Thank you for doing a video on the need for bigger brakes with jeep mods. Lifts change design angle weight and tire size are huge factors in needing up graded brakes. I recently up graded my brakes it really should have been the first mod. Please continue to push this point. I've been a fan of your videos from the beginning now this platform could save lives by making jeep owners aware of this major need. Plus they are awesome off road!!
RobDTom In a perfect world and on paper. Like Ryan said though, the real world factor you’re missing is that Kevin and I no longer hit 8th, or sometimes even 7th, gear. Whereas Michael does.
@@LiteBrite Overall the numbers arent huge in difference but add city driving and then more load on the tranny over the life of the jeep youll burn yours up faster. Plus, your 1st gear crawling ratio would be ever better ;)
When they added ABS brakes to our CHP patrol vehicles, they took us out and taught us to NOT modulate the brake pedal to prevent the ABS system from doing it's job. You were only using 70-80% of your stopping power if you were feathering the brake pedal to "stay out of the anti-lock system" like I think you said. In a vehicle that has ABS, you put the pedal to the floor and ignore the pulsing, grinding, kick back of the pedal and everything else that happens with ABS. Do another test on your own. On a back street with NO traffic, stop with YOUR way of feathering. Do the same thing with PEDAL TO THE FLOOR and measure the difference. You did yourself an injustice by feathering the pedal. That being said, YES you do need to upgrade your brakes with 38's. BIG TIME!!! I am on 37's and LOVE my Dynatrac ProGrip 4 wheel brake upgrade system. It stops better than my wifes stock 2 door with 33's.
Kevin Williams Modulating the brake pedal when equipped with ABS doesn’t make stopping distances shorter it makes them longer. It’s not an argument of ABS vs non ABS it’s about you confusing the ABS system on the vehicle by modulating brakes in this type of test. If you have ABS you just mash the pedal for quickest stop. It’s like this by design. Don’t let your experience with non ABS vehicles blind you. This is especially true if your vehicle is sliding on snow or ice you don’t pump/modulate ABS brakes it actually makes them less effective. Try for yourself though don’t take my word for it.
Kevin Williams I am familiar with what you mean about threshold braking. Threshold braking is for non ABS brakes and it is the practice of not mashing the brakes and optimally stopping on the verge of traction. In this case with ABS I’m suggesting you didn’t do your stopping distance any favors with this technique. If you didn’t get a little bit of ABS reaction I’d assume the brakes weren’t used to their capacity. Every ABS vehicle I’ve ever driven stops faster by using constant force. Only time I modulate is normal slowing down but I don’t need everything from the brakes then. I drove non-ABS vehicles for years and I get that you formed a habit but that doesn't mean it's right for the situation. Hopefully in an emergency you just mash the brakes. Either way the brake upgrade will be a very good idea. If you think you’re doing right then by all means brother keep on doing you. Give the two a try though. ✌️
Kevin, Watch your video. RUBITRON'S braking system has not locked his tires. It has brought the system to the MAXIMUM BRAKING EFFICIENCY and maintained it there. That is why you hear his tires starting to make noise against the asphalt. They are still rotating and steering. The MAXIMUM braking power occurs just before the tires lock up. It is the job of the ABS to bring each tire INDIVIDUALLY to that point and prevent the brake pedal from placing any more pressure on the pads causing lock up and loss of control. IF you are applying just enough pressure to stop your vehicle without getting to the point of ALMOST locking up the tires, then there is still some stopping power left in your system. To do a FAIR COMPARISON, you need to allow your ABS system to do it's job and THEN COMPARE!! You are giving yourself too much credit for your ability to out perform the ABS system which modulates each brake individually with your foot pressure on ONE PEDAL. You still had more braking power left vs. if you had let the ABS do it's job. Believe me, I have seen the difference from an EXPERTS trying to out think the ABS system and letting the system do the job it does so very well. TEST IT SOLO with just your vehicle and another video..
Kevin, Scenario: You are in a race going through a long sweeping right hand turn. Your vehicle is leaning to the left and loading more weight on the left tires and less weight on the right due to the physics of the turn. How are you going to make a maximum breaking application with only one pedal that you can push. All you can do is press/feather it enough to NOT lock up the right tires. Correct? The ABS system monitors each of the 4 tires individually and allows enough brake fluid pressure to get to the pistons of the caliper and bring it to the brink of locking up but not beyond. Each tire should be starting to lock up and then releasing, locking up and releasing approx. 20 times per second. There is no way that a vehicle which has ABS braking system can stop faster with someone feathering the brakes to prevent the ABS from kicking in, vs allowing the ABS system to work as designed. I realize that you have extensive racing experience without ABS and with ABS, but you obviously have not had the experience of having an ABS expert show you (prove to you) how dangerous an extra 20-30 feet of stopping distance in a panic stop can be. Please, for the safety of your subscribers, do a video comparison on Step Child so the people who follow your channel can make up their own mind whether they are going to feather their brakes and emulate you, or they are going to allow the ABS system do it's job.
@@Rocscrawler If you look up Threshold braking, it's supposed to be a better braking method than letting your ABS kicks in, provide. you know you car/brake/tires enough to max. out it's braking ability. I was able to do that pretty well when I was pushed braking to it's limit when I had my STi & Carrera with summer tires, but not so much with my Jeep JLU so far.
So true, older automatic jeeps came with 3.73's (I think) and the manuals had 4.10's, so the jump from 3.73 to 5.11 makes a HUGE difference, especially when you literally only have half of the gears (4 vs 8), and you go from 28in tires to 38s (vs 33s to 38s)
Truth. When I changed my 96' Chevy 1500 gears from 3.73 to 4.58 I actually increased my mileage because I made it easier for the engine to push the truck with the 35"s and stock 4 speed Auto. That is until I got up to 75MPH, then my mileage went down because the engine was turning so much faster.
Like others said that soft top is lighter than the hard top BUT it also offers better aerodynamics since it is sloped at the back there is going to be less turbulent drag behind the soft top jeep vs the hard top. weight difference from lack of passengers and gear etc. etc. All of the little things add up.
Great informative video! Kevin, 👍 for helping the lady changing her tire. You raised a great point about carrying a proper jack to change a tire, specially with a raised Jeep. I am going to see to that today! Thanks you guys for another great video.
Its probably been said, but the gear comparison sounds just right for your outcome. The weight of Stepchild probably is what scrubbed the mileage and acceleration (at speed) compared to Pepe. I was hoping to see a drag race as I’m sure Pepe would walk it easy. Pound for pound, Stepchild would get better mileage and top speed with 4:10s and Pepe would have better off the line and torque. More power & acceleration = more gear, better mileage & speed = less gear. The weight is what balanced it out, since Jumping from 4:10 to 5:13 isn’t that super big of a jump.
