Well said, a lot of situations need time to develop and even then, people should come to their own conclusions instead of hanging onto someone else’s words. At the end of the day, nobody is infallible and it’s foolish to think otherwise.
Kinda seeing the potential for some "case in point" action here. Then again, calling it out is useless anyway-- we all do it in some way or another. Being suspended by one's own puppet strings is a hell of a sensation. Literally.
One of my favorite online critics was the late John Bain/Totalbiscuit, and he talked multiple times about how terrified he was of his audience and how people taking his word too seriously would spiral out of control, in times like these we really need people that are aware of the effect they frequently have on their audience, great vid as usual Sol. Edit: 9:26 OH HEY BUTCH, FUNNY SEEING YOU HERE
-sigh- it pains me to believe I also joined in the bandwagon of believing whatever kind of dribble there is without stopping and using logical thinking before just jumping on a bandwagon for this kind of topic. I unfortunately acted this way during the Projared situation and I deeply wish I could've avoided following a bandwagon for it and I'm thankful I'm able to start to change my ways and use my own mental capabilities and form MY opinions while respecting the opinions, criticisms and critiques of others while making sure their opinions don't sway my own. We as people can't always see eye to eye, and while there are times we as a collective group CAN see eye to eye, that doesn't really mean we should copy the opinions we hear or see without forming our own
Yeah. It always frustrates me when certain critics and leaders try to boil their views down to their own when there are so many different factors that go into objectivity and subjectivity. It's even worse when they abuse their power by belittling their followers more than their detractors, especially when they can't even take constructive critiques. Isn't the point of criticism partly to give advice to those on how to improve their craft?
This is a pretty good video and I can think of two channels that serve as opposed approaches to people handling criticism from their audience: MysteriousMrEnter and Fact Fiend. With MrEnter, he used to do the bland screaming at cartoons thing, but when people started critiquing that style, he adapted and took the criticism to heart and is doing some pretty good work IMO. Then you have Fact Fiend by Karl Smallwood, who is so opposed to accepting criticism that he will ban literally anyone who doesn't comment something sycophantic and empty of content. The thing is, criticism from the audience isn't usually meant to put down a critic, it's meant to try and get them to be a better critic. Not unlike how criticism of media isn't always there to put down media, but to point out how something can be better.
I got banned from commenting on Fact Fiends for no reason. I hate it when RUclips tried to censor a comment and can't able to find a way to restore the visibility of my comment. That's why I always be weary about it and got myself saddened by the fact that there's nothing I can do about it. Until I realized that there's a "blocked user" and can used to prevent commenters from existing on the comments. I only used it to block spam and hate comments.
This is definitely why I hate someone like Lily Orchard. She keeps criticizing so many people yet when anyone criticizes her, she just hates on them and continues to perpetuate her situation as being a victim. She has no respect for her audience so she definitely doesn’t deserve any respect back.
And this is exactly why I unsubscribed from many anti-SJWs, like Andi Warski and Roaming Millennial as I liked them in the beginning but after doing more stuff that I just think is just wrong, there you go. I also don't believe in thinking what I like, or liked, is infallible. If someone did something I find really scummy, like how Andy invited and supported racists in his live chats and how Roaming Millennial is being a critic to SJWs just to push her conservative agenda, I will not give them any support and call them out!
Really have to say, you put a lot of work into this and nailed the points you were after. I wish people could move past easily bandwagoning these days, but it's just so easy for it to spiral out of control. Anywhos, thanks for the fun 12 minutes. :)
Excellent video. I really like where you go with the commentary on critics and the overall constructive nature of it. The main problem I see with the whole commentary/criticism community is it's always so destructive, with "this person/thing sucks, here's why" without any "here's an alternative" (you might get some constructive "here's how this scene could have been better," but the overall tone is "this sucks, lets laugh/rage at it"). While you definitely did deconstruct the problem, you left the pieces in a way that allows us to be constructive with your analysis, and I've found many people take kindly to constructive commentary of people/situations (at least in my own personal experience here on youtube). "The dark of the tunnel can be fun and exciting, but without the light at the end we have no hope."
