As an Independant Writer/Researcher as well as being a newcomer to Utah and not Raised Mormon, John Dehlin's Mormon Stories has been a Huge Major BLESSING to me in helping me to UnderStand most or all things Mormon and All Sides of Mormon Issues ! Deeply Grateful. Bless you John and family ! Thank you all ! ForEver Grateful !
Such a beautiful thought provoking discussion. I grew up evangelical/Pentecostal… sifting through it all now. Trying to decide how to live out and teach my children the truths and values that have survived the sifting. These podcasts help so much. Thank you.
What an interesting discussion. I feel like your podcast is my church (I'm never Mo and not a member of any church); I can feel the love, kindness, acceptance and unity in each and every episode. I have learned so much from each individual's story and journey - I can truly feel my heart growing with more love and empathy for all mankind. This probably sounds so corny and crazy, but it's true! MS models thoughtfulness, unconditional love, kindness, and respect as it holds loving space for every person it interacts with along the way. If that's not Christ-like, I don't know what is? I feel so fortunate to have stumbled upon the podcast and I'm a better person for it ~ thank you! ❤
I love John! He opened my eyes to the truth that was being covered up. I actually heard him on a different podcast the first time I heard him. So it was a huge shock and made me go research the truth for myself. And that is a great gift. It gave me the opportunity to research the actual truth. It was info released by the church etc. But having been told that I didn’t need to look things up, I left a lot of things alone. Figured “it will be answered on the other side”.’ Well there is only so much that can be answered on the other side. And since the church had lied about one specific thing I wanted ti know what else they lied about, covered up etc. So thank you John! I have freedom because you challenged me to look for myself!
You’re a good man John Dehlin. Like you, after leaving Mormonism I checked out a lot of different Christian denominations as well as the Unitarian Universalists. I realized that I would never be OK with Christianity’s notion that kind compassionate human beings who don’t accept Christ into their hearts are doomed to hell. It is absolutely outrageous. A god that is fine with most of “his” creations/children burning in utter and complete torment for all eternity is not one I am willing to worship. At least Mormonism gave me some comfort that all people had a chance to reach some degree of glory. Of course now that I’m an apostate, outer darkness is my fate.🙄 I’ll follow Jesus’s best teachings but a BIG no thank you to joining the religious institutions that claim his name. Thank you Dr Dehlin for your service in bringing truth to light. Truth matters and YOU matter to so many. I hope you get to write your book but MS won’t be the same without you. Please don’t stay away too long.😢
As a Christian, I think Christians do more damage with erroneous teachings like God being a God of torment. There are healthy churches out there but so many are the reason that people walk away from God altogether. God is kind, compassionate and loving. At the end of the day, I don’t need religion to save me, only Jesus. It is that simple.
This is epic. Loving every minute of this. John I learned so much about you. I see you as a fellow Christian!! Thank you BOTH for all you do!! I’m a practicing Catholic (Roman) and love this channel. “Preach the Gospel at all times. Use words if necessary." -unknown
Not the right time for a book, John. Your voice is reaching so many in an organic way. And you are perfect as the host of Mormon Stories. Books are amazing. But- your voice makes a real difference in this world.
I could listen to you both forever... THIS is heaven to me... love the love between you! JD, you do need to write a book, there will be generations to come that need to hear your story and have the knowledge and insight you bring. Not being dramatic, heartfelt. I am a never Mormon, but have had a faith crisis of my own. Cannot tell you how important it was to know there are others on a similar journey as mine. ❤️
Love when Steven said honoring John Dehlin! Absolutely right 👏 You do important work John! I would love to read your book. Although I am selfishly hoping you stay the main host of Mormon stories podcast. At least until after my interview 🤣 just wouldn't be Mormon stories without you.
I like what you said about your Dad John, a "Jesus Mormon". Still to this day I can look back on my LDS experience, and there are members that are exactly like that. I look at them as true Christ like people. Not alot came up to that standard, but the ones that did are amazing humans, and have made their mark. I like Stevens view on modern Christianity. That old school 19th century born again way of looking at Christianity, puts so many intelligent people off. I'm into my 5th week of binge watching Mormon stories. Am getting so much out of it. I'm finding it deeply reflective and therapeutic understanding where I've come from, and why I was where I was. Thank you guys, much love.
If you took off three months to a year to write a book (hey, Joseph Smith did it in three months!), we'd all still have thousands of hours of your past podcasts to visit or revisit. I'm a newbie just getting started listening to your vast catalogue of interviews, discussions, and Mormon stories, and I'm loving them all. You said yourself that it's important to focus on this life, the now that we have. Live out your dreams ❤️❤️❤️
John, if you write a book please write about your story. Personal stories are the most powerful and impactful thing. Truth claims-and the info many provide to debunk them-are arguable, but personal stories are irrefutable. Personal stories resonate. You’ll get far greater readership, touch more hearts, and open and enlighten more minds by writing your story. Please include your personal experiences and what you’ve learned from interviewing so many people. That’d be an epic book.
John, as I say in almost every post I make on your channel, I am one of your never Mormon subscribers. John, when you blurted out, “I have never gotten over my Mormonism.” I related to that so much. I am a former Seventh-day Adventist and I have to admit, I have never really gotten over my SDAism. There are many reasons for this. One is, there were many good things I learned and enjoyed there. I would never go back there, but there were good things in that community. Another point, like LDS, the SDAs believe they are the only true church, the remnant church for the last days. That is very SEDUCTIVE! It is hard to humble myself and no longer be an elite class of people. I could go on and on, but I love your channel.
So inspiring! So much desire for a loving, workable community! I was raised RLDS and thru you have met John Hamer & Steven Vezey? and could happily come back into that fold as Community of Christ! What er visualize is not 'average' but 'exceptional'! Ive been watching your podcasts for more than six years....love it all!
Great show John. It is such a good treat to have on your show different perspectives. All your shows, if only those who need to see them, would. A # to remember.
Every time I think I agree with John Dehlin... he expresses something else that resonates so strongly with me. The parallel of one person's 'great/obvious/must do idea' with someone else's 'divine inspiration/word of god/spirtual message'. Excellent. Couple that with the apparent need to use the right jargon to be 'saved' while accepting all the exploitation of those in poverty in the name of organised religion... Really fabulous to hear all of this.
Thank you for this John and Steven. I can’t stop watching because there’s so much to learn from this episode. This is the episode where John starts to process his childhood memories and see the trauma of others that he witnessed and then became the target of in a different way as an adult. Soooo good. Thank you for this!!!🫶🏽👍🏽💜
Wha a productive, life giving conversation! I've spent 60 years in the protestant church, and my roots there go.back since the 1600s, really. And I've always struggled with the idea of substitutionary atonement. John here articulates that struggle better than anybody I've heard. Yet I know how much the crucifixion informs my heart about the love of God and my access to it. " He loved us while we were yet enemies." Would we do that even for three days for an enemy? So they had access to the complete love of God? Jesus was able to give himself completely to.others. yet never lose the Self. His expression of love informs my heart and directs my relationship with God and others.
