean cheaper derailleurs with shorter cages. Thanks a lot for the tips.
Better to have a bailout gear and never use it especially if you're buying only one cassette for all purposes. If you're in the 10t you would actually be better off super tucking or doing a supertuck based position if you're in a UCI competition
@@jason200912 Those cassettes are for mtb, there is no "super tucking" going on. UCI banned those positions... If you have a XC racing bike, you probably own other bikes that fit different purposes and that 51tooth gear might be helpful there.
You get better spacing for racing application after the 28th tooth :
- 10-45 : 10-12-14-16-18-21-24-28-32-36-40-45
- 10-51 : 10-12-14-16-18-21-24-28-33-39-45-51
@@pbenjlo i think you know well that most civillian cyclists arent pro athletes under UCI regulations.
@@jason200912 Then why you bringing "supertuck" to the convo mate? Is this something you like to do when competing against yourself on your local trail ?
@@pbenjlo yes. it's faster than pedalling if you've ever been on a well kept bike trail
You deserve more subscribes sir! Great videos, love these stuff where you compare and test different groupsets.
Your videos are always very helpful and there is always something new to learn. I have to say this XT M8000 derailleur is amazing. After long time, I cnoverted my drivetrain 2x11 to 1x11 and it works really good. I kept my XT M8000 SGS and installed DEORE M5100 cassette 11-51T and it is really good setup, I am very satisfied with that. Works fine, shifts fine and looks nice. I tested it on flat soections and uphills between 20 - 25% of gradient and everything works really good. Climbing is amazing with this setup.
@@LoveMTB thank you for sharing all good information with us.
Now Im a bit confused. Did you manage to operate XT M8000 SGS with M5100 cassette without the goatlink? Everyone claims that you need to use RD-M5100 with M5100 cassette or 12 speed ones and that 11 speed XT M8000 is not compatible with 51 tooth large cog. Please can you make it clear? I guess if it works for you it does work.
@@digitalkovik Yes, I use xt m8000 sgs with m5100 11-51t without goatlink or any rd hanger extender. People say that a lot of things will not work but it work.
@@LoveMTB M5100 cassette pairs with Deore RD-M5100 as per Shimano. As you are mentioning in your video it works with all 12 speed RDs. It looks like it works with 11 speed RD-M8000 CG, but I was wondering if we set it for largest gear, vould it not be too far from lower gears? Therefore hard to setup to work reliably? One thing is if it works with no load in the garrage and the other if it works on trail.
@@digitalkovik I did not install any additional extender, I just kept my RD and instal M5100 cs 11-51, new chain cn hg601 and chainring 32T m8000
I used the 45t based on the fact I was riding 32t to 11-36t on 26" wheels, and still being limited by grip or front wheel unweighting on climbs. To get the same smallest gear with the 45t cassette and 29" wheels, I think it came out at a 36t chainring. I've gone with smaller because I've been unable to ride for 2 years and my frame probably won't accommodate that, but the 45t gives more ground clearance which is what killed my previous setup, a 10 speed on 26" with a proper short cage mech.
10-51t is a bit of a mystery to me, but I've always liked to pump out high torque rather than spin.
Another great video thx. I like how you figured out road blocks with amazing hacks. Great job and the shifting looked really quick and smooth.
Well, I used the 11-40 with 34t when I was riding 1x11
Now the new bike I bought I'm using 11-51 with 36t 1x12
But I think the jump between cogs its huge ¡¡ 8I most ride road bike so maybe its related)
I can't adapt to this so I'm Switching 10-45 with 34t chainring
The reason that I'll go for the 10-45 instead of 51 next time, is the ability to use the m8000 derailleur, I really like how the new ones handle cross chaining with the crooked cage, however I really hate how much they stick out from the bike.
When you say the new one do you mean the m8100?
@@Lee-ic2yn yes, and an update to the m8000, it doesn't handle a 12 cassette well, doesn't have enough side to side range, and a 12s cassette has the biggest cog even slightly more inwards than 11s.