"You do you" is a phrase that makes me lose braincells, unless it's about video games, movies, books etc. Saying "You do you" is an enabling phrase that you shouldn't say. I'd rather be told to mind my own business a million times than stand by people who are criminals
I think RUclips drama is fine as long as you don't get too emotionally invested or start to base your personality around it ( and if you do, honestly get a hobby lmao) drama is gonna happen online and irl, always has always will for better or worse. Humans are tribal. But it isn't youtubers' responsibility to teach anyone how to critically think about the views and opinions they're presenting- it's your own. That should be a given and something everyone should have learnt in high school. It's also not their fault if their fans decide to blindly worship them and put them on a pedestal as idols. Fanbases are renowned for being mindless and toxic. It's on the fans. I do agree with waiting for information before taking a stance on something instead of going on one person's take on the situation but again that's kinda obvious and goes for real life too. And this kind of toxic fan-creator relationship is not a new thing and definitely is not a product of RUclips either. I'm not a fan of how this generation are getting the blame for behaviour that can be traced back several decades for the gd umpteenth time. As if blind hero worship of celebrities doesn't go back to when we first had the technology to put them on a screen or record them, probably even before that. As if band fanbases weren't pitted against each other because of some beef between their favourite rockstars going back to like, Beatlemania probably. As if this isn't how fans of bands, sports teams, political parties, religions and pretty much anything you can name haven't been guilty of this dumb shit-flinging behaviour going back countless years and several generations, a lot of which make our little RUclips dramas look tame in comparison. But no, it's "the digital age" and millenials and gen z get blamed once again..I'm tired. But yeah I digress. I'm not saying we shouldn't check our behaviour but this isn't a "technology bad" problem. We definitely aren't the first people to do this and won't be the last either. But fr if you do find yourself getting too involved with stuff online, it goes back to the age-old proverb: G O O U T S I D E. Nothing online really matters that much and believe me I know how easy it is to fall down that rabbit hole. But at the end of the day I promise it ain't that deep bro. If you read this far thanks I guess, sorry for the dumb long comment but I just graduated uni and I miss writing essays on shit that doesn't really matter, apparently. Peace✌
I wanted to say one thing that I think you got wrong. No, it is not always the fans that want to attack another person. It is a lot of the time, but often it is the creators themselves that pit the fans against each other
Don't hate people in general but hate about the THING they do . If you disagree with people that doesn't mean you need to disagree with all of it same goes vice versa. And that's all some word's that i hold into.
@@koumorichinpo4326 that's bad because you also a people and if you're telling that you hate yourself then all i can say is that the world is not like what you see in the media(or internet)
@jaseandjohn if you're into toxic community ,i suggest you move avay from it ,meme places or jomes usually had some toxic people so ,reduce that ,do what you like
One of the few reviewers I respected was total biscuit. Him passing away hurt more than it should and was my first experience with death. Rest in peace.
It's not my responsibility to make sure my favorite content creators are on "the right path". If they do something shitty they deserve to be criticized, but their personal behavior is between them and the family/friends they interact with.
This really is an important message. You need not agree with any one all the time on any number of subjects. The entertainment media especially entirely subjective and it'd be foolhardy to be an adamant defender of any one thing to the point of extremist behavior.
I remember in one of angry Joe's movie review he said in the beginning that if you disagree with his opinion that is fine but then guess what he then starts complaining about people for disagreeing with him and he even lashes out at his own viewers and then starts complaining on Twitter.