Thank you, John, for your voice, for helping people like myself who choose to thrive in uncertainty in regard to faith and religion. If Joseph Smith truly saw God and Jesus Christ, maybe it would have been best if he had stopped at "Join none of them." 😉
I was a Southern Baptist in the 1980’s. One Sunday morning pastor shared with us a study that was done by the Southern Baptist Convention. Southern Baptist Churches we’re loosing members. If I remember correctly, mostly people were just leaving religion, but for those that left for another faith, The Mormon Church was the number one church Southern Baptist churches were losing members to. Cue the warnings and education about the Mormon “Cult”… their words.
Thanks for sharing your story with Christianity.. I believe that to be kind, mindfull, gentle and respectfull is more worth than any revelation, spiritual insight, calling, or even than to just follow any religion, guru or tradition. Many feel especially chosen because of what they follow, but people that simply try to be something "good" don't care so much about feeling chosen, they rather care about choosing what is good and show kindness and respect towards other people and their spiritual convictions.
So thankful to hear your dad told you what he told you but what I love so much is that your dad embodied do unto others as you want from them. The heart of what the reason Jesus came to say. Help others ahhhh thank you My heart and soul loves this And that is what I took from my Mormon upbringing.
John and Steven you are not alone. Many of us feel the same. We are done with the rigid doctrinal limitations of the religiosity of our faith. True faith needs doubts and hope and mystery.
John, you have a great voice and a personality and intellect that makes your podcasts so interesting and enjoyable. As I also went through a faith crisis as a Roman Catholic. As I’ve said before, I see a lot of similarities with how people who left the Morman faith realise that a lot of the teachings are false. I concluded that the way forward for me was to no longer be a member of any organised religion. I simply try to follow the teachings of Jesus ie to treat others as I wish to be treated “ Do onto others as you would have others do onto you”.
The kind of religion you guys are talking about is the kind of religion I am looking for. So when you establish your church of goodness, I want to be a part of it. I've got some great stories about how good god has been to me and how how much better life has become since I listen only to God instead of letting other people or institutions tell me what gods will is for me.
Please write a book! I would absolutely read it. Like Steven, I am an Evangelical Christian who is fascinated by Mormonism. I have many Mormon friends myself. Im just a nobody lol. I have been listening to Mormon Stories for about a year and have learned so much! I love you all! On the topic of ex-LDS memoirs, and some evangelical Christians, and ExMo’s at the beginning of the episode, you mentioned Lynn Wilder. I think you should have her on MS podcast sometime, along with her son, Micah. They have both written fantastic memoirs, and have great Mormon Stories.
John, I love the authenticity and transparency you bring. I’ve been soaking up your content and conversations as of late and really appreciate the phenomenal job you’ve done. I was curious, along your journey have you ever studied the Feasts of the Lord and heard the theory that Jesus fulfilled the Spring Feasts during His First Coming and will fulfill the Fall Feasts at His Second Coming?
I think you’d write a great book, I’d be curious to see your own story intertwined with lessons learned from these years of collecting others’ stories…but you serve a super important role through this medium. This has to be the priority, I think. My suggestion is to look for a partner on the book side, more than on the podcast/RUclips side. I mean, yes, take some pressure off by giving the interview mic over to Nemo, Gerardo, Jen or Margi from time to time, but more important is to find a co-writer who will craft the book with you and make that as light of a load as possible.
I'm obviously highly biased since my whole channel is about books but... of course John should write a book! I would love to see a book from him on the power of storytelling in the human religious experience, how to be a good listener, and how stories drive change in institutions
I would rather have podcasts than books, because I cannot read a book while I am working, but I can listen to podcasts. Also, because I am poor and I have a modicum of self-awareness, I can usually listen to podcasts for free, whereas books cost money.
I am a former evangelical/pentecostal Christian. Now atheist. Being atheist, for me, is not making the claim that there is no god(s), rather, I simply do not see the evidence of one or them. Steven is an evangelical and his praise of John is b/c John is undermining a faith that he believes is false. Easier to claim something is a 'ministry' when you agree with the person's ultimate goal to bring a religion believed to be false, to light. I find Steven's arguments and claims to be nearly as empty as the mormon's claims when it comes to a belief in a god. He says that god makes the final judgment. Of course. The traditional path is salvation is well known and evangelicals tend to believe that if you do not accept god, you will be damned. I also would like to know if Steven was actually an atheist or someone who simply was angry with god and tried to deny his existence. He admits to being angry with him/her/it. Not the same. Just some thoughts. Steven 'sounds' like a non-typical evangelical, but I only have this youtube to make any judgment. Why is Steven a Christian. More specifically, why is he an "evangelical" Christian and not one of the thousands of other sects? He says that he judges people based on their fruits. So....you don't have to be a Christian. Just a good person? Confusing theology that I have heard from Christians of from all sides.
John - the process of evolution in biology is NOT a random process. The mutations are random, but the natural selection is very ordered. You’ve interviewed plenty of biologists on here, so I was a little surprised to hear this old chestnut 🌰 coming from you.
My Christianity is in my heart and guides my steps an encourages me to lead with love for all. I am black cis hetero Christian ally who can’t/won’t go to church because the current culture in the church feels oxymoronic to me as a Christ follower.
As an LGBT Christian, God bless you for that ❤️ I wish affirming churches were more religious or less political because they make me feel just as unwelcome sadly.
You would write an amazing book John. That is something I would so look forward to. I love watching you and your interviews, love the commentary and articulation you have and also getting to know all of the people you work with and I think publishing all of that on paper would only amplify your success in spreading this message you have for the world. If you were able to find the financial, mental, spiritual, and physical balance to be able to both host and write, that would be something I know I would support you in 100% and I know other supporters would too. And if you choose to take a break and let another host take the reigns don’t be worried. I think like Steven was getting at, you underestimate yourself and how many people want to hear the messages you put out so whoever you choose to host would be more than loved because YOU chose them! There’s also no rush. Do what you feel you’re called to when you’re called to do it. Your supporters will be behind you no matter what.
1:24:30 MY FAVORITE PART! Thanks for being authentic and honest!!! Bravo!! Fun Fact: Anthropologists estimate that at least 18,000 different gods, goddesses, etc. have been worshiped by humans since our species first appeared. There are still religions older than Christianity being practiced - including: Zoroastrianism (10th - 5th century BCE) ... Judaism (9th - 5th century BCE) ... Jainism (8th - 2nd century BCE) ... Confucianism (6th - 5th century BCE) ... Buddhism (6th - 5th century BCE) ... Taoism (6th - 4th century BCE) I grew up studying the Bible and was a Hebrew/Greek Bible scholar in my 20's. Decades later... after beginning to realize how much we are ALL BRAINWASHED (in so many aspects), I asked myself: "Can the historical beginning of the Bible hold up to the same scrutiny I now use on politicians / agencies (FDA, CDC, etc) and on Big Pharma/Big Medicine, etc.? I dug in on the TOPIC OF "WHO WROTE THE BIBLE?" and "HOW CAN WE PROVE IT?" with that same level of scrutiny - leaving off my "confirmation bias" that I had allowed for in my youth. I encourage "believers" to do the same: Do this with fresh eyes... a beginners mind. Dig!!! Once you do, you will see "what is S A I D" (which are we are to "believe"... and not to "question" what we are "told"... we are just to put any uncertainty "on the shelf" and have "faith as a mustard seed" and simply "believe!!!!" (I did that as a kid with Santa Claus, too.) What you will find... is the "narrative" or the stories we are told... and you may find supposed "documents" that supposedly prove the authentication of supposed first writings, etc.. (Be sure to look at all the fabricated "historical" documents... ones that we are TOLD they are real... ergo "proof" and why we should believe. Each "religion" has their "narratives" and their "proofs" about their original documents from 'God' - and we are so willing to accept them. Then, look at all the transcriptions / translations over the thousands of years... by various "believers", etc. (As you do, note how many "religions" are run by MEN and subjugate women and children to being "lesser" and resulting in oppression and abuse. Think about that with a critical mind.) THEN, recall the effects of the child's game "Gossip" or "Chinese Whispers" and think about how you've seen that play out over and over in life - and get twisted to meet the objectives of those who thrive on POWER, CONTROL and M O N E Y. ie: ". . . Although the objective is to pass around the message without it becoming garbled along the way, part of the enjoyment is that, regardless, this usually ends up happening. Errors typically accumulate in the re-tellings, so the statement announced by the last player differs significantly from that of the first player. . ." en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chinese_whispers Just something to think about. Who knows? Every watch the movie "The Matrix"?