This is why i love ur channel. Thanks n keep it coming!
Like the addition of the face in th intro! ALso that commencal is oming up nicely looking forward to a full review!
Awesome hack! This should help many a Shimano drivetrain owner..... If I were to design my perfect drivetrain, it would be a 10 speed 9-48. On my Eagle 10-50 I double, triple and quadruple tap 80% of my shifts, and would love a wide ratio drivetrain. It would be lighter and I would be able to run my 30T chainring (like I already do) with an even better top end. SRAM and Shimano are in an arms race to give us the most gears, but not the best gears.... I understand racers need to keep a certain cadence up and they love the 12 speed stuff, but I'm just an average trail rider who couldn't care less about my cadence. < end rant >!
Doesn't he MicroShift Advent X already do that? 10 speed, and 48T.
@@georgedaswani9155 11-48T not 9-48T ... Getting closer though, and Box is close too.
I don't think you can get things much lighter as the Garbaruk cassette's Apart from using titanium. E13 has 9-46 and other 9tooth cassette's tho.
Speaking of making your own...
Next month i will try to remake the one up mini cluster with shimano spare cogs for the 12spd. i hope that this will work.... Well first parts must be back in stock😬
Guy... This is incredible!! Good news. But my main problema is the low power in the legs to ride with a 10-45 cassette...😂😂😂 Congrats!!!!
How about a tiny chainring? 26 or 28tooth?
"are not that big of a deal for weekend warriors like you and me" definitely loved that!>
All the necessary videos that I was looking for here on RUclips, were founded in your channel!
Awesome video. And there's even another option, running a 10-51 XTR cassette with the 51T cog removed. So 11 speed 10-45T with 80g saving. I'll try this route on my xc 29er. Hope the gaps at the largest cogs don't bother me.
did it work?
I think, I will start to stockpile the RD-M8000-GS's :DDD These got everything, the looks, the size, the compatability.
Also I wonder: The RD-M8130-SGS, how versatile is it? Or it's just for linkglide systems?
As usual great content. Always learn more than the title reveals.
I've been using an RD-M7100 on a CS-M7100 10-45T on a couple of bikes (hardtail & full suspension) and shifting is fine in the stand, but has a small amount of chatter when riding. If you tune this out with cable tension, the shifting speed slows. I'm going to try a RD-M7120 in the hope that the top pulley will be able to be adjusted closer to the cassette.
I'm curious to see how well a 45T rated, 11 speed mech might work as 12 speed availability is an issue at the moment. I have tried an RD-M5100 which was similar to the other 12 speed mechs rated to a 51T.
Wow great video!!! Will come handy to me some day. So a more important question how does it shift/perform on the trail? That's the one it matters the most
I bought the 10-45T XT. You're also supposed to use a different derailleur with shadow RD plus.
4:26 Nope, the difference is bigger, since the derailleur for the 45 is lighter, because of its shorter cage.
Great video! unf, shimano's choice of gear ratios leaves a lot to be desired. gaps are huge at the top end due to two tooth jumps between cogs, while gear changes at the low end are small, often requiring multiple shifts. take a 10-45 cassette with 32T 1x setup as an example. shifting between 12 (2.67) and 10 (3.20) cogs is a massive (0.53) gap, while at the low end shifts between 45 (0.71) and 40 (0.80) cogs, or 40 (0.80) and 36 (0.89) cogs are small (0.09) steps. looking at it another way, the (0.53) gap between 12 and 10 cogs is equivalent to shifting thru four gears, between 40 (0.80) and 24 (1.33) cogs! it would be great if someone offered more evenly spaced cassette(s) with single tooth spacing at the high end and consistent gaps thru the rest of the range.