Alright right now I'm in this headspace; *Fire Emblem: Build an army, Trust Nobody* . Like woof, there is a lot of nuance to this whole "judge a person" thing, since the knowledge on the event can sway so drastically for or against someone. Even now, the NC and Channel Awesome have continued to face the backlash of N.S.A., with Doug really proving to be the last bastion of the site and the RUclips face bar some news channels no one hardly watches. Meanwhile, people like Projared can come back revitalized after a complete shitstorm of negativity by using carefully planned countermeasures and the current climate of counterism on RUclips. But this creates an even stranger dilemma in which the commenters themselves devolve into a list of people stuck on previous information and refusing to accept or simply missing new information. We're still going to see people hating on Jared because they've branded the words behind his hate into their logic, but new logic contradicts a lot of the reasons to hate him. Heavy research would suggest he's innocent of at least his most aggregious actions, especially exposing to minors, but this level of investment is quite a bit more than the average person would be willing to invest. Ironically, in this age of information, we're as blind to change as Persona 5 constantly reprimands us for.
Ha, I remember when I made some dumb comments on a youtuber who made a rant on nostalgia critic that upset me, back then I used to like the content of nostalgia critic old and modern until I slowly realized why people don't like the nostalgia critic's content anymore and I kinda regretted doing that.
I find it very app that you're talkin about this particular subject in today's culture especially given the light of what happened this weekend in The Gaming Community. I completely agree critics need to be held accountable if they weaponize Their audience against a particular person although it is very hard for some people as Their audience will do things even if they repeatedly say don't do anything to these people which I've noticed a lot of political and politically charged critics tend to do.
I think that this applies to the audience just as much lol. And MrEnter explained how. Bad criticism is dumb and unneeded and damage whatever art even if it comes from some dumb kid from the comments or some asshole. Even if we just write it off as ehh ignore him. But why so they can propagate this problem further? By ignoring these types of people we have situations like Etika where they weren't the primary cause for his suicide, but they were influences of such. And they're a damn piece of shit being faceless doesn't matter that makes them even more pathetic than they already were. Hate mobs are stupid. People need to grow up.
I’m not a big fan of critics most of their collective fans can be pretty vicious when you don’t agree or say something against them but I still speak my mind
I find this video weird. I dont buy the communities as cults, the many i been a part of dont follow the BITE model to a level that i feel is really controlling how i think. I will agree that group thinking is terrible, but its not something that an individual can beat by themselves. Group thinking can only be over come by an idea that is strong enough to overcome it and has support of enough people. Though honestly I dont know how to fix this myself. As leaving a group will only weak your power to influnces things (and the idea that everyone could just leave is not how nash equilibrium works). To me its more like tribes than cults.
Well said, a lot of situations need time to develop and even then, people should come to their own conclusions instead of hanging onto someone else’s words. At the end of the day, nobody is infallible and it’s foolish to think otherwise.
ya they should just do them and have there own opinion.
Kinda seeing the potential for some "case in point" action here. Then again, calling it out is useless anyway-- we all do it in some way or another. Being suspended by one's own puppet strings is a hell of a sensation. Literally.
Hitler “came to his own conclusions” and look how that turned out.
@@Zelink108 nice.
Sugar
So do critics' critics need critics as well? :P
I T N E V E R E N D S
EyeofSol CRITIC-CEPTION
One of my favorite online critics was the late John Bain/Totalbiscuit, and he talked multiple times about how terrified he was of his audience and how people taking his word too seriously would spiral out of control, in times like these we really need people that are aware of the effect they frequently have on their audience, great vid as usual Sol.
Edit: 9:26 OH HEY BUTCH, FUNNY SEEING YOU HERE
-sigh- it pains me to believe I also joined in the bandwagon of believing whatever kind of dribble there is without stopping and using logical thinking before just jumping on a bandwagon for this kind of topic. I unfortunately acted this way during the Projared situation and I deeply wish I could've avoided following a bandwagon for it and I'm thankful I'm able to start to change my ways and use my own mental capabilities and form MY opinions while respecting the opinions, criticisms and critiques of others while making sure their opinions don't sway my own. We as people can't always see eye to eye, and while there are times we as a collective group CAN see eye to eye, that doesn't really mean we should copy the opinions we hear or see without forming our own
Yeah. It always frustrates me when certain critics and leaders try to boil their views down to their own when there are so many different factors that go into objectivity and subjectivity. It's even worse when they abuse their power by belittling their followers more than their detractors, especially when they can't even take constructive critiques. Isn't the point of criticism partly to give advice to those on how to improve their craft?
