Pending Major Breakdown Discovery During Routine Maintenance. Differential Failure Averted!!
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- Опубликовано: 27 фев 2023
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@randysworldwide7759 #rearend #spidergear #differential
#keepwrenching #wesselmotorworks #wrenchingwithkenny
@WrenchingWithKenny @SNAFU.performance @traditionovertrend2704 
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I never tried to "up sell" anything to a customer. If doing an oil change, it was part of my job to inform customers of issues I may see under their vehicle. Seriously, think about it, how often do customers look underneath their vehicle? Usually, not until there is a problem. It was great of you to notice the leaking differential cover as that is something that definitely needs to be brought to the customers attention.
Kenny's 'Do the Right Thing', Part 37!
Alerting your clients to serious conditions on their vehicle, should garner their appreciation and some gratitude, as you probably keep them alive without them even knowing it.
Broken down roadside, between Orlando and DeLand in Fl. when a jeep went by, and lost it's driver's rear tire/axle assembly. A couple of parts flew past me on the right shoulder, one just missing me by a couple of feet (which I was happy about!)I didn't catch if the rear cover was broken/blown off, but if it was, that was a piece of something back there. I think this could have been caused by a catastrophic failure in the rear diff of that CJ. I was extremely lucky, that day.
Yep my first clue was the metal on the fill plug, that's never a good sign. Keep the good stuff coming Kenny.
Been oiling filter rings for 50 years never had one stick...
me either. oil is slippery. no oil is sticky.
Never is a long time
Good catch, that missing shim caused a lot of incidental wear to those spider gears!
He's in for a big surprise when he pulls those gears. Can't say how it happened but that rear end is tore up and not repairable. The posi clutches are GONE. You should NEVER SEE the C clips with the main pin installed! The side gears are sunk in at least 2mm each.
The sintered metal spyder gears are of poor quality in the Ford 9.75 and 8.8 electric locker of that time period. The 9.75 carrier has a weak spot where the left side bearing journal casting has a 3-point web that breaks off.
Those spider gears are a common failure on the f150. Good catch on both!
Hello Kenny You remind me of Bob Hagan my auto shop teacher he used to put a column in the paper and answered questions about cars. The best teacher I had back in 1975 thanks for your time on this your experience is priceless
An honest mechanic is worth his weight in gold. The “up sell” is a real thing in too many auto shops. Makes people leery.
Broken bits discovered during casual inspection.
It's like inspecting the 'stone' you crunched on, nearly spat out, but discovered it to be your $500 gold molar.
I'm 60, I remember crawling under our 1971 Torino station wagon(351 Cleveland) with him to see what he was doing and help with handing him tools. I was small, it was easier for me than him. I'm still skinny and regularly crawl under my own vehicles to see what's going on.
🤔🤓🍻
PS-I was probably 6 or 7 at the time.
12:00 the real reason for oiling the rubber seal was to make it slip while you were screwing it on. used to be the would twist---or not and tear free from the filter and bunch up. so seals didn't adhere to the filters very well and the seal was a rubber O ring, which is why they didn't seal up to the motors very well, so when the rubber O ring was wet it was to stop that O ring from ripping off the filters and not twisting creating a gap for oil to leak out and to help prevent the O ring from tearing off from being over tightened and binding up.
the reason the O ring sticks to the motor is because people being cheap said use the hot old motor oil which is the oil that is burned out and shot. now what i have found is when i pre fill the filter and i spilled or over filled, i used the new oil to lube up the O ring and it never sticks to the motor, but i don't go cheap, i puddle it on that O ring because i know most of it will slide off once i tip the filter to screw it on.
that diff cover was worked on, that is excess silicone sticking out on the bottom of it, not the factory seal. some one most likely changed that oil, didn't have a correct seal on hand and the old factory seal was probably leaking and decided silicone was good enough with out getting the same torque pressure all the way around before seating the cover to the housing and mashed that corner down first, the most.
In the past forty years or so I have probably repaired or rebuilt at least a hundred or more differentials,
And I would be willing to make a sure bet that, after seeing how low on gear oil that differential was, and how worn those spider gears are, along with all of the metal glitter that looks to be all over everything,
That differential also needs a entire set of new bearings at the very least to go along with the spider gears.
