The USAF at Red Flag: Air-to-Ground | with Jeff Guinn
HTML-код
- Опубликовано: 19 янв 2019
- Jeff Guinn chats about his time flying the F-111 at exercise Red Flag in 1980/89 and how the aircraft performed.
Help keep the channel going:
/ aircrewinterview
or donate
www.aircrewinterview.tv/donate/ 
Авто/Мото
Somebody tell Jeff that there's never too much detail in these videos. Details are the stuff that we don't get to hear from anywhere else.
I talked to a FB-111 pilot out of Plattsburgh AFB back in 83 or 84. He said when they went to Red Flag got a F-15 on their tail. All they had to do was light the afterburners and go on the deck. They could easily out run the F-15s.
Well,,,,,,,,thats what 111's do, that was their thing. Deck skidder, an F-15 was built and designed to be up in the air miles away from the enemy while engaging them from distances that rival artillery fires.
This dude is an incredible interviewee! F111 is such an awesome craft.
I was in the RAF & saw the F111's leave for Libya & heard them return to Lakenheath a few hours later during those edgy times , I was demobbed in 92 as well , it really was a different world back then , just very happy to have made it safely through that part of cold war era history !
He certainly should never apologise for the details. loved it
Yep. It’s minor but leaders care more about others than themselves.
I love this guy! More Jeff Guinn!
He is great in front of the camera.
He is the coolest.He should write a book
I really don't understand why youtube never recommended me this, even if I watch tons of aviation and military stuff, but insists on giving me crappy minecraft videos or something...
This interview was pure gold!
Great to hear you enjoyed it!
I watched an earlier video with him and remember how much i liked listening to his anecdotes: he is a natural storyteller. Some people can tell the most fantastic stories, but still make them sound dull. He does not have this problem.
Man, this was a blast from the past. Everything Jeff said was accurate and brought back many memories. I was about 8 years behind him at Cannon AFB. I got to do several Red Flags, a Green Flag, Copper Flag, and some weapons testing at Eglin testing range. Several opportunities to explore the max performance of the -111. Lots of fun and wouldn't trade that assignment for anything. I also wish I had a GoPro or a way to download the images in my mind. Saw tactical line-abreast 100-300' doing 1.2 Mach. Watching wingman creating he classic motorboat wake in the desert floor. Did 1.4 Mach ( G model) low over water south of Eglin and can verify the hanging from the straps when you come out of burner. Reminder of how much energy you're expending to do that kind of speed.
Me too Breezy, one assignment (in ATC) behind Jeff. We were both FWS guys at Heyford. It’s a small but very different world!
Hey, very interested to hear your performance figures. Mach 1.4 at sea level is 926 knots, is that what you had indicated airspeed?
@@B61Mod12 At Red Flag in D, 1.15 - 1.2 was common. Bet the F could do allot more. However, egress for D/E was usually too short to get some real smash going. Wales to Isle of Man after Combat Descent demo overwater could get allot more. That Mach tape was huge so don't remember looking much at IAS in the mach, especially down low. Top speed in D off Eglin @ Coppertone was 2.7 with whole sortie dedicated to Ratuski profile & seeing who could go faster/higher. Could'a done more but ran out of room with ROE of < 1.0 by coast-in, right... Might've also popped briefly above 50K... Sky gets very dark up there! Memories get better but less precise as years pass.
I was a crew chief on this aircraft. Loved it.
Went to a few red flags, William tells and several other wtds, and deployments.
I remember a few red flags where we were severely handicapped. With out the handicap we wouldn't be stopped. Love this bird
@@B61Mod12 The F4 limit IAS was 750 or High Duct Temp Light whichever came first. I have seen 660 IAS and still accelerating on the deck in Cold Lake, Canada but I question 926.
I was there as avionics ground support in the last half of Sept 1980. We had AWACs present. When the F-15 and F-16 flew without F-111s as part of the scenario they came back in late afternoon doing victory rolls. When F-111s flew they just landed.