The criteria is the 10 commandments, truth and love, John. At the cross Jesus gave his life to save us from being separated from him for eternity, not because he stood up for his beliefs, but because he loves us. You are one of us.
Your spiritual journey resonates with me. Shane Vaughn of First Harvest Ministries located in Mississippi has videos that answered so many questions for me. It is not what we do, it is what our Heavenly Father is doing in us. Jesus (Yashuah) is the pattern son that we are to follow, not any man made religion. Keep seeking. It is so worth it to come into the change that our Heavenly Father has planned for us. Endure to secure.
Would a Buddhist monk that had lived his whole life in peace and Solitude go to hell because he didn't accept Jesus Christ as his personal savior? There are people that say: "yes". 🤷
Hey John! I just wanted to thank you for your take on the Resurrection and and the divinity of Christ. After leaving Mormonism, It surprised me how many ex Mormons in the podcast/social media world- RFM, Bill Reel, Nuancehoe, brittney Hartley, Allan Mount, John Larsen- seem to take a firm atheist stance. I’ve been delving into a lot of books about the life and divinity of Christ, and while I do doubt his Resurrection, I feel like an “I don’t know” is the best stance to take. Why do so many ex Mormons seem so firm on their stance that Jesus was not divine or Resurrected? Yes it seems doubtful due to the lack of evidence, but to adamantly say that he was not confuses me. Maybe I’m missing something
I would totally read John’s story in a heartbeat. I don’t know what to do about the time problem, but if you could work it out I would even pre-order. It’s not even an adoration thing (though I do have a lot of respect for you), I just think you’re a really interesting person and I would love to hear about your internal dialogue.
I nominate Nemo if there's a way he can grow his brand at the same time! Obviously I'd say Gerardo and Jen but they would have to go full time and that does not seem possible based on your comments. Yes much younger and different style but he come across extremely professional and thoughtful. Anyway hope you find somebody.
I would prefer Gerardo, John Larsen, or Nemo (my preference in descending order). However, if Gerardo already has full-time job, he might not be interested. And, I suspect John Larsen would not be interested.
John, you have got to get Jennette McCurdy on the podcast. Apparently she grew up Mormon and left the church and has had a pretty traumatic life mostly because of her mother and recently released her book about her life. She would be great!
I like John's openess to all beliefs, yet his no nonsense forward understanding of Jesus & Christianity. Thank you for sharing all you did in this episode! Totally agree with John on the "deadness" of temple ordinances, yet ignore or not prioritize those in need. I find Mormons miss the REALITY of the here & now ( I did too as a Mormon)!
"I am not the kind of person that reduces experiences to neurochemicals" - John I know you're a fellow psychologist so I hope I'm not saying something you already know (and I also fully admit I haven't watched the whole 2 hours yet) but in the contextual behavioral science (ACT basically) world we call the attempt to do that "radical reductionism" and I think it's such an important point! Every time you reduce something to something else - well sociology is just psychology which is just chemistry which is just physics which is just math - you LOSE really important meaningful contexts about whatever you were just reducing (behavior, for example). Sorry I know that's not really the point of this particular video but I always love it when radical reductionism shows up and being able to have conversations around it! :)
John, being saved is between you and God. You cannot say whether someone is saved or not BUT no one can say if you’re saved or not. As a Christian, I run from anyone that is more concerned about whether a person is saved or not then living out their own salvation. I also run from anyone that claims their “religion” is the only true faith.
I am grateful and admire both of you gentlemen. I am a Oneness Pentecostal who has been having dialogues with LDS missionaries for a while. You both are great examples of how to have meaningful discussions with people from different perspectives. I honor John for his years of sacrifice. I would say I am grateful for the tone he has taken in these conversations. I would say that salvation is not about you earning anything through worthiness- that’s not the Gospel. You can’t earn grace through good works. God may very well be directing and leading John in some ways. I would say ultimately though God wants to give all people salvation through faith in Christ. We are commanded in Acts 2:38 to repent, be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins and receive the gift of the Holy Ghost. I would agree there is no human who has the right to condemn anyone. I would say I want to see people filled with the Holy Ghost speaking with tongues, transformed from the inside out and living empowered by grace rather than trying to earn it. Anyone can be filled with the Holy Ghost if they have faith in Christ, repent and ask Jesus to come live inside you. Serving people, radical dramatic work to help others find peace etc. is most definitely a part of living for God but they are not to earn anything. They are to glorify the Christ who empowers you to live righteously. I would say the evidence of the willingness of the disciples to die saying they saw Christ resurrected is a good piece of evidence for Christianity. They went to the very place Jesus was killed to declare He had been risen and risk it all. It is worth betting everything on. I love you all and just wanted to share another perspective here. You all are doing amazing work and I know you are making a huge difference for society.
John Dehlin, I am horrified that anybody from any religious background would dare signal to you that you are a bad person or that you are going to hell or that you are going to be punished by God for not subscribing to the 'right' group. I totally understand your righteous indignation at that. Totally. And I happen to be a 'born-again' Christian. Please keep calling out hypocrisy when you encounter it. 😭
Has more good been done in the name of Christ? Or more harm? Open question as I don't know the answer, but I'd submit that it's the latter. You are good John. No need to attribute that to God, or Christianity.
Margi's interviews always really make me think about myself and my life and growth and how I approach the world. ❤ (And I've never even been Mormon...)
Steven. When you say prepare to hear another voice please give me your method that you use to determine how that is different than normal human cognitive choices. To be clear. How can you differentiate from the myriad of all tensions and somehow laser focus on Jesus?