The ring and pinion probably have a fair amount of wear also. But can be reused sometimes, because they are usually made of harder steel than many of the other components and wear at a bit slower rate , even when run low on oil.
Drain plugs over tightened by these Kids in Quick oil change places. I just had a kid Jame my 2010 Chrysler T&C dipstick in the Tube so tight I broke it trying to extract it to check the Oil level. A week later they replaced it and I checked the oil level and there was just oil on the Very tip of the Stick. It was 2 quarts low. I made a deal with the Kid if he Filled it to the mark I wouldn't say anything to his Boss.
I am 56 yrs old , I have always put oil on the seals of oil filters and I have never had one stick to the engine. I am not a mechanic by profession but I have always changed my own oil.
Good catch on the filler plug! With that much metal you knew there was a problem!
That's a given. It would be hard not to see that!
Good time to install a locker. The True Trac locker is a really nice piece.
If it's worth the investment... If not, it needs a whole new basket.... Someone was already there for a reason, It was junk before the cover was put back on with the gobs of RTV.
That is already an electric locker 9.75
The dealership I worked at had several plastic triangular signs for our use. “No oil”, “ no brakes”, “do not start”, etc and we placed them on the dash as needed. Some cars would be pushed out on the lot for days or weeks waiting for parts or a warranty decision so there was also the concern of lot people and customers coming up at night to take their cars.
I use 3M Post-It notes just for myself.
Your story did remind me that decades ago, when I was a dealer shop gofer, it was my job at the end of the day to pull as many of the German luxury cars into the shop as possible so the drug-addicted DIN-radio thieves didn't smash and grab through the night.
One car I pulled in had an oil hose disconnected and I left a long trail into the shop, people yelling and waving their arms. In the aftermath it was agreed that a sign would have helped prevent that.
One time I was working on a car. I had the turbo out, and a rag over the intake to prevent anything from falling in, but I had to wait for a part so I pushed it outside and parked it. I put a sign on the dash saying, "DO NOT START". Then what do you know, one of my coworkers needed to move the car out of the way for something. He got in, started it to move it... I was like WTF?!?! I opened the hood and found oil sprayed all over the engine bay, and the rag got sucked all the way into the intake manifold. I was pissed. I probably should have disconnected the battery or something, but disconnecting the battery in that car was a pain in the ass since it's located under the driver seat.
You got my interest mentioning Randy's. I don't live very far from their MN location! Thinking about rebuilding the transfer case on my '00 Jeep Grand Cherokee. Thank!
One time I was working on a car. I had the turbo out, and a rag over the intake to prevent anything from falling in, but I had to wait for a part so I pushed it outside and parked it. I put a sign on the dash saying, "DO NOT START". Then what do you know, one of my coworkers needed to move the car out of the way for something. He got in, started it to move it... I was like WTF?!?! I opened the hood and found oil sprayed all over the engine bay, and the rag got sucked all the way into the intake manifold. I was pissed. I probably should have disconnected the battery or something, but disconnecting the battery in that car was a pain in the ass since it's located under the driver seat.
That job was actually a complete nightmare. It was an Audi Q7 TDI with about 200,000km on it, but it was under warranty because of stupid VW with their stupid dieselgate scandal. It had a cracked EGR pipe. The pipe was held on by four screws. Three screws came out fine, but the fourth one snapped off. Then it was just one thing going wrong after another. Long story short, I spent 26 hours on a warranty job that paid 8 hours. My coworker starting the thing when it was apart was just icing on the cake. This was just the straw that broke the camel's back, and I completely quit the industry shortly after. I'm an accountant now. I'm done dealing with that shit.
That oil drain trough was probably meant for another engine, but they just have it there for all models just for simplicity of manufacture.
Good find, nice job ! Thanks for sharing!
You are so honest! That's good!
As a retired heavy duty diesel mechanic-etc , I’ve got you beat. I started on Cox .049 model airplane motors , then graduated to Briggs & Stratton lawnmower engines and McCulloch two stroke go cart engines then 57 Chevrolet’s. As for myself I’ve always lubed the oil filter seal. I’ve never had one of mine stuck to the filter attachment housing on a engine but I’ve had other filters from other mechanics stick to the attachment housing that I’ve serviced. But I always check any filter mine included to make sure the filter sealing ring is not stuck to the engine. When you where first started talking about this ; I thought you where going to talk about to pre-fill or not pre-fill a oil filter. And about the spider gears as far is I know theirs a cupped brass or bronze washer that goes between the gear and the spool housing.