This man doesn’t even fucking realize when he’s dropping absolute gems. Fucking incredible. Good stuff Jeff. Can’t wait for more
Nice to hear someone speak about this aircraft. I was a crew chief on A models from Nellie and took part in the war in Vietnam working out of Takhli. My A model flew the highest number of hours and the last bomb mission. It is now on display as the gate guard at Nellie. I was originally stationed at Mountain Home and also crewed the F model. I was with the 347th fighter wing assigned to the wing commanders bird 71- 0883 assigned to the 391st fighter squadron.
We eventually became the 366th TFW the gunfighters.
I also began at Mtn. Home with the 7th TRS RF-4C. Going from an F-4 to a brand new F-111F was a huge move.
I was at Mountain Home '77-'80. Shops CRS. I remember a practice deployment in Dec 78 or Jan 79. Froze my ass off guarding an empty safe on a pallet. We pulled the TOs so the shop could continue working. True story, a Sgt came by and I asked how I was supposed to guard the safe when I wasn't armed. He pulled a note pad out wrote M 16 on a page tore it out and handed it to me. I was now armed!
I was at Nellis 75 through 78 as a Crew Chief assigned to the 474th. You got our A models up at Mountain Home and we Got the F4-D. The F111-A is still my favorite. First love you know. I would have one on static display on my property if one was available.
The F-111Fs left for RAF Lakenheath in ‘77, when Mountain Home AFB received the As.
I did occasionally work on 884, but never did work 883 at Lakenheath in the mid-80s.
I dearly miss the F-111, and especially the Fs.
I thought the only F-4s that were ever ever assigned to Mountain Home were the ones that were actually deployed to SE Asia.
Did they ever actually fly out of Mountain Home?
@@patrickflohe7427 the 7th TRS birds flew out to the Alabama NG, the 10TRS , The 22nd TRS were deployed the 417th TFS was deployed to South East Asia. The 7th was disbanded at Mountain Home along with troops from Cannon, formed the 347th comprised of 389, 390,and 391 TFS we were assigned F models right out of the factory. Nellis had the 474 TFW A models. Those were sent to Takhli during the Linebackers campaign. We eventually became the 366 th TFW who moved without their F-4s from Danang to Takhli and back to Mountain Home. Eventually the F models went to other bases, but by that time I was gone.
Simply brilliant. I always thought the F-111 was an incredible aircraft and listening to Jeff’s remembrances told in such an engaging manner is a real thrill.
I worked F-111's at Cannon. Spent 20 years in weapons systems. I could talk to this guy for hours.
I love this kind of talk. Thanks for posting it. And thanks to all those who serve our nation. God Bless you all.
Wondering if Jeff did any training sorties to Ft Carson in southern Colorado. I remember as a kid watching A-7 and F-111 making low level runs from the south to north over our family ranch near Beulah, CO. The best days had loitering F-16s circling to the west in a valley waiting for them. I remember one day an pair of f-15s accompanied the ground attack element and surprised the f-16s. My brother and I were on horseback moving cattle watching a glorious dog fight play out above us.
Airburst range. Flew there a few times. Beautiful background for a fun day of flying on the range.
There was a time when the bulk of the commercial widebody fleet were flown by ex military guys just like this. I always found it a very calming experience to see one of these old silver foxes in the cockpit.
this was really good! thanks!!
(( hoping DCS models this jet someday - especially 900+ kts on the deck! i had heard -111s could really scoot on the deck - but Mr Guinn really hammered that point home - wow ))
I was in the 522 fighting fireballs 1986 to 1991 ! I was a jet engine mech , loved working on the F111D
He is such a natural speaker, he's right up there with Chris Bolton.
Nice vid, Guinn-Bob. Proud to have flown on your wing at Green Flag in '92.