Unfortunately that doesn't exist in the MTB world today
I really enjoy your content
Show, estava esperando este vídeo
The 29" trail and enduro bikes that guys like me can afford are pretty heavy. Having that 51 tooth cog is unfortunately necessary for many weekend warriors.
Excellent comments for us to consider. Thank you very much
What are your opinions on close ratio gearing? It's more prevalent with the HG 11s cassettes that I've looked at. For instance, the gear change from cog 3 to 4 on the M8130 11s (CS-LG600-11) has a 13% tooth increase. The CS-H113 & CS-G113 have a 20% increase in the same change. I think I could give up gross range for tighter ratios over the entire cassette. It might be okay for the largest cogs to make the biggest jumps. The real meat of my drive comes in the middle of the cassette, so I think closer ratios to match spin speed as I shift up and down may be a good idea.
Seams to be a great option! Thanks for the awesome hack with 11s xt rear mech ^^ . Do you think it would work on 26' bike, or the clearance would be too small ?
i have a 12s derailleur with long cage on my 26 inch bike. works fine, almost touches the ground though lol. Well not quite, havent had any issue so far.
@@Ropetable I still have 3x9 sram X.0 on one of my bikes ^^ Thinking about fun project for this summer. I was going to use shimano xt/ deore 1x11. I'll consider 1x12 with this hack.
@@pchlars5666 sounds great. The 1x12 Shimano cassettes are the best thing i ever shifted. The hyperglide plus on the 12s lets you shift under load, and results in always smooth shifts. just because of that i would go 12s. That hack is a great solution for you :D
May I ask, what is your chainstay protector? Did it come stock with your bike or is it aftermarket? Love your channel!
Do weekend warrior even need 10t instead of 11t ? I dont think so
But very good practical experiment for 10-45 old shimano rear drailer . Keep up good job
I consider myself a weekend warrior and I do use the 10T cog when taking the street or gravel riding with a fast group often.
So a 11s GS XT derailleur combined with SLX cranks, XT shifter and cassette (for some weight saving where it matters) + XT/XTR chain.
Hi, I am watching your videos for a long time now, great and very informative, many thanks. Is there any chance you could test Shimano 10-45 cassette with AXS derailleur, please? I am thinking about this setup but I am not sure it that would work. There is not many (well, not at all, just assumptions) on internet forums, and I think it would be a great video too! All the best, Jarek
@@LoveMTB many thanks
I like It. This RUclips channel has Indonesian subtitles. Thank you bro. 😊👍👍👍👍
Interesting hack with the derailleur, but did I get it right, it won't manage a 10-51? Also, where did you find the comparison on chain longevity?
Excelente video, con muy buenas conclusiones e informacion. Enhorabuena !!!!
Been reading comments here but still a bit confused. So here's my question. I want to install 11 speed deore casette 11-51 since that will work with my current freehub not needing to change. Will it work if I use any(SLX, XT, XTR) 12 speed derailleurs and shifters? Looking at options online, SLX,XT and XTR 11 speeds isn't compatible with the 50/51T cog. Makes me
Confused. Thanks
@@LoveMTB well I guess I'll just go deore m5100 all the way for the 11speed. Thanks
giant XTC 800plus, which cassette is suitable for upgrading?
Will the new shorter M8100 GS mech. offer any benefits over the 11 speed mech. hack in
form or function 🤔
Hi @LoveMTB. If done vice-versa, would a 12spd rd work with 11-50T 11spd cassette and shifter? Love to hear your thoughts
in my case I will use the xtr m9000 instead of the xt m8000, it will be perfect! thanks for the direct and objective tip!
Did you tried this? I'm planning on using this route, I'll need to get a micro spline rear hub, the cassette and shifter but at least I'll be saving on the derailleur as I'll be reusing my still very crisp m9000.
Have you tried the cheap 1x9 microshift groupset?
