Cloud Defensive REIN 3.0 vs. Surefire M340 DFT
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- Опубликовано: 8 сен 2024
- The REIN 3.0 thermal management intervenes when the external temperature of the light head reaches 145-150*f as measured with a laser temp gun.
The Surefire cuts output roughly in half at 100*f external temperature.
This is the reason for the disparities later in the video past initial start-up, as the Surefire reaches these temperatures after 1-2 minutes, while the REIN 3.0 reaches its threshold at 3-4 minutes, and cuts its output by roughly half, as well.
As a test, the Surefire light head was artificially heated to 110*f external temperature via heat-soaking it over a heating vent, but it was not noted to cut power from this.
Thanks for the vid. Those new surefires definitely fill the gap. With their switchology, I’d have to say they currently edge out the rein 3.0’s
Thank you!
Also, I was wondering. I'm debating getting a Rein 3.0 vs a SureFire Turbo m640DFT. So, if I'm gonna be doing a looootta night shooting, and I live in Utah, and I live 15 minutes away from open desert plains, and/or big gaping canyons and densely wooded areas, but also live directly in an urban environment -- do you think I'd appreciate the Surefire more? I would like to have a lot of throw, but I also don't like having super bright lights with significant foreground lighting/blowing out the foreground. Since then it obviously makes it much harder for me to be able to see a target through beam paths that have a lot of other environmental features in the way. I'm also not too keen on getting lots of backsplash and overly illuminating myself.
I.e. I'd rather prefer a 1-2 MOA red dot/reflex sight vs 6-8MOA dot, and both of those lights sorta felt like that to me; the Surefire felt more precise and less distracting, but the Cloud obviously has some serious performance benefits in some ways, especially with its output curve over time.
And also concerned about having something like a rein 3.0 when it's really snowy, and we get realllllly big puffy snowflakes here, as well as really really horrible smog in half the year or more sometimes (side effect of the rain shadow effect we have in the salt lake valley).
Only reason I'm asking is because I only got to try them out briefly and obviously didn't get to use them in any real life situations, so it was hard for me to evaluate which one is actually going to be more practical. If you were doing a lot of night shooting and you didn't wanna get blinded by your own powder smoke + (in the winter) the hot steamy air rising up from your own shots , is the Cloud gonna be a liability in that respect? I like the long battery life and the lower lumens of the Surefire for sure. I also like Surefire switches much more, but usually run clicky cap. And I also trust and like Surefire way more as a company than Cloud haha
That's a lot to unpack. That said, I've been using and modding lights since the late 2000's back when Gene Malkoff made stuff in his garage and hand engraved it. A few points:
Both Surefire and Cloud will drop lumens pretty hard due to heat in the fullsize, and desire to maintain battery life in the micros. The best thrower I've found that does not throttle down rapidly are the Modlite offerings and the Malkoff offerings. The E2XT/D in Malkoff, and OKW in Modlite will offer a tight, concentrated beam like what you are asking about, and should maintain output well. Also, consider the size of the lights. The Surefire "mini" and Cloud "micro" come in at within about an ounce and a half inch of the Malkoff and Modlite 18650 fullsize lights. I have come to the conclusion that 18650 in Malkoff/Modlite offer the best footprint vs. fuel/runtime crossover point.
When you get into 18350's, they are all made in China. I prefer other sources for things, and you can get 18650's of very high quality made in many other places. You also get 2-3x the run-time. The penalty is usually
@@UnobtaniumsQuickReviews Hmm, yes, I see. Lots to think about here. I agree with the points about suppressors, that was another concern of mine that actually drove me MORESO towards the length of the surefire and the Cloud. My suppressor is fairly long.
This gives me much to consider and makes me wonder if I should perhaps go back to my original, gun instinct, of buying a Modlite (in PLHV2 or OKW) or one of the high candela Malkoff setups.
And that leads to my last question. It's hard to tell on camera, so I wanted to get your personal opinion: Do you find the higher candela on lights like the rein 3.0 and the Surefire M640DFT to actually be significantly more valuable than something like the OKW or the high candela Malkoff, or even the PLHv2 or Streamlight HL-X, to actually make a practical difference in terms of visibility at distance, like 150-200 yds? Or in terms of blinding ability on targets within like 50-75 yards?