Brakes FOR SURE. Cruise control also is horrible for mileage since your engine is accelerating more. With 5.13 gears his is accelerating slightly harder in cruise and has more deceleration when him/the cruise control let off the gas.
you want floor jack and an extension on the jacking point and a way to mount it. the hilift will hurt you if you arent careful. pro eagle makes them or you could put a skid/mounting plate and the proeagle extension on a harbor freight jack
5:29 listen to how much later your buddies Jeep down shifts and goes. You guys got the jump this time and couldn’t make any gap. When he got the jump he was gone. You guys just aren’t roll racers and that’s okay. Both have to be in manual at a good RPM (to be in the right gear and not wait for the trans to bring you to the gear you need) and switch to auto after you floor it(to let the trans handle the shifts). Has to also happen at the same time or we’ll never know the difference. Give RUclips a better JL gearing test please! You guys have a lot of similarities between the Jeeps give us the real test!
I'm guessing regardless of insignificant weight, the Stepchild will get better gas mileage; because of gearing. Aerodynamics is huge; so, Michael drafting will help him save & get better mileage. Just thinking about Newton's Laws of Motion. Weight only factors in when it's a lot of stopping & going. Once the weight is going, the gearing and aero are going to factor in heavier than weight.
A trailer however, with more drag from the trailer tires will definitely cause a significant reduction in gas mileage, more wear & tear on the transmission too. Yeah, get some carbon fiber brakes to help with stopping.
Bottle Jack is great for carrying around for Jeep tire problems. Plenty strong and tall units available. Skip the Hilift for the new Arb trail Jack if budget allows. Always opt for trailer brakes. Surge brakes are ok. Go for actual electric brakes. Tekonsha Prodigy RF wireless brake controller was recently tested at a different RUclips channel. Or, opt for hardwire unit. Never skip on brakes.
That was cool to see, real world testing! Yup my 01-7.3, F350 4x4 dually has 410's it was the only way I could get a posy rear axle! didn't wanna get stuck with my overhead camper loaded up in the mountains... MPG drops over 65 an up...( braking test! ) I'm runnin' 35" AT's on my 2012 JKU and I would really like to upgrade my brakes now more than ever! after seeing the difference! WOW!!! GREAT VIDEO!!! BIG THANKS TO YA!!! PS. I got my NX Bestop last week, thanks for the $150.00 discount you saved me LiteBrite :)
I used to do a fair amount of drag racing and it's hard to beat higher ( 4.10) gears from a roll if your engine will pull the vehicle. From a dead stop (5.13) ratio would be an edge. I'm surprised though that the (4.10) gears still work so well with a 38" tire. Which in fact shows how good an all around ratio the (4.10) really is. I think the 40" tires will kill it and a re gear will become more important......enter super or turbocharger!! Fun stuff!
For highway driving, aero dynamic drag and speed (rolling resistance and transmission heat) is usually what governs how much fuel you use. And also weight a bit, if there's a lot of hills/mountains - Though highways usually try to go around those. Edit : I saw a bunch say "but he would use more gas because of higher RPM's" … which is both true and false. Modern engines with direct fuel injection will lean out the air/fuel mixture when they are under light load, so that helps. Also, the Jeep JL can be had with an 8 speed automatic (which I think they both have) - And with closer gear ratios, Michael is likely to have a gear that fits his optimal RPM range, at highway speeds, again curbing excessive fuel use. Something like a 500 RPM difference is not going to make a big difference in fuel usage, with a modern engine. Mind you, if you have an old engine with a carburettor, low RPM is king !
Cool test, but maybe the benefits would be hauling around a trailer boat etc and hill pulls. If your guys in Az heading out Payson pull your test up the long hill going along side the rim that would be interesting. As much travel you guys do I’m sure you come up on a lot of hills. Also would his pinion gear be weaker do to a smaller teeth count? Like you said about his four low try swapping vehicles out over the same object and see if Kevin thinks it’s a benefit.
The biggest benefit on the highway to any gears is to keep the engine running in the band that's most efficient. Changing tires often makes the engine lug more and makes it less efficient, re gearing can bring it back inline. All engines have a sweet spot where they do their best. most people don't re gear for highway, they re gear for off road and deal with other areas of lowered performance. Also, stop trying to beat ABS, it'll stop quicker than you can. :) Also, get trailer brakes.
I knew you would get hooked! I learned a long time ago that you can have much more fun when you know you don't have to drive your "Toy" home. Too many days stranded in the desert cause I broke something being crazy (stupid). :-)
Im soooo pumped up.. We leave at noon tomorrow 3/7/19 and are headed to Colorado springs cant wait to see all the awsome things out there and hopefully get to go play at the ram offroad park going to be a blast.. Thanks for the inspiration to get out there and do things... 😁😁👍👍😁😁
So, you had a difference of 1.3 gallons used. What was the actual travel distance so that you can measure MPG empirically? Also, on the stopping test, there is obviously a difference in stopping power. However, one must consider total weight on that test as well. The hard top does add weight to the Stepchild.
4.10 will get better gas mileage on innerstate the engine at lower rpm but will be slower getting up to speed ur added weight is why u both ran out around the same time. Should compare the rpms of both jeeps on innerstate with diffent gears.
My Jeep wj came with 3:55 and 29” tires. I’m now on 35’s and 4:56 . Using gear and tire calculations, this combo put me right back to stock performance. I see lifted mall crawlers all the time On huge tires. When I ask “people what gears are you running with those _______?” I get all sorts of responses. I even had people say,” I don’t mess with the engine , so it’s still stock” WTf lmao 😂
Love your channel and I was wondering where the you guys got the black decal on the top of your hood. I've been looking for one and can't find one for the rubicon. I live in Florida and sometimes the glare is fierce. Best of luck to you guys.
Re gear and brake upgrade thats a definite upgrade for me! Running 37s or bigger i would go with a Nitro 5.38 diff ratio and 4 pistons or 6 pistons brake upgrade with larger diameter rotors. Rather than the one piston jk brakes and 2 pistons JL.
5.38 is unnecessary in a JL Rubicon with the 8 speed. Maybe 40”+. Really for 38s probably only need to bump to 4.88 with the 8 speed and that 4:1 low for crawling. I ran stock 4.10s on my old 07 2dr JK 6 speed for awhile. It needed more on the road but was alright. The 4:1 and 4.4:1 first in the manual trans made crawling a non issue. Gears certainly help though not denying that. The JL doesn’t hold the same gear requirements as the 5 speed auto JK.