Ive been running a 11 speed XT drivechain on my Tallboy 4 becuase I built it frame up when the parts shortage began. I have a 36 tooth wolftooth oval chainring with a 11-42 cassette. I ride in N Ga. Mostly XC type trails but a lot of climbing. I have a hard time understanding why people would pay several 100 dollars more for a 12 speed and I also think the range on my 11-42 is plenty.
A lot of climbs and long climbs are not the same thing, for my local trails I could happily live with a 11-36 cassette even and 32t ring, however that would mean always springting to the top or very low cadence for riding more slowly, that doesn't work for real mountains, I want my bike to work both on flat ground (top speed I don't care about, I don't pedal downhill or race with cars) and to be able to climb for an hour @15% grade, and I'm no world class athlete obviously.
Imo 11s is enough gears for good spacing, unfortunately the companies have to find a way to sell you new stuff, so instead of a nicely spaced 11s with 10t smallest cog we got a complete new groupset with a higher pricetag and "not backwards compatible"
Really helpful , Can you use the SGS long cage M7100 that's meant for 10-51 with a 10-45 cassette ?
Please, Would I be able to use an RD-M5120 SHIFT IN PLACE OF THE XT-M8000 GS FOR 10-45 CASSETTE?
my my ... can save quiet lot of cash here :D
If you already have an 11spd rd you can indeed save a lot of money.
Maybe I missed it, but how is the shifting with 10-45 cassette using SGS derailleur? Or do I ‘need’ the GS derailleur for optimal shifting. The 10-45 w/34T will be a nice addition to my XC Race bike!
@@LoveMTB I found this video, it looks ok, but someone in the comments contradicted the performance running 12speed GS Derailleur with 10-51T cassette. So, not 100% certain it would work.
ruclips.net/video/q9EE4gvedpQ/видео.html
I just bought an 2023 Ibis DV9 as it has been touted as a versatile bike, so I'll be putting it to the test with some 27.5 wheels driven with the 12 speed 10-45 cassette, and the XT mid cage 11 speed rear derailleur. I'll give the funny guy @6:25 an update on how it turns out.😉
Can't wait!🙃
Why would the indexing on the 11-speed derailleur work on the 12-speed? My brain can't process that. Something has to be different...either the indexing distance per click or the width of the cassette (with a spacer?).
Shifter dictates it as long as the derailleurs are built for the same cable pull
Great video. Question: I'm buying a 29er wheelset for my fat bike which has a Shimano 10-51t and I'm wondering if I could run a 10-46t on the new wheel without having to adjust the derailer between wheel swaps? Thoughts?
Ok, so I should look for the same cassette to match original or move mine back and forth.
In the video you use M7100 for 10-51T on a 10-45T cassette, did you use the 51T mark in adjusting b-gap when using the 10-45T cassette?
@@LoveMTB thank you for this. Also, I found out that the distance between the middle of the guide to the 51T mark is 46mm which is the required distance of rd for 2x (m7120sgs) as stated in the manual
I have the 8100 XT and they are very good. No complaints
@@LoveMTB is it true that Shimano is coming out with a 13 speed cassette soon?
@@LoveMTB 🤣 only on the uphill when im struggling to breath and keep pedaling hahahaha
I have a question. Currently I have a Deore m5100 1x11 groupset with a cassette (11-42) with a M5120 SGS rear derailleur, but I want to change it for an XT M8000, which derailleur should I choose? SG OR SGS? I hope you can help me🤔
any opinions/experience with kcnc 9-52 cassette?
def appreciate the content even if Im wildly off topic.
@@LoveMTB thanks for the reply. Ive been hesitant myself and have been waiting for some solid reviews and youtube content about it but its hard to find. which may point to what youre saying...
I’ve had good experience with sunrace cassette and kmc chains and I’m using that combination on my hardtail bike, I’m riding at the moment.
I am curious about wear on smaller cogs on 12 speed shimano and sram with 10 or 9 Tooth compared to 11T. I know it makes sense if they have smaller cassettes with smaller last cog making it possible to use smaller chainring without losing topspeed and climbing gear. But I am not sold on the Microspline yet. Nor Xd drive, I would have to try it myself i guess.