Love you John ❤ If my mouth could sufficiently articulate what I think/believe/feel in my mind and heart it would be all the words that you share (so far in every episode I have listened to, you are my voice). Thank you for expressing what I can’t and for the support/healing that it is bringing to my mind and spirit and life. Especially when you are real and honest about your own faults. It is so refreshing to hear someone be able to speak the truth about themselves. My heart goes out to you for your courage and what you endure by being vulnerable and doing work like this. I can only imagine and I’m so grateful. I’m a born and raised Idaho mormon with strong pioneer ancestors and a majority active believing family who for the most part are still loving and sometimes accepting of family who are no longer involved in the church. It is so hard and painful to sort through the conditioning from growing up in the church. There are deep deep fears rooted in this religion and recognizing that has started this journey for me. I feel both so excited to know that there’s this whole life I get to do discover now but to have been given the keys to unlock my own prison cell, I do find myself just standing here in front of the open door trying to figure out 🤷🏻♀️ What’s next? Where do I go? Who even am I aside from this identity the church created for me? Because I have worked to suppress and replace her my entire life. How do I even take this first step out of the mental prison cell because it’s such a foreign feeling… All these thoughts and feelings are complex. Thank you for representing people like me/us. Anyway, much love for you KD
Go on a sabbatical for three months I think that’s a great idea and it is half written or even more just a matter of picking and choosing what material you draw from. But I love books and I would put it in my library And then listen to the audio over and over again.
I'm sad the Sandra Tanner event was closed to the public. There are many of us who have anxiously been waiting for that event since it was first suggested years ago :(
You are living a Christ led life whether you say so or not. This sparked my consciousness completely. This is how I try to live my life also. I had a faith crisis in my career when I realized that teaching was sucking my soul. I loved the kids. I loved teaching but could not abide the politics and criticism and non leadership that corrupt the bonds of teacher student interaction. It seemed like all the important decisions were opposite of the necessary changes to help the children. I was tired of fighting the good fight only to be deep sixed by administration.
1:31:14 John: I wanna preface this by saying that I really enjoy your podcast. It's really helped me to understand my Mormon friends and neighbors better. I think you're doing amazing work. I love the intellectual scope and logic seeking discussion. I would also like to address your question. My thought, as a "Christian", is that from a RELIGIOUS standpoint you are just like MANY "Christians"... Doing all the "right" and admirable things. But, as you list the things you want, it sounds as though you are missing that divine connection - the RELATIONSHIP with the Father. When we connect with the Divine through prayer, worship, quietness, meditation, etc., we feel His love. True love. In the Bible, Jesus says that His commandment is to LOVE one another. And, personally, I can only do that through seeking His heart for the person directly in front of me, listening, and serving as He directs. And, to be honest, I'm often surprised at both what He asks me to do and what I perceive to be the miniscule part of the ripple effect that causes. For me, when I serve based on my own understanding, it's often unfulfilling and un-impactful. As far as theology goes, I'm stumped and not inclined to debate anyone on anything. I mean, I have ideas... But, I'm still working on getting that commandment I talked about above mastered. I'll just be out here, listening to people, loving people, and believing that God will give them what's insight they need and desire. Love, grace, and peace.
I'm fond of the Red Letter Christian idea. I'll share my view here. To me, spirituality and religion are like smelling flowers vs pressing them in a book. If you read "scriptures" and a "member" cooperating in a church, you may well be firm, you're saved, and so on, as firm as a solid block of wood, the cross, etc. but if you earnestly try to heed the words of Jesus, Jesus himself says you are on a "rock", as much as Peter might have been the "rockbed" for the church. If you are sitting on a pile of riches and ignoring the poor then perhaps it's more like sand or trying to get to the rock by passing through an eye of the needle, but that is the house of sand...which perishes and can be robbed...treasure on earth.
I have lived the opposite as John's experience... evangelical Christian growing up in a 85% LDS population. Love my LDS friends but our faith beliefs don't align, we are friends in spite of the differences.
If god wanted us to know him he would tell us in unambiguous language that we would understand. And he would tell everyone, not just a small group of uneducated people who didn't write it down for 200 years.
Voltaire said it best..."Religion began when the first scoundrel met the first fool." The human race has an incessant need for understanding and meaning in all aspects. When there are no answers to some questions people will accept any ideas or leaders who can fill those needs. Found it ironic when John indicated he and Margi were most concerned about not being able to raise healthy moral children without religion. There was a study published in 2015 that showed a households increasing religiousness (no matter the type of religion) created children that were less altruistic and compassionate with others. Religion does not impart strong moral values, it often undermines developing strong moral values as is seen daily.
John, you need to look into Unitarian Universalist if you haven't. It is the closest thing I have found to what you are talking about. It's just not focused on any one diety or one religion. It tries to focus on taking the good you find from all religions. It's been pretty interesting to me. I will never give myself 100 percent to another religion, but that seems to be the montra of this church. Just grow in the way that is good for you.
I have listened to many podcasts of stories of mormon programming. I'm confused about what John's podcast is all about. You have to go through hours of every thought of every guest, and I am yet to find out if anyone found truth. I don't know the belief of the host or what the goal is of this podcast. I hope to find out soon.
If we wanted to be technically accurate, modern "Christians" are really Paulists, ie followers of the teaching of Paul as HE understood and interpreted the teachings of Jesus Christ. Had his brother James and/or Peter prevailed, the sect would have evolved quite differently with much less Greek influence.
John, no one can take your place. You are a superstar of Mormon Stories. You don’t need to write a book. The stories that you share speaks volumes.
I think this episode is what John’s book will be about, actually.
As an Independant Writer/Researcher as well as being a newcomer to Utah and not Raised Mormon, John Dehlin's Mormon Stories has been a Huge Major BLESSING to me in helping me to UnderStand most or all things Mormon and All Sides of Mormon Issues ! Deeply Grateful. Bless you John and family ! Thank you all ! ForEver Grateful !
My pleasure!!!
Such a beautiful thought provoking discussion. I grew up evangelical/Pentecostal… sifting through it all now. Trying to decide how to live out and teach my children the truths and values that have survived the sifting. These podcasts help so much. Thank you.
What an interesting discussion. I feel like your podcast is my church (I'm never Mo and not a member of any church); I can feel the love, kindness, acceptance and unity in each and every episode. I have learned so much from each individual's story and journey - I can truly feel my heart growing with more love and empathy for all mankind. This probably sounds so corny and crazy, but it's true! MS models thoughtfulness, unconditional love, kindness, and respect as it holds loving space for every person it interacts with along the way. If that's not Christ-like, I don't know what is? I feel so fortunate to have stumbled upon the podcast and I'm a better person for it ~ thank you! ❤
Wow. Thank you Beth. ❤️🙏
I love John! He opened my eyes to the truth that was being covered up. I actually heard him on a different podcast the first time I heard him.
So it was a huge shock and made me go research the truth for myself. And that is a great gift. It gave me the opportunity to research the actual truth. It was info released by the church etc. But having been told that I didn’t need to look things up, I left a lot of things alone. Figured “it will be answered on the other side”.’
Well there is only so much that can be answered on the other side.
And since the church had lied about one specific thing I wanted ti know what else they lied about, covered up etc.
So thank you John! I have freedom because you challenged me to look for myself!
I appreciate John's willingness to be vulnerable just like his guests always do.
You’re a good man John Dehlin.
Like you, after leaving Mormonism I checked out a lot of different Christian denominations as well as the Unitarian Universalists.