Your video’s are easily the best out there, thank you!
Oil filter drain on my 2014 5 liter f150 is also a pain. Some oil always stays on the plastic diverter and I'll get an oil drip on my garage floor a day after the change.
Thanks Kenny, really enjoy the channel.
Every place I had worked in the automotive trade over 45 years, I too NEVER tried to upsell shyt lol.....I'd make a list of things I'd found that could use attention, now, or later, and leave it to the customer decide when they'd want to address their issues. I did 100's of safety inspections, both for used cars, or auction vehicles, the dealerships I worked at bought.
I used to piss off the welders at Waste Management, when I was a diesel tech back in the 80's n 90's. Because I would find frame cracks in places no one else ever checked, thus making more work for our welders. I came to work 1 day, to find a hand made "badge" someone had clipped to my time card it said "CHP Inspector 12" hahaha
Great story! Thanks for watching 🔧
@stevophillips4121 what places no one checked for cracks?
OIL getting all over in a Plane like a Cessna with Retracts. That's why we always installed a Quick Drain you could slip a hose over that drained into a Bucket without splashing.
Randy's Ring and Pinion had the parts I needed for my old 99 Jeep GC.
3.5 liter EcoBoost is a monster for what it is and out tows the big V-8's. However if you want longevity I would highly recommend using a premium fully synthetic oil and 5,000 mile oil changes if you're working this engine. A high quality oil and filter is key to keeping the timing chains lubricated. Use a cheaper oil or go 10k oil changes and those chains will wear and stretch. Even though it makes terrific hp, torque and pulls like a beast I'd opt for the 5.0 coyote V-8 for simplicity. Same thing with GM and Ram, V-8 engine over the 4 or 6 turbo offerings if you want more reliability and a lower cost of maintenance.
Thanks for the video well done 👍✅. Take care of yourself and family and be Blessed ❤️❤️❤️.
Seals I oil them, as if the seal surface is dry it will stick, especially if the engine side is dry and oil free, then it will stick fast. Oil film on engine or filter seal it tends not to stick.
I usually just put the key in my pocket until I’m done with it, that prevents anybody taking off in it without oil
You make a valid point. I like to have the steering unlocked & the car in neutral while I'm working on it.
I am 70 yrs old when I was Turning 16 my father bought my older brothers 64 4 Dr rusted out biscayne for me and he had a rebuilt 327 put in it, and he told me the day he gave me the keys ,you had better always pop the hood in the morning and check the oil and antifreeze level no matter what the weather( and we lived in Michigan) and he said if he ever caught me not doing that he would take the car away from me... well I don't check my oil everyday now BUT at least once a week I do check it ...old habits are hard to break
So right all around. Especially overtightening oil drain plugs.
Important for sure, but what are the holding back? Gravity only. No real pressure.
True, but there is also vibration that can loosen stuff up. Thanks for watching 🔧
Aye. Tight, but no gorilla torqing!
Cheers.
Glad I watched..this is why I do most all repairs myself as can't trust people to do a good job and hopefully get a good mechanic when needed. I bought an 03 with 171k and am going over it..the heater line leaking at firewall has a rad clamp on one side and was loose now is tight with another for insurance. the diff isn't leaking but I been wanting to replace the fluid to know the level good to know to start with the drain plug I couldn't find it and check for shavings on it and then watch to see how much fluid is in there when slowly removing the cover. Oh also checking the slop is important I probably wouldn't of thought to check so thanks again.
Subscribed.. Love the ford truck videos.
Good day.
Thanks for sharing your knowledge and experience
From Leo: Your warning is good. I was almost done with a service and tire rotation on a car that was on my hoist. I left for lunch. The customer showed up early and the foreman gave him the car. I had not tightened the lugs and the customer lost a wheel and a fender when the wheel came off.
I ALWAYS rub old oil on the filter o-ring and it NEVER sticks to the engine. And I NEVER pre-fill the filter and have NEVER had a problem.
Wow, nice catch there.
Looking forward to the gear video!
Thank you.
Nice bit of care on your jo there 👍👍👍👍👍
Great video Kenny.