I'm planning to buy the Deore XT Groupset. I want the 10-51T cogs but im more of an xc rider so i want the bigger chainring. Can I use 36T chainring to 10-51T cogs?
I'd love to have the 10-45 in 11s variant, my hub cannot accept microspline tho.
A shorter cage would be nice too.
Why not a 11-50t 12s for regular hubs with a larger chairing in the front? That's what I'm using, just do the math online to see what matches the 10-45 gearset
@@ricardog4459 because I have that setup now bro -_- yes the range is the same, but if I could have same range with smaller front chainring, smaller cassette and in turn shorter chain with shorter cage, I'd take it. Old Shimano 11-46 had atrocious gear spacing and Sunrace also had it's issues. What I have now works better than previous Sunrace, but I'm worried about the longass cage not surviving a season, as seen in this video with 27.5 wheel it reaches almost to the ground.
@@piciu256 wow i never had that issue but I'm riding 29. Never thought about wheel size. Good luck
there is a 10 speed microshift 11 48 cassette 424g 65€ , I use that with rd m5100 and sl m4100 w/o display
@@sebastiengiovannelli8556 there is also a 50$ Shimano m5100 11-51 11s, I'm running it now, but if it were not for the expensive microspline, I'd be running the 10-45 with an m8000 mid cage derailleur.
I don't think I could use this with Box X-wide as it really is max 50t, with bB bolt bottomed out at 50T.
I've not tried other rear derailleurs yet. Nor tried Xd drive and Microspline. But have Garbaruk cassette on order. Ordered second Archer d1xtrail. Not sure when I will build my second bike. Nor what i will end up drivetrain wise.
Currently I use Sunrace 11-50t HG.
But I get sharp edges at the teeth, ramps, bend cogs slitgly, bend teeth on the smaller cogs,worst on the smallest cog. But I bend them back with pliers, use flat surface to tell if its straight, and sand the sharp edges off.
I am not sure if I did a mistake with ordering 11-50t Garbaruk, I've not tried 12 speed.
So SRAM 11 speed derailleur should work with 12 speed shifter / cassettes, too?
If the 11sp derailleur works with the 12sp cassette, what idoes the 12sp derailleur offer? Assuming 10-45t only.
Thanks for the video, I just bought a RD-M9120 by accident I thought I was getting the m9100. I have a 1x system with a 10-51 cassette. Can I make this Detailer work or do I need to return it?
@@LoveMTB what is the difference between rd m9100 sgs & m9120 sgs.
Hi , I’ve got the short cage XTR 12s mech and t seems to work well on the eagle 50t cassette. ( I’ve also tried my 51t XT cassette ). It shift smoothly and quickly and definitely gives more ground clearance
That’s interesting to know I thought the cage had to be longer for 12 speed so it didn’t go into the cassette trying to clear large 51t gear.
@@woduk it's more about the chain slack on the smallest cog than anything, top clearance is adjustable.
I have the 10-45 Xt cassette paired up the Xt long cage derailleur which offers the flexibility of going wider range in the future.
Did you use the 51T marker on your RD to line up with the 45T when adjusting the b-gap or did you use other measurement?
Great vid. We'll explained. 👌❤️
you can also get the wolftooth wolfcage for the 11spd XT gs and run a 51t cassette and have a lot of ground clearance
@@LoveMTB if you already have an XT 11spd its better to spend $35 on that and put the rest in a nice big cassette.
I wouldnt go less than 48t on a 29er though for technical climbing. the rollout of a 29 is just to big to not have an effective bailout gear below 48t
have you tried the garbaruk 10-46t ? or the helix?
10-45 is perfect range on the 12speed
Depends on your Terrain i would say.