Fantastic - one of my favourite interviews that you have made Mike. Big thanks to Jeff, he has a great way of recalling the days gone by, love the details especially the fuel flows / top speeds etc and of course the 'out of burner brickwall slowdown incident' . He is also humble and explains extra background info to set the scene so that the viewer can understand the context.
Cheers Iain! Jeff is very engaging when sharing these stories and as you say the background info to lead you into a story is brilliant.
Another Great interview. Jeff please write a book on the F-111 and your experiences!
Many thanks. Please interview again in the future.
I agree, he should put pen to paper and share his stories.
My first Red Flag was in '76 which I believe was RF #3. The earlier ones were the most fun. We had a 10 ship on initial back at Nellis which consisted of F-106's, F-105's, F-4's, RF-4C's. The commander thought it looked great but told us to knock it off.
in 1980 I had a 16x12' 1/72 scale airbase with 4 F-111 plus ton of other planes, lived on 30 acres I had red flag every day after school
Jeff is excellent in explaining very technical and esoteric things about combat flying. Look forward to learning about his time as a Navy sadness skipper.
I can't believe your videos don't get hundreds of thousands of views
Hopefully, one day that will happen which will allows us to get even more interviews out. Thanks for the support.
Try posting a few vids on LiveLeak, lots of aircraft guys there.
@@nickbreen287
whoa careful, hugely toxic racist gore crowd, i would advise against it if you have no experience with it.
i personally would not touch that site with a barge pole..... yuck.
@phatty ofurniture
sure thing buddy.
Actually been a member since day 1. There are far worse sites online so I'd advise not tarring everyone with the same brush if you're not familiar with the internet.
Brings back fond memories. The Vark rocked! I later flew the F-16 (another GD product, and you could tell the family heritage even if the two jets were quite obviously different), but still love the F-111 to this day. Never flew with Jeff, though, as I was at Mountain Home (A model) and Lakenheath (F model) so we never crossed paths.
Was at MHAFB in 82 and was CC for 70-100. Loved my time there. Can't tell from your sig if I remember you.
Do you remember Lt. Col. Phil Barrios? Cool dude and was the best stick I knew of.
I was a former SAC Gunner and had Aircrew Member Wings and Combat Crew badges on my fatigues.
@@rogerbeckner6419 Sure I remember Lt Col Barrios! Cool guy indeed, flew in Vietnam (in the F-4 if I remember well). I was at the "Goat" from Dec 1980 to May 1983, so you and I were there at the same time. Good times...
@@KRGruner 1982 in 391st. Crew Chief for Acft. 70-100! They finally repainted her and put her on a stick at Nellis.
@@rogerbeckner6419 Yes, I was in the 391st (Bold Tigers) at that time, having transferred from the 390th when that became an EF-111 unit. We must have met on the flight line at some point.
@@KRGruner I was the weirdo who had Aircrew wings and a Combat Crew badge on his fatigues.
Love the trip down Memory Lane. I worked the 111D, E, and EF from 82-92. Time I enjoyed in the 55th, 79th, 522nd, 524th, and 42nd (Deployed)
The F-111 seemed an unloved type in some ways. Yet very important in others. It seems its real potential was only being reached at the end of its life. Always had a soft spot for all wether strikers such as the F-111, A-6E, F-15E, Tornado IDS/GR* and Mirage 2000D.
Let me add in the AJS-37 Viggen, which was designed with this role in mind too. Even though it's a different plane, it's great listening to Jeff and hearing about how these kinds of missions were flown. (and check out the Viggen in DCS. =)
Strike aircraft are the one who kill troops, a must have if your frontline and are needing air support
@@thetreblerebel Strike and CAS are different missions/roles. F-111 was optimised for strike/Battlefield interdiction rather than CAS.
@@B61Mod12 out on a limb here . CAS=COUNTER AIR STRIKE?
@@thetreblerebel Close Air Support
He tells the best stories!
I love how fluent Jeff Guinn becomes once he's talking about something he knows well and uniquely.