I realized that I would never be OK with Christianity’s notion that kind compassionate human beings who don’t accept Christ into their hearts are doomed to hell. It is absolutely outrageous. A god that is fine with most of “his” creations/children burning in utter and complete torment for all eternity is not one I am willing to worship.
At least Mormonism gave me some comfort that all people had a chance to reach some degree of glory. Of course now that I’m an apostate, outer darkness is my fate.🙄
I’ll follow Jesus’s best teachings but a BIG no thank you to joining the religious institutions that claim his name.
Thank you Dr Dehlin for your service in bringing truth to light.
Truth matters and YOU matter to so many. I hope you get to write your book but MS won’t be the same without you.
Please don’t stay away too long.😢
As a Christian, I think Christians do more damage with erroneous teachings like God being a God of torment. There are healthy churches out there but so many are the reason that people walk away from God altogether. God is kind, compassionate and loving. At the end of the day, I don’t need religion to save me, only Jesus. It is that simple.
Don’t stop John! You are my favorite part of the podcast. Books- nah. What you are doing now is SPECIAL.
This is epic. Loving every minute of this. John I learned so much about you. I see you as a fellow Christian!! Thank you BOTH for all you do!!
I’m a practicing Catholic (Roman) and love this channel.
“Preach the Gospel at all times. Use words if necessary." -unknown
Thanks!
This whole talk is the beat of my heart! Thank you John for all you do!
Not the right time for a book, John. Your voice is reaching so many in an organic way. And you are perfect as the host of Mormon Stories. Books are amazing. But- your voice makes a real difference in this world.
As a relative newcomer to the podcast, it's been great to hear John's background and history in the last couple episodes. Keep up the great work!
I could listen to you both forever... THIS is heaven to me... love the love between you! JD, you do need to write a book, there will be generations to come that need to hear your story and have the knowledge and insight you bring. Not being dramatic, heartfelt. I am a never Mormon, but have had a faith crisis of my own. Cannot tell you how important it was to know there are others on a similar journey as mine. ❤️
I would love to hear John's full Mormon story.
Love when Steven said honoring John Dehlin! Absolutely right 👏 You do important work John! I would love to read your book. Although I am selfishly hoping you stay the main host of Mormon stories podcast. At least until after my interview 🤣 just wouldn't be Mormon stories without you.
Life is a journey, no doubt about it. Seeing you 2 good men being honest and transparent about your own journey is heart warming.
I like what you said about your Dad John, a "Jesus Mormon". Still to this day I can look back on my LDS experience, and there are members that are exactly like that. I look at them as true Christ like people. Not alot came up to that standard, but the ones that did are amazing humans, and have made their mark.
I like Stevens view on modern Christianity. That old school 19th century born again way of looking at Christianity, puts so many intelligent people off.
I'm into my 5th week of binge watching Mormon stories. Am getting so much out of it. I'm finding it deeply reflective and therapeutic understanding where I've come from, and why I was where I was.
Thank you guys, much love.
If you took off three months to a year to write a book (hey, Joseph Smith did it in three months!), we'd all still have thousands of hours of your past podcasts to visit or revisit. I'm a newbie just getting started listening to your vast catalogue of interviews, discussions, and Mormon stories, and I'm loving them all.
You said yourself that it's important to focus on this life, the now that we have. Live out your dreams
❤️❤️❤️
John, if you write a book please write about your story. Personal stories are the most powerful and impactful thing. Truth claims-and the info many provide to debunk them-are arguable, but personal stories are irrefutable. Personal stories resonate. You’ll get far greater readership, touch more hearts, and open and enlighten more minds by writing your story. Please include your personal experiences and what you’ve learned from interviewing so many people. That’d be an epic book.
John, as I say in almost every post I make on your channel, I am one of your never Mormon subscribers.
John, when you blurted out, “I have never gotten over my Mormonism.” I related to that so much.
I am a former Seventh-day Adventist and I have to admit, I have never really gotten over my SDAism. There are many reasons for this.
One is, there were many good things I learned and enjoyed there. I would never go back there, but there were good things in that community.
Another point, like LDS, the SDAs believe they are the only true church, the remnant church for the last days. That is very SEDUCTIVE!
It is hard to humble myself and no longer be an elite class of people.
I could go on and on, but I love your channel.
Thank you Bill! I really want to interview you!!!!
@@mormonstories that would be awesome!
So inspiring! So much desire for a loving, workable community! I was raised RLDS and thru you have met John Hamer & Steven Vezey? and could happily come back into that fold as Community of Christ! What er visualize is not 'average' but 'exceptional'! Ive been watching your podcasts for more than six years....love it all!
Great show John. It is such a good treat to have on your show different perspectives. All your shows, if only those who need to see them, would. A # to remember.
Every time I think I agree with John Dehlin... he expresses something else that resonates so strongly with me. The parallel of one person's 'great/obvious/must do idea' with someone else's 'divine inspiration/word of god/spirtual message'. Excellent. Couple that with the apparent need to use the right jargon to be 'saved' while accepting all the exploitation of those in poverty in the name of organised religion... Really fabulous to hear all of this.
Thank you for this John and Steven. I can’t stop watching because there’s so much to learn from this episode.
This is the episode where John starts to process his childhood memories and see the trauma of others that he witnessed and then became the target of in a different way as an adult. Soooo good. Thank you for this!!!🫶🏽👍🏽💜
You write this story as a book and that’s exactly how you reach the widest audience. The next steps are in this interview.💜
Wha a productive, life giving conversation! I've spent 60 years in the protestant church, and my roots there go.back since the 1600s, really. And I've always struggled with the idea of substitutionary atonement. John here articulates that struggle better than anybody I've heard. Yet I know how much the crucifixion informs my heart about the love of God and my access to it. " He loved us while we were yet enemies." Would we do that even for three days for an enemy? So they had access to the complete love of God?
Jesus was able to give himself completely to.others. yet never lose the Self. His expression of love informs my heart and directs my relationship with God and others.
I could keep listening all night. Love love this. Thx guys !
AWESOME podcast! At about 1 hour mark, wait for THE QUESTION for John. I screamed Yessss at the radio in the car!
I'm going to go back and see what THE QUESTION was for you!
Thank you John love you and Margi! Thank you for all you do for humankind!!
Thank you, John, for your voice, for helping people like myself who choose to thrive in uncertainty in regard to faith and religion. If Joseph Smith truly saw God and Jesus Christ, maybe it would have been best if he had stopped at "Join none of them." 😉
“ Nobody Really Knows “…..Never a truer statement.Great podcast…thanks guys…👍🏽
I was a Southern Baptist in the 1980’s. One Sunday morning pastor shared with us a study that was done by the Southern Baptist Convention. Southern Baptist Churches we’re loosing members. If I remember correctly, mostly people were just leaving religion, but for those that left for another faith, The Mormon Church was the number one church Southern Baptist churches were losing members to. Cue the warnings and education about the Mormon “Cult”… their words.
it would be interesting to track this with all the sexual abuse coming out in the SBC and LDS
John you have touched so many life’s.