With 5.13’s the engine doesn’t have to work as hard, and with the 4.10’s your putting more of a load on the motor to help you accelerate. Add a bunch of weight to the 4.10’s the motor has a huge load it’s trying to push. If you ride a bike uphill in a harder gear, your going to get tired faster, then of you had the bike in an easier gear.
Awesome video...very informative and wonderful cuz of real world driving....can't believe the different stopping distance...Jelly was crashed..hard day for her 😀...as always wonderful and looking forward to your next video......definitely something to look into...the brakes will help you out alot.......Safe travels
You can add electric brakes to most trailers pretty easily; for a 3500lb axle you should be able to do it for less than $150-200. etrailer.com has kits and install videos; adding trailer brakes will be a big help.
Regearing is more for acceleration and torque not for highway gas milage - total weight unless EXTREME won't make a huge difference since Jeeps have nearly no aerodynamics. Regearing can make a gas milage difference as long as you're in stop and go traffic. But highway is all for the lower gears... Note that in 2012 + all rubicons with autos were built with 3.73s not 4.10 because of gas milage (unless special ordered)
I have been running 38s with 513 gears for the last year or so and yes I can see how it could affect the mpg some.... Now I could be wrong but.... I think the more important thing about the gear ratio is long term wear on the transmission.. I will say that having 410s will make it easier if you want to go back to a 35in tire in the future, I would need to regear to drop back down. I just dropped back down to a 37 and while its only an inch, it is crazy how much difference I feel in the acceleration.
I put 4:88 gears and the Mopar big brake kit on my 16' JK running 37" Mickey Thompson Baja P3's and a 3.5" Metalcloak lift and they both made a huge difference! They made it way more fun to drive too. The Superchips tuner I got for it helped too. You can change the pedal response with the Superchips tuner so that alone makes a huge difference with the JK. Plus all of the different tunes it has. Awesome Jeeps tho guys! Keep up the vids!
The 5:13s will be slower on the rolling race you did. The rpms will max out sooner than the 4:10s. The only benefit of he 5:13s are take offs and low gear crawling.
when y'all are back in CO, do a test side by side going up that long road near the Eisenhower tunnel, just to see how different the gear ratio is between the two of yall
I don't know if I would re-gear running 4.10's. I'm on 3.73 gears with 35's and I definitely need to re-gear. I'm not thinking fuel economy as much as performance. My engine is really struggling on-road, especially on the highway. I'm doing 4.88's sometimes this Summer.
The lower gear ratio (5.13) will give you more strength (power) for climbing over obstacles where the higher gear ratio (4.10) lower the rpm’s at speed. That leads to technically lower gas mileage for the 4.10s. At low speed and over obstacles, I bet it would be opposite. Sounds like a good hypothesis to test.
I would recommend a bottle jack for you, safer, compact, inexpensive. You only need to jack up the axle a couple of inches to get your tire off the ground as opposed to a high lift where you have to go more than full droop to raise a tire.
a floor jack with a raised lifting point would be even better. theres kits to make the harbor freight ones have a skid plate so itll work in sand and dirt and it also helps it securely mount in your vehicle
Gears are rotating levers. It is, by far, the best bang for your buck mod you will ever do to you Jeep. Most neglect this because it’s an expensive and complicated job. Do yourself a favor with the money you have for that chrome gas cap and those flame stickers and save it for gears.
Lite Brite Ok thanks! Im guessing they must wear down faster because of the soft rubber. Im trying to decide if I should put them on my 94 toyota pickup. Hoping if I do I might get a bit longer life out of them due to the lighter weight truck.
Not convinced regearing is an absolute must, BUT bigger brakes is definitely needed once you go with larger tires. Looking forward to the trailer reveal.
Gears won’t help with fuel economy they actually make it worse technically but since there’s 8 speeds it will actually go into 8 unlike the 410s. So overall you’ll probably see close to around the same mpg.
Fixitall329 Exactly. Kevin and I no longer see our 8th gear, so that evens it out quite a bit. At 75mph, we’re both sitting right around 2500rpm, but we’re in 7th while Michael is in 8th.
Last time I was in the shop of 4-wheel parts they had a jeep with both diffs apart in one of their bays. I ask, and the mechanic replied that the owner lifted it, put large tires on it and drove it till both diffs gave up. They were rebuilding and re-gearing them. More braking - More Better!
U guys running the same tires PEPE / Stepchild? Just got 37" Patagonia's on my Ram PW and I've noticed a 2mph fuel increase in savings over my old 35" Cooper STT Pros! Ok, never mind, 8 minutes in to the video u said that you were. Lol
A way to do it tell him in 4 grear or 5 if you got it and each drive at 3,000 rpm and then you run away from him. So you stay at 3,000 rpm and have him the same speed as you . Then ask him what his rpm is. The higher you rpm the more gas you used
That was a really nice thing y’all did stopping to help that lady. Some 2x12s cut into squares for your bottle jack may do the trick. I’m going to do this for my Power Wagon. Nearly a foot under the differential makes tire changes sketchy.
I recently bought my second jeep with 120000 miles. Rolling 35” tires since new on the stock 3.73 gears. The transmission was shot and needed a complete rebuild. I also did a regear to 4.56’s to regain stock performance. No significant change in gas mileage. Way better torque, acceleration, power up a rock etc. for longevity of the jeep gears are way worth it!
new arb jack is much safer than a hilift also not as tall and heavy and who's axial CRC Jeep a mini step child ? side note if your towing gears will help
Just curious about the intake and exhaust. Are they also similar for MPG? And what about seat of the pants feel when driving both? Do they feel similar driving and wheeling in similar conditions?
The exhaust air bag lift or pretty cool you just hook them to your tailpipe of your car and it's a jack like a big ball that lifts it up there pretty cool just got to be careful with them they work pretty good for getting unstuck out of the sand just throw them underneath the Jeep and it helps lift it up throw sand Down Under your tires and get out of there it is especially helps when somebody sinks to the axles
Stock brakes ain’t made for 38’s. Get the power stop brakes - $350. Gears depend on lots of things. But 4:10’s with 38’s is putting lots of strain on your engine, trans, really everything.
@@madmaxinthunderdome winchs can and do break, at the worst time, so hilift still worth its weight in gold. Those that are afraid of them just don't know how to use them or don't maintain them properly.