I know that measurements like candela and Lux are not simple linear functions, and that candela in particular increases as a function of the lumens divided by the Square of the steradian of the beam (or something like that, I don't remember the formula off hand), and so that doubling candela doesn't give you twice the 'performance', but only more like 50% more 'performance', in terms of its practical functionality.
Do you think these lights hitting 100k candela like the rein 3.0 and Surefire Scout turbo actually make a practical difference in the distances you can work at compared to other lights with fairly high candela output? And if not, does the added candela output improve blinding characteristics significantly over other options like aforementioned OKW, Malkoff, Plhv2, or Streamlight HLX?
Thank you for the video. I’d like to see the m640dft up in there.
Did you get a lux reading on the cloud Defensive lights by the way? Like on the full size Cloud Rein 3.0 or the micro? I know the SF Turbo hits easily over 100k, which is great, but do you know the Rein 3.0 measurements? It's hard for me to find real testing that I actually trust haha
My equipment is very limited (cell phone with an app), but it hit around 100K, as well.
@@UnobtaniumsQuickReviews Awesome, thank you
why do you run a Molicel P28A 18650 2800mAh 35A Battery instead of a battery with more capacity, like 3500mAh. Is it cause of its Continuous Discharge Rating or its discharge rate characteristics or something?
1) Molicel is one of the very few manufacturers that sells A grade loose cells via retail to you and I.
2) The P28A has been replaced with the P30B as the best battery of its ilk, in my opinion. When you apply 5+ amps to these batteries, they compare very favorably with 3500mah batteries in actual capacity. At 3-4 amps, they are similar but not quite as good. Still, see 1.
@@UnobtaniumsQuickReviews Huh interesting, I'll have to learn more about this. I don't really understand lights or even really how they work or how they draw power or anything. So I don't really understand, but I can probably go figure it out. Thank you!
@@UnobtaniumsQuickReviews also, when you say they compare favorably, do you mean they actually will tend to do better than most 3500mah batteries in flashlights? or just that they do well? Because I'm still not sure I understand the advantage. I thought that as long as the battery was guaranteed high grade like Keeppower or molicell, and as long as the battery is able to meet the max amp requirements of the light, then that would be fine then? So like if I get a molicel or keeppowerwith 3500 mAh and like 10amp limit, shouldn't that be sufficient and give me more run time? Or do I not understand the way this light's driver's/emitter works?
I got the Surefire DFT and its a winner for me! Better then ANY light thus far and I have modlite and cloud…… Im changing all rifles to full size Surefires ….
Thank you for that. Definitely appreciate showing it with the 123’s.
For some reason I had it in my mind the Surefire Mini turbo was a 18350 only. I just bought a arisaka/malkoff 300 series for a 8” pcc, mostly because I keep a stock 123s in my truck for all my work (construction) and personal gear. I’m starting to rethink my purchase now. I don’t think I need all the candela for a 9mm pcc. At least that’s what I keep telling myself.
Surefire gets the win for me. I have both, but the Surefire light bodies having integrated mounts and being lighter while having similar performance gives it the edge
Great comparison video, super helpful.
I think it would be interesting if someone made a beam profile that had a tight hot spot with an elliptical spill to focus light where you need it
This would not work due to different placement/orientations of the lights, as well as having to "true" the threads/head to mate "perfectly".
@@UnobtaniumsQuickReviews if there was a simple way to clock the TIR lens it could work but I’m just wishing here. 😢
@@SGCXD It's still an issue if you cant the weapon over/under/ around cover, or are engaging targets on different elevation levels.
@@UnobtaniumsQuickReviews oh yea that’s a good point. My days as an inventor are over! 😂
@@UnobtaniumsQuickReviews is the surefire head screw onto an 18mm body or 16mm body? I’m looking to put a be meyers kiji head on the body and switch them back and force between batteries. I need to know if the threads are to wide for that though
Would you consider doing an indoor “house clearing” video with the REIN 3 like you did with the HLX and 340 Turbo?
I would, but I sold the 3.0. Im going to buy the 3.0 micro dual fuel though when it drops, and compare it directly to the m340 dft. I can do one at that time.
Great stuff
Man the surefire is so close in performance while being lighter and smaller and accepting all the good surefire accessories I think the surefire is definitely the way to go. Also with cloud they’re known for discontinuing products so support for their lights 3+ years later might not even be available.
I didn’t believe this until I went to their website and saw they don’t sell the 2.0 they released last year lol
Thanks dude
640dft is my choice