Someone else worked on that rear differential, you can see all the excess gasket in a tube squeezed out of failure to attach brake lines correctly. Good for you spotting the gear lube seepage.
Randy's is a great company.
🎉 excellent 👍 mechanical Watson 😁 👍 good work Sherlock
Great advice, thanks
I like your videos I have learned a lot even tho I’m not a mechanic thank you
Detroit Axle great company on stuff like that... Used them on 2 F150 rear differential rebuild... Quick service to you and great CS...
When I was 16 years old and sitting in my 66 VW Beetle listening to the radio parked in front of my parents home suddenly a tire came rolling by. I ran out in the street and stopped it. Looking up the street was a car parked with no rear wheel/tire. I rolled it up to the guy and he'd just got new tires put on his car from a shop maybe 5 blocks away. He was obviously irritated but proceeded to tell me he'd, "helped out" by putting on his hubcaps at the shop.
71 vw bus was my first! Had a 69 chevelle first, but it ran when I got it. Tye vw clutch was shot. Small beans in retrospect, but it was so different 25 years ago. Just did it, no videos to see it done first
The practice of oiling the filter gasket probably goes back to the days before our modern rubbers and silicones. The bit of oil may have helped make it easier to remove the gasket when those things dried out over time. I will try not oiling my gaskets for a while and see what happens!
Good idea with the trough there Ford. Lol.
I lubed the oil filter ring when it's an iron block engine with no sticking, aluminum I never do and never have sticking.
Different metal needs different techniques.
Love your vids man
The only engine I have where the ring sticks to the engine is a BMW R1200gsa. Aluminum, and it doesn’t matter if you oil the seal or not. I suspect it has to do with higher oil temperature than the average car.
Good catch 👍
Good diagnosis...
Good catch. It looked like the backlash was excessive in the ring an pinion to me as well
Going to be fixed when the spares come, because you will need to set pinion preload again anyway. So new set of shims there as well, probably new bearings as well, because if they have to come out they might as well go back new.
Did you see the C clip! The clutches are toast, and the basket is scored. It's junk.
I doubt this will be repaired. I expect, replacement.
Hahahah! That's Ford for ya! Oil pours out onto the ground anyway.
#14:30 put the cover [ after clean up ] on the edge of a table, upside down so you can knock out the bolt holes with a ball peen hammer. Some covers are thin like valve cover and require this.
this video has great tips for beginners in the field and honestly is just plays that everyone should do. the only thing i disagreed with was saying "were not gonna let him take this" i know he didnt mean it in the extreme. but never tell a customer you're keeping your car from them. warn and prepare the customer and document everything!
Nice video Kenny
very good call--sure saved large repair or worse --should make happy coustomer !!!!!!!!!!!!!
YES SIR! Visual ! I tell people everytime you fill up your car open the hood look around and CHECK your oil and other vitals if you can..this is an opportunity to see if anything is obviously wrong Thanks love your videos they make lots of sense!
Yaeh most people just put fuel in & drive a very few (mostly women not being sexist just truthful) don't even do that.
check the vent tube on the rear also
There is a lot of residue under that hood. Monday, Mercedes is pulling and re-seating the injectors and changing the transmission oil cooler on my 2012 E250 CDI. I asked them to clean up the area correctly while exposed. I'm OK to pay the time units. I just like it clean to see any unusual accumulations easily and identify the source. I feel that at their shop prices they can wipe off the grease.
Drain plug. I always find the plug to be much tighter than I tightened it on all of my minivans (5 different Chryslers). No clue how they do that, but happens every time.There's always oil on the filter adapter, no need to oil the filter gasket. Randy's is good, also Yukon.
They stick when they are over tightened and break seal loose from filter....or cheap filters....always oiled...never had one stick I installed
I know nothing about differential/axle, looking forward to seeing the next video
You're about to see an axle job go south really quick. When Kenny pulls that basket apart, he'll call it as dead. Cheaper to put in another rear axle. Note the C clips.... that's the giveaway on the extent of damage. You SHOULDN'T see them!
I have lubed the filter o-ring for as long as I can remember. I think I've had the o-ring stick to the engine maybe 1 time. What burns my butt is when someone torques the snot out of a filter and you have to use a cheater pipe to get it loose. One of the mechanics I use to work with did that and no matter how many times I'd call him out on it, he still did it. Working for a school district you never know what bus or vehicle you were going to work on and I'd always check to see who did the service previously so I'd know what to expect.
i did fleet service oil changes ,sprayed the seal with magnum.filters up dry.the filter rep in
training. advised not to prefill.and only unwrap, right before installing, to avoid the chance of any crap getting in the filter.
and i shut the bus down on the engine side.and the engine door open.