If I get this right , you traveled 2 1/2 hours on a full tank of gas, at 75 miles an hour on cruise control . Peppa’s Jeep and Step Child Jeep drove 187.5 miles. But here’s the difference on gas miles , Peppa’s Jeep got 11.192 miles to the gallon of gas , and Step Child’s got 10.336 miles to the gallon. Before gassing Peppa’s Jeep he had left in his tank 4.747 gallons , and Step Child had 3.361 gallons of gas left. The weight in both Jeeps gave you less miles then factor tires at 21.5 gasoline of gas you would of gotten at 20 miles to a gallon , you would of got 451.1 miles to a tank . But with the gallons left in the tank before getting gas Peppa’s would of gotten another 53.128 miles and you would of gotten on Step Child 34.739 miles , and the difference of 19.389 miles Peppa’s Jeep could go before emptying the fuel tank. If I got this right please let me know.
Which is allright for an offroad monster, like the Stepchild. But imagine having to daily it for a long commute ? In that case the MPG is horrendous ! Heck, I used to drive a panel van in the city, and that still got 28 mpg! Offroad vehicles are almost as thirsty as the RUclips commenters when Brittany wears skimpy clothing!!
Cool video, really like the real world testing. Rubitron is one awesome jl. Definitely upgrade your brakes if you're adding power. Me, I'm getting ready to install a supercharger, woohoo!
More rpms does not mean more gas. It's all about engine load. For example a vehicle traveling uphill at 2000 rpm will burn more fuel than a truck engine braking downhill at 4000rpm. while rpms are high the fuel needed to maintain them is entirely different.
everyone keeps bringing up the top but i believe hard tops give better mileage despite the weight. lots of airflow problems with a bouncing soft top especially at 75mph. assuming you went about 300mi on the tank i got a difference of only 1.4 mpg.
The gears make a difference in the mileage but... i don't know if it'll be that big; however, good brakes make a big difference in safety, in a very bad situation could be the difference between life and death. I hope that all of you never be in that situation on the road; have a great week!.
Awesome real world testing. I have an 06 LJ Rubi on 35's with 4.10 and 6 speed and I plan to go to 37's so I will probably have to go to 5.13's but for sure I need more brakes my stock brakes suck!!!!!
I think all you have proven is that you can run a much lower gear set 5.13's or 5.38's and it does not effect much of anything due to the 8 speed transmission. What it does give you is a much lower crawl ratio. In other jeeps with 4 speed or 5 speed transmissions lower gears would make your highway cruising rpms so high you would kill an engine and or burn a lot of fuel. The 8 speeds have pretty much made the jeeps far more driveable on the highway with modifications whereas before regearing was necessary.
How does it not make since though? He’s got less stress with his 5.13 at low speed. But if you guess are up to about 45-50 your 38s are rolling fine to where his 5.13s are running at higher rpms.
With y'all going Wheeling the way y'all do I would recommend getting trailer brakes when you go down a hill with a load you'll definitely will being glad to have them you don't want the trailer pushing you down the hill or off a cliff
I did 5.13 in my JK after 37s. Much better, shifts smoother. Very torquey in 4low. Teraflex BBK front and rear (alcon and baer a "little" out of my budget) works awesome. Peruse AEV jack base. Raises stock jack 3.5" and has a footprint the fits the stock jack. Nor will it maim or kill you. Unless Brit throws it at your head, but it's plastic so it won't hurt.....too much.
Try driving around town in stop and go traffic for a tank and see the MPG difference. I'll bet thats where it will really show the difference between gearing.
Your rigs are also aerodynamically different. Michael’s soft top has that notch back design. I’m not sure if that hurts or helps fuel economy, but it’s certainly different.
Also some differences in the fenders between their's and Michael's as well. I'm sure Michael's more open flares catch additional air and thus create aerodynamics with more turbulence.
Thank you for doing a video on the need for bigger brakes with jeep mods. Lifts change design angle weight and tire size are huge factors in needing up graded brakes. I recently up graded my brakes it really should have been the first mod. Please continue to push this point. I've been a fan of your videos from the beginning now this platform could save lives by making jeep owners aware of this major need. Plus they are awesome off road!!
I would say the gearing has more to do with performance off road. Lot less strain on drive line
Your 4.10 gears give you *better* mileage at cruising speed not worse.
RobDTom unless you lose your last 1-2 gears entirely. Go uphill and it just screams all the way up..
agreed, basically rpms in the low on freeway is the ticket. City driving would be different
@@MoonyJohn Exactly
RobDTom In a perfect world and on paper. Like Ryan said though, the real world factor you’re missing is that Kevin and I no longer hit 8th, or sometimes even 7th, gear. Whereas Michael does.
@@LiteBrite Overall the numbers arent huge in difference but add city driving and then more load on the tranny over the life of the jeep youll burn yours up faster. Plus, your 1st gear crawling ratio would be ever better ;)
4.88 gears and a Crown Big Brake conversation with the Mopar upgraded brake booster were two of the best mods I did to my JK
Road Armor fenders on Rubitron look clean AF! Smoothed out body lines & no Dumbo look with full flares w/ stubby.
When they added ABS brakes to our CHP patrol vehicles, they took us out and taught us to NOT modulate the brake pedal to prevent the ABS system from doing it's job. You were only using 70-80% of your stopping power if you were feathering the brake pedal to "stay out of the anti-lock system" like I think you said. In a vehicle that has ABS, you put the pedal to the floor and ignore the pulsing, grinding, kick back of the pedal and everything else that happens with ABS. Do another test on your own. On a back street with NO traffic, stop with YOUR way of feathering. Do the same thing with PEDAL TO THE FLOOR and measure the difference. You did yourself an injustice by feathering the pedal. That being said, YES you do need to upgrade your brakes with 38's. BIG TIME!!! I am on 37's and LOVE my Dynatrac ProGrip 4 wheel brake upgrade system. It stops better than my wifes stock 2 door with 33's.
Kevin Williams Modulating the brake pedal when equipped with ABS doesn’t make stopping distances shorter it makes them longer. It’s not an argument of ABS vs non ABS it’s about you confusing the ABS system on the vehicle by modulating brakes in this type of test. If you have ABS you just mash the pedal for quickest stop. It’s like this by design. Don’t let your experience with non ABS vehicles blind you. This is especially true if your vehicle is sliding on snow or ice you don’t pump/modulate ABS brakes it actually makes them less effective. Try for yourself though don’t take my word for it.