Was at Red flag A7D crewchief. I remember the F111 being there. This 1975 76 time frame. It was Awesome seeing all those aircraft working together.
I could listen to this guy's stories all day. Great stuff!
Cheers mate.
1989 I did 2 weeks at Red Flag from McGuire AFB supporting our C141B's Good days.
Another superb Jeff Quinn show.
Jeff Guinn had my full attention with no comms to Center, he found a way to get back to Nellis (5:20)following the Colorado River, flying through the Grand Canyon, when it was [still]legal, wing outs, flaps down. Airplane parts delivered. What a great interview.
The road to Desert Storm was paved at Red Flag
Jeff, if you ever read this, sincere thanks for such hugely enjoyable talks :)
Great vid for us guys on the ground. My left arm is two inches longer from R2 NCUs.
Wonderful interview! Thanks for posting. I worked F-111s at Upper Heyford from 89 till 93. These are great stories.
jeff, dont worry about the winded answers, you give some really great explanations for those who appreciate it.
Got the patch of the 79th ;-) Once upon a time, there was a Tigermeet at Fairford... I guess 1992?
Sorry I'm late, just found these interviews. Fantastic!!! Could listen to his stories all day long!
I would line up the beers in front of Jeff Guinn just hear him talk about his experiences. He makes some interesting points about the changes in air combat.
i was stationed there in 1983
to1984 working in the bomb dump 27th EMS
Would love to here more about flying with the Aussies. I bet they got up to some mischief
Brilliant interview!!! Thanks!!!
Cheers!
Outstanding interview.
Absolutely excellent interview, really informative.
Another Excellent Interview Mike. Jeff can entertain us endlessly with his tales.
Back on the Red Flag deal, I understand they are professionals, I understand the extensive briefing, but it’s still a mystery to me how somebody isn’t constantly running into somebody else, only because of the quantity of high performance airplanes in a small area.
Nice interview! Didn't realize the F-111 was as capable as it was. So much of the news I've heard about the aircraft was that it was a total flop, but from his first hand testimony it was far more capable that the weapons and philosophy of the day could make use of.
Glad you enjoyed it. I think the 111 just got a bad reputation but from hearing first hand it seemed to be a very capable platform.
It was NOT suited for the Navy mission off carriers. And it had bad early teething problems. It did evolve magnificently however.
Black Warrior Lures -- The Australians operated the F-111 for close to 40 years, too.
They only just retired them in 2010.
They LOVED the plane. It gave them the most capable, longest-ranged strike force in all of Asia.
Australia's more "grumpy" neighbors were very wary of the plane and its capabilities and were frankly terrified when they saw the video camera footage shot by the US F-111s in the 1986 Libyan raids and 1991 Persian Gulf War. They realized the Australian F-111s could do everything the American version could!
The Australian Air Force retired the plane because it was getting old and more difficult to maintain even with the spares the US provided from the mothballed American F-111 fleet at Davis-Monthan AFB. The US supplied spare wings, Pave Tack targeting pods, and engines from our fleet to theirs as well as selling surplus F-111G's (ex-FB-111A's) to the Australians as training aircraft (to reduce wear on their F-111C's which were roughly equivalent to the FB-111A in capability, similar wingspan and landing gear).
The replaced the F-111C with the Super Hornet in Australian service but the newer Super Hornet does not have even have the range and payload capability the F-111 had. Short of the B-1B (which really isn't used as a strategic bomber anymore), there's no tactical aircraft, not even the F-15E Strike Eagle, that had the payload/range capability of the F-111 and the F-111 (F-model at least) was even faster than the F-15!
The F-111s not preserved in museums are gone now. The majority of the American planes were scrapped but there are examples of every model in museums or in storage. The Navy even kept one B-model in storage at China Lake. They're just waiting to get money to restore the airframe before they display it. The Australians buried the remainder of their fleet that wasn't preserved in museums because those planes used hazardous material like asbestos that's very difficult to remove and dispose of. It was cheaper just to bury the airframes in the desert! They were compacted and warped in the process so they can't be restored to service, ever.