@@LoveMTB Yea indeed. Both do matter 😃
is it ok using m7120 on a 11s speed cassette and also using 1by setup? i have 11-46t
You can also buy the XTR GS pulley wheel cage plates for about 100 USD and install them on a cheaper derailleur
@@LoveMTB Yeah its expensive but cheaper if you already have a 12 speed derailleur. I believe the only reason that it is so expensive is because one of the plates is carbon. The outer plate (carbon) cost 90 USD while the inner plate (aluminum) is 10USD. I am running the XT 10-45 with the RD-M8120
I want shimano on next bike, cause i heard you can change gears when climbing...??!!
will shimano add the micro spline to the road lineup? that we can have 10 - 36 or 10 - 40 casstte.
@@LoveMTB
That's what I want to do, but I don't want to change the wheel freehub. : /
Just hoping there is 3rd party brand will produce some cassettes by 10-40 or lower teeth.
Do you know if I can use the 12 speed xt short caged deurailier (ment for 10-45 cassete) on ethirteen 9-46 cassette?
does the eagle chain work well on the new shimano 12 speed chainrings? always thought the shimano chains were narrower or something
I run sram chains and shimano chainrings on my bike and it works perfectly. Shimano cassettes are better though, when my xx1 is worn out i will switch back
Is it okay to use a long cage m7100 rd paired with slx 10-45 cassette? thanks
I have the 2018 Giant Trance 2 with the direct mount set up. So to clarify, I have the M8000 RD on it so with a microspline wheel upgrade and M8100 12 speed XT shifter, is my only option the XT 10x45 cassette? I really would like to do 10x51 but am annoyed having a direct mount derailleur will prevent enabling me to do this. Could my Trance be converted to standard mount?
@@LoveMTB Thank you very much for the clarification. Also, love the channel.
Bro. 10-45 cassette with grx 42t crankset. is that doable?
30 t front . 42 bqck . I am good with it
Denk wel dat het goed 👍
so 10, 11 and 12 speed mtb are the same pull ratio?
You've got me thinking about an M9000 derailleur now. I've got an M7120 at the moment and the length of the derailleur cage is a risk for sure... I've already caught it on a rock but luckily it only scuffed the finish off.
I was also running an 11-52 cassette but went down to 11-46 recently as I just didn't need the extra range with a 32t chainring up front. Maybe the climbs around here aren't as harsh as what others have to deal with!
Hi Bro I just ordered:
m6100 rd 12 speed
csmz901 12 speed cassette
Im planning to partner it with
M8100 shifter and
M6100 chain
Do you think it will work fine?
Thanks!
It's just my budget is tight and im planning to put m6100 shifter but the tech on xt makes a lot of differences so that's why
Maybe that's a point becasue Im not on racing or even in trail but Im planning to go soon (maybe after this pandemic) I've already watch all your videos about shifters including xt itself specially the 4 clicks and the multi release, + the faster release of cables unlike deore and slx well anyway Thanks! Nice and detailed review I've learned so many things through this! Earned a sub!
What's a good chainring combo for 10-45t cassette?
30t for enduro, 32t for xc
Can I use 10-45T on my deore RD-M6100-SGS?
Is it okay to use 45t on a 12s deore the long cage one?
Here is what I'm experiencing, I used Shimano 12 speed 10 51T with Shimano xt 12 speed derailleur and shifter with xtr hyperglide+ chain. I found that the shifting is not as smooth. The weird thing is a 12 speed GX eagle and XO chain shift very smoothly with Shimano XT derailleur and shifter. Very weird but true. I'm into the last combo now. Save lots of money by buying Shimano XT shifter and derailleur only but using it with Sram GX eagle cassette and chain.
@@LoveMTB Would it be good idea to mix 12 speed shimano XT shifter, 12 s cassete 10-45t and 12 s chain XO with M6000 Deore cranks with aftermarket Deckas chainring (specified as 7-12 speed)?