Kevin Williams I am familiar with what you mean about threshold braking. Threshold braking is for non ABS brakes and it is the practice of not mashing the brakes and optimally stopping on the verge of traction. In this case with ABS I’m suggesting you didn’t do your stopping distance any favors with this technique. If you didn’t get a little bit of ABS reaction I’d assume the brakes weren’t used to their capacity. Every ABS vehicle I’ve ever driven stops faster by using constant force. Only time I modulate is normal slowing down but I don’t need everything from the brakes then. I drove non-ABS vehicles for years and I get that you formed a habit but that doesn't mean it's right for the situation. Hopefully in an emergency you just mash the brakes. Either way the brake upgrade will be a very good idea. If you think you’re doing right then by all means brother keep on doing you. Give the two a try though. ✌️
Kevin, Watch your video. RUBITRON'S braking system has not locked his tires. It has brought the system to the MAXIMUM BRAKING EFFICIENCY and maintained it there. That is why you hear his tires starting to make noise against the asphalt. They are still rotating and steering. The MAXIMUM braking power occurs just before the tires lock up. It is the job of the ABS to bring each tire INDIVIDUALLY to that point and prevent the brake pedal from placing any more pressure on the pads causing lock up and loss of control. IF you are applying just enough pressure to stop your vehicle without getting to the point of ALMOST locking up the tires, then there is still some stopping power left in your system. To do a FAIR COMPARISON, you need to allow your ABS system to do it's job and THEN COMPARE!! You are giving yourself too much credit for your ability to out perform the ABS system which modulates each brake individually with your foot pressure on ONE PEDAL. You still had more braking power left vs. if you had let the ABS do it's job. Believe me, I have seen the difference from an EXPERTS trying to out think the ABS system and letting the system do the job it does so very well. TEST IT SOLO with just your vehicle and another video..
Kevin, Scenario: You are in a race going through a long sweeping right hand turn. Your vehicle is leaning to the left and loading more weight on the left tires and less weight on the right due to the physics of the turn. How are you going to make a maximum breaking application with only one pedal that you can push. All you can do is press/feather it enough to NOT lock up the right tires. Correct? The ABS system monitors each of the 4 tires individually and allows enough brake fluid pressure to get to the pistons of the caliper and bring it to the brink of locking up but not beyond. Each tire should be starting to lock up and then releasing, locking up and releasing approx. 20 times per second. There is no way that a vehicle which has ABS braking system can stop faster with someone feathering the brakes to prevent the ABS from kicking in, vs allowing the ABS system to work as designed. I realize that you have extensive racing experience without ABS and with ABS, but you obviously have not had the experience of having an ABS expert show you (prove to you) how dangerous an extra 20-30 feet of stopping distance in a panic stop can be. Please, for the safety of your subscribers, do a video comparison on Step Child so the people who follow your channel can make up their own mind whether they are going to feather their brakes and emulate you, or they are going to allow the ABS system do it's job.
@@Rocscrawler If you look up Threshold braking, it's supposed to be a better braking method than letting your ABS kicks in, provide. you know you car/brake/tires enough to max. out it's braking ability. I was able to do that pretty well when I was pushed braking to it's limit when I had my STi & Carrera with summer tires, but not so much with my Jeep JLU so far.
With an 8 speed auto you aren’t going see the difference like the old 5 speed auto with gears. But 5:13 are just compensating for the tire size.
So true, older automatic jeeps came with 3.73's (I think) and the manuals had 4.10's, so the jump from 3.73 to 5.11 makes a HUGE difference, especially when you literally only have half of the gears (4 vs 8), and you go from 28in tires to 38s (vs 33s to 38s)
Truth. When I changed my 96' Chevy 1500 gears from 3.73 to 4.58 I actually increased my mileage because I made it easier for the engine to push the truck with the 35"s and stock 4 speed Auto. That is until I got up to 75MPH, then my mileage went down because the engine was turning so much faster.
Like others said that soft top is lighter than the hard top BUT it also offers better aerodynamics since it is sloped at the back there is going to be less turbulent drag behind the soft top jeep vs the hard top. weight difference from lack of passengers and gear etc. etc. All of the little things add up.
Great informative video! Kevin, 👍 for helping the lady changing her tire. You raised a great point about carrying a proper jack to change a tire, specially with a raised Jeep. I am going to see to that today! Thanks you guys for another great video.
This channel is insane. So many upgrades. So much wheeling. So many new toys.
Its probably been said, but the gear comparison sounds just right for your outcome. The weight of Stepchild probably is what scrubbed the mileage and acceleration (at speed) compared to Pepe. I was hoping to see a drag race as I’m sure Pepe would walk it easy. Pound for pound, Stepchild would get better mileage and top speed with 4:10s and Pepe would have better off the line and torque. More power & acceleration = more gear, better mileage & speed = less gear. The weight is what balanced it out, since Jumping from 4:10 to 5:13 isn’t that super big of a jump.
Brakes FOR SURE. Cruise control also is horrible for mileage since your engine is accelerating more. With 5.13 gears his is accelerating slightly harder in cruise and has more deceleration when him/the cruise control let off the gas.
My Sister and I couldn't start drives ed until we knew how to change a tire, check the fluids and how to shift.
you want floor jack and an extension on the jacking point and a way to mount it. the hilift will hurt you if you arent careful. pro eagle makes them or you could put a skid/mounting plate and the proeagle extension on a harbor freight jack
5:29 listen to how much later your buddies Jeep down shifts and goes. You guys got the jump this time and couldn’t make any gap. When he got the jump he was gone. You guys just aren’t roll racers and that’s okay. Both have to be in manual at a good RPM (to be in the right gear and not wait for the trans to bring you to the gear you need) and switch to auto after you floor it(to let the trans handle the shifts). Has to also happen at the same time or we’ll never know the difference. Give RUclips a better JL gearing test please! You guys have a lot of similarities between the Jeeps give us the real test!
I'm guessing regardless of insignificant weight, the Stepchild will get better gas mileage; because of gearing. Aerodynamics is huge; so, Michael drafting will help him save & get better mileage. Just thinking about Newton's Laws of Motion. Weight only factors in when it's a lot of stopping & going. Once the weight is going, the gearing and aero are going to factor in heavier than weight.
A trailer however, with more drag from the trailer tires will definitely cause a significant reduction in gas mileage, more wear & tear on the transmission too. Yeah, get some carbon fiber brakes to help with stopping.
Soft tops are lighter than hard tops, so... there's that too.
Bottle Jack is great for carrying around for Jeep tire problems. Plenty strong and tall units available. Skip the Hilift for the new Arb trail Jack if budget allows. Always opt for trailer brakes. Surge brakes are ok. Go for actual electric brakes. Tekonsha Prodigy RF wireless brake controller was recently tested at a different RUclips channel. Or, opt for hardwire unit. Never skip on brakes.