Thanks for sharing your story with Christianity.. I believe that to be kind, mindfull, gentle and respectfull is more worth than any revelation, spiritual insight, calling, or even than to just follow any religion, guru or tradition. Many feel especially chosen because of what they follow, but people that simply try to be something "good" don't care so much about feeling chosen, they rather care about choosing what is good and show kindness and respect towards other people and their spiritual convictions.
So thankful to hear your dad told you what he told you but what I love so much is that your dad embodied do unto others as you want from them. The heart of what the reason Jesus came to say. Help others ahhhh thank you
My heart and soul loves this
And that is what I took from my Mormon upbringing.
I don't think anyone else can do Mormon Stories. Maybe that person will show up someday but for now it's only John.
No shorts- I love the long interviews.
John and Steven you are not alone. Many of us feel the same. We are done with the rigid doctrinal limitations of the religiosity of our faith. True faith needs doubts and hope and mystery.
I loved this show & I would definitely watch a part 2
John, you have a great voice and a personality and intellect that makes your podcasts so interesting and enjoyable. As I also went through a faith crisis as a Roman Catholic. As I’ve said before, I see a lot of similarities with how people who left the Morman faith realise that a lot of the teachings are false. I concluded that the way forward for me was to no longer be a member of any organised religion. I simply try to follow the teachings of Jesus ie to treat others as I wish to be treated “ Do onto others as you would have others do onto you”.
The kind of religion you guys are talking about is the kind of religion I am looking for.
So when you establish your church of goodness, I want to be a part of it. I've got some great stories about how good god has been to me and how how much better life has become since I listen only to God instead of letting other people or institutions tell me what gods will is for me.
Please write a book! I would absolutely read it. Like Steven, I am an Evangelical Christian who is fascinated by Mormonism. I have many Mormon friends myself. Im just a nobody lol. I have been listening to Mormon Stories for about a year and have learned so much! I love you all!
On the topic of ex-LDS memoirs, and some evangelical Christians, and ExMo’s at the beginning of the episode, you mentioned Lynn Wilder. I think you should have her on MS podcast sometime, along with her son, Micah. They have both written fantastic memoirs, and have great Mormon Stories.
John, I love the authenticity and transparency you bring. I’ve been soaking up your content and conversations as of late and really appreciate the phenomenal job you’ve done.
I was curious, along your journey have you ever studied the Feasts of the Lord and heard the theory that Jesus fulfilled the Spring Feasts during His First Coming and will fulfill the Fall Feasts at His Second Coming?
I’d write a book later… give this gig a few more years. Plenty of time for a book and will only be better.
I think you’d write a great book, I’d be curious to see your own story intertwined with lessons learned from these years of collecting others’ stories…but you serve a super important role through this medium. This has to be the priority, I think. My suggestion is to look for a partner on the book side, more than on the podcast/RUclips side. I mean, yes, take some pressure off by giving the interview mic over to Nemo, Gerardo, Jen or Margi from time to time, but more important is to find a co-writer who will craft the book with you and make that as light of a load as possible.
I'm obviously highly biased since my whole channel is about books but... of course John should write a book! I would love to see a book from him on the power of storytelling in the human religious experience, how to be a good listener, and how stories drive change in institutions
I would rather have podcasts than books, because I cannot read a book while I am working, but I can listen to podcasts. Also, because I am poor and I have a modicum of self-awareness, I can usually listen to podcasts for free, whereas books cost money.
John, Don’t take time off, please. We need you. Emulate Rachel Maddow wrote at least two books while keeping her daily program going.
I am a former evangelical/pentecostal Christian. Now atheist. Being atheist, for me, is not making the claim that there is no god(s), rather, I simply do not see the evidence of one or them. Steven is an evangelical and his praise of John is b/c John is undermining a faith that he believes is false. Easier to claim something is a 'ministry' when you agree with the person's ultimate goal to bring a religion believed to be false, to light. I find Steven's arguments and claims to be nearly as empty as the mormon's claims when it comes to a belief in a god. He says that god makes the final judgment. Of course. The traditional path is salvation is well known and evangelicals tend to believe that if you do not accept god, you will be damned. I also would like to know if Steven was actually an atheist or someone who simply was angry with god and tried to deny his existence. He admits to being angry with him/her/it. Not the same. Just some thoughts. Steven 'sounds' like a non-typical evangelical, but I only have this youtube to make any judgment. Why is Steven a Christian. More specifically, why is he an "evangelical" Christian and not one of the thousands of other sects? He says that he judges people based on their fruits. So....you don't have to be a Christian. Just a good person? Confusing theology that I have heard from Christians of from all sides.
John - the process of evolution in biology is NOT a random process. The mutations are random, but the natural selection is very ordered. You’ve interviewed plenty of biologists on here, so I was a little surprised to hear this old chestnut 🌰 coming from you.
My bad!!!
My Christianity is in my heart and guides my steps an encourages me to lead with love for all. I am black cis hetero Christian ally who can’t/won’t go to church because the current culture in the church feels oxymoronic to me as a Christ follower.
As an LGBT Christian, God bless you for that ❤️ I wish affirming churches were more religious or less political because they make me feel just as unwelcome sadly.
@@doubtingdennis If they just followed Jesus and left it at that, we would all be better for it.
John this is the book. Your Mormon story and all those that intertwine with yours, your parents, Grandparents, Margie etc.
❤️🙏
You would write an amazing book John. That is something I would so look forward to. I love watching you and your interviews, love the commentary and articulation you have and also getting to know all of the people you work with and I think publishing all of that on paper would only amplify your success in spreading this message you have for the world. If you were able to find the financial, mental, spiritual, and physical balance to be able to both host and write, that would be something I know I would support you in 100% and I know other supporters would too. And if you choose to take a break and let another host take the reigns don’t be worried. I think like Steven was getting at, you underestimate yourself and how many people want to hear the messages you put out so whoever you choose to host would be more than loved because YOU chose them! There’s also no rush. Do what you feel you’re called to when you’re called to do it. Your supporters will be behind you no matter what.
You two have great chemistry! Your discussions are super interesting and thought provoking.
Thanks!
1:24:30 MY FAVORITE PART! Thanks for being authentic and honest!!! Bravo!!
Fun Fact: Anthropologists estimate that at least 18,000 different gods, goddesses, etc. have been worshiped by humans since our species first appeared. There are still religions older than Christianity being practiced - including:
Zoroastrianism (10th - 5th century BCE) ...
Judaism (9th - 5th century BCE) ...
Jainism (8th - 2nd century BCE) ...
Confucianism (6th - 5th century BCE) ...
Buddhism (6th - 5th century BCE) ...
Taoism (6th - 4th century BCE)
I grew up studying the Bible and was a Hebrew/Greek Bible scholar in my 20's. Decades later... after beginning to realize how much we are ALL BRAINWASHED (in so many aspects), I asked myself: "Can the historical beginning of the Bible hold up to the same scrutiny I now use on politicians / agencies (FDA, CDC, etc) and on Big Pharma/Big Medicine, etc.?
I dug in on the TOPIC OF "WHO WROTE THE BIBLE?" and "HOW CAN WE PROVE IT?" with that same level of scrutiny - leaving off my "confirmation bias" that I had allowed for in my youth.