Aircrew Interview Could it possibly be because every pilot always seems to love their own plane? Compare it to the Spitfire/Hurricane-situation where the pilots seem to love the one they flew the most. How much experience does the pilot have in other comparable types? This provides a qualification to the love, as it were.
Me, I used to be an armoured infantryman by trade. My CV90 was and is the best IFV ever built. My experience with other types of IFVs? Marginal at best.
@@903lew It's only natural for pilots to love the plane they fly. But he was right on target saying the Air Force thinks that air to air is the most important thing. As he pointed out supporting the ground guys is the real mission and should receive top priority. Grudgingly accepting the A-10 and trying to mercilessly kill it ever since being a great example. Ask any grunt what the most beautiful plane in the sky is and he'll most likely say the Hawg. Not an F-15, 22 or 35.
Thanks so much for posting - very interesting.
Just an epic video, so informative and Jeff is a very genuine guy. I watched this a second time it was so good. Its very humbling that we have people like Jeff protecting our freedom. Thanks.
Here’s Carl!
"Line of sight scheduling" led to the coolest FedEx delivery @ 5:15
9:30 "Full Glass cockpit"
*Looks up photo of F-111D cockpit.
3 Screens, about 30 analogue instrument dials, and 300 switches.
Ah how times have changed.
Brilliant.
Excellent interview thanks
Geezus....someone give this guy an f-111 and a gopro....
ruclips.net/video/CN9jU4NW9K0/видео.html close enough
@ultrabaiterthe RAAF retired theirs 10 years ago. We could ask one of our museums to pull one out and lend it to you!
@ultrabaiter you are correct. I live in Brisbane and the RAAF used to fly the F111 low level down the river to Brisbane city centre, dump and burn the fuel and go vertical. Search “riverfire dump and burn” and there are plenty of videos on RUclips. Riverfire is an annual festival.
@@reillybrangan2182 While listening and enjoying the interview, came upon your recommended link. Took a quick look see and "Oh , wow!" Saving it to my favs to go back to watch later. Don't know how accommodating the cockpit would have been, but a 360 camera, for back then, would have been so cool. Thank you much for the posting the link.
@@reillybrangan2182 ADD to my comment...that video comes with comms👍👍..woo hoo.
So many good stories 😁
The epitome of a Mach Jock. The F111 was such a complicated and dangerous aircraft to fly. He even says that you could roll it upside down straight into a valley floor.
But I can imagine the Ardvaark flying low on mission into the Eastern Block avoiding ADA. Traveling Mach 1.5
Sir, I was at Mountain Home '77-'80. 366th Component Repair Squadron (CRS) aka can't repair s$!t. I remember senior NCOs leaving the shop to meet birds coming back from bombing comps. They'd talk to the crew, pull the appropriate black box bring it back to the shop tweak it and return it to the plane for the next mission. I remember bomb toss being a tactic. We were also bringing in pave tac by then. I'm surprised the D's didn't have what the older brother As had. One last memory, since the A was the oldest frame it was the first EF mod . I sat in the first EF we had. Still in Grumman colors, grey and orange as I remember. Gone was the WSOs stick and displays. It was an EWO station. The bomb bay was stripped and was APUs and ECM pods and antennas. Like you said it was 40 years ago and so much has changed. Our bird was analog one gate was 2 small boards with components soldered between them. Today one IC has thousands of gates. Our automated test equipment was run by a central computer called cen pac and data was loaded by paper tape with holes punched in it. Sort of like playing Pong compared to call of duty Lol
I was an Instrument and autopilot tech on the F111D. I was told that the computers that run the automatic test stations came out of old navy battleships that were used to control the big gun targeting system.