@@LoveMTB thank you for replay. Yes, have seen video in link provided couple months ago. Have found some good option for Garbaruk chainrings. It says "Compatible with all 9,10,11-speed chains, 12-speed SRAM Eagle, KMC, Shimano HG+ chains". So I guess Shimano chain is also an option. Just not sure SLX, XT or XTR level to choose. Or to stick with Sram XO option..
@@LoveMTB yes, Garbaruk page says it is compatible with Shimano 12 s Hyperglide+ chains. So may be ok :)
great usefull idea.
how about with the 10-51t?
Where is accent from? Great vid BTW
@@LoveMTB OK. Coz it isn't a accent I haven't heard before
Im running 2x10 with 32-22 front and 11-36 rear. Low gear equivalent to a 32-52 with much tighter ratios.
Actually doesn't have much tighter ratios. 10 speed 11-36:
11-12-14-16-18-21-24-28-32-36
12 speed 10-45:
10-12-14-16-18-21-24-28-36-40-45
Almost identical spacing other than the 10 tooth small cog
@@tomdeller6795 im not comparing 10 to 12 speed. I went from a 10 speed 1x with 32 front and 11-42 rear to what I have listed and there is a difference. Otherwise Id go back to 1x.
@@tomdeller6795 You have to consider the chainring as well, not just the cassette teeth in the back. A two tooth change at the cassette has almost a 50% bigger jump when matched with a 32 1x chainring rather than a 22 lower 2x chainring. It's easier to see when you look at it in gear inches on a gear calculator. It's one of the advantages that 2x can still have.
there is an xtr version of the 10-45 CS-M9101
Does it have to be XTR 11 deraileur, or can XT and others be used?
@@LoveMTB So the 11-speed deraileur can be slaved by the 12 speed shifter?
Man, I wouldn't be so eager to jump on this 10-45 m8000 idea if I knew the derailleur just barely has enough reach for the largest cog, the 12s cassette is wider enough as compared to 11s to cause problems.
@@LoveMTB just barely, I have to force the shifter onto the first gear, and the derailleur has nowhere further to go
@@LoveMTB it's not the range itself, that's supported well, it's about the width of the cassette itself, the largest cog is pushed a little more inside than it was with 11s, it's right at the edge of possible derailleur travelit may be that my frame exaggerates the issue just a little (chick derailleur hanger) compared to some others.
@@LoveMTB the issue is with the angle at which the cable is pulled, the derailleur can be moved more inward by hand, but it cannot be pulled any further by the shifter, anyway, I see the same thing in your case, so you can check it for yourself.
As I said, it does work, but just barely.
Btw. I always start with the end adjuster screw (to aid with setting cable tension), index the cassette and then set the limiter screws to barely touch when in either end of the range, starting with the limiter screws could present some issues sometimes.
Nice video.
@@LoveMTB i definitely will.
What xt rd i use in 10 51 cassette sir
9:00 wait what's this non compatibility all about? What am I missing?
@@LoveMTB but are you saying the 12 speed wasn't direct mount and is now? I don't understand the incompatibility you are referring to
I prefer the XT over the SLX. I've seen them both in person and the XT seems like a tougher built design (explains the weight). The SLX seems more matte on the surface, perhaps it's because there may be a manufacturing difference that the density and structural integrity of the SLX isn't going to be as good as the XT.
@@LoveMTB I like the looks of the SLX, it reminds me of the XTR M950 in some way.
MY DREAM.............2X11........ FRONT 2 = 22, 38.........REAR 11 = 11, 45........
BRAZIL HERE....THANKS FOR VIDEO
I'd like an eagle version of this.
Can I use 10-51T on my SLX M7120 RD?
Thanks for your very informative video. I really thought that SLX M7120 (2x) RD could not be use for 10-51T since it is designed for 10-45T.
What will probably happen if I will use 10-51T cassette on my SLX M7120 (2x) RD? Is it to operate or not? what are the circumstances?
was not expecting such small weight difference