I encourage "believers" to do the same: Do this with fresh eyes... a beginners mind. Dig!!! Once you do, you will see "what is S A I D" (which are we are to "believe"... and not to "question" what we are "told"... we are just to put any uncertainty "on the shelf" and have "faith as a mustard seed" and simply "believe!!!!" (I did that as a kid with Santa Claus, too.)
What you will find... is the "narrative" or the stories we are told... and you may find supposed "documents" that supposedly prove the authentication of supposed first writings, etc.. (Be sure to look at all the fabricated "historical" documents... ones that we are TOLD they are real... ergo "proof" and why we should believe. Each "religion" has their "narratives" and their "proofs" about their original documents from 'God' - and we are so willing to accept them.
Then, look at all the transcriptions / translations over the thousands of years... by various "believers", etc. (As you do, note how many "religions" are run by MEN and subjugate women and children to being "lesser" and resulting in oppression and abuse. Think about that with a critical mind.)
THEN, recall the effects of the child's game "Gossip" or "Chinese Whispers" and think about how you've seen that play out over and over in life - and get twisted to meet the objectives of those who thrive on POWER, CONTROL and M O N E Y.
ie: ". . . Although the objective is to pass around the message without it becoming garbled along the way, part of the enjoyment is that, regardless, this usually ends up happening. Errors typically accumulate in the re-tellings, so the statement announced by the last player differs significantly from that of the first player. . ." en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chinese_whispers
Just something to think about.
Who knows?
Every watch the movie "The Matrix"?
The criteria is the 10 commandments, truth and love, John. At the cross Jesus gave his life to save us from being separated from him for eternity, not because he stood up for his beliefs, but because he loves us. You are one of us.
That’s always nice to hear. ❤️
Your spiritual journey resonates with me. Shane Vaughn of First Harvest Ministries located in Mississippi has videos that answered so many questions for me. It is not what we do, it is what our Heavenly Father is doing in us. Jesus (Yashuah) is the pattern son that we are to follow, not any man made religion. Keep seeking. It is so worth it to come into the change that our Heavenly Father has planned for us. Endure to secure.
Would a Buddhist monk that had lived his whole life in peace and Solitude go to hell because he didn't accept Jesus Christ as his personal savior? There are people that say: "yes". 🤷
Hey John! I just wanted to thank you for your take on the Resurrection and and the divinity of Christ. After leaving Mormonism, It surprised me how many ex Mormons in the podcast/social media world- RFM, Bill Reel, Nuancehoe, brittney Hartley, Allan Mount, John Larsen- seem to take a firm atheist stance. I’ve been delving into a lot of books about the life and divinity of Christ, and while I do doubt his Resurrection, I feel like an “I don’t know” is the best stance to take. Why do so many ex Mormons seem so firm on their stance that Jesus was not divine or Resurrected? Yes it seems doubtful due to the lack of evidence, but to adamantly say that he was not confuses me. Maybe I’m missing something
I would totally read John’s story in a heartbeat. I don’t know what to do about the time problem, but if you could work it out I would even pre-order. It’s not even an adoration thing (though I do have a lot of respect for you), I just think you’re a really interesting person and I would love to hear about your internal dialogue.
I nominate Nemo if there's a way he can grow his brand at the same time! Obviously I'd say Gerardo and Jen but they would have to go full time and that does not seem possible based on your comments. Yes much younger and different style but he come across extremely professional and thoughtful. Anyway hope you find somebody.
I would prefer Gerardo, John Larsen, or Nemo (my preference in descending order). However, if Gerardo already has full-time job, he might not be interested. And, I suspect John Larsen would not be interested.
I'm totally in on John and Steven's all encompassing mega church! ❤ And I love the discussion.
One interview can truly touch the vacancy in a wandering soul…waking from the control of religion…
John, you have got to get Jennette McCurdy on the podcast. Apparently she grew up Mormon and left the church and has had a pretty traumatic life mostly because of her mother and recently released her book about her life. She would be great!
I like John's openess to all beliefs, yet his no nonsense forward understanding of Jesus & Christianity. Thank you for sharing all you did in this episode! Totally agree with John on the "deadness" of temple ordinances, yet ignore or not prioritize those in need. I find Mormons miss the REALITY of the here & now ( I did too as a Mormon)!
"I am not the kind of person that reduces experiences to neurochemicals" - John I know you're a fellow psychologist so I hope I'm not saying something you already know (and I also fully admit I haven't watched the whole 2 hours yet) but in the contextual behavioral science (ACT basically) world we call the attempt to do that "radical reductionism" and I think it's such an important point! Every time you reduce something to something else - well sociology is just psychology which is just chemistry which is just physics which is just math - you LOSE really important meaningful contexts about whatever you were just reducing (behavior, for example). Sorry I know that's not really the point of this particular video but I always love it when radical reductionism shows up and being able to have conversations around it! :)
OMG @RevolutionUtena! I'm so thrilled that a CBS/ACT person is listening to my show and commenting!
John, being saved is between you and God. You cannot say whether someone is saved or not BUT no one can say if you’re saved or not. As a Christian, I run from anyone that is more concerned about whether a person is saved or not then living out their own salvation. I also run from anyone that claims their “religion” is the only true faith.
Running will keep you in shape.....spiritually!
Radio Free Mormon is the only person with the depth and appeal to guest host Mormon Stories for an extended period of time. :)
I am grateful and admire both of you gentlemen. I am a Oneness Pentecostal who has been having dialogues with LDS missionaries for a while. You both are great examples of how to have meaningful discussions with people from different perspectives. I honor John for his years of sacrifice. I would say I am grateful for the tone he has taken in these conversations. I would say that salvation is not about you earning anything through worthiness- that’s not the Gospel. You can’t earn grace through good works. God may very well be directing and leading John in some ways. I would say ultimately though God wants to give all people salvation through faith in Christ. We are commanded in Acts 2:38 to repent, be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins and receive the gift of the Holy Ghost. I would agree there is no human who has the right to condemn anyone. I would say I want to see people filled with the Holy Ghost speaking with tongues, transformed from the inside out and living empowered by grace rather than trying to earn it. Anyone can be filled with the Holy Ghost if they have faith in Christ, repent and ask Jesus to come live inside you. Serving people, radical dramatic work to help others find peace etc. is most definitely a part of living for God but they are not to earn anything. They are to glorify the Christ who empowers you to live righteously. I would say the evidence of the willingness of the disciples to die saying they saw Christ resurrected is a good piece of evidence for Christianity. They went to the very place Jesus was killed to declare He had been risen and risk it all. It is worth betting everything on. I love you all and just wanted to share another perspective here. You all are doing amazing work and I know you are making a huge difference for society.
I love both of you and John I’m so with you regarding religion. I felt like you were reading my mind.
Angels and jelly beans and lollipops and choirs!! Love it!!! Sounds like a country song.
Why not do two interviews in one week, but post them weekly (so one gets a staggered release) so you can take every other week off to write?
John Dehlin, I am horrified that anybody from any religious background would dare signal to you that you are a bad person or that you are going to hell or that you are going to be punished by God for not subscribing to the 'right' group.
I totally understand your righteous indignation at that.
Totally.
And I happen to be a 'born-again' Christian.