I miss the days when RUclips was just a place where people could have fun. Now it's just big internet personalities plotting against each other.
This is a pretty good video and I can think of two channels that serve as opposed approaches to people handling criticism from their audience: MysteriousMrEnter and Fact Fiend.
With MrEnter, he used to do the bland screaming at cartoons thing, but when people started critiquing that style, he adapted and took the criticism to heart and is doing some pretty good work IMO.
Then you have Fact Fiend by Karl Smallwood, who is so opposed to accepting criticism that he will ban literally anyone who doesn't comment something sycophantic and empty of content.
The thing is, criticism from the audience isn't usually meant to put down a critic, it's meant to try and get them to be a better critic. Not unlike how criticism of media isn't always there to put down media, but to point out how something can be better.
I like Fact Fiend's content but when you Pin legit criticism for everyone to tear down, you got something wrong in that equation
Fact "We can literally disable the comments because we play the algorithm so well" Fiend
I got banned from commenting on Fact Fiends for no reason. I hate it when RUclips tried to censor a comment and can't able to find a way to restore the visibility of my comment. That's why I always be weary about it and got myself saddened by the fact that there's nothing I can do about it.
Until I realized that there's a "blocked user" and can used to prevent commenters from existing on the comments. I only used it to block spam and hate comments.
This is definitely why I hate someone like Lily Orchard. She keeps criticizing so many people yet when anyone criticizes her, she just hates on them and continues to perpetuate her situation as being a victim. She has no respect for her audience so she definitely doesn’t deserve any respect back.
He's also a pedophile
And this is exactly why I unsubscribed from many anti-SJWs, like Andi Warski and Roaming Millennial as I liked them in the beginning but after doing more stuff that I just think is just wrong, there you go. I also don't believe in thinking what I like, or liked, is infallible. If someone did something I find really scummy, like how Andy invited and supported racists in his live chats and how Roaming Millennial is being a critic to SJWs just to push her conservative agenda, I will not give them any support and call them out!
Really have to say, you put a lot of work into this and nailed the points you were after. I wish people could move past easily bandwagoning these days, but it's just so easy for it to spiral out of control. Anywhos, thanks for the fun 12 minutes. :)
Aye it's Sage.
I love the way you have transformed your channel Sol. Good content. Thank You.
Excellent video. I really like where you go with the commentary on critics and the overall constructive nature of it. The main problem I see with the whole commentary/criticism community is it's always so destructive, with "this person/thing sucks, here's why" without any "here's an alternative" (you might get some constructive "here's how this scene could have been better," but the overall tone is "this sucks, lets laugh/rage at it"). While you definitely did deconstruct the problem, you left the pieces in a way that allows us to be constructive with your analysis, and I've found many people take kindly to constructive commentary of people/situations (at least in my own personal experience here on youtube). "The dark of the tunnel can be fun and exciting, but without the light at the end we have no hope."
"You do you" is a phrase that makes me lose braincells, unless it's about video games, movies, books etc. Saying "You do you" is an enabling phrase that you shouldn't say. I'd rather be told to mind my own business a million times than stand by people who are criminals
I haven't been to this channel in a while, and the costume caught me WAY off guard. Great to see the channel still doing good work! Keep it up!
Same the outfit caught me off guard same with the mask. I was like oh shit did she become an Uchiha XD
Well that's a calvacade of a thumbnail if I've ever seen one
Has anybody told you that your closing statement is amazing. Also love the costume.
I think RUclips drama is fine as long as you don't get too emotionally invested or start to base your personality around it ( and if you do, honestly get a hobby lmao) drama is gonna happen online and irl, always has always will for better or worse. Humans are tribal.