@@jnbfrancisco that would be news to me but anything is possible. The bird was originally supposed to be a navy bird but got too heavy for carrier operations.
I was trained as a test station repair but not on the automated side. My equipment had the tail ir sensor , SPU, emergency beacons run across them.
@@flattailbob I remember an interesting story from Mt Home AFB around 1979 or 1980. A pilot reported that just as he landed the elevons split. The elevons are the control surfaces on the rear that control the pitch and roll of the aircraft. To control the roll they split or move in opposite directions to change the bank angle. The automatic flight control system will move these surfaces automatically if the aircraft changes roll attitude, even while on the ground. If when you touch down and one wheel touches down first, normal in a crosswind, then the control surfaces are supposed to move to counter the roll motion that will occur. The pilot should have known this was normal operation and so should have the maintenance people, they didn't. The maintenance folks thought they duplicated the no problem, problem and they thought they fixed the no problem, problem by changing the yaw flight control computer. The yaw computer was sent to CRS and they found no problem with it and sent it back because there was no problem with it. I was an Instrument and autopilot field training instructor at the time. So the maintenance folks sent one their guys with the computer to me to prove on my flight control trainer that the computer was bad. I explained to him that they had no problem and explained to him why they thought they had duplicated the problem. He looked at me with discuss and left with the computer under his arm.
Apparently there was a big huff between the O level shop and the I level people over this because the O level folks changed the data plate on their suspected yaw computer. A big no no. They got caught on that. I was disappointed with myself over this incident because I thought I had done a good job teaching the O level autopilot system to all the newcomers for over two years at the time. Apparently I didn't do a good job.
It would be interesting to have Jeff sit down with Ward Carroll and have a chat
Nice work
Thanks Ron.
Love u Jeff !
37:44 "I don't think a T-38 / F-5 could do more than 450 on the deck." Oh contraire my Aardvark friend. As a former T-38 instructor (Del Rio 1985-1989) I'm here to say that the T-38 will do 500 KIAS level flight on the deck in mill power.
And get beat up bad. While ingressing low level at RF, my package’s outrigger F-18’s asked us to slow down cause turbulence was beating the shit out of them. To us it was just a few gentle bumps. Asked what they needed and he said 420. We were doing 500 at the time. Can’t repeat what I said to my WSO.
That's it....... couldn't put my finger on it, but the gentleman looks like a Lee Marvin/Robert Lazar, hybrid there is no offence intended. Anyhow great vid, indeed great vids, hope I'm alright sharing these vids. doing my bit to spread the word, thank you.
Thank you. Feel free to share, Daniel.
Thank you, I'll get cracking... I'll tell anyone who'll listen. Every happiness and success.
This dudes stories are AWESOME!!!!!!! Jeff Gunn needs to get a ridealong seat at Red Flag with a camera guy!!!!!!!!!!! If you read this Red Flag now (2019) runs 2x a day for 3 weeks(minus Sundays).
Love it ...!
Jeff, the same thing happened to me at red flag 1995 in f111 f from cannon...pubs all over nose!
BTW Virgil unger was our squadron cc...522 .....
Of course the B-52 is the ultimate in close air support. It is the most accurate bobber on the planet
As it turns out, every piece of Ordnance ever dropped off of a B-52 of any kind, has indeed hit the Earth.
Nice helmet display.
First RF was 80-1. Parts were still in trailers
That EA-6 crew must've shit their pants hahaha
The A10 Rocks! By a Knuckle Dragger.
I was there in 89 with the 48th.
Maybe Jeff and a preserved F-111 can do a video on his recollections of this plane. I believe there one at the AF museum in Ohio. THAT WOULD BE COOL.
I would like to know when he was stationed at cannon. my dad was over the red squadrons supply in 92-93
He had said from 10/79 till approx 3/81 in an earlier video. For what it's worth, I was in the Red Squadron (522nd Fireball) from '78 to '80. Give your dad my regards.