I am not a ecoboost fan either. I still run my 30 year old straight 6 in my Ford truck.
good video
Very informative video. That rear differential has all the signs of a poor mechanic or inexperienced DIY effort.
The reason drain plugs are always striped is lube shops start them with power tools.
When I was 19 back in 63, I bought a ragged azz 56 Chevrolet Convertible. I could turn one of the rear wheels a half turn before the spyder gears engaged. The diff didn't make that much noise and I drove the heck out of that car for 17k miles before trading it and never repaired the diff which was one of the few things I didn't repair.
Now on that oiling the oil filter gasket. That's weird. I've changed my own oil since the 70's, and helped dad change his on his '54 Chevy with cartridge filter. (Yeah, I'm old.) And I worked in an Exxon station where I also changed oil and other minor services. But I digress. In all those years, I had a gasket stick exactly once and I've always lubed the new one before installation. Truck and my motorcycles. I always always check it. Oh, and I check it before I put the new filter on. 😂Did I mention I check the mounting surface for an old gasket being stuck?
Been working on cars almost as long as Kenny. In my 30+ years, I think twice some smuck put the filter on dry and must have cleaned the adapter housing, and wrenched them on with at least 200 lbs. of force. That is bad enough when it's assembled dry, but damn? Double whammy". When the strap wrench crushes the filter, and the screwdriver through the filter won't work? Time for some heat by means of mapp gas torch to try and melt the gasket and dissect it.
Oil or no oil. Doesn’t make a difference as long as you use the right filter and make sure it’s clean on the mounting surface and for cripes sake don’t over tighten it. It’s works equally the same either way. Don’t be in a hurry and use some common sense
@@DavidWeinberg-cm9xd I only work on vehicles that are mine, family members, or which belong to where I worked so I don't see huge numbers of cars, but twice I've seen factory-original filters that were screwed on so tightly that the filter housing would simply crush, then rip and tear before the filter itself would unscrew. In those cases we completely removed the bent and shredded filter housing and the internal parts so that only the base plate of the filter remained. Then we built a special wrench with protruding steel pins that matched the pattern of at least three or four of the inlet holes in the base plate. Then, engaging the pins of the wrench head to the holes in the base plate and using a really long handle, the based plate could be unscrewed. I once heard from a mechanic that there was a period of time when a sizable proportion of Chevy trucks came from the factory with filters too tight to remove by any method that involved getting a grip on the filter housing (even by poking a screwdriver through it).
I'm new to your channel I like what I see.
Here's a tip for you - Take a photo to show the client the amount of damage in the rear end so he or she knows that it was serious ...
He made a video instead...
lol THIS IS that picture!
You need to inspect cause the owner doesnt. From the customers perspective.. time goes slow, and before they know it the oil they thought they changed 4 months ago has been in there two years. You do good work kenny!
Great catch! Too bad for the customer - more $ into the money pit.
took a page from Audi's engineering. Turbo it & then kid yourself about plastic breathers & tubes holding the pressure in.
one time when i first started wrenching, i pulled a car in for an oil change. Pull the oil cap and put it in the air. Before I could drain the oil I get called off to do whatever it was. Come back 20 mins later and for some reason my mind thought I had drained the oil already before I left. I did not. Put the car down and proceed to fill it with 5 quarts of oil. It was a type of car I had changed oil on hundreds of times and I knew exactly how much oil it took without checking. Rookie mistake. As soon as I start it up and start pulling out of my bay, the entire shop was filled with thick thick white smoke lol. Put it back up, drained the oil, filled it with the proper amount, and shipped it. I hope the catalytic converter was ok lol and I always always check the oil when im done now Lesson learned
I remember a screw up when I was working at a quick lube place. I was only used to working on Domestic cars when I was 19. I drained the trans instead of the oil on a fwd import. Never saw a trans pan with a drain plug in it. I just started working there and was really nervous. I did realize pretty quick what I had just done. Never ever had that happen again. No lesson, like a lesson learned the hard way?