But it isn't youtubers' responsibility to teach anyone how to critically think about the views and opinions they're presenting- it's your own. That should be a given and something everyone should have learnt in high school. It's also not their fault if their fans decide to blindly worship them and put them on a pedestal as idols. Fanbases are renowned for being mindless and toxic. It's on the fans. I do agree with waiting for information before taking a stance on something instead of going on one person's take on the situation but again that's kinda obvious and goes for real life too.
And this kind of toxic fan-creator relationship is not a new thing and definitely is not a product of RUclips either. I'm not a fan of how this generation are getting the blame for behaviour that can be traced back several decades for the gd umpteenth time. As if blind hero worship of celebrities doesn't go back to when we first had the technology to put them on a screen or record them, probably even before that. As if band fanbases weren't pitted against each other because of some beef between their favourite rockstars going back to like, Beatlemania probably. As if this isn't how fans of bands, sports teams, political parties, religions and pretty much anything you can name haven't been guilty of this dumb shit-flinging behaviour going back countless years and several generations, a lot of which make our little RUclips dramas look tame in comparison. But no, it's "the digital age" and millenials and gen z get blamed once again..I'm tired. But yeah I digress. I'm not saying we shouldn't check our behaviour but this isn't a "technology bad" problem. We definitely aren't the first people to do this and won't be the last either.
But fr if you do find yourself getting too involved with stuff online, it goes back to the age-old proverb:
G O O U T S I D E. Nothing online really matters that much and believe me I know how easy it is to fall down that rabbit hole. But at the end of the day I promise it ain't that deep bro.
If you read this far thanks I guess, sorry for the dumb long comment but I just graduated uni and I miss writing essays on shit that doesn't really matter, apparently. Peace✌
I wanted to say one thing that I think you got wrong. No, it is not always the fans that want to attack another person. It is a lot of the time, but often it is the creators themselves that pit the fans against each other
Thanks for the tip.
Don't hate people in general but hate about the THING they do .
If you disagree with people that doesn't mean you need to disagree with all of it same goes vice versa.
And that's all some word's that i hold into.
I hate people in general.
@@koumorichinpo4326 that's bad because you also a people and if you're telling that you hate yourself then all i can say is that the world is not like what you see in the media(or internet)
@jaseandjohn if you're into toxic community ,i suggest you move avay from it ,meme places or jomes usually had some toxic people so ,reduce that ,do what you like
Great thumbnails of RUclips history, damn
You know things get serious when you go full philosophy-tube in the thumbnail.
One of the few reviewers I respected was total biscuit. Him passing away hurt more than it should and was my first experience with death. Rest in peace.
I just found your channel, and I already love it
It's not my responsibility to make sure my favorite content creators are on "the right path". If they do something shitty they deserve to be criticized, but their personal behavior is between them and the family/friends they interact with.
This really is an important message.
You need not agree with any one all the time on any number of subjects.
The entertainment media especially entirely subjective and it'd be foolhardy to be an adamant defender of any one thing to the point of extremist behavior.
I remember in one of angry Joe's movie review he said in the beginning that if you disagree with his opinion that is fine but then guess what he then starts complaining about people for disagreeing with him and he even lashes out at his own viewers and then starts complaining on Twitter.
I hate that I found this channel so late.
Great words. Nice video.
Critic’s Critics. Critic-ception
Alright right now I'm in this headspace; *Fire Emblem: Build an army, Trust Nobody* . Like woof, there is a lot of nuance to this whole "judge a person" thing, since the knowledge on the event can sway so drastically for or against someone. Even now, the NC and Channel Awesome have continued to face the backlash of N.S.A., with Doug really proving to be the last bastion of the site and the RUclips face bar some news channels no one hardly watches. Meanwhile, people like Projared can come back revitalized after a complete shitstorm of negativity by using carefully planned countermeasures and the current climate of counterism on RUclips. But this creates an even stranger dilemma in which the commenters themselves devolve into a list of people stuck on previous information and refusing to accept or simply missing new information. We're still going to see people hating on Jared because they've branded the words behind his hate into their logic, but new logic contradicts a lot of the reasons to hate him. Heavy research would suggest he's innocent of at least his most aggregious actions, especially exposing to minors, but this level of investment is quite a bit more than the average person would be willing to invest. Ironically, in this age of information, we're as blind to change as Persona 5 constantly reprimands us for.