@@tomthomas9264 i will certainly do that. thank you for serving!
Did you ever attend FWS?
He did.
Why did they name it the "Aardvark"??
My cousin was a Grunt in Vietnam. He said when they called air support Navy & Marines would about burn the tree tops off, maybe he didn't get a good look it might have been a Ardvark. Thank you for this interview, I agree they shouldn't try to get rid of A 10 or the F111 for that matter.
Just curious could the F 111 actually turn and burn if it was not totally loaded with every ordinance known to the A.F.?
No, the plane was too heavy and didn't have enough lifting surface to be a credible air-to-air system.
The heavy wing-loading of that plane was excellent for smoother rides at low-level but it also meant the plane was NEVER going to be a fantastic-turning plane.
The F-111 fuselage is flat and narrow (which does help reduce drag at high speed along with the swept swing; it's STILL among the fastest tactical planes ever built) and does provide SOME lifting surface but it's not enough for the weight of the plane. The F-14 and F-15 both have broad lifting surfaces (on the body) to the point that their effective wing-loading is less than what you read in books (unless they mention this face explicitly). Both the F-14 and F-15 have actually lost a wing in-flight and returned planes safely because of the additional body lift. That would NOT be the case with most other aircraft designs. It was dumb luck the planes involved in those accidents had the fortunate design capable of surviving a mid-air collision and loss of nearly an wing!
Jeff Guin talked about the fact that you NEVER really wanted to turn hard with an F-111 because it would lose speed quickly in hard turns. It was not built to sustain high-G turns and the wing itself did NOT have an automatic wingsweep mechanism like the later F-14 did. The wing sweep on the F-111 was done manually. You could NOT sweep the F-111 wing under G. The wings didn't have powerful enough sweep motors for that.
The lack of air-to-air performance in the F-111 design is a huge part of the Navy pulled out of the program soon (they made their decision around 1966 but were obligated under contract to carry out test flights of the F-111B until at least 1968; along the way they tested the AWG-9/Phoenix system which was later rolled into the F-14). They wanted an air superiority-interceptor and the F-111 was never going to be great in those roles. Grumman could see the writing on the wall and began quietly designing the F-14. Grumman was the lead contractor on the Navy version of the F-111, the B-model!
The F-111B was so unmaneuverable and slow-accelerating that the F-4 could outrun and outturn it. It was a really sad state of affairs but the plane was never designed to be an air superiority/dogfighting machine. The design of the F-111 was always oriented towards long-range strike but the DoD chiefs and Sec. McNamara did not understand aircraft design and the reality of different mission requirements of the USAF and USN. They just saw "long range" and "fast" and presumed the same design could be adapted for use by other services. The TFX/F-111 was primarily a USAF-led project and it was a disaster trying to adapt it for Navy service.
They tried to make a Navel version (F111B)and if I remember, the Admiral said something on the lines of no thrust in Christianity will make this a fighter
Ben D Jr And yet the F-14 used the same engines/thrust (-30's), just shaved some weight and drag. Just a reminder, F-111 G limit was 7.33 and the F-14 was 6.5 max. Both had very high cornering velocity and high energy bleed off. Just a product of that generation of fighter design and bureaucrats trying to get most options for the money. Jack of all trades, master of none. The -111 was well tuned and excelled at its role in the end. Very effective in Desert Storm.
@@breezypilot The F-14 had a higher G-limit than that.
They reduced it in service in last decade of service to 6.5G's but the plane was designed to a spec of 7.5 G's assuming a 6000-flight hour frame life which is the norm for carrier-based fighters. The F-14 pilots routinely pulled WELL ABOVE the design limit and the frame tolerated it. The G-limit restriction (along with a speed reduction to Mach 2) was to get another 1200-flight hours out of the plane without sending them back for major rebuilds. The Navy spent a significant amount of money in the 1970s rebuilding at least 300-400 F-4B and F-4J models into F-4N and F-4S models because of heavy use during the Vietnam War. If they hadn't done that, they would have a massive shortage of planes by the early 1980s. They couldn't afford enough F-14s to replace F-4s on 1-to1 and what became the F-18 was only vaguely conceptualized at that point (early to mid-1970s).