I recently stumbled upon your channel and like your approach to everything. You and some other channels like South Main Auto do great work.
Kenny certainly does! This one is going to be one of those curve ball mother lovers! The basket is toast! Note the C-clips that you SHOULDN'T see!
Kenny. I myself also have over forty years of experience
I’ve been doing oil changes for over 45 years and I have oil seen one oil filter seal stick to the engine. I usually only work on my cars and never over tighten the oil filter.
I whacked my rear diff with a rubber mallet but i couldn’t get the sirens to work 🤣
Awesome!!!! 22 minutes
Watch all your videos like your thoroughness about other issues on vehicle to tell customer about other issues about to need fixing
I take exception to the oil on the filter question, I always put oil on the rubber gasket, its matter of coeficient of friction situation, rubber on steel high COF, add oil and you can get additional 1/8th turn more than no oil, of course do it with out strap rench only hand tight. lack of appropiate oil in the diff can also cause such, esp in limited slip diff. using regular oil must use redline additive or such I replaced gears in my 2500 the spider gears could cut tough meat easy, I pulled out handpulls of metal in that situation. I over fill the diff , I know it causes drag but I know if I heat up the oil its going to go out of the vent, also put a tube on the vent and run it up in the engine compartment so as to prevent water in high water situations from getting in to the diff.
I always put a small amount of silicon lube ( Dow Corning 111/Super Lube) on the seal. The next guy will thank me. When doing a fleet of Cat diesel engines, it got much easier when they cycled around after using silicon lube.
Interesting
The way manufacturers shield engines with plastic covers dissuades many from getting their hands dirty in case they break anything!
Kenny I watch different videos and Rainman Ray is working on catalytic converter too
New to the channel interesting chain of events, either no maintenance or poorly done service, that customer better off for agreeing with your decision making process.
Only armchair mechanic now. Frequently over tightening drain plugs in my early days.
As owner I don’t know enough about cars and trucks great when everything is working not sure what to think when it’s not. Like to see if junkyard can supply a better rear end or if you think reinstall of new spider gears is enough it doesn’t look very promising.
Good find, it is hard to explain to customers problems found. They are only expecting pricing on a oil change. If I was a wrench I would video all my jobs. Look at the information you can show a owner who knows nothing about a car.
You could tell someone was in there by the silicone on the cover I love the work you show and do
I thought the same thing!
13:13 HAY, do I see a huge crack forming. It would be best to see that vehicle again,
I always see mechanics never remove or pull the dipstick out before adding oil in, to aid in venting. Have you noticed a difference on some cars? Oil will likely pour in faster and less chance of the funnel backing up or overflowing? The last thing I was curious about, since you must know all the little "Tricks of the Trade" was when pouring oil from a 5 qt. jug, do you pour it straight on with the spout , or sideways on a 90 degree angle? Love your videos, man. Take care.
Use the dipstick to aid the oil flow into the valve cover.
with your lower fingers all the way thru the handle have the 5quart bottle with the spout to the top, you can fine control the pour with out oil pressure rushing out with the spout to the bottom, to aid in getting it closer to a very short funnel you can tilt your wrist or arm to 45º the spout down, but a short funnel isn't recommended as it's a great way to spill oil all over the engine and could lead to an engine compartment fire going down the road if too much gets on the motor and around the plastic parts, this also leads to the engine that gets oil on it also collecting dirt and dust, and the fan will be blowing oil all over the engine as well exacerbating the wet engine problem multi fold number of times.
as far as the dip stick, yes it helps, but the wide mouths on the manifold covers i never use a funnel so big it plugs up the cover fill hole, but on a garden tractor yeah it helps alot.
i really like those pour nozzles with the hose that screw on to oil bottles if i don't have my flexi large spout hose oil filling can available for use, such as when i am at a gas station checking my oil levels
The spider gears are trashed, how does the ring and pinion look? you might be rebuilding the whole differential assembly!
Nice use of the evidence to lead into inspection.
Good thing the customer didn't say fill it up and let me go for now.
Failure would still come to it at that point of wear.
Two block and 3 sharp turns under throttle and it'll lock right up!
It's already burned out.
Note that you can see the C clips!
I'm sure he'll show us why when he pulls it apart and calls the owner again... Used rear end time...
The topic of discussion is why does everyone crank the filter so tight