That was cool to see, real world testing! Yup my 01-7.3, F350 4x4 dually has 410's it was the only way I could get a posy rear axle! didn't wanna get stuck with my overhead camper loaded up in the mountains... MPG drops over 65 an up...( braking test! ) I'm runnin' 35" AT's on my 2012 JKU and I would really like to upgrade my brakes now more than ever! after seeing the difference! WOW!!! GREAT VIDEO!!! BIG THANKS TO YA!!!
PS. I got my NX Bestop last week, thanks for the $150.00 discount you saved me LiteBrite :)
You guys forgot hard top and he’s running the soft top
I used to do a fair amount of drag racing and it's hard to beat higher ( 4.10) gears from a roll if your engine will pull the vehicle. From a dead stop (5.13) ratio would be an edge. I'm surprised though that the (4.10) gears still work so well with a 38" tire. Which in fact shows how good an all around ratio the (4.10) really is. I think the 40" tires will kill it and a re gear will become more important......enter super or turbocharger!! Fun stuff!
For highway driving, aero dynamic drag and speed (rolling resistance and transmission heat) is usually what governs how much fuel you use.
And also weight a bit, if there's a lot of hills/mountains - Though highways usually try to go around those.
Edit :
I saw a bunch say "but he would use more gas because of higher RPM's" … which is both true and false.
Modern engines with direct fuel injection will lean out the air/fuel mixture when they are under light load, so that helps.
Also, the Jeep JL can be had with an 8 speed automatic (which I think they both have) - And with closer gear ratios,
Michael is likely to have a gear that fits his optimal RPM range, at highway speeds, again curbing excessive fuel use.
Something like a 500 RPM difference is not going to make a big difference in fuel usage, with a modern engine.
Mind you, if you have an old engine with a carburettor, low RPM is king !
Grumpy ol' Boot Yup yup. At 75mph, we’re in 7th gear and Michael is in 8th, both at around 2500rpm
@@LiteBrite
Yup yup, and at that point, the jeeps aero dynamic properties (which worse than a brick! ), is what burns all the fuel. 😁
Cool test, but maybe the benefits would be hauling around a trailer boat etc and hill pulls. If your guys in Az heading out Payson pull your test up the long hill going along side the rim that would be interesting. As much travel you guys do I’m sure you come up on a lot of hills. Also would his pinion gear be weaker do to a smaller teeth count? Like you said about his four low try swapping vehicles out over the same object and see if Kevin thinks it’s a benefit.
The biggest benefit on the highway to any gears is to keep the engine running in the band that's most efficient. Changing tires often makes the engine lug more and makes it less efficient, re gearing can bring it back inline. All engines have a sweet spot where they do their best. most people don't re gear for highway, they re gear for off road and deal with other areas of lowered performance. Also, stop trying to beat ABS, it'll stop quicker than you can. :) Also, get trailer brakes.
Trailer and maybe a XP coming in the future??? :)
I knew you would get hooked! I learned a long time ago that you can have much more fun when you know you don't have to drive your "Toy" home. Too many days stranded in the desert cause I broke something being crazy (stupid). :-)
Stepchild gets brake fade ? What's the ballpark cost of that brake upgrade ? Thanks for the Jeep news ;)
@@boughtnotbuiltoffroad7784 Thanks Kevin. I understand. Thanks for sharing, once again.
If you want a good safe Jack for the stepchild and whatever else you will be pulling look into getting a Pro Eagle Jack. They are worth every penny.
Check out the Powerbuilt bottle jack. Definitely recommend
Im soooo pumped up.. We leave at noon tomorrow 3/7/19 and are headed to Colorado springs cant wait to see all the awsome things out there and hopefully get to go play at the ram offroad park going to be a blast.. Thanks for the inspiration to get out there and do things... 😁😁👍👍😁😁
So, you had a difference of 1.3 gallons used. What was the actual travel distance so that you can measure MPG empirically?
Also, on the stopping test, there is obviously a difference in stopping power. However, one must consider total weight on that test as well. The hard top does add weight to the Stepchild.
4.10 will get better gas mileage on innerstate the engine at lower rpm but will be slower getting up to speed ur added weight is why u both ran out around the same time. Should compare the rpms of both jeeps on innerstate with diffent gears.
Curious what their speed and rpms are. I’d guess they’re cruising on the faster side and michaels rpms are higher
Only way to get better gas mileage is to put v-8 in it lol
@@dedjrob Yes they are Micheal's Jeep has smaller Tires on it
I think someone got ripped off and didn’t get the gears they should have got. Lol
No Michael has 38 they clearly explain that fact...
What fenders are those on the other red Jeep??
My Jeep wj came with 3:55 and 29” tires. I’m now on 35’s and 4:56 . Using gear and tire calculations, this combo put me right back to stock performance. I see lifted mall crawlers all the time On huge tires. When I ask “people what gears are you running with those _______?” I get all sorts of responses. I even had people say,” I don’t mess with the engine , so it’s still stock” WTf lmao 😂
Lol call AAA if you need a tire change. I figured the 5.13 gears would pull harder. And big brakes are a must. Great video as usual.
I look at it opposite, didn’t lose much mileage for the better low end. Would probably be much different in the stop and go stuff.
Love your channel and I was wondering where the you guys got the black decal on the top of your hood. I've been looking for one and can't find one for the rubicon. I live in Florida and sometimes the glare is fierce. Best of luck to you guys.
Re gear and brake upgrade thats a definite upgrade for me! Running 37s or bigger i would go with a Nitro 5.38 diff ratio and 4 pistons or 6 pistons brake upgrade with larger diameter rotors. Rather than the one piston jk brakes and 2 pistons JL.
5.38 is unnecessary in a JL Rubicon with the 8 speed. Maybe 40”+. Really for 38s probably only need to bump to 4.88 with the 8 speed and that 4:1 low for crawling. I ran stock 4.10s on my old 07 2dr JK 6 speed for awhile. It needed more on the road but was alright. The 4:1 and 4.4:1 first in the manual trans made crawling a non issue. Gears certainly help though not denying that. The JL doesn’t hold the same gear requirements as the 5 speed auto JK.
With 5.13’s the engine doesn’t have to work as hard, and with the 4.10’s your putting more of a load on the motor to help you accelerate. Add a bunch of weight to the 4.10’s the motor has a huge load it’s trying to push.
If you ride a bike uphill in a harder gear, your going to get tired faster, then of you had the bike in an easier gear.