You misread something if you think the F-111 had a higher G-limit than the F-14. It was quite the opposite and that was another reason the Navy went ahead with the F-14 instead of continuing with the F-111B. The F-111 had horrible G-limits and bad maneuvering, worse than the F-4. Anybody that's seen an F-14 at an air show knows that plane was hardly a flying brick.
@@AvengerII F-111 G limit was 7.33 (clean aircraft with around half internal fuel load, if I remember well), F-14 7.5G as designed but 6.5 in practice. That is not the point. Were breezypilot is wrong is regarding corner velocity and energy bleed rates. The F-14 was much, much better than the Vark on both counts (even though it was nothing like an F-16 in a dogfight, that's for sure).
Sounds like modern F-111 and F-14 should be considered, imagine the missions they would dominate at. Damn politicians.
did he just confirm the existence of are 51 @25:15 ?? 😂👏
K
F-16 was low, F-15 was high.
Low level penetration was a must have weapon during the Gold War era. We had to have something to get in there and blowcem to hell if we had to ..
Having gone a little farther into the video, I have to say I am surprised as to how out of touch he is with current aircraft and tactics. I myself have not flown tactical fighters since the mid-90s, but I have tried to keep up to speed (so to speak!) as much as I can. Also not true that there were no night Red Flags in the 80s. Trust me, I flew at night at Red Flag...
I'm surprised how ignorant he is about other nations air forces. Like saying Russians don't have awacs and command and control, yeah russian air force was created two decades ago so they are still learning how to cnc. Hell they have awcs since 60s irc. I find it amusing that he thinks that stealth makes you go invisible or something so pilots now fly radically different because of it.
@@MarkoLomovic Well, he is right that the soviet Union (back then) had no AWACS. Yes, on paper they did, but it was a piece of crap. Now of course that changed in the 90s (though they still don't have the numbers needed, to this day). As to stealth, yes it does not make you invisible to radar but I'll cut him some slack because for all practical purposes, it might as well. That stuff works. The F-117 shoot-down over Serbia shows there are limits, but stealth is much better on newer types and the combat record of stealth platform is nothing short of eye-watering. So yes, we DO fly radically different now because of stealth, That is entirely correct.
@@KRGruner He wasn't talking about soviet union he was talking about Russia listen at 7:40
Well F 117 was trash (combat)plane anyway it shouldn't have gone to combat, from what I understand it was pretty much test plane marshalled into combat to look cool. Even in 90s it was mocked as "marketing" plane. It is flying brick that can't survive in high threat environment and its payload for task was miserable and it costs fortune to maintain. It being shot down has nothing to do with stealth. It was radar from 60s after all they just got too close to SAM site and they had no clue it was there because it was turned off.
Those records are bit skewed I would say and kinda hard to trust it is not like we have presentation or anything. What makes 5th gen good in my eyes is avionics not stealth that is just bonus.
So how do you fly differently ? BVR is still BVR, dogfight is still dogfight you would still need to get close to toss some bombs or whatever.
There are many ways to detect them and that kind of technology is just getting better and better while making plane even more harder to detect harder.
Lets not forget that stealth plane needs to sacrifice payload to achieve that and its operational cost and longevity of frame has ways to go.
@@MarkoLomovic OK, I'm done with you. Obviously a fucking troll. Not wasting my time.
@@KRGruner it is better not to reply at all if you are just going to call people trolls and be rude...
You didn't mention the most important thing to the Air Force chief. Diversity and inclusion...... above all else !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Too bad you didn't have LBJ to plan all of your missions and your bathroom breaks !!!!
Thank you for your service sir 🇺🇲. Btw what was your call sign??