Please keep calling out hypocrisy when you encounter it. 😭
Has more good been done in the name of Christ? Or more harm? Open question as I don't know the answer, but I'd submit that it's the latter. You are good John. No need to attribute that to God, or Christianity.
Margi can fill in for you on your sabbatical! She’s awesome too.
Margi's interviews always really make me think about myself and my life and growth and how I approach the world. ❤ (And I've never even been Mormon...)
@@katesanders2219 same here! 😁
Steven. When you say prepare to hear another voice please give me your method that you use to determine how that is different than normal human cognitive choices. To be clear. How can you differentiate from the myriad of all tensions and somehow laser focus on Jesus?
Love you John ❤ If my mouth could sufficiently articulate what I think/believe/feel in my mind and heart it would be all the words that you share (so far in every episode I have listened to, you are my voice). Thank you for expressing what I can’t and for the support/healing that it is bringing to my mind and spirit and life. Especially when you are real and honest about your own faults. It is so refreshing to hear someone be able to speak the truth about themselves. My heart goes out to you for your courage and what you endure by being vulnerable and doing work like this. I can only imagine and I’m so grateful. I’m a born and raised Idaho mormon with strong pioneer ancestors and a majority active believing family who for the most part are still loving and sometimes accepting of family who are no longer involved in the church. It is so hard and painful to sort through the conditioning from growing up in the church. There are deep deep fears rooted in this religion and recognizing that has started this journey for me. I feel both so excited to know that there’s this whole life I get to do discover now but to have been given the keys to unlock my own prison cell, I do find myself just standing here in front of the open door trying to figure out 🤷🏻♀️ What’s next? Where do I go? Who even am I aside from this identity the church created for me? Because I have worked to suppress and replace her my entire life. How do I even take this first step out of the mental prison cell because it’s such a foreign feeling… All these thoughts and feelings are complex. Thank you for representing people like me/us.
Anyway, much love for you
KD
Go on a sabbatical for three months I think that’s a great idea and it is half written or even more just a matter of picking and choosing what material you draw from. But I love books and I would put it in my library And then listen to the audio over and over again.
Yes indeed. We need Jesus
I'm sad the Sandra Tanner event was closed to the public. There are many of us who have anxiously been waiting for that event since it was first suggested years ago :(
That made me sad too!!!
@@mormonstories there is no reason we can't schedule a more public event as at some point, as long as Sandra is cool with that.
God is working on you both. I is all about him . We must be humble. That is Christ sample to all us.
“There was only one Christian, and he died on the cross.” Nietzsche
You are living a Christ led life whether you say so or not. This sparked my consciousness completely. This is how I try to live my life also. I had a faith crisis in my career when I realized that teaching was sucking my soul. I loved the kids. I loved teaching but could not abide the politics and criticism and non leadership that corrupt the bonds of teacher student interaction. It seemed like all the important decisions were opposite of the necessary changes to help the children. I was tired of fighting the good fight only to be deep sixed by administration.
The book is a memoir! Haha pleaseee it would be so good.
Johns book should be called Every Man Knows My History
John's favorite Mormon Stories moments. The end.
1:31:14 John: I wanna preface this by saying that I really enjoy your podcast. It's really helped me to understand my Mormon friends and neighbors better. I think you're doing amazing work. I love the intellectual scope and logic seeking discussion.
I would also like to address your question. My thought, as a "Christian", is that from a RELIGIOUS standpoint you are just like MANY "Christians"... Doing all the "right" and admirable things.
But, as you list the things you want, it sounds as though you are missing that divine connection - the RELATIONSHIP with the Father. When we connect with the Divine through prayer, worship, quietness, meditation, etc., we feel His love. True love. In the Bible, Jesus says that His commandment is to LOVE one another. And, personally, I can only do that through seeking His heart for the person directly in front of me, listening, and serving as He directs. And, to be honest, I'm often surprised at both what He asks me to do and what I perceive to be the miniscule part of the ripple effect that causes. For me, when I serve based on my own understanding, it's often unfulfilling and un-impactful.
As far as theology goes, I'm stumped and not inclined to debate anyone on anything. I mean, I have ideas... But, I'm still working on getting that commandment I talked about above mastered.
I'll just be out here, listening to people, loving people, and believing that God will give them what's insight they need and desire.
Love, grace, and peace.
I'm fond of the Red Letter Christian idea. I'll share my view here. To me, spirituality and religion are like smelling flowers vs pressing them in a book. If you read "scriptures" and a "member" cooperating in a church, you may well be firm, you're saved, and so on, as firm as a solid block of wood, the cross, etc. but if you earnestly try to heed the words of Jesus, Jesus himself says you are on a "rock", as much as Peter might have been the "rockbed" for the church. If you are sitting on a pile of riches and ignoring the poor then perhaps it's more like sand or trying to get to the rock by passing through an eye of the needle, but that is the house of sand...which perishes and can be robbed...treasure on earth.
I have lived the opposite as John's experience... evangelical Christian growing up in a 85% LDS population. Love my LDS friends but our faith beliefs don't align, we are friends in spite of the differences.
If god wanted us to know him he would tell us in unambiguous language that we would understand. And he would tell everyone, not just a small group of uneducated people who didn't write it down for 200 years.
Voltaire said it best..."Religion began when the first scoundrel met the first fool." The human race has an incessant need for understanding and meaning in all aspects. When there are no answers to some questions people will accept any ideas or leaders who can fill those needs. Found it ironic when John indicated he and Margi were most concerned about not being able to raise healthy moral children without religion. There was a study published in 2015 that showed a households increasing religiousness (no matter the type of religion) created children that were less altruistic and compassionate with others. Religion does not impart strong moral values, it often undermines developing strong moral values as is seen daily.
I was glad to hear John say ‘in my opinion.’
I think Steve Pynakker would make an excellent temporary host for Mormon Stories if he were interested. I can't think of a better fit in my opinion.
Thanks! I think I could do a week of episodes to help contribute to John writing a book.
1:47:57 interesting take about the "second great disappointment" and a "post-apocalyptic Christianity".
To organise, and sustain a church for everyone sounds magnificent, but I have a strong feeling very few people wile like it. Sad - very sad!
John, you need to look into Unitarian Universalist if you haven't. It is the closest thing I have found to what you are talking about. It's just not focused on any one diety or one religion. It tries to focus on taking the good you find from all religions. It's been pretty interesting to me. I will never give myself 100 percent to another religion, but that seems to be the montra of this church. Just grow in the way that is good for you.
Nevermind, as soon as I posted I heard you talk about trying that.
I have listened to many podcasts of stories of mormon programming. I'm confused about what John's podcast is all about. You have to go through hours of every thought of every guest, and I am yet to find out if anyone found truth. I don't know the belief of the host or what the goal is of this podcast. I hope to find out soon.
Jesus is the SON of GOD, and IS GOD - Steven makes some good points
If we wanted to be technically accurate, modern "Christians" are really Paulists, ie followers of the teaching of Paul as HE understood and interpreted the teachings of Jesus Christ. Had his brother James and/or Peter prevailed, the sect would have evolved quite differently with much less Greek influence.
John… you are the energy…write daily …
Jesus did kick ass sometimes. It was necessary to make a point.
I love this podcast