Awesome video...very informative and wonderful cuz of real world driving....can't believe the different stopping distance...Jelly was crashed..hard day for her 😀...as always wonderful and looking forward to your next video......definitely something to look into...the brakes will help you out alot.......Safe travels
You can add electric brakes to most trailers pretty easily; for a 3500lb axle you should be able to do it for less than $150-200. etrailer.com has kits and install videos; adding trailer brakes will be a big help.
Kevin, good job helping the stranded motorist 👍. The Rubitron is gorgeous...is that a custom paint job?
Custom wrap to match the dash
Regearing is more for acceleration and torque not for highway gas milage - total weight unless EXTREME won't make a huge difference since Jeeps have nearly no aerodynamics. Regearing can make a gas milage difference as long as you're in stop and go traffic. But highway is all for the lower gears... Note that in 2012 + all rubicons with autos were built with 3.73s not 4.10 because of gas milage (unless special ordered)
I have been running 38s with 513 gears for the last year or so and yes I can see how it could affect the mpg some.... Now I could be wrong but.... I think the more important thing about the gear ratio is long term wear on the transmission..
I will say that having 410s will make it easier if you want to go back to a 35in tire in the future, I would need to regear to drop back down. I just dropped back down to a 37 and while its only an inch, it is crazy how much difference I feel in the acceleration.
I put 4:88 gears and the Mopar big brake kit on my 16' JK running 37" Mickey Thompson Baja P3's and a 3.5" Metalcloak lift and they both made a huge difference! They made it way more fun to drive too. The Superchips tuner I got for it helped too. You can change the pedal response with the Superchips tuner so that alone makes a huge difference with the JK. Plus all of the different tunes it has. Awesome Jeeps tho guys! Keep up the vids!
The 5:13s will be slower on the rolling race you did. The rpms will max out sooner than the 4:10s.
The only benefit of he 5:13s are take offs and low gear crawling.
when y'all are back in CO, do a test side by side going up that long road near the Eisenhower tunnel, just to see how different the gear ratio is between the two of yall
I don't know if I would re-gear running 4.10's. I'm on 3.73 gears with 35's and I definitely need to re-gear. I'm not thinking fuel economy as much as performance. My engine is really struggling on-road, especially on the highway. I'm doing 4.88's sometimes this Summer.
I'm on the same boat as you, but on a JK. Current 3.73 gears on 35" tyres. Definitely feel I need to re-gear.
The lower gear ratio (5.13) will give you more strength (power) for climbing over obstacles where the higher gear ratio (4.10) lower the rpm’s at speed. That leads to technically lower gas mileage for the 4.10s. At low speed and over obstacles, I bet it would be opposite. Sounds like a good hypothesis to test.
YES YES YES with a lot of go you need a lot of whoo!!! AKA stoping power lol and gears ??? Good vid! Love it
I would recommend a bottle jack for you, safer, compact, inexpensive. You only need to jack up the axle a couple of inches to get your tire off the ground as opposed to a high lift where you have to go more than full droop to raise a tire.
a floor jack with a raised lifting point would be even better. theres kits to make the harbor freight ones have a skid plate so itll work in sand and dirt and it also helps it securely mount in your vehicle
Can we get an update video of the milestars with how much wear you have experienced and how many miles you guys have on them now.
Thanks for the reply I just installed a set of 35s on my jk hoping to get 30k plus on mine
Bobby Ratliff Just make sure to keep up with rotations! 😊
Always enjoy your videos
Gears are rotating levers. It is, by far, the best bang for your buck mod you will ever do to you Jeep. Most neglect this because it’s an expensive and complicated job. Do yourself a favor with the money you have for that chrome gas cap and those flame stickers and save it for gears.
Can you do another long term review of the Patagonia’s? Like how many kms are on them now, tread depth? Etc...
Blacktailbowhunter 01 We’ve got about 17k on them now, with about 60% tread left (although we’ve been hardcore slacking on the rotations)
Lite Brite Ok thanks! Im guessing they must wear down faster because of the soft rubber. Im trying to decide if I should put them on my 94 toyota pickup. Hoping if I do I might get a bit longer life out of them due to the lighter weight truck.
Not convinced regearing is an absolute must, BUT bigger brakes is definitely needed once you go with larger tires. Looking forward to the trailer reveal.
Gears won’t help with fuel economy they actually make it worse technically but since there’s 8 speeds it will actually go into 8 unlike the 410s. So overall you’ll probably see close to around the same mpg.
Fixitall329 Exactly. Kevin and I no longer see our 8th gear, so that evens it out quite a bit. At 75mph, we’re both sitting right around 2500rpm, but we’re in 7th while Michael is in 8th.
when you change the discs and rotors to the bigger ones do you have to do something to change the ABS so it's functional.
??
No change necessary with Alcon kit. My abs works fine in situations it comes in play
Last time I was in the shop of 4-wheel parts they had a jeep with both diffs apart in one of their bays. I ask, and the mechanic replied that the owner lifted it, put large tires on it and drove it till both diffs gave up. They were rebuilding and re-gearing them. More braking - More Better!
U guys running the same tires PEPE / Stepchild? Just got 37" Patagonia's on my Ram PW and I've noticed a 2mph fuel increase in savings over my old 35" Cooper STT Pros! Ok, never mind, 8 minutes in to the video u said that you were. Lol
So youre getting a polaris rzr and a supercharger. Cool, cant wait for the vids.
A way to do it tell him in 4 grear or 5 if you got it and each drive at 3,000 rpm and then you run away from him. So you stay at 3,000 rpm and have him the same speed as you . Then ask him what his rpm is. The higher you rpm the more gas you used
That was a really nice thing y’all did stopping to help that lady.
Some 2x12s cut into squares for your bottle jack may do the trick. I’m going to do this for my Power Wagon. Nearly a foot under the differential makes tire changes sketchy.
I recently bought my second jeep with 120000 miles. Rolling 35” tires since new on the stock 3.73 gears. The transmission was shot and needed a complete rebuild. I also did a regear to 4.56’s to regain stock performance. No significant change in gas mileage. Way better torque, acceleration, power up a rock etc. for longevity of the jeep gears are way worth it!
Nice video! Wow those brakes!!
You guys planning on heading back to Moab anytime soon?
Aw man. What a bummer he was creeping. Love Truck Night! Lol. Great video. Amazing brakes on Rubitron.
Simple bottle jack. I’m on 40’s and use one. Way better than a high lift for that tire change
new arb jack is much safer than a hilift also not as tall and heavy and who's axial CRC Jeep a mini step child ? side note if your towing gears will help
The question is, how much gas can you buy for the cost of a gear installation?