Im a film critic as well, I'd never want anyone to take my reviews as gospel, someone could see something so beautiful in something I see as repulsive
my grandma's a critic of erotic novels, i'm not joking
No one being above criticism is one of the facts of life. Great video.
Ha, I remember when I made some dumb comments on a youtuber who made a rant on nostalgia critic that upset me, back then I used to like the content of nostalgia critic old and modern until I slowly realized why people don't like the nostalgia critic's content anymore and I kinda regretted doing that.
I find it very app that you're talkin about this particular subject in today's culture especially given the light of what happened this weekend in The Gaming Community. I completely agree critics need to be held accountable if they weaponize Their audience against a particular person although it is very hard for some people as Their audience will do things even if they repeatedly say don't do anything to these people which I've noticed a lot of political and politically charged critics tend to do.
Critics are people, just like everyone else.
No, no they're not. Critics are subhuman.
But do critic's critics need critics?
Timing! -Casper
What’s the name of the critic at 9:31
"The EyeofAll, sees it Sol" 😝
I think that this applies to the audience just as much lol. And MrEnter explained how. Bad criticism is dumb and unneeded and damage whatever art even if it comes from some dumb kid from the comments or some asshole. Even if we just write it off as ehh ignore him. But why so they can propagate this problem further? By ignoring these types of people we have situations like Etika where they weren't the primary cause for his suicide, but they were influences of such. And they're a damn piece of shit being faceless doesn't matter that makes them even more pathetic than they already were. Hate mobs are stupid. People need to grow up.
I'm glad you ditched the fedora
I like the toilet shots
I didn't think it was possible for boogie to sink any lower but that clip...wow. I'm sure he was dissociated though.
who watches the watch men
*sad day*
Eyeofsol uploads
*happy day*
I’m not a big fan of critics most of their collective fans can be pretty vicious when you don’t agree or say something against them but I still speak my mind
No fantano in the thumbnail. Interesting.
What a fantastic costume!!😃
I love it.🥰
Wooowzers, Sol! You just uploaded sUuupEr LaTe!!
I think Dr. Hebert was on to something when he said Shakespeare should have the ability to spray stink on his critics.
All these examples were use perfectly wtf
When your in that mask your scaring me jesus
Oh boy another eos time to get depressed
:(
EyeofSol you make good videos they just tend to be depressing
TBH, Doug makes some really interesting criticisms despite his shady business practices
I think I like this video.
you're awesome!
Some people just can't be left to their own devices.
Pineapple
I find this video weird. I dont buy the communities as cults, the many i been a part of dont follow the BITE model to a level that i feel is really controlling how i think. I will agree that group thinking is terrible, but its not something that an individual can beat by themselves. Group thinking can only be over come by an idea that is strong enough to overcome it and has support of enough people.
Though honestly I dont know how to fix this myself. As leaving a group will only weak your power to influnces things (and the idea that everyone could just leave is not how nash equilibrium works). To me its more like tribes than cults.
I think you failed.
The best respone to this video is "okay wanna be boomer"
🐧
Can you make a video about e-begging.
Sure, eventually
I feel like the video would consistently have DSP in it XD
Finally a good video I can agree with. Man Doug has fallen from glace. Shameful. Great video by the way. :)
anthony fantano gave to (album here) a 9
its good i swear
Is that The Quartering?
The She-Ra guy? Ugh, he gives me an ulcer
He's a commentor, not a critic though
Very good video
G
👏👏👏👍