OFFRD I think someone actually did the math in one of the comments! Haha
Awesome video very informal. Love watching the fun ya'll have. Be safe ad always and send it.
Just curious about the intake and exhaust. Are they also similar for MPG? And what about seat of the pants feel when driving both? Do they feel similar driving and wheeling in similar conditions?
The gears would probably be more noticeable in a crawling situation
YOU are getting a RZR!!!!!!!! SWEET!!!!
Check out the new ARB Hydraulic Jack. Not cheap, but you can lift the Jeep with one hand.
The exhaust air bag lift or pretty cool you just hook them to your tailpipe of your car and it's a jack like a big ball that lifts it up there pretty cool just got to be careful with them they work pretty good for getting unstuck out of the sand just throw them underneath the Jeep and it helps lift it up throw sand Down Under your tires and get out of there it is especially helps when somebody sinks to the axles
Stock brakes ain’t made for 38’s. Get the power stop brakes - $350. Gears depend on lots of things. But 4:10’s with 38’s is putting lots of strain on your engine, trans, really everything.
Get a 20 ton bottle jack it can lift the jeep up 18 inches. Safer than a hi lift death jack. Bottle jacks dont take up as much room as hi lift.
A bottle jack can't winch you out of deep or slick stuff. I carry both in my suburban.
We have winches for that tho so does Stepchild
20 Tons is way overkill and heavy. A 4-6 ton with one of those swag offroad axle tube perches welded on would be ideal.
@@madmaxinthunderdome winchs can and do break, at the worst time, so hilift still worth its weight in gold. Those that are afraid of them just don't know how to use them or don't maintain them properly.
@@jake-mv5oi 20 ton is taller usually tho
1) Cool 2.) You must get the brakes 3.) Did you check to make sure Mikey didn't pick up the Creeper?
If I get this right , you traveled 2 1/2 hours on a full tank of gas, at 75 miles an hour on cruise control . Peppa’s Jeep and Step Child Jeep drove 187.5 miles. But here’s the difference on gas miles , Peppa’s Jeep got 11.192 miles to the gallon of gas , and Step Child’s got 10.336 miles to the gallon. Before gassing Peppa’s Jeep he had left in his tank 4.747 gallons , and Step Child had 3.361 gallons of gas left. The weight in both Jeeps gave you less miles then factor tires at 21.5 gasoline of gas you would of gotten at 20 miles to a gallon , you would of got 451.1 miles to a tank . But with the gallons left in the tank before getting gas Peppa’s would of gotten another 53.128 miles and you would of gotten on Step Child 34.739 miles , and the difference of 19.389 miles Peppa’s Jeep could go before emptying the fuel tank. If I got this right please let me know.
Which is allright for an offroad monster, like the Stepchild.
But imagine having to daily it for a long commute ? In that case the MPG is horrendous !
Heck, I used to drive a panel van in the city, and that still got 28 mpg!
Offroad vehicles are almost as thirsty as the RUclips commenters when Brittany wears skimpy clothing!!
Cool video, really like the real world testing. Rubitron is one awesome jl. Definitely upgrade your brakes if you're adding power. Me, I'm getting ready to install a supercharger, woohoo!
wouldnt his motor getting higher rpm using more gas
Yes
Jim Layey Ideally, except he can use 8th gear whereas we can’t.
More rpms does not mean more gas. It's all about engine load. For example a vehicle traveling uphill at 2000 rpm will burn more fuel than a truck engine braking downhill at 4000rpm. while rpms are high the fuel needed to maintain them is entirely different.
everyone keeps bringing up the top but i believe hard tops give better mileage despite the weight. lots of airflow problems with a bouncing soft top especially at 75mph. assuming you went about 300mi on the tank i got a difference of only 1.4 mpg.
1.4 Gallons, not mpg.
I just want to know what was in the box in the back seat. RC Jeep?
The gears make a difference in the mileage but... i don't know if it'll be that big; however, good brakes make a big difference in safety, in a very bad situation could be the difference between life and death. I hope that all of you never be in that situation on the road; have a great week!.
Need more info on the job one piece axle, please!
The aerodynamics are in your favor bigtime with regards to soft top vs hardtop.
Is that a SCX-10 II in the back seat????
Great job with the video, thanks for sharing
Awesome real world testing. I have an 06 LJ Rubi on 35's with 4.10 and 6 speed and I plan to go to 37's so I will probably have to go to 5.13's but for sure I need more brakes my stock brakes suck!!!!!
Carry a block of wood to put the jack on. I do that with my 40s works a treat.
You can get power stop brakes for $500 and have awesome brakes for a fraction of the cost.
Kevin Williams maybe Not, but way better than stock.
Dynatrac Progrip. 100% American made.
What kind of rig are y’all gonna be pullin ? We are looking st a 17SCD vintage for ourselves .
I think all you have proven is that you can run a much lower gear set 5.13's or 5.38's and it does not effect much of anything due to the 8 speed transmission. What it does give you is a much lower crawl ratio. In other jeeps with 4 speed or 5 speed transmissions lower gears would make your highway cruising rpms so high you would kill an engine and or burn a lot of fuel. The 8 speeds have pretty much made the jeeps far more driveable on the highway with modifications whereas before regearing was necessary.
How does it not make since though? He’s got less stress with his 5.13 at low speed. But if you guess are up to about 45-50 your 38s are rolling fine to where his 5.13s are running at higher rpms.
With y'all going Wheeling the way y'all do I would recommend getting trailer brakes when you go down a hill with a load you'll definitely will being glad to have them you don't want the trailer pushing you down the hill or off a cliff
I did 5.13 in my JK after 37s. Much better, shifts smoother. Very torquey in 4low. Teraflex BBK front and rear (alcon and baer a "little" out of my budget) works awesome. Peruse AEV jack base. Raises stock jack 3.5" and has a footprint the fits the stock jack. Nor will it maim or kill you. Unless Brit throws it at your head, but it's plastic so it won't hurt.....too much.
2fuzzies 🤣
Try driving around town in stop and go traffic for a tank and see the MPG difference. I'll bet thats where it will really show the difference between gearing.
Todd’s Jeep is badass
Your rigs are also aerodynamically different. Michael’s soft top has that notch back design. I’m not sure if that hurts or helps fuel economy, but it’s certainly different.
Also some differences in the fenders between their's and Michael's as well. I'm sure Michael's more open flares catch additional air and thus create aerodynamics with more turbulence.
Did he reprogram for the gears and did either of you for tires?